Innocent until proven guilty or guilty until proven innocent?

[AskingToughQuestions]

Let's just say someone on the news has been arrested on suspicion of a serious crime

What's your automatic response upon hearing the news?

Innocent until proven guilty

Guilty until proven innocent

[Red_Arrow]

"Presumed innocent" is a legal term meaning any defendant in a criminal trial is assumed to be innocent until proven guilty. There may be enough red flags and proof that the accused is locked up until after the trial to protect others, so the presumption of innocence is not something that allows a possibly dangerous person to remain free while awaiting trial. These days the news is full of stories of people who are locked up for killing someone, but they may have done so in defense of their own life, so they are presumed innocent until after the trial where they may be found guilty.

[ProbablyClueless]

Innocent until proven guilty, but let's be real; if you piss off the media, you'll stand trial in the court of public opinion. That's what happened to Rittenhouse. The poor kid did nothing wrong, very provably and very clearly, but even though he was found innocent by a court of law; a bunch of lefties have started throwing a bunch of bad faith lawsuits to harass him and drain his money.

These jerks are going to make sure he never has peace, simply because he chose the side the media didn't like.

[Potteplante]

Upon hearing the news?

Innocent until proven guilty - however I might change that the more I learn about the case. I don't always need a court to tell me if someone is guilty or not, heck sometimes I disagree with the court and sometimes innocents are proven guilty and guilty are proven innocent by the court.

[WhitneySnow]

Innocent until proven guilty but to be honest I wouldn’t presume either until the person had their day in court

[OlderAndWiser]

Innocent until proven guilty should be the presumption in the US.

[BoopBoopBeep]

People on this poll are damned liars it's not 92-8% just sit around the bar when the news is on, they show a mugshot and everyone is like "oh they finally caught that guy that did XYZ".

92% my shiny arsehole they just don't want to admit it.

[Anpu23]

It is impossible to prove a negative. That's why we have the assumption of innocence. Its impossible to prove you didn't do something, you can only prove that you did do something.

If you look at say a crime that happened at THIS time and place. You can prove you weren't there because you CAN prove you were someplace else, but not that you were not someplace.

[genericname85]

you can never proof that someone is innocent. it's impossible, cause for that you would need to have an exhaustive knowledge of everything that is real, which humanity just does not have. so the only thing we actually can do is proof that someone is guilty. if we fail doing that, they aren't proven innocent. they are not proven guilty. that's the process. nobody is ever proven innocent.

[A_Bell]

1. The killer had this DNA.
2. The defendant doesn't have that DNA.

I just proved the defendant innocent.

You guys aren't as clever as you think.

[genericname85]

so the example that you gave already assumes you already "know" who the killer was, which makes blaming the defendant sort of pointless in the first place but nevertheless, this does not at all conclude that the defendant is absolutely 100% innocent. because you can definitely have a part of the guilt in someones death that would not at all leave any of your dna. blackmail being one of many things that instantly come to mind...

i never claimed to be clever. but you just proved that you aren't either. so hey. welcome to the club.

[A_Bell]

Now you're saying proof isn't proof. I thought guys were supposed to be the logical ones. :D

[genericname85]

@A_Bell well take your time and read through what i said. maybe you'll understand it then. because i certainly did not say that.
.

[ibodi]

the woman said attention

https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cuwlc8DPTXN/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

[goaded]

Could go either way, arrested < indicted < convicted. If I were in a jury, I'd try very hard to require the state to prove their case, but as an outside observer, indicted people are usually guity. (ISTR 90%?)

[exitseven]

You should be innocent until proven guilty. However if a person has gotten so far through the system that they are a really standing trial, I think that they are guilty.

[KostasKouvalis]

In practice it's guilty unless proven innocent. When you go to trial, you aren't trying to prove your innocence, you're trying to disprove your guilt.

[Filthy_Immigrant]

it depends your gender. if you are a man you are guilty till proven innocent. if you are a woman you are innocent till proven guilty.

of course Johnny Depp and Amber Heard were a prime example of this

[Massageman]

In the United States, we have the presumption of innocence until guilt has been proven "beyond any reasonable doubt". The media doesn't seem, to agree at times, however.

[DiegoO]

If you wanna live in a dictatorship, the second option will be the norm.

—the guy who lived in a dictatorship

[DiegoO]

Lives (...)*

[worldscolide]

To a rational thinking person? Innocent until proven guilty.. To a worthless shit stain leftist guilty until proven innocent, and still guilty after proven innocent.

[bolverk]

I would automatically go with "Innocent until proven Guilty", even though with Main Stream Media the way it is today you'd think it was "Guilty until proven Innocent"

[AndLikeThatHesGone]

Innocent until proven guilty.

The fact that this is even a question honestly depresses me.

[strateguy632]

from what i heard innocent until proven guilty... except... certain politicians?

[jshm2]

Depends how white and rich they are, I suppose.

[noohair]

Well, I don't think it applies to every person equally. It depends what tribe you belong to. We, as humans have reverted to less acccepting of opinion of others.

[FunkyMonkee]

The first way is for those of us on the right, the other is for those dipshits on the left.

[Anonymous]

I'm 50/50 sometimes I'm like they are guilty before they even go to court. Sometimes it's easy to tell the person is guilty.

[Counterclocking]

A person should always be innocent until proven guilty. No innocent person should ever be in jail. Punishing an innocent person is to be a crime.

[HippieVeganJewslim]

Innocent till proven guilty. Many crimes are impossible to prove anyone guilty, so does that mean that everyone is guilty? I think not!

[gothbxtch]

it depends. in cases of r*pe, i always believe the victim until proven otherwise.

[tfan1]

It’s always innocent until proven guilty in a court of law 🙂

[Grond21]

With very few exceptions, it's innocent until proving guilty from my own judgement.

[DarkLegacy]

Innocent until proven guilty. In the UK it is written into the law

[AngryCarl2]

Innocent until proven guilty. Except Trump. We know what you did, Donald.

[Chthou95]

Its the first. Everyone deserves a fair trial. But how many people actually believe in that and go along with the latter?

[WhiteBoyChill]

My assumption is that they’re most likely guilty.

Cops don’t arrest people on mere suspicion usually.

[Lokiion]

This is so untrue it happens all the time😂

[WhiteBoyChill]

@Lokiion Tf u been smoking? I can count on one hand the number of times cops got the wrong guy

[Lokiion]

Either you stupid bias or oblivious. Anyways short list (there’s a lot more) of false charges: Deron Parks: Child sex abuse in 2010, sentenced to life in prison, served 8 years and 8 months.
• Patrick McAllister: Sexual assault in 2010, sentenced to 20 years and 10 months, served 5 years and 6 months.
• Aisha McClinton: Weapon possession or sale in 2010, served 5 months.
• Eric Anderson: Robbery, assault, illegal use of a weapon in 2010, sentenced to 15 to 22 years, served 8 years and 6 months.
• Otis Boone: Robbery in 2011, sentenced to 25 years, served 7 years.
• Livingston Broomes: Sexual assault in 2011, sentenced to 4 years, served 2 years.
• Jennifer Weathington: Murder, assault, illegal use of a weapon in 2011, sentenced to life in prison, served 5 years and 6 months.
• Elgerie Cash: Murder, assault, illegal use of a weapon in 2011, sentenced to life in prison, served 5 years and 6 months.
• Matthew Ngov: Murder in 2011, sentenced to 57 years to life, served 5 years and 9 months.
• Heidi Haischer: Fraud in July 2011, served 1 year and 3 months.
• Lydia Salce: Attempted murder in August 2011, sentenced to 16 years, served 3 months.
• Giovante Douglas and Cartier Hunter: Murder in December 2011, sentenced to life in prison, served 10 years.
• Russ Faria: Murder in December 2011, sentenced to life in prison, served 3 years.
• Jasmine Eskew: Felony assault of a child in September 2012, sentenced to 5 years, served 3 years.
• Michael Winston: Attempted murder, robbery, assault, kidnapping in 2012, sentenced to 26 years, served 5 years.
• James Frazier: Murder, other violent felony, conspiracy in 2013, sentenced to life without parole, served 5 years and 8 months.
• Clarens Desrouleaux: Theft in 2013, served 4 years.
• Jesus Sanchez: Murder in 2013, sentenced to 45 years, served 4 years.
• Sherman McCoy: Murder, gun possession or sale, conspiracy in 2013, sentenced to life without parole, served 2 years and 8 months.

[Lokiion]

at least 5% of people in jail are innocent which is a lot considering how many people are in jail

[WhiteBoyChill]

@Lokiion It wasn’t like they didn’t have good reason to believe most of those guys were guilty. And I’d even argue that some of them still probably were

[Lokiion]

They still were falsely charged with something they didn’t do and spent time in jail and got nothing in return but wasted years off life so yeah police get it wrong a lot

[WhiteBoyChill]

@Lokiion But they also get it right 20x more often than they get it wrong.

[Lokiion]

Ok that doesn’t mean they not wrong a lot a lot of people in jail 5% of that is a lot you just said you can count on your hand how many times they were my whole point is that you can’t since it’s thousands of times

[Anonymous]

The media pretty much makes them guilty until proven innocent, even though we are supposed to be innocent until proven guilty

[Sabretooth]

It depends on what we're talking about in. How transparent was the individual?

[robocop666]

In Spain your guilty until innocent. People are in hell there.

[Simslover92]

Innocent until proven guilty in most cases.

[Avicenna]

To me, the state still has to prove its case.

[Dargil]

Republicans, A
Democrats, B.

[Drumlin2001]

Innocent till proven guilty

[LiamJHayden]

Innocent until proven guilty.

[Sasahara]

In general, innocent until proven guilty.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

Innocent first til proven otherwise.

[In_Trance]

Depends on the circumstances