Does she want me to leave her alone or should I invite her on a real date?

[Anonymous]

We went out one night, as friends, and ended up in her bed but mostly as friends, just talking and some flirting. Whole night was her idea. We've been closer ever since but not when it comes to actually doing something together

Since then I've invited her to things four different times and she either says no or eventually cancels. Before the last invite, she invited me to her house to smoke one afternoon but I couldn't, she was ok with it and less than a week later she invited me again and we spent some time together. But then I invited her to do something on Halloween and she gave another reason why she can't

She always says that she "wants to" but there's a reason she can't, or "I will" when I tell her to let me know when she wants to do that thing we talked about. She even complained one time that she'd love to go to this place with me but money is very tight. I don't know if she wants me to invite her on a date or just leave her alone, especially since she seems more distant every time I ask her, but then she suddenly invites me to her house so I have no idea. For now I'm just gonna wait it out until she wants to do something with me again

[Anonymous]

' I've invited her to things four different times and she either says no or eventually cancels. '

Any man that knows his true worth would not invite her out a second time. And any woman that saw a mans worth would not cancel or say no four times. The two are related...

[Asker]

Sure but then why does she ask me to do something two times after my third invite? In the past if someone has said no more than once I leave them be, not even talk to them again usually, but she still wants to talk to me and do things when I leave her alone for awhile. It's so odd I can't wrap my head around it well

[Opinion Owner]

We don't need to know why, or wrap our head around anything, only enforce our own boundaries.

[CanadianLearner]

She has low interest in you as a romantic partner.

You should have escalated things more the first time you ended up on the bed.

You are being indecisive, and not taking the lead.

Asking four times and getting shot down is way too many as well.

As for why she asks you out afterwards, maybe her interest went up temporarily enough to want to see you again, or, she wanted to hang out as a friend-only and likes spending time with you in that way.

[Asker]

If we weren't drunk I'd have escalated, but that wouldn't have been ok. I am being indecisive, for sure, but partly because I don't understand why she keeps talking about things we can do together and when I ask her she doesn't want to. Yeah, 4 times is a lot! And three of them were just her ideas that I said "hey let's do this thing you talked about" When I told her I couldn't go to what she asked me to, literally the next time I saw her she asked again. If I'd do that I bet she'd ignore me for a long while. But what do I know really..

We both had breakups recently, if that matters

[CanadianLearner]

"And three of them were just her ideas"

So you let her lead, in a way.

"I don't understand why she keeps talking about things we can do together and when I ask her she doesn't want to."

Surprise her with something different than her suggestions

[Asker]

In many ways really. The time we went out she invited me out. She talked about a lot of things we could do together, then I just recommend we do them the subsequent weeks and nothing. With her two invites to her house in the middle somewhere, one which I had to decline. So yeah she's been leading mostly, and I think I'll just let her do that before I get too invested and hurt by her saying no or becoming distant

I did surprise her with a plan for Halloween last week but she said no. She "wanted to" but no. She's been talking a lot about Halloween since then so I'll see if she wants to do something, but only if she herself tells me otherwise I'm out, this is too difficult for me

[CanadianLearner]

"So yeah she's been leading mostly, and I think I'll just let her do that "

Bad idea.

Don't offer another date now, she has to come back to YOU now.

But for future times, you should be leading.

Set definitive dates... time/place/day.

"I did surprise her with a plan for Halloween last week but she said no."

She might have other plans for Halloween.

Generally not good to make plans for events like that, until you've been dating for a while.

[Asker]

Good to know. She has no plans, just said it's a long work day (it is a Monday, bleh)

Ok so I do have to let HER come back, good. But why not let her lead if I leave the ball in her hands that way? Seems to be the way she prefers, the only way she prefers really

[CanadianLearner]

"Ok so I do have to let HER come back, good"

Yes.

"But why not let her lead if I leave the ball in her hands that way?"

No.

" Seems to be the way she prefers, the only way she prefers really"

Rationalization.

[CanadianLearner]

Apply the principles in the YouTube video "Rejected Twice? Walk Away" by Coach Corey Wayne.

She must come back to you, it has to be her idea, BUT, you are *not* going to go to her place or out anywhere else.

She comes to you, or at the very least, somewhere very convenient/nearby to you.

[Asker]

You're saying if tomorrow she invites me to her house I should say no?

[CanadianLearner]

"You're saying if tomorrow she invites me to her house I should say no?"

That's exactly what I'm saying.

She needs to put in the effort, to earn YOUR time and investment.

You counter with something like:

"I've had a busy day, not really feeling like going out anywhere, why don't you come over to my place instead?"

[CanadianLearner]

Best case scenario if you go to her house:

Maybe you get intimate, but, it's on her terms. You're the one making the effort to go there. She has you wrapped around her finger, you'll come whenever she asks. And she'll discard you when someone else comes along. You become more invested.

Worst case scenario:

You agree to go there, get all excited, get all dressed up and ready to go, then 10 mins before you're supposed to arrive, she takes the offer off of the table.

[Asker]

Wow ok, interesting. I'm gonna think about that one. I always let people lead cause I'm clueless at this shit. Not like any of my relationship have been very long either. I guess I just don't understand how to communicate with people that way. If they say they wanna do something and I actually want to, I do, and I just expect the same back from others. This girl has been an outlier in my experience

If she invites me it'd be after our music class though, like right after it, when we usually do something together

[CanadianLearner]

"I always let people lead cause I'm clueless at this shit. "

This is not masculine. Women are most attracted to masculine men.

"If they say they wanna do something and I actually want to, I do, and I just expect the same back from others."

I used to think that way, life isn't this simple though.

"This girl has been an outlier in my experience"

Re-visit that idea, after you've learned more, reflect on the past experiences later.

Dive into Coach Corey Wayne.

Other coaches to check out (in no particular order):

David D'Angelo, Marni, Apollonio, Dan Bacon (Modern Man), Christian Hudson

Each can teach you about different relevant aspects to dating & relationships.

"If she invites me it'd be after our music class though, like right after it, when we usually do something together"

In that case, you would need to modify the reasoning for the invite to your place.

Try something like this instead:

"No, I feel like going home right now. Why don't you come to my place for a change?"

I'm less certain on that the phrasing of that one, but that should give you the gist of the idea.

[Asker]

I actually love the phrasing of that last phrase, definitely something I can pull off naturally

I mean my past experiences have been great, just not what I was looking for in a person. I've never actually "gone for" someone I actually like, just let it happen, perhaps that's how I feel with this girl?

[CanadianLearner]

"I've never actually "gone for" someone I actually like, just let it happen"

That only really works if the woman starts with an usual high interest level in you, likely because you are doing other masculine things, like living your purpose in life (i. e., dedicated to things you love, your career, etc.)

However, as you said before, "not like any of my relationship have been very long either", which can be a consequence of being able to initially attract a woman who throws themselves at you, but, not understanding yourself/men/women/relationships well enough to maintain it.

"... perhaps that's how I feel with this girl?"

Could work.

It's not very likely at all though, given what you have described so far about her and your interactions.

It kind of sounds like you're looking for reasons to take short cuts, take the easy way, and if you want this woman, I don't think that will cut it here.

[CanadianLearner]

an unusual**

[Asker]

Not looking for shortcuts but definitely not looking to make more effort than I usually do. I mean this girl behaved like most girls I've been with, but her cold and hot approach is new. Whenever a girl has not being interested since a hot start initiated by her, she just says it. At times even remain friends. This, is too weird for me, and I'll just let her decide what she wants. I want her but I'm not going to change much of who I am, who I am is what attracted her from the start after all, you follow me?

I can maintain my relationships, I just have never been IN LOVE with them and I feel that just wastes both of our times. Almost 3 years on relationship with someone I "loved" but was just good to pass the time and not be alone. Not fair to her nor me

Love the tips though, especially "going to my place for a change". We'll see what happens today, I know our schedules coincide and from what she told me yesterday her week is much less busy than last

[CanadianLearner]

"Not looking for shortcuts but definitely not looking to make more effort than I usually do. I mean this girl behaved like most girls I've been with, but her cold and hot approach is new. "

Fair enough.

"I want her but I'm not going to change much of who I am, who I am is what attracted her from the start after all, you follow me?"

I get that.

Sometimes change is necessary for things to go well. One way to look at it is keep the best parts of yourself, and compliment it with further growth.

"I can maintain my relationships, I just have never been IN LOVE with them and I feel that just wastes both of our times. Almost 3 years on relationship with someone I "loved" but was just good to pass the time and not be alone. Not fair to her nor me"

Interesting. You two settled then?

"Love the tips though"

My pleasure.

"We'll see what happens today"

It will be a learning experience.

I think you should stick to your guns and try to raise her attraction, by taking the lead.

Her hot/cold is from low attraction, her sticking around is because either the attraction level is just high enough, or, she wants something else from you and isn't expressing that clearly (i. e., validation, friendship, etc.)

[CanadianLearner]

An important detail about this phrase:

"No, I feel like going home right now. Why don't you come to my place for a change?"

It's more important how you say it, than the actual words.

It's about projecting your standards, what YOU want, and being willing to walk away (+ mean it) from terms that aren't to your liking. Her response shouldn't change your demeanour/attitude. You want her to come, but it's a "take it or leave it" vibe.

Conversely, the same phrase could be said in a needy/approval-seeking way, where the guy is super focused on her reaction/response to it (e. g., the things she says and her body language), and, is negatively effected by her giving an undesired response. This will not work in your favour.

[Asker]

Gotcha! I certainly gotta work on that. Thanks!

[Asker]

I did settle, dunno if they did but I feel I definitely did. I'll try to take the lead but only when SHE wants something, see where it goes from there. Her mom has been staying with her for the past week and also about three weeks ago, coincidentally when she has been cold, and she left yesterday when she was talking to me a lot more. There's just so many factors I can't think about them without exploding my head. It's on her, I'll follow suit if she wants and lead if it feels like she wants something

[CanadianLearner]

"Her mom has been staying with her for the past week and also about three weeks ago, coincidentally when she has been cold, and she left yesterday when she was talking to me a lot more."

Could play a role.

"There's just so many factors I can't think about them without exploding my head."

This is both true and not true at the same time.

Yes, there can be a lot of factors going into why someone goes cold, BUT, when someone is really interested, they push that aside and try to seek your attention. Show their interest. Because they want to spend time with you, and, because they fear losing you if they go cold.

Corey Wayne often brings up a quote (paraphrased):

"When a woman likes you, she makes it very easy for you, the doors just open up and all you have to do is walk through them. If the doors start slamming on your face, you have to turn around and stop trying."

Bottom line her actions.

What she says is less relevant.

[WhitneySnow]

Just be patient and don’t push her

[OlderAndWiser]

Don't wait on this girl. If she wanted you, it would have already happened. Everything she is telling you is excuses.

[Asker]

I feel like it's the best course of action, but it's so confusing. When I don't push her, she wants to do something, when I do she becomes a bit distant

[Asker]

@OlderAndWiser Yeah it sounds like excuses, except for one time, but then why when I stop asking SHE wants to do something? I just don't get her

[OlderAndWiser]

Google "approach-avoidance conflict"

[Asker]

@OlderAndWiser So it's likely more of a me problem than her problem. Thanks for the perspective

[OlderAndWiser]

It’s a matter of how she perceives a relationship with you. She could have unreasonable fears or concerns.

[Asker]

@OlderAndWiser so I should talk to her or leave it?

[OlderAndWiser]

It is probably an emotional response on her part, not the result of a logical analysis, and a carefully worded discussion with you will likely have no impact on her whatsoever.