Is toxic masculinity or toxic feminism more prevalent in the west?

[HawkPerception]

Toxic masculinity

Toxic feminism

[alice55]

The west is an incorrect words to use in this case I believe, the whole toxic masculinity only exist in America not in Europe / France (at least in in Western / northern Europe, more in Russia / Ukraine where men must be macho but are treated as trash and killed in war or alcoholic or during random street fight).

In Europe toxic masculinity do not exist since a very long time and popular men of now are towards the skinny side with a pretty face, for example the one considered as very attractive here are Timothee Chalamet and Pierre Niney (who played a gay character and it did not pose any problem to anybody it was seen as normal because he's ac actor unlike in America where when the actor of Spiderman played a gay character it made a lot of people not happy).

Another was was very popular and seen as the most attractive during his youth was Thierry Lhermitte who was also pretty lanky

thierry-lhermitte-dans-film-les-bronzes-1978-601x428.jpeg

There's also no behavior forced on men except making their girlfriend feel protected and paying for the first date (girls would pay for the second just never the first).

As for toxic feminism as in women hating on men is it extremely rare in France, never met anybody hating on men, just some old women saying they're better alone because they're more free, can do what they want, can watch what they want on tv an eat when they want but nothing to do this feminism more tired women who had to both work full-time, took care of their husband and children so now they want to relax

[alice55]

Those are act French icons are for men in France
Thierry Lhermitte :
sf1.telestar.fr/.../...s-bronzes-1978-601x428.jpeg

Alain Delon considered as being the Man, the real one in France :
easyreadernews.com/.../...scine-Delon-600x365.jpeg



Body for men in French ideal have always been pretty lanky even in the 60s

[alice55]

Thanks for the MHO ^^

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

Ah, a fellow french (or foreign living in france?) salutations!
I concur, there is no gender based toxicity I can see in common places in my town either. Though I disagree with the rule you said about women paying at the second date only, I mean my own experience makes me disagree here :D

Now I'm surprised to see "french body" archetypes featured in the topic, especially icons from the 80's, Lhermitte, Delon, why featuring them, considering the topic we're on? 😅

[alice55]

@Maybe_Maybe_not I'm French ^^
Is it good to see another French on here is it pretty rare

I mean is it not so much a rule but I know some women that does it (more in the form of a coffee though than a full on date)

I think the while toxicity between gender is an American things.

Because in America they consider toxic masculinity as body trait too, body type popular in America is overly muscular body (to the point of taking steroid and having an unnatural body is it seen as the most attractive body) a bit like Captain American or Thor actors. A lot of American men complain about this and is it also considered as toxic because is it football player body type that majority cannot achieve without medicament / steroid dangerous for the heathy who also make people become "aggressive" (which is usually seen as the only emotion a man can show without being called a "pussy" in America).
It been more than 8 years I'm on this site so I'm pretty roughed up" in what American standard are like and what they consider as "toxic masculinity" its both behavior and body trends.
Leaner body type just as French standard of beauty are more natural and healthier than the whole overly muscular beauty trends of American for the body.

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

You are also the first french I see, but I'm fairly new here :)

Okay, I see why you are featuring body comparison now, I'm not an expert at all in US culture, so I never know exactly when I'm facing clichés or real culture, thanks for this explanation, makes sense !

[alice55]

@Maybe_Maybe_not there's another one here currently I think is Julie4 or something similar :)

Over the years i only saw less than 10 French people on here we're pretty rare.

I only did it because the body standard also "influence" the youth is it better to look up to people having natural body without plastic surgery who are attainable for every regular person than having a standard of beauty / body looking like Arnold schwarzenegger XD

One is easier and healthier to get the other is just full on dangerous for a persons not followed by a professional trainer / nutritionist. :)

The whole overlymuscular body is really their standard of body for men there, is it the real ideal, especially in the South of America this is where the whole "cliche" things are pretty much a reality. The prudish reputation come from the Southern states because California or New York can definitely not be considered as prudish at all.

They kind of take everything to the extrem in America, body standard, women / men personality of what's masculine what's feminine etc...

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

Thanks for all these infos really, I'm barely beginning to scratch north American culture, it's been months I'm investigating but there's a lot to procees as the country is really diverse and features a wide (and wild lol) range of worldviews and subcultures, compared to here

[DizzyDesii]

I still dont know the definition of those phrases/sayings/words… in short, i dont believe in that shit

[HawkPerception]

Toxic masculinity refers to cultural norms and behaviours that enforce a narrow and often harmful definition of masculinity. It emphasizes traits such as aggression, emotional suppression, dominance, misogyny, hyper competitiveness, and devaluation of anything perceived as feminine.

Toxic feminism refers to the extreme or radical aspects of feminist thought and behaviour that can perpetuate negative stereotypes, hostility, or intolerance towards men or traditional gender roles. It's characteristics include misandry, victim mentality, exclusion of different perspectives, overgeneralization, and an intolerance of criticism.

[DizzyDesii]

I technically know what it means but i dont believe in it. Its like any man being a man these days is considered toxic. Hollywood and that kpop shit continue to try to influence men in this world to be feminine. And as for women I don't know what to say but a lot of real women are considered karens. I’m not defending the intentionally racist women but some women of every ethnicity are now being called “toxic” and karens. Its annoying.

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

Playing the relativity is relative game that I love, what is West? Baby don't hurt me? Seriously, what it is, is it the west as seen in US, in Finland, in Spain? They have things in common, but also a lot to differentiate with.

Relative painting being painted, yes, there is a cultural and existential war at play between feminity and masculinity. It can get ugly when toxicity is involved, but it doesn't need to be toxic. You can be a woman with traditional values without literally shitting on trans & lgbt. Like you can be non-binary without shitting on christians & white texans driving a chevy lol. Moderation in worldviews does exist, right?

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

hmm yeah, I forgot myself, the t of lgbt already designates trans, right

[Dargil]

" Toxic masculinity goes back 25,000 years, Toxic Feminazism comes and goes depending on war and economics. They cling to men whenever the schiff hits the fan And it soon will.

[DishLady]

Both jointly, which is where we have the problem of both genders assuming the worst of the other and being defensive rather than understanding.