Why oh why are republicans f*cking up everything right now when they are could so easily destroy democrats in 2024?

[Anonymous]

I used to believe republicans were mostly the party of common sense & logic. Yes there were always far right fringe groups (like Q’Anon) which I will not have anything to do with. But they are near powerless in the grand scheme of things.

Liberals tended to smear anyone who voted for Trump as a “fascist” in 2016 and 2020. But I know vast majority of conservatives are not like that. We do have plenty of conversations behind closed doors & most of us are nothing like what left accuses of us of being. Most of us voted for Trump to SPITE the left for unfairly spiting us to begin with.

Anyway republicans might control “big oil” but virtually all other institutions of power (big tech, mass media, public education and most terrifying of all the deep state and the legal system) have been taken over by democrats.

So why are republicans doing asinine things like having morons Matt Gaetz oust speaker Kevin McCarthy? If you are infighting when you are the underdog you are going to lose before you even start. Republicans can’t afford to have Down syndrome behavior like circular firing squads.

So why the hell are so many republicans getting behind Trump in the primaries vs. getting behind a level headed younger candidate that could destroy Biden with his eyes closed?

DeSantis could drink a whole bottle of NyQuil and look more awake then Biden. He could start smoking crack daily from now until November 2024 & still be more level headed and coherent then Biden.

Why the f*ck are republicans getting behind the one candidate (Trump) that Biden has any chance at beating? Why? I get that most of Trump’s legal turmoil was disgusting, heinous and unfair. He has my sympathy to a certain extent. But I’m not going to vote for him in the primaries just to watch him lose to Biden. F*ck no.

Why can’t so many dumbass republicans not realize that there is no substitute for victory? And if you truly believe that the 2020 election was “stolen” then why is Trump still running given it’s “rigged”.

Updates

6 mo

Just a few other points. I said that MOST of Trump’s legal turmoil is disgusting. But I didn’t say ALL of it was wrong. He really did screw up and likely committed a crime in the Florida case. But either way I don’t want him. Not only is he too much trouble but he is TAKING THE FOCUS OFF BIDEN. The media loves that. Just loves it. I just don’t get why so many republicans are so blind to recognize that. Just so stupid.

[nightdrot]

You misunderstand the nature of both American political parties.

American political parties are not ideological parties as you tend to see in Europe. Rather they are lose knit coalitions of regional, religious, ethnic, racial, income and other groups that have come together in part by common interests and in part by historical accident.

In the case of the GOP, it is a coalition made up of classical liberals - which Americans call conservatives - libertarians, small and medium sized business, religious and social traditionalists, lower middle and upper middle income earners, farmers, rural and exurban populations, and historically older voters. It tends to dominate the South, the Great Plains, the Rocky Mountain West and the state of Alaska - though this is starting to change somewhat.

On the Democratic side you get, ethnic and religious minorities, middle and high income wage earners, big business and entertainment industries, urban and inner suburban votes, radical liberals - which Americans call liberals. (Note, the term "radical" here does not mean as Americans use it, i. e. "extremist," but rather as the ancient Greeks used the term, meaning "to the root of.") The regions where it is dominant are northeast, the mid-Atlantic, the Pacific coast and the state of Hawaii. (Though again, this is starting to change and is one of the reasons that Mrs. Clinton was defeated in 2016.)

This is how you get a Republican Party that runs from Ted Cruz at one end to Susan Collins at the other, with the libertarian Rand Paul thrown into the mix. This is how you get a Democratic Party that runs from Joe Manchin at one end to Elizabeth Warren at the other. Quite simply, party identification is not about ideological identity.

Thus, you tend to get periods of intraparty infighting. Indeed, as Will Rogers famously said many decades ago, "I am not a member of an organized party, I'm a Democrat." Par for the course.

What is aggravating this infighting at the moment is that the nation is experiencing a populist upsurge in the culture. Populism is not a consistent political philosophy. Rather it is a political expression of the envy and resentments permeating the culture and tends, therefore, to a rough anti-establishment and anti-authority expression in both rhetoric and policy.

This is happening in both parties. (See also Robert Kennedy Jr.) It is what happened in Congress. Rep. Gaetz representing the populist wing of the GOP and therefore taking a wrecking ball to the party leadership. The Democrats opportunistically took advantage of this and thus the Speaker was expelled.

These populist waves are not unheard of in American history. See also the 1960s and 70s. See also William Jennings Bryan in the 19th century. The main difference this time is that the technologies of the past were unifying. See also movies, radio, television - all mass media. The new technology tends to a hyper-individualism, this aggravating the divides in society and thus the parties.

The bottom line, what is happening in the GOP is symptom, not cause. Like previous populist periods, this one may gradually exhaust itself. People grow weary of tumult and seek order and quiet.

How long this will take is hard to gauge. Bottom line, though, you are lamenting an earthquake. It is unfortunate, but it is the result of forces that even the participants cannot control.

[Asker]

Well thought out response sir.

[Asker]

I still think it’s complete Down syndrome insanity that republicans think they can afford inflighting despite having a huge uphill battle to begin with.

The difference between now and the 60s/70s is the modern mass communication is dominated by the left. They control the messaging. That in itself accounts for at least 5 percent points in general elections.

Speaking your mind like Matt Gaetz just to be “heard” is no substitute for victory. Nominating Trump to spite the left is definitely no substitute for victory if he ends up losing to that walking corpse Joe Biden. It’s no coincidence his name is all in the headlines when the focus should be on BIDEN.

[nightdrot]

Well, Rep. Gaetz believes what he does and was elected to carry out that mandate. I tend to agree with you, but "victory" is defined by the attainment of the goals that you set out and were elected to attain. For populists like Rep. Gaetz - and again, I am no fan and happen to think that populist politics is profoundly mistaken - to simply define victory as retaining a majority without attaining the policy goals he and others like him set out is no victory at all. Indeed, it is symptomatic of the problem in their view.

As to the modern communications, here too you are ignoring much history. See also, for reasons to save space, my response to this question: Do you believe the American mass media is unfairly biased? ↗

My answer was rated MHO.

Also, I am no fan of Mr. Trump. In fact, they are both populists and you could measure the differences between them with a micrometer. However, for reasons of space, we will leave that for another day.

[nightdrot]

CORRECTION:

This sentence: "Also, I am no fan of Mr. Trump. In fact, they are both populists and you could measure the differences between them with a micrometer."

Should read: "Also, I am no fan of Mr. Trump. In fact, both he and Mr. Biden are populists and you could measure the differences between them with a micrometer."

[slatyb]

There's nothing libertarian about the Christian Dominionists. That's good old 100% pure fascist theocracy.

[nightdrot]

@slatyb Okay, and if you find a large number of Christian Dominionists in American politics - not to mention a Fascist theocrats - call back. In the meantime, suggest you take some coursework in political philosophy and intellectual history.

Seriously, whatever your views, name calling is not a substitute for serious analysis.

[AviatorTom]

It's not Republicans as a whole. It's a small splinter group who get upset every time something goes against their way. Unfortunately, the US Federal government has deteriorated where a small minority can rule.

The rest of the world is laughing at the US. Where else can the leader (Kevin McCarthy, Speaker of the House) be removed by just one person, Matt Gaetz?

[AviatorTom]

Thanks for MHO

[Soteris]

I could easily ramble here for hours on how you misunderstood everything, but let me just point to two factors in this collapse of the GOP.

First of all, and this is something that happens very often in history by the way, is that the GOP runs on a false platform. The old GOP did not actually believe the propaganda that they pushed. They said things and promised things to get people upset and invested in their political positions. They would for example talk about illegal immigration but never really do anything about it or talk about abortion but never actually outlawing it.

They knew that the value in these things were not the solution but the problem itself so they had to maintain the problem to keep benefiting from it. If they actually "built the wall" or banned abortion or any other number of crazy polices then everything would go to hell. It was a scam and they were all in on it.

This new breed of GOP members however grew up on this. Being bombarded every day by statements about how they should ban this, or outlaw that. How it was all that groups fault or whatever. Instead of realizing that this was all a scam, they started to become true believers in the message that the GOP was putting out. Zealous believers as it turns out. So when it came time for them to enter politics and replace the old guard, things started to go sideways. Tea Party, QAnon, MAGA etc.. are fueled by their ideological beliefs.

Strategic thinking is out the window, this is a matter of religion for them. There is no reasoning with lunatics like these and also why they can't cooperate with the GOP old guard who only wants to give out the appearance but on the inside dont want to actually do anything.

This, among other things were the growing problem within the GOP.. and then came the 2nd factor which tipped it all over. Trump.

Trump, just like the old GOP is a conman but that is where the similarities stop. While the old GOP were able to construct this elaborate cooperation to scam USA as a whole, Trump has some kind of mental problem that makes him unable to emphasize with anyone else and he is also not very smart. That means that he could not see the bigger picture of the old GOP where they all existed to benefit each other. Trump was only concerned about benefiting himself.

Trumps plan going into the GOP was to suck it dry of the two things he cared about. Money, and prestige (AKA attention). Trump is like a cancer in the party and funneling all the resources intended to maintain the party into himself instead, and the new zealous ideologues LOVED him.

Before the election when Trump was just a candidate, I predicted that he would either lose or if the GOP were stupid enough to elect Donald Trump as president then they would destroy their party. So far I have been proven right, both on the stupid part and the fact that Trump has been tearing this party to pieces.

Trumps ascension to the presidency became the Ideologues ascension to GOP politics. No longer were the GOP politicians carefully planning and making rational decisions (granted it was to profit from corruption). Now there was no longer any thoughts or regards for the stability of the country or, perhaps more importantly for selfish politicians or your question in particular, the stability of the GOP itself. The GOP no longer benefits everyone, you have to fight for your own share now and you have to fight your fellow colleagues and in the process you bring the GOP down with you.

The GOP as a political party is probably doomed. The "rational" (if corrupt and evil) side of the party is the old guard which is going to be replaced simply because they are dying off and they are going to be replaced by more and more crazy people. Maybe if the GOP crashes and burns you can finally have some competent individuals try resurrect it from the ashes but that would be a herculean task.

[BootsLover94]

The old GOP basically love to win elections and make $$$ while this new GOP love pissing off the majority of the country off. Most Americans will not vote for these crazies

[Soteris]

@BootsLover94 Yeah, the old GOP were pretty good at winning elections while the new GOP are more interested in getting likes on social media. Its a strange transition.

[BootsLover94]

I think that the GOP will become extinct very soon

[Asker]

@BootsLover94 ah democrats have saying “the GOP will go extinct” since the Obama administration. They thought that the “browning of America” combined with progressive whites would be the new super majority voting block.

But they are WRONG. A growing number of minorities are voting republican including Latinos. Do you think working class latino families like “trans ideology” crap that white progressives are pushing? The Democratic Party has its own issues.

But one thing I will say is the Democratic Party did a much better job at staying united vs. the GOP particularly when it came to congress. AOC hated Nancy Pelosi but she didn’t try to oust her. They came to a truce. As someone as batshit crazy as AOC can make peace with someone she disagrees in her own party than why the f*ck can’t republicans stay united? Democrats have a lot more room and power (mass media) to make mistakes too. Yet they didn’t jump on rakes with both feet.

You probably disagree with me but I personally want Biden OUT. Gone. Off to the nursing home where he belongs. He has screwed up EVERYTHING namely the economy. He’s deeply unpopular and it should be easy for the GOP to get rid of him.

But instead republicans rather engage in stupidity and snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. I can’t make up excuses for people like Matt Gaetz or the masses of idiot is backing Trump in the primaries. Personally I think everything is going as exactly as planned by the democratic elitists.

[Soteris]

Oh I won't deny that Biden is a terribly weak candidate. Not really for the reasons you believe, such as him being bad for the economy or whatever, but because he is really bad at promoting himself and doing all that other stuff. Biden has accomplished plenty of things during his time as president but he sure as hell have not bragged about any. Before I specifically looked them up I had not heart a peep about them which is going to be a major problem during a presidential election campaign.

But if Biden is bad at running for president, the GOP has proven themselves to be oh so much worse. This next election could very well be a republican blood bath unless they sharpen up real quick.

[RealMarek]

“republicans might control “big oil””: Hate to break it to you, but big oil is forcing its employees into DEI, targeted white males during layoffs, and discriminates against white males in hiring and promotion. To the extent the fund GOP candidates, this funding serves to keep the GOP from doing anything about ESG and affirmative action.

As for the Republican Party, it serves the neoliberal elites as controlled opposition. McConnell and McCarthy sabotaged their own candidates on the populist right during the mid-term election. Disappointing results in an election cycle they should have dominated were preferable to them than allowing people into power who represent the views of their constituents as opposed to the neoliberal elites. This betrayal of everyone in the party who is to the right of the party establishment caused the difficulty McCarthy had attaining the speakership and, after McCarthy was found to have broken the promises he made to get elected as speaker and made a deal with Biden to slip funding for Ukraine (at a time when a majority of Americans, not just Republicans, are against such funding) into the general budget instead of allowing it to be tested by a vote these disaffected populists were bound to punish him.

For many Americans, there is no point in electing Republicans to office if they simply continue the neocon/neolib globalist policies of the regime.

[BootsLover94]

Because they would rather fight each other than win. They do not care about winning

[Asker]

And I’m sick of it. So stupid.

[exitseven]

Republicans are divided because the old Republicans want to go back to the Bush years when they were the party of the rich. Rhe party changed in 2016 to include anyone who believes in the American dream. Anyone who sees America as exceptional experiment Thomas Jefferson George Washington and John Hancock envisioned. The old guard is desperately trying to keep relevant but they are increasingly being pushed out by younger, more inclusive candidates.

[slatyb]

Inclusive? Sure, as long as your are straight, white, and Christian.

[exitseven]

@slatyb like Vivek or Donalds? When Trump was president people of color saw their wages rise in fact all demographics saw a significant rise in pay.

[slatyb]

Easily? You must live in the hinterland. The Republicans are a shrinking minority in the United States and are in power in Washington only because of the over-representation of rural states in the Senate and Electoral College.

[Asker]

“Hinterland” where we have record hyperinflation, an impending recession, skyrocketing urban crime rates, a crisis at the southern border and taxpayer funded money pit with the Russo-Ukraine war (we are giving them cash now not just military equipment).

I guess my “hinterland” includes a senile incompetent corrupt 80 year old president who looks like he is going to keel over second when he walks up Air Force One or trips on the stage. The fact his approval rating that is been often lower than Trump’s during his same time in office must be a weird coincidence too. All this despite the fact Biden gets the full protection of the mass media.

But again I have to admit core republicans are f*cking this all up. If they got behind any other semi decent presidential candidate besides Trump they would send Biden off to the nursing home where he belongs before he could of even mumble “Matlock!”

But I can’t make up excuses for how the GOP somehow snatched defeat from the jaws of victory.

[slatyb]

Republicans keep pushing social policies that win primaries but lose general elections, like bans on abortion and the destruction of public education. They do well with the homeschooling fundamentalists but are huge losers in a general election. Abortion restrictions lost big in Kansas, big in Wisconsin, and big in Ohio in August. It's going to lose again in Ohio in November.

[Asker]

Actually I don’t disagree with the radical push on abortion abortion. It took 50 years to overturn Rowe vs. Wade by now some ultra conservatives think they can get pro life policies in bluish swing states. Ah hold your horses.

But what are you saying about “destruction of public education”? If you are saying public schools should be teaching K-3 school children trans ideology bullshit then I am all for the “destruction” of that kind of “education”’.

But I know. Leftists have to indoctrinate young children in their ideologies because grown adults see the insanity of it. But really keep pushing the “we are coming for your children” and see how that works out in elections. Didn’t work out too well for Terry McAuliffe in the 2021 Virginia gubernatorial election.

[Asker]

*abortion abolition.

[goaded]

"record hyperinflation"? It's 3.7%! (12 months to August.) It was higher in 2006, 2008, 2011, as well as 2021 and 2022. Inflation hit 15% in 1980, and even that wasn't hyperinflation.

[DarkWinterNights]

Countries going to hell regardless. We can’t recover from this. No matter who we elect. A decade from now America will be a very different place.

[jahaims]

Both sides are playing you. They have the same goals/agenda. The stuff done in public is to keep you fighting with each other so you don't see what is behind the smoke and mirrors.

[Dargil]

Because Republicans are The Stupid Party.