It’s valid, but not because men are lonely. It’s valid because we’re finally acknowledging that marriage as we’ve known it has been a purposely unequal power imbalance between men and women for several generations. It’s only within the last 3 (Millennials, Z, and Alpha) that these women are not bound to marriage for financial or social reasons. If they get married, they want it to be with a partner who loves them truly and honestly and a lot of men don’t know how to do that.
It’s not their fault, either. They were simply never taught how to see women on the same level as themselves. They lack conscientiousness outside of their own ego and grew up in a society that basically taught them that being married was a given and they would all have wives without really trying. This is no longer the case and they struggle to try, let alone actually succeed. The “Male Loneliness Epidemic” is a direct result of men and women finally being on an equal playing field and now know that a lot of women would not have married men at all if they had any other choice.
Its a valid concern. But it’s not because women don’t want connection. It’s because too many men were conditioned to avoid emotional depth, mock vulnerability, and treat relationships like vending machines: insert niceness, expect girlfriend.
Then when women raise their standards or stop settling for bare minimum energy, it’s seen as rejection instead of an invitation to grow.
And to make it worse, some men stay pressed about what a 22-year-old little girls with a weak frontal lobe didn’t want, and act like that defines all women. It doesn’t. Grown women want connection, security, and emotional safety, not just a paycheck and a jawline. But we’re not looking at men who act like the world is against them just because they had a few bad experiences.
The thing is those bad experiences are CAUSED by the same women who have refused to learn how men work and what men want. The last 4 generations of youth have all about GIVING WOMEN MORE and men had to accept, give way, allow, step back, adapt, stay quiet, change. The concept of reciprocation isn't happening so men are just having none of it. Why is it MEN expected to grow into male girlfriends when women are the ones experiencing stress, anxiety, emotional rollercoaster lives, trauma after trauma then rely on therapy and medication just to exist in everyday life. Attempted self deletion is also a far greater issue among women so maybe consider women expecting men to become "more like us", the message ought to be "ladies, your behaviour hurts you AND us, why don't you become more emotionally resilient, less validation obsessive and process life internally to build up a stoic resilience LIKE MEN who don't suffer stress so easily, deeply or extensively nor do they end up in therapy, medicated or try to self delete as much as you". MAYBE , just MAYBE men are actually doing it right and the fashionable notion of feminising men is unwise for humanity. Connection is great but it doesn't have to be the one sided one women want. Learn what men want and deserve and bring that to tables that these connections will be formed on
There’s a big difference between what men want and what good men want. Grown women do care about what good men want, because good men come with reciprocity, emotional safety, and integrity. The rest… we don’t give a damn, and we shouldn’t.
What you call “giving women more” is just women finally becoming human beings with voices, autonomy, and options. If that feels like oppression to you, maybe ask yourself why that feels so threatening.
As for this idea that “reciprocation isn’t happening”? It is… for men who actually show up in relationships with something worth reciprocating.
You mock therapy and medication like they’re signs of failure. But the truth, is a lot of women are stressed, anxious, and burned out, because they’ve been taught to perform, please, and contort themselves for everyone else. I’ve lived it. That shit will eat you alive. And when we finally stop people pleasing and start living in alignment with what we need and want, things change. Our peace comes back. Our health improves. I’ve been living that too. So yeah, some of us need help clawing our way back from that mess, but don’t confuse that struggle with weakness.
And let’s not pretend men don’t need therapy too. The only reason male mental health stats look lower is because men are out here suffering in silence, untreated, and undiagnosed. Meanwhile, violence, addiction, and self destruction run rampant. You think that’s resilience? That’s unaddressed pain. We need more men in therapy, not fewer.
You close by saying “connection doesn’t have to be the one-sided one women want.” Cool. But it’s not gonna be the one-sided setup men have historically benefited from, either. The balance is shifting.
And finally, we can definitely learn what good men want. But the rest of men who think leadership means control, who think love is earned through obedience, who think women existing with standards is somehow an attack? We’re not bringing anything to their table.
If therapy is an essential NEED society isn't healthy enough. It's sick and the addictive nature of gym, hobbies, sport travel etc., aren't sogns of destroying anything except performance records. Women are stressed because feminists have told them they HAVE to conform to take power, be responsible, be everything boss, provider, carer, parent. because they wanted Women in work. EXPLOITED and unhappy. Like how men have been treated (but men have evolved resilience through generations of exploitation by society (NOT patriarchy as that's just a gendered boogeyman) so are used to it and have the ability to handle it better than women. Feminists are the ones pushing women into stress NOT men who are stepping away from that shit show.
You said, “If therapy is an essential need, society isn’t healthy enough.” Correct. It’s not. We agree on that. But the point isn’t whether therapy should be needed, the point is that it IS, because a lot of people are walking around wounded, stuck in cycles they don’t know how to break.
Now, as for your claim that “feminists told women they have to do it all” no. That’s not feminism. That’s performance culture. That’s the pressure to be everything to everyone, which existed long before feminism entered the chat.
The message I got from feminism is that you get to choose. You get to explore your life, your gifts, your desires, and you get to decide what fulfillment looks like. For some women, that’s career. For others, it’s motherhood. For others still, it’s something in between. The problem isn’t that we can do anything. The problem is people like you keep trying to tell us what we should do with that freedom.
I’m not stressed because feminism told me to work. I’m stressed when someone tells me I have to live according to their playbook. That includes the conservative one that says I need to be a nurturing homemaker and the boss babe narrative that says I need to hustle 24/7. I reject both. I built my life in alignment with what I want, and that includes a husband who contributes without being asked, a business I love, and a partnership that doesn’t revolve around one person doing all the labor while the other complains about how society is unfair.
What pushes women into stress is being constantly told by others what their lives should look like. You don’t get to decide what fulfills us. We do. And until you learn to listen instead of lecturing, you’re just adding to the noise we’re already tired of tuning out.
Women don’t need saving from feminism. We need men to stop talking over us and start believing us when we say, “This is what’s burning us out.”
ALL men want respect and you're showing that you're not prepared to give that while men have been the benevolent ones in that it's always them sacrificing themselves for others throughout history but feminism hasn't bothered to account for that and TAKE SOME OF THE BURDEN of providing society's needs by getting stuck in and instead pushed for POWER and soft access to wealth. HR, Education, administration etc., instead of mining, plumbing, construction, etc., that modern technology makes it very possible for women to be almost as capable as men of going the hard graft. You chose not to. You also chose NOT to support men swapping the roles over and be those oppressed stay at home adults who deserve 6 figure salaries for doing adult things for their families (and themselves) all at the same time of having no deadlines, no bosses (husbands were NEVER EVER deemed the controllers of what and how things were done in homes that's ALL on women EVEN NOW). Then you've had the whole workplaces adapting to accommodate women. READ THAT AGAIN the WORKPLACE not the NEW employee, changed so you could have your sensitivities imposed on workplaces. The behaviours that had been carried out the talk between men which MEN engaged in because that's how THEY vented was ended because of the language and tone that would upset women. SO if you want to be respected and have "good men" (who do as you want them to do because they're there to serve your needs) accept the bullshit you bring then be aware of how much has already been imposed.
Reciprocation isn't happening though. MEN have had more impositions on them to be coerced into being something they didn't want. Showing up how YOU want them to at their cost isn't reciprocation that's simping. You want male girlfriends it seems not men who have their own values and views, they won't fall for the controlling manipulative behaviour you're putting out.
Women are stressed and I've explained what should be done about that, take a leaf out of the books of MEN who are better at dealing with it and DON'T need to support an industry that is there, like the dating app, drug, alcohol and cigarette industries TO MAKE MONEY and keep you thinking you need more of it when there are real people around already with skill sets to show you but they aren't worthy of your respect or even attention because they're a creep, threat, predator etc. Ever thought that perhaps the feminist movement didn't consider the impact of sending women into the rat race as well as try to keep homes and families that are inherently desired by most women, as a smart move? Did it care? I don't think it did because the capitalists behind it wanted a workforce for cheap and got it.
This one sided connection could have been provided by the idea I mentioned above GET MEN IN HOMES being stay at home adults then come and see how capable "good men" can be. But you don't like handing over that power as women because feminism told you you can have EVERYTHING on the menu and the 6x6x6 simp to provide the romance you are entitled to.
Grega, just to clarify what I meant, yes, there are some younger or less experienced women who fixate on superficial stuff like height, income, or aesthetics. That’s immaturity, not standard-setting. What I’m talking about is women raising their standards in terms of character, life stability, and emotional maturity.
A lot of women still settle for men who are emotionally unavailable, deep in debt, addicted, have a criminal record, multiple kids with other women, or just plain don’t have their life together. That’s not being “too picky” that’s not being picky enough.
I’ve lived this shift personally, and it changed everything for me. So when I say women need to raise their standards, I’m talking about filtering in men with strong values, self-control, and alignment, and filtering out the chaos. That’s what leads to real partnership.
Shiprex, you keep saying “all men want respect” cool. But let’s talk about earning it. Wanting respect isn’t the same as deserving it. A lot of men expect it just for existing, not for how they actually show up in relationships, communities, or daily life.
And let’s be very clear, I absolutely do respect men, the right men. The ones who lead with integrity, consistency, and actual emotional presence. The ones who want real connection, not control. If you think respect should be handed out regardless of behavior, then you’re not talking about respect, you’re talking about entitlement.
You also keep framing women’s desires as manipulative or controlling. No. Choosing a partner who aligns with your vision for your life isn’t control, it’s discernment. I didn’t force a man into my life who didn’t want what I wanted. I chose a man who’s aligned with me. That’s the point of standards, not bending someone else into shape, but choosing someone who’s already a fit. Don’t get it twisted.
As for this idea that feminism pushed women into the rat race and “soft jobs” you’re again missing the point. The issue isn’t that women refuse hard labor. It’s that women are told what they “should” be doing, whether that’s mining or homemaking, based on your ideas of value. The reality is that women are finally claiming the right to design lives that actually fulfill them. Not society. Not men. Them. That’s what freedom looks like. And yeah, it makes some people uncomfortable.
You don’t get to decide what roles women should play. We do. You don’t get to dictate what makes us valuable. We do. And if a woman chooses a man who supports her vision instead of resists it, that’s not her being “manipulative” that’s her being smart.
So no, we don’t want “male girlfriends.” We want men who are emotionally intelligent, aligned, and capable of real partnership. And if that sounds like a threat to you, maybe ask yourself why.
Women don't have to earn respect in society do they? Just BEING female garners respect and protection, where's that for men? They have to earn it. Why is that? Where's the respect for them while they just go about their everyday life KNOWING they're being considered THREATENING, DANGEROUS, PREDATORY just for existing? When is that going to change? We know prostitutes tend to be women yet men don't go around treating women like prostitutes because some are yet women go around regarding men as the above. Why is that? Where's the mutual respect men give women (and other men in general)? Women have the initial negative connection toward men because they fixate on the few who may have made them uncomfortable and use that as a brush for ALL the others which men don't do. Why is that? You want men to FIT to YOUR lifestyle and aren't interested in THEM only how THEY provide something for you. JUST like workplaces had to ADAPT to WOMEN coming in so WOMEN expect MEN to adapt to THEM while doing nothing within themselves to make it mutual. Like spoiled children wanting all their toys AND the new toys to be JUST HOW THEY WANT THEM. So MANIPULATIVE is exactly that, you hide behind make up and promises then use manipulation to mould others to fit YOUR best interests. Men are the ones who are doing the dirty work women choose not to. Where is the reciprocal effort from women? Invisible. If you think women aren't afraid of hard labour then why are only the soft jobs being inundated and overwhelmed with women (like education which is now failing boys but no one wants to talk about that unless it's blaming the BOYS and male teachers are automatically presumed to be pedophiles WITHIN the profession) while there are plenty of opportunities for mechanics, plumbers, construction work that women can volunteer for but don't. WHY is that?
If women get to design lives while men are still providing all the infrastructure then how and when do men get the reciprocity of that nugget of freedom? They've NEVER had the freedom to stay at home and are deemed unattractive by women for such notions. Other men would be slapping guys on the back if they got to stay at home and keep house. It's all about WOMEN getting what WOMEN want while ignoring what men want and need. THAT kind of princess treatment isn't going to make queens no matter how far you take them down the board, the Kings will still be mated elsewhere while you're all away ignoring their needs. Being smart and getting men to keep doing the graft is why there's NO equity in society. It's ALL for women and always has been.
It’s been said over and over and we get it. Women are independent. Everyone should be independent. But we’re told to leave you alone when out and about. Yet, you want good men? How are we supposed to meet you if we’re not allowed to approach? You been telling us that? Feminism has taught you that.
Ship, you say women don’t have to earn respect, but historically, we’ve had to fight for it fight to vote, to work, to make decisions about our own bodies. If women were just naturally handed respect, we wouldn’t need movements at all. We wouldn’t need laws to protect us from being legally owned, silenced, or abused. So no, women don’t just get handed respect for “being female.” We’ve clawed our way into basic human rights that many men still resent us for having.
Being male doesn’t automatically make someone threatening. But let’s not pretend women’s caution comes out of nowhere. We don’t get the luxury of ignoring danger when violence against women is real, persistent, and usually committed by someone we know. That’s not “punishing men for existing” that’s survival instinct. And it’s not personal unless you make it personal.
As for your rant about women designing lives while men “do the dirty work” you’re describing the systems men built and enforced. The same system that told men they have to work themselves to death also told women they have to be pretty, passive, barefoot, and pregnant. Most of us are done playing by those rules.
Have you ever asked what it would look like to collaborate? To build something based on mutual fulfillment instead of resentment?
You say we want “men to fit our lives.” Most women want partnership and That’s why we choose men who align with our values and goals.
You don’t want women designing lives that don’t center you. That’s what this is really about. We’re not obligated to build lives around male fragility, nor are we required to take on every burden men resent just to earn a little approval. Respect is mutual, but it’s never owed to someone just because they’re bitter we stopped begging for it.
Black Eagle, feminism isn’t a monolith, and not all women are saying “never approach.” What we are saying is approach like a civil human being, not like an entitled animal who thinks every woman in public is a vending machine for validation.
I’ve had men approach me with respect, awareness, and good energy, it happens. And I’ve had others who act like they’ve never interacted with a human woman before. There’s a difference. And that difference is exactly what more men need to understand.
So no, I don’t agree with the extreme take that men should never approach. I do believe they should learn how to approach. That’s the key. It’s not that hard, and plenty of men figure it out. If others are struggling, maybe the issue is the lack of social self-awareness and emotional intelligence being taught to men in the first place.
Women come into a room and they are offered a seat since forever THAT'S respect, it was called chivalry and was conditioned into boys from when they could speak that it was their DUTY to do shit like that for women. It's not done so much now because men have realised they are bigger, more tired and need the seats for themselves. Men have been enslaved or killed while women would be saved and used as servants and enslaved but not killed THAT is a higher level of respect for women than men. So women got to live men didn't or were put to work that was physical so damaging to the body. That workplaces were made to adapt to introduce women when they came in is RESPECT. Those men's spaces women sought access to had to change so the women coming in wouldn't be expected to adapt or change their sensitivities to work alongside men who'd done jobs there for generations. YES mens spaces where they worked, vented, bonded with other men were sanitised for WOMEN so if that's not respect then wtf is? About voting because voting was originally based on wealth men didn't automatically get to vote when democracy began. Only once it became a more egalitarian thing did it become all men who were after all also required to sacrifice their lives for the state and women weren't so there was a cost and millions paid it but heck they're expendable AND STILL ARE for feminists because equality was only ever about what OPPORTUNITIES and not RESPONSIBILITIES within society. NO all about what you can get and not what you can do while men didn't and don't get those opportunities (PS women could almost always work as the working class always did but feminists were only interested in getting middle class women access to UPPER class opportunities (the men they desired)
The systems is what men built and women aren't changing the system they're just picking and choosing the easy access living life on easy mode so they can use men who are doing the essential services (see responsibility above). You point out those same systems feminists have only chosen to get into for selfish reasons and not actually make their own contribution (mens still pay around 70% more in income compared to women and it's women who get more from state benefits than men. Men don't want women to rule over, we want women to CONTRIBUTE equally since they haven't given men choices about their oh so oppressed lives of housebound servitude because that realm is 100% STILL WOMAN*S
Do you realize you got more freedoms than let’s say you lived in middle eastern countries? Ladies there can’t by law drive or leave their residence alone. You really shouldn’t complain. The feminist groups are toxic. It’s teaching how to hate men. Spoon feeding you stuff. You have no respect for men
Chivalry wasn’t respect, it was a product of a time when women were seen as delicate and less capable. Offering a seat or opening a door didn’t come from viewing women as equals, it came from viewing them as weaker.
And the idea that women “invaded” men’s spaces and ruined the vibe? No. What happened is, a lot of those environments weren’t built for emotional maturity or mutual respect, they were built for exclusion. When women showed up, some of that locker room culture got challenged. As it should have. If you wouldn’t say it to your mother, it doesn’t get said at work. Pretty standard.
As for your point about sacrifice: yes, men have historically faced harsh expectations. But women weren’t avoiding responsibility, they were denied the opportunity to contribute on equal terms for centuries. And now most women do work. Many are primary or co-breadwinners. Over a third of women out-earn their male partners, and yet they’re still doing the majority of childcare, housework, and emotional labor. That’s not “life on easy mode.” That’s two full-time jobs.
If men want to stay home, great, go for it. But don’t blame women for the stigma when it’s other men who mock stay-at-home dads and call them lazy. That’s your camp, not ours.
You keep asking for reciprocity, but women are already carrying a massive share, financially, domestically, emotionally. You just don’t value the parts you don’t see or benefit from.
We’re not trying to rule over anyone. We’re building lives on our terms.
@MzAsh, You say it’s a valid concern, but you spend the entire comment blaming men for their loneliness and ridiculing them for how they feel. That’s not empathy—it’s moral superiority dressed up as analysis.
You dismiss genuine male pain as immaturity, imply their desire for connection is transactional, and then mock them for reacting to rejection, all while insisting that “grown women” want emotional depth—as if men don’t. If a man said women only care about looks, money, and drama from “bad boys,” you’d call it a generalization. But you get to do it to men, and somehow it’s insightful?
The problem isn’t that men expect connection for being nice. The problem is that when men open up about being lonely, they’re met with contempt like yours. You don’t want growth—you want submission to a narrative that blames men for everything and absolves women of any responsibility. That’s not progress. That’s just prejudice in a different outfit.
On your terms on the backs of men still. You just ignored (gaslit) when I brought up men being stay at home ADULTS (you asserted DADS as if that's men's 9nly purpose) being derided by men when I explained its WOMEN rejecting that idea of a kept man like how women have zero stigma attached to being a housewife ( notice NOT mother) The share women carry is only what share they choose to accept which is only what they want to pick from. I've explained the emotional elements as being brought about by women's weaker psychology so that's wholly about women's behaviour not men's. Those "spaces" and vibes were
where and how men decompressed so were healthy enough for THEM because they were safe spaces men were content with but YOUR TAKE insisted it wasn't... the arrogance. Imagine men forcing women's spaces to adapt to sports bars, gyms or telling them that talking about partners and family was off limits? THAT'S reciprocation. Yes chivalry was a symptom of men protecting women from life's difficulties and it was because they are weaker physically and psychologically and it benefited women over men because it placed them on pedestal. It was encoded in law. Why are those laws STILL IN PLACE why does a man HAVE to support the lifestyle of a woman who rejects him after divorce? Her body her choice but HIS responsibility? How about choice of men after conception like women want?
You say women only carry the “share they choose,” as if that’s a flaw. It’s not. That’s called having boundaries and agency. And yes, women are choosing what they take on in life, just like men always have. Why is it a problem when women do the same?
You’re also still hung up on chivalry like it was some great gift to women. It wasn’t. Women don’t want to be on pedestals for being weaker. We want to stand on our own feet?
You claim women reject stay-at-home men, but men are the ones who mock and shame each other for being “kept.” And if more men want that role, maybe start uplifting it instead of whining that women won’t validate it.
As for workplaces “changing” for women, thats adjustment, not oppression. Work environments changed because inclusion matters. If men can’t function without locker room talk or juvenile bonding rituals, then maybe the space needed to evolve.
Now, if a woman gave up her income to raise a family while the man worked, then yes, if they divorce, she should be compensated. That’s an economic consequence of a shared agreement. If you don’t want to pay alimony, then don’t build your relationship on a dynamic where one person becomes financially dependent. It’s really that simple.
And finally “her body, her choice” does make it her responsibility too. But if you want to talk about “paper abortions” or the idea that men should be able to walk away after conception, fine, as long as they also walk away from any parental rights and never circle back for control later. But let’s not act like that idea hasn’t been floated before. It has. Many feminists support it. You’re not starting a revolution. You’re just late to the conversation.
So again, this isn’t about women having it easier. This is about women not playing by your script anymore, and you’re all aggro about it.
Men haven't chosen though, that's a myth. In order for a man to be seen he HAS to hustle, he has to have and be something. That is something women seem to ignore. They just turn up and GET Where do you get that idea men would MOCK stay at home husbands? (FYI men mock each other for having GOOD things icymi and don't have a clue about how men treat each other as a typical woman). That's ridiculous it's WOMEN who wouldn't go near them because they STILL insist on men PROVIDING, WORKING, being out of the house because they KNOW men would THRIVE and be content and that just rubs women up wrong. Men haven't chosen though, that's a myth. In order for a man to be seen he HAS to hustle, he has to have and be something. That is something women seem to ignore. They just turn up and GET Where do you get that idea men would MOCK stay at home husbands? (FYI men mock each other for having GOOD things icymi and don't have a clue about how men treat each other as a typical woman). That's ridiculous it's WOMEN who wouldn't go near them because they STILL insist on men PROVIDING, WORKING, being out of the house because they KNOW men would THRIVE and be content and that just rubs women up wrong.
You dismiss and try to ridicule men's bonding behaviours because you want to feminise them. You want men to BE LIKE US or be inferior. Well that's more of the feminist supremacy talking that you seem well versed in. Men need to VENT in ways unlike women, we take the piss out of each other, use foul language, use irreverent language and sometimes talk rude because THAT is how we vent whether you approve or not. It's arrogant af saying it needed to "evolve" instead of become oppressed and forced to adapt to women. The lack of self awareness is astounding here. You come away with MEN MUST adapt but women just turn up like some princess who can't handle rough and tumble whether it's language, culture or anything impolite.
Why does a millionaires wife who raises a child receive a lifestyle of a millionaire when she's doing the same job as the wife of an average Joe on average wage? That sort of BS is how hypergamy (feminist goals) has become women's MO. That getting with the successful guy because she'll become entitled to half his stuff when she upgrades next. A legal abortion doesn't deal with the other side of the coin where women can deny pregnancies they are responsible for that they terminate without the consent of the father. (I'm not advocating for forced birth) but what level of compensation should there be since men's compensation is 18 years of financial burden for the opposite. Maybe feminists ought to be a bit clearer about their message because they're all for the MEN SHOULD PAY mantra because that benefits them.
So it IS an easier way, the choices , opportunities and provisions women enjoy thanks to men are not being reciprocated.
Greg’s, sounds like the women you’re observing are just inexperienced or not great at qualifying men yet. That happens, it’s a mix of immaturity and poor discernment. But don’t mistake that for a universal truth about women.
There are plenty of women like me who don’t tolerate chaos. At all. If a man brings instability into our lives, emotionally, financially, or otherwise, he gets tossed.
The difference isn’t in what women “want”, it’s in what they allow. And smart women don’t allow mess.
Ship, men absolutely do mock stay-at-home dads, especially in conservative circles. Let’s not pretend male shame culture doesn’t exist.
And no, I’m not trying to “feminize” men. I’m saying act like a professional in the workplace. You want to vent, cuss, and talk wild, do it off the clock. If grown-ass men can’t handle boundaries at work, they shouldn’t be there.
As for the millionaire’s wife question, good men value the women raising their kids. If a man has a fortune and his wife stayed home to raise their children while he built that wealth, she deserves to walk away with a lifestyle that reflects the role she played in that success.
Now about abortion. No, men don’t get veto power over a woman’s pregnancy. Biology gave women the risk, the burden, and the consequences. So yes, she gets the authority. Is that “fair”? No. But nature’s not fair. If anything, it’s one more reason men need to be smart about who they sleep with. Wrap it up. Vet better. Stop acting like you’re powerless.
And by the way, a paycheck doesn’t make you a father. Being a dad means showing up, changing diapers, attending appointments, doing the damn work. Because that’s what women do.
There you go gaslighting men about how men behave. Maybe your stereotypical conservative male that you heard about on a feminist podcast would shame a stay at home man but you ask ANY man you aren't particularly friendly with whether he would be content to stay at home and not join in the rat race if they could maintain the same lifestyle and you know they'd jump at it. Women on the other hand want access to other potential mates in the fields they are interested in so greater attention can be given to them and they can carry on the upgrade for their lifestyles.
Swearing hurts no one, venting and conversing about things that could be lewd and uncomfortable to women is not unprofessional. If it were why would it have not been brought up before? Because MEN dgaf about that shit and had to adjust to accommodate, change, adapt, cower in fear as HR would be down their throat because the sensitive ones were upset. SO you DO want men to change to fit YOUR sensitivities and not the ones they had before where things were fine and men had safe spaces to be men and not mehn. They didn't have boundaries before according to you but then again they weren't WOMEN'S boundaries being imposed on them. Imagine we had to impose boundaries on sport so there would be no women's sport because it's JUST SPORT and that there would be no segregated women's only sports? NO we had to accommodate your "desires" as the idea of fitting in with men was too rough.
The millionaires wife didn't earn the wealth. She ran a household enjoyed the lifestyle HE created not her and whether he valued her she obviously wasn't up for continuing to provide for him the wifely duties yet still get's to keep the husbandly privileges that she doesn't deserve. Raising a child in a mansion and a tenement isn't different, if she isn't providing the wifely duties then he shouldn't be providing the lifestyle his work provides her. Interesting you didn't respond to the notion that men don't get a say in the post conception outcome. Denied a child but responsible for it at the same time? While women can deny or force a penalty without consent on him AND the amount is related to his income NOT the needs of the child. Get real. If a man doesn't want to be a father he should have to pay for a woman's decision to be a mother irrespective of her trapping him. That level of coercion should be a crime.
Ship, you keep pretending stay-at-home husbands are universally admired by men when you know damn well that’s not true. We’ve all seen how men mock each other for stepping outside the “provider” role. Whether it’s conservative circles or locker-room banter, the message is clear that men still shame each other for not hustling.
Also, let’s not act like being a stay-at-home parent isn’t its own rat race. It comes with stress, burnout, and a 24/7 workload. If you think it’s a break from the grind, then you’ve clearly never done it.
On the workplace stuff,? no, swearing and lewd talk isn’t “just how men vent.” It’s unprofessional. Period. HR didn’t invent rules just to coddle women. They exist to create a functional, respectful workplace that doesn’t willingly risk being sued. You don’t get to bring your “safe space” antics to the office and call it oppression when someone tells you to knock it off. You’re not being silenced, you’re being asked to act like an adult.
And about the millionaire’s wife, again, if she stayed home, raised the kids, ran the household, and supported his rise, then yes, she helped build that wealth. A good man knows that. A bitter one thinks it’s robbery.
Now, on the abortion topic, I’ve already said this. If a man wants to sign away all parental rights and responsibilities pre-birth, fine. But he doesn’t get to walk away and still claim say-so later. That’s the trade-off. The biological reality is that pregnancy affects women more. More risk, more burden, more responsibility, so yes, more authority. Nature made it that way. Complain to biology, not me.
You keep trying to paint women as freeloaders. But we’re out here working, raising families, contributing financially and emotionally, and still having to argue with grown men about why acting like a 13-year-old at work isn’t a constitutional right.
You highlight how ignorant you are of men's interaction. We MOCK each other for just BEING each other as a form of BONDING. I thought you had some clue but are apparently relying on stereotypical feminist tropes of "toxic masculinity" being how men are. We TAKE THE PISS out of each other because that''s how we work. I have never heard or seen a man compare their prosperity to another in a mean spirited way. I've met millionaires and students and all sorts in between and never heard a guy disparage another about the "car, house holiday, wife, kids, bike, etc." in any meaningful critical way. You'd take the piss out of the colour, or lack of power of the car as a piss take but always in jest and we can tell when someone goes to far by smacking each other about the head or telling each other you went too far. Staying at home, doing your own thing at your own rate HOW YOU want to do it instead of some manager nagging you (she's the one bringing the bread in) and it's like being an adult just with better stuff and maybe a bigger kitchen if someone else is paying for it. You can catch up with friends, go to the gym, get the lawn cut, do investment from home, etc. ALL WITHOUT a commute, colleagues or CEOs to satisfy. A life of self driven motivation would be preferable. ASK the men around you who aren't related to or running their own business whether they'd like to stay at home with the same lifestyle and prospects. The ones doing everyday jobs EVERYDAY. Especially ones who've been working a few years NO the millionaire's wife is NOT entitled to his wealth any more than he's entitled to her body after divorce, she brought the body and sex (it's women who control that I hope you recognise). I take it the notion that men shouldn't have to financially support a child they don't want with a woman is the agreement here? And the ad hominem is below you.
For some for sure. Guys don't socialize as well as women and we need to make effort to engage w other men emotionally, be supportive. I've succeeded at times and failed miserably as well.
There needs to be more outlets for men to be open and get help/support. That would benefit their women immensely. It have to be done against society because society does not support this in men so much.
I'm lucky to have good wife and family, but even then, I'm youngest, I could end up alone. If I lost my wife, so much of my connections would go away. I haven't done as good a job making long term connections.
I see men around like that and it's sad which makes me more compassionate towards those that are down and out.
The best thing there is, is being authentic, open, vulnerable. When I see that, it's a person on a good path.
No, we do fine alone. In fact introspection and skills we need to make a living and become better men are developed alone. We still need to work and associate with other men on occasion, not complete isolation.
Things like fixing family and divorce court would be a step in the right direction to heal this “dating problem”.
The vast majority go for men with resources and/or the best looking, its just the way it is. As well most men will take whatever they can from whomever they can as long as they think they can get away with it. An old lawyer recently said as much to my father and I in a meeting.
Most men who aren’t so much to look at or very wealthy would find a mate in High School or College back, thats obviously not how it usually works these days.
Yes, it’s a valid concern—and the fact that it even has to be debated shows why. Male loneliness isn’t just about dating struggles. It’s about isolation, lack of emotional support, and a society that mocks men for being vulnerable, then blames them when they suffer in silence.
Dismissing it with, “Men just don’t want to grow,” is part of the problem. When women express pain, they get empathy. When men do, they get lectures. That double standard isn’t empowering—it’s cruel.
– Eva ❤️
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Anonymous
(25-29)
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It is. And it makes it more concerning that society is very rigid to soften the image of male as "strong". Masculinity is often seen joining it with non dependency, independent, strong mentally and physically. Neither the people around a male person is going to accept that men also can cry. And man himself is never going to accept it that they need people. Sometimes in fear of getting judged sometimes in shame and slf doubt and sometimes in ego. Instead they make the concept of Alpha, Gama whatever, male more popular.
It is and it’s a growing problems. I’ll say from experience that some women on here say men struggle with emotional depth and the men are voicing frustration. Both sides are right, men need to work to bond with the women in their lives. Women need to understand that the men in their lives need help. That many of them are psychologically hurt and have no way to or no one to express those feelings with.
I for instance am a loner. If it wasn’t for the fact that I live with my dad currently. I could go day if not weeks without talking to anyone and months to years without a real connecting experience. I’m so lonely and especially with relationships. I wish I had a partner who could help me heal and learn to love. But she must accept that this process won’t be quick and easy and that a lot of very dark emotions have to be dealt with.
Why would it not be? If people are suffering it makes sense to offer solutions. If you ignore it or worse tell them they suck then you will create resentment and resentment creates things you really don't want. There's a reason some really dark groups recruit incels.
@Dat-Alpha-Lion that's why men sheds exist and other community centres may call it differing things. In Australia just google men sheds or mens sheds (it's not a euphemism) and it basically is a way for a *cheap* social club for lonely men to be able to form legitimate social networks and or community BBQs, community games - basically a way to keep men from falling into dark holes 🕳️😧
The problem is the difficulty of making a living wage for non-college men coupled with the high cost of housing. It used to be possible to graduate high school, get a union job, gain skill and advance, making enough to own a modest home and support a family. Those jobs are mostly gone, leaving a lot of men with few options.
@Dat-Alpha-Lion "Male loneliness" .. Is that a new 'disease"? Sounds like somebody is too busy sitting around beating his meat, instead of getting out and being social.
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