Lots of minutia to this topic and lots of assumptions being made.
You use the word "confident"? As if a guy would walk up an approach a stranger if he felt she wasn't confident but if he perceives her as confident he suddenly won't.
I'd say that is just a false premise.
Do guys really even just approach complete strangers that much? I wonder if it even happens all that much.
When it does happen I'd say men are more apt to approach, approachable women. What do I mean? Let's say a woman is out and about with 2 or 3 of her friends. That probably will rule out her being approached. Most guys won't try and butt into a pack of several women. He'll most likely approach a woman who is by herself.
Is she hanging out with a guy friend? Most guys will assume that is her boyfriend or husband and once again, she isn't alone, she is already connecting and interacting with someone so most guys won't try and butt in.
Is she carefree and pleasant? If a woman is really focused and not paying attention to anything, she seems in a hurry, on calls, making no eye contact, she doesn't seem approachable. If she is relaxed, makes eye contact with people, smiles, says hi, she seems outgoing and approachable.
There are lots of factors.
Do you get approached a lot?
No I do not.
Well, I don't know your situation, you may be married or in a committed relationship but if you are single are you wanting strangers to approach you in public?
Do any of the criteria I listed in play for you? Are you always with other people or with guy friends? If alone are you really focused on what you are doing seeming in a hurry and making no eye contact with anyone around you, like you are on a mission and you need everyone out of your way?
If you are alone and make eye contact when you are by other people and give them; an outgoing smile or say hi it makes you much more approachable for a stranger who may find attractive.
Out of all the things you listed I think the only one that relates to me is probably that I am always busy doing something.
I smile all the time and if I am approached I am quite sociable. Do I want to be approached by anyone? Honestly not really. You don't know who to trust these days especially when you hear of all the nasty things that happen to women. That said I will say there have been times where I have met guys I find attractive and although the flirting has been mutual said men never take it to the next level. So I was simply curious. Because it seems there exists a real fear of some sort.
One last thing to add: considering what a dangerous world we live in it's definitely better to be considered not so approachable than to be considered too approachable because that's when bad things are known to have happened to women.
I know there are still plenty of good men out there but I grew up with my grandma warning me that if ever a guy laid hands on me inappropriately I was to bite his wrists. That's why my parents sent me to martial arts lessons.
Yeah, you can never be too safe.
@Miristheiss,
I think this is a case of confirmation bias. I see it all over the internet these days. Women need to explain (to themselves) why men aren't approaching them. Instead of accepting the obvious truth that a lot of men have always been meek and shy about approaching women and now there are a lot more men who are simply done with trying to approach women in the age of social media and women's distorted perceptions of their own value.
So women are proclaiming themselves to be "strong women" or a "confident woman" and latching onto that as the reason men are "afraid" to approach them.
They simply refuse to accept that men aren't "afraid" of them. A lot of us just no longer want to approach them. We're tired of all their guessing game / mind reader bullshit and drama. We're a lot more cautious about wasting our time and effort on women who aren't worth it. We haven't given up. We've just become a lot more selective.
For (some) women it's much easier to adopt the narrative that men are afraid of them because they are so "strong and confident" rather than admit good men have lost interest and are thinking a lot more before engaging because a large number of women (not all) have become annoying to be around. And men with options are choosing carefully if they are smart.
Confident or arrogant?
I think a lot of these guys measure the likelihood of rejection and also measure how bad that particular girl would make the rejection sting.
A confident woman can also be kind and empathetic... may take the approach as a compliment. The poor guy at least shot his shot.
An arrogant woman on the other hand... most likely going to get verbally accosted, never going to hear the end of it, and most likely will get socially/publicly put on blast.
The likelihood and how bad rejection is going to be, has a lot to do with how difficult they may find it.
To put it another way... when I was a younger man, and still a pack wolf that hangs out with dudes while we look for chicks, we's play this game where we challenge each other to cold approach this girl or that girl... try to get her number type stuff. I already knew before I even started which ones was going to outright reject me and which ones was going to make it sting. Some people call it intuition, but I call it, "Just observing how she acts and carries herself." So if I already figured out it's going to be a fail, probably going to get ridiculed by her as well, but I have to approach her... I'm not walking into that with high hopes of anything other than self-deprecating humor.
You were blessed to have that intuition when you were younger. I didn’t have it back then.
@blueonblack22 That blessing probably came from early child abuse that forced me to read people to avoid slaps or getting hit with things. But that skill did set me apart from a lot of other guys later in young adulthood.
Yeah I was often clueless. Not always. I had my moments. But I had to be in the right mindset.
They say only 3% of guys naturally “understand” women that way.
@blueonblack22 Yeah I could believe only a certain % can read women like that... think it would be higher. Like a lot of guys seem to be able to read the attractiveness of other men and I know I can't and a bunch of dudes are like me. I can only size a guy up in a fight, but I have no fucking clue as to what makes certain wimpy dudes hot to women. Women seem to have all those skills and those skills become faded when it comes to our gender.
I guess we can only make the best use we can with the gifts the Gods give us. lolz.
Opinion
50Opinion
Apparently what some women consider "confident" is simply obnoxious. For example...
My friend and I go to a bar. I order my beverage and start looking around at the architecture, commending on a nice sconce or mural or whatever. The rando next to me will glance over at it and then chime in as if I had been talking to him. "Oh, you know? I've never noticed that before." 1,2,3, we'll be talking for the next hour or so. If he's got the balls to ask then he'll probably get my number and text me at the end of the night "nice meeting you, chat soon" (which yes actually happens when a real man knows what he wants).
By contrast, my friend looks around with an expression that I can only describe as "she smelled something bad and is looking around for it." She's got a sardonic look on her face and is immediately scoping out things she doesn't like. She's automatically slouching and seems like she's ready to leave even though we just got there. Only a very very odd very aggressive sort of guy will approach her. The nice guys never do. And she wonders why this happens, though MANY MANY people have told her to be a little sweeter/calmer, less abrasive, etc.
I'd honestly argue that the overwhelming majority of women confuse confidence with arrogance or being obnoxious, in fact.
@Steelcore5280 UGH, dude... seriously? :/
@Steelcore5280 No you sound like a dbag.
I'm a little insecure myself, but I'll give my 2 cents. Men tend to avoid "VERY confident women" because it generally entails that they're egotistical, entitled, and have hypermasculine traits and always want to compete with them. We don't want to compete with women. We want a woman that sees our value and isn't afraid to ask for help or want us to do things she admits would be easier for us. A man feels best when they feel useful and "Very confident women" don't tend to provide that satisfaction.
Most men have no problem approaching women at all. That’s just something lousy women tell themselves so they don’t have to admit that they’re just not the catch they think they are. If you’re all that and a bag of chips, he’s going to say or do something to get your attention.
Certainly it’s not an absolute, but it absolutely is true. You are likely subscribed to the myth that men care only about physical beauty. Maybe you should read “He’s Just Not That Into You” by Behrendt & Tuccillo.
Confident but not arrogant women are actually easy to talk to
I'd say that pretty much hits the nail on the head!
Agreed. Sadly, most confuse arrogance for confidence.
Because they confuse confident with bitch. No one really knows what you are getting when approaching so may as well not do it.
There is a huge difference between confidence and arrogance, and women 90% of the time confuse the latter with the former. I've also learned the hard way on how to tell if a woman in arrogant or not.
The overwhelming majority of women are arrogant to a degree that I simply do not care to approach them anymore, and even if I am picking up on any potential signals, I'm still not very likely to approach. Women have turned it all into a game and an ego boost, where they reject and humiliate men in front of their friends and in public settings. Some women (who I am no longer associated with) outright admitted to me they'd compete with their female friends when out together to see who could reject the most guys that night.
Women have created and nurtured an entire cultural phenomenon that makes it far too risky for men to approach women, and with the ris of social media, it's less appealing for men to approach women in person. He could be labeled a creep or a harasser and she can fill and post it on social media for thousands, potentially millions of followers, to see and react to.
Why would men do the traditional cold turkey approach now when they can just send you a message in your DMs and wait, with far less pressure and more anonymity?
All that you say is very true. And I find it terrible that women actually play these games. It's terrible. And I apologise for that even if I am not a woman who does this.
@thegreenyogi I don't think apologies are needed at this point anymore because, now, I've completely given up on the concepts of dating, marriage, and relationships. I'm just not interested anymore in dealing with any of that, and now I've decided to put even more of my focus on other things like my career, friends, etc.
My genetic lineage will die with me, but that's not a problem for me.
Social media. I can't speak for all men of course but here's some insight that is prob true for a good amount of confident men. Also, this is my opinion for the well intentioned man as well. There are plenty of crappy men and women in general so let's level set with this first.
On social media there are way too many videos of women bashing men for approaching a woman in any social outing. They ridicule men, say they rather take a chance alone with a bear, and demonize us.
A smart man would realize of course this isn't all women, but it does make you think. Men are being cautious and defensive more than ever. Hell I've seen wives embarrass husbands online over every childish things.
So when would a confident man feel safe enough to approach a woman is another question to ask. Good men and women are definitely caught in the middle of this ridiculously insane social media bashing era that is preventing physical social reactions. It's why I think it should be called anti-social media. It doesn't really encourage people to be social in a physical space most of the times.
There could be a lot of reasons. I think a lot of men think that women like that are likely to reject them and no one likes to be rejected no matter how confident you are.
I think other men just aren't really attracted to women with high confidence. That's more of a masculine trait so if a woman has a lot of it it can turn some men off. That's the case with me. I'm not afraid to approach a woman who seems highly confident, it just isn't attractive to me.
So why would they flirt if they're not attracted? Flirting is just a game. Both men and women do it. I've done it at times with women I wasn't really attracted to just because I wanted to see if they would take the bait. Men like a challenge but they also don't like rejection anymore than women do.
There have been times I flirted with women I wasn't attracted to at all because I felt sorry for them and wanted to boost their spirits. So you never know why a man is flirting. Women like that attention especially if they find the man attractive. So I assume I'm not the only guy who sometimes just likes to make someone feel good by doing that whether I'm attracted to her or not.
How do you define “confident”. There is a difference between a woman being obnoxious, loud, etc. vs being truly confident. Quiet men and women can be very confident.
It’s also more socially acceptable for a woman reject and publicly humiliate a man vs. a man doing this to a woman. Sure if the guy is being an aggressive dbag he might deserve that. But that’s not always the case. Some women will do this just because they are in a bad mood and/or find the man unattractive. That judgment purely comes down to a woman’s “feelings”. A man can’t get away with that the same way a woman can.
Anyway I am all for men approaching women again. It’s slowly coming back but the last decade really screwed a lot of this up (#metoo did a lot of damage).
But you need to remember that dating is not the same for men as it is for women. You are looking at this as apples to apples and it’s not. Not giving guys an excuse to be insecure.
However I know exactly how it feels to be unfairly publicly humiliated. It’s not fun.
It’s not a matter of being shy or intimidated. “Confident” women can come across as bitchy and masculine. The same way a woman or a girl who finds a guy or man to wear skinny jeans or the way he cuts his hair.
I’ve heard plenty of western women say, males showing masculinity is “toxic”. So that’s the world we live in? Males should be neutered because showing masculinity makes him the bad guy? While masculinity for women is celebrated? To be honest, I’ve seen a certain poll with a certain question posed for guys — would you rather 1) have a sweet, down to earth feminine girlfriend or wife? Or 2) a woman who is career driven and comes across as masculine?
Majority picked (1). There’s nothing wrong with a female being career driven but this whole inequality pay gap BS, patriarchy nonsense is all ideological driven by 3rd wave feminism. Even Pamela Anderson said she considers herself as a feminist but 3rd wave feminism is radical. I know someone may say “omg what a bad example! You’re quoting a woman who sold her body!” Pamela is near 60 years old and she regrets the decisions she’s made and is happier with her life now then back then. Women get paid on onlyfans and can make a lot of women vs guys or men using it. This has nothing to do with being sexist.
From my POV as a guy, a woman can work, she can pursue a Masters. But there’s a balance. Living in the west, I get turned off by women a lot nowadays because she’s either a hardcore left feminist or a radical Trump supporting Republican/Conservative and I don’t conform my life about social and political ideologies.
***Edit: The same way a woman or a girl who finds a guy or man to wear skinny jeans or the way he cuts his hair as feminine***
I think men need the signal it's okay to approach.. I am not confident but I have had multiple guys stare at me but because I have low self esteem I can't smile at them or say Hey first because I am too worried at the time, thinking why is he looking at me or if I say Hey will he think I'm weird or not reply lol So I will look at him and then look away then look back and he is still staring and then look at him and walk away and look back and he is still watching me as I leave. To never see that guy again, that has happened quite a few times to me..
m I have absolutely no idea of what men could find easy or hard or anything in such context. I don't discuss that topic with men at all. And even if I did, I would need tons of witnesses to form an opinion that makes sense.
But there are obvious elements to me, I see confidence as a role played, not a state of things. Amusingly, I also see lack of confidence as a role played. I think we're all playing one or another, sometimes both simultaneously or rapidly alternating. Until something or someone presses the right button to crash the role. After the crash, it reveals a pleasant truth, at least pleasant to me.
🎭
Because not to pretty lady make brain go durr, but we have also been conditioned by manipulative & abusive women, who test everything we do, gives hints instead of communicating, plays with our emotions with no intent of it going anywhere, and it takes very minuscule mistakes to turn make a woman lose all interests. We have to think and process everything before speaking or doing anything, and with our brains working against us, it takes a while to think of what we want to say or do. With timing being important, it's very hard.
*not only do pretty lady make brain go durr
Who says men find it hard to approach confident women? I don't. Those are exactly the sort of women I'll take a chance on. Of course they could be confident idiots with a totally distorted self image. But they just may be the real deal. A healthy well adjusted intelligent woman who knows herself. That's worth investigating.
Why do women who don't get approached much always seem to decide it's because they're too hot, too confident, too intimidating, etc?
Could it actually be that men don't find you attractive or some personality flaw that guys see as a huge red flag? I mean... Occam's Razor. In the absence of evidence, the simplest explanation is usually the best choice, right. Maybe the guy chose the woman he was attracted to each time. It just wasn't you. Over and over again. Or maybe guys are getting tired of the flirting games in their mid 30's and beyond. Think about it.
Why do women erroneously believe this? Seriously, you women ask this like you really believe men are scared off by confident women. They're not. They do avoid loud obnoxious overbearing women, but that is not "confidence" maybe you need to consider the possibility we're not seeing the same things. True confidence isn't loud and overbearing. True confidence is solid, consistent and unyielding. I'm never going to be attracted to a woman that considers herself a "boss b****" and thinks she's going to subdue me. I'll treat you like an equal of course. But your newfound equality does not mean you rule me, anymore than I EVER ruled you.
The me too mmovementis why. Too many horror stories of being called creeps, gavjng our reputation, jobs, careers and lives ruined, even when we did absolutely nothing wrong. Not to mention many women have been screaming to leave them slone online and in person. So guys just keep their distance. Not trying to be bitter or anything at all. Im just telling you the reasons why men do this.
The no 1 answer right here.
A lot of times women mistake confidence for arrogance. Because they speak their mind as they say so they take that as being confident. A lot of women who are “confident” also act like men. Men don’t want to date other men. We want to date women.
Because a lot of confident women aren't into traditional roles. Like, for instance, having children. As a confident woman, I can quite frankly that motherhood repels me. I'll never cause my body pain. If I want to ruin my figure, I'll simply eat more junk food.
Confident women are also intimidating. You never know what they're thinking. Except the blunt ones such as myself
We don’t. I am astounded by the amount of women who think this. By “confident women” you are probably referring to women who have very high income levels and are so full of themselves that they think everyone should bend over backwards to please them. These women exude vibes that men simply don’t find attractive. These women think that men think the same way women do. They think the same qualities that give men value in the dating world are what gives them value too. But it’s actually the opposite of reality. Then when they can’t attract men, they think “oh, they must be intimidated by me.” Utterly fucking laughable. This stems from a lack of knowledge about the male psyche.
I wasn't referring to the entitled kind of women you speak of. Those are simply arrogant women with a huge ego. I'm referring to women who have a confidence that comes from knowing who you are and that navigates life with great strength because she's had to survive alone out of unfortunate circumstance and that possibly has trust issues.
I don't think it has anything to do with being confident. Does the woman in question show interest and asks questions back, or flirts back? Or does she only respond positively? Guys may sense it becomes a one-way conversation and continue with their day. Of course, with this one paragraph, there is a lot of speculation ongoing.
All the best,
Alex
An overly confident, independent woman who is hard to control can intimidate many men.
The term "control" does not mean giving orders or forcing but rather that the man has a certain framework and rules and the woman is expected to naturally comply with them. This signifies that she trusts and respects him and it also reflects her femininity. In short, either she follows the man's rules or it means the man becomes the woman's plaything.
I understand what you mean. It certainly complicates things. What has society done? Everything is so messy.
If a guy finds it difficult to approach a confident woman, that will typically indicate he lacks the level of confidence and/or charisma needed to attract her. He is already insecure and fearful of judgement or rejection.
Women understand life better than man. Status and time are like a clock in the women's body. Do you think your man knows any of that? no. Men are not looking for a partner until much later. Are you pretty? i know. But man come around later, maybe only once pretty start to fade away. Before then, think about yourself and babies. Life is worth living, no matter what. Loveyou H.
most men seem not to have such a problem... they simply consider rejection as a part of the game without taking it personally... so they approach and enjoy whatever comes :D
Confidence and success are two sides of the same coin. Movie stars are confident because they are never rejected. Simps are not confident because they are always rejected.
They may question the possibility that the woman is going to try to emasculate them. That she's so far out of her feminine nature she's more like a guy. Most straight guys won't find that appealing
Because "very confident" is actually code for "Entitled, arrogant, and too good for you" and all men know this.
I like confidence in a person. Just as long as they know what they’re talking about!
I love learning new things about just about anything.
I used to be really shy around women. But that has changed a lot.
The question is assuming the question largely. Just as women might flirt without being serious so too might men. It could just be for practice.
Rejection hurts. I very rarely approach women because I know what will happen... another rejection. Most women are fairly nice about it but a rejection is still a rejection
I find it hard to approach any women. If anything confident women are easier to approach because they're less likely to become hysterical as soon as you clear your throat to say something.
It isn't difficult. Rather, many overly confident women aren't fun to be around, because they try to turn things into a competition and / or won't be vulnerable to a man. I want you to need me - at least a little. And vice versa.
Honestly, I think some guys just get a little intimidated. confidence can be super attractive but also a bit nerve-wracking to approach
Because they always look like they're busy with something, and it would be rude to interrupt.
They don't. Only unconfident people would have a hard time approaching someone. It has nothing to do with the other persons confidence.
It’s not hard. We’re just of being rejected, filmed, posted on tick tok. Called creeps etc. hard to believe grown women do that. But they do! Starting to think all are like that
Because for some reason, women are told it's not ok to be confident, and even aggressive themselves. That it's "not womanly". Honestly, I sometimes wonder why women even like men
Nope. If I am interested and she seems to be single, I don't care who she is.
I've never struggled with it, but I could see some guys having an issue with it.
Hmm, I'm not sure. I love confident women and have no problem making a move. But I believe most guys like submissive women.
Confident women tend to disdain men they think beneath them on any level.
If a guy is confident and shows interest but doesn't take it any further means that he thought something was off and lost interest.
It doesn't matter if they are confident. They are all hard to approach.
I've never walked into a bar and thought, wow, she really looks confident.
Yeah, usually the self-described “confident” woman is the least dateable person who has an overinflated ego and sense of self-worth where she will only go for men well out of her field.
Whole premise is false. If a man is confident and the woman us hot enough he'll approach.
Because women have done everything to discourage this for the last 30 years. This is why Ameeicans date Asians.
Confidence is not the issue, but it's a convenient scapegoat.
It's hard for me to approach any girl I like, because I'm too shy.
Just want to be sure first before making a move. This sometimes takes longer
Bright people often make us think of our flaws.
Fear of rejection, humiliation, etc.
Spot on
They are afraid they will get beat up.
We're looking for a sign
Because confidence is our power as women
I don't know. I don't even wonder about it.
No they approach you instead
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