I wouldn't say its common, but if it happens to be its based on a type of man versus being generally based on the entire sex or even a particular demographic. This is a sign of an insecure PERSON. Someone who has pride and ego issues. Ego issues because they base their self-worth and/or they blame the circumstance on a presumed inadequacy that is mostly I product of their own negative self-image and more or less nothing to do with the breadwinners income, anything they do or have done or any character trait/character flaw of their own. It's completely centered around their partners negativity. The crappie way they treat their spouse is simply a byproduct and is called projecting. Its just as it sounds it would be. When you feel great then it tends to exude it with little to no effort. Well its the same as with anger or sadness. When either or any of the following emotions are felt, it's nearly impossible to simply sit on them and forget about them. But if your are the big bank breadwinner, then don't feel let this type of shit bother you.
As for me, I have/had this relationship where my ex-wife made 3x as much as I ever did weekly so I embraced it as it's a success for the both of us.
But when it comes to paying at a restaurant my ego and pride do get the best of me. I always must pay the bill.
Literally no where in that study it states husbands treat their wives poorly if she is earning more money than him. It says it is due to traditional belief that men must be the main breadwinner. Research also shows many women still desire men who are closer to their socio-economic status hence reinforcing those norms.
While your uncles treating their wives badly could be because of number of reasons, directly or indirectly related to earning potential or not at all.
I like independent ambitious women, I wouldn't be in anyway put off by it or treat her differently. I'd support her anyway possible. What men don't like is career coming before relationship regardless of her income level.
Its 21st century and I don't want to be in a relationship where we still shackle each other to outdated, archaic norms. I would be happy my wife is successful even if money is not the only way to define success. As long as we are together and happy that's all that matters, money shouldn't come between us.
I noticed a lot of men disagree with the Asker's observation. When I went back to work, my husband treated me very badly. After a decade went by, he was finally able to talk to me about it and his perception was that I worked because I didn't think he was providing for us. I never said such a thing and I'll never make as much money as he does. None the less, he took it as an insult and he still resents me for going back to work.
Some men resent women for dedicating their time to a career and not him.
Other men place their own value on their ability to provide, so if the woman is making more, he feels he can’t provide and feels inadequate.
Opinion
50Opinion
I will probably get beat up onn this one because my opinion does not agree with the majority of marrried couples my age and younger. My father told me that in a married relation neither one has personal property. Everything is ours, including the checking and savings accounts. Something that I noticed when the divorce rate began to skyrocket was that no one was thinking we anymore. It all became me. My wife and I had similar jobs and yes I always brought home a bigger check but it all went into a common account. This is where trust comes in. Is your spouse going to spend the family's proceeds on things they want or things the family needs. Me or we? I have always let my wife pay the bills. I have a tendancy to pay everyting off and be left with nothing at the end of the month. She has a much better sense of finance. If it was up to me we would be struggling most of the month. I found that if I took care of her without question she would find a way to provide the "Things" I wanted. If she bought me a new powertool to complete a job for her. I ususally ended up with a new musical instrument and did not even have to discuss it. We have been married 50 years now. My hands are shot from all the playing. It reminds me of a line from "The Question" by the Moody Blues " All the love that you have been giving has all been meant for you." Makes you think.
50 years of marriage, that’s great! But the difference is that in your marriage is mutually beneficial. For my aunt and uncles relationship it’s more parasitic. My uncle refuses to work, cook, clean, basically do anything to help out but when his wife complains about this he yells and berates her.
Because they gave themselves up. Especially if you grown up with being the provider it´s hard for guys to accept the role that they are not. Maybe all people, but guys especially can have hard in adjusting to new situations.
I and some other guys we take our self-confidence out of what we achieve causing my self-confidence to be extremely low when I can´t solve problems. To society I am what I do.
In modern society success is measured in the money you get for it. So if there are always other people that are more successful than you are it is natural process that you feel like you´re a loser comparing to them.
The longer you feel that the more it becomes a problem because some day there will be a breaking point where a man´s will to change things turning self-pitying and the realization that no matter what you do you´re not going to be good anyways.
Then they loose interest in everything because trying isn´t worth it when you don´t believe in yourself and feel a living failure.
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I think for most of us, it makes us feel less valuable to her.
As the article says: " if your male spouse is having a hard time defining his role as a provider "
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I disagree with this part:
" especially if they’ve been raised and conditioned to believe men ‘should’ dutifully make more than their wives,” she says.
The only way to get through this pain point is to talk about it with your partner, Torabi says. “Allow yourselves to get vulnerable,” she adds"
And I disagree because it's not how we are raised it's called human nature men by nature masculine and dominate they want to lead and making more money makes the man more eligible to lead.
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P. S: for me, I don't care if she makes more money because in my culture/religion the man should spend his money on his family while the woman keep her money to herself unless her husband income wasn't enough then she can help, and I think this way the man will still feel as provider even though he makes less money.
Common phenomenon that takes place when a woman makes more money
1. She respects the man less
2. She sees herself more as the leader/decision maker and will in small ways order him around
3. She tends to show disrespect than generally shows up in arguments
In most cases the man is responding to a shift in her behaviors towards him. It's not that her making more bothers him. It's how making more money changed her behaviors towards him.
This is actually very common. Some women will be self aware and honest enough to come out and say it. First time I heard a woman talking about it was out of college. She said she hated that she felt this way, but that when she started making more money than her man that she began to lose respect for him.
Because for a lot of women a main reason for a man's value to her is his ability to provide. Not all women react to it this way, but it's pretty consistent.
Good example of this was the show Big Bang Theory. I wasn't much a fan of the show but saw enough of it to know a bit. Wolowitz was dating this mousey voiced blonde.
Relationship was relatively good. Later in the show she starts making more money than him and slowly in small ways she began to be condescension towards him.
Eventually this behavior leads to a fight and she says he can't handle the fact she makes more money than him. When really it was the passive aggressive condescending behavior she exhibited and didn't even notice.
Because instinctually she looked at him as less of a man
That’s horrible and that makes sense but for my one uncle even though his wife makes more than him she works her ass off just so they can have a house for them and their 5 kids to live in and she cooks, cleans on top of that. She never really gets mad at him except when she can’t take his laziness (refusal to get a job/clean anything)
He says he’s doing this because he’s starting ideas for a new business but all he really does is stay home doing absolutely nothing. He won’t even go to the grocery store to help with groceries, it’s that bad and even my mom tries to help him by telling him but he just gets really mad and defensive.
Know guys like that as well. Usually the woman stays because when things are good they're really good and when they're bad, although it sucks she knows the good comes later.
It's when the good stops coming around or is less frequent that she reaches a pain point big enough to leave. And as shitty as this end point sounds...
It was her decision to knowingly get with a man who is a deadbeat. Knowingly have the child of a man who is a deadbeat. Stay with a man she knows is a deadbeat. Then repeat this process However many times it took her to have multiple children by the guy she knows is a deadbeat.
It's shitty. It sucks. But it was her choice so you cannot be too sorry for her when thats the life she chose
I think that your set of experience, is too small!!
I ASSUME ALL women are AT LEAST equals!! Why should I feel bad, or unsure, when she does well, and earns a lot of money, getting paid for her work!!
What kind of weak, simple-minded guy, would feel bad, and not totally support, and encourage her, and her success?
Maybe idiots, with OLD-Time thinking, when women were submissives!!
I love STRONG, Confident women, and totally support them, in EVERY WAY!! More women, as CEOs and maybe more GREEN-FOCUSED companies, caring for the environment, and the future for our children?
So many, now, are dominated by greedy fucking bastards, just focused on PROFITS, but not the IMPACT of their company, and how the next 2 generations are going to live, on this planet!!
How much MONEY, is ENOUGH? What about the future?
Well actually the opposite is usually true. When a woman makes more money than a man she will usually not even date him in the first place or resent him for making less causing her to start cheating. Women in general prefer a man who is essentially better than them. So that man will have to at least on the same level or better than then in most things like financially educationally, maturity etc. Women who's husband maybe lost his job or is no longer making the same as her will often divorce her husband and seek out a man that makes more money.
There could be a few reasons why your uncles treat their wives bad. They are fat, they are never home, they suffer financial abuse, their wives don't respect them, they are cheating.
They’re always home, they’re lazy. One of them fat and the other is average weight a little on the skinny side. He didn’t lose his job he quit working cause he says he thinks he’s above “low value jobs” and I don’t think they’re attractive enough to have someone want to be with them other than their wives tbh. And I don't know what you mean by financial abuse
Financial abuse is a form of domestic abuse. It's like say a woman is married to a man who is the breadwinner while she stays at home with the kids but he won't allow her access to any of his earnings for the basics, well that can happen to men too.
I am not sure how common this actually is. I have not clicked on the link yet to read the article attached. But I have known of instances where this was the case. I used to know a lady who made more than double what her husband made, and he was cheating on her even after she discovered it.
And I know another lady who had a professional job and her husband only worked part time. He didn't treat her well and they ended up divorcing.
But those are only two examples. Not sure about society as a whole.
Guys get judged by what they have to offer and it doesn't matter how well he's doing if the people around him are doing better he will feel like he's not useful. He might also feel like his partner could leave him at any moment which is not a great basis for a relationship so this will add to his feeling on instability and stress him out. If a guy has to deal with struggles like this he's not going to be able to be as loving as when he feels confident and like everything is going well. Every guy will be affected by this but some will handle it a lot better than others.
Probably because it's totally unnatural and to some degree, despite us being civilized and having technology, basic biology influences how people behave. Instead of these successful women whining about how their husbands mistreated them, they should ask why they didn't get a more successful man to begin with.
What are you even talking about? I never even said anything about my aunts complaining, they only complain because of how lazy my uncles are and they married them cause they obviously love each other. Marriage shouldn’t be about a business agreement or else it’s not marriage that’s just some financial contract
" Marriage shouldn’t be about a business agreement or else it’s not marriage that’s just some financial contract" - Marriage is a business agreement.. it's not a romantic comedy or a Disney fairytale. People who go into it thinking it has nothing to do with business are the biggest whiners of all.
" they only complain because of how lazy my uncles are and they married them cause they obviously love each other" - Yeah, sounds like your aunts are desperate women who married lazy, deadbeat bums because the guys who aren't lazy didn't take them seriously. Happens all the time. Sorry, your aunts aren't as special as you think.
I agree with your comments. Why did they marry a lazy man instead of someone more successful? Because highly successful men were not into them. And obviously marriage is a contract. Its far more about business nuts and bolts than it is about love. If you get married for love without considering anything else its doomed to fail.
These are making big assumptions, how am I even supposed to know how my uncles were like when they met my aunt when I wasn’t even a fetus at that time? From context clues they changed after a while, because people can do that. One of my uncles used to actually own a successful business but it went wrong and now he refuses to work while his wife struggles to put food on the table
"they changed after a while" no. People dont really ever change. Their core personality is what its always been. It takes serious events like trauma or becoming a parent or finding Jesus to even change a little.
@bamesjond0069 dude that’s not how humans work? Do you know anything about psychology to even be talking like that
That is exactly how they work. Do you know anything about psychology? Thats basically 101 in your first college course. Smh.
@bamesjond0069 Oh, well. We tried. OP will look to her aunts as experts on men... follow their advice and end up in the same situation they're in.
Yeah. From my perspective the aunties are highly unattractive for LTRs so its not a surprise they are with men that have issues at some level.
@doopayo oh wow you even give examples of how they disrespect them and then still don't get it. I hope they get away from these cunts and get decent women.
It's a part of toxic masculinity and guy culture. Men are trained to believe they need to be the primary breadwinner. Being called a "woman" or being implicatively "inferior" to a woman is an insult that other men laugh at them for. It is very subconscious, but very real. I'm not justifying it, as I believe it is obviously wrong to do, but for many men it is a daily reminder of failure and inferiority and unfortunately many men don't know how to handle that.
Weird that it's the women who treat them like less in the first place. After all it's them who want rich guys. Men don't care.
Because men know that women who start out earning their husbands don't respect their husbands as much, especially if the relationship didn't start out that way. Men spend a ton of time being told by women how little they contribute to the household, if not for their money. So yeah, you take away the guy's ability to contribute the one thing you tell him he contributes, and he'll be understandably concerned about where he stands.
Would not bother me in the slightest , unfortunately its NEVER happened , but if it did , Id seriously treat her like an absolute gem , I should have married a wealthily power lawyer or big business owner , as long as it was all for real..
Then Id be the perfect guy , because of my understanding of business.
Never understood how some people (mostly men, let's not lie about it) could refuse MONEY because they were not the one who were making it in the relationship. Like what?
But i kinda feel like our generation isn't the same about it, because the only persons i've seen reacting like that were older than me.
The problem is that many women - no matter what her advantages might be - feel like the man should always be earning more, and that "her money" should be HER money, and that "his money" should be THEIR money. So, they get resentful if they have to spend their money on a man, and over time, she loses respect for her husband, quickly followed by losing her attraction to him, and THAT results in cheating or divorce, with women initiating divorce 77% of the time, and women who make more than their man initiating divorce 90% of the time.
Yes, there are some women who are happy to go out and work even though their husband doesn't contribute as much - but they are the *exception* to the rule, NOT the rule.
I've never heard of this but I think that if it happens it might be rooted in insecurity. The man may feel he cannot adequately fulfil his role as provider to a woman who has more money than he does. Or possibly the fact that she has more money than he makes her superior or even disrespectful to him and he resents her as a result. Who knows with humans?
OMG I'd be on my knees worshipping the goddess that she is! I can't imagine any guy treating his wife poorly to start with but if she's making more money than me I would do everything in my power to keep her happy.
Usually either because she sacrifices good looks for money, or because she expects too much pampering for her work (i. e. two guys and being assisted in getting that - which some spineless guys do attempt - I turn them down in disgust when they approach me)
Its related to the money but not exactly the money. Because for example it works that way with a pimp and a ho. The difference is the pimp is in control. There are a few aspects but its primarily about control. A man can maintain control its not so much of a problem. When a man isn't head of the house anymore they get resentful and act out.
Some say it has to do with the way we have been for thousands of years. Men are not used to their partners earning more than him. They always thought of themselves as providers
but you can also see some women saying that dating a man who earns less than you is dating down and they would be much more comfortable if their man earns more or the same as them.
I think it happens with people who are still somewhat stuck with the old mindset.
I also heard that i find it unfair from the man. I agreed with my
girlfriend that we run a FLR (female leaderd realastionship). should mean that she
is allowed to manage money, what is bought and what not and its also like an Demokratie everything up to 500doller decides she over 500 doller we decide. We both think it is the best re-state://background_color_rgba (0, 0, 0, 0), font_color_rgb (77, 77, 77), justifyLeft
They're probably idiots with fragile egos that couldn't stand their wives earning more. They associated manliness with being the provider so when their wives fonit better they feel threatened and throw tantrums like man-children.
My wife makes more than me. I don't treat her bad. Of course I could be lying, but I really don't care that she makes more. We both have jobs, we both contribute to the house so if she makes a millionaire amount that's good for both!
As for why some men don't think like this... In one word, ego. That is all. They need to make more to feel like they wear the pants around the house.
Maybe because guys have been programmed since birth that they ate the breadwinners. When it doesn't work out that way it can make them angry. Or maybe the wife rubs his nose in it.
Your two uncles and CNBC. Definitely very reliable studies. Do you expect this to be taken seriously?
Because divorce will likely follow. Either the wife will see her husband as useless and cast him aside (I hear this happens a lot in North Korea) or the husband will leave because he will feel like he is failing his wife.
Because she starts being bitchy and more assertive so, overall, there is more friction.
Most high earners women are psychopaths. Even you will treat psychopaths poorly once you get to know them...
Anti social personality disorders make up less than 0.2-3.3% of the population? Nothing I even brang up about my aunt is enough for you to self diagnose her for having aspd, and I doubt you have the license to even do so to anyone at all.
This information is all stuff you can research, it seems you just hate women.
@doopayo you could have also researched that women who earn more treat their men like less which is a fact. Obviously they won't react good to that.
It may not be true in this case but often times the man will be treated like shit for earning less even though women are earning more on average now lol.
In Reality most men don't give a shit about how much money you're making as a women. There are exceptions like your uncles but you assume that money is the reason they're treating their women like shit when it could be something else
Haven't observed anything like that.
Have been engaged to someone that earned more then me.
Couldn't care less. it's just money.
That's why never be in relationship with a guy who makes less money than you. I read heard if woman make more than 65 percent of household income she is highly likely to be abused.
Not necessarily , i want a mature female dominant girl in my life who can take care of most of the things, like female led relationship and believe me that mamy man also want this
I know of no example of this and I know a number of women who earn more than their husbands.
Multiple reasons but mostly because the wife loses respect for the husband and her attitude and lack of consideration for his opinions shows.
I wouldn’t care as long as she is contributing to the household.
Probably she would be contributing more
I don't know, but I wouldn’t mind my wife making more than me. Seems immature to me
Usually because they are always treated like garbage.
My uncles aren’t treated like garage, they’re the ones that are ungrateful and treat their wives like garbage and both have anger issues. They get mad at the littlest things, it’s my uncles that are the toxic ones. No man should be yelling at his wife, the stuff they do is borderline marital abuse.
Same reason why wives treat their husbands poorly regardless of how much income they made
The fact that women are as abusive as men
Maybe they don’t feel like a man anymore or insecure just like a bully that picks on people , I’ve never been in that situation before though
I wouldn't, i wish i had a wife that made more than me.
I don't care what she makes. In fact I'd love it if she made more.
Because it becomes competition not corperation. Thousands of years of evolutionary psychology isn't going away
It is not true that it's almost always the case.
That's caused by ego and insecurities.
I am sure you only heard one side of the story.
some men are just narrow minded shits.
2 are almost all cases? Really?
id love it, i wouldn't have to work so hard
it wouldn't bother me. i'd be fine with it.
what i hate is when they have a dead end job like fast food or retail although retail is more tolerable than fast food
“Pride”
Fuck off
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