The stay at home order is not about politics or any superficial means.

[BlackWidow93]

"I stayed at work for you, you stay at home for us"

While everyone is staying at home and social distancing we are preventing the amount of cases that are being urgent enough to land in a hospital as to not overwhelm the medical staff or god forbid it be like pearl harbor and we have so many cases that we now have to decide who lives and who dies. Are people really that heartless to not care? Do people really just care about themselves anymore during a tragic time?

If you look at the hospitals now there are already an overwhelming amount of people who have it and are dying and they're running out of space for the bodies. We need to be humans for a sec and not think about ourselves or politics or any superficial means.

People are staying at home and practicing being safe right now to help flatten the curve. They are helping to slow down the rate of which people are being infected so that way hospitals can treat those who need it and help save lives. Without these people, we wouldn't have workers to help strengthen the economy.

So while people are protesting the stay at home order and saying they deserve to go back to work, you are being completely selfish. You are not thinking of those around you. You are not thinking of the well being of your business. It should not be forgotten that the singular you is just one of many in a company. It takes an army to win a war, so to speak. And we can't have an army without our soldiers.

In short, making people stay at home RIGHT NOW, is allowing the people who dont have the virus to have minimal contact with the people who do have the virus therefore slowing the spread and decreasing the number of deaths.

The stay at home order is to protect Americans from having a massive amount of exposure. It is also giving the healthcare workers the time they need to treat everyone, amongst the scrambling around that they are already doing to keep those who are infected, alive.

Whether you're democrat or republican or independent or don't care about politics, you are still human and should care about the lives impacted by this pandemic. This shouldn't be about politics. It should be about doing what's right.

[musicbrain5]

Exactly. I wish more people would understand the point of staying at home or just simply not going out on a whim or visiting/gathering with people because you want to. The longer people carry on as normal, as if nothing is happening, the longer this is going to go on. Even a few days ago, Trump was insisting that Canada open our borders to non-essential, recreational travel from the US. Thank goodness Trudeau made a good decision that it’s not happening, and Trump relented. We don’t need anymore sick people coming here, especially from New York State. People in the US absolutely love politicizing everything, and this is no different.

[Bananaman177]

Trudeau just spent a bunch of your tax dollars buying protective equipment from China only to find out the shit he bought doesn't even exist and the planes he sent to pick it up had to come back empty, which cost even more money. He's a fucking dipshit and a world class sucker, they elected him to legalize weed and he legalized dog blowjobs instead.

[msc545]

@Bananaman177 Dogs give blowjobs?

[BlackWidow93]

Please do not post sexual crap about dogs on mytake

[BlackWidow93]

No because I know you're being mean

[musicbrain5]

@Bananaman177 Can you not post that shit here, thanks.

[musicbrain5]

@Bananaman177 And how much American tax dollars were wasted by Democrats bitching and moaning and then trying to impeach Trump? Lmao.

[musicbrain5]

@BlackWidow93 It’s funny that he hasn’t come back to this question.

[BlackWidow93]

I've learned you either get the ones that are like cockroaches or the ones that ghost

[Anonymous]

Thank you. This is spot on. I am continually surprised by how many stupid and ignorant people there are. Some people are just dumb as a rock.

@888theGreat

[BlackWidow93]

Omg thank you for recognizing him as being one of them. The stupidity of people on here make me really sad for humanity.

[888theGreat]

Actually , most people agree with me, so you and your genus friends are the minority.

[BlackWidow93]

@888theGreat ok barbie doll

[Opinion Owner]

@888theGreat Um, no they don't. I mean clearly there are a lot of stupid people here in the US but the majority are not dumb enough to actually believe COVID-19 is a manufactured crisis.

[888theGreat]

Sure , it was produced in a lab , I call that manufactured

[Opinion Owner]

@888theGreat It was not "produced" in a lab. The entire scientific community is unanimously in agreement with that fact. Analysis of the DNA and RNA of the virus has conclusively confirmed it has not been artificially manipulated and is of natural origins. It is however possible it accidentally leaked from a lab, but there is no proof of that yet.

It is clear that the virus originally came from a horseshoe bat that originated in a cave roughly a thousand miles from Wuhan, and that means the origins are natural and it was not "produced" or "manufactured". What is not clear is how it made its way to humans, and that may never be clear.

The good news for you is that, unlike this virus, willful ignorance is easily curable. All you have to do is educate yourself on actual facts instead of politically motivated biases and bullshit conspiracy theories.

[888theGreat]

Keep believing in your fantasies

[Opinion Owner]

@888theGreat Such an intelligent response. lmao

[BlackWidow93]

@888theGreat and @Rangers are not smart. He literally sees the logic, sees the facts, sees the death in hospitals from the virus and still thinks the way he does. Its heartbreaking you have some Americans like this. So unfortunately @OpinionOwner we gotta let them be.

[Opinion Owner]

@BlackWidow93 Yeah, you're right, willful ignorance is a disease that can only be cured by the victim. But unfortunately, COVID-19 is an example of how the ignorance and stupidity of some people can literally cost other people their lives.

[BlackWidow93]

It's heartbreaking...

[Opinion Owner]

It really is.

[chris0977]

"The entire scientific community is unanimously in agreement" - this statement is evidence of ignorance, as the entire scientific community is not unanimous, you're likely in your social media "bubble", because many scientists I've read, and found online, state they believe otherwise.

2nd, unanimous agreement isn't evidence, as there has been widespread majority agreement on much in the past later proven false.

Saying the entire world, or large communities, are is unanimous agreement is evidence of ignorance in itself; no large crowd is ever in total, unanimous agreement on anything.

[msc545]

Remember that 50% of the population has an IQ of less than 100. Barely enough to read and write.

[Opinion Owner]

@chris0977 Please provide some sources, because I'm calling bullshit. I have researched the fuck out of this and I have literally NEVER seen a SINGLE credible source who isn't in 100% agreement with the solid scientific proof that it's not possible SARS-Cov-2 came from a human-manufactured source. So please, provide even just one credible source. I'll wait...

[Opinion Owner]

@msc545 Indeed, this pandemic has brought those sub-100s out of the fucking woodwork.

It has also brought out the fucknuts who are desperate to buy into any conspiracy theory that comes along.

Dumb as a fucking rock.

[chris0977]

Core to the issue is the word "credible"... the reason you can't find any is because the narcissist (you) claims yourself arbiter of truth, meaning I could present sources, but only your judgement gets to deem them credible, or not - if I deem something credible, but you do not, it's irrelevant, as your conclusions are all that matters.

If I judge something truth, as many do with "conspiracy theories", as you call them, their perspectives are irrelevant, because yours is all that matters.

[chris0977]

You have already judged those who don't agree with your perceptions, and perspectives, as "idiots", before anything is even presented, which, in itself, presents a fundamental bias, as being objective requires emotional detachment from bias toward specific beliefs to evaluate information as equally as possible.

Not only do you reject information which doesn't agree with you, but literally resent (act in anger) another's right to have an opinion that doesn't agree with you, because you seek control you don't have (over another's opiinions/actions), which frustrates you, leading you to talk down to them on grounds of self-proclaimed (narcissistic) superiority.

Again, do we equally get to judge "credible" in what I present, in answer to your previous post, or are you the sole arbiter of credibility, and anyone who disagrees you will strike down.

Based on your previous posts, I already know the answer, the question being rhetorical to make a point, because I can't provide a "credible" source, as only one side gets 100% decision in definitions of "credible", which in itself makes any judgement highly biased, as someone with pre-defined anger and hatred toward specific views (lack of objectivity) is making the judgement.

[chris0977]

So my question is, based on your anger, hatred, and highly subjective (emotionally biased) reactions:

1. Who gets to judge a source credible (does anyone other than the narcissist get a say)?
2. How do you judge a source credible when the foundation of credibility (objectivity toward ideas) has already been proven highly compromised?

[Opinion Owner]

@chris0977 Just provide a source, dumbass. Any source! You won't because it doesn't exist.

[chris0977]

Can't. You've already, narcissistic (nearly to a textbook degree) declared yourself all-knowing, there being nothing beyond your beliefs that could potentially exist. I concede to you as the source of all that ever was, can, or will be known.

[Opinion Owner]

@chris0977 I'm not asking for a credible source. I'm asking for ANY source. ANYTHING AT ALL. Even a tabloid will do.

You and I both know you can't provide one because none exist.

Now, run along and fuck off, dumbass.

[flappy]

@chris0977 no one knows whether the virus was natural or man made. What we do know is that it is fatal and does not have a cure except waiting it out. Sorry to say if you are protesting stay at home orders because the virus was man made then you all are dumb. Why not publish articles, make appeals to arrest the one responsible?

[flappy]

Also, if any of you want freedom to move go to some pure open area and walk run or do any activity. And of you can't, just wear a mask and do some solo activity where you don't interact with other people.

[Opinion Owner]

@flappy chris0977 I agree with all of that, except for the part about no one knowing whether the the virus was man made. We actually do know it was not man made. It is genetically almost impossible. There is overwhelming scientific evidence that it is of natural origins and was not created or modified by humans.

It came from a horseshoe bat, and likely from a population of those bats that exist in a specific cave about 1k miles from Wuhan, although it is possible there are other populations of those bats elsewhere.

But scientists have been studying those bats in the labs in Wuhan for some time, and the virus they carry is almost 100% identical genetically to the SARS-Cov-2 virus that is causing this COVID-19 pandemic among humans. It is, however, very suspicious that those labs were located in Wuhan, where the first cases of COVID-19 were. The only question is how it got from the bats to humans. It IS possible someone intentionally released it, but it was not manufactured by humans, that much we know. The most likely scenario is that it was accidentally leaked from one of the labs.

There is plenty of information out there among the scientific community about this. Here is one source of many.

www.sciencealert.com/here-s-what-scientists-think-of-the-coronavirus-was-made-in-a-lab-rumour

[Marriedwith2]

logic and the truth are ignored by most of the slack-jawed manbabies here

[Opinion Owner]

@Marriedwith2 When are you going to get a fucking pink account, sweetie?

[chris0977]

@Marriedwith2 I've come to realize, much like riding a bike comes naturally, where I used to get angry at many posters after pointing out they reply to debate (arguements presented) with character attacks (stupid, dumb) of the individual, and continually fail to address the statements made directly, no matter how many times this distinction is clarified.

Much like riding a bike, which comes naturally to many, but for a time seemed impossible, many now never get taught to distinguish between facts and feelings. While it seems clear to those who do (i. e. I present information, you reply to that information vs. call someone "idiot" or "stupid" without ever addressing arguments presented) know how to separate data from emotion, much like colors are obvious, but not to color-blind, many have brains literally unable to make this distinction.

[OlderAndWiser]

Apparently, you are not in the half of the planet that lives from paycheck to paycheck. In an ideal world, everyone could stay at home indefinitely and consistently act in an altruistic way. However, in the real world, economic survival is as important as medical/health survival, and many people see their lives crumbling with no obvious path to recovery.

The fact that you don't understand what motivates these people doesn't mean that they are wrong. It just means that you don't understand.

[Lliam]

Thank you for a breath of intelligence, OlderAndWiser. It cracks me up how privileged people can call someone selfish for having compassion for those in distress.
50% of Americans don't have $500 in reserve for an emergency. Official unemployment numbers have skyrocketed to 26 fucking million. People are losing their homes, their life savings, their shops and small businesses. People in nursing homes aren't allowed to have their loved ones by their sides during the last hours of their lives. Alcoholism and drug abuse are spiking due to the consequence of isolation. Suicides are increasing. Oh, but it's selfish to think about all that.

[hellionthesagereborn]

Yeah it is. First and foremost, when can we start working and earning money? I mean since you and those like you think you know best, so much so that you believe its perfectly exceptable to shut down the world (because you said so) and put upwards of 15 million americans out of work and with no income, what is YOUR solution to this? OH! I know, we can all just collect "free" money! Yeah, that's it, we can just have the government magically make money and give to us were we can all live in a lovely little utopia where the government just magically makes everything appear (never mind that the government doesn't have a side job and only gets money from people paying taxes (something they can't do if they are not earning money). Or we can face reality that this virus, which by the way is NOTHING compared to other flu's and that's including the common flu (which by the way they have been conflating all deaths with coronavirus deaths (since we started keeping track of coronavirus deaths we have seen virtually no deaths from the flu (which kills 500,000 globally), pneumonia (which kills 2.5 million globally), strokes (which kill 5 million globally and disable another five million) and heart attacks (which kills 18 million globally).

Seems rather strange, well until you actually pay attention and here actual fucking doctors pointing out that based upon how we record the deaths we are in fact conflating non coronavirus deaths with coronavirus (which means we honestly have no fucking idea how many people are dying from it but its less then what is reported by a substantial margin, especially considering that 75% of the people who have died "from" coronavirus had at least one preexisting disease and about 50% had three or more).

In short your saying we should all die of starvation and have economic collapse that will cause generational economic issues and poverty and homelessness and starvation, because people on one side of the political spectrum said so and continue to bad mouth and dismiss the other sides point when they say hey, if we don't open up the economy now instead of a minority of people dying we will have the FUCKING MAJORITY! This is absolutely potlical, the left prayed for this to happen, they begged for an economic collapse to make trump look bad and they got it. One guy started surveying leftists in the streets asking if they would continue the quarantine and have millions more people lose their jobs and become homeless if it meant that Trump would be forced out of office and most leftists were fine with that trade off.

This is superficial and its fucking political and your going to drag us all down to hell because of it.

[BlackWidow93]

Ok people like you, can ignore all the rules, get sick and die

[hellionthesagereborn]

HA! First and foremost, your literally calling for me to die anyway, so what the fuck does it matter? I mean I'm sorry I'm not as privileged as you, that I cannot simply not work for months at a time, to have my bills paid for me, to live without having to pay rent or buy food. I'm sorry I'm not being taken care of by others or being afforded the opportunity to collect a paycheck without showing up to work, I know that I'm just a lowly poor piece of shit that isn't deserving of life like you are, but unfortunately I still value my existence enough to not want to starve to death. I know, how selfish of me. This is why I despise the left, you claim to have the moral high ground, claim to care about the poor but then you don't hesitate to throw them under the bus the moment its convient for you. This virus isn't lethal to the overwhelming majority of humanity, I don't have three preexisting diseases nor am I over the age of sixty, so I don't think I'm going to be dropping dead any time soon (at least from this virus) so I'm sorry for disappointing you.

You just admitted your agenda is more important then the lives of every American, the 15 million people who are now jobless and unable to get work, rent money, and food but please keep telling me how your morally superior to me and every one else in the world.

[BlackWidow93]

I just dont care about what you're posting

[BlackWidow93]

Sorry I'll rephrase: I didn't care to provide you with an articulate response so I lumped it up into one stupid, simple statement.

[hellionthesagereborn]

Of course, because you can't rationalize your way around it so you dismiss it. You know everything your saying is bullshit so your just going to walk away when your called out on it. You have no response to the 15 million jobless people or the poor who are going to be hit hardest by shutting down the economy. Like I said, your privileged beyond compare and that's fine, but don't act like it makes you better then others.

[BlackWidow93]

Alright fine. You complain because you wanna go back to work? Well if you go back to work then your chances heighten of you getting it. Why is that? Because although you may be ok with avoiding people, the other people may not be. Then it becomes a chain reaction like the meat plant near here that had to be shut down cuz 1 person got it and they thought it wasn't a big deal.

As far as your assumption that I'm "privileged". I sure as hell am not. That so called stimulus check is just going to pay my hospital bills. My money will run out, my food will run out, I am dealing with DMV being assholes and LGH being assholes. I have to deal with so much stress per day and I dismiss baseless opinions such as your own because I have better things to do with my time than educate a moron on how people like you care more about yourself than the well being of anyone else.

Go suck a dick

[hellionthesagereborn]

My chances of getting it are almost non existent and its not lethal generally speaking for people under the age of sixty and for people who have less then 3 preexisting conditions and that's ignoring that we are only counting the smallest fraction of people who get it i. e. the worse cases. So going by those that have been counted as being the absolute worse case scenario (and ignoring the estimated five times greater number of people who are asymptomatic and/or have already recovered), that leaves me a.2% chance of running into a person with coronavirus, not contracting it just coming into contact with some one who has it. even multiplying that number to account for multiple POSSIBLE contacts, we get a pathetically small number of people.

But you know whats not highly improbable? Becoming homeless, starving and not being able to afford medical attention for actual issues (how many of those 15 million people who lost their jobs and income are diabetic? On heart medication or any other medication?). Not all of us are so cowardly as to need to imprison ourselves for something that is at worse case scenario no different then the flu. Some of us have responsibilities, families to take care of that depend on us (yeah, those 15 million people who are now jobless, that's not 15 million people affected that's 15 million FAMILIES that are affected. That's a substantially greater impact then what is happening with coronavirus)), bills to pay, and businesses to run (you think that all of these businesse are just on standby? Like they can survive with no money for months at a time? Small business are already shutting down for good, and all the jobs they provided are now gone when we need them most (because so many are now jobless)).

[hellionthesagereborn]

Of course your privileged, because your sitting here telling us we can afford to starve to death, you clearly have to be privileged because your so out of touch with reality. You can't demand that every one lose their job have no homes or food and not be privileged unless your insane.

As for your pathetic insult, is it suppose to offend me? So first you wished for the poor to suffer and die now you are hating on gay people? Whats wrong with being gay?

[Physics-Man]

@hellionthesagereborn

Right on my friend! Put some sense into her!

[Goma15]

Refreshing to read here. I also want to point out that the "save the economy vs. save lives" thing is a false dichotomy.

The economy will be negatively affected whether there is a lockdown or not. People will go out less because of this virus anyway. Which means a lot of businesses will have less revenue regardless. If the virus is allowed to spread too much people will start falling ill, preventing them from working. And if the virus were to spread enough it could literally kill hundreds of thousands of people. And that's a heavy hit for an economy anyway. And that's not even counting what would happen if the healthcare system is overrun. It would either mean another new shutdown or that people who don't have the virus would just start dying because there aren't enough doctors or beds. For those saying the lethality rate is super low, by the way. You don't know that. Nobody knows the exact lethality rates. And they tend to vary as well from country to country (probably based on amount of tests, affected groups, etc.). As of March 3 the estimated lethality rate was 3.4%. The typical seasonal flu has a lethality rate of less than 1% (as little as 0.1%) and mostly old people. Coronavirus affects all age groups, even if it affects old people more. Not to mention NOBODY IS IMMUNE and there is NO VACCINE! This means that every person in the world could theoretically get it. Know what 0.1% of the entire world is? It's a lot. 3.4% is even more. Talk about tanking the economy.

What I think is the most selfish though is people who are overly worried about not being able to go out and do fun things. Yes, it sucks that nobody can go out and do fun things with friends or whatnot (though you can still go on walks on your own and stuff so long as you stay away from people). I haven't seen my girlfriend in 2 months and I miss her. But this is a few months of your life of not being able to do that stuff. There will be many more months and years to go out and do fun things. But people who die due to this thing will not have more months and years to spend on anything. They'll just be dead. And going out isn't just risking your own life. It's not "I might get sick, but I'll brave it anyway." If you get sick you risk spreading it to everyone you come into contact with. Thereby not only making it so that we're stuck with it longer, doing more economic damage but also leading to further deaths. I don't know about anyone else, but I would be fine not going to the beach for a year if it would save only one life.

[Goma15]

A source I used for reference www.worldometers.info/.../

[Goma15]

When I said if it were allowed to spread more it could kill hundreds of thousands of people I meant in the United States. It has already killed about 200.000 people worldwide. But "only" about 50.000 in the U. S. so far.

[Intactivist500]

It is way more complicated then you realize. People want to go out of the house, so they can go to work. The government is only giving them a one time stimulus payment of 1200 dollars. That is not enough for anything. Plus, the mortgages, and other due payments were not put on hold. So in three months when everyone returns to work, they'll have to pay for three months worth of bills, and mortgages, plus the current month that they return to work. People are going to lose their houses if they don't get back to work soon. And the government is sitting on their asses and doing nothing to help the common people.

Plus, the doctors and medical community are supposed to be there for the people. They are there to help us, and they refuse to help anyone unless you have Covid-19 or in severe pain. I cannot even go to get a root canal right now. Even Dentists refuse to see me. The hospitals are literally turning people away, and people cannot even go to see their own doctors. So much for having great health insurance, or if you're one of the lucky individuals that has free healthcare because of your job, and don't have to worry about paying for health insurance. Speaking of which, you know what is going to happen when those people lose their jobs due to this Covid-19? They will lose their medical insurance. Businesses will eventually re-open yes, but not all will. Some will go bankrupt, and the individuals that had those jobs will be permanently out of work even when the economy re-opens.

This is not a Black or White situation. There are logical arguments from both sides, but you have to look at it from the protesters' point of view too. What if you were let go of your job, and you could not afford the bills, rent, or mortgages because the government is only giving you are one time 1200 dollar check that won't be able to take you far, and you still have a lot of bills to pay, and no money because you cannot go to work to make money?

https://www.youtube.com/embed/OycimGuHy9A

[Lliam]

Thank you for your awareness, Intactivist500.

[lightbulb27]

well said. this is the challenge we face, we need to manage the spread so doesn't overwhelm the system and postpone the spread until have better tools... but how do we do that for 12-18 months? A lot of businesses will be shuttered and only have so many trillions before the currency collapses... paying social benefits.

that's the tension. I have friends with businesses and they are looking at losing it all and who knows what else and their view is... let me work, staying away from others is a choice, manage it. e. g. they can do what they can to.

Seems like some things can be opened, some are not going to make it... anything that was social fun strikes me as not working anymore. Some businesses that were booming before may not be viable under old cost structures. The whole economic system was already bubbleicious and now it's been pin pricked...

Some things that may not come back in my view for a long time...
bars, stadium events,
restaurants... marginally... I don't see how they work on the old cost structure.

we need to spin up new economy so people work from home and socialize in other ways.

It's an issue of how do we manage this... I haven't heard a great ansewr yet, I don't know anyone has one. I think social payments are going to be part of our reality, however that is facilitated. and depression.

[BlackWidow93]

Thanks for responding. It was interesting reading this. It sucks that the people who are taking this virus seriously and are acting responsibly are being overlooked because of the people at rallies and such who are not.

I definitely agree though with the work at home thing. I wish my job would let us work at home permanently if we choose.

[lightbulb27]

yes, I was noting to someone else... the media always puts a lense on the annoying loud ones. Whatever sells, whatever looks out of whack... they show that and amplify it. The majority are well behaved an in line... but there are a lot of people itching to get back to $... not so sure that is reality. Be careful of the media, it is an amplifier.

I've seen both "left and right" supporting those events, it isn't just the right. They look nuts, some of them are and we had one in my state die from covid... who was complaining about stay at home. But they have a legitimate issue. They own a business and don't know how to make ends meet, or they live paycheck to paycheck. no food on table, no meds, risk of eviction, etc... trouble! The other issue is social such as people who work with addicts, feel restricted and are losing people by way of distancing. In effect, it's asking them to sacrifice people they love (addicts they care for, women pulled off the streets) for someone they don't know. It doesn't equate in their minds.

There has to be a balance. "May we live in interesting times". chinese proverb.

I face this whole challenge myself. I can work, but should I? The more I do the more I put myself and someone fragile at risk. I'm more in favor of going dormant like a plant... wind the whole economy down to a degree to low level, low cost, low burn rate... ramp back up when ready. That is an extreme answer... not sure we are ready for that as it be a depression.

if we could ramp up more "at" home jobs, that be good. put your thinking cap on... or maybe you are a nurse/med and it isn't necessary. REalize though... a lot of hospitals are not in a good place. $ comes from societies output... that output isn't there, the $ making treatments aren't happening. The whole system has to shift. Hospitals may need a bailout from what I've surmised.

[BlackWidow93]

Who were you noting to? You can always @ them. But I do agree. We should have more at home jobs. This is terrible for people with mental health issues. Meds are expensive

[lightbulb27]

It was a family member in person not on GAG.

[BlackWidow93]

Ahh ok

[Anonymous]

You completely fail to understand the impact of the economic shutdown on middle-class America. That’s unfortunate because so many people are suffering and will continue to suffer. And these effects are not temporary as you suggest; many jobs that are lost today (30 million thus far) will never come back. Food banks are already short on supplies and this condition will only get worse. There will be hunger and homelessness, and to ignore that is either callous or naive.

You talk about flattening the curve. The purpose of flattening the curve was to prevent the health care system from being overwhelmed by Covid-19 patients. That was more than accomplished. Even in New York, the system accommodated every patient, and no patient needing a ventilator went without one. Also, flattening the curve does NOT reduce the space beneath the curve. That is, the expected number of deaths is the same; they are simply spread over a longer time period. And the millions of deaths predicted to occur in the U. S. from Covid-19? Estimates now put the total at about 60,000... about the same as the seasonal flu.

Covid-19 is most deadly to people who have pre-existing health conditions, especially older people. That population can be easily identified and isolated without impacting the broader (entire) population. Remember, most people who go to an ER and test positive for Covid-19 ARE SENT HOME to recover. In fact, the survival rate from the virus is now estimated to be 99.5%. That’s not as high as the seasonal flu, but it does demonstrate that if you are otherwise healthy, you are highly unlikely to die from this disease.

A broad stay-at-home policy also ignores the benefits of, and destroys the opportunity for, herd immunity. Sweden’s policy of NOT shutting down its economy has not only produced death rates at or below other European countries, but they are now unlikely to have a “second wave” because of herd immunity. That is, less people will die overall.

Public policy decisions always require multiple inputs. That is, there are always trade-offs to consider. Covid deaths will never be pushed to zero and that’s something we must accept as a society (for the greater good). Deaths from the flu, tuberculosis, AIDS, and many other diseases/viruses are also not at zero, and yet as a society we’ve come to accept that. There is nothing radical about accepting it with respect to Covid-19. Good public policy requires it. We could reduce highway speeds from 55 mph (or even 70-75 mph in some states) to 35 mph and save thousands of lives. We don’t because it’s not good public policy.

Continued...

[Opinion Owner]

We have indeed had a crisis in the U. S. and around the world. Emergency action was necessary and warranted to reinforce our health care system... flatten the curve. Mission accomplished. It is now time to address our Constitutional rights, specifically the Bill of Rights. Those rights include freedoms of speech, religion, and assembly. Also, the government cannot seize your property (including you business or your job) without just compensation. These rights were inserted into our Constitution not for common times, but for the uncommon ones. The times when such rights could be threatened. Like now. The governments of many states revoked the rights of their citizens, even threatening to enter citizen’s homes to cite and arrest those in non-compliance. In other words, the freedom of Americans has been taken away. On our own soil. By our own government. All without giving heed to the basic facts stated above.

How long will this continue? How long should it continue? Another month? Six months? A year? Or should we wait for the promised vaccine in 12-18 months? What if there never IS a safe effective vaccine? (There is no vaccine for AIDS or the common cold, which is also a Coronavirus.) Yes, you can say “wait,” but what happens when millions of American lives are destroyed, the economy collapses, people die from lack of care for their unaddressed medical conditions, hunger and homelessness become rampant, and violence follows? Think it can’t happen? Try Venezuela.

Think the government should simply pay people to stay home? What do you think happens to all that debt the government issues? Who will buy it? Who will pay for it? The government cannot give money away without first borrowing it or taking it away from someone else. Heavy taxation will just further crush the economy.

Continued...

[Opinion Owner]

You say this shouldn’t be political, but your myTake is politics in its purest form, since it encourages government to take away the freedoms of its people. Also, the longer these freedoms are seized, the longer the people must rely on government to survive. Then people essentially work for the government and the government controls the means of production. Sound familiar? Yep, it’s socialism, pure and simple.

Your myTake is a nice endorsement of socialism. Give up your freedom; the state will take care of you. After all, we must be humanitarian, right? And there’s this virus. It’s a great narrative, but heartless and deceitful to those of us who are now feeling the real pain.

[chris0977]

Because "experts" said millions would be dead by now. World death count stands at around 170,000. Were this the death count for less than the population of the United States (say 300,000,000) would be 0.0005%, except this isn't the US population, but out of over 7,000,000,000.

Further, doctors speak on medical diagnostic codes being combined in the death count for co-morbid patients, meaning if someone dies of heart failure but has CV-like symptoms, this counts as a CV death.

When I ask many what they did to analyze, or give context (individual thought) to information presented, many can only repeat, like robots, whatever the news put in their head, and say things like:

"I wear a face mask because I still don't want to get it."

By this logic, because of all the forms of flu, and other contagious disease, everyone should wear masks their whole lives, because many other diseases, statistically, they have a far greater statistical chance of getting, including many cancers.

The public emotionally reacts to whatever the news chooses to present, then forgets about their outrage a week later as the news focuses on some new shiny object, which the public collectively outrage to that, as if no other issues exist.

I've presented a few analytical considerations regarding context (i. e. reflected on information presented to reach individual conclusions).

You've presented a narrative built on causal reasoning without any supporting analysis, only emotional appeals as justification (selfishness, etc.) as the sole basis for why someone should agree with you.

I'd be very interested to hear your factual support behind this judgement, conclusion, reaction.

[Iamagoodguy]

I'm pretty sure they said could be dead you know if we didn't go into full lockdown everywhere basically. Which we did.

[chris0977]

@Iamagoodguy I live in Massachusetts. No stay-at-home orders or mandated restriction on groups, ever. Despite this, I'm lucky to find someone who can say they know someone who's been hospitalized, even tested positive, meanwhile New York, which went into full lockdown, along with New Jersey, supposedly has more cases than us.

"recent CDC projection estimated that the U. S. coronavirus epidemic could infect between 160 million and 214 million people"... by this logic the most infected states should not be some of the most lockeddown, while a state with no lockdown is beneath both, since core to preventing spread is social distance.

[chris0977]

Didn't phrase that well. The 1st and 2nd states in full lockdown are New Jerssey, while Massachusetts, a state without any lockdown, or gathering restriction, is 3rd, assuming social distancing is critical to preventing spread.

[chris0977]

As with others, would love to hear critical thought/analysis to form individual conclusions, based in reasoning, which may or may not agree with mine, but doesn't directly, often blindly, only parrot whatever the media presents.

[888theGreat]

I think it is a superficial crisis to Hurt Trump on the Economy , which was Trump's strength. I know liberals and nothing is beyond them. No ethics or standards. Lying is fine if it gets the results. They told us 1 million of us would die, wrong. They have told us we would die from Global Warming and US would be 50% under water by now, wrong. That when Saddam burned the oil wells in Kuwait, it would block the sun and there would no food , wrong. They continue to manufacture crisis (for ratings) and tell us we are all going to die, wrong again. Now , if you can shut world economy , hold all citizens under house arrest over a nasty cold , you can unleash martial law with the drop of a hat. The total dead here is a measly 36,000 , more died from normal flu, more die everyday for other causes. 7,425 people die each day in US , that means in 5 normal days we lose more than Chi Com 19 has killed. I also don't think that 2% of the population should hold the other 98% of the population. You are born and die, that is the way it is. Also most of the high risk people put themselves in that situation. Did you smoke, did you catch HIV from butt sex? Sorry , but it is true.

[zagor]

Yeah, you sound like a Trump supporter. The Prez who initially told us this was no worse than the flu.

So somehow the "liberals" concocted this, and then got the rest of the world to go along with it, just to prevent Trump's re-election?

[888theGreat]

@zagor Media led cry economy must be shut down or everyone will die

[zagor]

Yeah I'm sure the Chinese media caused their shutdown.

[888theGreat]

@zagor no they threw out all media and then took what little rights their people had away and the liberals in US would like our system to be like that from now on

[zagor]

Wait, you just said this was caused by the media. Now you are saying the liberals want to muzzle the media? Make up your mind, man.

[888theGreat]

@zagor Let me explain it slowly for you. The US media are Socialists , they would like to undermine everything the constitution stands for. They like the Chinese model of governing over people. No individualism , everybody dresses the same , no rights, same pay. China threw out the foreign media so they could not report on what was really going on in China, this kept the virus secret longer and allowed China to destroy the million or so bodies of dead people. The media in US are stupid idiots and don't realize that their freedoms will be taken too by a Chinese style government here in US. This is why they always support dictators in other countries. This is also why the Media gives away troop positions to our enemies.

[888theGreat]

@zagor It is not worse than flu , the regular flu will kill more than this virus 19

[zagor]

JUST NOT TRUE. This has killed more twice as many in three months as die in a bad flu year. And is MUCH more contagious.

[zagor]

Leaving out the stats for a moment, two people I kind of know (OK, people my parents knew) have died of it this year. And at least two semi-celebs. How many people do I know in either category who have died of the flu in the last TEN years? 0.

[betaTester]

I think it is okay to go outdoor, just don't go near other people.

The problem is when most people go out they don't just "go out", they actually go to some other destinations, either indoor places or places with other people, like going with friends to some pubs or parties. Someone who protests the lockdown might say "b-but I go out and keep my distance", the thing is he doesn't see the big picture, millions of other party goers are beyond his control, and he doesn't see the conspiracy theorists who believe the virus is a hoax standing right next to him, in fact he doesn't realize most people around him in the rally are the type who believe 9/11 is fake or that you can recover from AIDS by taking vitamins.

If people are smart, the government wouldn't really have to tell them to stay at home or stop going to concerts or stop going to the beach parties etc. The problem is many people are not smart, and the government has to take care of stupid people too, not like we can just ship them off to an other planet, so they had to resort to draconian counter measure. If your population is smart you can just let people go out they will know to keep their itinerary to minimal, then you can do contact tracing on infected individuals.

[AllThatSweetJazz]

"saying they deserve to go back to work, you are being completely selfish"
They NEED to get back to work, for EVERYONE'S sake. You're not going to have a country to get back to if you just sit inside. Millions more every week are becoming unemployed, crude oil just went negative -- companies have to pay to get rid of their oil. What's this all going to look like if you get to something like 50% unemployment?
Meanwhile there's speculation that China is gearing up for war. The virus is bad, but that doesn't mean that it's the only bad thing out there. You flattened the curve, good job, but you can't just flatten the curve forever, there's a cost to it. At some point the risks of staying inside outweigh going outside -- and it's coming FAST. Normally there's something like 150 people in the US that are said to die from poverty each year. What happens if this economic damage continues, people are running out of food and social order breaks down?

You say "The stay at home order is not about politics or any superficial means." Okay well, neither are the get back to work protests. There's a political justification in that the US government should have the authority to tell people they have to stay inside, but that justification is to serve the underlying reason people want to get back to work: because they are going to lose everything if they don't. We're all interconnected, so dismissing it as selfish is nonsense.

How about I call the people telling everyone to stay inside selfish for wanting to let the world starve and collapse because it's not afflicting them that badly for the minute?

[BlackWidow93]

you're thinking of the economy of thinking of the amount of human lives we'll lose if this virus gets out of control. No people = no economy = no government

[AllThatSweetJazz]

I'm thinking of the people.
"No people = no economy = no government"
Correct. If you say inside and do nothing and people don't have access to the economy, people won't get food. It's ignorant to just look at the easy obvious answer that "the virus is dangerous so stay away from it". Yeah, obviously. But you're ignoring the "if no one works then there's no food" part and the "with no economy, the country is vulnerable to attack" part. Yes, it's an equation and so you should be trying to balance it.

Why don't we shutdown for the flu indefinitely? Because we deem the 500,000 people that die from it every year to be acceptable losses. The benefits of working help people more (in other words keep more people alive) than hiding from the regular flu.

It's so ironic that it's the people who are calling the people who want to work ignorant, when really it's the people telling everyone to only fixate on the virus that aren't seeing the big picture.

So don't tell me I'm not thinking about human lives. I was telling people the virus was going to get bad back in January and I still think it's dangerous, but there are new complications. I'm thinking about the cost of human lives if *everything falls apart*. Yes, people will die to the virus. But the risk of losing *even more* lives is eventually greater if you stay inside. Can you grok that?
At some point it is *more dangerous to hide* from the virus.

The economy is how people get food, medicine and all the other goods and services *that they need to live*. Maybe it's time to wake up and realise that the economy isn't just money, it's the system that we use to sustain ourselves and whaddaya know that's actually kind of important too.

[BlackWidow93]

No actually I'm not. That's why we have essential workers staying open. Its moreover that people can't afford food and such. There are tons of farms right now wasting crops because they can't transport them before spoil.

Dont duck your head in the sand

[AllThatSweetJazz]

You just sound like you're agreeing with me. So who's head is in the sand?

"Essential" doesn't mean you have a fully functioning economy that can provide for everyone.

And yes, farmers are tossing food back in the ground, dairy farmers are dumping millions of liters of milk, food banks are running dry as huge numbers of people overwhelm them. That's exactly the kinds of problems I'm talking about. That's the stuff that happens when people don't have access to the economy.

What I think will really happen is people will eventually say fuck it and open up their stores and everything in defiance of the state governments, and the government won't be able to do anything about it. That'll get things going.

[BlackWidow93]

And then they'll get fined and the state will get more money. I dont agree in the way that you're going about things.

[AllThatSweetJazz]

They're not going to be able to fine hundreds of thousands of people.
But also, no one would pay it anyway.
And furthermore, many want to go out and work *because they couldn't pay a fine if they were even willing to*. There's no point in fining people who have no money and who don't believe in the legitimacy of the order. The cops will try to fine someone and people will say 'no, fuck you' and all the people will take the worker's side because they want to work too.

[Steve37]

The problem is that the corona virus isn't the only thing we are fighting against. People are losing jobs and are unable to pay mortgages and put food on the table. The longer we stay licked in our homes, the more businesses will fail which means those jobs are lost permanently. For a large majority of our population, financial ruin poses a greater risk than the virus. You can call those people selfish if you want, but how is that any more selfish than those expecting the entire population to self quarantine to reduce their risk?

[BlackWidow93]

It all boils down to whether you care about others more than yourself.

Businesses will fail. We'll rebuild them. As far as people needing money to eat, I don't know the solution, other than food drives and such. That's a question for the higher up

[Steve37]

Caring for others more than yourself works both ways. I'd gladly expose myself to greater risk which I can manage myself if it meant a handful of people could start earning an income again to care for their families.

[BlackWidow93]

Not everyone can do that

[BlackWidow93]

I. e. people with respiratory issues or pre existing conditions

[BlackWidow93]

I feel like that would be a choice individual people would have to make but it's the government so idfk what they're gonna end up doing next

[Steve37]

My point exactly. Let each individual manage their own risk instead of mandating everyone take the same action by government order. It would be wise for those with other health conditions or other risk factors to perhaps remain quarantined, but for the large majority, reducing physical contact with others along with increased hand washing and avoiding touching one's face are all the precautions required.

[BlackWidow93]

That would be great except for the big corporations not letting people have their own say. Like I have a pre-existing condition, I'm at high risk and they still wouldn't let me work from home until wolf shut us down.

[Steve37]

I think that's where government's place is in all of this. They should establish reasonable rules for what warrants staying home and provide protections for both workers and businesses to cushion the losses for each.

[BlackWidow93]

Exactly!!! It's the big corporations that need to be put in place

[Steve37]

Big corporations aren't the enemy, they are vital in the recovery from all of this. They are responsible to shareholders who shouldn't be forced to bear the financial burden either. Both sides near to share in the pain here, businesses and workers.

[BlackWidow93]

They aren't the enemy but they need to be put in place. We should be equal

[Steve37]

That's a philosophical discussion but I understand your point. My view is that corporations shouldn't bear the entire burden here but shouldn't get off scott free either. Many corporations are doing what they can to assist their employees, many are not. I'd like to see banks give relief on mortgage payments by allowing people to skip payments temporarily and add those payments onto the back end of their loans. Banks could allow interest to accrue but bumping those payments would provide tremendous relief to people right now.

[BlackWidow93]

Definitely

[888theGreat]

It all comes down to you dying from starvation or getting a virus that only kills 2% of old , unhealthy , and people with HIV.

[BlackWidow93]

@888theGreat you do know that young and healthy people have died from this virus right?

[888theGreat]

How many? No, if so they had a disease already , cancer, or something else.

[BlackWidow93]

Ok then.

[Kiran_Yagami]

A recently posted study by the University of Southern California and the Los Angeles County Department of Public Health shows that nearly 4.1% of Americans have covid-19 antibodies in their blood and that anywhere from 200,000 - 400,000 people in LA county alone have already had and recovered from Covid-19. That means the mortality rate is less than a tenth of what everyone is claiming it to be. Less than 1%, and most people who get it never know they've had it or even get sick. Social distancing is about CONTROL. In all likelihood, we will all get Covid-19 and never even notice and social distance hasn't done a damn thing to stop it.

[BlackWidow93]

1. Where are the other studies? Are you doing a comparison for every state? Where are your sources for the general consensus of each state? 2. You aren't very concrete for presenting one case of data. Maybe another states study will contradict with LA. Maybe they made a flaw. Who knows because you didn't include any of them. 3. Yes social distancing is control. It takes self control in order to control staying inside or going out. Yes the government is trying to control us going out to control the spread of the virus. 4. Yes everyone will probably get it at some point but this "control" is segmenting the virus therefore allowing us to "control" the virus 5. I bet you any amount of money that if we werent social distancing, then the amount of cases would be uncontained. Social distancing allows us to contain it.

[Kiran_Yagami]

Both Stanford and UCLA conducted their own studies and came to the same conclusion. Social distancing is about control. We don't need drones monitoring people remotely for social distancing. We don't need to arrest fathers in the park playing with their kids while there isn't another soul in sight for social distancing, or to arrest people alone on their boats in the middle of the ocean to maintain social distancing. Nor do we need conduct police raids at drive in churches where everyone stays in their cars to maintain social distancing. Stop being so naive.

[AllThatSweetJazz]

It still means it's dangerous, just for different reasons. People should be looking to get back to work either way. But even if the mortality is equal to the seasonal flu, it doesn't really change the risk assessment since it would mean the infection rate is *way* higher that the flu and so even with the same mortality we would still expect to see similar numbers of deaths. The benefit of lower mortality and higher infection rate is that the ceiling for how many people it could negatively effect is lower, but in the short and medium term we can still see loads people die. (This is all assuming you can't get re-infected and that it doesn't go dormant and then come back).

[BlackWidow93]

@AllThatSweetJazz 👏👏👏 you get me point

[Johnson7319]

This was a live action drill you sheepeople.. physiological experiment that's unprecedented.. the fuxking presidents telling people to shoot laundry soap or sumahit.. I live between two of thwargeat military bases in the WOELD and military activity has done nothing but escalates instead of being nuetral as in no live action drills over the gulf of Mexico (live bomb drills?) Noisy.. the American gun owners are the biggest military on the planet. They thought they were gonna have problems with us and we've rolled over like bitch dogs and said ok as long as we're off work n still draw a check.. this was a voup against our economy and our social lifestyle and they've won we won't go back to how it was.. ever.. ok let the fucktards loose n I'll field questions

[Sensmind]

What has happened although many people have died, is that we were too successful, in Ireland the worst case scenario was 20,000 deaths but I think we are roughly about 500 now just past peak we think. We have a reproduction rate of under 1 (one person infected infects another down from 15 at the start)
So all the people economically affected are straining at the leash "Its over let us back to work" and they are being temporarily held at bay by warnings of a second surge and need for testing and contract tracing before large scale relaxation of restrictions. We are in near lockdown for 3 weeks, schools closed for 5 and another 2 weeks to next checkpoint (6th May), I think it will be hard for government to hold the line, with public opinion and of course cost to state. They reckon 25% of the population is receiving some kind of State Covid support (in context that would be 80 million in the USA).

[Apope16]

The states with the lowest death rates are the ones that never locked down.

[BlackWidow93]

That's good

[Apope16]

Very good. I think we should be questioning whether the lockdowns are saving lives or wether flattening the curves would have taken 2 months regardless of what we do.

[BlackWidow93]

I dont think we should. Really it's not up to people like me or you. It's up to each state regardless of what anyone thinks. Each state has their own problems.

[Apope16]

yeah. thats a fair point... except... in my state they are treating us like we are NYC. we are not. we flattened the curve long ago and its getting cray cray

[gotc147]

Jesus I don't even know how to start this...

"Social distancing" (a cute little buzz term, thought up by marketing people) is not and has not been working. The outbreak happened in November, so December, January and February we weren't doing any "social distancing" and the virus was being spread completely uninhibited. Hospitals were not overwhelmed, people weren't dying by the truckload and we didn't even hear any stories about how there has been a spike in deaths from the flu or pneumonia. This means the virus isn't a big deal, going about our daily lives has not lead to what the "experts" have said it would lead to.

Stay home if that makes you feel better, but you do not have the right to put everyone else under house arrest because you're afraid of your own shadow.

[1truekhaleesi]

So when you get sick do you want to be intubated or nah?

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi Good god no, what kind of idiotic question is that? Over 99% of cases have no symptoms or symptoms so mild that the treatment is go home and ride it out. Almost nobody who gets it needs to be hospitalized, let alone intubated.

You think this virus is a death sentence don't you?

[1truekhaleesi]

We don't know how this virus operates. I've had healthy patients drop dead from it. I've had old, immunocompromised patients fully recover and get discharged. You're more than welcome to go out and get sick. You're what my coworkers and I call, "job security." The issue is when you get others sick.

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi We very much know how this virus operates, it's just the majority of people, such as yourself, are too stupid to see it.

[1truekhaleesi]

Wow really? Where'd you get your degree in virology?

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi Get with the times, this is the information age.

We spent December, January and February doing absolutely nothing to stop or slow the spread of this virus. Hospitals were not overwhelmed, people were not dying by the truckload and everybody was still going to bars and restaurants.

It's not a big deal, people with agendas just want everyone to think it is.

[BlackWidow93]

@1truekhaleesi Thank you for educate him

[1truekhaleesi]

This is a new disease and it hadn't spread to America at that point. You still haven't told me where you got your virology degree.

[1truekhaleesi]

To OP: Lol. I try. I work in healthcare and this guy has no idea the amount of patience I have on account of how much bullshit I have to put up with at work.

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi Oh, are you ones of those clowns who thinks nobody in America had it before the first confirmed case?

[1truekhaleesi]

Over 80% of people are asymptomatic, which is the problem. I guess if you don't get sick, it's not an issue right?

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi Exactly my point, which means it's been floating around the US since December, shortly after the outbreak.

So again, all winter with no overwhelmed hospitals, no truckloads of bodies, no stories about people dying by the thousands from pneumonia or the flu or some mystery illness.

If this virus were even close to as deadly as people like you seem to think, we would have noticed long before mid March.

[1truekhaleesi]

Try telling that to a family who lost a loved one. Like I said it's not an issue if you're not sick right?

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi Appeal to emotion fallacy.

Diseases are part of life, people die from them, it's tragic but it's life. You think I haven't lost people I love to illnesses? Wake up and smell the coffee.

[1truekhaleesi]

You're welcome to put your life on the line. Doesn't mean others have to. After 9/11, just short of 3,000 people died, we went to war, trillions of dollars spent, and we surrendered our freedom and privacy forever. 41,000 people have died and you can't stay inside? Seriously? You're acting like a teenage girl trying to sneak out of her bedroom window. If we had ten 9/11 days, we wouldn't come close to the number of deaths of covid-19.

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi Pushback has been growing over the infringements of our rights post 9/11. Well, in the US there has been, you Europeans, especially Brits just keep asking for that boot to be pushed into your neck harder.

Nobody is risking their life anymore today than they did February 1st, December 1st or August 1st. We lose 40,000 or more every flu season, another 35,000 to car accidents, 30,000 to suicide, half a million to medical malpractice, millions to cancer... And you want all of us to get our panties in a wad over a 12 ounce can being dumped into a 50 gallon drum.

Live in fear, it's what you pussywhipped Brits are best at.

[1truekhaleesi]

I live in America. Again, you're more than welcome to get sick. Even if you don't get intubated, coronavirus will make you wish for death. You can still get others sick Typhoid Mary.

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi Sorry, got you confused with someone else.

My, along with everybody else's chances of getting sick beyond moderate symptoms is in the thousandths of a percentage point. You're allowing your perception as a healthcare worker dictate your view of reality, like an airline pilot who thinks "everybody" is flying around when in reality only about 5% of the world population has ever been on an airplane.

[1truekhaleesi]

Once again, where did you get your virology degree? I know multiple people with virology degree that aren't from Google who disagree

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi All of whom are doing the same thing you are, letting their perception dictate their beliefs about reality. Perception is often warped.

Ask your virology degree friends why there was no jump in deaths over the winter if this thing is so deadly.

[1truekhaleesi]

Diseases aren't an instant thing. It had to spread first. Oh god such a hard decision. On one hand, I have an expert in this field who has a Phd in this and on the other I have a conspiracy theorist who doesn't even have a degree in this. Who to believe. God this is so hard.

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi It takes 4 months to start killing people? Then why was it nearly instant in Wuhan? I thought this thing was super contagious? One person ends up infecting 59,000? 2 weeks or so from infection to symptoms and it can be passed on in that first two weeks?

The math isn't that hard, over the course of four months you should have millions of people infected, so where are all the bodies if it's such a killer? We should be around a million people dead by now, so where are the other 800,000+ bodies?

[1truekhaleesi]

Huge population density, poor sanitation?

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi Plenty of places that are densely populated. You'll have to define "poor sanitation" because from what I understand, unless you're wiping down every surface after every person touches it you're not being clean enough.

Seriously, you've got to come up with something WAY better to explain this 4 month gap from outbreak to suddenly only now it's spreading to a point where we need to not interact with each other or the hospitals will get overwhelmed.

[1truekhaleesi]

I'm done explaining. At this point, you're being willfully ignorant. You really would rather reopen the country and kill millions instead of just like... demanding a debt/rent freeze and temporary UBI till we're in the clear?

You simpin' so hard for capitalism you're protesting to let your nana, peepaw, and all your compromised friends die so you can return to your shitty middle management corporate job like some beta cuck for the oligarchs.

Little dick energy.

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi Translation: "I can't answer your question and because I can't it shows that you, at a minimum, have a point. So instead I'm going to make it seem like I already gave you an answer, call you a few names and ghost".

[1truekhaleesi]

Or you just don't know how to use Google. Little dick energy.

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi Google just shows me a growing number of studies showing that what I'm saying is correct.

[1truekhaleesi]

Whatever little dick.

[user0000047]

@1truekhaleesi So we should shut down the entire economy because one person died? This is so fucking ridiculous. Its 9/11 all over again. They're going to strip you of so much freedom during this crisis in the name of safety.

If one person died in a car crash would you suggest a complete ban on all motor vehicles? Where is the quarantine orders during the regular flue season that also kills thousands a year? After all the death of one person matter more than freedom and well being of millions.

You are a fascist.

[user0000047]

@1truekhaleesi 9/11 was another exaggerated event that politicians quickly capitalized on to reduce the freedom individuals had in America. More people die in car accidents in America than 9/11. Again, that doesn't mean we should ban all motor vehicles from the American public. Freedom is more important than safety. Give me freedom or give me death. You fascists are never going to take away this fundamental American spirit no matter how much you try.

[1truekhaleesi]

@user0000047 I don't even know where to start with you. Tootles.

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi Meaning he's right about you and you don't know how to respond.

[1truekhaleesi]

Or he can barely form a readable sentence. I almost had a stroke reading that

[gotc147]

@1truekhaleesi Could be, but isn't.

[BlackWidow93]

@1truekhaleesi some people are just too far gone to fix. I commend your efforts but nothing will make them see the light.

[BlackWidow93]

@1truekhaleesi replying just gives them gratification

[gotc147]

You mean this light? www.bing.com/.../...-story.html%3foutputType%3damp

[1truekhaleesi]

OP, thanks. I tried lol.

[BlackWidow93]

You're welcome😄 I know they keep coming back but like cockroaches it just takes awhile😂😂😂

[Anonymous]

Good mytake. Also with the police so busy the Pakistani

rape gangs are taking advantage of the situation to rape young white girls, another reason to stay at home.

[Anonymous]

It is though, people are just gullible as fuck and think that those in power have their best interests in mind, not seeing how this is going to be used as an easy excuse to take away the people's freedoms. In fact they don't even need an excuse, the people are stupid enough to beg for it too.

[BlackWidow93]

No the people aren't too stupid to beg for it. It literally is mindboggling how you can see the logic, look at the hospitals and still be this disillusioned.

[Opinion Owner]

There are countries without an enforced lockdown like Sweden and Japan that are doing just fine, better than the US actually.

I'm also not saying that the virus isn't bad, that it doesn't exist, or anything stupid like that. I know nurses dealing with covid patients.

However, you mention hospitals - it depends on what you mean by that. Are you talking about the things you see and hear in the news? Because they're going to push a certain narrative anyway, and that's where people are gullible. And anybody who questions the official narrative is automatically assumed to be an idiot - that's precisely why people are so easy to fool.

Many hospitals aren't over-crowded at all. The opposite in fact. Some nurses are actually out of work. That won't be reported in the news because it doesn't fit the narrative.

There are also some strange goings on outside these hospitals. I can't link of I'd show you the videos. Groups of nurses without PPE, in their scrubs, dancing in the street, some even with these big choreographed dance routines, laughing and joking. How do they have time to do all of that? Why are they not following social distancing rules, the rules that have us all locked in our homes? That doesn't make sense.

And then, you probably don't see what's coming next. More surveillance, more tracking, less privacy. We're all being told to use banks cards rather than cash, why? Because we're about to go cashless. Some are talking about mandatory vaccinations. Microchips even. That's what people are begging for, not realising how it can and probably will be used against them. "Just do as you're told" you might say - exactly. That's what this is about.

[BlackWidow93]

No I 100% understand the news is geared towards viewers and yeah some nurses are out of work but like in NY, bodies were stacking up. We dont want that happening in other states.

"Just do as you're told" is kinda the summary of this but in PA it's not all like that. We should've nipped the virus in the bud when it first got here and there wouldn't be any of this.

[MalcolmNZ]

We down to only a couple of cases a day in New Zealand because we adopted a lock-down quickly, I got a police warning for hiking out of my local area. We were allowed out of our houses for solitary exercise, and to go to the supermarket while maintaining a 2m distance between people. That was pretty much all that was allowed.

[Teyfet]

Thank you! I was going to post something similar. Self-quarantine is about protecting our first responders, our healthcare workers, the people we most depend upon to save lives & help us. Hospitals should have the right to reject Anyone who does not comply, because they chose to endanger themselves & others - in assuming those risks, they should also be forced to accept the consequences.