Do you believe that a man should be able to sign away his financial responsibility for a child b4 the child is born?

[Vegasrunner]

Similar to how abortion is a women's choice.

[Anonymous]

So I say no. Unless somehow she tricked him. Meaning she didn’t take her pill on purpose, or tampered w the condom or something. Now if he was stupid to try to pull use the pull out method, that’s on him as well as her because they know they’re both taking a risk. At the same time even though I said no, I believe it’s up to that man individually if they want to do so. Just the same as the girl saying it’s her choice to abort the baby. I think a man should have at least some options. I get that one leads to no child being born, the second leads to a child being born w out a father in its life.

[dynamicyandere]

That sounds similar to a prenup, but instead of protecting people from having their assets split 50/50 after a divorce, it protects men from paying child support in the event of a pregnancy.


Generally-speaking, I believe that the law should prioritize the well-being of the child rather than the convenience of the parents.


But in order for that to happen, I believe things need to be evaluated on a case-by-cases basis that’s fair for everyone involved.


That means, it needs to be done in a way where neither the mother or the father can take advantage of the system.


So, I’d say that I understand how this could be a potential solution to a problem (mothers taking advantage of the system). But, it creates room for fathers to take advantage of the system.


So I believe the real solution is to improve and regulate the existing legal system in terms of how they make rulings, rather than inventing new legal documents.

[Vegasrunner]

@dynamicyandere How could the father take advantage of this situation?

[dynamicyandere]

@Vegasrunner A man could promise to be loyal to a girl, impregnate her, and then leave, without any repercussions. Men that SHOULD be paying child support may be able to abuse this to get out of it. It wouldn’t actually be so much taking advantage of the system as it would be more taking advantage of womens’ vulnerability. Only a**holes would do this though. But, some other policy would need to be put in place to prevent this kind of misuse too.

[dynamicyandere]

@Vegasrunner Similarly to a prenup, it cannot be signed under duress.

Another thing would be if the woman actually could not be financially secure enough to care for children on her own.

A man leaving her then would also leave her down and out.

Before a woman can sign such a legal agreement, she should also be in good financial standing.

[dynamicyandere]

@Vegasrunner it’s horrible how many women take advantage of men by leveraging the legal system. That needs to be fixed.

But, it’s also important that we have policies in place that can ensure men don’t take advantage of women either.

Ideally, nobody should be taking advantage of anybody — and policies should be structured in such a way that protects all genders.

[msc545]

She can get a job, just like men do.

[Vegasrunner]

@dynamicyandere So you're saying women that walk away from relationships are taking advantage of men and should be punished?

[Vegasrunner]

@dynamicyandere You need to try to live in the real world.

[dynamicyandere]

@Vegasrunner No, as I said earlier, everything should be evaluated case-by-case.

What you described sounds like a blanket statement.

Of course women can walk away from relationships.

But, there are cases where some women divorce because they want their husband’s money e. g. Amber Heard vs Johnny Depp.

[Vegasrunner]

@dynamicyandere Spending time focusing on exceptions will leave you broke. Stats show that women overwhelming leave relationships, meaning men need to prepare as such. No successful business makes their plan based off statistical anomalies. If the women isn't financially secure to take care of a child then that's her problem. We spend way too much time making excuses for women vs holding them accountable.

[MzAsh]

Before the child is born, yes. He’s also giving up all rights and privileges of fatherhood as well.

[Vegasrunner]

@MzAsh Yes that is my question. The woman can keep the child and the man keeps his money.

[Anonymous]

An abortion results in no kid. A “paper abortion” does not erase the child. The child must be provided for. Who should do it, if not the parents? Be a somewhat honorable man and financially support your kid, it's the least you can do considering nobody can force you to parent the kid you created. The argument for paper abortions is to make things more fair between men and women supposedly? But, signing a paper and walking away is a lot easier than undergoing an abortion, especially if the decision to abort is born of financial duress. How will you then compensate women for this imbalance? Or, can we just admit that it is impossible to make reproduction completely fair? Most of the natural burden falls on women, but there is the one area where women have a bit more control, why do we fixate on that? Trying to square that for men will have a ton of knock on effects that make for fewer choices and heavier consequences for women and children.

[MzAsh]

I get where you’re coming from, but here’s the thing. So many women have babies believing they’ll have proper support from the father of the baby. And when the kid is born, dude flakes and goes his own way to live out the rest of his bachelorhood and she’s stuck with all the responsibility, and spends the next 20 years chasing his deadass (or another guy) for help. I think if women understood when a man plans to not be there (either financially or physically), and the guy feels he has the option to surrender rights and responsibilities, we’d at least have a more honest glimpse into what the future holds. At least she’ll be able to reconsider whether or not she even wants to raise this baby if he’s going skip out. It’s better to know sooner than later and have a baby under the false notion that he’s going to be there.

[MzAsh]

I mean, for me, whether or not the guy is going to be there is a dealbreaker. I would absolutely refuse to be a single mom, or have some other man raise his kid as long as he’s alive. My husband would be getting his hands dirty just as I do. A paycheck every month doesn’t cut it. I’d write up an agreement on that too.

[Opinion Owner]

You make a good point. That isn't something I thought about

[Vegasrunner]

@anonymous The mother would orvare you saying women aren't capable of taking care of children?

[Vegasrunner]

@MzAsh Someone would have to sign the other side of that agreement, the man could simply refuse.

[msc545]

She can give the child up for adoption - no child to care for after that.

[Opinion Owner]

@asker I didn't say women aren't capable of taking care of kids. I said when a child is born (a paper abortion doesn't erase the kid), the parents (mom and dad) should be the ones taking care of the kid.

@msc545 A woman who puts up her baby for adoption still has to give birth to the child.

I'm a man who's having a hard time emotionally rehoming my cat. I can't even begin to imagine "rehoming" a baby I carried for 9 months, hormones all over the place, and the pain/dangers of giving birth.

[msc545]

Giving birth to the child is not a big deal in the context of forcing a man to work for 18 years to support that child.

[Opinion Owner]

We're just going to have to agree to disagree here

[Anonymous]

Absolutely, but only if he formally makes his decision known early enough in the pregancy that she can still abort if she so chooses. But that would require she let him know she is pregnant with his child, and there is currently no legal requirement for that. If she doesn't tell him she's pregnant until after after the cutoff, she has lost the right to require he make his choice known before the "cutoff", but once he has been made aware he must make his decision known with a certain period, maybe a month.

If the father decides to get a "paper abortion", he give up both his responsibilities AND his rights as a father.

[Billlewis]

Actually, yes, because my ultimate dream is to serve a beautiful woman who has gotten pregnant by another guy, and we have the a

p legal documents drawn up to absolve him of any financial responsibility whatsoever, thus allowing me to help raise her child.

[RavVid]

Seems fair to me but there needs to be some rules around it. Women have to declare they are pregnant at the missed cycle and the guy gets to say he will or won't take financial responsibility. It is only fair that the woman has an opportunity to have an abortion if it is NO.

If a woman does not declare pregnancy then the guy should still get to say NO even if it is too late for an abortion.

[Kingofkings1992]

Yes. Women are always talking about how they want equal treatment. We should get it too

[Vegasrunner]

@Kingofkings1992 please stop using logic on GAG.

[Drumlin2001]

No. The person who suffers most is the child. Men have to take responsibility for their kids.

[msc545]

So do women.

[Anonymous]

At any point, yes. If a female doesn't need the males approval to abort, the male shouldn't need a female's approval to leave her alone.

[love_conquers_lust]

I don’t believe you can do that unless both parents give up parental rights for adoption.

[OddBeMe]

Yes a “legalese abortion” is how I described it.


It’s only fair.

[kicod164377]

I am in favor of paper abortion and against female abortion in all cases.

[exitseven]

No, you play , you pay.

[Vegasrunner]

@exitseven So you don't believe in a woman's right to choose?

[exitseven]

I really believe it is a decision that must be made by both parties.

[Vegasrunner]

@exitseven So you believe a women can't make a decision about her own body on her own?

[exitseven]

A baby has rights so does the father. It is his offspring too

[Vegasrunner]

@exitseven Don't be embarrassed but I think you responded to the wrong question. I asked if you believe women can make decisions on their own.

[exitseven]

damn, I did respond to the wrong question. I meant to answer the one that asked how old I was when I lost my virginity.

[Vegasrunner]

@exitseven All good it happens.

[msc545]

Absolutely YES.

[Masterodd]

Fuck no... thats dumb