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I think it is totally disgusting. Especially for kids who are not old enough to even know who they are yet or what is involved in the process, or what the life long consequences might be.
Yeah well you're pretty disgusting too according to your ex's. Looking like Rachel for ESPN
@PoliteSpeaker Ha! I have no exes so neener neener!
Gender differences manifest themselves before the onset of puberty.
@Ad_Quid_Orator so? identity doesn't. they don't know what they are
by the way; its sex differences that manifest before puberty. gender is a pseudoscience that' s not real
@007kingifrit Differences in behavior associated with sex (gender) manifest before puberty.
These pictures... that is blantant child abuse. No I don't support it because I believe in actual science not how you "feel".
@Aimée__LJ 1) When you are born you're either a girl or boy. You're not a dragon or anything like that. If people truly want to be trans then okay but don't bring children into it. That for sure crosses the line!
@Aimée__LJ Okay then I identify as a queen. My pronouns are "my lady/your majesty" and I would like to be addressed as such. Thank you!
@ElizaPam You were not born a woman and you also cannot do certain things only women biologically are capable of doing. Now, the key word is "feel" just because you feel something doesn't mean that you are. Your chromosomes don't lie and that's just the truth. That being said, I know that there are certain burdens that come with being trans I get it.
@Aimée__LJ no science does not support transgenderism. its just many fake scientists have the title of scientist nowadays
real science requires things to be observed. gender can't be observed, thus gender is not science
@007kingifrit I can be observed
@Aimée__LJ Science supports a lot of shit, like things/places mentioned in the Bible but no one believes that. Science says anything that the people who pays their salaries say is true. Or else there would be a whole lot of them unemployed or working at Walmart. I have no idea how science can go along with transgenderism.
@Aimée__LJ ok you're not a real scientist and you talk about science like an idiot
science is not a god approving or disapproving of actions. you must always explain WHICH science supports something, its methods, and how often it was reproduced
science must be observable. gender is not observable, therefore it can never be science
@007kingifrit I'm a psychologist. There are countless scientific studies about transgender people and physical evidence showing it is not just a mental disorder.
@Aimée__LJ over 75% of published psychology studies are fake www.theguardian.com/.../study-delivers-bleak-verdict-on-validity-of-psychology-experiment-results
give the same patient to multiple therapists/psychiatrists and you will get different diagnosis, this has been a well known problem for over 100 years and has never gone away. This paper tries to offer some non objective criteria to fix it but I’m only sharing it because it admits the phenomenon www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2990547/
being a psychologist is exactly WHY you are so uneducated on science. psychology is a pseudoscience with poor methodology
all studies you have on genderism will fall into 1 of 2 flaws. external or internally invalid methodology
1. the studies will either rely on self reported information or other methods that are not science. asking people to report information is not valid science
2. the studies will observe something but not be able to say with certainty that the things they are observing is what they claim it is (brain scan studies fall into this category)
there are ZERO studies that support the existence of trannies that don't fall into these 2 categories. not one. go on and try
@Aimée__LJ not a single study you just listed isn't covered in my source of 100 studies. or uses methods that i didn't already explain were fake
@007kingifrit sorry was unaware you were a scientist? Where did you graduate from?
From what I understand biological sex and gender are two different things one is rooted in science the other is rooted in society and culture. For example a man can have feminine traits and a woman can have masculine traits like a tomboy.
@vald9inches That's partially true. Gender is a societal interpretation, but I believe their are biological reasons for it. You don't need to be an MMA fighter like myself to understand that the average male is physically stronger and bigger than the average female. In the old days, when technology was limited, men often did the heavy lifting. Moreover, men and women are similar in many ways, but also very different.
Men and women bring different energies and it's those opposites that often attract us to each other. For example, what happens if I put a baby or a puppy in front of a girl? I too go nuts when I see a puppy or baby despite being a big MMA fighter. In other words, women are TYPICALLY nurturers and healers, men being more or less, meat shields for their family as harsh as that is and are builders of society.
Anyway, gender is NOT disconnected from sex. Naturally, I'm casting a HUGE net over 7 billion people and there will always be exceptions, but historically speaking, when you have cultures across Earth that have had NO contact with each other and 98% of the time the gender roles have remained the same more or less, you begin to realize that gender roles exist for a reason.
@Aimée__LJ Name those societies.
@inbox I am sure there are some female mma fighters that could beat you in the ring or outside of it lol are they rare? Possibly but that would be debatable... So gender roles are not so concrete and why should they be? Everyone is going to be good and bad at something so just let everyone do what they are naturally good at. We don't live in the stone age anymore lol
@Aimée__LJ I’m not a 3rd gender please never call me that thanks
@Aimée__LJ there’s really only 2 genders in my opinion
@Aimée__LJ I am a transgender woman who transitioned as a young teen I want to help people understand so they don’t say mean things only the staff does that 😔
@Aimée__LJ I know OP said teenagers shouldn’t be trans so I wanted to make my voice heard
@Aimée__LJ but sex roles... are the same in every society
@007kingifrit gender* and obviously not as I said some societies have more than two genders because the roles aren't the same. Tribes where there are males who don't want to hunt and would rather weave fabric or take care of kids. A lot of societies are very accepting of gender diversity. It's fucked up that western society is so against it.
@Aimée__LJ it was not always the case in the west, the Vikings are a fair example of it.
www.getrealcambridge.com/.../
Within Celtic society and archeology there have been various things getting rewritten. This is mainly due to historical archeological work, where a skeleton that was originally classed as female was reclassified as a man due to spears and other weapons, ditto a male skeleton without weapons and with other items such as pottery , weaving was classified as female. Druids, Priests etc were also a bit of a conundrum as a number were castrati and there was transvestism present.
If history overwrites homosexuality in the past, anything else is also painted over.
historyofyesterday.com/the-third-gender-existed-since-the-dawn-of-time-5f9765956ac1
www.hrc.org/.../seven-things-about-transgender-people-that-you-didnt-know
talesoftimesforgotten.com/.../
@Aimée__LJ Science knows shit. That is why the world is so polluted and going down the tubes. Science has no power to stop any of it.
@Daniela1982 um no you actually have that extremely backwards lmfao thats the work of politicians and corporations and capitalism in general that is polluting the world. Science and scientists will be our only hope to fix that problem
@Daniela1982 I feel like a woman on the inside, always have always will. I don't care what you want to call me. Don't expect me to deny my true feelings to appease you and everyone else. I will never be ok with being covered in hair and having being arms and a receding hairline and I will never want to use my penis sexually. I just wish you could not be so mean.
@Aimée__LJ no SEX roles are the same in every society. not gender. gender isn't real
and don't bring up obscure tribes that CLAIM to have a 3rd "gender" they are backwards inferior savages on the edge of extinction specifically because their ways are failures. we shouldn't be trying to mimic them. i would argue they are almost not the same species
transgenderism is a religion not a science. gender cannot be observed regardless of how they claim to feel.
@007kingifrit You have evidence of our gender by us. Who would put all the time, money, and effort into making themselves a target for hate, discrimination, and ridicule by altering their body to resemble the opposite sex? No less the sex that's weaker, more vulnerable, objectified, and still considered inferior even today? Don't you think there's a reason why I wanted to be a girl my entire childhood then transitioned into one at 14 due to male puberty making me suicidal and making it impossible for me to continue convincing myself I'm a boy? I used to literally tell myself that when I hit puberty these feelings would go away but they got worse. If my theory about why I'm the way I am is a lie then tell me yours hoss.
@007kingifrit well. I don't take kind to being called a liar hoss.
Opinion
95Opinion
Well, I support people's right to transition if they wish to do so, as long as they're making that decision on their own and are old enough to do so, like 16-18 at least, I don't agree with raising a child as 'gender neutral' or something like that and confusing them.
I don't believe a person can change everything if transitioning, so I don't agree with biological men for example, competing against female athletes, at least at a professional level, I don't think that's right.
Trans people need to accept that not everyone will view them as the opposite to what they are from a biological standpoint and I totally disagree with hiding it in the dating world, because if nothing else, why base a potential relationship off of a lie.
They should also be classed as trans too, so people can decide for themselves, whether or not they consider them to be 'real', suitable for dating, etc.
Personally, I'm a strong believer in coming across in a nice way and trying to look at things from the other person's side and whilst I do believe you are what you are from a biological POV, I don't agree with random people harassing them or beating them up or anything, not that I'm accusing anyone or doing or encouraging that - a person can't help how they feel inside and I'm sure that if it was a choice, we'd all be comfortable with our biological gender, so I do feel for trans people in a way, being confused and all, but I do wonder what makes them feel that way, like what makes a man feel like he's a woman inside and vice versa.
The whole gender-neutral thing though, as well as the 73 different gender thing though, that, I really don't get, I mean if you're going to give people identities based off of what they feel, where do you draw the line, I saw a video a while ago about some point like that, where someone was talking about a man or woman identifying as disabled and a man identifying as a toddler or something and asking to be adopted, surely we've got to draw the line somewhere, otherwise I identify as a billionaire and will therefore set up a gofundme so people can send me some money.
As a child I didn't "fit" the typical picture of a boy.
I enjoyed ballet, music, art. I was at home in a kitchen (still am!). I hated sport. Especially soccer, which in England was heresy. I wasn't aggressive. I even made daisy-chains from flowers while my co-students were playing sports during playtime (recess).
These days I would have been told I was a girl in a boy's body. Since I have only ever been attracted to girls, I'd have been told I was a lesbian in a boy's body, not just a boy with a creative & soft side.
Things I've been able to learn thanks to my softer, creative side:
I can build with wood. The skills I learned interlacing daisy stems can be applied to timber beams.
My muscle mass & bone density is higher than average. That allowed me to survive covid and be walking within a month of having my leg amputated. The only thing preventing me from running is my current prosthetic won't allow it, so I'm hiking mountain trails. The leg was amputated in October.
Normalising this trend is another step in the destruction of Western civilisation. How long before all sexual deviants are saying they just "identify" in a different way. I've already read several articles where a pedophile is claiming they "identify" as a child as their defence. It's only a matter of time before a judge, or worse a jury, accepts that bullshit and a child rapist walks away without as much as a slap on the wrist for destroying a child's body.
Genetic transgenderism, where a male body on the outside has an X-X chromosome or an individual who externally presents as female has X-Y chromosomes is a different issue. In those cases the external physical characteristics of the individual don't match the genitals that develop inside them. That's an actual medical condition where surgical treatment may - and only may - be relevant.
Otherwise maybe enough people will "identify" as sane and find a way to turn things round before we destroy ourselves.
Maybe I'm old school but I will give an example, majority of my family are women. I have 3 older sisters and no brothers and my father was absent and never seemed to care about me. So you would think a kid like me around all that estrogen, my sisters having posters of guys on their wall, girly music playing and blah blah blah would make trans back in the 90s. But I truly believe little boys and little girls have this innate quality that is distinctive. We sit here and talk about male masculinity or femininity, but for boys how is masculinity a thing? A lot of boys are short and skinny, it's not until we get older where a guy's voice will change, hair starts growing, hormones start raging, muscle builds, we get taller that separates us as young men from girls. The reason why I brought up that I was in a very girly household is that my sisters never encouraged me to watch sports, or watch X-Men or other super hero shows, or play video games geared towards boys or wear clothes meant for boys or play physical sports that girls would not. I truly believe boys have something embedded inside of them to be boys and it shows. I dont agree with this system of pushing this trans idea on kids because what gets normalized through the media and government rules will make children confused on what path to follow. I never will accept this LGBTQ ideology that is being forced on to kids.
Anyone who disputes me and says "it's not being forced", please it is. I've seen LGBTQ supporters seem like they are loving and caring when in reality they aren't, they are quite destructive with their behaviour. I'm very different than how many people act on this site or society in general. I am not a fan of capitalism or communism, I am not a left supporter, nor am I a right supporter. I just vote liberal during the elections because they tend to be more willing to give money for the public in times of need. But I know what the monetary system is about as well but that's another topic itself. I know when people read my comment they think I'm an idiot, who doesn't have his life together because I am not choosing sides. Why should I? If we talk about free will or freedom of speech that is restricted and I don't mean being racist or sexist. I mean through an economic, political frame, why should I accept what is normalized when this world seems more divided than ever where we are on the brink of another Great Depression and World War as economists and political scientists have warned. Capitalism is evil because it exploits works for maximum gain, but you know what China is a communist country and they're practices towards workers are really no different either, yet we play this tug and war game of capitalism vs communism.
When are people going to realize, wow we are being brain washed to accept something that is not working where millions and millions and millions of people have died because of these ideologies, if the system worked why would there be blood shed? Now the dangerous tool is this LGBTQ agenda to be pushed on kids, we are trying to change the sexuality about something. Kids at a young age aren't looking to date or have the mindset of an 18 year old but regardless of course modern day people even on GAG will read this and disagree with me completely. They will look at this and think my answer is offensive when all I am saying is questioning the system, am I allowed to question the system? If I can't then no one should talk about freedom of speech or democracy. In Europe for example they want to ban the hijab when girls want to wear the hijab, isn't that discrimination? Yet western countries label Islam/Muslims as oppressors? People should read history even before Islam emerged and people will hear/read/see that oppression and beheadings have happened wayyyy before religions started on earth.
I believe in treating the 0.005% to 0.014% of males and 0.002% to 0.003% of females who genuinely suffer from gender dysphoria with respect. I'm okay with such people deciding to medically transition once they are mature adults. I even know three such people. They are really nice, low key people and they're not pushing any weirdo agendas.
But I vehemently oppose the radical LGBTQ agenda of pushing alt-sexuality and non-binary bullshit on impressionable school children or even teens. Let that shit be a college elective. I absolutely oppose transition treatment for non-adults. I support psychological counseling for adolescents who are uncomfortable with their bodies or confused about their gender. I absolutely oppose the idea of allowing men who claim to be women to access women's only facilities or compete in women's athletics.
I support equal legal rights for homosexuals. I think people should be able to love and marry whom they want, and I don't believe in policing sexual practices between consenting adults. But radical LGBTQs are actually creating backlash against the progress that had been made in accepting homosexuality and even gender dysphoria. The agenda is threatening to tear society apart.
I debated answering as was not really sure how to put it, however…
one of my close friends (within my social group) is trans, post lock down I went out on a ‘date’ with her as she had been stuck home for months on her own. Great day out.
anyhow I am very much of th opinion that people should be allowed to develop, grow, learn about sexuality in a factual manner without bigotry or extremism from either side of the divide. They should have the ability to express themselves, show who they feel they are and do this without hate.
I believe any early years should be only via professional medical and psychological advice.
the person should however have resources, advice and support available.
The entire sexuality things is not going away, it’s shocking that there is still hate and violence against gay men in 2021, this just shows what a hard route Transgender has to tread.
Just because someone does not agree with something, does not mean they must hate it, nor should they be forced to love it, there is a choice of being neutral.
I agree with both @ChocoBat and @Aimée__LJ and @Ez-Bri-Z
I believe transgenderism is a completely new concept to many people and obviously there are plenty of reasons why someone may or may not support transgenderism. For me personally, I support the normalization of transgenderism because the world that everyone Iives in is constantly evolving with new information and new ideas. This has been true throughout different generations. If you really think about it, an argument can be made that Boomers were the first generation that began to question traditional sex roles. Different generations had different concepts and different ideas that were trying to become normal and obviously were highly controversial. Think of it this way: many people debated the existence of condoms back when condoms were becoming popular in the 1960s and now most young people see condoms as a go to protector. Who knows what will happen many years from now when human society looks back on the transgenderism movement but in my honest opinion, I'm glad these issues are finally being brought to light. For me, transgenderism is essentially the changing of the guard: its the new controversial topic that most people have very divided opinions on with completely new information available just like with condoms back in the 1960s. For me personally I support transgenderism because of the change in culture. Its important to realize that questioning yourself or considering a change in gender is now the new culture. My entire self concept is based upon change and its important to recognize as someone who technically is a gen z even though I classify myself as a Millenial due to being close to the cutoff birth year; its important to realize that transgenderism will become normal over time due to the many factors that I mentioned before which is why I support the normalization because change occurs every day whether we want the change to occur or not
I agree that society should, and will incorporate the non-heterosexual community with full inclusion. But, right or wrong we must resist the urge to do it arbitrarily, and quickly. I know that I probably appear to be an old, narrow-minded, fool. That very well may be. However, I still feel that it will take at least a full generation to acclimate our society to completely incorporate this new lifestyle. We cannot be persuaded to expedite this process or we could face an unexpected backlash which could result in a much longer time frame.
I think kids should just be kids and I thought by now adults would have learned to kick off from labeling each other based off what someone seems to do or act like.
It's honestly immature to constantly use labels just cause you think it helps.
If you are a man into things and have emotions that would be considered feminine, your just a man.
If you are a woman considered to enjoy what is considered male activities and emotions, you are a woman.
That's it.
The fact that we continue to label others in yo make up a line a different types of people is wrong because this is not a healthy identity. You need to love who you are as you are and be respectful of others as they are. Kids don't need to grow up with labels over their heads and parents who can not fathom the idea of allowing their children to love themselves however they may come to be. So just let kids be and learn to respect yourself and others.
If that's how an adult identifies and is comfortable being transgender, non-binary, attack helicopter, I don't care at all and will gladly befriend and support anyone through their identity discovery/journey. Children on the other hand should NOT be encouraged to be trans, take hormones, etc. If a child claims that they are transgender or whatever let them grow into that and let them figure out who they are on their own. Parents should not be dressing their little boys as girls and vice versa. I don't care how progressive you are, leave children alone and let them figure out what they identify as on their own. Be supportive of course but don't push or entertain this behavior in one direction or another until their old enough to truly understand and comprehend who they are.
if you let it into adult behavior it will inevitably pollute children also
gender is a religion not a science and anyone who claims to be trans just isn't. they always have other problems that could be fixed and they would stop trying to be something they aren't. its escapism.
nobody is really capable of knowing themselves. and taking self identity seriously is just not helpful
Gender dysphoria is a real diagnosable condition though. I'm not talking about people who just "feel" like or "think" that they'd like to be the opposite gender, I'm talking about the full blown mental condition that's been diagnosed by a medical professional. Do those people not deserve to feel more comfortable with themselves? Yes I know that one cannot "truly" change their biological sex but if it helps someone who is suffering mentally then I don't see the problem with it. Many people with gender dysphoria end up with severe depression and end up either suicidal or go through with the act and end their lives, especially if they are unable to get hormonal treatment and/or surgery. If it can potentially save a life then I'm for it. But I agree with you, some of the shit that comes from the far left is absolutely fucking bonkers. I'm really only talking about true "transgender" individuals.
While I certainly wouldn't vilify or discriminate against any transgender individual simply for going about their daily business, I think this is becoming a poisonous cult ideology, which is inveigling people who would not otherwise be that way inclined - especially children.
In the same way that I have nothing against gays or lesbians, but we must concede that their sexuality is not the "norm" in the sense that it is not the sexuality of the majority, transgenderism is not the norm either. It doesn't mean anyone should be vilified or oppressed, but it does mean that a vocal minority shouldn't attempt to bully the rest of us into becoming mouthpieces for their thing. Like - you do your thing, we'll let you get on with that, and you let us get on with our thing.
Many of you are too young to remember, or you weren't even born yet. But, in the early 1970's there was a lot of violent protest against the forced busing of minority kids to schools in more affluent neighborhoods. The premise was just. However, the execution led to tragedy because the public wasn't ready for it. If they had gotten the public involved in the decision making process, they could have created a temporary solution, while a permanent one was being created. There is a parallel between that and the current gay/transgender contraversy.
I have heard of kids 5 years old getting gender reassignment surgery. When I was growing up in the 50s, 60's and 70's, none of this transgender stuff wasn't even heard of. This is something new in our society. And don't force us straight people to like it, because we are STRAIGHT and you need to respect our right to be straight. Get it?
My guy is right. In no way is being trans have anything to do with being straight.
And just "enlighten" us on how you're being forced to like Transgenderism and your rights are being violated?
*facepalm*
@Arcreactor81 I wanted to know why transgender has nothing to do with being straight. I don't get the whole transgender thing, but I am glad I am straight that's a fact! So, tell us...
Being straight is about your sexuality.
A transgender person can be straight, gay, bi and whatever else they made up recently. Either from the viewpoint of their original or new gender.
For example, a dude can be straight, transition to a woman and still like women or be gay, transition and still like men. It literally has nothing to do with sexuality.
Gender != Sexuality
@TallAnon but they do have sex so it is about Sexuality. Do some go through with transition and not have sex? Or eventually have sex when they are old enough? Cause for me, being straight, I know I am going to have sex only with a real 100% male that has never taken an hormones or had any kind of operation. Being straight isn't complicated for us.
Everyone has sex, me having a tattoo doesn't make tattoos sexual because I may have sex with one on at some point, that makes no sense.
Whether you consider a straight man transitioning to a woman, when it still likes women gay or straight is just semantics. Words are irrelevant, our language has limitations.
In easier terms; What he wants to fuck doesn't change because he chops his dick off.
I accept it as long as people know their place. The problem with the transgender community today is they can’t accept actual reality over their created fantasy and it gets to be way too much for any person to handle. I liked it back in the early 2000s where transgendered women would cross dress and still call them selves transgendered. No need for the 50 genders and overall confusion of what gender you actually are
This whole movement is going way to fast. To force children to deal with this without the parents consent is wrong. All this is going to accomplish, is a deep mistrust between parents and teachers. You cannot allow that kind of dynamic in the school without expecting inevitably, violent and tragic consequences. Eventually, some transgender kid is going to have a crush on some heterosexual male. If the other kids find out, then the public ridicule that the hetero kid will have to endure is unnecessary and dangerous. His reaction could lead to tragedy. Who ever is seriously considering this, should never be allowed to dictate school policy ever. A powder keg just waiting to be lit. A real solution, would be to segregate the gay, transgender kids into their own schools until they reach college.
No, its doing far more damage than it does things good.
If someone has gender disphoria and genuinely feels physically ill from their own body its a good thing they can transition and its a good thing they would be accepted as their new gender. But all this i have some traits from the other gender so now i am going to transition in hopes for acceptance of my gender role stuff has to stop. Its making the problems they have WORSE because now suddenly rather than embracing who you are you changed yourself to something you were not. And now suddenly you'd realize that the people willing to be your partner has vastly dwindled because the person who would have originally loved you for you is not going to fall for your transitioned self because they want a family. Its a very tragic life that is not better for anyone who would not experience physical distress otherwise.
It risks someone pushing it onto our kids. It risks someone forcing rules on me. So no. I was never anti lgbtq or whatever the damn acronym was. But I noticed as they got more rights suddenly they demanded more and more to be equal.
With so many identities out there idc about any of them anymore. I’m not post of any of these groups. I’m alone. Just me. My job. My pets. If I die living my current life it was be a depressing life at the end but I can think of a worse way to die. I could die being forced to accept some rule stating I have to refer to you as a god damn oak tree. I don’t like being told what to do so I unplugged and I’ll live away from society as much as possible.
I don't support it but I'm mostly indifferent. Nothing should stop grown adults from living their lives how they want... certainly not me.
The thing that bothers is from the moment children say they think they're the opposite gender certain parents encourage them to keep going that way. Children don't know what they really want or what's good for them. Children's brains are still developing. Next thing you know they're given hormones that disrupt their growing. That's a huge decision not fit for kids to make and they may end up seriously regretting it once they've grown.
Unpopular fact: Transgenderism is a mental disorder, classified as "gender dysphoria" in the American Psychiatric Association (APA).
We can not and should not say just let them be free. Because they are "extremely" susceptible to self harm.
There is of course the transgenders partaking in sport activities. The pickle here, is that after surgery and years of hormone therapy, Trigender females retain their superior muscle power giving the cis females an unfair competition.
There are also places that we want to reduce sexual tension, for example prisons or I don't know public restrooms. Placing transgenders in any of the existing structures, presents problems. Creating their own, presents even more.
Ok where do I start ,
We like it or not they live among us! We like it or not they belong to humans tribe. We like it or not what can we do about it can you fix it?
They don’t bother me and you. We envy rich people we envy bright people we hate this and that we even hate straight people because they are dating cool people. Straight people are getting divorced every 16 minutes. Straight people abandon babies. Is our life going to get better if we don’t support transgenderism? I mean even questioning it is pointless and non existent we aren’t even meant to exist here forever to begin with. Just make those damn good memories as quick as you can and die happy because there is no time for questioning what to normalize or not…
Here is the thing, transgenderism is a natural occuring phenomenon. Its also not normal nor something to glorify. Its like color blindness, just because people are color blind doesn't mean we need to act like every one is color blind that their is no such thing as color vision and then push it on our children and claim they too are color blind. Most of this is just utter bullshit propaganda which ironically makes life far more difficult for the rare individual (less then 1% of the human population) who actually is transgender.
So the issue isn't transgenderism, its not even transgenders, its the ideological belief structure that is trying to use this condition to destroy gender norms, identity, and relations.
I do not support the degradation of men and the encouragement enabling of mental disorders. Especially this stange form of Munchausen by proxy that seem to be going on. Little kids won't do this to themselves. Somebody has to do it for them. Who? The parents with a whacked ideology ramming critical gender theory down their kids throats. It all makes me sick to my stomach. It's just a political weapon, but it causes real human damage.
The chances of actual, real gender dysphoria is really, really low. the amount of it being displayed is like 10 standard deviations above the norm. Too many people are living lies. And the truth is going to crash down really hard when it can no longer be restrained.
Yeah, just stop going after the kids. Let them decide once they're an adult and their brain is fully there. Also separate unisex bathrooms, and laws stating you can only go into the biological bathroom of your choice *after* you transition would be much appreciated
I can only speak to the LGBT thing here as a lesbian, but at no point did anyone come for me to make me like women just like nobody came for you to possibly make you straight (assuming you are). That is just something you know. Trying to force someone into a role they are not for the mindsake of a random strange just seems cruel to me.
Neither of my kids have shown signs of being transgender, but even if they did, I'd still let them explore their gender expression because it is nobody else's business.
Where I think the line needs to sort of be looked at is hormone therapy prior to being of age of consent. I have no problem with blockers being used to delay puberty until they are of age to make their decision legally.
As for the bathroom thing, where do you consider "after transition"? Are you saying after they have surgery? Not a lot of then can afford it or may even want it. Are you saying socially transition? Ok yeah, I'd be more down for that.
@Ez-Bri-Z see the problem is that's where I disagree with you. It's not cruel to denial kids hormone blockers and I am not forcing them into any role by doing so. It's a simple matter of keeping them safe until they are at the mental capacity to make the right decisions for themselves. You wouldn't let 5 year old get permanent life altering surgery to become a fairy or barbie just because one day they said they want it - in my eyes that's horrible parenting. It's not wrong for a kid to be transgender, not at all. But it's very wrong for a parent to take a kids word at face value and then make permanent decisions for them based on (what I believe) they want for the child instead of what the child actually wants for themselves.
If transgender parents really cared for their children, then to me, they would wait until their kids are adults with fully functional brains before jumping the gun to operate on their own children.
@Ez-Bri-Z oops I misunderstood you sorry about that, but no I do mean full transition. I'm not taking that risk.
Hormone blockers isn't permanent and thats the point. All it does is stop puberty until you are ready for it to happen. So if they are still set on transitioning they end up having a puberty very similar to their desired gender. If they decide to detransition then they just have a normal cisgender puberty for their assigned gender at birth.
There are no operations at all.
@Ez-Bri-Z and if they can't afford it then thats what the unisex bathrooms would be for, and we would have laws implemented to make sure there bathrooms aren't neglected either ( make them just as comfortable as the rest).
I'm fine with the idea of unisex bathrooms being a thing. I just know I have never been harrassed in any bathroom. Most people just want in do their business and get out. Now, me just sitting here minding my own business outside of the bathroom, definitely have experienced guys making me uncomfortable. Never had a non passing transgendered person do it though.
@Ez-Bri-Z I don't agree with you, I think they do have permanent affects, like making young boys develop boobs, have a high pitch voice, less facial hair. Etc (those things don't just go away once you're off hormones) and for girls, it would impair breast growth, throw off periods, deepen the voice, give then even more hair growth. Those do leave lasting effects that will be hard to mitigate later on.
I didn't say hormone blockers are surgery, but simply stating that fact doesn't change the common thing that the parents who approve of these procedures want - to make detrimental changes to their kids bodies before they are even capable of consenting. It's very disturbing.
@Ez-Bri-Z jessica yaniv
Hormone blockers don't do that. It literally stops puberty from happening. They are basically just delayed in prepubescent states until they either come off of them and either just go through puberty as they would have or end up taking hormones more aligned to their identity and develop more along those lines.
@Ez-Bri-Z that's not true at all, hormones blockers carry permanent side effects.
Genderhq. org/trans-youth-side-effects-hormone-blockers-surgery/
May i counter with one of my own?
www.mayoclinic.org/.../art-20459075
@Ez-Bri-Z Transgendertrend. com/nhs-no-longer-puberty-blockers-reversible/
@Ez-Bri-Z I wish I was at 3+ so I could give you full links but short short story - they're not reversable they leave lasting affects.
@Ez-Bri-Z I don't want to overwhelm you but there's this other one from kasier Permanente that talks about the side effect of permanent breast growth.
Thrive. kaiserpermanente. org/care-near-you/northern-california/eastbay/wp-content/uploads/sites/6/2020/04/Estrogen-and-Blockers-What-You-Need-To-Know. pdf
Again really wish I could give you the full links, not at that level yet.
Common sense should tell us that when you fuck with the developmental process of a child there will be long-term side effects.
There are long term side effects if you force a transgender child through two different kinds of puberty. Forcing someone to be in a gender role they don't identify in as well as having no real support structure are why suicide rates are so high in the transgender community.
Hell, my dad and I fought about me being who I am in the rainbow and I just married another woman. I can't imagine it for someone who is transgendered having to deal with it.
@Ez-Bri-Z I don't believe that's why the sucide rate is so high in the community. Again there's nothing wrong with being transgender or lesbian ( wish you and your wife well). But I think most of it stems from a lot of trans people having disproportionate levels of gender dysphoria - For example a trans person can know they want to be in a different body, but also not have it effect them to the level were they can't function on a daily basis. in my opinion a lot of trans people (but not all) have the former, gender dysphoria which causes them to be sudicial.
@Ez-Bri-Z not to mention just a lot of inner turmoil and pressure about making sure you pick the right gender/ if you are really happy as that gender. It's a lot for the average teen to process and then having to think about hormones or surgery - I could see why they would feel depressed.
The gender dysphoria which can help be relieved by letting them experience as close to a normal puberty to their identified gender as possible.
If I wanted to be a guy my whole life, but was forced to go through a female driven one. Go through having periods, develop breasts, etc id be pretty depressed too. If I got put on blockers and at 16 or 18 was allowed to go on testosterone and not experience any of that, then the only thing I'd really have to be concerned about would be a phalloplasty. If I have to go through 2, well now I have a feminine frame, I need a mastectomy, need to be on hormones for years to get bottom growth, etc.
Hey, kids can't have gender reassignment surgery. That's just not a thing. Trans kids would go on hormone blockers and see a therapist until they are old enough to decide on if they want to go on HRT which most of the effects of are reversible depending on how long the person is on them.
@Aimée__LJ they aren't reversible and there are multiple studies that show this stuff. But again we can't just give these body changing hormones to kids who aren't in the capacity to even constant. Parents who do this are setting a dangerous precedent for careless operate on child before their even in the right mind to do so.
They aren't body changing hormones. They are there to prevent the hormones from changing their bodies, hence puberty blockers.
Operation on kids for this is also not a thing or at least super rare anyway if it is happening outside of intersexed individuals where the parents decide on a presenting gender for their child.
@Aimée__LJ No there are permanent effects that kids will have to deal with, permanent breast growth, sexual dysfunction etc, tiny crotch etc. When they go on puberty blockers at a young age.
It's not true that's it's not reversible, and those who wouldn't be honest about it clearly don't have these kids best interest at heart.
@Ez-Bri-Z yes they are, I gave you multiple likes, including some by real doctors offices like kaiser permanente that prove there are permanent lasting effects from hormone blockers. I don't know what else to do to make you see that this is a dangerous thing to be doing to children.
@Ez-Bri-Z your fundamental changing their hormones, before they can even start. That's wrong on so many levels. And yes in my book that is operating - no sane parent would do something like that to a child
@Aimée__LJ No they're not rare, and even the NHS itself removed the fact that these hormones were reversable from there website. Giving these hormones to kids under the age of consent/adulthood is very wrong in my book, but what's worse is lying about its permanent effects. Breast don't just go away after hormones, nor sexual dysfunction, or highten risk of breast cancer. We should not being living to these kids and their parents about what the true effects of these procedures are.
Also by the time children go on HRT they are usually 12-15+ they are perfectly capable of understanding the repercussions of the medication if they do change their mind. That is also why there is therapy to help them understand the process and to guage if they are suited for HRT. You don't just go to the Dr and say "my child is trans" and they just hand you some HRT, it is a complicated process.
All I can say is agree to disagree. I'm talking hormone blockers not estrogen/testosterone. Frankly if they decide to detransition for some reason ill deal with that rather than have then commit suicide for denying them the opportunity to choose. I can have a mastectomy done to fix that. I dont have a surgery to fix them after they are dead for several years because a random person on the web was uncomfortable with the idea of getting someone the help they need
What bugs me is we have hundreds of thousands of minors who can get plastic surgery for things like nose jobs and nobody bats an eye.
Tattoos? Sure knock yourself out. In Idaho you can be as young as 14 and get a tattoo with parents permission. Some states don't even have a minimum age requirement.
There isn't a place in the US where it is illegal to permanently modify your child's body against their consent with circumscions.
But to offer a life saving option of delaying puberty for a transgender child, suddenly we are up in arms about how we are going to ruin their lives. It is so hypocritical.
Medical treatment for dysphoria can include puberty blockers, which a Centers for Disease Control and Prevention study found reduces risks for mental health problems and suicide, which 35% of transgender youth attempt. Prepubescent minors may decide to socially transition before requesting treatment, experts said, social transitioning by seeing how changing their style and name makes them feel.
None of those things I just listed about puberty blockers or socially transitioning are as permanent as death or the long term dysphoria you can cause by denying transgendered minors the ability to present as how they identify.
@Ez-Bri-Z no such thing as gender so letting kids examine that would be child abuse as you are confusing them for no purpose
also research is becoming very consistent you weren't born gay. you have either a dead parent or molestation in your childhood or some other trauma
May i suggest you consult a dictionary? I didn't just make the word up out of thing air.
Both my parents are very much alive and still married. They live minutes from my house. I was born gay the same way you were born straight. Nobody had to teach you who to be attracted to. I've always been attracted to girls.
@Ez-Bri-Z you don't think stopping puberty has some... mental and physical side effects? yikes
@007kingifrit Wow, were you just looking to resurrect old threads?
As opposed to denying what's clearly a real phenomenon?
Yes, of course I support the normalization of transgenderism.
Transgendered individuals are real and fundamentally no different from other members of the LGBT in that they are the proof of the fact that human sexual orientation and identity are separate from human biology.
It's disheartening to see that transgendered persons today still have to fight the same fight against ignorant people that non-heterosexual people have mostly won by now.
But I'm certain that reason and tolerance will eventually win over bigotry and ignorance.
Not as it is implemented now.
Are there people who suffer from transgenderism? Unfortunately yes.
However, the transgender proponents have promoted child abuse. Parents happily go along with their young kids believing they are the opposite sex.
The problem with that is young kids don't begin to comprehend gender/sex until they hit puberty.
So to encourage a kid's fantasy that he is a she does not allow the kid to grow and mature at his normal rate.
If a person chooses to embrace being transgender after reaching an age of understanding that is fine.
But promoting puberty blockers and body altering surgery to young children is not more than child abuse.
no i am a scientist and have multiple problems with the very concept of gender that lead me to classify it as a religion not a science.
1. gender is unobservable and unfalsifiable. thus someone can change their gender daily or lie about their gender and... how do you tell? we need an objective way to tell. we don't have one. the genderists say "gender is fluid" as an excuse for this but that's an ad hoc response. not a solution.
2. the implosion principle states that if you allow one false truth into a body of knowledge you can twist that body of knowledge into ANYTHING. for example once physicists justified the nonsense of "string theory" people could turn around and say "well other sciences don't need to be observed so gender could be real too". one lie begets a 2nd
I used to interested in a couple girly things, but that went out of fashion cause people said it was bad, I mean it worked out for me, I guess? Only reason i liked it in the first place was for my sister and she used to be a degenerate back in the day, I'm glad I didn't turn out like her back then. Kids are really stupid, dumb, absolute morons and that is because they know nothing about life, a person has to grow up until he or she truly knows what is the best for them, often times they do not even know themselves even when they're damn adults, but freaking kids? The government in many countries will jail one of the parents if he does not comply with transgender none sense from his wife, it's all messed up and they're using our tax money to mutilate children, children who cannot consent!
No. It's child abuse since we know only a fraction of a percent of the population is even transgender and a lot of them have psychological issues. Parents should be raising their kids to fit into society not trying to use them to make political statements & feel woke.
Not at this point. It's too extreme and too dangerous, right now. With all the extremism going on with trying to endanger children, to trying to ruin women's sports, to potentially getting the law involved for "misgendering" someone. I tried being tolerant, but they're infringing on too many rights of the 99.5% of us, right now. I can't support losing rights in favor for 0.5% of the population (and probably even less than that, since not all trans people are the POS types like Jessica Yaniv).
I do support, gender norms are becoming not a thing of the past as people discover they can be more expressive over how they feel and behave akin to their identity. This is all new territory and I am fine with it as I advocate for equality not just for sexuality but gender as well.
"Take sex. We used to think it was pretty straightforward. X and a Y chromosome for males. Two Xs for females. But we see more combinations than that in real life …
We have to listen to the science. And the science says that we’re all on a spectrum.”
-Bill Nye the Science Guy...
no. i think these ideologies that are going around are wrecking society. i'm talking about forced gender cooptation. forced acceptance for easily fixable issues like obesity and forced acceptance of delusional idea of gender and sex.
to me, those are signs of a failing society.
i'm for freedom of sexual expression as most people. but sexual expression is private and has no business in the public realm. and if you're a guy dressing like a girl (or vice versa), flaunting your sexuality, you're free to do that. but you are not entiteled to my respect for doing that.
i'm for equity or fairness between the genders. but our ideas of "equaltity" have nothing to do with any of that.
i think you should love yourself no matter how you look. but if you're morbidly obese, lose the fucking weight and don't bitch and moan about people telling you that you are unhealthy. cause those people are right, no matter how much you don't wanna hear it.
Surely, I used to have a much differrent opinion but my best friend is trans and the whole process I've seen her go through, the way she'd described everything... It made me change my mind a lot.
I still don't think a child should be transgender except for very select cases of diagnosed dysphoria or dysmorphia.
I also think a lot of people pretend to be trans for attention and that should be heavily discouraged.
But yes overal, I think it should be normalized.
the problem is there is no objective way to "diagnose" gender disorders as gender can never be observed. people can be WRONG about their gender and many people detransition eventually... after mutilating their bodies.
60-90% of people who claim to be trans under 18 eventually grow out of it
A review of more than 100 studies found no long term benefits of gender reassignment surgery at all for trans people. And that many studies had poor methodology heavily skewed towards telling trans people what they wanted to hear which means encourages the operations even though they have no positive effects www.theguardian.com/.../health.socialcare
no, we have no methodology. the "therapists" are activists in disguise
I've never claimed everyone that thinks they're trans actually is, I mentioned that dysphoria/dysmorphia should be a bar, that there's a lot of people that pretend to be trans, I've met people that went through a lot of trouble trying to get to where they are, people that live in very unfriendly countries but still deal with it, the people you're thinking of are not what I'm talking about, I'm not talking about people that are upset with their bodies, I'm talking about people with an actual wiring quirk, they exist and they should be accepted, this is not something they wanted or chose.
People are too easy about it, this is a troubling problem though, since there's also a trend of fake trans people/people that think they're trans for wrong reasons, in an ideal world checks shouldn't be necessary because nobody wants to be dysphoric, but it's necessary because of these people.
"nobody wants to be dysmorphic" i wish that were true. but i know human nature better than one as young as you
people want to have something wrong with them sometimes if life already isn't going well that way they can have something to blame for their unhappiness. its called self handicapping. that's why we see trans people never get happier as they get older. they only became trans to explain the unhappiness they already had... its an excuse
and dysphoria isn't a bar either, there are no objective standards to dysphoria
No what I'm saying is, people do not want to be actually dysmorphic, they think they know what it means to be, that they are because they want to be trans, nobody actually wants to have it, people just think they do/pretend they do, it's very rare for people to actually experiences
there is no distinction between people who want to be dysmorphic and people who think they want to be. from our exterior perspective its the same thing
the point is we can't trust a human's ability to self report information
Not the way The Intersectional/Identitarian Mob is pushing it, especially when it is being aimed at Primary/ Junior School age children where the kids are being shoved down the Transgender track if the kids show the slightest mannerism of the opposite sex.
imagine being your gender from birth, say a male, an all you know is you like makeup dresses so on, you can't help it... u just do... just like another male can't help he loves football and a beard. imagine you dont feel male... all u know is... u feel female.. so naturally u want to look an live as that... thats all you know is, you dont feel male, u dont feel yourself, until you become as female as possible... why can't this be ok... why can't we let people live their lives in peace... why must we expect them to stay their birth gender, stay suffering, so were not uncomfortable,,,, i support people being free an happy to be who they feel they are, and we all should support it.
I have lived in a male body all my life.
I have no clue as to what "it feels like" to be in a female body. No male can!!!
Do people suffer body dysphoria? Yes!!!
Girls who suffer from anorexia or bulimia suffer from body dysphoria.
It is a mental health issue.
Does that go for serial killers too?
this is an emotional appeal. not a scientific one. gender isn't a real concept. the man who likes dresses isn't trans. just weird
@Hanmakev Ha Ha
1. For kids I don't support it.
2. I am transphobic , I get nervous around them and don't know how to react.
3. I have never directly interacted with them.
4. Here transgender are different than you find in western countries.
5. But none the less I neither support nor insult them.
6. Since I never interacted with them at emotional level I have no idea how to feel I am neutral in this case
Nope. There are 2 genders male expressed genetically as xy. And female expressed genetically as xx. And physiological differentiation such as xxy or xyy etc is a genetic disorder and comes with a myriad of health problems and whilst i feel for those people that dosen't make them a new gender. Or they're mental disorders in which case get then a psychologist not validation.
Adults can do whatever they want, but people need to stop pushing their agenda to trans the kids. Children are too young to make these life altering the decisions. Bad parents who let their kids do this shit deserve to rot in jail.
I think there are people that have physical issue re. not well defined gender, eg not being totally XX or XY. Sometimes with both sexes physical traits. These people deserve good care and understanding. Gender dysphoria not linked to a real physical condition should be considered IMHO a psychological pathology and treated as such. Normalization of intersex / motivate them to treatment (hormones, sex changes) is IMHO not a good idea.
Not at the age of those CHILDREN in the pics.
For fucks sake, I worse a dress once playing with the neighbor girl when I was I don't know 11?🤷♂️ was a one time thing all the parents had a quick laugh no big deal. If I had some of these kids moron parents they would have seen that, pushed it, and ruined my whole life.
Several different things here.
If I support normalization? Yes.
If I support forced, coerced, or influenced trans? No!
If I support under 18 year olds take hormones or do the operation? No!
It's fine and should be considered normal, by an adult making a conscious decision.
if someone has an actual intergender disorder like klinefelter syndrome i understand but aside from that i think it’s gender dysphoria. Just because you feel one way inside doesn’t mean a sex change actually is going to validate your delusions. a guy that has his dick removed and takes hormones to get tits is still a guy just with artificial body parts. I think most people regret “transitioning” eventually if they do.
I’m trans and I voted no because we’re not “normal” the same way any other natural variant isn’t “normal” what I want is to be normal I don’t want normal people to be like me
It was cool until terms like , "pregnant people" ,"chest feeders" and "menstrators" became a thing
Those terms prove that the transgender movement is full of science deniers.
There are age of consent laws for a reason, those age of consent laws should prevent pervert, sicko, pedophile, sex freak, deviant parents from doing this disgusting shit to their own kids.
Trans = Gender dysphoria is a term that describes a sense of unease that a person may have because of a mismatch between their biological sex and their gender identity. This sense of unease or dissatisfaction may be so intense it can lead to depression and anxiety and have a harmful impact on daily life.
Normalizing sin will never bring peace to the sinner. Loving the sinner on the other hand will work wonders perhaps even help them want to become "normal".
I personally feel neutral about it because I am not that much into the topic. But i just have a hard time seeing how, for example, a man could become a woman or vice versa. A woman that menstruates, can give birth, has a different body composition than a man. How can a man become that? I don't know I am just confused.
No because it's mainly boys becoming girls for the free attention they'll get, not because they're born girls.
Every transgendered person I've meet had a mental illness issue or what it looked like some kinda of low to high mental retardation. The normalization of transgenderism is taking advantage of the most vulnerable people who need help. It's not helpful to lead them down a path that only makes things more difficult and less understanding about the reality of the of the world. I don't support the normalization of transgenderism, I only support compassion to others and to treat them as an individual.
This, and among other reasons is why the US is about to get invaded by one of our enemies.
You are who are. Do not hide it. Many will never understand. But just because you do not understand, doesn't give you the right to hate on them. It's their life not yours. But one thing I'll NEVER agree with, is f'n makeup!! Especially à young kid. Makeup with women has to be the dumbest invention ever.
Oh please with the dislikes. Truth hurts, doesn't it? You think trans people have mental problem yet makeup, eyelash extensions, fake hair, long ugly useless nails, surgery, botox, completely changing who you are is widely accepted? You just hate yourselves if you don't already and put that hate on others that do not even affect your life.. Bunch of hypocrites. Grown ass humans can't act logically, it amazes me. I have no confidence in the human race, especially religious type.
I am a transgender myself but I am not cross dress or taking hormone. I think there are people who is not transgender but they are changing. I mean it's upto them how happy they will be as a women or men. however I am against transgender who didn't get sex change operation going to the women's spa. They have to have get surgery.
Hell no!
Absolutely not. I consider that as a mental illness, and I wouldn't support the normalization of any mental illness in society, whatever it is.
You treat an illness, you don't make it normal.
I mean do whatever you like. But I don't have to listen to you tell me about how you are a man or a woman because you "feel" like it.
No Especially not in children, Thats fucking monstrous and child abuse.
Looks like those of us with a brain voted the same.
I have no problem with transgender adults. You do you boo. Live your best life.
When it comes to kids, all bets off.
Well they can be whoever they want to be.. not a problem with me.
Society is being destroyed by the globalist Satanists destroying normal and holy things. And forcing us to accept culturally destructive things as normal. I know what your gonna say im crazy thisnandnthay but there's evidence. of the globalist conspiracy the decay of our civilization and the Bible prophecies proven true. I say thisnas. someone who has suffered from gender. dysphoria my. whole life so I'm not trying to be mean
Yeah nobody cares what they want to look like, we care about a few dictating the vernacular of the many.
You’re an Asian you should know exactly why this is problematic as your people are predisposed to Totalitarianism.
Everybody should be as he/she want, but the society should not be indoctrinated to Gender Mainstreaming. They as they like and I as I like.
No. It's child abuse. You are what you are, just look in your pants.
No; I would just as soon normalise perverts, thieves, and other frauds.
Only a pop thing that can blow out of proportion very easily.
Some are and some other's are just because of it's a popular thing in western society just like homosexuality in the 80's.
A lot of people that just want attention.
No If I had a child I would disown him and the mother.
And that's the nicest thing I can say.
It's brainwashing from media.
That first pic reminds me of an account I read from some famous author about a boy prostitute in makeup propositioning him. It was from the 1890's.
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