The downfall of feminism?

[Anonymous]

Do you think as women realize the negative impact of feminism to masculinity and the dating pool, that feminism will end?

[Anonymous]

they won't. they'll just double down on their misery and try to inflict their bad choices onto other women but they won't matter

men will realize the negative impact of feminism and eventually enforce it out of the world provided they do it as a collective which they're already trending towards

men are the enforcement arm of society thus any physical force, laws, resources, rights etc. are all owned and only allowed by men to exist. most men in the military, police etc. are somewhat red-pilled. even the feds are but they play along with the corrupt government to enforce blue-pilled thinking

if a small group of men like the Taliban can rid feminism completely out of Afghanistan, the same can happen in the west

no feminism allowed otherwise no food, water, electricity, internet etc.

no feminism allowed otherwise no protection from murderers, rapists or bears

no feminism allowed otherwise no rescuing from natural disasters

no feminism allowed otherwise no help lifting heavy stuff, fixing stuff etc.

if feminists wanna play strong, independent, modern woman, then let them try. there's a reason why there's no feminists around when shit gets tough

all liberalism including feminism is destined to fail. the question is whether or not conservatism gets dragged down with them or not

[AhmetHasanCan]

yes it will end.

Because it had the opposite effect, women wanted to want equality in the beginning.

But this has become a war, they want privilege not freedom. Over time, women became more masculine and men became more lazy.

Now women are not happy with this situation, they want those old strong masculine men back

[emeraldsaphire]

No, I don't think Feminism is hurting the dating pool or "masculinity" I do think guys need to be more careful about the women they spend time with though. Most women I know are vary careful around men, and for good reason, but women can be just as dangerous. Sure they are probably less likely to rape you, but they can do far worse with fake allegations. Sure most women would never do that, but most men wouldn't rape women either.

This is why Feminism is important, we need to treat women and men the same way. Sure you have some craptivists who just wan to make some cash, but over all Feminism has been good for men and women.

[CuriousMoonFox]

Craptivists 😂 I love verbal innovation.

[Asker]

I think you come from a kind hearted place for sure but I’d have to disagree. Especially considering women are just as likely if not more likely to rape men the statistics are blurred thanks to toxic masculinity telling men not to be themselves along with toxic femininity. Also there are too many women in there late 20’s-30’s literally crying making videos about how they can’t get a good man but it boils down to men no longer want to date these superficial women who use double standards and hold delusional beliefs.

[MzAsh]

I think we’re in a transition of men and women navigating relationships with each other on more equal footing. Men don’t want to share the man card, but they’re going to have to suck it up. And women don’t want to have to share financial responsibilities but they’re going to have it suck it up too.

[Asker]

Feminist Women literally fought for the right to share financial responsibility by fighting for the right to work despite the fact women already held jobs. But men held dangerous jobs men still hold the majority dangerous jobs. Men don’t want to share the men card because we are men “MEN” not women, there is and always be a difference, mentally, physically. And if you think women can be men you’re lying to yourself and giving in to the social delusion.

[MzAsh]

Of course there are differences between men and women, not denying that. There’s also a certain identity that men tend to tie to their masculinity, but many of these traits aren’t exclusive to men.

[Asker]

Can you elaborate on those traits, because I agree some men have a toxic self identity that they think they have to uphold however there are also certain things a man should do. To exhibit masculine traits twords friends, family and love interests that’s my belief anyways

[MzAsh]

Well, a large degree of men would like to think of themselves as providers, but most simply can’t afford to do so. They want to think of themselves as leaders, but so many are too untrustworthy. Many would like to think of themselves as protectors, yet, statistically, the biggest threat to women are their partners. This is why women seek more independence and agency in their relationships instead of forging the path of the stay at home wife.

[Asker]

I can agree on some of those points however when it comes to the biggest threat being their partner, I disagree. Weak men give men who can provide, protect and lead a bad name by being male. It’s what leads to blanket statements such as the claim men are the most dangerous. It’s also what leads to men having to ask what women bring to the table. You can’t expect certain traditional values and not hold up on both sides. Also it doesn’t take a lot of money to provide, it’s excessive greed that leads both genders to financial ruin and disappointment. Average yearly income is $50,000. I’m raising a family on less. I’ve learned most men not only don’t know how to be a man but also never took the chance to learn what it means to provide. How learning financial literacy is important. How change and growth is necessary to being a better man for yourself and for finding a suitable partner. Feminism has made women greedy wanting to be the man and get the man. You can’t expect me to protect and provide if my needs aren’t met. Another toxic trait taught by feminism to men was being a nice guy, nice guy syndrome has lead to so many guys getting friend zoned and leading to toxic thinking on how dating, sex, and other masculine behavior and acts work people wonder why nice guys finish last when its what women preach about wanting. However it just teaches men to not be themselves and to lose confidence.

[MzAsh]

Women are statistically more likely to be harmed by their partners than by strangers. It’s an uncomfortable truth, but one that cannot be brushed aside simply because it’s uncomfortable or inconvenient.

Financial provision is more than just meeting the bare minimum. You are responsible for ensuring security and stability, which, in many parts of the U. S., is tough on $50k due to the cost of living, healthcare, and unexpected emergencies. The goal isn’t about living extravagantly, but securely, which is a reasonable expectation, not a greedy one.

The issue I have with many men’s idea of the role of leader and provider is that they only think in terms of physical or financial, but there’s much more involved. Emotional support, creating a safe and nurturing environment, and demonstrating reliability and trustworthiness are all part of the package that men must provide.

Lastly, on the nice guy trope. Being genuinely nice is never an issue. The problem arises when nice is used as a manipulative tool, expecting romantic or sexual rewards merely for showing basic decency. Women don’t owe anyone their affection in return for niceness. A man can always reject interactions when they have been romantically rejected by her. No woman is ever holding a gun to a man’s head forcing him to be friend zoned. He can walk away.

[Asker]

Again points I agree with and ones I don’t. When it comes to lgbtq relationships when it comes to lesbian vs gay relationships, statistical data shows that lesbian relationships end in domestic abuse, and end due to feeling like one partner doesn’t meet their emotional needs. Gay relationships have problems but not like the women.

And strangers being abusive are a small few. Almost ever masculine man would help and protect a woman relationship or not. Living in a low income area but holding a leadership position I see many differences in both masculine men and those who claim to be for feminism. The ones who are for feminism have always had nice guy syndrome and rage not to mention the studies on men that contradicts what feminism teaches. If you want to better understand my beliefs I can give some references for videos with some of my beliefs.

When it comes to the leader and provider role that’s an earned trait. You don’t get that out the gate. Like sure first date I can see picking the place time and date but the rest is over time as trust and knowledge of each other is established. Only simps give that in the beginning and simps are the ones who uses kindness as manipulative tools it’s also what I call nice guy syndrome. And it’s not intentional. however by being taught not to be themselves (masculine) in place they believe being nice alone untitled them to have their needs met. They don’t understand but it’s also no excuse not to learn either. Another issue is dating standards and people rating themselves higher than they are.

[MzAsh]

I’m interested in viewing those videos to better understand where you’re coming from. Please share the links.

Regarding the leader and provider roles being earned traits, I agree to an extent. Men must demonstrate they’re worthy of their role as a leader and provider. It’s a two-way street. Women today have substantial options and are in a position to choose partners first, who not only match their effort but also genuinely enhance their lives.

[Asker]

Honestly if you, YouTube whatever podcast they tend to interview the product of feminism aka: only fans girls but I will try to find specific ones.

[MzAsh]

The whatever podcast cherry picks young bubble headed girls to humiliate on their show, and tries to paint them the example of modern women. What does their videos say about your views?

[Asker]

I consider those bubble headed girls, the kind of women men typically come across in the dating pool and all have feminist beliefs. Full of double standards. I’ve came across only women like them however I also have met women where I was the problem and had to grow. I became that weak man due to following feminism and when I stopped I was able to get better results. In the world of trial and error learning what works and what’s toxic to you is some of the ways you succeed in becoming a better version of you. Women shouldn’t normalize sex. Women shouldn’t try to be men.

[MzAsh]

If you’re into the Whatever podcast and running into women like that, you’re swimming around in the shallow end of the pool. Mature, thoughtful men and women aren’t hanging in those shallow ends. Can you identify the differences between the two?

You mentioned ditching feminism brought you “better results.” Can you clarify what results you’re referring to?

Regarding sex and gender roles, Why should women adhere to your standard of not normalizing sex? What makes you the authority on that?

Women, like men, have the right to embrace their sexuality without stigma. I believe as long as they safe and informed, they can have sex with whoever they want.

And this notion of women not trying to be men, what does that mean exactly? Women are constantly called masculine for the most basic adult things, and it’s ridiculous.

You’re inviting a trial and error approach for personal growth. Why should it be any different for women? Because I know what’s gotten me results too, and it’s not what a lot men try to tell me, not knowing I’ve already been happily married for 17 years.

Let’s hear some concrete explanations instead of sweeping generalizations.

[Asker]

The difference between the two? I’m not gonna say I’m just amazing and perfect for my beliefs, I’m still learning how to articulate my views without coming off as a dick. As for ditching feminism, it fed me this lie that if you’re a good guy you get more out of life not realizing it made me just an entitled prick. It basically said toxic masculinity was generally anything associated with masculine things or aggression was bad or that disagreeing with women was wrong aka women are always right 🙄. I’ve learned to be kind without expectations and I’ve learned how effective the word no is. I’ve learned to put myself first because I can’t support a family if I’m stressing over my own needs.

I don’t expect all women to change that would be impossible. What I was trying to say was that high body counts don’t interest me and it’s a shame women have forgotten that if you’re willing to give it up on the first date, you’re basically a sex toy. Men won’t respect you and many won’t wanna date you. But there are outliers. And gender rolls? There are only 2 genders biologically and scientifically. So no I think gender rolls are straight forward however this idea that the woman is a trapped slave is such a joke. A lie planted in your head that lead to this joke of a system where now both partners have to work and kids are raised by the government. Feminism can’t accurately define a woman.

[Asker]

By what I mean about women being men, is the fact that by trying to be what your not your like someone trying to hard and just being fake. Women dressing in sweats… everywhere, women letting themselves get unhealthy because body positivity, and oh it’s not a choice🙄 it’s scientifically proven it’s a choice. Unless you have an unfixable health issue you have no excuse to be in an unhealthy state. But agin it’s just my opinion.

[MzAsh]

You’re mixing a lot of personal frustrations with broad generalizations about feminism and gender roles. Feminism isn’t about making men weak or women right, it’s about equality and respect for individual choices, including how someone decides to handle their sexual life.

High body counts or sexual freedom isn’t what defines a woman’s value, respect and consent do. Also, equating women who have sex on the first date to “sex toys” signals a lack of respect and understanding of consent and autonomy. I encourage women to be safe and make informed decisions about their sex lives, and I also encourage them to refrain from giving it up to unworthy men, but there’s a line between that and slut shaming, which is something we aren’t tolerating.

Lastly, while there are indeed biological genders, many of the roles society assigns to these genders have evolved. Women can wear sweat pants, and be the breadwinner, the decision maker, the boss, and still maintain a womanhood they’ve defined for themselves. Women are not simply delicate little flowers who bake cookies and take care of the kids. And although I encourage women to be healthy and in shape, no one is obligated to be a certain level of fitness or healthy. People can choose to be unhealthy, or fat, or drug addicts, Or unhygienic. I’m not saying they should or that’s good, but at the end of the day, the rest of us just have to get over it.

[Asker]

The tenets of feminism, a book about feminism says otherwise, and I feel you’re taking what I say to heart and not understanding I said sweat pants all the time. I’m applying this all to healthy dating and regardless of culture or civilization biology stands strong. And you’re right some of this is personal as I’m stating personal preference of most guys. They have done surveys over what men and women find attractive about one another surely that tells us what people desire yet we still argue because at the end of the day we are all individuals with our own wants desires and needs. Yet patterns can’t be ignored. When a majority has a preference and you cater to the minority you cut your options down, that has been my main point if I’m going to work and making the money that pays for the food, lights, water, and Any other bills, if I’m paying for your health care and your gym membership. And all of your needs are met, there should be that balance of you taking care of the house. If I put in the work to look good and be in shape you should too. I want my kids homeschooled. The results show it’s a better method and even most rich people didn’t go to a public school. Or at least finish it.

[Asker]

And who said anything about them being delicate flowers you have to be tough to be a mom, and the majority of women believe it or not unless it’s just because of algorithms want to be stay at home moms and hate that they have to work a 9-5

[MzAsh]

The thing is, feminism isn’t one voice. It clearly means different things to different people. How would you define feminism?

I’m not concerned with what the majority of men want. I focus on good men only who respect and value women, and not just as companions who meet traditional expectations.

Regarding your point on supporting a family financially while expecting a partner to maintain appearances and manage domestic duties, if that’s mutually agreed upon and upheld then that’s fair. Many women, including myself, prefer to work, contribute equally, or even be the primary earners. The traditional household model isn’t the only viable or desirable option anymore.

If we’re to support stay-at-home mothers or wives, society must ensure they’re adequately respected, appreciated, and compensated for their often invisible labor. This includes providing them with opportunities for personal growth and respite. Instead, most stay at home moms and wives are under way too much control and stress.

As a result of the control and stress, many women are choosing paths where they feel most valued, which increasingly isn’t just within the confines of their homes. As long as societal structures fail to fully appreciate and support women’s domestic roles, this trend will continue. Women are smart and will navigate towards where they feel valued, be that at work or in roles outside traditional norms. We need a serious reevaluation of how we support and respect all choices women make.

[Asker]

https://youtu.be/B0jFWV5cSNY?si=llqVe16WAA4ox3NK

[Asker]

Found the video that aligns with my views

[Asker]

https://youtu.be/TolnEJWiS54?si=9ZgOoJ-END2wVdtY

[Asker]

I think this one explains my views on feminism and literally these videos have no bullying. It many women vs 2 but it’s from the pov of Brett cooper

[MzAsh]

There are valid points made there, but there’s also a few fundamentals I disagree with.

Feminism today recognizes that women have more choices than ever, and with those choices come both opportunities and challenges. The idea that hookup culture is universally detrimental to women oversimplifies a complex reality. Many women, including myself, have experienced phases in our lives where exploring sexual relationships without the pressure of immediate long term commitment has been empowering and positive. The key here is having the discernment to choose partners who respect and enhance our lives in some way, regardless of the relationship’s longevity.

Critics often link feminism to a supposed decline in happiness among women, suggesting that increased freedom and choices have led to increased dissatisfaction. But this fails to acknowledge the deeper issue, which is the challenge isn’t the choices themselves, but how we are equipped to handle them. The so-called paradox of choice might overwhelm some, but the solution isn’t to restrict women’s options, it’s to better prepare for a world rich with possibility.

Gender roles work for some but not for all. Our society must accept that traditional paths, like staying at home, are not the sole blueprints for a fulfilling life. Many women thrive in roles outside these norms, finding satisfaction in careers and personal independence.

The discussion on mental health is more about increasing awareness and resources than a direct indictment of feminism. Mental health challenges reflect a myriad of factors, including but not limited to societal changes. As we become more aware, people need the tools to manage stress and make choices that align with their individual needs, rather than prescribing a one-size-fits-all approach to life and happiness.

Modern feminism is on expanding the mold to fit diverse experiences and aspirations. Every woman has the right to define and pursue her happiness, free from societal judgment.

[Anonymous]

There's no question feminism has done done good things, back in the day. But for the last 10 - 15 years it has done far more harm than good, not just to men and boys, but to women and girls too. Women are less happy today than at any time in recorded history, the sexes are more divided than ever, the nuclear family is in shambles, and yes, we have feminism to thank for that.

[Agape93]

So wanting equality hurts masculinity? It's that fragile?

[Asker]

Feminism has been about women wanting to be men and tell men how to be masculine. If it was about equality, double standards wouldn’t be there but it is a hot take so if you wanna define a few things before a debate breaks out I’m open to hear your logic.

[Agape93]

Nope. Feminism is about wanting equality between men and women, period. Nothing else.

[Asker]

That’s the surface belief however men and women are already equal in the sense of rights and pay.

[Agape93]

Not really. Some companies still pay women less, and women are actively having their rights taken away with it expecting to worsen next year. If we were equal, then feminism wouldn't be needed or even really valid. But sadly we aren't there yet.

[Asker]

Then those women should sue because it is literally illegal for a company to pay up less for doing the same exact job at the same exact intensity putting out the same results however women choosing lower paying jobs is not a man’s fault. Or the patriarchy. Most feminist values women don’t want but the government is more than happy to take 2 income tax paychecks from a household. If anything men are disadvantaged the reason dating is a train wreck is due to feminist beliefs.

[Agape93]

Illegal doesn't mean much if you aren't likely to win or you have bigger priorities in life. Companies do illegal shit every day, even after being found guilty.

Again, how does dating someone who wants equality, at all negatively impact dating? That doesn't make sense

[Asker]

You’re assuming the desire for equality is what is winning feminism is full of cognitive dissonance maybe you as an individual are this amazing person who does believe in equality and understand that men and women are different with different needs and if so that’s amazing but that’s not the reality of modern day feminism

[Agape93]

As I've said on here dozens of times already, ALL feminism is, is a desire for equality. Period. What most guys like you misunderstand willingly, is that if a woman is sexist and calls herself a feminist, is not at all a feminist. That's like conflating a good dad with a child abuser who claims he's a good dad, and using him as an example of why being a dad is bad.

[Asker]

What comes to mind when you think of a traditional type man?

[Agape93]

Depends on the culture. Can you specify? What is traditional as a man in Germany is very different than in Japan or in the USA.

[Asker]

Fair enough well then let’s say I’m more traditional as an American, I believe the man should make the money to better his family and living situation, while the woman stays home and takes care of the home front. Equality through equivalent exchange. However I can’t say I know what traditional is for Germany and though I lived in Korea for a year I never got to experience Korean home life.

[Agape93]

Sounds like my parents. Dad made the money, mom didn't do shit.

[Miristheiss]

Women often don't know what is good for them.

[Asker]

I mean sometimes for sure.

[Anonymous]

Here for your weekly internet cry because you can’t get a date?

[Asker]

No, I got a beautiful woman I’m proud of but, it’s okay. Jumping to conclusions is expected.

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

There are no negative impacts of feminism to women

[Asker]

But it’s misleading women, and causing misery for both men and women giving delusional advice and double standards. So how is it not hurting women?

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

The patriarchy does more harm to both men and women than feminism

[Asker]

Can you define patriarchy?

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

A society with a male majority ruling class that’s often politically conservative

[Asker]

Okay making sure we got our terms right, now explain how that’s bad

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

The laws and rules and general societal ongoings will unfairly favor men over women

[Asker]

I disagree in society women hold more power they lead relationships, women are more likely to win in court against men unless they have absolute I refutable evidence. Women are more likely to gain custody over kids, they are guaranteed paternal peace of mind. Also women serve smaller sentences than men. There are many ways in which women have the advantage.

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

Women “win” more money in court because they make less on average. If she made more, she would be responsible for child support, evidence of the pay gap. I agree that family court is unfairly biased in favor of women, feminism is working to correct this. If women have lighter sentences, it may be because of this bias but also because showing remorse gets you a lighter sentence

[Asker]

Majority female offenders repeat their offenses once free. And if women would take up jobs in the areas where there are no women, and be able to perform on the same level then the data you’re referring to would equal out however women don’t take the high paying jobs that men do because they can’t preform the same tasks at the same rate as the men in that career, it’s why there are no female navy seals, and almost no women on oil rigs, the date you provide takes pay for all jobs not accounting for the lack of women’s existence in the ones they can’t physically or mentally perform.

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

Statistic data can always be manipulated depending on one’s sample size, you’re right. My point about child support still holds, however

[Asker]

In most cases the man would support the child without the need of child support enforcement. Feminism promotes promiscuous behaviors as well there are many men paying child support for a kid that could be 1 of 3 other guys. Feminism also miss characterizes toxic masculinity. Guys are literally scared of women and women aren’t happy yet that’s what feminism has brought. A bunch of men who are scared to be men.

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

The patriarchy scares men more than women do. It’s why male suicide rates are higher, because they can’t meet the intense social standards placed upon them and then don’t seek help as a result of those same standards

[Asker]

Can you give me an example of these standards you mean?

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

“Men have to be tough and strong” = you can show no emotion accept anger because that’s manly and you can’t go to the doctor’s because you will look weak. You can’t have any weakness or vulnerability which is why male friendships, on average, aren’t as communicative or emotionally vulnerable as female friendships because if a girl tells her friend she loves her, it’s a compliment. If a guy tells his friend he loves him, he’s gay.

[Asker]

Ah so the toxic masculinity standards taught after feminism that may be misconstrued. Tough and strong doesn’t mean you can’t show emotion. It means if I get a scrape I should probably not cry about it because crying isn’t gonna help in that situation. If you don’t go to the doctor when you’re hurt you’re either dumb or you have determined your wound is not doctor worthy. And male relationships are weak due to men not knowing how to interact with men and by not knowing who we are our suicide rates are up, we are lonely because we can do things by the feminist book and be labeled a nice guy, women don’t want a man who gives them their way they want a man who’s a man a provider, and protector some one who uses logic when emotions are high. Feminism has also lead to in real expectations asking for someone who makes $100,000+ a year wanting a protector and provider but not offering anything beyond basic relationships expectations. And sometimes less than. I know I’m all over the place with my points but this all connects to the singular point I’m making which is feminism makes women less feminine and men less masculine

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

You’re blaming all the faults of patriarchy and gender roles on feminism like that isn’t exactly what the patriarchy has taught you to do

[Asker]

I’m using my eyes and seeing exactly what it is, I used to be a feminist, I used to think oh I’m a nice guy which has to be the most toxic thing a guy can think because it leads to this terrible belief that’s reinforced by feminist belief that if we are nice, say yes and never disagree give you all your needs and ignore ours then we deserve love and sex and our needs will be met on the back end but that’s not how it works. It’s selfish thinking and even women are repulsed by this behavior that’s not masculine men can be emotional with friends and family but when it comes to your partner a man should never be emotionally vulnerable with their partner.

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

If you were a nice guy, you weren’t kind. You acted out of the assumption of reward, not out of any genuine desire for kindness

[Asker]

I agree. Whole heartedly and that was the toxic traits I picked up as a result of being raised by my mother, being told men and masculinity is wrong. Being told to be the opposite of healthy masculine behavior

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

I think a 20-post long reply chain is enough. If you want to keep talking about this, DM me. Otherwise, I’m done

[Asker]

Agreed, I’ll message when I get this profile level up

[Astarlessnightsky]

What negative impact?

[Asker]

The large number of men who don’t know how to be a man, loneliness epidemic of men, women with delusional expectations of men. The list goes on.

[Anonymous]

Get out and ride a bike.

[Asker]

I do from time to time, exercise is important