Not at all. Thanks so much for the "thumbs up."
That makes a lot of sense
Of course, it is the strategic aspects that are important in this story. France wanted to be part of the "Indo Pacific axis" especially since in addition we have a territory in the Indo Pacific we could have played a role.if France had reacted thus only for this contract, I would have been the first to say that my country had a childish reaction
Scroll Down to Read Other Opinions
Oh, this is about $66 billion. That's nothing.France was going to sell $66 billion of diesel-electric submarines to Australia who canceled the contract in favor or American nuclear-powered submarines. From a defense, reliability, and environmental perspective, nuclear submarines are the way to go especially given China's increasingly larger navy.The way this gets resolved is that the English, Australians, and Americans spend $66 billion on French products, ideally technology or defense-related products. The US can do that by having a long-term deal with Airbus and Dassault for military aircraft primarily based in Australia. Getting the Indians, Indonesians, Japanese, and South Koreans on board would help too.
People who comment miss the point. Beyond the economic aspect, it is above all that France was excluded from the strategic aspect of the Indo Pacific by these allies. This is not about France's bruised ego. Nor only about a cancelled armament contract. This is about **trust** between supposed "oldest" allies.
@Julielamar2 I totally agree.
Thank you, it is the strategic aspects that are important in this story. France wanted to be part of the "Indo Pacific axis" especially since in addition we have a territory in the Indo Pacific we could have played a role.if France had reacted thus only for this contract, I would have been the first to say that my country had a childish reaction
@Julielamar2 Please stop being dishonest. France was well aware Australians were talking to the USA for months. They knew it was coming and in typical French fashion they ignored it until it became a problem now they want to play victim. Australia had been very clear as early as that they were becoming uncomfortable with the idea of going into the 21st century with antiquated diesel designs that the French were NOT developing at a comfortable pace and with the setbacks the $66 Billion was already estimated to reach $90 Billion for the first fleet plus untold billions for 20-40 years worth of maintenance. In February at the latest Australia was already in a place where they'd be in the year 2041 with 80 year old technology at $100 plus billion from 2nd-tier French Engineers. France knew the Australians were unhappy. They were NOT kept out of the conversation. The French chose to ignore this until the contract was actually cancelled. Now they want to cry about it. "Australian-French submarine contract on verge of being abandoned"www.bignewsnetwork.com/.../australian-french-submarine-contract-on-verge-of-being-abandonedwww.washingtonpost.com/.../
The French have got state of the art nuclear submarines. The Australians wanted diesel-electric ones.
@tartaarsaus the French boats are not on par with latest Astute or US Block V’s
@ChrisMaster69Based on what? The Barracuda class is about 6 years newer in terms of development.
@tartaarsaus what barracuda boats are currently built and commissioned?What about servicing schedule on the barracuda power plants?TLAM etc.
@ChrisMaster69I mean, every single new tech will have fewer built and commissioned than tech developed 10 years before. And for the record, 5 are being built and 1 is completed. That’s a logical consequence of the Barracuda being newer than the Astute.
@tartaarsaus the Astute as with every weapons platform has upgrades to each build.This has been standard to both ships and subs since forever, you build a QE Super-battle ship, then you realise 10 years later building the last in line, you need newer stuff on it.The majority of the Navies do this when building, for example kit for later builds appeared in latest sub commissioned, the rest will then likely receive it as mid life upgrade or as a part of a refit during maintenance.Also the French fucked the Aussies over with the contract, security was a huge concern, % of work to be carried out in Australia was dropping, lead times and costs where getting crazy. Overall for Cold War and other theatres the French have not been as busy as the US or UK, The French dropped the ball on this big time and are now crying about it.If I was a betting man, the new Canadian boats will likely be the same as the Aussie ones.Both the UK and US are going to be heavily committed in the Pacific rim, the French politically are too much a lose cannon. This is not saying they don’t get involved or do stuff in regards to the military, it’s the political side of things.Also Eurocorps is a big concern to NATO and impact on any global commitments.This is more than a simple submarine order.
The British were unable to build their Astute submarine without American assistance. The United States accepts only auxiliaries as allies. This is the only role Brexit leaves to the British. And France was not only deprived of an important contract but kicked out of a strategic partnership.
Thanks for answering
It's good to be politically educated. It's not good to take this s**t too seriously.
@Gwenhwyfar you're welcome
@EnglishEuropean I agree
Also very important, France is a proud nation and elections are coming. Being mad at Anglo-Saxons always works there
@tartaarsaus How did they lose money? Were they already in the production stage? Did they have an established contract that was cancelled?
@Jamie05rhsThere was a contract that the Australians signed for delivery of submarines and then Australia decided to cancel it
Oh, they did? Wowww. That's f'ed up. That's not right.
@Jamie05rhs It wasn't the contract cancelation by itself... it was more about the way it was handled. Apparently France found out through news sources that Australia was canceling their contract in favor of the contract from the United States instead of finding out from Australia directly. So France pulled their ambassadors in protest.
@NYCQuestions1976 I see. I guess there's no point in having ambassadors there if people don't even talk.
@Jamie05rhs. Exactly. It was a gesture to prove a point. Australia should've said something to France before the media found out. France still would've been mad (it's a multi-billion contract), but they probably wouldn't have pulled their ambassadors. I'm sure they'll be sent back soon enough.
You will tend your garden 😊
No ambassador will stop me there :D
Ummm it has to do with the prime minister of Australia ( Conservative government) pulling out of a submarine deal with the French and the Australian government dealing with the Usa and not notifying the French of the new deal. Id be pretty annoyed as well. We need the new technology for rising tensions with the CCP but Morrison should have communicated with France in a much better fashion, although this pandemic has shown how useless the PM is.
joe biden could fuck up a glass of water.
just like the USA and Russia... who are supposed to be sworn, mortal enemies that hate each other and would do anything to destroy the other... however the two governments have at least half a dozen agreements to not mess with each other and maintain peace... of which, some agreements were renewed recently, while others have been long-standing
You're fine.I just had no idea this happened.
We all live in a yellow submarine, a yellow submarine, a yellow submarine…
I think the are just trying*(Man I hate the Shiite spellcheck)
While i agree 100% Morrison should have communicated in a much better fashion. This pandemic and this deal has shown how out of touch he is.
Great nobody needs the us UK or Australia.
@Hallo626262 You are either Chinese or just plain stupid. I won’t even get into why as what you said is just moronic and you can’t fix stupid as the saying goes.
Nobody needs them
Lol americans really think they played an important role in WW2?
@Hallo626262 I don’t agree with @Fuentes a lot but he’s right that America played a vital role in winning WWII
@Hallo626262 we did British and Canadians were being stomped and Russia begged us and the Allies begged us to jump in and wee did liberated France after our invasion in 1944 funny how as soon. as we jumped in we ended that ish in 1945 in only a years-old the whole world was getting beat up since the 30's once the US steps in all of a sudden the Nazi's are sent packing, and Russia begged us to march into Germany & we said ok go ahead we also raced the British with taking down Italy, then Anzac forces Australia was getting stomped on by Japan not even China could stop them
@Hallo626262 but here comes the big bad USA IF A sending brand new fresh out of Bootcamp Marines dien to the pacific spreading ourrselves thin and we chased the Japanese out something Australia and New Zealand should have been able to do but did not and then we gave Japan the atomic bomb of Hiroshima so yeah its a common fact in history the US intervention lead and ended a war it took the rest of the world years to fight but we only were there fir a year. So yes we lead the way and you all followed us thats why Dwight D Eisenhower was the leader if the allied forces an American so open up a book and see we played a huge role buddy!
😂😂😂Thanks for answering
He has pulled the Ambassador from Australia
@tartaarsaus Oh. The article I saw didn't mention that. Fair enough on that point, then.
I don’t hate Biden but I think this was a bad move alienating France
Bye bye empire. France was never yours to lose buddy
Not the whole country, just the democrats.
@rcljr And the rest of us for allowing them to take the kind of control they've never had before.
Are you vaxxed? Do you wear a mask?
Honestly me either
Not for the first time though. France once left NATO and the US did not support it during the Suez crisis.
Yeah it's just politics at this point especially considering france has elections coming up soon so everyone is trying to act tough for the voters
Oh yeah I did read that the other day
Apparently it does have to do with the submarines.
Now the spies ARE the government.
Over a messed up nuclear sub deal. The legal term is tortious interference with contract.
Thank you for taking the time to explain. Where are you from?
New Jersey. And you’re welcome 😊.
I’m sorry. I’ve thought about it a lot and I still don’t want to talk anymore.
Tell me what you want to talk about
WTF stop being like this
I don’t wanna talk anymore. Have a good life.
not about your shit. I want to talk about something
Have a good life? With people like you? Is it possible?
being paranoid and running away like crazy. Who the fuck care what you do on here. If you care, then stop being like this
Tell me what you want to talk about and maybe we can talk one last time. After that I’m done.
okay then PM. I don't want to keep talking to you too
Terri do you have to be a bitch like this? I meant you can go. Your stupid ego is too much
you block me so easily, can you even be a bitch like this
for a month I am asking you to PM me
@343434434 I don’t want to PM you
" maybe we can talk one last time. I don't want to keep talking to you too. "you can tell that but when I say, it shatter your ego to dust
why? because I don't have cunt?
And I hope you remember who saved yours in your little revolution.
Odd that someone named "libsareretards" liked my opinion. And right wingers aren't?
This is not the most essential contract in this story