I bought this explorer with cash I had saved up planning to have it 10+ years, only had it a little over 4 years. They are calling it a total loss because the parts to fix it has gone up so high in cost due to supply chain issues and inflation.
I know its maintenance history and have taken good care of it. Now I have to go find a replacement, assuming I can even find one, there are car lots around here with almost zero cars on them for sale.
It does not seem fair that I will have to take out a loan to replace a vehicle from an accident that was clearly not my fault as the pay out will not cover it all.
I think the laws need to be rewritten to require replacement or repair rather than cash out the value of something when it is not your fault. Replace with same year and model, or better would be fine by me.
This is going to be major financial strain on me as I would never voluntarily take a loan out when I already have another loan I am paying on. I feel forced into it, there is no mass transit around here, I live 35 miles from the city in rural America and that is just the edge of the city.
With the laws written how they are currently that means all cars in accidents are now considered disposable to fill up our junk yards and create pollution to manufacture new ones.My poor carLegally speaking, with my attorney says it can take years to get things resolved and try to get more but the law is pretty straight up on value so not much may happen there. For medical issues much more can be done though.
I am glad neither of had any major medical problems but this really sucks. Especially since when I get another one, some idiot can do the same thing and I get screwed over again.
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+1 y
All I really want is for insurance to make it as if the accident never happened.
I do not want to be 'better' off. Especially since I am a victim, for all I care if someone 'caused' the accident the insurance can screw them over as they caused it.
I'm specifically referring to updating the laws for victims to make it so it is like the accident never happened, nothing more. Nothing less. As we are currently creating thousands of victims every year with the current setup here.
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+1 y
Thank you everyone for your comments, to those that support the current system. I hope you get in an accident, have your car totaled when you have zero way to replace it and no outside help and then you lose everything in your life from your job to your house to everything.
That is my blessing to you, that you reap what you sow.
Do you think car insurance laws need to be updated in how they handle accident victims?
I totally agree, my first car ever. I bought for $900 dollars... to get it legal, needed new tires and a rebuilt carburetor, got that all for $300 more, so in it $1200 dollars.
Three weeks later on my way to work at a minimum wage fast food job, a lady ran a two way stop sign and t-boned me. Her insurance offered me $300 dollars for what they deemed the value of the car, my dad (as I was only 18 still living at home and on his policy) pointed out the new tires and carb and got it up to $500.
The lady that ran the stop sign fully admitted she was watching birds fly around and not watching where she was driving.
I had no car now to get to work, and still owed $700 on it. I got majorly messed over by the system.
At the very least it should of reimbursed me for the total owed so I could start fresh.
I removed the four tires, I had bought them from Sears and took them back to get a refund for about 20% less than I bought them for. I still owed on them on my Sears card after that, but much less.
When the tow truck driver came he was mad, said tires were part of the salvage, I said so, don't care... we already got the $500 payout.
I told him where he could get get them though, gave him the address to the Sears store I had returned them to.
I ended up having to file bankruptcy cause I had no way to get to work anymore while still owing on my old car, plus no way to buy a new car. The amounts do not seem like a lot but this was back in the 90's and $4.25 an hour part time just wasn't much. I ended up having to include my Sears card in it, cause no job means I couldn't even pay that 20% I owed, and the other loan I had no way to pay that, was a signature loan to get the car. The system forced me into bankruptcy right as I was still trying to build my credit up.
I do agree to your point though, that disposable cars are bad. I would think those pushing for less CO2 would be all over this, less disposable cars is less pollution. Shouldn't there be outrage over this practice increasing pollution from all the climate change people?
This is exactly why I have a huge metal protection grill on the front of my pickup so if someone cuts me off, their car will get creamed, ruined, totaled and my truck can still drive away. I also have a extended bumper sticking out the rear.
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You have severe soft tissue damage from the impact. Your lawyer can get a big settlement from thinsurance company. It is the other driver's fault 100% so they do not want t ogo to trial on this.
That is in the works but told on average here it is at least two years, covid has made things take a lot longer. Any kind of pay out is years down the road from that.
Sorry about your accident and I’m glad you’re okay. I’m sure that was very scary!
Hopefully since it was a total loss, you’ll get a decent amount of insurance money. And often, you can sell a junk car. Pull-a-Part is one company that buys cars for parts, even if the car doesn’t run. It would be great if between those two things, you could avoid the loan!
Yeah, a change is definitely needed. It just sounds so shady…. so the insurance company gives you money that you’ve been paying for over the years with your policy…then they take your car from you…and then they sell the car for a profit? Seems very corrupt.
I'm sure they'll lose money on the salvage sell, more like they pay me the value as if I had wanted to sell it at the time of the accident, then they sell it for salvage to try and re-coop as much as they can, probably more like 70% of what they paid me... or whatever they can to part it out. They'll still take a loss, just trying to minimize it.
I would speak to another attorney. If he makes it sound difficult to win, it probably just means he’s too lazy to take on the case. It does suck, though, when you only get the ACV for your car because you will end up paying more for another car unless you risk buying an older vehicle. If states update their laws to make provisions for people to have new cars after their vehicles are totaled then insurance rates will skyrocket. Basically, the rule of insurance is that you will not receive more than the actual value even though insurance companies practically advertise that their products will get you a brand new car.
Suppose a fairer settlement would be $1500 more. Suppose the attorney gets a third of that, or $500. How much time can the attorney afford to spend for the chance of getting another $500? You can't get a lawyer to take a case to recover a small amount of damages.
I'd be fine with a replacement of the exact same year, model, mileage, etc... I do not want something newer, but if they can't find the same, then something newer would do.
All I want is to be in the same situation as if the accident never happened, I do not want to be better off but this is making me far worse off.
They are not even trying to look, it is a situation of here is your cash, good luck... not our problem that you won't have a car, can't find one or will end up homeless, we are heartless souls. Ironically you'd think if this is the average value of the vehicle they could just keep the cash and find a replacement for the exact same amount right? Seems logical to me.
@slatyb I know it won't, which is why I have already written letters to lobby for a change to the up coming state legislature session, explaining my situation and how I will be homeless in a few months as a direct result of this.
That between the guy who hit me and the insurance laws, my death will be on their hands.
Can't take it away from anyone, but if more people comment, I'll have the option to pick another one. More popular more MHO's, at least it seems like it works that way.
Yes, insurance companies don't provide that service. They write you a check and then it's over. The best you could do is get additional cash for the inconvenience, but if there's an applicable state law, that's what you get for the collision damage.
Sorry you had this accident. Please remember that in every accident, there us almost always an innocent victim.
You don't need to change the law, change your insurance. Your insurance company should be more than happy to write you a vehicle replacement policy. Just beware that will result in higher insurance rates than you are currently paying.
They are only doing the value as if I had wanted to sell it prior to the accident, which is all the law here requires. Sort of like forcing me to sell it when I never would of. I would rather they be forced to just repair or replace my car. Same exact model or better is fine by me.
None of the carriers I've checked with here offer replacement car cover unless the vehicle is new when you buy it, and has less than 15,000 or so miles on it. What carriers do you know that offer that on older used vehicles with higher mileage?
Far as I know, GAP is really only good here for loans, so if something gets totaled it pays off the loan, as the pay off amount might be the same as the loan.
I've heard of it before here, but it was more like what you said... buy a car for an amount, drive it off lot... value goes down, someone hits you on the way home. Insurance pays out value after you drove it off lot, GAP pays the rest.
You lack an understanding of economics. No insurance company can survive it they pay out more, or even as much as the premiums they collect. Therefore, the law doesn't need to change because it would be too expensive. Accidents happen to the unfortunate few and you were one of the unfortunate; that's life.
Nevertheless, you can buy insurance from Lloyd's of London and other insurance companies that would pay the full replacement cost. However, you will not because instead of paying less than $1,000 per year for car insurance, the cost would approach $5,000 per year.
I get economics but as a victim the law should be changed to make me whole again, I do not want to be paid millions or any of that. All I want is things to be back to how it was before an asshole hit me.
He is 100% at fault, and the system is doing nothing other than giving him a ticket. There is no incentive to not just ram people all the time in the current system. He had a piece of shit car and probably has already bought another one to ram his next victim.
All I'm saying is the laws need to be changed to make it so the victim is in the same situation as before the accident happen. They do not need to be better off, but I'm far worse off... and I cannot even legally kill the guy for doing this to me, but he could indirectly kill me.
So I get called back into the office, no car... now I'm fired for not showing up, a few months later, I'm homeless and starving... then I die of exposure and starvation. Where is the justice in that?
Life or nature is not about justice; it seldom is. You are suggesting that I and other uninvolved people pay more (that is, pay higher insurance premiums) to reimburse you loss and that is not going to happen. I'm sorry for your loss, but I'm not willing to pay for it. I'm glad it didn't happen to me.
You have recourse in law. You have the right to sue the person that caused the injury for the amount of your entire loss. If you do, and can prove your case, you will get a judgement for the full amount. However, collecting a judgment is not the same as collecting on a judgement. If he can't pay it, there is nothing you can do. Furthermore, if he already had debts in addition to judgement, he will file bankruptcy and erase the debts and almost certainly the other creditors will have first claim on his assets, if any. Even in the unlikely event he has no other debts, if the judgement exceeds his assets, he will still fill bankruptcy. If he has adequate assets that you can collect, you are in luck. However, few people will have enough to pay.
I'm fine with his insurance company charging him more to pay it off, no need to raise rates on everyone else... just charge him $5000 a year until they re-coop their costs, seems like simple math. Insurance companies can work together too, so if he changes carriers the others charge the same amount and pay it back to the original one. They do this for each of their claims they are trying to recover costs for.
If they all did that, they could get their costs back. Also driving without insurance can be made a felony where you do jail time guaranteed like 5 years, no less, no parole.
As for my question of what am I suppose to do, you totally ignored it? How can I avoid losing my job, getting evicted and dying of exposure and starvation? That is the path I see happening to me.
At this point that is all I want to know, how to avoid that.
Accept the fact that you are not going to be made whole and make the best of the situation. If you had had collision insurance, your insurance company would have offered you some money to settle. You should take it, and buy a $1,000 used car. Use that car to get to and from work.
Sue the driver in small claims court for $1,500 or whatever the limit is. Contact your state's insurance commission and let them contact the insurance company in your behalf.
Your car looks drivable as it is. Go to the police department and get their permission to drive the car during the day, too and from work, using hand signals.
@DWornock It isn't drivable, the rear right tire is smashed into the wheel well and gets cut up when driving. The guy literally pulled out, floored it and rammed me at close to 50mph. This wasn't a suddenly stop where he just hit me. I was at a complete stop, waiting for traffic in front to move for over 20-30 seconds, he pulled out, floored it rammed. Still no idea what he was doing or why he would do that. I have asked the police to arrest him on a assault, as this does not seem like a pure accident to me. You don't just pull out, floor it and ram someone without touching the brakes. Feels like he was assaulting us, or doing road rage or something. They are investigating the situation.
I've accepted that I will not be made whole and as if the accident never happened, but I now understand why people will turn to crime and how the system creates criminals. Someone with their back to the wall may have no choice but to steal money from somewhere to avoid being homeless.
Just another thing our system does to create crime and the system is totally been created by rich people for rich people, as they'll have nice unique cars that have to get replaced and it likely benefits them as they own stock in insurance and car companies.
At least now I know, I can RAM someone and if I have a $1000 dollar car, no big deal... if they were an ass driver I can get their car totaled and they'll get screwed over.
I hope that anyone who supports the current system gets screwed over by it, when they have no way to get a loan and will lose their job and house and all, then I'd just laugh at them. You supported a system that did you in.
Don't count on the police to do anything. The courts have ruled the police have no responsibility to protect individuals. They don't see it as a crime, certainly not a crime that is easy to prosecute. They just want you to go away and will tell you whatever believable lie that will make you less of a nuisance.
Doing to another what was done to you will not benefit you. In fact, it would take up some of your time and destroy your $1,000 junk car. Every since societies became larger than tribes, the masters have never cared for the people. Their interest is what benefits them; not the people. Justice for the little people is rare and no law you could get passed would be beneficial to you. You can write letters and suggest a law but if you suggestion doesn't benefit the masters, it will never pass. Maybe you will receive a form letter reply, but that is all.
I had an idea: Could you possibly keep the damaged car on your property somewhere, and then spend like $2000 to buy an old p. o. s. just to get you around for the time being; then wait 1-2 years and then fix your Explorer when the price goes down?
It's never going to be worthwhile to repair her old car, and unless she has rural acreage, she can't just stick a junked car on her driveway. It may not be possible to repair the car at all due to structural damage. The insurance company totaled it. She gets the settlement, they get the car. She would have to pay them to get the wreck back.
I did ask if I could pay the difference between payout value and repair cost, was told no. If I want to keep it, I have to reject the payout offer, then they go to auction for a salvage bid and then I get that and can keep it, but it won't be as much as the pay out offer, would be much less.
@Jamie05rhs It is crap, as it is essentially saying, if I had wanted to sell my car at the time of the accident, here is what it is worth. They took an average of retail price and trade in value, so more than trade in but less than retail and said here is your offer.
Like stealing my car, cause someone else broke the law and then telling me, your screwed cause finding a replacement vehicle in this market is going to be impossible.
I don't know the situation in the states but here in the uk they'll write your car off for the tiniest of dents. I've seen cars that could be fixed for less than £100 being written off and the owners getting a few grand. It doesn't make sense
So you had a four-year-old car and they gave you book value? That should have made you whole financially, although you still lose the time needed to find a replacement. Do you feel that the book value did not correctly reflect the current market for used cars? How much did you owe on the car? How much did you get from the other driver's insurance? His insurance company or yours should cover a rental for some time until you can get another vehicle.
The value of the old car does not cover the cost of a newer replacement.
At the very least the insurance should be the ones looking for my replacement car. I tell them I want another of the exact same year and model and condition, mileage, etc... and they find it for me.
I should not have to spend days, weeks, months or years trying to find a similar myself, as none of that time, energy, travel, fuel, etc... should be on me.
They SHOULD have to find me another used car with same condition and mileage and just use that payout to buy it for me. It can be newer for all I care, but not older.
I paid cash for it, I had no loan. To buy a newer vehicle of the same is going to cost $15,000 more than my paid off vehicle which will require a loan. I have not found the exact same year, make and model around here anywhere, only newer options exist and that is not my fault.
The value paid out is average for the condition of my vehicle, that is fair... what is NOT fair is that I get screwed over with having to take out a loan for something that is NOT MY FAULT at all. It seems to me they are STEALING my car and saying here's the money good luck, sorry can't help you find a car without a loan in the same condition, same make and model, not our problem.
If I can't qualify for the loan, I will be literally screwed when my employer calls us back into the office with no way to get into work. IF I can qualify I will have two payments that will be hard to meet each month.
I don't want the value of my car paid to me, I want my damn car back or a replacement of similar age, make, model everything. I want it to be like the accident never happened so I don't have to go find a car and take out a loan.
Otherwise I do not feel like it is making me whole to steal my car, hand me a check and say screw you, were done. It doesn't solve my problem is needing a new car and/or having to take out a loan I may or may not be able to even get.
No, it doesn't cover the cost of a newer replacement. It covers the value of the car you had. Being involved in a collision is not winning the lottery. How could they choose a replacement car for you? There aren't an infinite number of used cars available. There's a lot more to choosing a used car than the year, model, and mileage.
Yes, it's a PITA but that's life.
Days, weeks, months, or years? Just shop online, see what the dealers of that make have available. Four years old? I would look for a certified used car.
@slatyb As a victim I do not feel that I should have to spend any time trying to find another car. All I want is the same thing, I do not want something better unless they cannot find it then they give me a free upgrade. That should be THIER problem not mine.
I feel like my car was forced sold out from under me against my will. I never would of sold it for this price or any price... would of kept it for ten or twenty more years. I do not see it as winning the lottery, I see it as fucking me over, as have you seen the price of used cars lately?
Even the exact same year explorer that I have found online are 15 grand more than what they are offering me from dealers.
I cannot afford a new loan, so what am I suppose to do? The laws should be changed to address this not say, sorry sucks to be you.
I need a another vehicle not a choice, can't afford the loan so you tell me what am I suppose to do?
Eerly similar situation. I had to purchase a new car too. Mine was made shorter as well, but my frame did get treeked enough to push the rear quarters into the rear wheels.
I too had to purchase a new one as the cost of used cars is stupid crazy. I feel your pain.
The other party's insurance should cover the"replacement value" of your car, not the value the opposing insurance company has arbitrarily decided it is worth. Get a new lawyer!
My insurance company determined the value as I worked with them, they'll get reimbursed from the other one.
The law here only requires the value as if I had wanted to sell it myself before the accident, not replacement cost. As even a used vehicle I found same year, model, everything and within 10,000 miles of mine, is $15,000 more dollars to buy from a dealer than my pay out. I would of thought they should of paid me the value that the dealer is selling it for, seems they do not have to.
I would check that law and see if it really says that - I find it hard to believe. Also, at this time, used cars are selling way above market value - if you wait a bit, that may change.
So far that is what both my attorney and the insurance company said, they only have to pay out a 'average' value of it at the time of the accident if I was going to sell it myself, so between trade in value and retail and that is what they are offering. This is why I think the laws need to be updated. It doesn't make people whole, if they need to go get a replacement vehicle.
As for waiting a bit, sure I can... but then if my company decides I have to go back into the office for work, I have no way to get in without getting a ride. Ride now everyone is work from home due to covid but they keep saying we will all need to go back in possibility by April. My only hope is covid keeps ravaging things until I get a replacement vehicle, guess I will pray for more variations of that (:
Getting a ride to even do shopping is a hassle, I live in a town of around 2500 people and need to drive at least 35 miles to get to work or the nearest big city with stores.
They only have to cover the value of the vehicle as if you were trying to sell it on the market at the time of the crash. They do not have to consider what it is doing to the victim to get a replacement vehicle. Not their problem.
Any car you buy, the moment you buy it loses value fast... so you can see how getting a check for that lesser value won't be able to buy a replacement vehicle without taking out a loan.
Rowan , the guy who acted as Mr. Bean had a McLaren F1, when he crashed it, they had stopped the production of that model, I guess because it cost way more to fix it, but insurance covered the costs.
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