What are your thoughts on 'no uterus no opinion' argument on abortions?

[CubsterShura]

A common argument of pro-choice people is that a man should not have opinions on abortion, especially not be against it, because they aren't the ones who get pregnant. They don't have a uterus, so they have no right to dictate what a woman should be doing with theirs.

I find it very hypocritical and faulty. Women always have opinions on men's businesses, no one has a problem with that. Plus no one seems to raise any concern against pro-choice men even though that is also men having an opinion on abortions, as if it's only ok because pro-choice women are okay with it.

I'm pro-life and have a uterus. I also received backlash. I really don't think a uterus or lack of it is really the issue in here. It's just their way of silencing the entire half of a group of people.

[Jjpayne]

I can see why it would make sense. But here's the thing, if you are the dad it's an important life changing event that effects both of you. As long as he's committed he's important in this. But she still has the most to invest in this as she is having the child so it's 100 percent her choice still but his voice still should matter to some extent especially if he plans to be the breadwinner and full financial supporter.

Second medically and for the value of procreation men have a say. Not to say that every woman would deny a child but come dystopia... And their are movies about this... That in an extremely rare case would be difficult... But medically, while it is more of health for the mother and the child, medical advice is important. But I'd also say medically it's more about if it's good to have the child or not... So I guess it mostly comes down to the father... This might be on the right track but if the thought if real women understand they would not be pro life but there are many women that believe and support pro life. But going back to medical for a second, pro life is interesting... The class debate at to what point the baby becomes a child and to what point it's considered murder. I think the terms abortion and murder are interesting... When you have sex as a women you are saying " I admit there is the risk of getting pregnant" only for some women "but I'm not going to be held responsible for the choice I made"
Now given that... There is a movement that birth control has caused that allows women more freedom... That is another good question... Who has control the baby or the woman?
I honestly don't think there's a good response for this argument but the more I discuss it the more I believe it should mainly women discussing it with other women but the father is an important piece as he is part responsible for the child. Down votes pending... :)

[Ninjazzed]

In all fairness, men partake in sex all the same, they’re also at risk of becoming a parent, therefore they should be made to take birth control so that the responsibility is equal.. it shouldn’t just be mandatory on her end.

[Ninjazzed]

Neither baby nor father has control or a say over it, really. Depends on the circumstances.

If the pregnancy is either:

-The result of rape
-Likely to be life-threatening
-Mother/father is a teen or is unable to provide for the child financially

Then abortion is most likely the best option, for parent and child.

Immature teens shouldn’t be forced to birth the child but should be given the option for abortion.. abortion is usually the most plausible solution—because.. and I hate to say it—but that child will never be provided with the love, care, and financial support it needs.. they will suffer from neglect while their parents are struggling financially. And if said parents decide to keep the child, neither will never see a promising future.

If they decide to have the child anyway without the proper means of caring for it, they’ll most likely have to end up setting it for adoption and that would only ruin that child’s future.. they would most likely bounce around adoption centers in the system as an orphan, wondering what exactly went wrong.. nobody wants to grow up always feeling worthless or believing that their parents threw them away.

The child grows in her body for 9 months, she’s the one sacrificing her mental/physical health and well-being to grow a child and then endures the agony that comes later in childbirth.. It’s ultimately up to her. Can’t stress that enough.

Her body, her choice.. but that shouldn’t suggest that the father shouldn’t express his concerns.

[Jjpayne]

@Ninjazzed thanks that was helpful :)

[Ninjazzed]

No problem, thanks for the feedback

[dangerDoge]

Context:

The crux or overall premises of my abortion argument:
P[remise]1: Abortion kills a fetus.
P2: A fetus is a human being.
P3: Killing humans is morally wrong.
C1: Abortion is morally wrong.

I go into my viewpoint on abortion here:
With or against abortion?
The general theme of the argument is 'take responsibility for your actions.' A point I emphasize in the opinion is that I believe accepting the consent of sex also includes acknowledgement of the potential risk of pregnancy, whether almost non-existent or very likely. The knowledge that sex can ultimately lead to a baby is very likely to be known by the time of having sex, and that further means there is no justification for abortion between two consenting adults.

Response to Question:

With my viewpoint previously discussed in mind, I think the 'no uterus no opinion' argument is faulty with the main reason that the crux-- the sexual encounter, was done with presumably two consenting adults. It takes both sperm and egg. If both said yes and thusly 'contributed' to the pregnancy, both have the responsibility. I acknowledge the future potential physical risks are different for men/women, but the initial consent is still equal. There is no pregnancy if there is only one party. The 'no uterus, no opinion' viewpoint only has any merit if you look at the pregnancy itself and completely ignore the sex that happened before.

I am open to discuss the viewpoint with someone if they find my argument faulty somewhere.

[kim45456]

I am pro choice because you should have an control over your body. Nobody can use your organ against your will.

[kim45456]

And you can't compare an emvryo with a full grown human being

[dangerDoge]

@kim45456 “You should have control over your body.”
I have two responses to the statement.
1.) A person does have full control of their body when they decide or decide not to have sex. Nobody should force a person to have sex, and that is when the decision is made to accept or deny the risk of pregnancy. If there is some act of force involved with sex, that would start to lean towards rape. Now, that would break my argument, but I do address in my first original opinion on abortion that I concede to acts of rape as moments where abortion can be done. Otherwise, it’s the consequences for the action presented.

2.) The embryo/fetus/unborn baby (whatever stage it/he/she is at) is in the mother, but it is not the mother. I go into this argument further into the comments from the original opinion.

[dangerDoge]

“A.) This falls under a transitive relation. (I. e. if A is part of B, and B is part of C, then A is part of C) So if the fetus is part of the mother, this means that each pregnant woman has 20 toes, 4 eyes, 4 hands, and half have penises. This is a bit of an absurd connection to say the least.
B.) Secondly, the unborn baby is in the mother, but it is not the mother. The choice to have the baby was, from my perspective, already chosen by having sex. If I understand your argument correctly, it implies that, since the fetus is dependent on the mother and cannot survive on its own, then it is the mother’s decision to terminate. To that, I would ask then why people under 18 can’t be aborted if they’re financially dependent on their parents? Or why, again, people hospitalized can’t be just killed if they’re dependent on caretakers. A person being dependent does not make said person abort-able. More so, the argument still boils down to whether the fetus is a person. If the fetus is a person, killing the fetus would be morally wrong.”

“And you can’t compare an embryo with a full grown human being”
Could you clarify? Why? What clearly separates an embryo from an about to be born baby from a born baby from a teen to an adult, etc.?

[SpacedCharr]

I'm pro-choice and agree with you, to a degree.

I think it's important to remember that there's a valid concern when most of the people involved in the legislating process either are not women or are women voting solely on personal religious belief and not according to their elected constituents (hard to prove, harder to balance the duty of care to all).

That said, I think a man whose to-be-child may be aborted deserves a voice - but not necessarily a vote. It's very dependent. If the mother would die, abortion should be prioritized to save the life of the mother. She can always try again, or give a loving home to one of many existing children in the system.

If the mother would survive, but she wants nothing to do with the child, that should be her right but she may need to pay alimony and full custody - and responsibilities therein - would reside with the father.

I think the woman, the one most at risk in a pregnancy, should be the loudest, strongest voice in her fight. But I think, as it takes two to make a baby, the father has a voice, too.

In legislation, though, I don't think any bill should be passed without a full perspective that reflects the actual diversity of the population.

[OrallyFixated]

Men are entitled to have an opinion, and they are entitled to share that opinion. Men should NOT be silenced on this issue. That being said, I do have a problem when they comment on the ease of pregnancy and child birth, or when they minimize the whole experience to make it seem like it’s some minor inconvenience.
Pregnancy and child birth are difficult and will change a woman’s body for life.
We should talk about this, all of us. But can we please give act of pregnancy and child birth the respect it deserves?

[CubsterShura]

Whether or not pregnancy/childbirth is easy is not necessarily relevant to the abortion debate.

[OrallyFixated]

Of course it is, especially when men, who will never have to experience pregnancy and child birth, comment about how insignificant that experience is.

[CubsterShura]

No it's not. None of that changes the fact that a fetus has the right to its own life.

[OrallyFixated]

You do the same thing I’m talking about. You have no respect for the sacrifice and risk that one takes when they are pregnant and give birth.
You dismiss it as irrelevant.
It’s absolutely relevant. A fetus is not equal to a person who is already born.
Not the same
Sorry

[CubsterShura]

So yeah just because I care about the life of a fetus it automatically means I don't have any regards for the pain that a woman goes through while pregnant and birthing. Logic 1000 right there.

[OrallyFixated]

You dismissed it as irrelevant
You’re words, not mine.

[CubsterShura]

Lol I didn't say pain is totally irrelevant. I said it is irrelevant to the fetuses right to live. There's a major difference between the two.

[OrallyFixated]

How can you say that you are not dismissing a woman’s concerns about pregnancy and child birth as irrelevant, then go on to state that it’s irrelevant? 🤦🏽‍♀️
Do you even read what you post.
Either you accept it as legitimate, or you accept it as irrelevant. You can’t have it both ways.
I don’t usually use a persons age to dismiss them because young people have a great way of seeing the world, and I believe they have much to offer in these conversations. However, I’m going to have to chalk up your ridiculous double talk to your being young and inexperienced.
I really hope you mature enough to see what I’m talking about, because right now, you don’t make any sense.
I’m done
Have a good day.

[CubsterShura]

It is legitimate. But not relevant to the pro-life argument.

Legitimate and relevant are not the same thing. If you are unwilling to get what I mean, well, sit and whine. I'm out of this.

[MzAsh]

The man involved in the pregnancy can have an opinion but it’s the woman that gets the final say since she’s the one who has to give birth. She’s the one with the authority.

[Exorcist_Rampage]

What about women who rape men and become pregnant due to it? The man had no say where his seed would enter. The man didn't get to decide if he wanted his seed into another woman or no woman at all. That woman still gets to collect a potential child support due to that. Doesn't that embarrass you as a woman?

[MzAsh]

An anomalous situation but based on principle the man shouldn’t be required to be responsible for a child born out of him being the victim of rape.

[Exorcist_Rampage]

But you still think he should be forced to be a biological father if the woman decides not to abort. You don't think men get to decide if raped.

[MzAsh]

No I think he should be able to decide whether or not he wants anything to do with the child. She shall never be able to tell her to abort or not, regardless. That’s her pregnancy, not his. But he shouldn’t be held responsible for the child.

[Exorcist_Rampage]

It is her pregnancy due to force. Just like it is his impregnation if he forced himself on her and it is his seed being forced to develop in her if he is raped.

[MzAsh]

Regardless a woman cannot be told what to do with her pregnancy.

[BagoH]

Just gonna put this here. Your logic is flaw as hell. Dumb arguments presented by you. 🤡 🤡

[MzAsh]

What ideas do you propose?

[MzAsh]

As in, how would you resolve the issue?

[MzAsh]

If a woman wants to keep the baby but he doesn’t, who should get their way? She he be able to force her to have an abortion?

If she wants to abort but he doesn’t, should get get to force her to give birth?

Someone has to make the final call.

[brkninpcs70]

And if the man doesn't want the child, he is still forced to support the child. I believe if you chose to carry and give birth it's your responsibility for the monetary support of said child. Due to you not giving the father a say. ( Not that that's me, I've helped raise 5 kids, 4 not even mine) but I believe this is a want the cake and eat it too thing. " No it's my body I choose, but you have to pay..."

[MzAsh]

I think if he doesn’t want the child, he shouldn’t have to pay child support IF he signs away ALL rights and responsibility as a father, including not seeing the child.

[Stacie3]

I do feel men have a right to their opinions and to exspress them..
When a woman gets pregnant then father of the baby should be given a chance to express his thoughts on it, and the mother should give those thoughts a genuine amount of consideration, before makeing HER decision..
I am personally against abortion so that would not be an option. But I would consider adoption if that was what the father asked of me.. that is not to say I would do it.
Ultimately whatever choice is made the woman is the one who has to live with that choice..
Option 1 abort.. She has the rest of her life to think about the baby that she choose to have taken from her body.. to wonder what that child may have been.
Option 2 adoption she will spend 9 months letting her body nurture this baby.. a minimum of 4 months feeling it move inside her.. doctor visits hearing the heartbeat.. ultrasound seeing the baby within her.. and then after hours of laboring pain give birth to a baby that will not come home with her.. now she has a lifetime of thinking about this baby and how it is doing.. if the parents she picked for it treating it well?
3rd option to become a mom.. now she has a lifetime of trying to do what is best for a child that she may or may not have help from the father with..
Point being she will live a lifetime with the choice she made.. so it should be her choice to make..
As I already stated I am personally against abortion.. but I dont feel it is my right to force my opinion on anyone.

[SexyPetite]

As for those who do or don't have a uterus makes not one bit of difference to me. The FACT of the mattrr is this. Both my dad and uncle have worked in Emergency Medicine. I have riden along with them in the field many times. I've seen more than most adults. I believe all abortions should be Legal. I take this as the right thing to do because untill you see a wire coat hanger sticking out of a girls vagina brcause she couldn't stand the thought of carrying the baby of the man who raped her any longer and where she lived didn't allow abortions. Which then left her with no other choice. But to take things into her own hands. And please dont respond with well she could of put the baby up for adoption. If you even go there you will just prove how ignorant you are on emotions. There shouldn't be a single law needed to say if àbortion should or shouldn't be legal. It is a medical procedure that has been proven to work. At what its designed to do. It should be the ladies choice If a guy wants to keep a baby that a girl he is with who becomes pregnant by him. He better have talked with the lady prior to getting her pregnant. Otherwise he should wrap it or just skip it all together. She too should be using birthcontrol if she is unsure of wanting a baby or not. So abortion should always be allowed for any age or any reason
Personally i will always keep any child I should become pregnant with except in the case of rape. I will never keep a child conceived by evil

[MackToday]

It pretty much makes sense. Especially given it's conservative men who are supposed to be for small government and individual liberty. Odd they're against abortion. I'm sure not I can't think of a more totalitarian oppressive view than to tell women the have to have some rapists baby. There is 0 moral argument against abortion as well. These clowns are shrieking that a fetus or even an embryo is some how a baby. The far left and far right are both nuts, it makes as much sense as Bruce Jenner is a real woman. How warped.

[kim45456]

By that logic you are killing all potential lifes by mastrubating

[CubsterShura]

Neither sperm nor egg grow to become full organisms by themselves. Not even a somatic cell unless its genetic material is transferred to the nucleus of an ovum. An embryo, however, does. Better luck next time.

[kim45456]

An embryo is using the womans uterus against her will. That is like if someone take your organs out of your body for its purpose

[MackToday]

The fact that it grows does not make it a baby, that would take a lot of time. Until it is, it isn't nothing at all hard to understand about that.

[kim45456]

I agree it is not a nab

[kim45456]

Baby**

[MackToday]

@kim45456 It's obviously not so they mystery here is why on earth are their people insisting that abortion is somehow wrong? Not only insisting but willing to commit terrorist acts to stop it. It makes no sense unless there is some kind of nest guarding instinct they have or something like that. Something left over from another time maybe.

[Zorrak]

About abortion I believe not allowing a man to have an opinion over something just because of his gender is discriminatory because after all a woman gets in bed by choice and is aware that without saftey she will have a child and majority of them dont want responsibility for the child and decide to murder the potential of life they would of had like Hope's and dreams, even rape victims choose to keep their child. I studied about abortion and majority of the women were irresponsible teens that murdered their child

[SlothySlob]

To me personally, when two persons consciously have sex without protection they give consent to one another in having a child. The fundamental idea of pro-choice is of a curative, where as pro-life would be exercising preventatives.

While people should have the freedom of dicking themselves raw, in both senses, they are completely forgetting the core element of life, which is that every action has consequences.

In other words, people have completely forgotten what common sense it and completely foregone any kind of caution.

[mrfoox]

Men will always have an opinion on this, and that's fine. In the end of the day though, they aren't the ones who will have to carry the child and then give birth. So the woman should have the final say in if she feels ready and willing to have the child or not. Being a parent is a full life commitment, and being forced into being a parent will most likely lead to the parent being unhappy and most likely make the child feel uncared for, or worse, the mother takes out her frustration on them.
I think that couples who are faces with this choice should discuss it openly a long, absolutely. But in the end it should come down to the woman and what she is ready to do.
I'm guessing you have a strong opinion on this already so I'm not here to argue with you. This is my own thoughts and opinions, nothing more or less

[Passinggas]

“I'm pro-life and have a uterus. I also received backlash.” Well you have retained your instincts and sense of decency regardless of all the left’s mindless indoctrination. All that the left promotes is “hypocritical and faulty.”

First off, my thoughts are that I know whom I am having sex with and that I know that this woman would never consider it in the first place because I sense her instincts. Even the left leaning women I have been with kept it when they mated with some zero.

I know and can sense it immediately when I meet a soulless woman. While they physically have a uterus, their bombarded indoctrination has turned it proverbial gangrene. Their horrid aura emanates a pungent presence that simply runs me off. Therefore, I have never had this problem and I know that instinctively I would never agree to her having one. I just avoid the trash so I won’t have to smell it.

[kim45456]

I am pro choice and now whine. Why do you kill animals, if you are so much about lifes?

[Passinggas]

@kim45456 “Why do you kill animals?” so you just admitted by drawing the analogy that abortion is killing whereas nowhere in what I have written here did I mention killing, but killing certainly is on your mind obviously. That is your inner self crying out over your personal dichotomy eating at your remaining marinating soul. I kill to eat, survival. You eat something that someone killed and prepared for your precious self so that you can so daintily select your food from the shelf and not believe something died for you to eat. You also promote killing for irresponsible pleasure because you have rights over all. Killing to eat is not a choice while killing for pleasure is. You know another version of pro-choice is keep your legs crossed too. And hello to you too…

[Passinggas]

@CubsterShura Also, both should realize that they give up their rights when they conceive; it is the only thing that seems fair. equal...

[kim45456]

I am not saying it is killing. It is hypocritical to me if you eat meat, but are pro life. Also by mastrubating you are killing all potential lifes

[Shiver]

Some women are so stupidly vocal on men's issues and then start complaining when a man even as much as suggests that maybe the father might also want to voice his opinion on his own child. Fucking NO ONE is saying it's ez pz to carry a child, no one can force you to keep a child you didn't want, but to sit there and say that men don't get to voice their opinion? Really? It's immature and literally sexist. That's the literal definition of sexism. Hell, it's not even about having a uterus or not, it's about agreeing or disagreeing. Women who disagree get attack anyway, so it's not like it's only about men anymore. There's definitely some men who are the same way, I'm not saying they don't exist.

Look, do what you want, but everyone gets an opinion, that's how it works. If these types of people can fuck off back to school, where they teach the basic right to an opinion, that'd be great.
We live in a society, maybe start acting like it.

[AllThatSweetJazz]

Dumb.

Of course I get to have on opinion because I'm a free thinking entity and I'll have whatever damn opinions I damn well please, because that's liberalism. A uterus doesn't mean shit.

Secondly, there could be situations where a man could have an abortion, so just because they can't doesn't mean they don't get to have an opinion. Should sterile women and post-menopausal women have no say either? Bullshit.

Thirdly, it's my kid too. Maybe for a minute consider the alternative scenario. Someone else is holding your child's life in their hands and have no say in the matter. It's cruel and fucked up.

[kim45456]

You should have an opinion but she should have the final say in abortion

[AllThatSweetJazz]

@kim45456 Up to a point.
You still have to recognise how messed up the situation is though.

[kim45456]

I mean you can try to convince her but what you can you do except this? You can't force her.

[AllThatSweetJazz]

@kim45456 Doesn't matter. That part isn't what I'm talking about. I'm talking about recognizing the grotesque nature of the situation.

[KrakenAttackin]

@kim45456 Fine, 50/50 split with the decider being a court of law.

[kim45456]

What do you mean? What do you want to split?

[jgokgotit]

This argument is not valid. Someone has to be the voice for the babies that cannot speak up to tell the woman what the baby would appreciate. Also, like it or not, God intended man to be the head of the family, which makes HIM, not HER, responsible for the welfare of the entire family, which includes protecting the baby while it forms. Her choice was whether to have sex or not. When she chose to have sex, she chose ALL consequences that go with it, including the risk of getting STD/STI and HAVING A BABY. Also, watch a documentary on what happens to a baby in abortion. It is not pleasant, NOR is it painless for the baby.

[Exorcist_Rampage]

It's a bad analogy. Women have opinion how their son's penis should be after birth and sometimes decides to mutilate it. Circumcision is wrong but abortion is worse.

Also, what about women who become pregnant due to raping a man? He didn't have any say on which woman got his seed or if he even wanted his seed spread. Many times the woman doesn't care and she may get gain child support due to corrupt USA government systems and ignorant and uncompassionate judges. Women should be embarrassed by this.

[Exorcist_Rampage]

Also, I'm glad you're Pro Life. You're a major sweet <3 madam @CubsterShura

[kim45456]

You should be shamed because of many rapists by that logic.

[Stoner710]

I think if we are going to play that game it’s going to get very very dangerous and we are going to end up in tribalism you can’t have an opinion on Illegals crossing the border because you’re not Mexican you can’t have an opinion about black people because you’re not black you can’t have an opinion about women because you’re not a woman this is a very dangerous game that will ultimately end and Civil War and nobody wants that pro life I’m going to have an opinion there’s nothing anybody else to do to stop me from having opinion and if somebody wants to try and punch me in the face they’re going to lose some teeth

[Rocky_Jocky57]

I think they mean the government, mainly run by men, who pass laws on abortion. But I can see them meaning all men in general. I agree with the government parts they shouldn't have a say on what a woman wants to get one. On the whole husbandbor boyfriend, they can have an opinion all they want, at the end of the day, the woman decides what she wants to do.

Also, for those who say they shouldn't pay child support if she wants it, I say, talk a beofre put birth and sit bsoffebyou first have sex and maybe a bit after you guys first have sex. Get both opinions out and decide bsb if its worth having sex. Sex gonna happen, it's a freaking everyday act that people do, nobody is gonna br acting asexual before marriage. But, if she decides she doesn't want it, that's her decision, most of the time its costs little, so your jot gonna be paying child support.

[Paige90]

Great question!! I am also pro-life and I have always wondered why the guy doesn't have a say so in deciding if the couple gets an abortion. The baby is half of him and he has just as much right to make the decision as the girl does.

[CubsterShura]

Just because the man is half of the baby doesn't mean that he also gets any right over the baby's life. The baby is its own being growing to become its own organism with its own life and neither men nor women have the right to terminate it. Many women who want to keep a baby are forced to abort by their partner and that is just as wrong as any other case of voluntary abortion out there.

[Rangers]

@Paige90 I like you! Lol

[PondyPand]

Everyone is allowed an opinion.
What actually counts opinion wise around abortions is the potential parents. Yes, that includes the male. His opinion counts since it's half his child genetically.
But her body has to house it. And if it's not wanted, it's a parasite.

[TallAnon]

Excluding things like rape and danger of death/diseases/etc. because that should obviously be the women's choice.

Having sex means two things: 1) You know there's a possibility of the woman getting pregnant. 2) You involve eachother in the situation.
In my opinion, the second you have consentual sex with eachother, you have agreed that the other will take part in the decision of abortion. If one of the parties wants it to live, the baby should be born, but the party that didn't want it is no longer considered a parent and revokes all his rights to the baby.

[Cryostatic]

Alternately, you agree to pay a lifetime of child support the second you put your dick in her because that’s the default outcome of a pregnancy, and it’s her decision at that point whether she wants to carry it to term or not, because she’s the one who has to do it.

“Personal reaponsibility” and all that.

[Anonymous]

All this business about pro-life and pro-choice depends so much on the situation. It is so different when there is a guy in the relationship as opposed to just a single girl, even though there is a guy in the picture somewhere. In a loving relationship, the guy must have some input to the final decision, depending on his circumstances.

The whole thing about this argument is pro-life and pro-choice are not balanced. Pro-life only gives one option. No abortion. Pro-choice has two options. It does NOT mean always abort. It means there is that CHOICE, depending on the circumstances. If there is going to be real hardship, to the detriment of the child, then abortion might be the right choice. If there is a loving guy, who can provide well for the child and is going to be supportive, then the right choice may be no abortion.

[Opinion Owner]

In short, pro-choice does NOT necessarily mean pro-abortion, which is how most people seem to view it.

[CubsterShura]

The pro-choice content that I come across online says otherwise. Some are literally cold.

[Opinion Owner]

But that is the whole point. There IS a choice. It is up to the woman to judge her situation and circumstances.

In my case, I do not want any children. I have spent 7 years flogging my guts out at uni, along with a huge debt. I am not prepared to throw that all away looking after a child, even though I have a loving partner.

That is how I feel at the moment, when I am not pregnant. If I DID become pregnant, it might be possible that I would change my mind and let it be born. It is a question that at thevmoment, I cannot determine the eventual outcome.

[DJB72]

Ok, I'm very much "Pro Life" - not "Anti Abortion" (there's a massive difference). That being said: If a woman can have absolute authority over reproduction let her.

Naturally, she must release the man from any and all financial responsibility if he didn't want the baby.

[KrakenAttackin]

OK, but what if she wants to kill the child and the man wants to keep the child?

[Apple1996]

Men can have their opinions but they shouldn't be pushy about them considering they have no idea what it's like to be in that situation where they would need a abortion. Women should have a right to overly voice how they feel since it is only affecting them.

[Lightningfire]

I strongly disagree with that phrase. No one is going to tell me I can’t have an opinion because I’m a boy. They’d be getting a fuck clean off 😂 I believe a woman should be able to choose whether she has an abortion but I respect pro-life opinions as you’re entitled to them.

[Anoniemus]

No one said they can't have an opinion. What is being said is that they shouldn't decide for women a choice that a woman should make over her own body.

I don't care what you are. I do care when you're trying to force others to do something YOU want because of YOUR belief. How would you like that done to you? You likely wouldn't, so stop with the hypocrisy.

[YellLow]

I think its right. Men shouldn't give an opinion unless they are involved, meaning, if we are talking about their child. Then, if he wants the baby the only problem would be if the mother wanted to go through the whole process just for the father and give it to him.

[Account2]

Well personally I think if you were ever a fetus you should be able to have a say. I'm okay with women having a bit more of a say than men, because they are the ones who bear the things, but everyone was a fetus before and everyone is a human. So everyone should have a bit of a say. I'm pro-life and don't have a uterus.

[Rob19777]

But the dumb cunts who say this tend to forget that it takes two to make a baby. Both a woman and a MAN and without the guy's sperm there would be no baby. And as someone who's always wanted a child of my own i find that very disturbing and heartbreaking to hear and as someone who got frequently told as a child by my own mother that she wishes she had an abortion when she had me it hurts even more to hear shit like that. Those fucking cunts who spew that shit don't realize the vast amount of vile that's coming from their mouths especially with what takes place in an abortion. That unborn child which did absolutely nothing wrong is having it's limbs torn piece by piece apart off its tiny little body by a suctioning vacuum and then it's head and skull crushed with a pair of medical tongs. It's a very sick and disturbing proceedure. Those cunts who promote that sick shit truly dont think before they speak or use their brains or any common sense

[Pink2000]

I am pro mind my own business... if a woman wants to have 6 abortions then that’s her choice. It’s her body and I’m not the one who has to raise them. I have a problem with men telling a woman what she should and shouldn’t do with her body.. if it’s not their wife or girlfriend considering getting an abortion then they shouldn’t have shit to say about another woman... period. Same goes for women. If a woman wants to get an abortion then so what. It has nothing to do with you (speaking in general). Are you (speaking in general) gonna raise the child , no, then you (speaking in general) shouldn’t be telling a woman that she shouldn’t get an abortion.

[GOOSEBOY78]

you can't be pro life if you dont have a penis to create it.
hate the SJW brigade it takes TWO people to create a life. the SJW can keep their mouths shut on what is fact. men are just seen as paychecks or sperm donors to SJW who choose the pro life road.

[FakeName123]

That statement is spoken like a true authoritarian. That tells you everything you need to know about this mindset - independent where you stand on the actual debate.

To not go too much into detail about said debate: It is solely a philosophical one. When and what do we define as life? Depending on the answer to that it becomes removing a clump of cells vs a murdering an innocent human.

[holidaze]

I’ve never done it, and probably wouldn’t, but if I was ever in a position where I said something and had that as a reply, I always thought a great response would be “that’s OK, I am identifying as a woman these days so don’t oppress me, you bigot.”

[CubsterShura]

LMAO

[Glorious_Gay_Dragon]

Opinions are very different than authority. I may have an opinion on abortion and womens health, i may not prevent someone else from partaking in procedures they have a right to access It wouldn't matter if i were her spouse, father, or priest, my opinions do not supercede the right of someone else to make their own medical decisions.

[SimpleRhubarb]

I use that argument almost exclusively when men act like it’s not hard to carry a baby. Even if a man is prochoice, they often think it’s easy to carry a baby. That shit is hard and it can destroy you physically and emotionally during and after the pregnancy. The physical effects can be permanent.

[CubsterShura]

If they think pregnancy is easy then explain to them that it is hard in a way that they get it instead if telling them no uterus no opinion.

[HedwigInABox]

They obviously should be allowed to voice their opinions. But in the end they should not be legaly allowed to force the women to either keep the child or abort it.

[grace9876]

but you forget that choice also affects him as he is legaly bound to support that baby for 18 years so why should he not get a say so by your own logic women should not be legaly allowed to force men to hand money over for something they had no legal say in

[HedwigInABox]

@grace9876 I never said he should be forced to pay for a kid he didn't want. I believe men should have a Last way out of parenthood Like women do with abortion. He could sign over his rights to the mother and would no longer be responsible for the child. That would be fair in my opinion.

[grace9876]

yeah that would be fair i agree sorry if i came off harsh i just do not like it when things are unequal is all and i just assumed since u did not state it that u where ok with forcing men into parenthood was ok cuz as it stands the laws around this are unequal against men

[HedwigInABox]

@grace9876 it's fine (:

[grace9876]

ok so can i ask do u really think men should be able to say no to paying child support as other women just call me names or dimiss me when i bring up this point

[HedwigInABox]

@grace9876 yes. But the child would legally not be his anymore. So he doesn't have any rights over it. And I think child support should also be restricted. If the father want's to directly pay for his child's clothes, Games, school trips or whatever he should be allowed to do that instead of just handing over the money and trusting his ex to only use it for the child

[grace9876]

i agree u are the only other women who agrees with me

[VenusSweets]

The option of abortion SHOULD be available since it will not only danger the mother but the child itself. If the child is not wanted and is born it will live in an unloving home, abandoned, or handed off to an adoption home only to feel unloved and unwanted. And if the person was raped and was impregnated, they shouldn't have something not only unwanted, but also a constant reminder

[VenusSweets]

The world is already overpopulated enough

[CubsterShura]

Uh we're talking about whether or not men should be able to voice their opinions and concerns on abortion, and not necessarily about abortion bring right or wrong by itself. Find another question.

[WalterBlack]

It is typical of the more militant feminists. Any words that come out of a man's mouth are automatically wrong. It is essentially reverse discrimination.

Personally, I support a woman's right to choose. However, I also support the right of men to express their views on abortion.

[Anoniemus]

No such thing as reverse discrimination.

[WalterBlack]

A group that perceives itself as being marginalized retaliates by marginalizing the entire group of people (not individuals) that they believe is the cause of their situation. This involves making overly broad statements and policies that work against the entire group to which the alleged agressors belong. There is no effort to weed out the "bad apples" and hold them accountable for their words and actions. Instead the entire group is blamed. I'm not sure how you can say that there is no such thing. This happens on a regular basis and the original post is a perfect example. Being a member of the male sex means that a person can't have an opinion on a particular topic? That sounds quite sexist to me.

[WalterBlack]

Furthermore, I'd like to point out that there is a big difference between having an OPINION vs having CONTROL. I think men should voice their OPINIONS on abortion because it is a topic that affects the future of the entire human race (as well as the individual fetus when speaking about a specific pregnancy). However, I do not think that anyone should have CONTROL over what happens inside a woman's body other than that woman herself.

[Anoniemus]

Again, no such thing. It’s discrimination. There is no reverse. It works in all ways. Blacks discriminating against whites is discrimination, not reverse discrimination.

[Agape93]

Disagree in a sense. Anyone is welcome to have an opinion. But, you may NOT have the final say in the matter. That is for the individual woman to decide on her own.

[InfobotsMom]

You can have an opinion, there is no law against opinions and, similarly, opinions aren't law. The law is the law and abortion is legal.

[MissDawn7961]

I am anti-abortion ! if the woman does not care how the man feels about his baby in her womb and she aborts the unborn baby ! then the father of the baby should sue her for murdering his unborn baby ! Thanks

[broken_heart_at_48]

I feel like this if we're married or if I'm planning on actually stepping up and being a dad not lose interest in a year or 2 then he should have some say but no matter what the female should have the final say because they're the ones that have to carry the baby and they're the ones that would have to go through the ordeal of the abortion. Otherwise she being forced to be a baby incubator and that's not right

[KrakenAttackin]

Bullshit. If the man has no say he should not have to pay one nickel of child support.

[broken_heart_at_48]

Bullshit a man would step up a support his kid without being forced to by the courts

[DorkVader]

I think a woman's body is her own business, and while men are welcome to have an opinion on abortion, there's no way they should have final or decisive say over a woman's choices. That's it. For instance, women don't advocate for men having vasectomies until they are ready for families when they are just as likely to cause pregnancy, and they are safer than abortions and reversible, and we would never presume to.

[AJSALPHA8]

I agree with it women should have control over their own bodies that's like women telling men what to do with their dicks no one should have power over any one else's medical decisions especial another gender talking about something they dont even have

[Djaay]

Men have opinions on this subject because we're the other half. And by the way , GOD has commanded men to spiritually lead over women. So dont strife over our duty as we address them towards you'all. We are also reminded ding you of the judgements of GODS commanded wrath concerning murder as he says he will. That's all of our business as well.

[hotfirework]

in my opinion everyone should be able to voice their opinion, you can't silence men because they don't have a uterus, it's immature. Anyway, I think women should be able to have an abortion.

[Ericalovescats]

It's a bad argument that I am embarrassed females came up with. Roe v. Wade was made by men, I guess that means you get rid of roe v. Wade

----

I'm pro life too by the way

[sissyboy86]

If it were simply the womans body it would be one thing. But it's not, it's also the babies body that the man should have claims to.


Men don't have reproductive rights and it's terrible.

[HOAAH]

Everyone can have an opinion. Opinions are just someone's thoughts on a certain subject. It's freedom of speech. Plus you usually need men to make babies too.

[RasmusAiken]

Do I need to own a puppy in order to hold the opinion that it's bad to torture puppies?

[KrakenAttackin]

I don't own a feminist but I have no problem torturing one.

[arizonaguy95]

I think that is a vile sexist thing to say. Everyone has the right to have an opinion regardless of sex

[mermaidrocketship]

Everyone is allowed to have an opinion. Telling someone their opinion isn’t valuable for any reason just shows inability to defend one’s position.

[LoU_Hades]

If we extend the ideology to no opinion = no child support then I'm sure the no uterus = no opinion advocates become instantly very hypocritical

[Cryostatic]

Nobody with a uterus has ever tried to legislate how I use my cock. I don’t know what you’re on about.

[Astarlessnightsky]

I can somehow see, where this is coming from, but i as well think this is not right.

I think the father should be heard and both parents should have 50/50 responsibility when it is about their baby.

[CubsterShura]

Honestly, no one should be having any say over the life of a fetus that's growing to become its own living being.

[Astarlessnightsky]

Thats a whole different topic.

If someone has a say in it, its both parents, since both parents are responsible for the (unborn) child till it is mature.

[kim45456]

So you are going to force her?

[Astarlessnightsky]

The best way is to have a discussion beforehand and use protection if both aren't 100% agreeeing to habe children.

But if the woman gets pregnant and later decides to abort, the father should have a veto right.

I mean neither sex can produce children without the opposite one 🤷‍♂️

But for some reasons the man is often excluded from all sorts of familybusiness and their childrens life.

[kim45456]

It is in her uterus

[kim45456]

And you dont pay for her to carry the baby

[Astarlessnightsky]

Thats the one biollgical thing that can't be changed, if you are born female you are the one getting pregnant, thats the truth.

Maybe in the future we will have crossbreed with reptiles or birds, so the female only has to lay an egg and let it rest under a heat lamp for a couple of months. But so far we have to give birth the old fashioned way.

[kim45456]

Does not matter, she does not own any shit or life to someone. So she does not have to carry a shit

[Astarlessnightsky]

If two people have unprotectect sex, both are responsible equaly to deal with the aftermath (unless one of them was deliberatly dishonest).

If neither wants to keep the child, its fine, no harm done, but be more carefull next time.

When the man doesn't want to deal with the child, he loses custody and has to pay allimony, unless they abort it.

But when the woman doesn't want to deal with the child, the father has nothing to say?

[kim45456]

"When the man doesn't want to deal with the child, he loses custody and has to pay allimony, unless they abort it." Yes, that is unfair, and that is why men should have a right to not pay

"But when the woman doesn't want to deal with the child, the father has nothing to say?" It is her body, you only can convince her and give your opinion

[KrakenAttackin]

I am pro-life as well and I believe the left-wing is so crazy hypocritical.

How come a married woman can have an abortion WITHOUT her husband even being informed (let alone giving consent) and YET a married man CANNOT have a vasectomy without the WRITTEN permission of his wife?

[SimpleRhubarb]

It is easier for a man to obtain a vasectomy than it is for a woman to obtain a method of getting permanently “fixed”, though.

[KrakenAttackin]

@SimpleRhubarb Lame as hell. How hard is it for a wife to inform her husband that she is getting an abortion?

[SimpleRhubarb]

It’s not hard at all. The point is that we shouldn’t have to rely on anybody to make decisions.

[soleil2666]

No spermatosoid no opinion is the same argument. Show me a woman that can get pregnant without the male contribution.
Who carries it in their body is obvious. Both are needed to make one. Deal with that being the way of the nature (those who can manage it get to have children, those who cannot go into oblivion with no eternal life via that child)

[Liadon]

I believe that men's opinions should matter on this subject, but I also believe that all opinions should be backed up by research or logic in major situations such as this.

[Antelope]

I think men should have a say only as far as they should be able to opt out of financial responsibility for the child should they not want it. Beyond that, the point of pro choice is that it's her body, her choice, not "our body, our choice"

[lernulo]

I think all of theses issues are a waste of time and energy.
On my opinion people who love themselves think about living together and protect their children not into who is gonna have the right to kill them.

[Miristheiss]

Nope.
When it comes to killing other people that stupid semantics ploy isn't going to work.

[Drumlin2001]

I'd disagree. Fathers should have the right to an opinion. Not to say they should be able to force the mother into anything, the woman holds a veto. But they have a vested interest, it is their child too.

[MissDawn7961]

Drumlin2001 - you are so right and thanks

[blackxbarbiex01]

What if it was rape

[Drumlin2001]

In cases of rape, the man shouldn't have a say.
Though it is more complicated when a women rapes a man.

[CaptainSmartass]

Both the man and the woman should be allowed to express their opinion on the matter before it takes place. I would also say that expert medical advice from 5 separate doctors (preferably specialists, and ideally from separate hospitals/clinics) should be sought beforehand, as well, along with written confirmation, if it's safe, in each case.

Simples...

[ADFSDF1996]

It’s a type of censorship

[MissDawn7961]

ADFSDF1996 - if it was not for you men then the woman would not be pregnant , so you men have a say on not aborting an unborn baby that is part yours too

[Wowgirl30q]

@MissDawn7961 hey he's a good guy don't blame him