This is actually a big myth and a misunderstanding. We are VERY far away from being able to create "designer babies". I know this because I'm well-informed on the issue for personal reasons. My wife and I want to do a PID to have children. Until recently, this was still illegal in my country (in most other countries, it has been legal for a while now).
When you actually ask a doctor/researcher who works in reproduction medicine, which I have done during one of our consultations (we are still in the very beginning of the process), he will tell you that "designer babies" aren't something anyone has to be worried about. While scientists do know the human genome, it is far from clear which genes affect which traits. At the moment, we're basically blindly hitting keys on a keyboard - except that this keyboard has roughly 30,000 different keys. Moreover, complex traits, such as intelligence, are often a product of many different genes playing together in a perfect orchestra. At the current time, we are not even remotely close to understand these processes, let alone being able to artificially manipulate or reproduce them in a Petri dish. From what I know about medical technology today, I am pretty sure it's going to take AT LEAST 200 more years until we get close to pulling this thing off.
Many people wrongly imagine PID to be something like creating a designer baby but it's in fact much more basic. And it has the direct purpose of avoiding severe disabilities in the child (it's not creating your dream child). Even if the whole procedure (which is very long, exhausting and expensive) will be successful, all my wife and I can be sure is that our child won't have my particular genetic disability. Apart from that, it is just a normal kid. It might still struggle from a bad asthma or get cancer at age 10. It is in no way invulnerable, nor will it have "an edge" over other children/people.
u We may soon know enough technology to enable us to accomplish this but that does not mean that we will do so wisely. Should we eliminate shortness and have all humans over 6 feet tall? What is being short has an advantage for survival at some point in the future? Should we eliminate color blindness. Maybe that has some advantage for survival.
And what will happen to high school when EVERYONE is beautiful enough to be in the In Crowd? :)
Excellent questions. Shortness seems to be linked to diet growing up if you look at the general difference between rural chineese people in china eating a diet of fish and rice mostly and American chineese.
Most people will assume that colorblindness is an undesirable trait that should be eliminated but it actually makes people better hunters. At the present, that may be an insignificant factor, but we don't know what this world will be like in 100 or 500 years.
As the developing of science and technical i find it awesome, though not really intelligent.
I see it from an ecological (Ecology-science, not the movement) perspective: we create a disequilibrium if we choose the genes, because we still don't have enough information of how to create a bunch of perfect beings with perfect characteristics to live in our competitive environment without it being chaotic (diversity of genes is something really important in populations and communities, since all beings have for example more capacity to overcome certain illness- and what would happen if everyone had all the "good" genes? No one would die, and that's bad for all natural equilibrium on Earth
And from a more philosophical/ethical perspective: i think it's a way of refusing the liberty of he who will be my child, also it's a way of conditioning my appreciation towards him/her
It's already becoming a reality but i do disagree with it. We aren't meant to mess with these things. I believe in letting things occur naturally.
www.theguardian.com/.../designer-baby-pgd-would-you-edit-your-unborn-child-genes-more-successful
The other side of the argument is that for the last maybe 100 or so years we haven't been letting things naturally. Medicine and technology has been used to compensate most genetic weaknesses and those genes are passed on. We've essentially eliminated natural selection and evolution.
That is true, we've kind of already overstepped the let things happen naturally and I think we're just gonna keep on doing so. I've already seen that they are thinking of genetically modifying horses for sport, a lot of people are against it though but technically we've been selecting horses of our choice instead of using natural selection. It just takes longer to get to what we want.
This is true. They've done it with cows too, like a cow isn't supposed to produce so much milk she can barley walk
it's really horrible in my opinion and inhumanely
Radiation is natural. Atomic bombs are not.
True, I wasn't thinking about the sun.
There's radiation in the earth too. Uranium and radon etc
The thing is, even though that radiation is natural, it does not mean that it actually has a negative effect on the Earth or it's beings. Anything that isn't created naturally and is instead man made is unnatural in my opinion. I agree with Asthen. Perhaps one should ask a question, is this morally right? Should i create something that would never occur in nature?
@Ahsthen Yeah I heard they've been cloning polo horses for years now. But you see like that's wrong in my opinion, no wonder he's the best. cause he's been using the same horse, technically speaking, for years now, when it should be dead and he should be looking for a new talented horse. In a way it's cheating. It's like cloning the best race horse to ever live and keep racing his clones so you can keep winning money.
I think it's GREAT! *in theory* In reality, it would be abused very quickly and very often. Rather than improving and saving the world, it would be used to create super soldiers, master races, and all sorts of naughty things.
The super soldier thing is very likely
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32Opinion
Don't really know. I need to hear more discussion on the topic.
Interesting technology that allows genetic engineering, hopefully it won’t be misused.
In China and India they have been eliminating female babies for decades: the gendercide: www.economist.com/.../21714981-how-one-worlds-great-social-problems-solving-itself-war-baby-girls-winds
https://www.economist.com/node/15606229
In some regions young guys can't find girls to marry.
Isn't that more like eugenics and well... abortion. I mean like actually choosing the sex of your child not erasing it.
Not only abortion. A hole in the ground for newborn babies without a dick.
It's going to take a long time and a lot of horrific human sacrifice before hey can actually do what they claim they'll be able to do.
There's going to be a LOT of designer babies who have massive and debilitating "side effects" from their genetic tampering. Oh, you want your baby to grow up to be tall? Maybe he'll have adult onset schizophrenia too, whoops! You want a baby with a high IQ? maybe he'll also be deathly allergic to soy. (98% of processed food contains soy, good luck with that.)
We don't understand the complex interplay of our genes anywhere near as well as we think we do, and I think a LOT of these so-called designer babies, and the parents, are going to suffer tremendously because they believe the marketing hype.
If it can be safely and accurately done, why not? You're already doing this somewhat when you pick your mate--you're selecting half of your child's genetic makeup.
So if genetic editing can give your offspring good eyes, lowered risk of cancer or heart disease, good hearing, etc... why the hell would you not?
"Sorry son, we could have given you great eyesight, athletic ability, and a strong immune system, but we decided not to. Have fun getting contacts and trying to avoid athletic injuries."
Things like height can only be predicted via genes. There's too many other variables to make them "designer". The mother's womb plays a HUGE role, so unless she's going to adhere to strict diet and activity schedule, nothing is certain. Even dieting has a huge effect on outcome. Poor diets kill growth spurts. Skin pigmentation is also very temperamental. Eye color only works for blue and not blue. Blue is recessive, so it can be controlled by using only blue genes. Most genes, however, only provide predictors. People with the liver cancer gene sometimes do not develop liver cancer.
Already happening, father's can seek egg donors and mother's can seek sperm donors. Albeit, not technically genetic engineering, yet.
It's a very real possibility that genes can be manipulated invitro to prevent things like autism or cerebal palsy.
Well that's called Eugenics everyone from the Nazis to slave owners to the Jews of New York have done that.
That was not what I was discussing. That more adequately described your description above, selecting desirable traits vs fixing health issues. What I described was gene manipulation to save the child from a life of suffering while you describe changing aethetic traits which is eugenics.
Sorry I took the wrong meaning
No worries, I misread sometimes too, it happens
Well you can already choose eye color and stuff, honestly I don't like it, it's like choosing your baby from a catalogue.. just feels wrong
But I must also say the only thing I find good is that you could, if wanted, choose to remove genetic illnesses like down syndrome
"shrugs"
It is what it is.
I guess I don't think about it much because people are going to be people. We still have all kinds of issues with race, gender, sex, etc. I am sure we will simply project our issues into genetics field.
Possibly a disenfranchised underclass of those born naturally. Rich people could ensure their kids are intelligent thus preventing upward social mobility of the poor. Hard to know how this would play out.
I don't think it is all that hard.
:D
Omg what a can of worms i dont want to over think it bc scary and sad but yes remove illness from unbornbaby but no modifications. Messed up man. Ahhh blue skies pretty butter flies !!!
I always remember that gattaca film with Jude law where the main charcter lives in future where designer babies are a reality and he was born naturally so no matter how hard he works he will never be good enough to achieve his dreams.
I would edit my baby's terminal illnesses, any type of disabilities and increase the immunity but that is the limit... we need to evolve into someone better and not degenerate, for that we need to have some limitations that we will break through
If everyone is perfect, then the few imperfect ones will always find a way to become superior
It's already happening somewhat... it'll happen, no question about it...
I'm okay with it as long as the primary goal is that they'll be healthy and well taken care of.
I don't think that's good, imagine everyone want their child to be lawyer ot doctor. Who will construct car and all?
Possibly everyone could be a lawyer or have basic medical knowledge. It would be a very competitive world, imagine those who were born naturally trying to compete.
That's simple: rich people will get perfect babies, while the pleb will get normal babies.
Which will basically make 2 human species. The one we have now, and a superior species, genetically engineered and improved.
The normal people, and some kind of elite who won't just want to live with inferior people.
I think it's sort of immoral. So you would like your kid more if they had X colored eyes or an X type of nose? While there are so many children needing to be adopted and wait their entire childhoods, fruitlessly searching, for parental figures?
I say genetic editing is our next step in evolution if an ai wanted to improve it would as for nature as well we would be opening our bodies to evolve in our life time instead of thousands of years (i want a baby gurl with invisibility)(a baby boy with super human reading skills)
100% Awesome!!! Sign me up.
China is already doing Human testing, they have had success engineering babies immune to HIV.
It's either Engineering, Eugenics, or endless centuries of disease and such.
It's like communism, sounds great on paper, but not good in practice. Would work if everyone was altruistic, but that is not the case
I don't like such an idea, it would set off a human arms race. I am not technophobic, quite the contrary, I am longing for the day when robots start doing all the work for us, but I believe humanity's fundamental nature must remain unchanged.
If we can make our future children have healthier lives that way, I'm all for it.
I think more people need to be like me, so it's a good idea.
I find it very worrisome. When humans try to control something that is the first step in fucking it up. Just look what central banks are doing to the world economy. Having said that, it wouldn't do any harm to prevent gross birth defects.
Not sure I'd want to do it myself but it sounds kinda cool
It's gonna make the rich even more supreme and the poor more retarded
I think that's happening already. The working and lower middle class are already being replaced by automation and robots in the workforce next will come baby licences and then sterilisation. If you believe in such things.
Perhaps
That's going too far but in some case people with genetic disease who want a healthy baby may benefit from. it
The History of planet Krypton will repeat itself on earth
I think it should be looked into more. The technology has so much potential. We could eliminate genetic disorders.
I can't stop thinking about Genetic Rejection Syndrome from the Outer Limits when I hear of designer babies.
It's like cyborging their kids and, running away from their duties.
Everyone starts from zero and, that can't be changed I guess.
I think it’s wrong, but then I don’t ever plan to have children in any way, shape, or form.
There are some pros and cons to it and that should be taken seriously into account.
I think it's fine so far as eliminating disease. Wanting the 'perfect' person and paying to do so while others cannot is all kinds of unethical; on top of all this all people being the same a single contagious disease could wipe them all out.
Why not? I'd rather hae people pick the Baby they want
I think it might be good for editing out hereditary illnesses
kinda takes the romance out of 子作り
Reminds me of nazi experiments
Jewish experiments too.
Did the Jews have their own experiments too?
I'm amazed!
Years ago Tay-Sachs was high amoun g Jewish kids in America so they started a screening program of Jewish couples before the got married and had kids. They wiped it out.
NO, that goes against everything moral
only for health reasons
Dystopia is bullshit.
Its brilliant we can create superior beings
I'm not in favor.
EVIL!!!
I really hope so.
It's interesting
It's kinda scary
sounds rad
Sounds cool
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