What's next as 12 states sue Trump arguing that tariffs "upended the constitutional order and brought chaos to the American economy"?

[Anonymous]

https://rollcall.com/2025/04/23/twelve-states-ask-trade-court-to-halt-trump-tariffs/

[DrPepper12]

Well because the GOP party is a big believer in states rights and local rule, the federal government will defer to the state out of respect for federalism.

Nah. JK. Trump is going to tell the states to go fuck themselves and a spineless Congress is going to continue to acquiesce to an orange fascist scumbag trader rapist thief fraud rather than preserve their institutional powers

[slatyb]

Constitutionally Congress has authority over tariffs but the Republicans in Congress are cowards and won't do anything to prevent Trump from destroying things.

[blackeagle007]

Yea and that’s why they are getting grief in their hometowns. All they want is to have each others back. Mid terms coming!

[MisterWack]

Well it ruined free trade between all nations of the world and The United States of America, it was used as a bargaining chip by threatening world leaders for political gain, and made America more difficult to deal with in the foreseeable future.

Let me explain, we will always be at a trade deficit because what we get in return is more valuable than money alone. When you go to your baker, you buy bread by handing them money while you are handed back bread. What comes from that is, positive experience between you and the baker along with an understanding that you lost money for a good & service while the baker understands I gained money for providing a good & service. Trump is like punching that baker in the face for never giving him money.

Apparently, the trade between USA’s greatest trade partner, Canada was $2.7 billion of goods & services each day in the year 2023 alone. Do you think threatening to raise tariffs without a clear plan or easily accessible page illustrating what Trump Administration wants to achieve / how they’ll go about it will A) Make the economy stronger and instill stability with our trade partner OR B) Make the economy shaky and instill instability also concern amongst the Canadian people?

B) ✅ Because Canadians are now buying less American product than they once have, the stock markets went down significantly due to the scare what it would do to the economy, and Trump Administration seems to change its mind every two seconds first it was “tariffs April 2nd” then it was “90 day pause because of people being YIPPEE”. This isn’t good, this isn’t how a President behaves or his consitutents of his own cabinet since no one tells him off like, “Hey this might be a bad idea”.

I love this country and I love our partners, want to see free trade reign supreme and to put trust back into those that make our economy strong rather than poking them in the eyes. It is sad to see this happen. Also weren’t tariffs supposed to lower prices? Trump promised that and haven’t seen one cent decrease on anything at the grocery store.

[Avicenna]

I'm surprised that no one seems to have asked or mentioned what authority on tariffs that legislation has granted the President. Here is some of them:

https://customsandinternationaltradelaw.com/2025/03/27/presidential-powers-and-tariffs-a-breakdown-of-key-trade-laws/

https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/how-congress-delegates-its-tariff-powers-to-the-president

[Zack-Bann]

The show goes on like it always has


A while back this app was flooded with questions saying “What’s next for Trump after getting convicted?”
Welp, president.


It’s useless to get worked up about these things. They will always follow a certain natural progression

[contentious]

It's pretty much a no-brainer that the 12 states will lose being that Congress has the authority to delegate tariff modification to the President to regulate foreign commerce. There are 50 states, 12 object and 38 either support the President or are neutral currently. Furthermore, Republicans control both the House and Senate and should easily win any vote in support of delegation of authority to the President on the matter.

[AviatorTom]

The courts should dismiss each of these cases on a simple legal principle. Any disagreement about tariffs is, per the Constitution, between Congress and the President. States have no legal standing.

[AviatorTom]

But liberal judges don't follow the Constitution, they make their own laws.

[DrPepper12]

Absolutely 100% true The states have no standing. But Congress does, and they continue to erode their own institutional powers

[AviatorTom]

@DrPepper12 I agree. Not sure why the President doesn't get Congress, which his party controls, to establish the tariffs. Should be easy to do, not sure why it's not done that way.

[DrPepper12]

Cuz cowards don't like to go on record in public.

[exitseven]

How come this did not happen in Trump's first term when he imposed tariffs on steel and aluminum? These people are wasting their time and hopefully the voters remeber this next year.

[Asker]

It didn't happen in his first term because he didn't have all of the blind loyalists around him like now. Back then, there were enough competent people to be a guardrail... along with the courts.

[WhiteSteve]

Right here. This is the whole point. Tariffs on certain products, to encourage domestic production, totally fine. That’s the RIGHT way to use tariffs. Not my original line, but tariffs are “a scalpel, not a mallet.” Use them on specific industries to encourage growth at home rather than outsourcing. I can get behind that in many situations.

What’s incorrect is blanketing everywhere with them. And not for nothing, the Reagan era policies are why we outsource in the first place, and we stopped being a manufacturing economy, and became a service economy.

If we want to become manufacturers again, we can. But it can’t happen overnight, you need to have the groundwork laid down and probably close to a decade of reliable domestic supply chain IN OPERATION before cutting off the supply from elsewhere.

Also very important to remember that America doesn’t have the type of people anymore for manufacturing. Americans aren’t hard workers, they like desk jobs where you don’t break a sweat and don’t work long hours. And that’s not what factory work is. I don’t think we have the people for it, frankly. They’re deporting people who would work those jobs. Also, our labor laws would render our produced materials to being much more expensive. And all I hear is people bitching about the price of things, so I don’t think we’re suddenly going to start paying 5x on all of our shit, and still sing the national anthem at the register. All this “to pay more is patriotic”…. that sounds great and all, but no one will do that.

[WhiteSteve]

We made a decision decades ago that we prefer paying less money for things, and in order to provide that price point, our corporations outsource labor and materials-production to essentially third-world countries who don’t have sound labor laws. iPhones are expensive already, but you’ll have to be a 1%er to afford one if anything besides the retail leg of the process is in America, and it wasn’t assembled by an eight year old in Vietnam make 36 cents an hour. Imagine the price tag when a bunch of $15/hour workers are doing it.

It’s also not inherently bad to have trade deficits. A trade deficit, in some cases, just “is what it is”, and isn’t a sign of being ripped off or some other type of bad business. Madagascar makes like 80% of the vanilla in the world. We can’t grow it anywhere here, so we buy from them. Madagascar is also poor as fuck, so they aren’t buying iPhones and Cadillacs from us. So naturally, there’s going to be a stark trade imbalance, and that’s fine, because we want vanilla.

China, we can talk deeper about that trade imbalance, but like I said before…. that trade deficit is WHY we have cheap products to begin with. We aren’t necessarily “losing” in the grand scheme of things, it’s just a symbiotic relationship we have, largely because our citizens aren’t willing to do the work that Chinese are willing to do or have no better alternative options. Looking at a piece of paper and just saying “our number is lower than their number” and perceiving it as a rip-off is kindergarten economics.

[WhiteSteve]

What Trump is doing now is simply an economic paradigm shift that will require different expectations and lifestyle changes from what Americans currently know, and it would be a large step backwards for most people, even if it brought prosperity, which I think it won’t. We simply don’t have the population for factory work, we’re way too soft and demanding for that to ever work. Only desperate people take jobs like that, and we don’t have enough. Plus there are labor laws and unions and all that. It’d never work.

And the biggest problem is that Trump aims to generate revenue from this, and that’s a bad miscalculation. Maybe that worked in 1875 when America didn’t have the infrastructure to support, and other countries were still transporting goods with donkey-drawn carts, lmfao. There’s much more competition in the modern world, and I can’t stress enough that America has incredibly soft people who aren’t built for factory work. Our great-great-grandfathers are long gone.

It’s not going to work out in a way where we start making tons of money and we get rid of income taxes and all that other pie-in-the-sky shit. Always remember that these people are lying through their teeth, they don’t care about you or me, and this is all to facilitate huge tax breaks for people who need them the least, and they’re ham-handedly trying to make us think that tariffs and DOGE and all that, are in some way an effort to save you and I money, and if you believe that, I’d also like to sell you these magic beans, Jack. This is an administration of the wealthy, FOR the wealthy. If I could convince you successfully of anything, it would be that. These people are not our friends, and they don’t have our best interests in mind, only theirs.

[exitseven]

@WhiteSteve Once you start shipping jobs overseas it is hard to bring them back. Trump is trying to hang on to the steel and automobile industries. When they go, there goes the American middle class or what's left of it.

[WhiteSteve]

Definitely true, tough to reverse the outsourcing, because we’re now used to cheap goods. When the 86 cent plastic spatula from Walmart start costing $15 and you can’t carelessly leave it next to something hot anymore, regular folks will feel it, but people like Trump don’t care because they’re wealthy and anything under a six digit price tag, they’re not even going to look or notice. Trump doesn’t buy or use spatulas, lmao, he probably has a private chef at each of his homes, or lord knows he loves fast food. Swipe the card and the accountant will handle it, there’s no thought to it.

I’m all for keeping homegrown industries thriving, and that’s the correct usage of tariffs. The point shouldn’t be revenue generation, it’s the domestic industry protection and stimulation. But there’s a reality that we may need to face down where “middle class” would have to look like living in a one-room shack like it is in less developed countries, because we simply can’t compete with the cheap exports we can get from Asia and elsewhere.

Thats the paradigm shift that would have to happen, society as we know it would need to undergo a huge change. Workers need homes to go home to. Vietnam and China have lower standards of living for their working class. They probably don’t have cars, it’s just a whole different lifestyle that we would need to adopt in order to keep up with the prices. Americans scoff at the idea of any rollbacks in comfort, for any cause.

[WhiteSteve]

We’re in kind of a catch-22 where the wealthy are hoarding most of the money, dispense just enough for us to get by, barely, but only if you work way more than anyone should reasonably be asked to, these same wealth-hoarders are the ones who sell us our basic needs, and for some reason we voted for the wealthy guy who appointed his wealthy friends to cabinet positions and special task forces, and they dangle minor money in front of us with promises of tax cuts or some DOGE check that won’t be coming, and even if they do, wouldn’t change your life.

But it’s all good, it’ll “create jobs.” Fuck all that…before we get to any of that, how about paying all those people what they need to live better than just paycheck to paycheck, they forgo their small personal cruise ship or sending Katy fucking Perry into space for ten minutes, reclaim that supposed “great” era where a man could walk down to a bank with a smile and a firm handshake, walk out with a job for the next 40 years, and make enough for a house with a white picket fence, a car, a stay-at-home wife/mother for 2.5 kids, a dog, a week long family vacation in the summer, and a retirement pension. Those days are gone, because the wealthy stole it from us, don’t make excuses for them or let them do it for themselves, and make you think they work harder and are more deserving. PAY PEOPLE MORE AND PROFIT LESS. It’s that simple, and in the post-mom & pop era where it’s all big box chains everywhere, I’ll ask for that and sleep like a baby afterwards with clean conscience.

[WhiteSteve]

Trump and Company are just trying to perpetuate that. Instead of appeasing you with a couple thousand bucks in your tax return that’ll be spent in 60 days, how about you just made $20K more a year, like we proportionally should. What the owner/CEO does is no more important or impressive or valuable than what anyone else down the line does, so pay your army of workers who actually make the shit “GO.” Fuck your yacht and palatial estate, no one needs that and no one should even aspire to that, that’s chasing the wrong things in life.

The middle and working class are fucked because the upper class is fucking them, it’s really that simple, but they’ve brainwashed people into thinking their some special caste of exceptional people who we need to be accommodating🙄

Totally in the corner of the working and middle class, and I’m just astounded that they believe Trump when he says he cares about them. Trust and believe, Trump only cares about Donald Trump, and to a lesser degree, other wealthy people he wants the respect and admiration of.

[Fireguy17]

Its odd since the US has had tariffs before, and it wasn't a big deal, but i guess because it is Trump doing it now it is different.

[Asker]

The market wasn't put in total chaos like it is now.

[DrPepper12]

Do you really think It's advisable to take on the entire world in a trade war at the same time? Do you really think that any nation would want to do a bilateral deal with a moron who can't make up his mind about tariff rates or even why he favors tariffs in particular circumstances. The simple fact is that he is cedeing valuable trading partners to China the European Union and the rest of the world while we get passed by. Like the economist said, this is the dumbest trade war in the history of dumb trade wars

[FunkyMonkee]

So far, only the bullshit media is saying any of that.

[Asker]

Keep your head in the sand! It's not helping your cause. Even CEOs of major companies (like Walmart) are raising the alarm! Only ignorant idiots are calling "bullshit"!

[FunkyMonkee]

You've got the wrong person. I'm not a loony lefty.

[DrPepper12]

I think going from a 2% chance of recession under Biden to a 45% chance of recession under Trump in under 3 months is quite an accomplishment. Any halfway intelligent economist, even my seniors at 17 understand that this is just flat out stupid and counterproductive

[FunkyMonkee]

@DrPepper12 Who told you these numbers?

[DrPepper12]

Forbes www.forbes.com/.../

[HaveNoName]

Majority of illiterate white American retards who voted for Trump do not believe tarrifs impact the consumer. That also includes his bimbo dumbass press secretary.

[onedarkcloud]

I guess you think we were better with Biden, Harrist. Please tell us how at least now I can afford to buy eggs, bread, milk, and some meat and heating fuel and gas for the car. With Biden and company paying for illegals to live here on our dime we get nothing. How is the AMERICA LAST DEMOCRATIC COMMUNIST PARTY OF AMERICA plan TO PAY FOR THIS I know tax the rich, Tax them, they leave the country and you lose all tax money, that you have nothing. Brilliant solution!

[HaveNoName]

@onedarkcloud It is pathetic that a country as large as USA cannot find presidential candidates besides a couple of baffoons. It is not by accident. It is all by design.

[Pterodon]

Fuck em. It’s the president that sets foreign policy not the courts. The people voted for this. He promised it

[Asker]

I thought you MAGAs were all about State's rights and "law and order"! Oh, I forgot! It's only ok if it support what the Fuhrer wants!

[David318578]

States don't set foreign policy that's the presidents job, so what do you mean by law and order? The president is following his constitutional duties.
You might not agree with what he is doing, but there is nothing illegal about it

[Asker]

@David318578 Ignoring judges is "law and order"? I understand who sets foreign policy. These states are hurting and have no choice but to fight back in any way they can.

[David318578]

@asker if the judge has no athority then yes the president can ignore them. Trying to dictate foreign policy and agreements is outside of the Judicial branchs powers.

[DrPepper12]

Wrong. Congress allows the POTUS & can extend or revoke that power over tarriffs at any time. Only 25% of Americans voted for this. Wake up!

[DrPepper12]

@David318578 Who determines whether or not a court is of competent jurisdiction and has the power and authority? I'm pretty sure that acts of Congress create the legislative branch so, the Congress has created quartz of competent jurisdiction and even a handy flow chart to explain where cases should go.

[David318578]

@DrPepper12 the powers and responsibilities of the branches of government is spelled out in the constitution

[DrPepper12]

Exactly. Congress has already legislated that the courts are bona fide for this law dispute.

[David318578]

@DrPepper12 then that legislation is unconstitutional. Congress has no athority to give the judicial branch the powers of the president. That's laughable.

What this really is, is political grandstanding..

[DrPepper12]

The judiciary act of 1787 is unconstitutional? Lol ok

[David318578]

@DrPepper12 nowhere in that act does it give the power of the judiciary branch authority over foreign policy. You are literally pointing to the act that shows that judges have no athority here.

Like I said all this is, is political grandstanding

[DrPepper12]

Questions of law are settled in court. Simply calling it "X" changes nothing. It's a matter for the courts to settle.

[David318578]

@DrPepper12 the stance is absurd, it would be like me saying that a judge should be able to vote on a bill, or create a new bill. Or even sign a bill into law.
And then when someone points out that's outside of the athority of the Judiicial branch, I just wave it away saying that's for the courts to decide.

The constitution has spelled out the powers of the government, the Judiicial branch has no athority to vote on bills nor does it have any authority on foreign policies.

[DrPepper12]

Don't have the time or crayons to explain to you how govt works...

[David318578]

@DrPepper12 you already explained how the government works at least for judges by referring the Judicial act. Unfortunately that act spells out that the courts can't do what you want them to do.

[Godihateyou]

A big lol. Those 12 states have no grounds. What a waste of time. By the time beats them all in court he will have made America Great again and there is nothing the Democrats can do to make America weak again.

[Sluttt]

They can do that? Wow. Go ahead sue him. Make that bitch poor

[Anonymous]

The Democrats were all about tariffs and deportation. Funny how things change.

[goaded]

Limited, targeted tariffs and legal deportation. Funny how things change.

[Opinion Owner]

How many people did Obama deport?

[goaded]

Far too many. How much credit did Republicans give him for doing what they wanted done?

[Opinion Owner]

Why would your hero do what you hated him to do? And why didn't you people complain about it? Were you afraid of criticizing one of your own?

[goaded]

The left complained about it. They called him "deporter in chief"; that was an insult. How much credit did Republicans give him for doing what they wanted done? How come Trump is so useless he can't match Obama's numbers?

[Asker]

Yeah... like how the market is tanking and thrown into chaos right now! Big difference!

[Opinion Owner]

But but but but tariffs are a tax on citizens! Why would Obama do that to his loyal citizens?

[DrPepper12]

Contingent, strategic & impactful - not blanket stupidity!! Do it legally & with due o

[Opinion Owner]

I think you're missing the point. Is a terrif a tax on the citizens or not? Make up your mind and stop cherry picking.

[Filthy_Immigrant]

let me guess all those 12 states are blue

[In_Trance]

Absolutely nothing