Do you think Incels are their own worst enemy?

[Idonthaveausername]

Obviously I think Incels are their own worst enemies. They blame women for their problems because they're not man enough to accept their fault and improve their lives

Yes. They have bad attitudes that push women away

No. They are right to blame women for their problems

[capncool]

Yes, indeed they are. A good portion of incels are actually average or even decent looking guys who are some combination of being out of shape, having awkward hair/beard styles, wear unflattering clothes, have poor grooming habits, etc. Personality wise they often lack self esteem or confidence. They also tend to lack confidence, self esteem social skills, often tend to lead unattractive lifestyles (NEET, have a lot of bad habits, don't do anything that's remotely interesting), but the biggest problem is their attitude.

I used to be a much less attractive guy, I'd say I looked something like Ernie from Sesame Street. I could have easily fallen into inceldom, but I refused to accept that label and resign myself to it because I knew I wouldn't find any support or advice on how to improve my situation, all it would have done is just make it worse. Instead I lost weight and got in, I stepped up my grooming, I changed up my style, I got rid of more than half my entire wardrobe and replaced it with more flattering and interesting clothes, most importantly I put myself out there and through much trial and error I got to where I wanted to be.

It's much easier said than done, improving oneself and becoming better is not an easy task at all and there will be times where you just want to give up. As they say, if you don't struggle you don't improve.

(Guy in the pic is not me, just a very good example of how much difference a better haircut and beard can do for a man).

[coachTanthony]

There will always be people out there who would rather blame others then actually improve themselves. It's mostly laziness. Big dogs eat... crying little puppies stay on the porch.

[Jean-Marie_Céline]

Yes.
Their madness and the hell they live in is self-inflicted.

[aliiiek]

I vote B , but not because i believe its womans fault , but only because its not their (the incels) fault , if someone born with a disability its not their fault , I don't know maybe its gods fault maybe its the parents fault that they ingore bad genetic in mating , i understand the pain of incels and i know its not their fault , u have right to be confused or even angry , nature is going to eliminate you for some reason , i know girls have standards that automatically remove bad genes and don't let them pass in the future , girls do the right things, and i only blame guys. yeh Guys With Good Gene aka (GWGG) Gwggs it's you that don't have standard and go and make a short girl pregnant and make her a mother , you know what would happen if that woman has son? There is 50% chance that your son inherent her bad gene Yeh there is 25% chance that you have an incel son who is going to suffer And be careful , the standards of not being a incel is getting higher every generationIs that what you want mr gwgg? So please for the sake of your own future son , when you think of standards , think about your future son too , thats allBest of luck , aliiek

[btbc92]

Yes. You can always get a prostitute, not that I agree with it if you don't want to be a virgin anymore. Nobody cares. Better to be like me celibate by choice because you have morals such as no sex before marriage, instead of complaining how you can't get sex, yet nobody owes you sex and sex is readily available as porn is. Honestly.

[Anonymous]

Neither.

I don't think their attitudes are invalid.

Even if women are awful, that doesn't matter, because focusing on other people's bullshit generally doesn't help.

Finally, they are also thrown to the wolves and we insist they fend for themselves when we don't do that with other people. Incels aren't the only group but they're one of the kinds of people we feel perfectly comfortable disregarding, it's perverse. We throw them to the wolves not out of we have any interest in them solving their own problems, rather it's because you'd rather they simply disappear. And if they survive then cool.

It's interesting that people who often don't have their own shit in order will tell incels to just fix their own life. It's as if being even sparsely sexually active has a different level of importance. And if it holds such weight, it's curious that incels are disparaged rather than helped as we help other people having a rough time in life.

[monkeynutts]

You should elaborate more about his its valid. I can't understand how you can give up on a biological imperative, the need for close connection with the opposite sex. Why does failure have to result in a complete negation of sexual activity, you simply recognise where improvement needs to be made, and follow through to achieve your original goal.

[Idonthaveausername]

I get what you're saying, but society has only given up on them because they've given up on themselves. I do agree with a large concept of your point, but I hold people responsible for their actions more so than others

[Opinion Owner]

@monkeynutts They are obviously having a rough time, they're isolated, depressed, frustrated. So I'm not going to say to them that their frustration anything they're feeling is invalid. It obviously sucks and I'm not just going to tell them that everything is fine.

I think the presence of the biological imperative is at the core of the issue. They don't give up on it, that's the problem. They have this drive toward women at the core of their being in spite of the lifetime of negative experience that they have felt trying to satisfy that. All that negative experience no doubt causes a great deal of pain and we also have biological imperative to avoid pain. So it appears to be this perverse situation where in their heart women are seen as sources of great joy and comfort --this is familiar to most men -- but at the same time everything else they've experienced and felt drives them the other way to avoid pain. I think the most isolation and pain they feel, the more they sense women as that source of relief from it and when that doesn't come the pain gets worse and around they go with this internal tug-of-war.

It's never one failure though, is it? When we say "incel" we're defining a one dimensional character for our own abstract analysis. The actual people have more to their character but here we identify them by this word that by definition is a situation of perpetual failure. You don't think they've probably heard all the advice they can stand about what to improve and all that? Then after all this continual anguish society expects them to just shape up, improve themselves and fit right in? It must be hell to try to please a group that have been the source of so much negativity for you, "improvement" might not be so simple when that "goal" is tainted.

[Opinion Owner]

@Idonthaveausername
Some people tell you to just pull yourself up by your bootstraps.
Some people go a lifetime without getting a win despite their persistence and need help.
I don't think the stigma and disdain incels receive helps in either approach.

[monkeynutts]

Yeah yeah you boys don't investigate the possibilities, and don't probably try hard enough. Sorry I come from a country that was founded on a penal colony, if my great, great , great grandfather ever said it was just too difficult I would not exist. Smarten up your acts.

[Opinion Owner]

@monkeynutts So if it didn't affect you it must not be a problem for anyone?
What about the other dudes alongside your ancestor who didn't say it was too difficult but didn't have everything work out so well? Every bad thing that happened was probably just them not trying, right? People of the worst kind have surviving bloodlines are they something to be proud of? What does "difficulty" have to do with it?

Also, notice how you didn't make an argument of any substance? It's just "smarten up." Thanks for your useless opinion that you can't even exemplify.

[monkeynutts]

Hey opinions are like arsewholes, we all got one, you need to take a deep breath and let go of the fact that others see the world differently, I can say that my impression of what we call incels is a mixed one of feeling sorry, ambivalence, and frustration, it is true that none of those emotions are useful in helping young guys find true and lasting happiness in the arms of a beautiful woman.
If we are talking seriously about helping people , I would seriously have to question what motivations these guys have, are they looking for a wife, or a way to have meaningless sex with as many women as they can, cause I won't have anything to do with the latter, some men are ugly, and have no business interacting with the opposite sex.

[Opinion Owner]

@monkeynutts I fully accept other people see the world differently, do you? My whole point is about exploring another perspectives. Maybe take your own advice.

Assuming the worst about them is a problem, there's no reason not to give them the benefit of the doubt. I think like most dudes they're going to be looking for a genuine connection and you can cater to that. But even if they go on to indulge in hookup culture well then isn't that their business? If they were interested in random sex they'd probably be going to prostitutes anyway. It's the seeking of something more substantial that makes it so hard for them.

[monkeynutts]

Yeah but their choice, if they are engaged in hook up culture, they have to stay away from my female friends, I'm not going to encourage bad behavior, if they can't get laid it may be because they need to re address their attitude to the opposite sex, anyway unless they are my family i dont really care if they have relationships with men or women, or become a hermit.

[Opinion Owner]

@monkeynutts Yes, we've already established that if it doesn't affect you then apparently it's not a problem worth being concerned with. Let's just say you don't have the kindness and empathy to help here and leave it at that.

[TonyBologna25]

A lot of people are rather unfortunate looking and don’t have the ability to socialize the way everyone else does. Can they make efforts to improve their situation? Sure, but I think it’s only logical to understand that they have a big disadvantage in life in comparison to most.

[Idonthaveausername]

Yes. I wrote a MyTake on that if you're interested in reading it

[Goodwifie]

It's not just about looks alone.
Some people just have no sense of how to develop a mutual connection.

[HopelessPaul]

That's honest and empathetic enough.

[A-man-22]

Neither poll option is what I believe.
Both sides are at fault to an extent.
Incels have horrible attitudes towards women. Women aren't causers of all your problems.
Yet some women really do give the entire gender a bad name.

Just like some women forsake men because they were mistreated by them incels do the same.

I'm no incel and don't support the cause but I can understand why they exist.

You'd get bitter if no one ever loved you and the only ones to get close to you use you.

When you see women getting loved for their flaws such as weight and body shape yet many women would turn you down for being short or timid you feel hopeless and then anger.

It no reason to hate all women but I hope people can see both sides so their is no hate going to either side.

[ForteExe]

If there was a third choice that said "men and women are both culpable for the existence of incels" I'd chose that one instead. I don't think the problem is "women just need to weaken their standards and spread their legs" or "incels are a bunch of spineless wimps who need to stop blaming others and get their shit together". There's more to it than that but I currently don't have time to go into more detail. I'll explain more on this later (if I can remember to do it lol).

[ForteExe]

Okay so as I see it the incels are a symptom of a greater problem, so I don't think addressing them in a vacuum is the correct approach. It'd be like only treating a fever when someone has the flu, while ignoring the viral infection entirely; even if the fever breaks you still have the flu. I think the bigger issue is the current dating game. The rules used to be "boy meets girl -> boy courts girl -> boy gets date -> if boy and girl are a good match after repeated dating then they get married -> they start a family-> they grow old and die together". While those rules have basically stayed the same there have been other rules spontaneously added and seemingly arbitrary details have been changed, making it more difficult to play within the old rules.

[ForteExe]

For instance the fuckery that's been debated about gender roles and what is "sexist" or considered "harassment" have made things overly complicated. Depending on who you talk to, it's sexist for a man to want a woman who'll stay home to take care of the house and family. Some women will not only say it's sexist, but also try to get you fired for suggesting it and destroy your reputation, while others prefer to stay home and take care of a family and don't consider it sexist at all. I was called a pedophile by 3 women on GaG recently for saying that I didn't want to date a woman above 27 because at that age childbirth becomes risky. I've both seen and personally experienced vitriolic reactions from women AND men when the value the traditional gender roles of both sexes was expressed by myself and by others and it's had a real impact on how I've approached women. It's not good. I have a more stubborn and persistent temperament than the majority so usually don't just give up when I want something, but persevering and eventually meeting my girlfriend was extremely difficult for me. I was depressed and listless for a long time because I couldn't figure out what I should do to be successful with women, and when I looked to others for advice I got nothing but unreliable and contradictory suggestions. If not for my stubbornness I think I would have given up long ago and instead live my life bitter, resentful and alone. It is a fact that there are guys far less persistent, stubborn and articulate than I am, and those are commonly (but not entirely) the incels.

[ForteExe]

They're the guys who can't figure out the game and don't want to keep failing until they succeed. Instead they blame women for making the rules too hard and convoluted, knowing full well the game shouldn't be this hard and insist the rules be made easier. Incels by no means take a productive approach, and in that sense they only make their situation worse. However I don't think their potential success is truly within their control either. That is, even if they got their acts together and did the "right thing" (whatever that is) the game is still broken and playing is extremely difficult. I don't even know what advice I could give them. I don't know what the right approach is. I successfully met my girlfriend out of sheer chance and a stroke of luck that people often pray for. I can't think of a way to reliably go out and get a girlfriend because there's too many random factors to worry about. It's too damn dangerous these days. I do think incels are right to blame certain women for their part in making the game exceedingly difficult. There are plenty of women who haven't actively made things worse, and those ones should be cherished as far as I'm concerned. My girlfriend is one of them and I couldn't be more thankful to have met her, but the ones like the 3 who called me a pedophile for not wanting to date women who are too old to give me a family can go to hell and are every bit responsible. I don't think they are responsible for my ability/inability to get a girlfriend, but they are among many who have caused unnecessary tension between men and women of late, and make it exceedingly difficult to speak comfortably with the opposite sex.

[ForteExe]

I think the best solution to salvaging the "incels" is a two-fold attempt at 1. Making the rules of the dating game both clear and constant, restoring tradition as much as possible, and 2. Telling incels to take responsibility for their own shit situation and point them in the right direction when necessary. HOWEVER, any advice given MUST be both constructive and reliable. If they follow the advice they are given and still fail they will default back to their degenerate "incel" behavior". No advice is better than bad advice in their situation. There's also something else about incels that most people neglect to mention regarding the affect this is having on them. It's been shown scientifically that repeated social failures among humans inhibits serotonin levels in the human brain, and it's been separately proven that humiliation, failure and low sexual activity are all factors in low testosterone production in men. Incels are subjected to an abundance of these things at once (regardless of whose fault it is), and the psychological impact it's having on them is extremely harmful. Particularly in the case of testosterone production, since T levels stop increasing naturally in men in their mid 20s. In other words, if they continue the way they've been past their mid 20s their physical development will be permanently stunted, and even if they get a break later in life they will never recover from being "incels". Additional, their insufficient testosterone and serotonin levels will make them less attractive to women, catching them in a positive feedback loop. People like to talk shit about guys like that and call them pathetic wimps (which doesn't help their recovery in the slightest, and actually makes it harder to change), but these guys have a serious issue that needs to be taken seriously, regardless of who's to blame.

[Idonthaveausername]

I appreciate the extensive response but do disagree with the core concept of it. Yes dating rules have changed, but that doesn't mean you have to play by the new rules. Plenty of people still play by and prefer the old rules. I prefer the old rules and don't want to date a fuckboy who just wants to sleep around and shack up with a girl until they get so tired of each other they have to break up or get knocked up. Playing by the new rules will end in a bad relationship, so if that's not what you want, you don't have to do it that way

Essentially the reason why that has all changed was "women's sexual liberation." Is was not "men's sexual liberation" because they already had a lot of sex and it was well-known men used prostitutes while women did not. The problem is that men were ok with treating women like nothing more than sexual objects because it made them feel macho. Women get the name for it, but it was because both men and women were ok with sleeping around. So yes it is a problem and it has changed dating forever, but men are equally guilty for ruining it. Considering men have always oversexualized women and push for it more, from my perspective, men were more guilty of inciting this hookup culture we have now. So while I do think it is a problem, it is not correct for incels to blame this hookup culture on women because both men and women engage in it

When I say incels are their own worst enemy, I say that because they have bad attitudes. Insulting women is not a good way to get them to like, sleep with, or date you. Their aggressive, rude, and hostile behavior is their problem. Blaming women is their problem. Blaming anybody but themselves for their own problems is their problem

[ForteExe]

I'm not really sure what part we disagree on. I agree with everything you're saying. I think we've more or less said the same thing, although you've described the toxic dating climate a bit differently than I did. I agree that these guys are rude and disrespectful in their approach and it's not a good solution and that women aren't responsible for men's actions. The only thing I'd add to your response is that the guys we're talking about when we say incel have a serious problem to deal with and they often don't know how to deal with it, and it's not a problem that can be solved only with their actions. You've done a better job at crystalizing some of the points I made though, so thanks for that.

[ForteExe]

Instead of saying "incels are rude and need to stop" I think it's more productive to say "incels are rude and making their own problems worse, and instead of lashing out both men and women should seriously consider what they can do to make interactions between men and women more civil and inviting instead of intimidating and unpleasant."

[cykasenpai]

Great points. The incel question fascinates me and it fascinates me even further the lack of understanding people seem to have. It's really not a simple "just improve lol", but at the same time they're, at least, partially responsible for their situations.

You say things have become overly complicated. I share a similar sentiment. The thing I dislike the most about female-male relationships now is how incredibly restricted I feel when I want to talk to a girl. It really makes things more complicated. The difference between talking to a girl from the East (japanese girls in particular) and a girl from my home country is paramount. You feel so comfortable with mainland Asian girls in comparison it truly baffles me. I live alongside a lot of international students. I've approached quite a few.

[ForteExe]

Thanks senpai. I hadn't really thought about Japanese girls as part of the equation before, but I've gotten the impression for a while that Japan is probably one of the last bastions of traditional gender roles (even though their own region specific traditions seem to be dying out).

[cykasenpai]

Yeah either japanese girls or fundamental christians haha

[MarkRet]

There's a guy on GaG right now who goes on about being a virgin, but he only wants an 'attractive' woman, not a 'fat ugly woman', because that will make him look like a loser, or something like that. Ultimately, he ends up BEING the loser.

[Jean-Marie_Céline]

I know him.
I tried to give him advice and help him, but he only wants shoulder pats.

[ciitruskiwi]

That guy just complains for the sake of complaining. Like @jean-marie_celine said, he wants shoulder pats not advice.

[PopMart1997]

Does this guy post the same stuff on Reddit as well?

[Jjpayne]

I did not know I had a name :) but yes I agree with you, we just did not take the right steps that we needed to make a relationship happen, my fault was I watched to many romantic movies and listened to too many of my Christian friends that said just wait for it to happen and it will happen when you least expect it, bs I have been waiting for 20 years for that to happen...

[cykasenpai]

Haha I have a hard time thinking you would even remotely classify as an incel

[Jjpayne]

@cykasenpai "involuntarily celibate" is how it is described. While I am waiting for right one, it does not mean that I want to be celibate, no I think about it almost everyday to have a romantic relationship with a girl, the problem is I have been waiting for a girl to show up for me and I just now am fed up with waiting too long to wait for that girl to show up, I need to go looking for her. Now don't get me wrong, it is for a relationship and if the relationship is good sex will naturally follow

[cykasenpai]

You're not grasping the concept. The idea of involuntary celibate is that no matter what you ever would do, you cannot find romance. In your case, it was a voluntary choice to not go looking for a partner. It wasn't because something was so wrong with you that you couldn't possibly get a partner.

[Goodwifie]

@cykasenpai This dude is definitely a an Incel

[cykasenpai]

@Goodwifie Who're you referring to?

[Dchrls78104]

I thin that Incels are their own worst enemy. Everything I have read about them suggests not only that they think that they are sad and pathetic losers who can't get girls no matter what they do, but also that they have a warped sense of entitlement to sex and women and in this regard are not above the use of violence.
Forcing love never works.

[Repa33]

"Im such a nice guy! Why dont those dumb, worthless, chad chasing, cock sluts want a gentleman like me?"

[Jean-Marie_Céline]

[Jean-Marie_Céline]

*How nice guys thinks sex works.

[Nuremberg45]

@Jean-Marie_Céline lmao I used to have one of those

[esotericstory]

@Repa33 just because someone has a poor vocabulary doesn't mean that they hate women you know.

[Jean-Marie_Céline]

@Nuremberg45 Did it work?

[Nuremberg45]

@Jean-Marie_Céline nah lol not at all

[Jean-Marie_Céline]

@Nuremberg45 Dang, I'll have to burn the stack I prepared 😂

[Nuremberg45]

@Jean-Marie_Céline Lol Abort mission, Abort mission

[Unit1]

Oh man. Those are as terrible as their female counterparts, who tear other women down in an attempt to shine and stand out.

[Jean-Marie_Céline]

@Unit1 I had to deal with a so called "nice girl".
Instead of that card they have the "Times I acted like a lady" card.

[Unit1]

@Jean-Marie_Céline Pretty much. Here, it took me some time to find these (and I'm sure, that there are some more on the internet).





Although I wanted to point that out, the amount of males turning into demons appear to be present at an alarming rate I would say.

[Nuremberg45]

@Unit1 good lord, if a lady wants to be treated like a lady she needs to act like a lady and a man must act like a man to be treated as such

[Unit1]

@Nuremberg45 i agree. It's really that simple. Although some would say king and queen instead of man and lady but it's basically the same meaning.

See the problem is there is no way in dating to test how women/men would handle rejection. If they handle rejection fine, then we lost her already and there's no way to get her back. But if she turns into a demoness then we can be sure to be having dodged a bullet. It sucks.

[Nuremberg45]

@Unit1 true, especially on a first date

[Anonymous]

Men with bad attitudes do push women away. Life is too short to be miserable (and we're miserable when we have to put up with people's bad attitude. I wish there was a test we'd have to take (and we'd have to be honest) before entering a relationship. The next best thing I found is to learn about people's subtle behavior and what it indicates. I learned what to look for by reading "Are Women The Stronger Sex?" It was free to download from online book sites and it became a valuable tool I refer to often.

[hellacray]

Yeah and from what I've seen most of these guys don't have jobs, aren't going to school, and spend a lot of time just complaining with other incels.

Of course not all of them are like this cause there are guys that stop being an incel. But I'd say a good amount of them just needs to work on themselves first.

[Malik00]

Here's the problem the definition of an incel has become so broad, that people just apply it to any man that doesn't do whatever a woman tells them to or doesn't agree with everything she says. I thought incel meant anti social dipshit not someone who is critical and a free thinker.

[Anonymous]

Most girls probably have met at least one of them online. One of the reasons I quit this website when I was younger was because of an incel. Just toxic and horrible people. If you are an incel, it's most likely because of your personality and how horrible a person you are towards women. You aren't the nice guy that can't get a girl because they are all shallow. You are the "nice guy" all women with a brain hate with all their guts.

[Stephen3355]

Boo hoo, another angry feminist

[Opinion Owner]

Cue "nice guy".

[Liam_Hayden]

Most INCELs are self-created. They are lazy and/or awkward, yet expect to date women who get attention from other men. When they fail, instead of blaming themselves they blame the women who choose active and positive guys rather than the boring and negative ones.

[Celtero]

Not always as simple as "just improve yourself lol." Just because it's easy for you doesn't mean it's easy for everybody else. Some of these people are physically deformed, hideous, mentally ill or impaired.

[Idonthaveausername]

My uncle is in the hospital having his toes amputated, but my aunt still loves him despite his deformity. My ex was caught in an explosion at work and had a deformity of his eye yet I still loved him. My boyfriend is mentally ill, but I'm okay with that because he uses medication. Plenty of people are impaired by many things and still manage to get a date or marry. That's no excuse

[Jean-Marie_Céline]

I don't know if this is a defense to incels, or a subtle jab at them

[Giggletr0n]

Found the other incel. I am 2 for 2

[Celtero]

@Giggletr0n Dude, I remember you from when I first joined as one of those creepy guys who hits on minors.

@Jean-Marie_Céline Not really a defense... I'll tell incels to stop whining and make something of themselves when they pop up. But I'll also let people know how ignorant they're being when they think they could do so much better if they were in their shoes.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

No one said it was easy to "just improve ourselves". Some might have genuine difficulties doing so and there is nothing they can do about it. Nothing except their attitude regarding the problem. I had a midget in my high school that was known as one of the biggest casanovas around. I am not joking here!
If someone doesn't want/can't improve himself or his atitude then he will have to be really patient until he finds the right one.

[Anonymous]

The thing is, when you have people like feminists that exist, it's natural that there's going to be some backlash. I'm very happy to know that most women aren't feminists but in the eyes of the incel's all women are man-hating, female superiority seeking trash because feminists have a very loud voice.

[Nuremberg45]

My school of thought is no one is responsible for any one elses actions, but we are responsible for our own actions

[Nuremberg45]

by the way what is an incel

[btbc92]

Not celibate by choice. INvoluntary CELibate. = INCEL. A really dumb terminology.

[Nuremberg45]

@btbc92 so just a stupid excuse as to why a person is single?

[btbc92]

Exactly.

[Nuremberg45]

@btbc92 lmao

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

Yep. Crying and moaning won't fix your life. Go out and meet girls at least one of them will say yes if you go out a lot.

[Theroarer]

Then why are men in open marriages slowly killing themselves in depression, anxiety, loneliness if all that was necessary was to go out and meet girls and one of them will say yes?

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@Theroarer: I don't know. I'm sick of all these men always whining about women.

[Theroarer]

Well they should complain when they have serious problems and are dying in such a horrible lonely deaths all in the name of love, like you wouldn't whine when you are hurt. Who cares about the people who die abused to death believing it was love eh?

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@Theroarer: I don't worship love nor women, so it doesn't me at all. I worship God only.

I just simply go out and always see cute women and talk to them if I think they are cute. If you don't open your mouth to speak then don't expect women to talk back to you.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

*bother

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@Theroarer You know that even if the suicide rate is bigger in men doesn't mean we are all doing it or ever will consider doing it.
Worshiping woman is something some weak guys do in hope they will like them. This only backfires of course. Don't worry there are many many guys out there who don't do this.

[Lord_Thy_Gawd]

Both. Men are stigmatized for being short and/or bald and it doesn't make dating life easy for them. It becomes easy to develop a toxic attitude, but doing so just takes away the chances you have left.

[Anonymous]

yes!!! some of the shit they say 'im not attractive' 'im not rich' im not this or that, like dude ur a 7 if u shaved ur "beard" and got clean clothes. just talk about something other than ur low self esteeme and u will be fine. its really not that hard.

[Anonymous]

From the ones I've met, yup. They tend to be toxic as hell and have a warped perception.

[BlackDawn]

Yeah. When a girl hears incel, they aren’t Thinking that this is simply a misunderstood guy. They are thinking OK this is a woman hating asshole

[Lance1965]

Yes, excuses, excuses, excuses, this is all you hear from them.

[SentientBrick]

Very yes. They blame their problems on others because its easier than change.

[MarketData]

I don't get Incels. If they hate women so much why are they so pissed about not getting laid by them?

[capncool]

Sour grapes

[YHL6965]

They are bitter, and bitter people are disproportionately aggressive with others.

[Americanteengirl]

I think that men who call themselves incels are unattractive and insane.

[Anonymous]

Incel here, make whatever strawman you want to believe of me for being one.

One frequently misunderstood point about incels is that you can only take conscious, personally accountable charge of what you control (and we do, for much your personal butthurt prefers to cherrypick and indulge your confirmation bias), but that doesn't mean denying or covering your eyes when there are external, systemic and natural hierarchies (either biological or cultural) rigging the outcomes. Regardless of whether those hierarchies are inevitable or not, forcing your liberal meritocratic sense of personal responsibility will only further reproduce ingrained inequities.

Perhaps you could drop your condescending focus on empathizing with worldviews but taking a look at objective, external realities to individuals that yet affect them.

[Idonthaveausername]

Actually taking responsibility is a conservative spproach. Wining about the rest of the world causing your problems is a liberal approach. The rest of the world is not punishing you. You are responsible for your actions. Wining and complaining about women and the world is only making you less attractive. So if your goal is to aound patheticand never be worthy of a relationship, then you're doing a great job

[Opinion Owner]

Seems a moronic female didn't understand how social exclusion works because she takes her pampered privileges for granted.

[Opinion Owner]

I recommend you to actually take responsibility for yourself and your own shit cognitive biases instead, go read about the just world fallacy instead of being an uncivilized ape.

[Idonthaveausername]

There is nothing pampered or privileged about me. I have lived on my own for 4 years and fully financially support myself. I work a full time job and have worked up to 63 hours a week to provide for myself and support my future. I take full responsibility for myself and my actions

[Opinion Owner]

>thinks she's not pampered for living on her own for 4 years
LOL, go tell your daddy about that if he didn't abandon you for being a shitty kid or something.
>works 63 hrs a week yet finds time to shitpost a plethora of mytakes on GAG
Yeah yeah, to think you could've invested such time in learning not to be human trash and actually being empathetic and philosophically self aware instead. Spare me your hypocritical nonsense, you act like some humiliated retard who fucked up hard once, hates herself but is in denial and now is trying too hard to cover up for her insecurities by shitting at herself at others. You wonder why some many old people regret your way of being and perhaps you'll learn a thing or two instead of being a retarded whore who can't even get proper culture nor education and thinks of herself as worthy for shitty work ethics she knows little about, other than she feels validated for it.

[Opinion Owner]

If anything, you're the retarded liberal who buys meritocratic bullshit because she can't think in an intellectually honest way about the necessary principles for it to work, you're like a shitty post-Marxist thinking we already live an egalitarian society with equal opportunities for everyone regardless of objective material and physical conditions or distribution of power.

[Opinion Owner]

You're nothing but a first-world ginger whore who knows shit about the rest of the world or the people other than herself, you're the kind of retard who can't see beyond her own nose until she lives crap but who cares, all in all everyone treats super well and pampered cute tiny faces of your kind.

You're morally disgusting and at this point it doesn't even matter if you become aware of it, because you couldn't do shit either for creating a better world for anyone but your own individualistic self.

[Idonthaveausername]

I'm a registered Republican and very conservative in my beliefs. I do not believe in a Marxist or socialistic society. Intellectual, a socialist or Marxist society would not work, so there's no way to think that it would. Everyone is equal under the law. Any inequality you experience is self-made

Everyone on this site lives in the first world, so you properly shouldn't be so hypocritical with that insult. I love being a ginger and my boyfriend loves that I'm a ginger as well. Considering I've never slept with anyone, much less for money, I'm not a whore by definition. I am not retarded, but my brother is. That is a medical diagnosis, so you shouldn't accuse people of being so without a medical degree. I have experienced more in my lifetime than most people, and the fact that I've made it through is the reason why I understand how to help people understand what their own problems in life are. Nobody Pampers me except myself. I hold myself to the same morals most religions do, so I'm the exact opposite of morally disgusting by objective opinion

[Opinion Owner]

Oh, look at that, a murican sweetie thinks she's rahpablikan cuz she followed daddy's word, what a miracle of female critical thinking who doesn't even stop to reflect on the ideological weight of her actions as long as she's loyally pleasing her cock in turn.

You're one hell of a moron not to realize that's shit because I'm neither from a first world country and I know I'm not the only one, further proof you're so fucking pampered you can't bother knowing who's in front of you. If you think you've experienced more in life that's because you're a retard who can't connect the dots between experience and time nor learn to be humble about it, just like any edgy teen who thinks she knows shit she doesn't. Your level of self awareness is that of any random slut you can find here; they get special treatment from everyone for their looks, without realizing until they get older, uglier and abandoned and they're forced to wonder wtf happened. You're so unprepared for real bullshit that at this point I kinda pity you.

[Opinion Owner]

You're the kind of idiot who doesn't figure why her platitudinal advice doesn't work out in an objective, externally hierarchized reality and perhaps honestly believes her shit actually helps, because end of the day you don't have to take shit charge for when it fails or is not falsifiable in a Popperian sense.

You obviously weren't expected to put particularly any notable effort in life (yet you think you do, because you wouldn't be able to live with yourself otherwise) and that's why you're like this, it's a f*** cliche.

[Opinion Owner]

If you want to talk big on your own responsibilities, learn a thing or two and read philosophy for your own personal sake if you don't give a shit about others.

[Idonthaveausername]

My life is pretty great right now, so that's proof my advice works out. People who take my advice end up with better results. My advice has lead me to find the perfect man for me who is protective, loyal, and intelligent. He is everything a girl could want from a guy, especially his height and attractiveness. So you're not fooling anyone because I know my boyfriend and I found each other because we were meant for each other and deserve to be together because we treat people right and are morally sound. Our future together will be so blissful, we won't even be able to hear your groans in the gutter below. I work hard now in life so I will he able to support my boyfriend and any future children we may have. I will keep his health and happiness as my main responsibility in life, and that's more than anybody could say for you

[Opinion Owner]

You're honestly stupid and incapable of putting yourself in other people's shoes who won't fit your cherrypicked "patients", aren't you? It's like you don't even realize how what you call help is basically projecting shitty platitudes from your own experience that aren't doing the job themselves nor are seeing who is really in front of you.

I'm glad you won't ever have to be born under another skin, because you completely suck at thinking of anyone else but yourself. Perhaps it's best that human garbage like you keep in your social bubble, foreign to others real problems so that people who can actually listen and become part of those who really need it won't have to deal with your shit kind.

[Opinion Owner]

Think for a second about every circumstance that you didn't choose but led you to be where you are, for much it hurts your ego to accept you owe it to real conditions much more than your spirit. Think for a shitty second how what you call help isn't for helping others but validating yourself as a human being (notice how hard you try to convince me you're decent and flawless as a human being, you wonder why politicians are much like you but people won't trust them shit until realities come from down the sewer).

Deal with it, you can't help everyone with shitty virtue signalling words. It doesn't mean others hadn't heard your shitty platitudes nor actually tried and put effort (you shamelessly can't see from your own privilege), but the world's not necesarily going to adapt to your ideas in everyone. Have that minimum moral decency not to put yourself above others and their legitimate judgment before you want to pledge to God you're "good wahman" or whatsoever.

[Idonthaveausername]

You should keep talking. You need to let all this pent-up anger out. It's not good for your mental health

I'm going to take excellent care of my boyfriend and he's going to take excellent care of me. He's going to love me and provide for me and protect me from jerks like you. I'm going to love him and nurture him and provide the comforting, supportive family he's always dreamed of. We each hold the other one on a pedestal above all other living beings because we care more deeply about each other than anything you'll ever experience

[Opinion Owner]

Further proof you're ignorant as fuck when it comes to mental health concerns, I bet you couldn't even differentiate between psychological currents nor cite a reasonable share of scientifically replicable studies that won't turn out being shit quackery.

Yeah, we all start life being idealistic as fuck until unpredictable shit happens, and you don't understand wtf is going on until it's too late. Didn't know a shitty insignificant incel could represent such a threat to her Majesty, by the way. Good luck struggling with your hypergamous thoughts as you grow up and find out who you have in front of you isn't who you thought to be.

[Opinion Owner]

End of the day, I'm not going to hurt you a single bit (just wtf with you assuming I'm an immoral, uncivilized ape by this point) and all the damage will come from the worst threat you currently face: yourself and your own delusions. I can see you're the kind of female who'd get a beating from her abusive husband but would still think a retard like me represents a worse threat.

[Idonthaveausername]

Mental illness is actually something I have a lot of experience with. My father is a narcissist (that's how I know how to deal with selfish, conceited trolls like yourself) and my mother is a schizophrenic (that's how I know how to thoroughly explain concepts to delusional individuals such as yourself). Mental illness is a serious concern and I encourage you to seek professional help because your anger and hostility is well outside a mentally healthy range

I'm not about to tell you my whole life story, but I've experienced enough unexpected things in my life to be able to laugh at your mockery. Nothing in life is predictable, therefore I do not live in an idealistic world

The only person you're a threat to is yourself. I'm sure Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth isn't concerned with any insignificant incels, and I'm sure she's never even heard of you

I don't have Hypergamous thoughts because that's not a thing. I don't hunt down guys because they have status. I look for certain qualities in a man who will support and protect me, someone I'll be compatible with and able to love. Refusing to settle for anything less than you need for a healthy sustainable relationship is smart planning, not Hypergamy. What's funny is my boyfriend was actually getting to the point where be was ready to settle before he met me, but now neither of us have to settle because we finally found each other. I don't need your luck, so you should save it for yourself. You're the one who needs it

Lol you couldn't hurt me. You're a nothing but a miserable username. I don't see you as a threat. I see you as a pathetic loner who needs a friend. If you need a friend, I can be one for you

I dumped my ex for cheating on me, so I certainly wouldn't stay with an abusive husband. My boyfriend is the sweetest, kindest, most gentle man I've ever met, and he respects my boundaries. He would never hit me or insult me

[Opinion Owner]

So, the little snowflake thinks because she had a narc daddy (my mom also was, by the way, and I'm not whining like you about that nor bringing it to justify myself) that gives her the authority to call others trolls to project her own image of superiority. I don't know where the fuck are you imagining I care about delusions of grandeur or whatever daddy issues you're projecting on me, now that's definitely your own fight to have. Not even gonna discuss you probably don't even have a psych degree, nor have read APA standards nor discussions on its definitions.

Glad to see you finally realize I don't precisely care abut your life, but you have some work realizing how idealism works regarding its philosophical works.

That's a nice change of words from your previous post, seems it worked to ask your boyfriend to pamper and calm a bit your mood in there, Queen Elizabeth. All for you excellence's well deserved joy.

That's not for you to claim, darling, self-reporting does a poor job when it comes to females addressing their own behavior as the sexual revolution's consequences are gradually coming to prove.

I could but regardless of your cynical beliefs that's not my goal, no matter how butthurt you sound there trying to belittle me to feel superior about yourself. For much I think you're an unempathetic degenerate, I'm not one to hurt a fly without good reason.

Again, you're thinking people in black and white terms, from overidealization to a full negative image. For someone who claims knowledge in mental health, I assume you're aware that trait has its associations.

[Opinion Owner]

In summary, I'll cite one of my favorite authors, who I figure a delusional brute of your kind must know little of to recognize him without a Google:

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they're free".

You could've spared yourself those bitter words if you learned to acknowledge your own and others limitations in life, but instead of that you chose to condescend and humiliate, to disregard the shades of gray and radicalize other people as either troll, self indulgent garbage or "sweetest, most kind, gentleman" types, for what I humbly suggest to question yourself about it and how your own attitude and beliefs contributes to the way you get treated. Here, a good start so you don't get too lost about it:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Just-world_hypothesis

[Idonthaveausername]

Stop claiming that you're not trying to hurt people. Abusing people online by calling them names and accusing them of doing things they're not is trying to hurt people. Your hostility is uncalled for and abusive. I'm not hurt by you because I understand you're pathetic and lashing out at others due to your own inability to take responsibility for your actions. Don't think you know anything about me because you don't. Everything you've written is about yourself, so don't make yourself a fool by thinking it applies to anybody else

I know much more about psychology than you seem to think. I've read the DSM and followed up with the main coauthor on things he would've changed. What psychology students are taught today is a watered-down version of True mental illness that they can apply to anybody, whether that individual is mentally I'll or not. Certain things were intentionally redacted (such as homosexuality and transgenderism) to be more politically correct. Psychologists are taught to not treat these as a mental illness anymore because people like you are too easily offended by telling them that their mentality is wrong and hurting them. One of the worst things they changed was simplifying schizophrenia into the same condition despite catatonic and, paranoid, and undifferentiated schizophrenia hosting an entirely different set of symptoms

So please continue to deny my knowledge of psychology, because you're only going to further prove my level of competence when I explain it to you and your level of incompetence by using it wrong. I studied medical psychology because I used to want to be a psychologist. I decided not to be one because I'd rather not listen to problems from people like you who refuse to do anything about your situation and would prefer to blame others for your problems

I'm not a queen yet, but my boyfriend will treat me like one once we're married; and I will worship him as my king. We earned that. We are not privileged

[Opinion Owner]

I originally posted with no intention to hurt anyone but get incel difficulties recognized in difference to others. Same way you recognize disability, gender or any other handicap that breaks equal opportunities for different people. You began preaching in a condescending tone as if we didn't take charge of ourselves for it, and that speaks poor of your own incapacity of not projecting your personal experience onto others.

I never claimed hurting you either, because as you sure know, you're the one who has unsolved issues and likes to project on others. You're making others pay for having an abusive narcissistic parent, you refuse to accept you didn't have control over that and cope pretending everyone else who faces a difficult time should be able to control it same way you think you should've done but didn't. I honestly invite you to relate to rape victims in the same way, given they're at least your own gender. I haven't told you anything about my life as you did to try disuading me, so your "talk about yourself" smells much like you're trying to move past telling me about your own life.

Yeah, I've worked with psychologists as well and I know enough on how you prefer to belittle and ridiculize people when you don't know how everyone's differences won't be answered by preaching a rigid concept of responsibility that more often than not is an appeal to authority to keep people thinking faults can't be ever external and everything that happens is by your own fault, regardless of what you can do from it.

Unlike you, I don't feel an insecure need about stating my major or real life status to validate myself, so I'll leave that space in blank for your personal imagination to comfort herself.

[Opinion Owner]

Should add that in sheer honesty, every major in psychology I've met has much better skills to empower people without an humiliating tone or invalidating well addressed circumstances instead of taking the easy way out and say "awh nahw day play viktim again can't wahrk laik diz".

[Opinion Owner]

It's quite ironic how you like to blame liberals instead of taking charge of that instead, and the reason why I think you're as full of bullshit as they are. Hopefully the whole profession won't enter in crisis because of politically biased imbeciles like you who get pissed at others for a flawed concept of responsibility, regardless the fact I don't share liberals take on it either.

[Idonthaveausername]

I do take responsibility for myself and my actions

You can keep talking to yourself here. It doesn't even sound like you have a theory on what it is you think I'm not taking responsibility for yet you keep claiming I'm not doing it with something. I'm not blaming liberals for anything. The only people I'm blaming anything on are winy, pathetic, hostile little Incels whi go around insulting women because they don't want to take responsibility for their own bad behavior and negative attitude towards women... that would be you. I am not political biased nor do I compliment political bias when it comes to responsibility. You are respond for yourself no matter what political party you affiliate with

[Opinion Owner]

The fact you're making half assed (and incorrect) diagnosis on anonymous people you don't know about speaks otherwise, that's a professional responsibility even kids know enough about.

You're now playing retard after attacking politically correct culture (which you don't even seem to know from which psychological current that comes from, perhaps you could read a bit about social constructionism for starters so we can speak the same language), which is in poor taste but I can't force you otherwise. Making a strawman of incels isn't gonna help the fact you're not even adhering to basic moral imperatives like treating others as you wish being treated, nor you can stop to think for a second that, perhaps, those disgusting incels can and do behave and take responsibility yet are excluded systemically for their characteristics instead of their behavior.

I'll leave this here for you, in case you want to improve yourself about what's causing your judgment flaw:

en. wikipedia. org/wiki/Just-world_hypothesis

[Idonthaveausername]

I'm not trying to diagnose you. You accused me of not understand psychology, so I merely explained to you that I understand a lot more about it than the average individual

Im. not playing dumb. I know exactly what I'm talking about. I am explaining to you that I am not liberal nor do I believe in political correctness or socialistic views towards responsibility because you have falsely accused me of doing so. If you can't handle someone debunking your false claims, them don't accuse people of being something they're not

Stop being hostile towards other people. Stop blaming women for your problems. Start taking responsibility for yourself and your problems in life

You are an incel because you think you can dictate what women say and think, but in reality you're completely wrong. Women don't want to date you because you're a misogynist. If you want to prove you're not, then stop accusing me of having beliefs that I don't and trying to do things I'm not

[Opinion Owner]

You called me a "narcissist just like my father", among all the accusations. Someone who actually understands about it doesn't react the way you did from right at the beginning nor falls for the old triggersome words I spelled.

Even without regarding the substance of your ideas, the way you convey them is so rigid and self assured that it raises a red flag to bother taking you seriously at this point. I'm telling you that there's a difference between what you tell to yourself you are, and what you're on your acts and judgments at others. It's called a cognitive dissonance, which I'll assume bona fide you recall from your lectures.

To be honest, no one calls me hostile in real life. Again, it's easier for you to demonize me because it gives you moral relief about being wrong, I'm not one to take that out from you but that's just my two cents.

Now this is moronic delusional beyond any doubt, I kinda pity your poor strawman here. All my life, the one thing I wanted is someone I could see as an equal in terms of personal agency, autonomy of judgment and communication. Someone who had similar powers, limitations, philosophical takes, life experiences, you name it. Your own fear keeps building an image of me or other incels, dishonestly ignoring individual context, to feel correct about yourself, same way as if I actually generalized all women under the same sack (no darling, I don't).

Anyways, I can't force you to be humble about yourself, that's either something life will force on you or not, or hopefully, something you'll eventually choose to cultivate and empathize from an intellectually honest position that is not just what you choose as your personal, egocentric beliefs. Whenever you can actually do that, I'll actually treat you as a human being.

[ForteExe]

Yo @anon stop being a whiny little cunt, man up and take responsibility for your actions. The reason you can't get any is because you're so damn spineless that you mine as well not have a dick to fuck her with. The time you spend slapping the keyboard with your feet could be spent doing something useful.

[Idonthaveausername]

Yes I did say I know how to handle people with narcissism like my father, and that you first nicely into that category. Many people have narcissistic-personality disorder without being full-blown narcissists. Now I'm not a psychiatrist, so I know I can't diagnose you, but I can point out that you have a lot of the traits used to diagnose narcissistic-personality disorder. If you were a narcissist, you would 1) be so full of yourself you wouldn't he offended by my mentioning narcissism in relation to you and 2) think much more highly of yourself than to blame women for making you an incel because you would think all women loved you. But I'd peg you as the insecure narcissist if you were indeed one because you obviously think so slowly of yourself as to be an incel

I am rigid and self-assured because I know what I'm talking about and am not enough of a doormat for you to change my mind

With this attitude you have towards me and other women, you will never find someone who sees you as an equal in autonomy of judgement because every girl you meet will have better judgment than you. Nor will you meet a girl who sees you as an equal in communication because a key part of communication is understanding the other person's perspective, something you are clearly ignorant of

I fear nothing in life. I have been through enough to understand what life is and how go deal with hardships. I am thankful that I've finally met the one man I can truly connect with on a metaphysical level with respect and security, and that we have established a clear and open line of communication based on mutual care for each other's well-being

I treat everyone as a human being on principle of being a human being because that's how that works. The fact that you're treating me otherwise is a judgment of your character flaw

[Opinion Owner]

See how you think you know someone from a few posts? By this point I'll assume you know what are you doing, it's not like it has much of an effect given you're luckily not an actual therapist.

This is just immature and proper of youth, I'm not way older yet I can make a point in having changed myself from being as rigid and arrogant as you are.

You're literally so retarded you still don't understand why I'm purposely being like this at you in particular. You don't even see even if you weren't a female I'd treat you the same way, but that's yet another trick of yours to protect your moral stance from recognizing people can be more complex and have different responses, let alone making behavior choices according to the context. That still won't take out the fact others like you are less civilized in personal agency to take charge of themselves and adapt their disposition, which you must've noticed in my case is gradually less "hostile" as you call it, whereas you've not changed yours a single bit.

"Fools rush in where angels fear to tread". Trying to validate your past experience by pretending your control and tame every aspect of life is just an insecure cope mechanism, google for Ilusion of Control if you want to improve yourself again... assuming you want to grow as a human being and not an ape. That's not how a healthy person accepts his or her past wounds, can tell you not only from personal experience.

[Opinion Owner]

@ForteExe Aaaand nothing of value other than some shitty whiteknight, props for your effort.

[ForteExe]

Lol like you're saying anything of value? You're doing nothing but spouting hyperbole.

[Opinion Owner]

@ForteExe Yet another proof of apeish behavior in the absence of rational thought.

For a spoiled mommy's boy raised in the richest country of the world, your emotional and critical thinking skills are disappointing to say the least.

[ForteExe]

Yet more proof* you pretentious ass

[Opinion Owner]

@ForteExe I'm not moving a single finger, you're exposing yourself instead of contributing honest opinions. If anything, I could accuse you of being pretentious and patronizing for thinking incels don't put effort nor take responsibility (yet, guess what, that's not enough), but I'm not gonna push it too hard at some other clueless moron of the bunch.

[ForteExe]

Lol dude I defended you guys in another spot on this post so you're not doing yourself any favors by lashing out at me. You're not worth anyone's time or sympathy if this is how you act though. Fundamentally you're no different than the feminists who helped you fall into the rut you're in now. Stop blaming other people and claiming to be the victim of circumstance and do something about your shit life instead of whining about it online. No one wants to hear your crap anymore than we want to hear it from the feminazis.

[Idonthaveausername]

When you're dealing with someone online, a they have to go off is a few posts. Therefore I have to gauge your personality on the few posts I've seen here. If you're consistent, then you're a sad boy who wants a loving girlfriend more than anything who will worship him and sleep with him, but who will also allow him to treat her like a second-rate house plant

Au contrare. I perfectly understood why you're acting like this towards me. You were clearly triggered by my post insinuating that your lack of female companions and sex is due to your own selfish inability to respect women. I'm not confused at all on that

I am rigid because I am correct. To be wavering would be weak-minded. I don't want to be like you because my life is better than yours

Insulting people is not civilized. Please stop fooling yourself

I have no allusions of control. And I don't need to Google how to better myself or read a book or watch a seminar. I better myself by treating other people and myself decently, and being a little ray of sunshine to their day

Funny that a troglodyte should compare me to an ape. You should understand that I have neanderthal DNA, not silverback

@ForteExe is not a "shitty white knight". He is an honest man who doesn't approve of your melodrama because you're making other guys look bad by acting the way you do. He deserves much more than props for his efforts is assuaging you 😉

[ForteExe]

Thanks OP. @anon I'm gonna go spend the remainder of my night with my girlfriend. I'm sure you could understand that I'd rather be with her than you. Enjoy your teen angst.

[Opinion Owner]

@ForteExe "Defended", your virtue signalling makes no to change facts, same way platitudes suck shit at pretending everyone just taking showers and personality lessons will somehow just make it because "i wanna fink da wahrld iz fair". We all know actually abusive animals, not only pretentious but effectively dominant more often than not score their shit no matter they give a rat's ass for ethics, self improvement, personal agency or whatever you like to call it for your ideology's sake, there's no fair world and honestly I'd not have replied OP the way I did if she just had the capacity to accept that.

I'm no feminist but to scapegoat the state of the matters on them for something that has been there along the whole of human history is no better, you can figure out that by simply reading more from XIX philosophers on women (take Schopenhauer or even Nietzche for a start) to Socrates, let alone cultural pieces (Shakespeare is redpilled af).

Your unineuronal, ignorant thinking, same one who tries scapegoating feminists must make you think this is about either blaming oneself or women, not even structural reasons or determinism as an argument there. The point here is, hierarchies don't care shit who you blame you for, because your power as a person is limited and unequal to others; the inferior deserves hate and punishment, the superior deserve praise and reward.

Needless to say, you whining about "whiners" (given you lack the capacity to signify in a less simplistic form as the mentally challenged baboon behavior you show) is just ironic.

[Opinion Owner]

That's the most retarded excuse I've seen for someone to not correlate the treatment she receives as a consequence of her own feedback.

The amount of delusion you wrote further below is just circular in relation to what you already said, you're clearly no longer in a position where you do deserve more honest replies because you won't read.

[Opinion Owner]

@ForteExe Don't know what makes you think that's a triggersome reply to heal your butthurt, I don't have shit against you for having or not having a girlfriend but the fact you think people have no reasons to call out bs.

[Opinion Owner]

Anyways, whatever of value you could've said by this point, it clearly never showed up. Little point to keep trying to open your eyes by now.

[Idonthaveausername]

Lol you crack me up. It's like you're copy/pasting random things you found online. I honestly don't even know what you're going on about anymore because you seriously make zero sense. Your thought processes aren't even consistent. At one point I thought you were Forte because you were speaking like him and not yourself, but that makes even less sense because you aught to take your own advice at that

Not sure if you're acusing me of thinking the world is fair? I am the first person to say the world isn't fair. Of all things I've been through in life, if someone had told me that was fair, I would've liked to see the same happen to them and have then come out the other side without a mental state similar to your own. You still haven't given any legitimate reason why you think the way you do, so as far as I can tell, there is something inherently broken inside you. If you have come to this conclusion without something unfair happening to you, then you are far too gullible of a person to let all ths MGTOW incels brainwash you. If you have been in a negative enough situation to truly understand why the world is not fair, you would take responsibility of your own actions in putting yourself in that position in the first place. You alone are responsible for maturing as a human being to rise above your circumstances. Nobody is going to take your hand because you have to do it yourself

You treat me poorly because you're a wounded animal, lashing out at everyone who has something he doesn't: positive feedback from fellow humans. I didn't have that for a long time either, and I did my own fair share of lashing out, but I grew up because I had to. I had to get out and start being an adult and start supporting myself. When you're on your own, you have to take responsibility for yourself because there's nobody else to blame it on. Whatever has happened in the past is no longer relevant when you're moving on with your life

[Opinion Owner]

Nope, this is you being dishonest again.

You're indeed struggling hard at understanding the idea that actions and personal responsibility isn't enough (not only on this topic, btw), and I can see you're not one who has the capacity to imagine why, specially as you think it only in your own self centered personal experience terms.

I treat you poorly because you're being dishonest and disdainful of ideas that contradict your own. You think others didn't (or don't) evaluate and study your own beliefs about morality and the world, but the truth is that we do, something you're not doing from your side. If anything, I could say you're the butthurt one for not having been helped on your own misery, now you want to tell yourself you can individually control every circumstance you're put into to spare yourself from your fear of admitting you can be weak. I can even imagine how you could be one who has vampire fetishes and the likes from this.

[Opinion Owner]

Needless to add, a lot of incel/beta men problem are the direct result of what os actually a lack of personal responsibility from females themselves.

[Idonthaveausername]

I am 100% honest. The only thing you really have in this world is your integrity, and mine is polished like a diamond because I tend to it carefully

Actions and personal responsibility are the only things that will get you anywhere in life because they stay intact even when you run into surly and sordid people

You treat me poorly because you're bad person. I am trying to enlighten you, not disdain you

Au contrare! I'm glad nobody took my hand in life. I got to where I'm at in life on my own and it has made me a stronger, self-assured, independent person. This is freedom to know I don't have to depend on anyone for my own satisfaction and livelihood. When I met my boyfriend, I had the freedom to choose his affection, and I'll have the freedom to choose his protecting and depend on him when we get married

I don't fear being weak because I know I'm not. I know I was strong enough to overcome my past circumstances, so there's nothing I can't handle

How many posts did you read through to find out I have a vampire fetish? Lol that's some dedication, but you really should find someone else to be obsessed with because I don't need it from you

No woman is responsible for the way you feel. You feel that way because you don't think you deserve anything better. It is a fault of your nonexistent self-esteem. You have to take responsibility for your own feelings. Stop blaming women for your problems

[Opinion Owner]

You're not even trying to think that perhaps most of incels know about what you call personal responsibility, you want to give platitudinal advice to validate yourself.

>are the only things that will get you anywhere in life
Wrong, some people can get quite far without moving a finger, others might try their best and not move that much far.

> you're bad person
Black & white thinking, trait proper of BPD (nope, I'm not diagnosing you either). For you, it's like there's great, fantastic people or horrible pieces of shit you can't understand.

For this, I'll recommend you a very user-friendly book on cognitive biases for you to deduce which ones you're falling victim of: google Rolf Dobelli's The Art of Thinking Clearly. I can send you a PDF copy if you're not bright enough to get it on your own.

>depend on him
Again you taking for granted your relatives, bosses, bfs until conflict appears and you probably either walk your way out without trying to change yourself, or you shut up and stand the abuse until you can no longer hold and burst. Unhealthy expectations.

"I know that I know nothing", can bet you've never touched a philosophy book to not even recognize one of the most famous quotes in the field. Applies well here, though.

You might not believe it, but I didn't scroll shit. That's just my dating experience with looking to date that weird red flagged girls who had this controlling, fixated personality of yours. Again, you're not as unique as you think you are.

[Opinion Owner]

They are, same way I'm responsible if I treat you poorly as you've been whining all along. I never denied being responsible for my treatment towards femoids (you even noticed I hadn't used incel jargon until now, seriously?), same way I control my behavior to show valoration and respect for people who are humane and humble enough. Women are full of bullshit you might close your eyes as much as you want, but that out in culture are recognized as an objective reality they can take charge for. I'm not gonna make the effort of elaborate a detailed list for a self indulgent female nor I'm gonna break your pampered reality where no one questions your self righteous beliefs, just because I'm one who believes in critical thinking.

[Idonthaveausername]

The question isn't whether you know about personal responsibility, it is whether you take responsibility for yourself or not. As long as you continue to blame me for your poor treatment of me, you are not taking personal responsibility

Maybe you don't know how thay works...

If you do something, it is your fault

If you treat someone negatively, it is your fault

If you insult someone, it is your fault

If you're an incel, it is your fault

Lol I don't need to read that because I don't have a victim mentality. I have freed myself of that by getting on with my life and being a decent human being despite the tribulations I've faced. You really aught to take your own advice and read it yourself

It doesn't matter what words you use because you're saying the same thing... and you're still wrong

I don't take abuse. I can depend on my boyfriend because he is respectful, cares deeply about me, and will do anything to ensure my happiness; as I will to the same for him. When you execute that whilst adhering to traditional gender roles, that is called a relationship... I know that's hard to understand because you've never had one before, but there's nothing abusive about it

If you think I'm controlling, no wonder you're single. I'm dying with laughter

[Opinion Owner]

What I've been telling you from the beginning is that most of incels (included me), do, but you're too stupid to see that. You don't give a shit about the effort we do or that we have to invest 10x times the time, energy and resources to get similar results or uncommited chances others get from not moving a finger, while you expect others ironically to value your own effort. That's a particularly infuriating aspect of women.

Maybe it's you the one that has been telling me how you know everything without a single self-critical question here, you feel like a god who "illuminates others" while being free of flaw, the ultimate female canon of success and attractiveness, wondering why haven't you turned a Marie Curie or get viral in social media by now.

Nope, wrong there again in all of those. You don't live in a solipsistic bubble. Your actions are in constant interaction with those of others.

None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they're free. Just let that one sink before you google who coined that phrase.

No argument shown here, no effort back either.

The whole thing of abuse is that you can't control when it happens to you, because the person doing it is more powerful psychologically than you. You might feel in control yet your low level of self awareness disables you to apply a correct theory of mind to identify abuse signals and you might spend some time before connecting the dots, realizing you weren't as much in control as you thought. Seen that plenty of times, from the most pathetic single moms to mentally rigid, insecure neurotics looking for safety and love while swearing to themselves they're autonomous until they're forced to either run away or change, and, of course, they'd rather do the first as the easy way out, because you don't give a rat's ass for anyone but yourself.

Of course you won't want to admit that to a random anon, and I don't care you do either. Point is, if you'll ever be able to ask that to yourself.

[Opinion Owner]

The worst part of people like you is that you're too selfish to bother validating others thoughts without making it all about your own. For much I try to put effort, you don't put yourself in a position where you question yourself yet you expect others to do, you don't open your mind to a concept of responsibility and control other than your own (for example, collective or social responsibilties) but you expect others to do, and that's a overall very shitty attitude to have, I don't know if it's either your viking rape genes, unsolved authority issues, or something else you don't realize you have. It's like you don't even have touched a epistemology book, and I can bet you don't either do all those "responsibility" things you preach in vague terms like doing exercise, practicing empathy, agreeableness, flexibility or anything alike. You just believe there's a "natural" way you have of seeing things you don't question and that's it, if a cripple gets thrown at a pool and can't swim his way out, I can see you laughing at him for not being able to and having no one to blame but himself.

End of the day, gotta take you're some random femoid living on the other side of the world, in a shitty individualistic US culture I'd never find in here either (luckily for me), can't respect a bitch who can't properly answer my points but keeps talking with herself no matter how honest I get at you.

[Idonthaveausername]

As long as you continue to blame me for your abusive name-calling towards me, then you are not taking responsibility for your actions--that would be the opposite. I haven't insulted you or called you names. You merely took offense to me calling out the BS of Incells because women like me (who aren't Feminists) threaten your self-pitying lifestyle

You are simply wrong. I don't expect anybody to value me, but I reward those who do. And I do not stay in abusive relationships, and my current boyfriend is not abusive at all. I clearly set boundaries for him and he respects them. Neither one of us likes to see the other upset, so there is no psychological abuse, nor would there be a benefit of psychological abuse in our relationship. If you can't fathom that I have a healthy relationship with a decent, caring, respectful man, then your jealousy has gotten way out of hand. My boyfriend is my dream partner, and we are both in the best relationship we've ever dreamt of, and extremely happy with each other

You should read some Nabokov before trying to misuse his word "solipsistic"

I don't consider myself to be a flawless human being and I don't like social media

Your thoughts are not worthy of validation. You insult others, therefore you remove and worth your opinion would have. If you want people to value you, then you have to be somebody worth valuing. But you sit on G@G all day dishing out words of hate and griping about how no women is going to love you, and you shit all over other people's relationships just because you've never had one. You will never get a decent woman with an attitude like that. As long as you continue to act this way and think those negative thoughts about others, you will never be worth anything to women or society

[Opinion Owner]

You insult us by condescending us. If you can't understand that, I give up changing your mind.

Of course you feel like you don't have to expect it, you're a female and you'll always get it no matter how you are nor what you take charge for.

I read him and I also know its modern usage, same way words adapt to a changing cultural context, sweetie.

If you really believed a single shit of this, you'd not be acting up your ass.

This is just another shitty strawman of yours. Again, not gonna waste effort on this.

[Opinion Owner]

Ultimately, if you want to stop being insulted by incels, learn a bit about causal attributio theory before assuming incels don't get gfs because of personality, considering how abusive retards can get away with worse with no deluded imbecile like you talking bs on them.

[Idonthaveausername]

Maybe you need a dictionary. You are the one being condescending by calling me patronizing names like Sweetie. I'm calling out your BS

If your whole intention was to try and change my mind, then you've been wasting your time. You're never going to convince me of anything by being a jerk. And since I have my dream relationship with my dream guy right now, you're not going to be able to convince me that my desires in a relationship are wrong, and you're not going to convince me that your life is desirable. My life is simply better than yours because I've worked hard to achieve it

I don't need to act because I have conviction in the things I say and believe

ROFLMAO! Incels DON'T get girlfriends. That's the whole point of being an Incel. You're "involuntarily" celibate because women think you're too pathetic to date, much less sleep with

[Opinion Owner]

You made this post, you replied with your holier-than-thou shitty attitude, you provoke me telling me about your relationship, you got what you deserved from me and that's it.

With that attitude, I can see how non-hypocritical you are of expecting others to take you seriously in your message. I'm not the one with the mind-changing savior complex here, and I don't know wtf made you assume my life was desirable, you're like pampered gringoes idealizing poverty to masturbate themselves about self-made narratives.

Confusing insecurity with conviction is another mistake of yours. I don't care you take me seriously or not by this point, but it's funny you still feel compelled to reply with some random nonsense that avoids the philosophical substance and reinforces a personalized attack, no matter my change of attitude towards you.

That's your own lack of knowledge about who falls in the incel category nowadays, feels almost like you just bought what some liberal magazine reported for a definition. I pity your incapacity to think twice what you choose to think about things overall, specially as you haven't bothered even to know my personal experiencies (which, unlike you, I don't have the self-centered need to come tell those without being asked for first, let alone you're not particularly worthy of trust by this point).

[Idonthaveausername]

I provoked you by telling you about my relationship? Lol that's the most pathetic thing you've said yet

Philosophically, you're doing this all wrong. You need to be selfless and self-sacrificing if you want a relationship

My boyfriend and I are willing to sacrifice a lot to be together. It costs a lot of money for us to fly across the country to see each other. If none of this worked out (which we know it will because we both listen to the other's needs and are willing to put in the effort needed to sustain our relationship long-term) we would be wasting a lot of money, time spent getting to know each other, and emotional bonding that we couldn't get back or give to someone else. But we both know it is worth it for the other. My boyfriend is taking an even bigger risk to move out here next month so we can be closer together. If you're not willing to move across the country for love, then you don't deserve it. You only deserve what you put out there, and right now you're only putting out hate and degrading women

I don't know why you're thinking that I think your life is desirable? I view your life as pathetic and worthless. I honestly don't think you'll ever see the message I'm trying to get across to you because you're too self-centered to think you could be wrong and too selfish to treat a woman properly. You're too scared if women to risk dating, so you're going to be alone forever. Since I would much much rather be dating my boyfriend who has off-the-charts long-term potential and isn't afraid of marriage or expecting divorce, there is no part of your life that i would desire more than my own

[Opinion Owner]

You tried doing it and failed, which is worse. 'Look at how happy I am', no need for you to lie again by this point, this is the internet.

Said the woman who knows nothing about selflessness.

We're all grown ups to know there's a big gap between what you claim things to be and what they actually are. From small details to eventually big ones. Come on, like you're not adult enough to know how many idealistic retards do dumb cucked shit to end up impoverished and abused because of an illusion. I'd rather realistically negotiate with the woman that'd actually date me the way we'd have worked shit through, since again, you seem to think of yourself as the universal example instead of letting others be themselves instead of being an abusive whore who puts herself above other people's goals.

Your message is full of shit, yet you know you keep replying because it hurts you deep in your anus the truths I say in spite of that. Man, I only hope you last until your 30s at least, typical foid psyche to not even know how to handle their butthurt once reality checks in.

[ForteExe]

Can the both of you please just let this thread die already? You've been at it for months.

[Opinion Owner]

@ForteExe And the cuck is back on the game, boyos.

Just let the copes go, why so authoritarian? I thought you fucking muricans were too individualistic to give a shit for others, jeez.

[Opinion Owner]

If you're so bothered for the alerts, you have no one to blame but yourself for posting in, lol

[ForteExe]

@incelMcGee The alerts don't bother me, but seeing this continue for so long is kind of pathetic. You're both justifying the other's position by giving one another the time of day. You have no chance of changing the other's point of view or convincing each other of anything. You're just bickering at this point. If you were being any sort of productive I'd engage in your discussion, but I have no patience for mindless drivel.

[Opinion Owner]

@ForteExe I forgot the cuck's moral authority is law. Funnily enough, she's the one claiming that she's happily in her self made paradise yet constantly comes back at getting her dosage of shittery, she has no one to blame but herself for it given I'm inherent trash according to her.

[Idonthaveausername]

Well you are inherent trash because you're insulting me (and this other guy). I am happy with my self-made paradise that I've worked extremely hard to build

[Opinion Owner]

The lady feels insulted by some random user of the Internet, how cruel this world can be.

"worked extremely hard"... just go preach that to the majority of the world's population who didn't get the privileges you did, sweetheart.

Anyways, in case you're still bored enough to challenge your illusions, there's this compilation of research to help you realize your own nature beyond what you make of yourself

https://justpaste.it/2msmg

[Idonthaveausername]

Lol are you still complaining about your life?

You can't insult me because you're too pathetic

I have no privileges in life. I have worked extremely hard for everything I have

How about I confirm my "illusions" with all the lovely pictures I took while on vacation with my perfect boyfriend

[Opinion Owner]

You're the one complaining about feeling insulted, then you conveniently switch from victim mode to fake toughness to hide your insecurity. I've known 13-yr-old relatives smart enough to spot this immature bullshittery you're putting up here, what a shame for a first world cunt.

Says the pampered baboon who knows nothing about the lives of people in the rest of the real world since she's too concerned about only her own. You must be a totally useless piece of shit to think sitting up your ass and being a bitch while making others move around can be called hard work.

You're like the empty nouveau-riche who needs a symbol to claim you're no longer worthy of being bullied and worthless as you used to. Again, gotta pity this irrational need to convince others what you believe you are, let alone random people on the internet.

[Idonthaveausername]

ROFLMAO! Hey look everybody--it's another pathetic Incel who would rather insult and complain about women rather than admit he is a misogynist who can't get a date because his personality is such trash

Oh yeah, I guess I'm complaining that my perfect boyfriend is moving across the country just to be with me. He is so attractive and attentive to my needs and wants that I would much rather have an Incel who would treat me like crap and complain about being ugly *eyroll*

My life is great right now. The more you hate on me, the more you will be consumed by the green jealousy monster

[Opinion Owner]

Funny thing is that lots of men can afford being actual misogynists who give a single flying fuck about making women independent and responsible for their actions, yet they fuck as they please any weak daddy's girl who's too feeble to take charge of herself, if that's not a free pass for emotional or sexual abuse and dependency, get the fuck off. Just keep talking about personality, honey.

It's funny it's him and not you the one who moves. It's always about your needs and not others, sooner or later he'll realize it. I pity him for his naivety, but that's life for us.

It's so great you spend months arguing against who you judge as a miserable human being. Seriously, if I were a successful billionaire, I highly doubt I'd spend this long going into the homeless to feel better about myself to build a half assed sense of happiness that ultimately tricks no one but yourself. I'm sorry for being honest but I bet you have no one who'd care enough for you to tell it, so it's gonna be some anon again.

[Anonymous]

Not necessarily. While incels usually are whiny little fuckers, it's not always purely their fault. I personally never even had a kiss in my life, and I tried literally E V E R Y T H I N G. In the end I just had to accept the fact that I will never be with any woman in my life.

[Anonymous]

Have you ever considered the fact that the vast majority of them suffer with severe body dysmorphia and severe depression, but then again mental illness is a 1000x worse for men than it ever will be for women

[Idonthaveausername]

Yeah. That's extremely unattractive

[Opinion Owner]

Little wonder so many men kill themselves

[Idonthaveausername]

Men kill themselves because they're weak-minded. Women kill themselves because they're weak-minded. People in general kill themselves because they're weak-minded. It is nobody's fault but their own

[Opinion Owner]

Wow fuck you, you clearly have no idea how difficult it is to have depression

[Idonthaveausername]

I was diagnosed with depression and PTSD as a child. I've grown up with depression and still experience symptoms. You should go say that to my psychiatrist if you honestly believe that trash spewing out of your mouth

[Opinion Owner]

What trash? I've had depression and anxiety my entire fucking life, and because of that it made me feel like a fucking failure as a man. I don't consider myself an incel, but I can understand how they came to have such a negative mindset.

[Idonthaveausername]

"Wow fuck you, you clearly have no idea how difficult it is to have depression"

That trash. Clearly I have experienced depression, so I do understand how difficult it is

You are worthless as a man because of the way you treat and insult women

My boyfriend is bipolar, so he also understands depression. I do not think he is worthless for it because he still treats me right and respects me

[Opinion Owner]

How the hell was I supposed to know that beforehand, I'm not a fucking mind-reader? I was pissed off because of what you said about suicidal people.

[Idonthaveausername]

You won't know that until someone tells you because you didn't ask. That's why you need to ask these things before insulting people

I have strong opinions on things. You are going to meet people with strong opinions on things. You have to get over it and treat people decently. Never assume someone doesn't understand what you're talking about

[Anonymous]

A guy can do everything correct and every girl he asks out still rejects him for being short or bald.
Tell me, what can a guy do to change his height? And how is it his fault if he is constantly getting rejected by every girl he likes for thing he has ZERO control over.

[Idonthaveausername]

Stop complaining about it

[Jean-Marie_Céline]

Hmmm, it depends.
I'm short and balding, yet managed to attract a much taller and beautiful girl and had to turn down another.
More than the things you can't change, I put effort in those I can improve and my strong points.

[englisc]

This is just another example of the way incels are their own worst enemy. I too am just a short guy, yet I've done fine. It's a bit of a disadvantage to be short, but plenty of short guys do fine - if you can't get a girlfriend it's most likely something else about you that puts them off, but you'd rather blame your lack of height and leave it at that.

[Jean-Marie_Céline]

@englisc Exactly. I have a lot of insecurities and you know them, yet the moment I started to be more confident (largely thanks to your advices) I started to drawn more and more people, not only girls.

[coachTanthony]

I am 5'6 and bald and I do just fine. My personality is larger then life. I don't need to be tall or have hair to be successful and neither should you!

[Opinion Owner]

Not complaining won't change anything. When you're being judged for something you have ZERO control over, there's nothing you can do.

[englisc]

Pussy.

[Jean-Marie_Céline]

@Opinion Owner, but there are a lot of things you can improve.
And sitting behind a monitor just complaining and complaining won't help.

[englisc]

@Jean-Marie_Céline You'll never get through to these types, you can't help people who only want to make excuses for failure because it's the easy option vs actually doing things to improve.

[Opinion Owner]

I feel like I did everything I could. I didn't start of being bitter and I had a lot of female friends who enjoyed my company. But none of the ones I was interested in wanted anything more than a friendship.
And I've seen guys with all kinds of personalities, even guys who are genuine jerks get girls easily.

[Opinion Owner]

@coachTanthony Do you do fine with women between the ages of 18-21? Because I have no worries about being able to attract women 30 or older, since they tend to lower their standards by then in terms of looks. I'm just not interested in them.

[Jean-Marie_Céline]

@Opinion Owner It's a matter of attitude. Victor mentality instead of victim mentality.
I don't have the explicit goal of attracting people, I just have my goals and projects to pursue, and I put passion in them - work, cultural and sport initiatives, friendships.
When you do that, and people see that you know what you want and you can be a positive presence in their life, they'll crowd you - girls, guys, older men and women alike.

[coachTanthony]

I did when I was your age and yes I was still short and bald back then too! If you are going to be a man worth having you got to get out there and take your knocks. It's the only way to get better. I have been rejected probably over 1000 times in my lifetime but it sure has made me who I am today. I didn't stop because it stings... I kept going because I knew what I wanted and nothing was going to stop me.

[Giggletr0n]

Found another incel. 3 for 3 now

[englisc]

Opinion Owner - what did you do?

[Benedek38]

Opiniom owner, I am appalled by the reaction of people here.

It's true that you can improve yourself, and that it DOES make a difference. But the hate you get is unjustified. Don't listen to them. Bece the best version of yourself, haters be damned.

[Benedek38]

@Giggletr0n I love how you are calling people incels and shaming them for it. Sounds like projection, you dirty incel

[englisc]

@Benedek38 The reason people like this get such reactions is because it's a lot of weak excuse-making. It's an argument AGAINST being the best version of yourself, and an argument for not even bothering to try to be.

[Opinion Owner]

@englisc What if you did everything to become the best version of yourself but the girls you liked still thought you weren't good enough for reasons out of your control?

[englisc]

I asked before, what did you do? Just because you think you did the right things doesn't mean that you did. If other short guys like us can find attractive women, that should tell you that you're wrong.

[Anonymous]

Thanks reminds me that pretty much all incels are male.

[Theroarer]

No incels are completely justified in their hate it's not societies place to create fraudulent gender equality for its glory and then burn the

[Theroarer]

entire generation of people who are caught in the web, I refuse to put the blame on incels, it's the gender equality proponents who run society as a social experiment with fraudulent equality that are entirely to blame. Worse than Nazis the lot of them.

[MarketData]

Not sure if trolling or genuine response from crazy person?

[Stephen3355]

Well it is mostly women's fault. They choose bad boys over the good decent men and this leads to a society of single mothers, fatherless children, and broken families. So yer, it is mostly women's fault.

[Idonthaveausername]

If you nen as a whole stepped up and started being decent, there would be no bad boys to complain about

[monkeynutts]

I will rise to the occasion.

[esotericstory]

Its kind of how feminists blame the patriarchy.

[Idonthaveausername]

Well no, that's not a fair analogy. There used to be a patriarchy, and many countries like Saudi Arabia are still patriarchies. Women aren't doing anything to Incels, so there's nothing tangible to compare it to. Women blame the patriarchy for giving them no rights because women didn't even have the right to vote, work, or own property until roughly 100 years ago

[cavmanier]

Feminists are still blaming the patriarchy currently. Go take a feminist college class.

[Idonthaveausername]

@cavmanier
That's because it is a political movement and a political movement needs a target
ROFLMAO! Why would I do something like that? I have a well-paying job and can fully support myself. I don't need to waste any money on college. I chose not to go because I don't like Millennials or the political agendas colleges push these days, so I have absolutely zero desire to do so now

[esotericstory]

Patriarchy was a necessity, if all your women were abducted and raped the citizens of that tribe could not reproduce anymore.

[cavmanier]

I agree. It's political and a lobby group.

[esotericstory]

And besides, in the feudal system both male and female serfs were subjected to the same lack of rights by both male and female ruling class.

[Giggletr0n]

Found yet another incel. 4 for 4

[esotericstory]

@Giggletr0n Where lmao?

[cavmanier]

In pretty much every government it's not like males were doing great. They didn't get to own land or vote either. They struggled similarly to women. Women just love to cherry pick the brief period of history where men really did have obviously significantly better rights in 10% of the world during those 150 years.

[Anonymous]

To effin' right! We have one here, somewhere!!!

[ChocolateMarie2001]

Yes but that means more ladies for me.

[Organic_Pineapples]

I'm a young handsome looking guy and I'm also a proud incel.

[chris_987]

Show me a women who doesn’t blame men for her problem and you’ll have your answer

[Idonthaveausername]

I don't blame men for my problems. On the contrary, my boyfriend has fixed many problems in my life

[cykasenpai]

There are many women who blame men for the patriarchy and claim men have oppressed them and is the reason why they can't (insert list here). There are far more such women than there are incels.

[chris_987]

Lol but you see what she did there, she ask a question about a fringe group of guys who hated women, then related the question to her own person life there by making my conclusions obsolete. See that’s why I don’t have much hope for girls understanding guys.

[Giggletr0n]

Found the incel. This is more fun then playing found the vegan

[Idonthaveausername]

@cykasenpai
That's because men created a patriarchy that stood for thousands of years. Places like Saudi Arabia still operate under a patriarchy. If you don't want women to blame men for creating a patriarchy, then you shouldn't have created one in the first place. There are more women who condemn patriarchies than Incels because there are very few Incels compared to the entire population of men, there are more women than men in the world, and all women were affected or are still affected by the patriarchal system men created

[ciitruskiwi]

@giggletr0n your comment just made my day 😂

[Idonthaveausername]

@Giggletr0n
Lol I think I could handle vegans more. I had a lady cook me some vegan food on a yoga retreat one time that was delicious. She didn't judge me for eating meat either, so she is much more of a pleasant person to be around

[chris_987]

So if there are more women than men in the world what stopping them from taking over everything? And ruling the world.

[Benedek38]

Aaaand she'a a briandead feminisr, with a white knight orbiter no less.

[Idonthaveausername]

@Benedek38
Lol I'm not a feminist. I voted for Trump. Your incorrect assumption is the reason why women don't like you. Don't accuse women of being something we're not

[chris_987]

Lol a women that voted for trump? You do realize that’s worst than incel

[Idonthaveausername]

Nah. Trump has revived our economy and brought unemployment to the lowest its been in my lifetime. I've paid more than $5 a gallon less for gas than I did during parts of Obama's administration. I don't see anything wrong with that

[chris_987]

Still does mean that girls hate that you like trump, and they will treat you as such, just like how people treat me

[Idonthaveausername]

Girls hate me because they're jealous of me. Voting for Trump has nothing to do with it

[Benedek38]

Voting for Trump ia not an automatic red pill. Plenty of so called "traditional women" out there who act like they are traditional at face value, but are actually career oriented ice queens, practically the ÜberFrau™ imagined by radical feminists.

You're worse than a feminists - you're a feminist in denial.

[cykasenpai]

"That's because men created a patriarchy that stood for thousands of years. Places like Saudi Arabia still operate under a patriarchy. If you don't want women to blame men for creating a patriarchy, then you shouldn't have created one in the first place. There are more women who condemn patriarchies than Incels because there are very few Incels compared to the entire population of men, there are more women than men in the world, and all women were affected or are still affected by the patriarchal system men created "

This is blabla language for "I blame men for everything!" which is the exact same thing incels do. The victimhood narrative is the same, we just don't persecute women for acting victims and crying. However, we do for men, incels and low-status men in general.

[Idonthaveausername]

@cykasenpai
Not in the slightest. I showed you a women who doesn't blame men for everything and you lashed out at women. I explained their reasoning because you're clearly deluded in understanding how society works

[cykasenpai]

What are you talking about? Where is that woman? All I'm seeing is a woman who's blaming the patriarchy for all dat woman-oppression and then ironically claiming that incels are terrible for blaming the society for their troubles.

[Idonthaveausername]

@cykasenpai

Men were responsible for oppressing women when they had a patriarchy, and they still are in places like Saudi Arabia. That's a fact. That is history

Yes incels are wining about their pathetic lives and they need to stop

[cykasenpai]

It's only through the eyes of your ideology that women are oppressed. Every time you look at the details, you'll find they reveal a more complex picture.

I'll give you two facts to chew on. One, men die overwhelmingly more in combat zones, including saudi arabia. The worst of the worst befalls men, not women. Two, if you ask Saudi women, they'll respond with a perceived happiness number that's higher than that of men.

[Idonthaveausername]

@cykasenpai
Men die in war zones because men cause war. Women do not cause war. We fight sociologically without the need for physical aggression. It is the fault of the Male anatomy caller testosterone that is the reason for men dying in war zones

You're seriously going to deny female oppression and then defend it by using the country that has the most? Why don't you just go there if you're so misogynistic?

[cykasenpai]

"You're seriously going to deny female oppression and then defend it by using the country that has the most? Why don't you just go there if you're so misogynistic?"

Resist your emotional outburst. Please, respond to the fact that perceived happiness in Saudi Arabia amongst women is higher than that of men. Why is this the case?

[Idonthaveausername]

@cykasenpai
There's nothing emotional here. Accusing me of being emotional is your problem. Stop being misogynistic

I highly doubt the credibility of that. If it was published by someone in Saudi Arabia, then the results were most likely skewed. Until a year or so ago, Saudi women were not able to drive, and the consensus was that women were not happy about it

If the claim is that women are unhappy but men are unhappier, I would believe that. Men who don't treat women properly will never experience the treatment of a woman who truly loves and respects him. So yes, I could see those men being even unhappier in the overall unhappiness. But that does not mean Saudi women are happier than women in non-oppressive societies

[cykasenpai]

Yeah. I meant what you wrote towards the end. Women in Saudi Arabia are happier than men in Saudi Arabia. It's almost a universal constant, by the way - women generally report being happier than men, except in the West.

I'm pleasantly surprised that you've also seen the statistics on perceived happiness. If I understand correctly, you're saying that the reason men's happiness in Saudi Arabia is lower than women's, is because their alleged oppression of women makes women not give them love. That seems contradictory to me. If women were so badly shaken by the rules of their society that they're unable to love, wouldn't their perceived happiness be lower than men? Why would men be hurt by this more than women? Where's the evidence that women in Saudi can't or won't love men in Saudi? Why, ultimately, if women are oppressed in Saudi, is their perceived happiness higher than men?

I'm not saying the rules of Saudi are perfect in any way. I don't think we should adopt them. But to look at only the formulation of the rules and conclude they are oppressive without neither you nor I having any clue about how ordinary life functions there, while also noting that the women themselves in Saudi aren't too unhappy with the situation, strikes me as a case of holier than thou.

[Idonthaveausername]

@cykasenpai
faithwentz.wordpress.com/.../

This details the oppression women face in Saudi Arabia and describes how unhappy they are about it. Wen in Saudi Arabia are not happy. Men are just more miserable because everyone is

[cykasenpai]

I never said women were happy. I said women were more happy than men, statistically. That's the only think I care about, because you're claiming Saudi is oppressive towards men (I assume by men) which is a silly claim when taking into account the fact that the supposed oppressors are less happy.

Being more content with life than your oppressor doesn't make sense.

[Idonthaveausername]

@cykasenpai

That's because you've never been oppressed, so you wouldn't understand. Those women are forced to live this life, so they have no option but to live with it. But they can make the most of their situation for themselves and deprive their oppressors or what it is they truly want from it: obedience and love. A slave wife may sleep with you and cook for for you because you tell her to, but she will never love you or carress you or flavor your food with care. Those men are unhappy because they legally have everything they want, but it ultimately still deprived them of the emotional satisfaction. They're unhappy because they have the choice to give it up, but they've gone too far to backtrack now

Saudi men have oppressed their women, but in doing so they have also oppressed themselves. The men are less happy than the women because it was their choice to end up that way, and the women don't have to bear the guilt

[cykasenpai]

It's a romantic take on it, with the women being silent victims who're fighting back in their own way, the guys having the short stick in the end. But it's pure conjecture with no facts to back it up.

No matter how you slice it, oppressors being less happy with a situation than the oppressed, goes against the definitions of oppressors and oppressed.

[Idonthaveausername]

@cykasenpai
You may think it's a romantic take, but I see it authentic. I know women and men from the Middle East and my ex was from there. He thought he could get away with treating me like crap and cheating on me because I prefer to be submissive and traditional in relationships. Ultimately he was the one who was unhappy because I left him for it. He never got over me and now I have a new boyfriend who is much more respectful and caring. He appreciates me more, so he will have my love for the rest of his life. If I lived in a society where I would've had to stay with my ex, I would've withdrawn from him and denied him love and affection

The definition of oppression isn't about happiness. Oppression is about control. But when you live in an oppressive society, everyone is oppressed, even the oppressors. It may not make sense to you and I don't know if I'm explaining this right, but it may help to look at political leaders. Hitler oppressed himself to the rest of the world by only giving himself the option for world domination or death. Kim Jong Un's uncle was a political leader there, but he was also oppressed because hs faced death by opposing his superior. When you give yourself ultimate power over another person, you destroy your own ability to have a real relationship with that person, therefore negating any sort of happiness you could derive from that oppression

Oppression isn't happiness; oppression is power. But power doesn't make you happy, it only gives you control

[cykasenpai]

Your point about oppression not necessarily yielding happiness is a good one. I don't disagree with what you're saying about oppressive systems, I've heard North Korean leaders perpetuate theirs mostly because if they don't, they get shanked by someone else who is willing to. But I think your definition of "oppression = power" is where the issue with the Middle East lies.

We've deviated very much from incels by now, but having power over someone (regardless of how much power that is) does not equal an oppressive relationship. Parent-child relationships are the obvious example. Whether you have an oppressive system is really predicated on whether the checks and balances of responsibility and rights are properly set up. So for example, while women don't have the right to a job, they also bear none of the responsibility for providing an income to the family. From our high horses in the West, we see only the lack of a right and claim oppression. However, if your job is to manually extract minerals from a hazardous and toxic mine, working 16 hours a day, then it's unclear who's really 'oppressed'.

One thing you'll notice about Middle Eastern culture is that these systems aren't unilaterally propagated by men. The women are as staunch supporters of those systems as the men are. Either you think those women are brainwashed and stupid or you take a more nuanced approach (imo) and consider that those systems might have some degree of proper balance, given their particular circumstance.

Sorry for the long-windedness by the way.

[Idonthaveausername]

@cykasenpai

No it is absolutely necessary

Women is Saudi Arabia are not happy. Women in Iran are not happy. That's why they are trying to gain more rights for women

Your claim is that these women in oppressed societies are happy, but they're not. Simply claiming they're happier than the men isn't worth anything. Those men have plenty to he unhappy about

And yes those women are brainwashed by their religion and culture

[cykasenpai]

> And yes those women are brainwashed by their religion and culture

Your sexism comes out clearly here. You assume that women have no agency and are sheepishly subjugating themselves to rules and regulations without anything to gain. Your presumption is that these women are unable to have any effect on society and that any opinions they voice in favor of the current system are the result of nothing but their own ignorance and weak will.

I'd like to say I'm surprised, but this is one of the pillars feminism stands on. "Internalized misogyny" is the polite way of telling women they're too retarded to assess their own situation.

[douride2]

In short yes.

[DECENTSCOTTISHLAD999]

l dont like them

[Blueeyes81]

For the most part.

[Rider22]

I blame the feminists.