Why did Biden outright lie?

[Juxtapose]

Trump never said this, it can't be proven.

[nightdrot]

Actually, what Mr. Trump said was that, when he was President. he told those NATO allies that failed to meet the 2% of GDP defense spending goal that he would let Russia take them over. This was at a campaign rally where he was telling supporters that the United States' taxpayers should not be called upon to bear the full burden of defending Europe.

This was, frankly, campaign rhetoric and it is not confirmable as to whether or not he told this to those NATO allies that were not meeting the 2% of GDP goal. Obviously, no state - even those no meeting the goal - would admit that Trump threatened them.

On the American side, given the rising isolationist tide that is concomitant with the rising populism is both the Republican and Democratic parties, it is understandable why Mr. Trump said this at a campaign rally. The message being - "America, I will not let you be played for a sucker."

Frankly, in the grown up world of international relations, it is doubtful that Trump actually made such a threat. The political appeal on the home front is understandable. It is amazing to see a large segment of the GOP - the party of Ronald Reagan, victor of the Cold War - opposing aid to Ukraine. Yet as noted, it is a symptom of the rising tide of populist isolationism that is currently running through American political culture.

Yet, if Mr. Trump had made such an actual EXPLICIT threat, it would have divided NATO to America's disadvantage. Already, Germany has been looking to cut a deal with Russia. Britain, on the flip side, has taken a hard line. The states of eastern Europe are supporting a hard line, but if they felt that they could not rely on the USA, they would almost certainly work to cut a deal with Russia. More out of fear than ambition, to be sure, but nevertheless it would almost certainly shatter NATO.

As to Mr. Biden's motives, they were clearly political. Make Trump look unreliable. Split the GOP between its' old Reagan internationalist wing and its' rising populist-isolationist wing. Like so much with Mr. Biden, the strategic logic was thin but the motives were obvious. Which is to say, crassly political and directed at the American home front.

[sawno]

"My fellow americans, the state of the union is... not good. Our border is being overrun due to my fight with texas. Your tax dollars we sent to Ukraine has no sign of defeating russia. The entire economy has gone to shit because nobody can afford things. All the jobs I helped create were just because they were previously tempoarily gone because of covid and because everyone needs additional jobs to survive. As a true Tyrant we have gone after you for your beliefs and speech, but fear not we have gained our corporate donors record profits and the stock market is just fine".

Doesn't exactly sound good so he had nothing honest to say.

[WindyandWarms]

His state of the union speech was fact checked. He lied 30 times in one hour. It really isn’t so much about him lying, he’s just telling Democrats what they want to hear. They don’t care if it’s true or not.

[GoodGuyBreakingBad]

He is why I left the Democrats, but I don't support Trump?

[SolitarySolace]

That’s what career politicians do for a living. They lie. Trump isn’t a career politician. He’s a businessman who ran for president as a Republican and won in 2016 and now the democrats and leftists hate him because he isn’t your typical politician. He’s an outsider.

[DryGermanGuy]

Trump did say this (inviting Russia to do what they want), just not on the phone with Putin. Which was hardly necessary, because Putin heard the message loud and clear, he did not even have to ask his intelligence services, with Trump hollering this treasonous nonsense at every cult rally.

All the other quotes about Trump are on the record also.

[Juxtapose]

I'm not taking your word for it, not a chance in hell. I want to see actual evidence.

[DryGermanGuy]

It's typical of fools to waste their time with non-issues or peripheral issues:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IuT7KdPwpaA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LV6mVmAVQU4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3IENAdJL7A4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzOq8a2AOpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRpfNJMpHcc

[Juxtapose]

Oh my god, you guys are going on about Trump saying he wouldn't help NATO if they don't pay the bare minimum 2% that they are contractually obligated to? Come on man that's ridiculous.

[Juxtapose]

He's using his leverage to get NATO to pay their fair share.

[Juxtapose]

But yeah, Joe Biden explicitly lied and this is just more proof.

[DryGermanGuy]

First of all there is no NATO bill to pay for. NATO is not a country club with fees. And nobody owes the United States any money, which the MAGA fools so erroneously believe.
And if you don't understand how dumb, treasonous and dangerous Trump's remarks about NATO really are, then nobody can help you. Putin is salivating at the thought of fooling and outwitting Trump again.

[Juxtapose]

No, you're wrong.

"The 2% defence investment guideline

In 2006, NATO Defence Ministers agreed to commit a minimum of 2% of their Gross Domestic Product (GDP) to defence spending to continue to ensure the Alliance's military readiness."

"The combined wealth of the non-US Allies, measured in GDP, is almost equal to that of the United States. However, non-US Allies together spend less than half of what the United States spends on defence. This imbalance has been a constant, with variations, throughout the history of the Alliance and has grown more pronounced since the tragic events of 11 September 2001, after which the United States significantly increased its defence spending. The volume of US defence expenditure represents approximately two thirds of the defence spending of the Alliance as a whole."

www.nato.int/.../topics_67655.htm

[Juxtapose]

Trump has good business acumen in insisting that his allies pay their fair share instead of hoisting the majority of the cost of a multinational organization onto the United States.

If my country is going to be paying for NATO's so much, my country should own NATO.

[Juxtapose]

*NATO's defense so much

[DryGermanGuy]

Actually, it is you who is wrong because you are completely confused about the setup and structure of the whole NATO organization. Primarily you are confusing the organizational costs/budget with the military budget of individual member states. And Trump does so, too.

Quote:
NATO defense expenditure

Direct contributions
Member states pay for NATO's three common funds (the civil and military budgets and the security investment program) based on a cost-sharing formula that includes per capita gross national income and other factors. In 2023–2024, the United States and Germany were the biggest contributors with 16.2% each.

Indirect contributions
Member states pay for and maintain their own troops and equipment. They contribute to NATO operations and missions by committing troops and equipment on a voluntary basis. Since 2006, the goal has been for each country to spend at least 2 percent of its gross domestic product on its own defense. [...]

en.wikipedia.org/.../NATO#NATO_defense_expenditure

[goaded]

He'll claim wikipedia isn't a valid source because he can't be bothered to follow the references in the article.

[Juxtapose]

Yeah no, Wikipedia is not a valid source.

And they are still obligated to pay their fair share otherwise why the fuck is the United States a part of that organization? If we pay the majority of the cost then we should own them.

[goaded]

It's not my fault you're too lazy to visit the page and check the sources. It's not like you follow the links anyway, is it? Ad hominem is so much easier than addressing the argument.

[DryGermanGuy]

@Juxtapose
Then again here is the original NATO source, if you have the time to read the much longer text instead the Wikipedia summary, go right ahead:
www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/topics_67655.htm
So, with the small Germany paying the same operational amount (16,2%) as the large United States, does that mean Germany should also "own" NATO?

And lastly, as food for thought, the only country ever to trigger NATO Article 5 and request military assistance from the allies was, you probably guessed it, the United States.

[Sasahara]

Maybe the old coot actually belive Trump said that. Either way, he most likely said to make Trump look bad. Not that it matters to leftists if he lied intentionally or not, they will still support him because he is not Donald. If you check out Biden questions here on GaG you will after a short while notice that a bunch of them has negative answers about Trump or "at least he is not Trump" answers.

[AviatorTom]

Haven't you noticed that, inside the word politician, is a little LI? Lying goes with the territory.

[AngryCarl]

Trump probably didn't use those exact words to Putin, and yes Biden makes stuff up all the time. It's pretty embarrassing.

Biden

[BoopBoopBeep]

This is why men like Zell Miller left the party.

[patois]

He's a Biden... That means he's a crackhead. It's crazy that Democrats vote for crackheads these days.

[exitseven]

I think that after being in politics since the 70s Biden can no longer tell the difference between the truth and the lies hw spews. For him, I imagine, lying is just like breathing to him

[Avicenna]

Biden's low approval ratings show that most people know he's a liar and a criminal

[DJB72]

My guess - electrodes on his balls controlled by Klaus Schwab...

[genericname85]

cause that's what all politicians do. they lie so you vote for them. none of them is ever any different.

[goaded]

LMAO at a Trump supporter talking about lies!

[goaded]

Orban did just visit Trump, said Trump wouldn't send any money to Ukraine, Trump has said he got a "beautiful letter" from Kim Jong Un, and maybe Trump didn't phone Putin and say he should do whatever he wants, but he publicly said he would encourage Russia to do “whatever the hell they want” to any NATO member country that doesn’t meet spending guidelines, so how much do you think he'd defend a non-NATO ally?

About as much as he defended the US ally against ISIL, the Kurds, when he gave the green light to Turkey to steal their land.

[OtterMan68]

you want me to list all of Trump's lies about what people told him?

[goaded]

Anything with the words "sir" and "tears".

[OtterMan68]

@goaded EXACTLY!

[Sasahara]

@OtterMan68 He did not ask you to list Trump’s lies, he asked Why did Biden outright lie.

[goaded]

@Sasahara So Trump didn't say “In fact, I would encourage them [Russia] to do whatever the hell they want."?

"NATO has a target that each member country spends a minimum of 2% of gross domestic product on defense, and most countries are not meeting that target. But the figure is a guideline and not a binding contract, nor does it create “bills”; member countries haven’t been failing to pay their share of NATO’s common budget to run the organization. "
edition.cnn.com/.../index.html

There were also a few wonderful decades when Russia wasn't threatening the peace, unlike the USSR.

[Sasahara]

@goaded I never said anything about what Trump did or did not said. I pointed out that the question is "Why did Biden outright lie?" not make a list of lies told by Trump. Otter her answered "Why did Biden outright lie?" with asking asker if he wants a list over lies Trump have made. If asker wanted that, that would have been what he asked for.

[Sasahara]

@goaded How about we ask the asker if this question was ment to ask for a list of lies told by Trump.
@Juxtapose When you wrote "Why did Biden outright lie?" did you mean to ask for why Biden lied, as your question looks like to me, or were your question intended to ask for a list of lies told by Trump? If so, you should have mentioned that somewere in your question.

[goaded]

@Sasahara I'm pointing out that whether or not the message to Putin was in a phone call or a public statement pales into insignificance to the message itself: Trump said "I would encourage them [Russia] to do whatever the hell they want" to NATO allies.

[KrakenAttackin]

Because he can say anything and the media/party apparatus will cover for him. Pretty remarkable to have this kind of unconditional support.

[OddBeMe]

I don't know. He’s old and he’s not under oath. Already beats Trump.

[gorydetails]

Biden is an insufferable liar.

[Wiredone]

He doesn't know how to tell the truth

[PrettyCrumblBb]

Because he's a politician.

[BLP11520]

he has been lying his whole career🤔