Equality with men is not always beneficial to women

[LiaRaven]

Inspired by a question I answered this morning on GAGS, the question was

“When do you think women will finally be equal to men?”

Equality is important, but trying to make women the same as men in every way isn’t always helpful. Men and women are different in many ways, physically, emotionally, and socially. True fairness means respecting those differences, not ignoring them.

1. Physical Demands
Men and women have different bodies. In tough jobs like the military or firefighting, expecting women to meet the same physical standards as men can cause injuries or stress. It’s okay to create roles that fit different strengths. Many men also feel a strong instinct to protect women in dangerous situations, not because they see them as weak, but because they care.

2. Work and Family Balance
Women often want to balance work and family. Competing with men in high-pressure careers sometimes means missing out on time with children or personal life. Some women later feel tired, unhappy, or regretful. True equality means women can choose what makes them feel fulfilled, even if it’s different from what men choose.

3. Career Choices
Women often choose caring jobs like teaching or nursing. These may pay less, but they offer emotional reward. Forcing women into male-dominated, high-income fields doesn’t always bring happiness. People should feel free to follow what feels right to them, not what society says they “should” do.

4. Emotional and Social Roles
Women are often more emotionally sensitive, and that’s a strength. Men are sometimes raised to be tougher or less emotional, and some may admire women for their kindness and care. In relationships, many men naturally feel the need to protect and provide for women, not to control them, but because love makes people want to care for each other.

5. Special Protections

Women go through things like pregnancy and childbirth. That means they sometimes need different support at work or home. If we treat men and women exactly the same, we could lose helpful things like maternity leave. Fairness means giving what each person needs, not pretending everyone is the same.

Conclusion

Men and women are equal in value, but they don’t have to be equal in every way. Real equality means freedom: freedom to be different, to follow what makes us happy, and to support each other with respect and care. Men protecting women is not a sign of inequality, it can be a sign of love, honor, and mutual respect.

[SotiCoto]

No no no. You've got this fundamentally wrong at its core.
Men and women are NOT equal in value. That is the core of all the problems.
The female body has inherent value that the male body doesn't. That is why women are coveted and objectified... while men... aren't to anything like the same extent.
That is why throughout history men have always had to tackle all the dangerous jobs and the like: because men are expendable and women aren't. Because as long as there is at least one man around he can do his reproductive duty for everyone and the population continues unimpeded... but losing even one woman will have long-term ramifications. Most of the problems women have had with lack of freedom throughout history all stem from the fact that they have value... and men don't.

Oh, and being emotionally sensitive isn't a strength. Don't be ridiculous. It is a crippling weakness. To believe otherwise is just lying to yourself because you're too insecure to accept it is a problem rather than a useful skill.

[LiaRaven]

I disagree. Men and women are equal in value simply because they’re human. Saying women are more valuable due to reproduction is objectifying, not respectful. Both genders have faced unfair roles. True equality means freedom to choose, not being limited by biology or tradition. Sensitivity isn’t weakness, it’s human.

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

Very well, there are a few points where I don't understand why you're mentioning them, because it doesn't relate to equality to me so:

2. Work and Family Balance and 3. Career Choices

Many men AND women will take regretful decisions on this aspect, as growing older. That's personal, not social because I don't think any society forces women to work in high-pressure jobs in the name of equality?

4. Emotional and Social Roles

I also don't see which society is demanding women to become "tougher" or less emotional (which means rigid, way more than toughness or less emotional, but I digress)

5. Special Protections

Strongly disagree with this example, because you assumed that giving something, socially, to women take away something from men, it's the opposite, maternity leave opened the door to paternity leave.

Looking at 2, 3 and 4, I wonder what made you think that equality, as in fair treatment, could mean being identical, what is the line of thought bringing you to this evaluation?

[Chazmatazz269]

All three of your oversights are quite easily observed and debunked by the pay gap myth. Entirely justified by taking the number of men working and the number of each working divided by total income for each. This deliberate misinformation suggests that men are paid more for the exact same work, universally. It’s been debunked dozens of times by economists, sociologists and anthropologists. Creating special conditions so that women who work in safe and comfortable fields while earning the same as men who are literally risking life and limb daily is a real factor that only people who dare challenge the liberal status quo are addressing.
I suspect you’ve never stopped to challenge what you believe, let alone what you’ve been told.
Try reading “Being Wrong” by Kathryn Schultz. Don’t worry, it’s not even remotely political and it’s supported entirely by empirical evidence. Afterwards, take some time to reflect on ideas you’ve too long held true. Some will pass muster. Many will not.
Good luck on your true awakening!

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

Okay? 😂

Serving me with flattery: "I suspect you’ve never stopped to challenge what you believe". To then go for a patronizing attitude about my "true awakening" and "reflect on ideas I've too long held true".

Those psychological levers are a bit too obvious. Please use that on someone else.

[Chazmatazz269]

So you concede that you don’t have an intelligent argument? Sweet! How very rare of you!
Please feel free to share what you’ve learned here with your closed-minded relatives and friends. The whole world would be better off if more willfully ignorant people came to this conclusion as quickly as you did!

[SamWinchester058]

Then read what she wrote again until you understand it from her perspective. Just because you don't understand it doesn't mean she is wrong. Cultural pressures often inform policy choices... it's all downstream of culture. If society is shifting from a policy perspective then it's more than likely culture pushing it in that direction. Good or bad. I do like your thoughts on maternity leave.

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

@Chazmatazz269
I didn't learn anything new, these communication levers you're using to convey arguments are already trending a lot. I understand you've been inspired by some YT captions, proudly stating: "THE TRUTH NO ONE IS TELLING YOU". I admit though that you're being a little bit fancier, using flattery immediately before arrogance.

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

@SamWinchester058
I don't need to read it again until I understand, that's why I asked her questions, to get more of the OP's perspective. It's not about right or wrong here, to me, it's about perspective used, line of thought used. Because, unlike maths, there is no truth in soft science talks, just perspectives. And I don't get hers, so far, so I'm genuinely asking her questions, not making a point using these questions.

[SamWinchester058]

You seem like you're well read. Personal attacks should be above you... stick to your points my friend.

[LiaRaven]

No one is allowed to attack @Maybe_Maybe_not on my posts

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

Oh thank you, Lia 💚

[SamWinchester058]

Who's attacking him? He personally attacked Chaz. Lol.

[LiaRaven]

@SamWinchester058 🤓

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

Adding something about paternity leave, I didn't know it doesn't exist in US, I took if for granted, hence my statement about it, because it's common in EU. EU and many developed countries, which includes Turkey, Mexico, Colombia but not USA, not Israel, nor New Zealand

[SamWinchester058]

Interesting info

[bddddd]

Plus one

[Pearl222]

Very well written. I’ve always thought of feminism as essentially freedom to exercise the same choices and rights as men. What women choose is upto them, but they should at least have equal opportunity.
Also, there are some things that have and will always be different between men and women. Rather than working to eliminate these differences, we should work together as one to hone each other’s strengths while respecting the biological and emotional differences. That’s the only way we can live in harmony without putting any one gender down.

[Anonymous]

You can still achieve equality with all of that, genius

[LiaRaven]

Really?
Go seek equality by yourself, genius lol

[LiaRaven]

But don’t come here crying when you get your equity, because believe me men’s life are much harder and I am saying “men” not “ douchebags”

[LiaRaven]

Equality*

[Opinion Owner]

@liaraven

How are mens lives harder?

All they need go do is work a job

A woman needs to work a full time job, then come home to do 90% of the housework and child care

Who has to torture herself in childbirth?

Who had to GIVE UP her career in order to have children?

Who has to have a shorter fertile window?

Who has to deal with menstrual pain every month?

[Opinion Owner]

Who is more likely to get raped, beat up, or robbed? Women! Theyre the weaker sex

Who is more likely to suffer from poverty? Women!

Who are more likely to be single moms? Women!

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

... I can't argue against substance here, this "who" list contains a lot of force 👈🏼

[OlderAndWiser]

The problem with discussion such as this is that very few people ever define equality.

[Shiprex]

I like the way this is worded as it's pointing out differences being the factor that is evident for different treatments instead of the concept of same treatment.

What has happened is that women's liberation has pushed for opportunities in male dominated fields historically to promote women into them BUT it missed an opportunity with doing the reciprocal effort of promoting men into primarily female dominated roles of education, especially now we see how that is failing young boys and no one points the finger at women for that as it's the boys themselves and men around them at fault. Also nursing and care professions like psychology and other health careers that are industries in themselves catering mainly to women by women and that shouldn't be the norm. That has to be something addressed.

I would say the latter point about emotional beings also needs to look at good practice. We get stressed and end up with all sorts of mental illness and dependency on drugs or therapy because of this but NO one suggests men's methodology of dealing with stress as being a smart way forward for ALL. Men deal with stress better, less prone, for shorter and less deeply, sure the self delete is higher for men but women still try 3 times more often and are thus struggling worse with these ideations. MAYBE pages from how men work need to be put into practice and emotional regulation should be something taught to young people both young and old that it's NOT always necessary to emote and have validation from others, that dealing with things yourself IS possible. Just look at the bigger stronger and faster half of the population doing all that shit and coming home tired without all the need for "sharing" and rumination over things for validation.

We're FINE and that's all that needs to be said until we ask or offer otherwise.

[ohsheeT]

We live in a duality world you have God with out the Devil, you can't have positive* without negative. You can't have a love without hate.
You can add man without woman
You cannot have success without failure
So is all reality. They are the same they are equal.

If I start dating somebody, they are my equal. In every way
I don't care what society says.
I don't care what these big tiled groups or organizations say

I don't care what man can do I don't care what women can do.

But the person that I date or i'm with
I know what the differences are and I don't care. We are equal in every way.

And if she wants to do something she cand if there's a reason why she can't do I will help her succeed.
And if somebody tells her she can't do something I would look at her and I would say. What do you think about that?
And I would help her succeed on her own Not with society, be labeled organism organizations.
I believe they do more harm than good.
But that's just my belief. Because it doesn't matter, we are all equal.

And if you're talking about skills nobody is equal, you either can do it or you can't

And it's not about if you.
Can do it or if you can't. It's all about you get the opportunity.

We know men and women are not Equal, we know that God in devil is not equal. We know love and hate is not equal. We know Failure and success is not equal. But you can't have one without the other. So in that sense, everything is equal.
Musical

Become one with Self that's equal become one with others That is equal Become one with this universe that is Equal

When you can love and respect somebody because who they are not what they can do. But who they are. That is equal?

[Chazmatazz269]

Nearly perfectly worded.
I would add just a couple of things.
The farthest and widest reaching poll of its kind showed us that while over two thirds of men would sacrifice their earnings potential to have more time for family, less than fifteen percent of women would be willing to accept that change, and a negligible percentage would be willing to work more to afford that opportunity to their kids and the fathers of their kids.
This truth is almost universally overlooked based on what we expect is “best” for families and society at large.
It’s not that men don’t feel the sacrifices that career women feel. We generally just suck it up because that’s what our traditional gender roles, asserted by both men and women, demand. We sacrifice and serve. And it’s absolutely exhausting to do so with little to no recognition and appreciation.
Working women are basically brand new to this and assert that it’s just another form of misogyny.

[TheSpaceGnome]

Women are treated better than men and have been since before I was born, that should change in my opinion.

Men and women do not come in standard sizes, stengths, etc. injuries and stress occur in men just as often on the job.

Most men need time for kids and personal life as well, and are generally speaking overworked, sick, and exausted.

Most teachers and medical professionals are men.

Women are not more emotionally sensitive than men. That myth needs to die, and women need to stop being insensitive to men's emotional needs.

Maternity leave still exists so nursing the baby can happen, paternity leave also still exists.

[RavVid]

It is NOT OK for special physical standards for women.

There are only two possibilities if special reduced standards are created for women.

1. women can't do the job physically but for political reasons are being given jobs

2. Men are being discriminated against if they can meet the womens standard but aren't employed

[strateguy632]

Like men don't get pregnancy leave vacation , so you really want complete equality? https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/maternity-leave

[BadApple69]

Very good write up! What you said is a 100% correct.
I respect women for who they are, and yes they can do things I can’t do. In return I can do things they can’t do.
As you stated we can have equal value but not be the same. I am glad for the differences.

[wynning]

Equity might be a better term for this perspective. Differences will exist but over time with the constant of change, a lot of differences and even similarities becomes more and more down to the individual and what they decide to do.

[SolitarySolace]

It’s true that equality of value doesn’t mean sameness — but what matters is whether the differences are being used as an excuse to justify unequal rights or opportunities. If a woman freely chooses a different path, that’s fine. But when the system or culture says ‘you can’t’ or ‘you shouldn’t’ because of your gender, that’s not respect — that’s restriction. The danger is always when ‘special protections’ morph into ‘special limitations.’”

— Eva ❤️

[msg321]

Congratulations 👏 🎉 unfortunately in the name of gender equality people want to create a genderless society. The life would be very boring in a genderless society. We are different and the differences between men and women make the world a better place. These differences don't compete each other. In contrast they complete each other.

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

Who are these people, seemingly threatening, you refer to who want to create a, supposedly, genderless society?

[Djaay]

There's a BIG HUGE problem with believing in equality hoping that two equals parts become together. This is so wrong on every level. Its against nature , it deny's CHRIST , it's against GODS commanded commandments of an anointed authority given to men to be the head of household. GODS will wants two through marriage to become AS ONE , not two equal parts. You women should be alarmed of the anti-christ behavior you'all are displaying. The consequences for this behavior certainly isn't Heaven.

[Guanfei]

Well, you can't have both. Either you take equality, including what isn't beneficial to you, or you accept inequality with its bad side.
You can't wish for everything good men have but none of the bad.

[MannMitAntworten]

“Equal” was never meant that we are the same and equally capable in all areas. Its use was intended as being equal in the eyes of the ‘Law’. Granted even within Law there exist inequalities.

[genericname85]

yeah "equality" in our society is understood like cherry picking. it's only interesting to women when it benefits women but as soon as there's a slight drawback, that's where they want traditional roles suddenly xD it's hilarious.

[MysticDevice]

Comment section is gonna be on fire lol.

But for the record I agree with you.

There has to be equal rights but we also need to acknowledge the fundamental biological differences in between.

[AviatorTom]

Mother Nature never intended the sexes to be equal, and they shouldn't be. Attempts to make them equal will fail, miserably.

[Anonymous]

Equality means access to the same opportunities, which is very fair. Equity means forcing the same outcomes regardless of how qualified a person may or may not be. That is abhorrent.

[Anonymous]

The elite plan is to create a genderless society for the end days of planet earth so they can be enslaved to mine resources for the construction of the elites moonbase, the last step will be harvesting the oxygen out of the atmosphere

[TallAnon]

I think we're rapidly heading towards a future where men don't give a fuck

[LiaRaven]

I don’t give a fudge how tall you are lol

[TallAnon]

Ok, that doesn't change what I said

[LiaRaven]

Exactly