Obviously, such people exist. Otherwise, it wouldn't be a thing.
There are reasons for it. For example: While the term existed before the infamous party (but with a different meaning), the "Nazi"-term was an abbreviation from the German Nationalsozialismus (「National Socialism」).
Of course, the counter-argument can be used, saying that the name is not always reflective of the actual thing named. For example: 「The so-called Holy Roman Empire was neither holy nor Roman not an empire.」 And, that does that merit.
But it's also true that mentally walking East can get you circling back West. For example: 「"Equality for all!" → "All cultures are equal." → "The culture of the Brazilians is equal to that of the Italians, whose culture is equal to the Arabs, whose culture is equal to the Koreans, whose culture is equal to Papua New Guinea's Sambia tribe, who ritually feed their underage-boys… eh, MALE-ESSENCE direct from the tap regularly, so they can be masculine and eventually reach puberty in due time." → "All cultures are not equal."」 https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/bering-in-mind/an-ode-to-the-many-evolved-virtues-of-human-semen/ Walk further without counter-balances and absolute cultural-supremacy becomes an easy conclusion.
While I have not yet done any detailed study on the specifics of Socialism & National Socialism, the the seemingly-obvious similarities between the Socialism of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics (U. S. S. R.) & the National Socialism of the 3rd Reich seems similar enough for an identical preliminary-conclusion for either, that living in there would not be desirable. Similar enough for them, apparently.
But personally (while I'm more familiar with the "for"-argument and lacking in the "against"), I'm withholding a conclusion until I actually research this topic myself.
The right relies entirely on performative misinformation. You can drive yourself nuts trying to disprove or fact check everything they say - indeed that's why they say it.
The problem is lying is easier than anyone ever imagines. And if a whole political party does it constantly it is inevitable that at some point someone will assume that they can't actually be lying constantly because that would be too ridiculous - like a conspiracy or something. I don't know why people assume the only explanation is conspiracy when it is much simpler to explain it as a scam. But while people who value credibility and integrity waste hundreds of hours fact checking each lie, the liars will have told thousands more. Because lying is really easy. .
The only solution is to turn it off. This is why the right has dumped so may resources into fighting against "cancel culture" in its infancy - because they know their existence is entirely the message of their existence. Anyone who has a shred of decency is left wing by default, and so that's pretty much everyone. It takes all that misinformation to create and sustain a right wing. So simply cancelling that misinformation would be the end of the right.
People call Nazis socialists because the name of the party is the National Socialist party. Regardless of Hitler's actions and political alignment, it's still called the socialist party.
People use that do demonize socalism even though it is the antithesis of socialism.
My go to retort is, "Yes, and the Democratic People's Republic of (North) Korea is both democratic and a people's republic."
Names are propaganda, and are used/manipulated to suit the whim of whoever is talking.
(NSDSP) National Socialist German Workers Party. NAZI is the abbreviation for National Socialists "Sozi".
Hitler won popularity when the German economy was in the toilet. He blamed the "wealthy Jews" and told the Germans that if they didn't have a house it was because a Jew had two houses. He demonized the Jewish community as the "wealthy not paying their share." Sound familiar?
@TrueConfection Where did you even get that information from?
The only articles I could find that’s remotely talking about what you’re referring to is a recent article.. so not about “Soviet Russia” . It’s about Russia
And they mentioned nothing about it tainting socialism?
If you’re going to talk about history you need to be intellectually honest.
There were several conspiracy theories circulating around the time about the Jewish people being communist (which is weird if Hitler was supposedly a big commie). He blamed Jewish people for Germanies problems (not rich Jews ) after they lost world war.
The whole point was that Jews were the ones blamed not just rich Jews.
These anti Semitic beliefs about Jewish people hoarding money
Please do your research on topics before speaking on them because you’re starting to sounding like one of those Holocaust apologists?
They were socialist as hell. Hitler believed that loyalty to state trumps any economic theory and didn't cooperate with other socialists, but his party had many socialist policies, they targeted workers with their campaigns. Nazi regime then made use of massive government projects to stimulate the economy and after several problems resulting from their policies even put strict price controls in place. Though they didn't usually directly nationalize industry, they did place their people in key companies, dictated prices and enforced their decisions, effectively taking control even if original owners were allowed to keep ownership unless they misbehaved. Overall it their style of tyranny had very clear socialist aspects, and they called themselves socialist too. You could argue other parties were even more socialist than the Nazis, but they certainly were not some laissez fair free marketers. On the spectrum they were certainly more socialist than not. If the government today put in place the same economic measures as they did, I would be alarmed for many reasons.
Nazism was socialist, but only in its 1920 program, which was 13 years before it took power. The original program of the NSDAP envisaged the nationalization of all existing companies.
However, this did not happen. The German economic boom of the early 1930s in which Germany grew at rates of 9.5% a year was financed by stealing from workers' pension funds. One of the first Hitlerian measures was to abrogate the right to strike, increase working hours, block all wage claims, dissolve trade unions, block the opening of production sites abroad, bind the production plants of German companies to Germany and hire exclusively German labor, to this they contrasted the impossibility of firing.
At the same time, protectionism tending towards autarchy was established. De facto the Nazis maintained the Rhenish control system on the management of companies where the state assisted the business management and pushed the companies themselves.
Fascism, on the other hand, was an alternative to socialism, communism and classical liberalism. It was economically corporatist. Corporatism is favored with a view to class collaboration, as opposed to the Marxist class struggle and capitalist individualism. It argued that inequalities between men are fruitful and generate economic growth (as opposed to socialists and communists). But also the need to channel the strength of individual social classes into the national interest, giving the state an intermediary role in the relations between them (as opposed to classical liberals).
Most people who talk about the Nazi's know nothing about them but what little agrees with their cognitive dissonance.
The Nazi party were not one entity and there were public and private supporters of the government many of whom did and didn't agree with their ideologies but their policies.
It's a far more complex picture that Hollywood has dumbed down.
A while back I became obsessed with the Holocaust so I’ve done a lot of research on it and can agree. Most schools only cover the basics and not the entirety of the tragedy that happened or even explain how the nazis/Hitler got into power in the first place.
No obviously lol, How could nazi's be socialists when they literally locked up communists and had tons of propaganda ageist ideals of socialism and wasn't following Marxism ideals at all. Hitler loved the idea of class systems. Marx did not. One is socialist, one was not.
There name just like china's commie party does not reflect the beliefs of Marx nor have anything to do with socialism or communists views.
Uh, you clearly don't know your WW1 and WW2 history. They were literally a socialist party. In the beginning, in German, the party's name was Deutsche Arbeiterpartei which means German Workers' Party. The original creator of the party was against being called Socialist but eventually they became the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei (The National Socialist Worker's Party). Prior to Adolf Hitler taking control of the party, active between 1919 and 1920, they were just an average Socialist party and were barely on the map. It was after Adolf forcibly took over, during the late 1920's, that they became a powerful party. He used socialist rhetoric and propaganda to gain a following and, eventually, the party warped into something else.
They branded themselves as socialists to get the attention of the German working class. It didn’t matter what the parties name was prior at all because Hitler openly expressed his disagreement with socialism and communism.
Hitler being socialist would be against the anti semetic beliefs of the nazi party since it was already a popular anti semetic belief at the time that Jewish people were communist. That’s why a lot of anti semetic propaganda included such imagery.
While their name did include the word “socialist”, their policies and treatment of left-wing opponents show they were not socialists in any actual meaningful sense.
It boggles your mind how the Nationalist Socialist Workers Party (aka the Nazis) and movement could have socialist tendencies?
Really?
Technically speaking, that party and Hitler himself were influenced by Mussolini's fascism, but largely shifted to a socialist system shortly after taking power, for various reasons. It's not much of a leap though because functionally speaking, the biggest difference between them as far as the public is concerned is the rhetoric to justify themselves. Both are authoritarian governments clawing for excuses to justify seizing power. Fascism has popular messaging in campaigns, but historically doesn't last long in functioning government. All that crap does is get people in power, by appealing to national identity, or appealing to the welfare of all. Once power is attained, priorities shift quite a bit, and pretty much never deliver what was promised regardless.
Actually Nazi were socialist. Sorry to bust your bubble. They nationalizd all the industries, regulated their currancy and devolped social programs all for the good of state and community of people.
Now it was corrupted and you can get into the ethical discussion... but its beyond prove positive fact that they were socialists.
According to Karl Marxs doctrine, socialism is the state between Capitalism and Communism. Communism being the ultimate goal of any state. Just like there is no truly or pure capitalist state, there never was or is a truly communist state. So according to Marxs one could argue that every state is socialists... because they all fall between capitalist and communist.
Now there is a piont were socialist can turn nationalist. The difference being that a socialist state is focused upon the greater good of the people and community at large within a states own borders.
Nationalist are solely focused on the greater good of the nation, which can encompasses the nation of people beyond the boarder of any given state.. even at the cost of communal good inorder to achieve a greater good.
So you could argue the Nazi were a Nationalist, which they were, but Germany was a socialist state, and even Nationalist States steam from Socialist principles. Nationalism is corrupted form of socialist, just like anti-marxist will argue communism is corrupted form of socialism.
So its all academic honestly... Nazi were socialist.
Yes. Generally the same people who think their rights are being taken away by being told to wear a mask in public during a pandemic.
Before 1933, the Strasser brothers championed some measure of socialism in their policies, so they could compete with the genuine socialists and communists, but it was just marketing like Trump's disappearing affordable universal health care. The Nazis murdered one brother and the other fled the country.
It's a right wing propaganda push to make the left look bad, or the Nazis look good, pushed initially by Dinesh D'Souza.
I've had people on here argue with me that Hitler was a communist and good friends with stalin. Won't be long before they claim hitler and Charlie Chaplin were the same person because they had the same moustache.
okay I'm curious what you call a political organization that promoted social welfare safety nets, worked close with unions, and gave tax payer money to women every time they had a child. "Conservative" and "Fascist" wouldn't be the first to come to mind. Another word misunderstood by Americans in general is "Fascist". They use this word when the proper word for what they are talking about is Authoritarian.
Capitalism is way more evil than socialism could ever be. And if the nazis were socialists whats your divinities proof cause as far as I’m concerned the nazis hated marxists beliefs and locked up communism and burned all of Karl marxs books
How can capitalism be more evil than socialism? Capitalism is morally indifferent. It can be used for evil purposes, yes, but more often than not, it does a lot of good. Socialism, on the other hand, is inherently evil.
Can proponents of two different evil ideologies not be enemies?
Capitalism promotes unlimited increased production on a planet with finite resources, capitalism inherently promotes the oppression of the working class. After all, the capitalist system and mode of production would collapse if the capitalists weren’t allowed to get away with exploiting their workers.
The future of the world isn’t capitalist or a capitalist system. Capitalism is going to collapse and a new systems bound to remain in its place, just like fatalism collapsed and was replaced. So to will capitalism be replaced with a superior system.
Under socialism production will not be valued over humanity. We can increase the standard of living for all Americans while caring for our environment.
Under capitalism issues like fixing climate change, inequality, hunger is never going to be solved despite us having the capacity to solve such things.
Developing countries will continue to be exploited for cheap labor, slave labor, and paid poverty wages by multinational corporations under a capitalist system.
During the pandemic while millions of Americans have gone homeless, and are struggling to make ends meet. The richest family in the world are making 1 billion every two weeks?
Have you ever thought to wonder how hard are they working to make 1 billion a week? How many workers are they stealing wages from to make that kind of money? And why do so many people praise billionaires like literal Gods so much?
Until capitalism collapses every single worker under the capitalist system will be a literal slave to the capitalist mode of production. If you don’t go to work, you die.
And if your Christian (guessing from your profile) I think you should know that the god of your Bible wouldn’t stand for the imperialism and inequality that the capitalist system promotes today.
A common issue with politics in general is how the definition of a word or view can be changed to suit the side using it or to be changed to used against the side that isn't. Due to this definitions and views can be in a state of flux and it also make it next to impossible for ether side to agree on anything. So we end up in a situation where one side is say they are socialist one moment and the other is saying they are not. Only for that to flip at the drop of a hat and it continue to change.
They literally were socialists, or are we now saying that the name of the group doesn't necessarily coincide with the actions of said group, if so I'd like to have a word about 'antifa'. Hitler hated communism, and didn't like socialism as he thought it would lead to former, so instead of basing the worldview around globalism, he based it on nationalism. Hitler sure as hell was not a capitalist. Leftoids don't wanna admit that Nazis were socialists, but that's just a simple fact.
There is more to socialism than just unions, or so I've been told by socialists. The 'national' part of it is the reason they didn't like unions in the first place, because they didn't give the nation power over them. The entire point of that system was combining what was necessary for the nation (national) with what was necessary for the individual (socialism). Trade unions were replaced by the German Labour Front anyway. And socialism, as in an economic policy, has jack shit to do with Jews having rights.
Hon, they were socialist, just a right-wing authoritarian form of it. Socialism is an economic policy, and national socialism is as well, which they engaged in with gusto.
Except you're incorrect. National socialism is by definition in the right wing, as it engages in socialism in the context of nationalism. That makes national socialism right winged as the economic policy works in the confines of said nationalism.
Nazism is against socialism. Hitler actively suppressed trade unions and refused to give the homes of German princes to the people, as he felt this would move the party towards communism.
Socialists, along with other left-wing political activists opposed the Nazi regime and were persecuted under it. The Communist Party and Social Democratic Party (SPD) of Germany were banned in 1933, along with the limitation of the power of all those who opposed Nazi rule.
The concept of national socialism is inherently anti socialist. Doesn’t matter how you change the way you phrase it
Nazism has socialism in its name. And correct, they were persecuted as it was believed socialism on its own would lead to communism. But thays why the nationalism part was so important. That was the form of governance, nationalism, with socialist policies in place for those deemed worthy of being in that regime. If you are not worthy of it, you didn't partake. If they didn't want to do something, they didn't do so, usually at Hitler or mullers discretion.
They were. hey called themselves the National Socialist German Workers party for a reason and they took control of their industries during WW2. There was nothing "right wing" about the Nazi's. That term is thrown around to associate them with conservatives. Nothing conservative about them.
The national socialist party? Yes they were socialists😂. Either that or they were really capitalist who deceptively called themselves socialists in anticipation of the 2016 election😂🙄. You got to understand that both sides are BS! Both sides lie and push propaganda and both sides aren't in politics to help people but for personal gain. Once you accept that you will truly be woke. Perhaps stop reading WorldStarHipHop and watching CNN and learn something from Malcolm x. Until you do every one of these posts you make make you sound like a dink 🤡.
“we are today seeing a global rebellion of the oppressed against the oppressor, the exploited against the exploiter.”
Malcolm X saw the limitations of black nationalism and recognized black peoples racist oppression under capitalism.
You can’t have capitalism without racism”, he said once in a rally in Harlem.
You sound real dumb if you’re trying to act woke by bringing up Malcolm, when you definitely know jack shit about the words he preached !
Malcolm was assassinated for a reason, I bet the only side of him you know is the white washed liberal version of him that the US tries to push in schools to erase his actual radical beliefs?
The name was the National Socialist German Workers’ Party (NSDAP). In name, in policy and by self declaration the NSDAP was a socialist organisation. Some people today are confused, because the only paradigm of socialism with which they are familiar is the failed Marxist version.
This is a desperate rear guard ploy from a dying conservative movement around the world. We were forced to run their neo liberal economic experiment at gunpoint around the world for the past forty years and it failed miserably. If Christopher Hitches was alive he'd literally rip D'nesh Desouza's lungs out in public.
It is what the they were National Socialist (Nationalsozialismus). They were totalitarian, anti capitalist (but would use it if it suited their needs), everything was secondary to the state, does that sound like any political party in America today? But the best analysis of them is here; www.econlib.org/.../
