What are your thoughts on patriarchy?

Question

SomeGuyCalledTom · Accepted Answer

let's take it one by one, rapid-fire:

--unequal pay: MYTH, the so-called "wage gap" is based on industry averages, which is itself more a reflection of men taking on additional work or more demanding/ difficult/ technical work roles that women (on average) tend not to take on. A man and woman hired to do the same job, in the same department, at the same company, with the same experience, will make the same money. There's no "gap", and any discrepancy in the national aggregate can easily be explained by differences in work preferences and aptitudes, and any number of other mitigating factors.

-- Abuse: not sure what's being implied here. Who's abusing whom? What form does this alleged abuse take? How do you possibly extrapolate the actions of a small % of men who are abusive up to the societal scale of an all-encompassing patriarchy? This is purely emotional conjecture, and no basis in reality. Majority of men are NOT abusive, period.

-- Gender roles: uhh yeah that's how human societies evolved in tandem with our biological evolution. Why would you wanna get rid of all gender roles? You can interrogate their value on each role's individual merit, and reach society-wide consensus on which roles are patently unfit for use in today's world. But the mere fact of gendered role-playing in society doesn't prove the existence of a patriarchy... any more than it proves the existence of a matriarchy. You think women's role in society was just foisted upon them by power-hungry men without consent? Get over yourself, "power" in context of human history almost always revolved around not perishing to disease and famine and war. You really think men had the luxury to sit around thinking up ways to oppress women? Spare me.

-- Objectification = okay I can agree with aspects of this point, since postmodern society pushes to oversexualise both women AND men. But feminists only seem to care when it objectifies women. But if a guy's under 6ft and doesn't own his own property and have perfect teeth? "Oh he must just be a simp haha". (Note: I'm 5'7" and perfectly happy with my height and physical appearance, so this isn't coming from any place of bitterness on my part. My point being, the women who DO share attitudes like this are often the same ones to moralise and grandstand about how men shouldn't be allowed to so much as NOTICE a woman's physical attractiveness. Oh and let's not forget that much of the media that objectifies women... IS AIMED AT WOMEN. All that misogynistic music in nightclubs is for women to dance and sing along to while they get drunk and look for hookups. All the "unrealistic beauty standards" are by female-aimed brands selling female products on female platforms. But society as a whole does objectify to an extent, and that's more a result of our collective moral bankruptcy and instant gratification culture, rather than so-called patriarchy.

-- unrealistic standards of beauty = covered this one already, but I would add that models look highly attractive and toned because they represent an IDEAL to aim towards, not necessarily a target that must be reached. Ideals exist to orient our sights in a productive direction. If a plus size model inspires a bigger girl to get in the gym, then great! I'm all for that, a little diversity of consumer options never hurt, we can let the free market decide. But I don't see beauty standards aimed at women as evidence of a patriarchy, for same reason I don't feel victimised when watching swoll buffed guys in movies like The Expendables or Magic Mike. If anything it makes me think "man I would never look that ripped, but I kinda wanna hit the gym now". Is it an unrealistic standard of male beauty? Hell no. Do I CARE? Heeeell nooooo.

--Rape culture = MYTH. Doesn't exist. Most men are naturally protective of women, since they have mothers, daughters, nieces etc who rely on them. Even in prisons, rapists are the lowest of the low.

Edanurus · Accepted Answer

I'm going to assume you mean feminist patriarchy theory rather than patriarchal heirarchys here.

It makes a whole lot of sense when you're rich and treat "men I know" as "Men generally". It makes sense in the constraints of the 1% but not for the rest of society. Here's a few points that turn me away from patriarchy theory (dates/numbers are based on the UK).

• Men have always had the right to vote - No not true in the slightest it wasn't untill the 15th century men who weren't nobles could vote. Even after it was about 5% of men who could vote. By the time it was decided it was around half of men who qualified for the vote, that was the 1918 equal representation act it gave men over 21 and women over 30 with £5 of property the vote, the age would be reduced and the property requirement would be removed 10 years later. Like I said makes sense if you're rich.

• Women get custody because patriarchy says women are the caregivers - then explain to me Tender Years, the movement started by feminists to convince the world that women should look after the children because thats best for them. (Caroline Norton if you would like to look her up).

• Men kept women from joining the workforce - Well I believe that if most people won the lottery they would leave their job and most likely the industry. Because as I see it (going back to the rich thing) Women working for the majority hasn't been "You get to go live your dreams" or "You get to do something "meaningful with your life" its "Once upon a time only one of us had to go to the meat grinder all day, now we both do and can both be tired and miserable most of the time. Though I still dont believe that women have been kept out of jobs throughout history the plebs have always worked regardless of gender, only the rich have the privilege of not having to work/worry about cashflow, everyone else had to work!

• Men are Evil - "Well I don't believe that and I believe in patriarchy" Why not? If I believed that men throughout history oppressed women then I would come to the conclusion that men just have an inate compulsion to do that. To me thats evil and comes across as cognitive dissonance, how can you oppress and yet still be good?

• Its based on the victim industry - what do I mean by this? Domestic violence, sexual assault, sexisim activism; All very lucrative businesses and completely worth spinning some yarn, sure it won't help actual victims.

•Men make more than women for the same job - Just... no. thats an aggregate, it doesn't take into consideration hours or job responsibilities. The wage gap fits in quite nicely when you consider the more hours someone does the more they make and it doesn't scale the more hours you do the creater your hourly rate.

So to finish, the problem here is that Patriarchy is touted by the rich. It's the actress whos worth billions who think all men have the same power and motivations that Harvey Weinstien had. Miss Blockbuster who thinks Joe the dustman has more privilage and power than they do.

jennifer_bloom · Accepted Answer

Well patriarchy that oppresses woman and abuses them is bad but I don't think its the men who have unrealistic expectations of how woman should look - Most of the men I know have a 40-80 pound weight range in how heavy or light their girlfriends can be before they are not physically interested in them anymore - and men are genetically programmed to find females attractive so most woman don't have to work very hard to look nice to them - but the other stuff you discussed makes sense - some guys have very crazy standards of beauty - but they are not the majority.

archiz · Accepted Answer

Patriarchy still exists people🤦🏿‍♀️ The U. S isn't the representative of the world. I am against any group that stigmatizes a specific gender as elite.

ADFSDF1996 · Answer

It’s a fictional scapegoat created by the 4th wave feminist movement in order to justify their Misandry and efforts to subjugate men.

4th wave feminists don’t want equality, they want a matriarchy where men are 2nd class citizens. For this reason many women don’t consider themselves feminists but still believe in true equality.

https://www.ipsos.com/en-us/american-women-and-feminism

https://www.google.com/amp/s/thehill.com/business-a-lobbying/401804-poll-less-than-half-of-female-millennials-identify-as-feminists%3famp

Anonymous · Answer

Patriarchy doesn't exist. It is only in the minds of naive, victim minded little girls like you. The images you posted are pure nonsense.

Regarding the first one, half of managers in the US are female, so...

Forgot to have children? What's your point? Did I miss a memo that said women must have children, or that they are not allowed to now? What's your point here?

The third one is packed with bullshit. Like everything you feminists do, it is extremely gynocentric and ignores a lot of facts. Every point it attempts to make can be refuted with facts. Gender roles... women are more guilty of perpetuating gender roles than men are today. Who is forced to approach and ask out the opposite sex and pay for dates? Male dominated industries? What about female dominated industries, of which there are many. Educate yourself here. Google is your friend. What about the fact that 94% of workplace deaths are men because men "dominate" all of the most hazardous industries, as well as the dirtiest and most unpleasant? I don't see you feminists whining about "equality" in the garbage collection industry.

This sort of dishonesty is why feminism gets so little respect and support today.

MackToday · Answer

It's not real. What they're calling "patriarchy" is just the way people are. Men and women live that way because it's how they evolved. Their is no organization no ideology behind it. It's in our DNA.

The people calling it patriarchy and railing against it have no real interest in bettering things for women. Take a closer look really look at the "feminist" movement. What is it doing about the gang rapes that happened in Cologne Germany? Where is the outrage over the million plus girls sex trafficked by Muslim grooming gangs in the UK? Why is the feminist movement promoting radical Isalm? Is Islam friendly to women? Does it promote women's empowerment? Think. You are being lied to.

ShortCircuit · Answer

Every problem that leftists/cultural Marxists/feminists attribute to "patriarchy" is just a consequence of centralized power (government). The only man that benefited from "patriarchy" in 12th century England was the king. The average man underwent back-breaking labor so his family could share a potato, and was sent to fight and die in wars that he didn't wage, on behalf of the ruling class. And if you want to make it a competition between men and women (which I don't believe is necessary), at least the average woman got to nurse children indoors, while the average man either toiled the land under the blazing sun, or took an arrow to the ribs.

TL;DR: The grievances are often legitimate, but misdirected. Turn your pointed fingers to the institution of government.

Felicityoyo · Answer

The word pachriarchy has somewhat been tainted by radical feminism. But it is a thing that exists. How women are often belittled and have certain societal expectations put onto them by men and even other women is a result of a residual patriarchal culture. Think of the "smacking broads" days... One could say this culture still exists though on a much more muted level. Its ingrained in our society, culture, and even our laws. While obviously this isn't to say "all men bad" it's simply recognizing where certain preconceived notions and glaring injustices affect women in ways that can not or do not typically affect men.

Dargil · Answer

It ended 30 years ago. Now it is a convenient victim card to be played to game the system even more in their favor just like the civil rights industry race hustlers. More is not enough.
When I was dating actively, I asked subtle questions intended to extract views on "the patriarchy". If I heard the slightest hint of victimhood, I pulled the plug on her and left her to her #metoo meetings and rabbit vibrator.
If men don't like where this cloud car is going, don't date them, don't fukk them, don't marry them and don't let them bear, raise or teach your children. They are a cancer to out culture just like jihadists.

JimboGB · Answer

The greatest system known to women lol I see on your diagram you left out all the men dying at war or the ability of women to have a provider or all the progress under such a system. It is hard to respect your position if you are blind to the positives from such a system.

vannefftor · Answer

If you're refering to america as a patriarchy you're very mistaken from a political science pov. Equal pay for equal work is one thing but the aclu still defends abortion rights and there are organizations like metoo, times up etc that take advantage of the ideologies of women just as often as men are taken advantage of for the military or prison. Any woman who tells u as a matter of fact that america is a patriarchy likely doesn't think highly of men and furthermore knows very little about social science or the actual oligarchic plutocracy we currently ALL live under.

AlexanderBrunnrgaard · Answer

I defer to Dr. Jordan Peterson on that matter. He captures the essence of what I agree with completely.

grega239 · Answer

Those pictures are so incorrect.

Unequal pay: you get what you earn.
Abuse: happened to men aswell.
Gender roles: you mean like provider and protector?
Objectification: men are objectified as utility.
Unrealistic standards of beauty: women care more than men.
Rape culture: false. This never existed in the west.
Male dominated industries: teachers and nurses are majority female.
Gender stereotypes: men have those too.
Shaming language: you mean like deadbeat , Mama's boy, beta male?
Negative female portrayals: such as?

ThisAndThat · Answer

I see you must be a newbe to feminist gender indoctrination. If you actually believe that women are oppressed, mistreated, how about you ask them this question. How about women trading everything they have their oppression for the rights and privileges men have. The let's see how many women especially feminist give you a resounding NO, and they will too. And you know why they will? It's because women especially western women, are the most privileged and spoiled women anywhere in the world and they know it. Ask yourself why MGTOW exist. Why no men want to get married anymore, many not even wanting to date anymore. There has to be a reason for that right? If men were even treated decently MGTOW wouldn't exist and men would still be dating and getting married, but that's not happening, is it? There has to be a reason, think about it.

littleloren02 · Answer

It doesn't exist. If you think it does I'd suggest doing research and stop listening to fat as shit feminists.
If you still think it exists after that then I'd suggest getting your head checked as well.

worldscolide · Answer

It simply does not exist... It's a made up feminist word so that they have something to fight against and feel good about them selves.

sawno · Answer

Mostly radical propaganda that is used as an excuse to make the world less equal.
Not proven in the west and illegal by law, but absolutely used to harm men.
In my country its used as an excuse to make it harder for men to get hired and i despise that.

GraveDoll · Answer

I dont buy most of it

look the nature of things are what they are

man were built to do somethings better than women and vice versa.

why is this a competition? man and woman go very well together if it wasn't for ego.

I do feel there some unfairness but that every group of people no matter what category you fall in.

Sensmind · Answer

As a concept I am against it but I am not sure it is as bad as some feminists say - I am all for dismantling it but not at the expense of men - I want all groups to be equal - In fact one day I want to think of the world as full of individuals not as members of different groups.
Maybe not in my lifetime but soon we will be more equal , maybe in yours

Miristheiss · Answer

I have no thoughts on "it".
That word only makesme think of these types the last 10 years who have made up all of this stuff... safe spaces, toxic masculinity, institutional racism, pay gap, patriarchy, white privilege... etc.

Fools.

They think they are so wise but are fools.

Nails on a chalkboard.

DaddyRollingStone · Answer

I think women face far more abuse in our sexually liberated culture where we have quasi-human sex trafficking in pornography, where women have their self esteem destroyed as teenagers on social media, where women actually believe that motherhood is slavery yet take jobs as teachers and nurses to look after children that are not their own. The "patriarchy" has not existed since WWII ended, we have been a decadent liberal society for the last 75 years - and that is true

Curmudgeon · Answer

A bogus concept invented by leftover and now cultural Marxists, when their Soviet economic model fell apart.

Mroz75 · Answer

How about you stop letting the society controlling your mind, and not believing everything they say, and also here's a simple pic, so you would understand better the genders and also about feminism/patriarchy

DanaeAdam5 · Answer

It shouldn't exist.  Can we just have fucking equallity cause I really don't want to live in a matriarch society and DEFINITELY NOT to a patriarch either.

btbc92 · Answer

That is not patriarchy. That is what you call toxic masculinity. Patriarchy cares about women, treats us with respect, and still be the head of the household and a leader. That chart is feminism crap. Women allow it to happen, so there you go.

Anonymous · Answer

I'm not really for patriarchy. I think that image above is only half-true though. For example, gender stereotypes go both ways. So does shaming language. So do gender roles. So does objectification. So do unrealistic standards of beauty. Remove patriarchy and those still exist, so you can't attribute those to patriarchy.

And I am not really sure what "rape culture" means. Obviously, our culture doesn't tolerate rape. Yes, it happens, but so do theft and murder. That doesn't mean our culture tolerates theft and murder. #RationalThought.

genericname85 · Answer

i can't believe that in a time where women have more rights than men, we're still speaking of a "patriarchy".

hayley_may · Answer

Ok but first if you want equality to be a thing, guys r NOT to be expected to pay for everything Period. Equality is not women over men or women vs men or men over women. It’s e-fucking-quality.

Anonymous · Answer

Well obviously if you frame it in a negative way, a person is going to have a negative opinion. I prefer to think of it this way:

I am grateful that my dad takes care of me. I will do anything in the world for him. Anything. Men are the leaders of the world, like it or not. They are stronger. We are supposed to help them as much as we can to make the world a better place. This has nothing to do with equality. It has to do with complementing them to form a better society.

UncleJessieRabbit · Answer

These are really general human issues than gender-specific issues.
You are young and gullible, and under 18 and anon that's what I more expect.
"Unrealistic standards of beauty"/"Objectification" towards women specifically, is only a social construct.

Ámayas_20 · Answer

I don't believe it exists in the west, yes there are still gender issues that both men and women face in society but there is no patriarchy in the west.

Agape93 · Answer

It’s a disgusting ideological relic that should be destroyed

msc545 · Answer

Patriarchy is a construct invented by feminists to bash men.

cute_short_nerd · Answer

I know many women who are making more money than doctors, sitting in an office, and filing misc. papers.

DanOh2018 · Answer

I don't know, what are your thoughts on the majority of university graduates being female now? Does that make it a matriarchy? Should anyone care?

theChineseWASP · Answer

Well I don't like the patriarchy in society at large. But I do like to be the patriarch at least in the bedroom haha

Barbaric · Answer

The second image you posted is precisely the reason that patriarchy will always return.

taleswapper · Answer

It's a religious belief. It cannot be falsified. No matter what you say, what evidence you show, the faithful will turn it upside down or inside out to "prove" that it supports their position.

samantha_c96 · Answer

Most nonsense. Male dominated industries is not part of the "patriarchy", are you going to blame a builder for hiring a (biologically stronger) man? Or what woman would have the strength to work on an oil rig?

Hispanic-Cool-Guy · Answer

Patriarchy is the way a society should be runned but in fairness and justice and not oppression of women as times past.

Women should get the opportunities to chase and work on their dreams too, like men.

DiscomfortZone · Answer

A made up word by the lowest and most pathetic kind of feminazi filth, blaming their own ridiculous failures on others.

padreflint · Answer

It's pretty much a thing of the past. Many heads of state are women, many CEOs are women it's on its way out.

Anonymous · Answer

What patriarchy? The one that was dismantled before you were born? Is that the one you are talking about?

Anonymous · Answer

I don't like it, people should be equal, regardless of the biological sex.  Gender roles are made up, they are just a social construct imposed by religion.

TonyMetal_1986 · Answer

That's how it should be and will always be! Also there are some non sense and fake declarations about patriachy!

Jennifer_34 · Answer

What you define as the patriarchy existed to get shit done. Things needed building, wars needed to be fought, people needed crops and food. MEN got together and got things done. Women DID have a chance to do so but never did.

Liam_Hayden · Answer

There isn't one, at least in the West. The majority of voters are women. The laws in general favor women. The courts definitely favor women.

Gedaria · Answer

Sadly , it is one sided. It's a pity it cannot be equal. In working together sharing responsabiltes...

Stan_Control_ · Answer

It's something i don't see happening where i live. (Belgium)

TwoToTooTutu2 · Answer

It's not ideal, but it is far from what you think it is.

JesseJayNeak · Answer

How many times do we have to dismantle this? The patriarchy doesn't exist

Anonymous · Answer

feminists create patriarchy but before tradionally patriarchy never existed untill feminists came along and created it

Anonymous · Answer

It does not exist in places like N. America and western Europe. Anyone who thinks it does is a nutter and/or very dishonest.

Pulseofsulfur · Answer

It's a myth because it's showing the small percentage of jackass men in society. Most men are respectful towards women. Why not show that the suicide rate for men is higher than women and men deal with more stress than women

Anonymous · Answer

Same thoughts on any twisted/corrupted society or organization.

Anonymous · Answer

A fictional idea created by insane ideologues needing to blame someone else for their poor choices.

Anonymous · Answer

A very poorly defined term to the point of not being terribly useful for anything other than complaining with no actionable purpose.

TheEagle_000 · Answer

I don't like the use of that term. That's all to be honest.

OddBeMe · Answer

Well so far it’s produced slavery, recession and a coronavirus. Maybe we should start sharing power.

Harmseygrace · Answer

It's how it's supposed to be.

peter_hall · Answer

No good, just remember "THERE IS NNNOOOOOO SUCH THING AS A WEAKER SEX!!!"-Jim Carrey from liar liar

Anonymous · Answer

It has to end... Somehow. Just like any dictatorship.

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