So what is it that I’m not understanding about American black people? How am I being unfair?

[WhiteBoyChill]

So I get called racist all the time because of my views toward them but truth be told I have no qualms against Asians and hispanics.

Similar to whites, Asians and hispanics are part of the immigrant population.

They came to the country by choice to presumably build better lives for themselves. And it’s the same deal with black immigrants though they are a smaller share of immigrants in terms of absolute number.

So I understand that black people are at a disadvantage because of slavery but ultimately no amount of complaining is going to help them.

I mean the best thing anybody can do for themselves is try and overcome the obstacles as oppossed to waiting for somebody else to change things for you.

That’s the problem I have with American blacks. They aren’t proactive like the rest of the American population.

There are poor whites in the country with very little education but they actually attempt to do something about it.

Updates

+1 y

I guess what I’m trying to say is that black people have to pull themselves up by the bootstraps if they want things to get better. Nobody else can help them. I mean Ben Carson grew up in a bad school system but he was still able to end up better off than the average white

[normalice]

Unless you are suggesting there is a genetically inherited problem with black people that makes them unable to compete at the same level as other races (which, such a statement (sometimes dubbed "eugenics") is the very definition of racist), then you must admit the problem is elsewhere. Our national conversation on race has at least shifted over the last 60 years such that the majority understand the eugenics argument is a racist one.

It is important to understand that eugenics was the majority opinion 60 years ago, which is not long, but even though that opinion has fallen from favor the sentiments behind it have not: people just learned they can't say it out loud or, at best, they get ignored. They have not learned that it is false. This is how the dogwhistle approach to racism became popular in the 80's. There was about 30 years after that where Republican candidates, particularly in the south, were chosen by who had the most clever dogwhistle. With Trump people got tired of the cleverness and just wanted to go back to the "great" times when we could say black people were monkeys again and no one cared if it was racist because the majority was fine with racism (but not racist!).

Anyway, the point is none of this involved fixing the problem. In fact all it did was encourage people to be automatically divided on any proposed solution, because there is a substantial number, particularly of southern conservatives, who don't want it solved. The plain fact is the thing it will take to fix it is reparations. No amount of blame or pep talks will change the fact that schools in majority black neighborhoods are underfunded. Yes, there are those who break out. That's not new - indeed one of the first casualties of the shelling of Atlanta during the civil war was a well off freed black man. But if we want the problem to be fixed everyone has to stop whinning about it and fix it, or at least agree to stay out of the way.

[WhiteBoyChill]

I’m not a Eugenics guy because successful blacks do exist.

But regardless I’m not really sure where you’re coming from. I’m a Republican and race is never really discussed. Its only on my mind constantly because most of my friends are liberals

[WhiteBoyChill]

And in regards to the whole black schools being underfunded, can’t city councils change that? City councils run by white liberals specifically?

[normalice]

So, you haven't seen right wing media talk about the border, welfare queens, or urban crime rates? These are the most common dog whistles, after all.

And I don't know the process by which funding is allocated to schools. I do know that conservatives in both parties have been cutting funding to schools across the country in an effort to create justification for giving that money to private schools, under the pretense of "school choice."

The main problem with liberals is they are too easily distracted by national politics, which only effectively influences maybe a tenth of their lives, if not significantly less. Local politics are vastly more important and vastly ignored by the left. The run on school boards is an excellent example of that - no equivalent organized effort by the left to shout down the right wing extremists at the meetings was put into action. But this also means even if part if the democratic party, it's still usually the most conservative democrats that end up with local control of things like school funding.

But that's all kind of beside the point. I believe it's some federal law that schools be funded primarily through property taxes. So people only end up funding their local schools and if you live in an area with low property values (i. e. an impoverished area) your local school will be underfunded. And as long as every public school is underfunded, none of them want to start donating their already limited funds to poorer schools.

It's a question of priorities. Do we want to give rich people more of our tax money, or do we want to spend it on schools? Republicans seem to exclusively represent the former while no one seems to be representing the latter.

[WhiteBoyChill]

I thought Trump campaigned on lowering taxes and signed the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act in 2017

[normalice]

Right, which raised taxes on anyone making less that 250k (I think) over 10 years, though lowering them initially, but permanently cut taxes for anyone making over (i think) 750k. Misnaming things is the goto Republican scam. Though, for their 2022 platform they just straight up admit their going to raise taxes on people making less than 250k (or something like that). I guess they figure people are going to vote for them anyway. It stopped being about making economic sense long ago and is now 100% grievance culture and refusing to let government do any work - other than tax collection to give to the rich, of course.

[WhiteBoyChill]

Weird. I have not heard of this

[normalice]

Yeah, McConnell got briefly mad at Rick Scott for releasing the 2022 platform this early, but once it was clear the left thought the right would be upset by it, and thus the right seemed determined not to get upset, no one seems to care anymore.

[WhiteBoyChill]

Ah well. Donald Trump was the only one I ever liked anyway

[normalice]

Yeah, that's why the GOP can't let him go. They know no one will ever vote for a Republican based on merit. They know no one will ever agree to give more tax money to the rich, which is their only goal. So they rely entirely on entertainment to keep people voting for them, and like other forms of entertainment, need to up the ante each "season" or people lose interest. Trump was many things but a bad entertainer was not one of them. He was their series finale. If they can't figure out another way to stir up the same joyous hatred that Trump stirred up, they are effectively dead as a party.

I suspect this is why they publicly ally themselves with Trump but if you look carefully they seem to have taken measures to assure he does not run in 2024. They learned he is infinitely more useful to them as a martyr they can speak on behalf of, rather than a victim that speaks for himself.

[maverick2022]

Nothing will help. Blacks are brainwashed and weaponized against white people in America. All their hatred is driven by jealousy of white success in culture because let's face it blacks were bred to be slaves. They did not work their way up the hierarchy and earn the privilege to reproduce. It was something granted to them. At least from conversations I've had with some on here, there's nothing you can tell them to change their view. There has to be some unhealthy amount of self-hatred mixed in as well. Think about it, why do some blacks loose their bowels and shoot people when they hear the word nig? Obviously touches some weak nerve in them unlike the dozen derogatory terms they use for white people. It's also important to realize that not all blacks are the same. Some don't hold similar views at all and are tired of the same things that you mention.

[WhiteBoyChill]

Yes I agree. There are some blacks worth saving but overall they are a problem

[Gordyshore]

What Black Americans do you actually know? Let alone how many have you actually had a conversation with? I think until you have a conversation and actually listen to what they are saying then your conclusion is flawed. It's like me saying I don't like nor do I care for apples, but I have never seen nor tasted one. It's not hard to get an understanding nor is it hard to have a conversation. The black experience is unique because there are layers to things that you wouldn't understand; even if I explained it. The true question is do you want to understand us, and label us all the same? Or do you actually want to understand what it's like being in the black experience? I will admit we have problems that have been instilled into our culture, and even with the knowledge and understanding there still seems to be a disconnect. There are countries that have been oppressed for decades, and even with the freedom they acquired; they are still in shackles.

[WhiteBoyChill]

I do not understand where you are coming from. How are black people still oppressed?

Are black people still being told they can only live in certain neighborhoods and go certain places? They have all the same options just maybe not the same opportunity.

I don’t call that oppression but just an inheritance

[Gordyshore]

Do you think because we are not being told which neighborhood to live in; that we aren't oppressed? Have you never looked at the history of America? Not the white-washed version but the actual version? Black people are the foot soldiers for almost every movement; which doesn't only benefit us, but also immigrants. What did black people inherit? Do you know there were 167 successful black cities that either got burned down or are now underwater? Do you think that's by chance? You can't be serious we saying why black Americans are the way we are. On top of that Black women are the highest degree earners out of any ethnic group in the states. We have the highest numbers obtaining our bachelor's, master's, and Ph. D.'s. Even with the education, we receive we are still being underpaid and undervalued. There was just a law passed on being able to wear our natural hair. As a people, we have a lot of milestones that we must cross.

[WhiteBoyChill]

You lost me when you said black women are the highest degree earners.

Where is this study?

[WhiteBoyChill]

I’m willing to admit fault if you provide me something credible but based on everything I seen its been Asians

[Gordyshore]

It won’t let me provide and link because I don’t have enough points. I have found all my resources and data to back up what I am saying

[Gordyshore]

I have tired but you don’t follow me so I won’t allow me to message you

[Gordyshore]

It won’t allow me to send a private message to you

[WhiteBoyChill]

Oh my b im following you now

[WhiteBoyChill]

My bad

[OmcSketch1]

So here’s the thing…you get called racist because you’re grouping everyone into the same category based on their skin color.


What I’m reading from you is that you think that at no time in present day or history has a black American done what was needed to get ahead in life and make their life awesome…which simply isn’t true.


You’re saying that several white or other skin colors are disadvantaged but they do things to make their life better…but that’s not true for that whole group either.


No matter the skin color you can always find a hard working person or a lazy person you cannot group them because skin color does not determine the person. Open your eyes a bit and try to understand that you have these prejudices…recognizing that your prejudices aren’t true will help you see truth.

[WhiteBoyChill]

I gave Ben Carson as an example of black Americans succeeding. And there’s also Oprah Winfrey and Thomas Sowell

[WhiteBoyChill]

Its an evident fact that most American blacks are just lazy

[SmokinAces2000]

Asians and Hispanics also weren’t forcibly stoped and had barriers on top of barriers to prevent them from building “a better life”. I’ve already told you about the greenwood district which I’m sure you never did look up and also lets go back to slavery when slaves were beat and sometimes killed for trying to read or write. Redlining forced black people into poverty stricken areas where they had to get low income jobs. Now let’s go back to end of slavery when slaves were tossed out of plantations with no money and barely anyone would hire them. I’ve debunked your argument but I know you won’t admit it and also give the bootstraps argument a rest because what bootstraps and what boot.

[WhiteBoyChill]

You didn’t debunk my argument because I acknowledged those facts.

I admitted black people are at a disadvantage because of past discrimination but nobody is trying to hold them back any longer.

Redlining is dead.

[SmokinAces2000]

Like I said, a whole race of people set up to fail for centuries

[WhiteBoyChill]

But nobody is telling black people they can’t succeed if they want to.

[WhiteBoyChill]

My argument is that a lot of black folks have already given up

[SmokinAces2000]

I said it once and I’ll say it again, you can’t expect a whole group of people who have been set up to fail to pull themselves up by their bootstraps when they don’t have bootstraps or boots

[WhiteBoyChill]

But it’s been done before though. That was my whole argument. Ben Carson and Thomas Sowell are living examples, among others

[WhiteBoyChill]

Most black people just tell themselves it isn’t possible and that is what creates the problem

[SmokinAces2000]

Of course it’s been done, there are successful black people and non successful black people but it’s clear that you think black people as a whole should be on par with white people economically but that’s just unrealistic and very ignorant

[WhiteBoyChill]

I just think black people can do better is all. Not enough black people are challenging themselves enough.

[SmokinAces2000]

You are making baseless claims, “not enough black people are challenging themselves” that’s a baseless claim with no evidence to back it up

[WhiteBoyChill]

Then why are there so many black people living on welfare and unemployment and resorting to gang activity.

Don’t pretend you haven’t noticed these things.

[BlackBull6]

Whats interesting about this is the difference between African americans that have been here for generations and west Africans that have arrived recently. West Africans do very well economically. What that tells you is that its not about being "black" but rather about institutional and systemic racism that makes it hard for African americans in particular to better their lives.

[WhiteBoyChill]

Well that was my whole argument. Black people can be succesful if they want to be. The opportunities do exist for them here at home as it does for those West Africans you just mentioned

[BlackBull6]

You're almost there but the issue is there are more barriers for African americans in particular. For example, many successful black neighbourhoods were bulldozed in the middle of the last century for freeways, other neighbourhoods were vandalized, etc. This is not to mention all the outright racism in policing, etc that they face.

At the same time, black people are starting to do a lot better lately. You can't fix 300 years of trauma in 20 years.

[WhiteBoyChill]

I understand where you’re coming from but the issue that I have is that I still see a lot of complaining take place.

And my whole argument is that what good does complaining ever do?

It just takes time away that you could be using trying to better yourself. I understand things were different in the past, but in today’s society a black person won’t be denied a job if they have the skills

[ibodi]

Have you ever heard Paris Syndrome? If you can't give what they image don't speak how is USA good freedom... etc. like Ukraine's president say he don't want to be idiot if so don't act like that. you know how to ruin your image.

[jshm2]

Then you need to fucking educate yourself, dimwit. Slaves were not just Black. Natives and others were also taken and used as slaves. Not to mention had land and wealth stolen by White polical action.

[WhiteBoyChill]

Im talking about black people exclusively tho

[bamesjond0069]

Well i mean my white ancestors were immigrants but i didn't choose to come to america. Im not sure why someones ancestors being forced or choosing to come makes a difference when nobody born in america chose to come here.

[WhiteBoyChill]

My argument is that slave descendent people inherit less than immigrant descendent people. We start our lives out in different positions

[bamesjond0069]

I didn't inherit anything though

[WhiteBoyChill]

I didn’t either. I just meant that we generally start out in better positions like in terms of having more wealth and stuff from our parents

[bamesjond0069]

Well i started in a kinda poor but not very poor family im 3rd generation immigrant.

[AvaOneLasTime]

Some people's best is to complain. And some people just want to see the world burn.

[WhiteBoyChill]

Like what I’m saying tho is I get that black people inherit more poverty but is complaining really helping

[CloudMassacre]

Right away, you’re doing the “they act differently” thing pops my racism radar

[WhiteBoyChill]

Its the truth. How often do you hear Asians and hispanics alledge racism?

[CloudMassacre]

Pretty often in South Dakota

[WhiteBoyChill]

Well maybe people are actually racist there but its only black people doing it where I live

[CloudMassacre]

So it seems like it’s a human thing more than a Specific race thing

[WhiteBoyChill]

No. Because of all minorities black people complain the most

[CloudMassacre]

I feel like white people complain the most

[WhiteBoyChill]

Maybe because in South Dakota 90% of the population is white

[EnglishEuropean]

You're not understanding that black people are the same as you. They just have different pigmentation.

[WhiteBoyChill]

But they are culturally different tho too

[EnglishEuropean]

But black culture isn't homogeneous. You'd be mad if people called you white trash wouldn't you?

[WhiteBoyChill]

Ya bro i get that but most black people in America descend from enslaved west Africans brought on ships over 250 years ago

[OddBeMe]

So you’re seeing poor communities. But statistically there are more poor whites. So why are you focused on blacks?

[ragooo8]

I agree.

[WhiteBoyChill]

Thanks. I’m just getting frustrated is all