Think we should have forced Southerners to tour plantations after the Civil War?

[OddBeMe]

Not sure most understood what slavery actually was. They were just fighting for white supremacy. Lazy fcks.

The Germans “knew” what was happening during the Holocaust. They benefited. They felt good about “being Aryan” like Confederates. But I don’t think it set in until the camps were liberated and films were shown.

Like you would riot if you saw in person how the poorest kid lives today…in cockroach feces.

[handsomelad70]

Americans operate at a sixth-grade level, meaning they often lack empathy like an average pre-teen, plus most post-Civil War Southerners still believed in black inferiority so they'd have come up with white supremacy-based excuses about slavery's "benefits" for African Americans, which some whites apparently still believe. (For example, Glenn E. "Schemy" Schembechler III, who in TWENTY TWENTY-THREE expressed such racist sentiments and lost his post at the University of Michigan, where his revered father, the late Glenn E. "Bo" Schembechler, Jr. was football Head Coach from 1969-1989.)

[OddBeMe]

Yeah…same for Germans post war. They do have good de-nazi education tho

[handsomelad70]

Unlike America, whose mis-education system minimizes the grievous, generational harm to African Americans which began with their importation to America as slaves beginning in 1619 and in some ways continues in 2024.

[DrPepper12]

Quite a few here and in the South believe that institutional and structural racism is illusory and false. Only the very privileged could take that POV

[OddBeMe]

All true.

[msc545]

@DrPepper12 truth

[Anonymous]

Why are you still talking about slavery and the plantations like it’s an issue today? Like yeah, it happened and it was horrible. Blacks sold other blacks to slavery and people took advantage of it, white people but there were black slave owners too. It’s history though. Non of us were alive when this happened. There are however still slaves today, maknly in the middle east and africa. Go there and preach, try to save an actual slave in the present time when they can still be saved. But of course you won’t, it’s all just talk and no action. You’re warching this shit happening now around the world and still do nothing, just like people of the past watched it happen and did nothing. You’re just like them, we all are.

[msc545]

The reason this is being brought up now obviously is because the racism continues unabated for the most part. It has continued ever since slaves were brought to this country and it will continue for many years to come if not forever.

[OddBeMe]

@msc545 this.

[OddBeMe]

Honestly your lack of appreciation is why.

[DrPepper12]

Way to miss the point ENTIRELY!

[purplepoppy]

All they'd see would be fields. A much better idea would be to give each one a taste of the whip, just a lash or two. Perhaps it could have become a tradition with a whipping day every year

[OddBeMe]

There’s still a slave plantation open for tour like Auschwitz. Shows whipping posts, chained up dungeons, etc.

There was an antebellum facade pushed by gone with the wind shit about gentle slavery. Same as Germans tried after the war.

[DrPepper12]

I like the karmic justice meets hunger games vibe!! You got my vote @purplepoppy

[Avicenna]

Odd, you might want to inform yourself about postwar Germany before you try spouting nonsense- that country has done a very good job of owning up to what happened between 1933 and 1945.

[OddBeMe]

@Avicenna might want to read up on the Historikerstreit before you embarrass yourself…even more.

[Avicenna]

I'm familiar with it, but you're wrong in analogizing it to a view of slavery in the antebellum South as "gentle slavery". If you were more familiar with German political and historical discourse, you wouldn't make that false analogy. It's much better that such things get debated openly. One of the issues raised during that time (in the late 1980s), was whether the Holocaust was a unique crime.

While there are some exceptions and even some deniers, Germans do not mispresent the Holocaust- read a history textbook if you doubt that. You will see a lot more of revisionist history on the Holocaust in the Anglophone world.

[Avicenna]

The point about debating openly is to debunk nonsense. If the discussions are not public, it's much harder to debunk them before they metastasize.

And the larger point about racial and ethnic hatred and what it can lead to is most important to remember and teach to younger generations.

[OddBeMe]

@Avicenna I’m probably more familiar with German and Confederate history than you will ever be.

Despite good education denazification there has always been a movement to push the Holocaust off to just the SS, and even just the top SS. Hell there were books proclaiming Hitler didn’t even know. Dumb fucks.

They all knew, even the civilians.

[Avicenna]

I very much doubt that you're more familiar with German history than someone who speaks German, has relatives there and has lived there over half his life.

You're equating fringe views with the mainstream- such views are not mainstream. German schools are very good about properly educating students about the Nazi era, and that is a much better indicator of mainstream views and what actually matters.

by the way, people who lived through that era find it difficult to talk about it.

[OddBeMe]

Actually an outsider usually has a better perspective especially when you have family dependent on our debate. Lol

[Avicenna]

What I'm saying is that you are making the same mistake that you make when discussing US politics- you generalize fringe views as belonging to a much larger group of people than they do. it's part of your caricatures.

[OddBeMe]

Fringe views: is a Presidential nominee fringe now? Dumbass.

[DrPepper12]

@Avicenna tis true! USA Americans love to extrapolate from erroneous, biased, misleading or simply made up data Because it "feels right".

[DrPepper12]

I think the election of 1876 was a tragic mistake when the northern states negotiated away federal troops stationed in the South. South went right back to slavery in all but name by 1890s. Like the war never happened.

Fact is we never came to terms with our civil war. No "Truth & Reconciliation Commission" just anger and violence that still summers in a stew of lies, bigotry and Christo-fascism.

[OddBeMe]

True and love the pic. Mho

[msc545]

MHO right here!

[Chazmatazz269]

Most people don’t really know what they’re fighting for. That’s why we use political propaganda to promote war, and not real footage. If you could watch video of Palestinian children being butchered by “the good guys” and still promote what Israel is doing, you’re a psychopath - full stop.
That said, i think everyone should have to witness firsthand the horrors of war, ALL war. Especially what the Nazis did. It might be the ONE thing that could put an end to the almost endless hyperbolic and ignorant comparisons of everyone we don’t like to Adolf Hitler and the Nazis.
Might even ACTUALLY bring an end to war. Give people something REAL to consider before they support armed conflict.
I’m also in favor of mandatory conscription for EVERYONE in favor of war. If YOU like it so much, YOU go fight it!
TA DA! No more foreign conflicts.
You’re welcome.

[loveslongnails]

Many people in the south, especially in the deep red south, still believe the Confederacy was rightfully formed to protect the South's states right to govern themselves no matter WHAT. They will tell you it was all about their rights, and the North was the aggressor. These same confederate flag fliers have never once read their own state's letters of secession, nor have any idea what the Cornerstone Speech said, much less who said it. They are some of the most ignorant people you will ever meet when it comes to history. It's physically and mentally depressing trying to talk to someone like that.

[WindAtMyBack]

They knew what slavery was about. Contrary to what you imply, they didn't like it either. Only a small minority had slaves, and an even smaller minority were plantation slave owners, who were not in any way representative.

England was the one who wanted slavery. In fact, they demanded it before the US gained independence.

[OddBeMe]

I read 30% of southerners had some business in the slave trade. Plantations were the top 1%.

And they liked the boost to their ego. Lazy fcks.

[WindAtMyBack]

I don't believe that for a minute. Unless you are looking at the effects of slavery in the overall economy. In that case, pretty much everyone in the South, the North, and most of Europe was affected by it.

I've read closer to one in fifteen owned slaves. Slaves were expensive, and not many people could afford them. Most people who did own slaves owned a small number of servants. Only a tiny portion were plantation slave owners, and they basically served the European market - which is why slavery existed in the south in the first place. It almost died out on it's own until there was a surge in demand in Europe.

[OddBeMe]

Duke university good enough?
socialequity.duke.edu/.../8.10.20.pdf

[WindAtMyBack]

That's not Duke University. It's just some person with an agenda. But even if Universities like Duke took such a stance, which they don't, it still wouldn't mean anything.

[msc545]

@WindAtMyBack Horseshit!

[WindAtMyBack]

You're a fucking retard. Go fuck yourself.

[msc545]

Reported, clown.

[OddBeMe]

not duke university…yet duke. edu clearly shown.

And they don’t keep debunked research up for perusal

[WindAtMyBack]

It's a PERSON from Duke. Having an edu address doesn't mean shit. But apparently you're too stupid to figure that out.

On top of that he's a self proclaimed reparations advocate. Which doesn't exactly give the person credibility.

Now fuck off asshole.

[msc545]

Reported this too.

[WindAtMyBack]

@msc545
Oh, I'm scared
Now fuck off mother fucker.

[OddBeMe]

How do you think research is done shithead? A person does it and is PUBLISHED by accredited sources like DUKE UNIVERSITY

[OddBeMe]

@msc545 he’s an ass but as long as he doesn’t get spammy I don’t report.

[msc545]

ok...

[OddBeMe]

@msc545 but wind is a piece of shit. So I won’t be sad seeing him go.

[msc545]

Well I just reported his ass three times in a row. Maybe this time the moderators on here will actually do something about this although I'm doubtful.

[msc545]

I mean after all he's an influencer and I'm not so there's that.

[OddBeMe]

@msc545 I def don’t blame you. I just hate mods lol

[Avicenna]

Well, you're a Southerner and descended from plantation owners and white supremacists. Have you apologized to the descendants of slaves and the descendants of the Union Army troops who died because of your ancestors' white supremacy and ownership of slaves?

[OddBeMe]

How many times have I argued for reparations? And you replied…what?

[OddBeMe]

Nuthin huh? Scion of black repression shall be your moniker.

[Avicenna]

I remind you here that you have previously admitted to "being racist but trying not to be" (I know, everyone, try not to laugh...),

So you have argued for reparations to be paid by OTHERS due to YOUR guilt. You've done nothing but ask others to pay. You've only been asked to apologize, and you can't even do that...

... and you have (predictably and bizzarely) lashed out at me. You might want to ask the hundreds of African-American kids I helped graduate from high school how much I supposedly "repressed" them. Not that you would care- you're on record as claiming they all African-Americans are "crowded into ghettoes".

You will always be the Scion of Segregation and Slavery because you go from one extreme to the other- now you are racist towards whites and Jews, even to the point of calling for them to be stripped of their US citizenship.

Maybe you should tour Auschwitz to see what anti-Semitism and other forms of racism leads to before you become even more extreme.

[OddBeMe]

Not others. But what’s your view of reparations?

I’m guessing anti…you racist fuck.

[Avicenna]

Odd, you have admitted that you're racist and your many comments have reinforced that. No one takes you seriously when you call someone else racist because they don't want to pay for you to expiate your racist guilt. You just want others to hand over money and ignore the underlying problems (problems that, incidentally, are worsened by racist policies that you vociferously support, such as allowing unlimited numbers of people to enter the country illegally) that a lot of people, black and non-black face.

Reparations don't solve the underlying problems. Opposing them isn't racist. But while we are on the subject, how much do you think should be paid per person in reparations?

Everyone knows you are a racist and anti-Jewish piece of shit, Odd. Wanting others to pay for it doesn't get you off the hook.

[OddBeMe]

So you’re against reparations for ancestors of slaves…yet you keep stupidly saying I’m the racist. Hahahaha

[Avicenna]

Well, one of my grandfathers was a slave laborer 80 years ago. Do you see me running around demanding reparations for it? No. And US slavery ended 160 years ago.

But you refuse to answer how much should be paid in reparations per person. Have you even thought about it and what it might accomplish?

And, yes, you are an ultra-racist, also toward blacks. You support policies that displace them from the labor force, from affordable housing and even from local social services.

[OddBeMe]

You’re like @Juxtapose who think they can be 100% NOT racist which is a virtual impossibility.

That’s what I meant by “try not to be”. We’re all tribal morons.

[Avicenna]

That would actually be a really good discussion to have. But do you see why guilt is a bad driver of policy?

[Juxtapose]

I am right and am 0% racist.

[OddBeMe]

Jux I could go through your history and prove that 100% wrong.

You’re just not that important enough.

[OddBeMe]

@Avicenna I see the argument that guilt can be a bad driver of policy but how else does shit get done?

Flint water is STILL fcked

[Jackblue]

Sure and alongside that everyone northernern white, southern white, and African American should have had to see the famished conditions that "free" Africans lived in and then decide for themselves which is worse. Large numbers of blacks also emigrated to Haiti after in became independent, most migrated right back they preferred living under white supremacy to a land neglected by white trade.

[Drewtate]

Democrat voters were sheep back then and still are, democrat voters will vote to genocide Palestinians

[Sevenpointfive]

after? what good would that have done? a bunch of white dead people strewn about?

[Dargil]

They do all the time. I've been to 5. Toured Trail of Tears sites as well.

[Juxtapose]

Most people in the South were not slave owners.

[OddBeMe]

As I eluded to shit for brains. Fuck me. can't be your mental crutch

[Juxtapose]

[OddBeMe]

I’m pissed at other things today.

[Juxtapose]

All good 👍

[DrPepper12]

But hundreds of thousands of poor white dumfuks joined the cause. Why do you suppose that is?

[OddBeMe]

@DrPepper12 laziness. They liked being better than blacks without doing a damn thing.

[DrPepper12]

Indeed:
"If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you."
LBJ knew a thing or two about the South

[OddBeMe]

@DrPepper12 funny LBJ. Signed civil rights into law and admitted losing the south for Dems. But had some racist moments. Just the time I guess

[DrPepper12]

He was Texan through and through that's for sure!!

[OddBeMe]

Yeah that’s the catch 22 of historical figures. Morality says he’s wrong. Same as FDR when we rejected shaming Jesse Owens hand.

But they’re flawed politicians. Who did remarkable things.

[OddBeMe]

*shaking hands

[msc545]

I don't think it would have made any difference

[OddBeMe]

It really didn’t for Germany really. Polls show.

[msc545]

Racism is persistent and apparently heritable in a non-genetic but still effective fashion.

[DrPepper12]

True. We can't get rid of that limbic brain. Fear of "the other" is baked in and has really outlived its evolutionary advantage. Yet we'll be stuck with this brain for countless Millennia going forward. Fucking ironic, ain't it?

[OddBeMe]

@DrPepper12 although…. @Juxtapose claims to be a perfect un-racist human. Any pointers bruh?

[gorydetails]

Are you trying to troll or really this stupid?

[OddBeMe]

More Americans should know what your grandpappies did for a living.

[gorydetails]

I'm not jewish, remember?

[OddBeMe]

I mean who knows. But doesn’t matter. I’m sure your neo nazi pals all have black and Jew in their dna,

[gorydetails]

Well it does matter since they were the vast majority of slave holders.

[OddBeMe]

You think Jews were vast majority of slave holders?

[gorydetails]

I know they were. Jewish records indicate such.

[OddBeMe]

“any Jew who could afford to own slaves and had need for their services would do so.”

My god…every jew? Oh no. Just southerners. So Jewishness or Christianity doesn’t matter, in that both say slavery is ok. But just greed.

You fucking antisemitic shithead.

[DrPepper12]

Id LOVE to see this source!!!

[OddBeMe]

@DrPepper12 not sure Joel’s klan leader cites his sources.

[gorydetails]

Where did I say every jew? 75% of jewish families owned slaves in Charleston, Richmond, and Savannah. 40% of jewish households nation wide owned slaves.

[gorydetails]

[Avicenna]

That sounds like BS to me. Sure enough:

www.jpost.com/.../The-Jewish-slaveholders-586544

[gorydetails]

@Avicenna lol, playing with numbers.

[OddBeMe]

So could it be people in Charleston, Richmond, and Savannah were big slave owners? Jewish or Christian?

You’re the one who brought up antisemitic fuck.

[gorydetails]

75% of other groups didn’t own slaves.

[Avicenna]

Your figure is wrong. What's so hard to understand about that?

[OddBeMe]

Other groups. How about business owners in Charleston, Richmond, and Savannah?

[gorydetails]

@Avicenna 40% of American slaveholders were jewish and they did not account for 40% of the population. I don’t know why that’s hard for you to understand. You and fagbeme are pissing your pants about facts. I don’t really care who owned slaves. I don’t expect anyone who lives today to feel guilty over slavery.

[OddBeMe]

This is from 1993 but it’s probably more up to date than your racist literature.

And you better not fucking call anyone a “Hamas lover” you fucking Nazi.

www.washingtonpost.com/.../

[gorydetails]

What, I’d better not call you what you are you slimy piece of shit? I know exactly where you stand.

[Avicenna]

Anti-semites have been lying for years about Jewish involvement with slavery in the US South:

www.thecrimson.com/.../

www.myjewishlearning.com/.../

Yet we're supposed to believe that Jews were 40% of ALL slaveowners.

gory, can you find any other source to back up your claim? Even your source backs away from that figure.

[OddBeMe]

@Avicenna it’s weird to be arguing with you. And then on another post you call me a racist fuck. Lol

[Avicenna]

LMAO. Your broken clock is right twice a day, Odd. I don't want to compliment you too much, but you aren't all bad...

[OddBeMe]

The fact you think a “racist” could be right is shows how stupid your argument against me really is.

Just debate, no need to straw man me. I can take a bath here and there. But you just keep going on and on abut this scion shit and I end up ignoring your dumb add.

[OddBeMe]

*barb (and a bath lol)

[gorydetails]

Wait, you are or aren’t in support of the Palestinian protesters on college campuses? You know , the ones who are chanting death to jews?