You are an officer of the law, what do you do?

[lightbulb27]

Watch from 4:40 to 4:15. You are the police now, you are hired. What do you do differently?

Since everyone wants to beatup and complain about police, here's another recent video I'm sure you'll see more of soon. No cheating and finding out what happens...

Sometimes cops die

Sometimes the individual dies

Sometimes it goes well. Either way, if you one of the ones judging the police, then you'd better be prepared to handle these situations and think quick!!! On a daily basis, you seal with risk. No mistakes or you lose your life or freedom.

Bonus: will the President and VP would show up to the funeral of any officers killed in the line of duty?

Praise the Blue, they did as good as I could have done, maybe better

Another cop failure, I'd have done this...

Send sacraficial social workers instead of police

I'm just an "armchair quarterback", I like to complain but have no solutions.

[Lliam]

I didn't see the cops do anything wrong or use excessive force. The original cop was super helpful and polite.

If someone who is a crime suspect is incoherent and uncooperative, are the cops just supposed to let them go?

That piece of shit was playing all the cards, screaming for help as if he was being assaulted. Then crying "They're trying to George Floyd me." Give me a fucking break.

In this and in Floyd's case, claims of racism are a joke. Lowlifes these days try to use race as a get out of jail free card.

[Msputiton]

So 4 to 6 cops have this man on his stomach and he can't move.

So it was necessary to taze him over and over again and for like 10 secs each.

The guy had something wrong with him, but once he wasn't a threat, there wasn't a need to continually taze him over and over again because he moved.

We got to get out this mindset of they are always justified to do whatever they want when a civilian annoys them.

Once he was on his stomach they could've forced the handcuffs on him without shocking him.

The are to protect and serve.

Not protect and serve unless you disobey then we kill you or beat your ass.

That's a gang mentality not a government official.

Fire fighters don't get mad, and purposely set more of the house on fire.

I don't understand what is so hard to get that hurting and killing someone that is no longer a threat is wrong

[lightbulb27]

I applaud your honest answer.
As well, how interested are you in joining police force to find out what it's really like? I think when you do, you'll find out it isn't so simple nor easy. That guy was resisting, he got up. Cop used a knee on the back (probably illegal now). Some people can be on drugs that makes them 10x stronger than normal. He could grab a gun and kill. It's dangerous... on a daily basis.
You have a point on the tazing while he's down. I suspect that was used to "calm him", but I don't know, I'd have to hear more. I don't think it's torture, it's to get him relaxed so he doesn't fight while getting him to the car... e. g. George Floyd fight in the car.

[Msputiton]

I have 3 police officers in my family and 2 friends who have joined and they echo my statements.
Pretending that this is okay is ridiculous.
But a split second judgement not at all.
But to have dude on the ground with multiple officers unable to detain one unarmed man without using a weapon can't do their jobs.
That is their words not mine

[Msputiton]

I will also say they have told me many times of the mindset of these dirty cops from their own eyes.
They believe they are god like. They have made statements that if a suspect refuses to listen they deserved a beating, or death.
They also have a thing called a rough ride for anyone who gets on their nerves. And it is handcuffed and not secured in the back of the wagon.
They also have many cops who say i refuse to chase a suspect if they run I will shoot them.
People need to stop pretending because a cop is a cop they can do no wrong.
And other cops are afraid to speak out because they have a mentality of cover up for fellow cops no matter how dirty the action, or we will destroy your career for speaking out.

[lightbulb27]

I applaud they are in the job! they may be right about that. But that is still reality, can only find so many people who can do this well and 100% of the time.

[Msputiton]

So you give a gun to murders? And when they murder you go well it's hard to replace them keep on murdering

[Msputiton]

And to your statement not a lot of people want to do this job is incorrect. My uncle is friends with a sergeant who runs the training academy. The requirements changed as to who they accept over last 15 to 20 years. They turn down tons of potentially good cops because they now focus to much on educational background rather than does this person have the proper skills and mindset to do the job properly.
He say he gets too many cadets and new recruits who are educated but couldn't handle themselves in a fight, or even protect themselves.
But they are forced to pass them through because the new requirements are education instead of commonsense and street smarts needed to either deesculate a situation, or bring them down properly.

[Aerissa_Jade]

Obviously the solution seems to be Robocop with those robot androids to respond to all crime.

I generally support the police, the sheriff here and his deputies are awesome but city police are totally different.

Most the time in the city when there is a problem, it is because people ignore what police are telling them to do.

They also try to run away a lot, if they would simply comply there would be less deaths.

[lightbulb27]

100% agree. Robocops (AI or remote controlled) is the future. But even then, there will be cries of racism and bias. There's no way to handle a person that resists, effectively, 100% of the time. And whom is doing the programming and owns the business?
if you aren't running for office yet you should be...

[Aerissa_Jade]

If someone does say racist, it would be easy enough to have a third party independent review of coding to see if someone coded racist behavior in it.

If it is, it gets removed, if not then it can't be racist because someone of any race doing the same thing would get the same result.

[RolandCuthbert]

I don't what's wrong with you.

We have solutions.

End Qualified Immunity. And stop pretending that if you were one of these victims, you would be okay with this. You seem to think only "Blacks" are complaining. Nah. . ."Blacks" are the only one who organized.

Do you think Laney Sweet and her family are okay with her husband being shot begging for his life on his knees?

You think Shannon Ruppert's family is okay with her being killed for threatening an officer with some scissors?

What about Justin Diamond's fiancee? Do you think he was glad when BLM came to Minnesota to ensure he got justice because Mohammed Noor shot and killed her without even thinking.

[lightbulb27]

You have an uncany way of never answering my question. Your opinion is accepted, but didn't address the question. How do you do a better job... expand that to a daily basis of threat, and factor in the # of police executed and killed in the line of duty plus the fact you'd like to go home to your family each day... and remember... no mistakes or the rest of us throw you in jail for being a bad cop! Remeber, you are a cop for the next 30 seconds...

I don't agree with eliminating qualified immunity on your behalf (since you are a cop right now by my decree) and because if we did that, we wouldn't be able to replace you, not easily.. get pricy. It's bad enough as it is. It scares me to think of the trauma to citizens that Memphis, New orleans, Balitmore, Detroit, DC, NY, LA will experience as police quality and quantity declines. I doubt all that trauma and crime will even be tracked.

There should be a balanced view, or at least a counter argument.

If police tell me to get down, I get down and I don't fight. that solves 99.99% of the problem.
The only words I know with police are "yes sir" "no sir". problem solved?

If you defend the subject listed above, you are nuts! If you pay him a dime, you're nuts! I would pay the officers "stress" bonuses.

[RolandCuthbert]

You have an uncanny way of not reading my answer. I put it in bold. Maybe it should capitalized instead.

END QUALIFIED IMMUNITY.

If you disagree with that, then that is your right. But stop pretending we have not offered solutions.

As for your other nonsense, we have rights in this nation. We have the right against unlawful searches and seizures. We have the right to travel where we wish without suspicion. And just because a police officer is an insane fruitcake racist does not give him the right to invalidate my freedoms, because he like you, think my "race" is suspicious. Ending qualified immunity, lets me sue him for invalidating the rights that are guaranteed to me from the Constitution.

And I will fight to end qualified immunity, from now until the day I die.

[lightbulb27]

I wouldn't be in these scenarios because I would submit or take responsibility for dying. My answer to police is "Yes sir" "no sir" "thank you sir". It avoids lots of problems... lets teach that to all the children...

Qualified immunity wouldn't help you solve this situation any better would it? It just put the police in a worse position. How do you see that playing out if the police just let him run around in the street because they are too afraid to mess with him? That IS the scenario in my area... they won't engage many crimes.

[RolandCuthbert]

Right, submit your rights. I will not. The Supreme Court has ruled that police have the right to lie. So I will never trust a police officer. I will always observe my rights in dealing with them. You should do every single thing they order you to do.

The rest of us will advocate for being American citizens.

I just outlined how qualified immunity would protect people from unlawful arrests, searches and seizures. If officers are personally liable for their actions. . you know. . . like everyone else, then that will modify their behavior. Because right now, all their bills are paid by the state or the jurisdiction they are in. So the only legal recourse against them is criminal. Which almost never happens. But lawsuit are won all the time.

So it doesn't matter that Breonna Taylor's family got millions when the lawsuit is just taxpayer money.

[lightbulb27]

The arrest in this scenario looked lawful to me.
Breonna Taylor - not sure what you mean. The rest of society is somewhat culpable in her death by way of making police "trigger" scared. We raised, educated, and allowed criminals to rise up and live freely... which police have to end up dealing with. She was one innocent victim caused by our greater failure. We should pay...
Cops are humans, people, neighbors, sometimes... total A__holes. But usually, just doing their job... a nearly impossible one in many places now.

I might support ending qualified immunity, if society made adjustments as well... to reduce the threats to police.

[RolandCuthbert]

I don't know what scenario you are talking about.

No, the rest of society is not culpable for police misconduct. The police should be accountable for their actions. And when local prosecutors refuse to prosecute them for criminal behavior, the recourse for the victims should be the ability to sue them directly. Because right now, they are not even accountable for their actions.

And given that you and many like you, sanction not only murder by officers. . . you sanction the literal torturing of citizens to death. . . there must be a way for these officers to face some kind of penalty other than paid vacation.

The Constitution must step in and give some remedies to those who have been victims. So ending qualified immunity removes the protection the police normally get for infringing upon a citizen's Constitutional rights.

You have posed this nonsense before about the dangers police face. It is much more dangerous to be a taxi or uber driver. It is more dangerous to be an electrician. It is more dangerous to be a construction worker.

Yet all of these people find ways to do their jobs without murdering, torturing or committing acts of brutality against other citizens.

You are here making the claim that the reason why this happens is because of threats to police, yet you defended an officer who literally choked George Floyd to death. . . while under no threat.

[lightbulb27]

I'm talking about the video posted above, that is the scenario. Officers are required to deal with the individual since he's causing a disturbance [someone called police on him apparently], he's wandering around in traffic. But they have a hard time...

Go ahead and pilot such an idea of QE in some city, heck, pick Memphis for that matter. It's ripe for an idea. Not something I'd want in my city, but it's up to those citizens to live with the results. If it works well, can look at implementation elsewhere.
I suspect it will address some of your concerns of police brutality, but create other negative effects most would not want.

[RolandCuthbert]

To "deal with"? What are you even talking about? I didn't watch the video. I get tired of watching police harm individuals who are having mental issues. And then have certain people pretend that this is normal.

And you are always posting videos of "Black" people getting beaten up by police. Just like "we" are the only ones incapable, in your opinion, of following police orders.

The man was/is on the spectrum. And was brutally beaten by an officer.

But I did not create a thread dedicated to justifying his brutal treatment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGXpRqP-9rU&t=173s

So we should not try to get better outcomes because of your crystal ball? Dude, if you are so good at predicting the future, put it to better use and become a stock market analyst.

[lightbulb27]

The video I pulled was one from the 2023 list of people killed by police. It's a simple question.

[RolandCuthbert]

And I am still not understanding why you are pretending you have not gotten an answer. If you don't like the answer that is one thing. But to pretend that you haven't been told that we need to end qualified immunity is. . . well at this point. . not even a rational response.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yA65tArWSp4

[lightbulb27]

The question is" you are an officer of the law, what do you do?". I'm asking how you handle the scenario better/differently? Your answer is..."end qualified immunity". Ok. Assumably when that is done, police won't feel so protected, and will thus, not be rough/aggressive. Or maybe they won't even do their job or signup for law enforcement in the first place?

Your answer raises the question... what are the negative effects of the decision to end QE.

A) I'm not convinced that ending QE would have improved the outcome of this scenario
B) I think the negatives are likely worse.
C) There is still no discussion of how to re-train society, so that the risk to officers is less... so they have less fear, and thus, less risk handling all other cases.
D) you are welcome to try ending QE in your area and see how it goes. Some states have worked on it.

As a social course, I'd favor (C)! Still punish officers if they do wrong, and hire the best we can. There is no perfect answer, but the day people respect officers and respond better, is a better day for everyone regardless of color/culture.

The officer (s) in video I posted, did as well or better than I could do in that scenario.

[RolandCuthbert]

So finally, I get a response after several posts. No one cares that police are being rough or harsh with dealing with criminals. We are concerned that the police are doing their jobs.

I am just trying to get you to a rational conversation. Because there is no way we will ever agree, I cannot stand folks who are disingenuous. So since you have to play that game, let's try the game of logic.

You are claiming the loss of qualified immunity, which protects the officers from being charged with the violation of Constitutional rights, will make the officers scared to do their jobs.

1. Violating constitutional rights is not in an officer's job description. You can look that up but that's pretty standard across the entire nation.

2. The point of my videos is that the officers are wrong. The officer who brutalized an autistic man was wrong. The officer who arrested a 69 year-old man was wrong. They should have followed the law and followed departmental policy. And they should never be employed again.

3. Again, I didn't post anything about your scenario. More than likely your video did not result in anyone being disciplined, charged, or sued. So since the video is just of a standard arrest what are you even complaining about? Do you even know what your point is?

4. Because my point is simple. If the police have been proven wrong. And state is refusing to prosecute them, then the victims should have a right to sue them directly. Since we know the civil litigation against officers has a pretty high success rate, there will at least be some justice for these families.

[RolandCuthbert]

5, Because the point is again, civil litigation currently does not work. The officer beating up the man on the spectrum was never disciplined or prosecuted. He quit. And more than likely found another job with a different police department since we have no way to track bad cops. Being able to get millions from the city does not do a thing other than give the family money. But we are talking about giving them justice. Now misunderstand all of that.

[lightbulb27]

It's a valid point to track someone's job performance, no different than any other career. I see merit in that.
Of what I saw/read on the video you posted, he way over reacted and violated policies. I always ask... why? We never get the why in these cases, so I don' think we ever learn, we just hope to find someone better. Id want root cause analysis on these scenarios.
If it came up for a vote, I'd look at it intently before I voted. As I said, deploy this policy in your area and lets see how it goes. Police is a different job than Electrician (example you noted above), because they are constantly in domains of conflict. they have to make the right decision every time or lose their job or die. They are dealing with emotionally complex humans not well understood, organized, and designed wiring systems. If humans were better trained [part of my approach to addressing the problems], would have less problems and defects.

But I hear no talk in the media or in anywhere about training citizens. Every video review of a disaster is always the cops fault. In the video I post, I could not do better. I'd have no interest in being a cop if I'd get sued and lose everything because some psycho, drugged up human is suicidal... and they are just one of the thousands of risky scenarios I encounter in such career. Not worth it...

Talk with your state reps about getting some laws changed in your area... if you feel so inclined.

[RolandCuthbert]

1. No one says an officer's job performance isn't monitored. The point is when they quit after being accused of breaking the law, they can simply find another job.

2. Why? It is not even a valid question. Do you ask why a criminal broke the law? You are willing to justify the execution and even torture of folks you consider to be criminals. But you have never posted a thing about root cause analysis, etc. Those people can just be dismissed, so why are you so concerned over criminals who just happened to wear a badge?

3. You pretend this is about jurisdiction. So I don't think you have read any of my posts. So go and read the George Floyd Policing act. The guy whom you justified the torture of. Go read that legislation so you can understand this has nothing to do with "local" jurisdictions. I am quite satisfied where I live that officers would be prosecuted for breaking the law. So it really would not apply to here.

www.congress.gov/.../1280

4. You do not want citizens to be trained. That's your point. You want citizens to be compliant. And since you do nothing but post videos showing "Black" people being uncooperative, your point is to "train" us. So why be disingenuous? Just be "direct and clear".

And again, you are making claims that are just nonsensical. This is about the violation of Constitutional rights. Officers are required to observe those rights, despite what you have said here. The issue is who pays when they do. Like this city will be paying millions to these lawyers. All because an officer did not know the law. So you don't have to train the officers. But I agree they should be able to sue the city if you refuse to train them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOFJga-Vt4o

[Paul09]

You forget police are humans. Humans, make mistakes, and plenty of humans are a-holes or pure evil. There are both honest cops, and scumbag cops

[lightbulb27]

valid point, I noted that below as well:)

[exitseven]

I did not watch the whole thing but it was obvious the guy was up to no good. First he says somebody wants to kill him,, then he says no somebody is trying to put something in his car. He is clearly lying.

[OfMiceandMen]

Only on the night shift.