Why do genuinely kind guys get shoved over to the side and in friend zones when trying to meet a girl?

[SeanshterMonster]

I know those guys (me included) don't like to command anyone, don't like taking control or being controlled, and would never hurt anyone other than themselfs. If they were dom in the bedroom they would be a soft dom, someone who's on top but gental and soft. I would hate myself if I ever mistakenly hurt anyone.

[ElGatoDio]

There's a happy medium to everything. Temperance. You gotta find that. I get what you're saying. I don't think anyone wants to hurt someone (unless they're a bad person). That being said, you can be kind and firm. Women, as much as some of us might not want to admit it, like when guys take charge and act dominant from time-to-time. But like I said, happy medium. Don't do it so much that she feels like you're being controlling. The best advice I can say, and I feel like everyone needs to do this regardless of gender, is communication. Maybe she wants you more dominant in the bedroom? You wouldn't know that without communicating first though. Talk to her. Ask her if you're hurting her. Communicate. She'll tell you. Some women like a soft dom, some don't. Maybe find someone that has the same interests as you?

[SeanshterMonster]

I don't even know how to be a dom. I can be a kind and gentle dom, someone on top who is gentle. But I don't know how to be dom and take charge. I can't take charge of someone else

[ElGatoDio]

Then find someone who likes that sort of thing. There are definitely women out there that are into that

[SeanshterMonster]

I hope to find someone

[slatyb]

You are totally confused about what it takes to attract and keep a partner. You don't have to be a "dom", you just have to be assertive enough to ask someone out, and then attentive enough to know when she wants to be kissed and more. If you are all "Can I hold your hand? Can I hug you? Can I kiss you?" she will wonder if she's dating a man or a pubescent teen. If you are too self-conscious to pick up on the usual signals of human courtship (both positive and negative), you might benefit from a dating coach (a licensed therapist who offers that service, not some internet pickup artist).

[slatyb]

by the way, I was in your shoes at your age. I was attractive and didn't know it, and totally clueless about women showing interest. I was about 18, working as a math tutor at college. There was a very cute flute major who would come see me weekly. If she sat any closer she would have been in my lap. What did I do? Nothing. I imagine her talking to a friend, saying "I've done everything but get in his lap." Friend: "Maybe he's gay?"

[LazerBean]

Being kind is not the same things as being spineless. My husband is the kindest, most thoughtful person I know, but he also can be assertive when he needs to be. Good women love a kind man, but nobody likes a spineless Man.

[SeanshterMonster]

So not wanting to take command, or be dominant or be in control is spinless? Deep down that just feels wrong, like I would be hurting the person I care about. Who am I to control people, who am I to stand over people and be dominant. I'm not more of a person than everyone else

[LazerBean]

Not being able to be assertive and put yourself out there is spineless. If someone breaks into your house and you can't, as the man of the house, take command and control the situation, then yes you are spineless. If your kids are being unruly and they won't listen to you because they know you never do anything, then you are spineless. There are times when taking control and being command is absolutely necessary, and if a woman feels like you cannot provide that for them then they're going to see you as weak and unable to protect them.

[SeanshterMonster]

I'm sorry but if someone breaks in I'm getting everyone to hiding. Cause who knows if they have a gun, I ain't gonna fight them bare handed. I'm not some Bruce Lee. The kid thing, of course they would be in trouble but it's not like I'm gonna hit them. That's just inhumane and just builds a horrible relationship for them to hate me. I'm 5'6" and skinny, I can't do much for protection.

It's unfortunate that the only people loved unconditionally is women, children, and pets. Men are only loved under the conditions that they provide every little thing.

[LazerBean]

Why would you assume you're supposed to fight them barehanded? Another indicator of a weak mind. Also the assumption that women are loved unconditionally is ludicrous considering you and many other people are on this site complaining about them. That doesn't really reek of "loving".

[Nobleone]

If someone breaks into your house then chances are you're going to have to get into a physical altercation with them or hide in a closet and hope they don't find you before they run away with all your stuff.

[LazerBean]

So you're just going to hide an hope for the best instead of, say, owning a gun and having some capability of protecting your family? No balls, no brains, and that why nobody wants you.

[Nobleone]

Where the fuck did I say that that's what I'm specifically going to do? Read this

"Why would you assume you're supposed to fight them barehanded? " That's what you said to OP right? Obviously if someone breaks into your house then why would you not assume its going to get physical?

[SeanshterMonster]

It's either I risk death or I hide. I'm sorry, I'm hiding. I'm not prepared to take someone's life.

[LazerBean]

Not prepared to take someone's life, but prepared to give up your own and those of your family. Which further solidifies my point.

[slatyb]

"It's unfortunate that the only people loved unconditionally is women, children, and pets. Men are only loved under the conditions that they provide every little thing."

And there's the problem in a nutshell. Instead of trying to change your behavior to be more successful, you just whine like a child "It's not fair!"

[slatyb]

Kindness is a basic requirement. All my friends are kind. What else do you have to offer? Do you have a life? Friends? Female friends? What do you like to do? If you meet a woman can you have a conversation without hitting on her immediately?

[SeanshterMonster]

Of course I have a life, hobbies, friends. You'd be surprised how many assholes are out there. I'd say Maybe 20% of everyone I meet are actually kind

[slatyb]

The number of assholes you meet depends on the company you keep. I rarely encounter any except while driving.

[Sevenpointfive]

because kindness and money are usually all they have to offer

[SeanshterMonster]

I don't even got money to offer. I'm short too

[Sevenpointfive]

well there you go. no money

[Smoke-n-Growls]

Is that fear holding you back?

Because it sounds to me you're too afraid to take chances - and generally, people don't really take to cowards afraid to take risks very much.

[SeanshterMonster]

I wouldn't say it's a fear. I would say it just feels wrong to be dominant or commanding or to hurt someone. I take risks of course, like jumping out of a plane.

Deep down it feels like I would be a horrible person to dominant over someone

[Smoke-n-Growls]

You don't have to be.

But you also can't always control whether or not someone is going to be hurt. You could do everything "right" but someone will register it different and be hurt by it.

In addition, that fear or over-emphasized concern can make you a target for people who want to take advantage of you.

It may not feel like fear to you, but it's the message you're putting out there. And, again, most people don't like cowards who are afraid to take risks.

It's a mindset that leads to a limited life, and not many people really want that.

And, again, a fact of living your life is that you'll end up hurting people. Maybe not intentionally, but you're bound to at one point. Best learn to make peace with that early.