From youth teams to professional sport franchises, we often witness organizations utilizing Native American tribe names in order to establish their popular ventures. While it appears harmless to others, many citizens see this as a misrespresentation of the Native American culture, saying that it tends to dehumanize them to mere savages. On the other hand, the sports communities defend their actions by implying that they are positive portrayals that depict Native Americans as strong, fierce and vicious warriors, which are desired qualities for a sports team to possess.
What's your view on the topic?
Is it offensive for sports teams to use Native American names and mascots?
I like these sports teams with native American mascots. I especially like what the Atlanta Braves do since they have native American culture and iconography without any depictions of the people themselves which I think is in good taste to promote the good qualities of the teams and by extension, their mascot. However I could be wrong on account someone could say cultural appropriation and that's it's own discussion in and of itself.
Cleveland Indians are less ideal for sure since it's a cartoonish caricature. I don't see it particularly offensive since American caricatures are often in pop culture and sports and I don't see a problem, but then again this is a different story. They've settled on calling the Cleveland Indians the "tribe" and going for a red C logo while still retaining chief wahoo as a secondary logo and Still technically being called the Indians. The red C logo isn't a great solution since it's confusing with the Cincinnati Reds who also have a red C as a logo in the same state of Ohio. I wouldn't mind too much if they re named the team as the Cleveland Tribe although that's up to them. Washington Red Skins are 100% other than just being called the red skins which is a bit of a toss up. The logo is realistic and not demeaning in any way. Redskins is a 50/50 deal though.
Overall they're alright, and I wouldn't change any of it, but that's not for me to determine.
We love our Chief Wahoo here in Cleveland and I don't foresee ever giving him up no matter what anyone says. My family is Irish and we have no issue with the Boston Celtics drunk ass leprechaun looking mascot. #gotribe
Here’s the thing, most native Americans live in near total poverty. Their land rights are frequently infringed upon, KEYSTONE PIPELINE ANYONE? They’re the most likely race to be shot by police officers in the United States, they have the highest suicide rate, they have the lowest life expectancy, and they have the least amount of representation in the American governmental system of any race. Native American culture has been systematically destroyed and appropriated since Europeans began to colonize the americas. And yet very few seem to care. Ultimately I think there are far better things to focus on than wether or not the name of a sports team might be offensive. Maybe we should focus on the fact that Native American water supplies are 60 percent more likely to be polluted by heavy metals and other toxic substances, maybe we should focus on the fact that Native American women are almost 3 times as likely to be sexually assaulted than women of any other ethnicity, maybe we should focus on the fact that Native Americans are a full 15 percent more likely to be killed by police officers than any other ethnicity. And keep in mind they only make up 2% of the population of the United States. Those are the kind of things that need to be focused on. Not wether the Kansas City Chiefs name is offensive.
First and foremost I think its misleading to claim "many" citizens find it offensive, I think the overwhelming majority of people don't care either way. However in my opinion not only do I not see it as a bad thing, I see it as a good thing. You don't name your team after something that you don't respect. So I would agree with the assessment that they call it this to invoke the positive aspects of the people. For instance red skin is a reference to the use of red war paint by native American people. Its a symbol of war and combat and by extension the aggression and ferocity that comes with it. This is not used as a perjorative in this sense (no different then other team names like using spartans or celtic warriors as logos or animals like bears or tigers or lions renowned for their strength and ferocity). Further more what every one is ignoring in this is that in almost every case of this, it was done with the consent of the various native American groups (for instance the fighting illini's mascot is a native American war chief. During games he does a war dance one which was taught to them by an actual illini chief and is only allowed to be done by the mascot when he knows it PERFECTLY. This is a great sign of respect.). This is also why the US military names their attack helicopters after different tribes, when they do they also have them blessed by that tribes leaders, its a sign of respect and and acknowledgment of their strength. Its a way to incorporate them into our society, a way of assimilating their culture into ours and the modern day culture. I think this attack on these practices is in fact detrimental to the native American tribes as it removes the few prominent symbols of their people from mainstream culture and thus removes the influences they may have on said culture that they are apart of and hampers their voice.
I have heard of this topic 2 times in life. There was a new up and coming football team and they had to pick a name that the NFL and every one would agree with. Most of the older teams didn't have to worry about it as much because the opinion of the few really never gotten heard. Now days every one with a cell phone can hear about the most minuscule things and sometimes get to have a say in what is going on. I wouldn't want to even try to come up with a team name for any sports team at all anyone. You will piss off a few people and wind up getting sued. I couldn't come up with a great name like the Kansas City Chiefs or The Washington Redskins. I would be trying not to be politically incorrect. Let me give it a test and tell me what you think. I have going to use my home state ok.. " The Denver football team " is pretty much the only thing I could come up with that was politically correct. I don't know how on earth you could do a mascot. I totally understand that somethings are offensive to others but that's life and we need to deal with it and get over it.
Isn't it interesting that no one ever talking about Notre Dame being the fighting Irish? This is the identity politics of giving perceived groups of hardship extra better treatment. Also no one is offended with the ethnic teams called the Texans or the Knicks (meaning dutch people).
Everything can be perceived as offensive though. I can be offended that you are offended.
Asking the question of if the football team means to be insulting by using them as a mascot is more productive.
No I don't see it as offensive though. They are using the term to be portrayed as their team being strong. It's not like they are naming them after something negative. It's really a compliment.
In the pros, it doesn't matter because they do whatever the fuck they want.
In college sports, the NCAA is this grand abusive power that, frankly, should be sued out of existence for its monopolistic powers and abuses.
The fact that Notre Dame is one of the most popular schools in the USA including having a DEDICATED football contract with NBC at one point. Furthermore, it is a Division I power in multiple sports. This means that the NCAA does not want to fuck with the Notre Dame cash cow.
By comparison, North Dakota is a power only in men's college hockey and that is not big money. So, the NCAA can do the politically correct thing without it significantly affecting its bottom line.
If the NCAA fucked with Notre Dame, the NCAA would be in deep shit. First, the NCAA is located in Indiana just like Notre Dame. Second, Notre Dame has many visible, moneyed, and high powered alumni - like lawyers who might sue the NCAA or who might create a rival organization.
So, for the NCAA, it's OK to kick the dogs, but don't kick the lions.
Again, though, in the pros, it doesn't matter to the owners because all that really matters to them are their fans. Owners will due whatever the fans want for business reasons. For instance, this is why we no longer see Chief Wahoo, the Cleveland Indians mascot. While Chief Wahoo had a lot of support, the desire to retire that logo was strong as well, so the Indians did just that... but they won't change their teamname. There's way more brand worth in that than any logo.
But the Redskins won't change because their fans don't want it... and the Redskins are worth a lot of money. Same with the Atlanta Braves.
Really, it is all about the money. It's ALWAYS all about the money.
You're saying exactly what I was saying. Some native Americans feel prideful over a team mentioning them as their symbol of strength (most likely positive and optimistic ones). Others are likely cry baby cynics that hate most of the world so they are offended.
That was what my response was about. I was asking why I've never heard one person say the fighting Irish is offense. It's because the Irish are white and pop culture doesn't think things can be offensive to white people. Imagine a fighting Zulu. That would get shut down instantly because of our double standard for what is supposedly racist to the pop culture herd bozos.
Maybe if those teams that use those 'Native' names, made an effort to connect with the Native Nations, maybe sponsor some kinds of support, depending on the Nations, and their needs, it would be more acceptable. Not every Native 'tribe' is associated with Casinos, and making Millions!! Some of the 'reservations' are horribly poor, and need help, and if some sports team uses their name, and does fund-raisers, to support them, maybe, just maybe, it might be ok? Not for me to say, but just suggesting. . .
Certainly not the Fighting Irish, according to the NCAA, but certainly so according to the NCAA who put oceans of pressure on North Dakota which eventually changed the name and logo.
Political correctness is fine until we are talking real money. Then being an asshole is fine.
Depends on the name. Actual tribes or things like “braves” are drawing from an image of native courage that’s certainly not disrespectful. Some specific names are a little disrespectful.
Redskins is probably the highest profile one that’s pushing the line a little. I don’t think it’s so bad that it should be like not said in a broadcast (some announcers avoid it). But I do think a switch to the Washington Potomacs (the actual tribe from the DC area, and the ones the main river in the area is named after) would probably be an improvement. Name that keeps the positive part of their identity but actually makes it even more “Washington”.
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Anonymous
(30-35)
+1 y
When it comes to sports they are using the names in a prideful manner. They take pride in whatever mascot they are. Should Scandinavians find it offensive that teams are called Vikings? No. My HS mascot was Vikings and we took pride in being a viking. My college mascot was Indians when I was there and we took pride in that as well. They changed the mascot after I left to a bird because of the politically correct BS. Hell, my HS viking mascot while I was there got changed from having horns to having wings because some parents were complaining about it being demonic. I just checked the HS website and apparently they changed it back to having horns again. Something is only offensive if you want it to be. Even if they are depicting Native Americans as savage tribes (as many of them were) it's still only offensive if you want it to be. There could be some Native Americans that would take pride in that. So, to them, it wouldn't be offensive. To others it may be.
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Anonymous
(45 Plus)
+1 y
Indigenous people is what the rest of the world uses. When I first moved to Texas a woman verbally attacked me for using the words Native American instead of Indian. Come to find out she was Native American and found the term Native American more offensive and used Indian herself. But Texas is weird when it comes to these things. My ex and another guy used to throw racial slurs ant each other. The other guy would call him a camel jockey and my ex would call him a cracker. This went on for awhile before my ex's co workers asked him aren't you offended? He told them no we've been friends for years.
No it is not racist. It is fucking moronic to say so. Ironically it is whites who dont like it not native americans. I am part cherokee. It does not bother me or any native American i know. They are celebrating the native americans. It all goesto intent. If they were trying to be disrespectful i can understand the argument but obviously they are not
What I, as someone who does not fit that category, think of this has no bearing on what the members of the targeted group thinks. They might actually be ok with this, they might not. Their opinion is what really matters in the end.
Here’s an example: in 1999 Warner Brothers decided to take the cartoon character Speedy Gonzales down because of concerns of stereotyping. Despite this, the League of United Latin American Citizens has always seen the characters as a cultural icon and remained popular within the Latin American community. Thanks to the petitions from thousands of fans from this community, Speedy was put back on the air in 2002 on Cartoon Network.
No way! It's more of a honor than an insult. They never name teams after something that sucks. When's the last time you saw a sports team named the sloths? the slugs? Never. Because they always name their teams after strong or powerful things. People who find it insulting are baseline retarded.
Throughout my life, I've gained friends of Native American descent. Like me, they're also sports fans. None of them have ever mentioned that they're offended one way or another by the issue. In fact, some totally support their fave teams with Native American names and mascots. I'm a bit of a Cleveland Indians fan & also like the tomahawk in the logo of the Atlanta Braves.
Some team mascots are offensive, like the Washington Redskins, or that goofy Chief Waahoo of the Cleveland Indians. Most of the other ones, like the Kansas City Chiefs or the Florida State Seminoles pay respect to Native Americans. Then you have the Fighting Irish of Notre Dame, complete with a fighting leprechaun. I don't think even the Irish would find that offensive.
The NCAA tried to force my alma mater - FSU - to abandon using the name "Seminoles.". The Seminole Tribe of Florida quickly jumped and explained that we had, in the late 1940's, asked the tribe for their permission, they had agreed, and we maintained open communication with the tribe to make sure that we did not do anything offensive. They were proud to have us using their name.
This is one more issue for SJWs to try to stick their nose in other people's business.
It's shouldn't be offensive to people. If anything I'd say that they're doing more to honor native Americans than they are to damage them. The only people offended by it are people who want to be.
Additionally, how far would we have take this? Teams with names in regards to predators, centurions from the Roman Empire, knights of England? There's a lot of names that put things and people into what could be considered a poor light, do we have to remove all of that?
How is this… Who would… No. It's fine. Nobody cares. You see, this is why I don't like the concept of culture. Look. Look at this pointless shit. At people being obssesed by it. Look at this absolutely pointless problem. Don't you have bigger fish to fry, in 'Murica? This is non-issue.
I don't think it's up to the sports teams/communities to decide what Native Americans find offensive. If they say that it's offensive and harmful to their culture, then it's offensive and harmful to their culture. And considering the literal genocide they've been put through, I think it's quite bold to assume that anyone else has a say in how their culture should be treated or perceived.
It's only been the last 8-10 years where SJW idiots say they're offended, and they're not even native Americans. If you're offended by using native American names, you need to get a life, grow up, and learn some REAL truthful history, not the made up shit they teach in schools these days.
It's not an offensive act to use a Native American name for a team, as long as it's done in a respectful way. It is disrespectful to use names that are pejorative, such as 'Redskins.' Just as we wouldn't shouldn't use for a team mane 'N------' or 'White Crackers' or 'Honkies.'
No. For the most part. . For example. A chief is a social rank. It's like saying chef. Both are coveted and honored positions. So it shouldn't be considered offensive to name your team the chefs. Same goes with the chiefs. On the other hand. The Redskins. That's an old derogatory name that came from an old way of speaking. Similar to the word coon. So. Something like that should be changed to Indians or natives. Or what have you.
In regards to the NHL team Chicago Blackhawks, Native Americans themselves said they like the recognition and say it is a respectful name honoring their heroes.
People (especially white people) shouldn't speak for the Native Americans and say what is offenseive or not.
I don't think so but is it kinda weird to see them using it. A mascots / name should have some logics behind I don't really understand the logic behind the use of native American name / mascots (I didn't searched either) but others than that I don't find it offensive.
No. I'm Irish, do hear me pitchin' a bitch about the Celtics or the Fighting Irish? I'm not into fighting! why should I be known as fighting just because I'm Irish? But, it still makes no difference at al to me that they're called that! It's just a name! I'm sure there's rock bands that use "ethnic" names but nobody ever says a word about them.
No, it's not offensive and shouldn't offend anyone at all. If you're offended by a historical figure relevant to your culture having his or her name used to express badassery or efficiency, you should be flattered. I think cars manufactured by Lincoln are badass, and that's all I know about them.
What do you accomplish by taking offense to something harmless? Besides building a negative reputation for yourself, nothing.
Anything can be offensive if you choose to get offended by it. In order to know if its purpose is offensive, we'd have to know the real reason they chose those logos.
I personally don't find it offensive, and I find it hard to believe that a team would choose a caricature, something to mock someone and offend them, as the logo of their team. You wouldn't use something you dislike or find inferior as something to represent you.
Picture this: aliens conquer the U. S, push everyone out of their home and take a few slaves. Some years after that, they invent a new sport and call their teams names like "the Washingtonians", "the New Yorkers" and stuff like that and the aliens start making human costumes for their mascots. but no human is allowed to participate until many, many years after. But then again, it's not up to anyone other than them to judge if it's offensive.
I think it is lame when they complain about a team being named after them. People wouldn't spend millions of dollars and work hard to try to win if they were using it as an insult. I guess you can't expect logical thought from a group of people that thinks getting free checks and spending it on alcohol and totaling multiple cars and parking them to rust is a good thing. Seriously, that is reality for many of them.
One interesting piece of evidence is the origin of the name Washington Redskins. In 1933, George Preston Marshall , the owner of the team, which was then located in Boston, renamed it the Boston Redskins in honor of the head coach, William "Lone Star" Dietz , an American Indian. When the team moved to Washington in 1937 it was renamed the Washington Redskins.
Have they asked permission to use the name? Is the team paying something for that name and the right to use the name? What kind of publicity is are they (the team) getting? If you don't know at least this entry level questions. Then we can't have a truly factual, unbiased opinion of the matter
I’m not Native American so it doesn’t offend me personally but i don’t like it. Just seems weird. I would hate it if Zulu was suddenly made to be a mascot for a team or sport that has nothing to do with African culture.
That is the problem... non Native Americans are the ones getting offended and speaking for them. Native americans themselves have stayed that they are PROUD of the NHL team being called the Blackhawks. And many others have said the same about other teams.
I don't care if it is or isn't, people don't own words. If you want to make a team name out of a native American tribe or with some sort of native American reference, be my guest. Most of these teams are ancient now, so insisting they change is just retarded. They're tried and true.
No, it's not offensive at all. It's meant to honor them because they were fierce warriors who won the respect of American settlers. The Seminole Tribe of Florida actually endorses the use of the Seminole name by Florida State University.
Hell, "back in the day", savagery was the order of business. The Brits taught scalping, it wasn't a native custom. The locals decided, "Damn, that's macho." and went with it. Everybody sucks.
it's litterally as offensive as using slavery times symbolism. you came, killed the vast majority of them and now you think it's fine to use their cultural symbols? what a douche move.
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Anonymous
(30-35)
+1 y
I personally don’t see how that’s seems as a bad thing? They are doing it in a good way and are showing love/like them so I don’t see why that be seen as negative.
Probably want to try those translated Chinese novels. They are pretty much that. Chinese guy, super OP plot device, runz the US sport team, got lots of medals... etc
Heck, no. A school we have to pass periodically has a team reference on its sign about their tem- the Devils. THAT is what we should dump as being offensive.
The Fist Nation peoples would probably be laughing their asses off at your concern. the ones that I've met really done give a heck for the "colonists".
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Anonymous
(45 Plus)
+1 y
People are too sensitive and need to get over shit. It’s not offensive.
Yes it is offensive, they're not celebrating a culture, they're basically stealing cultural identity to make money, native American names should be protected by copyright,
What a bull crap, how you can celebrate culture u aren't part of? Stealing cultural identity, do even know what you are talking about? Its impossible to steal it. At your age you should have known better.
Ps. Im from Europe, so maybe its just American hobby getting offended of everything.
No it's not as long as they get permission like the Florida State Seminoles they got permission. you need an NFL rivalry the Redskins versus the Cowboys this is perfect
It's not offensive to the vast majority of them. Who even believes the names were adopted to mock Native Americans? You name your team after something you respect because why would you want to be called something you hate?
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