Why I Won't Be Taking a Knee Any Time Soon

[newbie2015]

Taking a knee on the sidelines of a 49ers game during the National Anthem

By now if you haven't read about the 49ers Colin Kaepernick, you've been living under a rock. For those who haven't heard, the 49ers 2nd string quarterback initially decided to kneel during the National Anthem in late August. At the time, Kaepernick stated in an interview his protest was due to police brutality. He has recently broadened his reason to cite general oppression of blacks in America.

Though this gentleman is more successful then the majority of us, an article in the LA Times tells us several black athletes have been mistakenly incarcerated and/or accused of crimes without reasonable cause. It continues that the likely culprit is the color of their skin and that perhaps racism and oppression are experienced even in this privileged upper echelon of America's socio economic class.

I will say I respect a person's right to protest. I desire all men and women of all races to have equal opportunity. Without a voice, there is no opportunity for change. So if I believe this, why in the world do I not agree with this form of protest? In the following I'll try to explain my stance. This isn't to say i think he should not do what he wants. This is only why it is not for me.

When I think America, I don't think Cops

I have to admit I do have a decent relationship with cops. My cousin is with the state. He's a good honest man. None have given me an issue. Maybe I'd feel different if I grew up in a town where I was wrongly accused. Occasionally, I've met one I didn't think was a good person and they have tried to get me to admit what I did not do. But I've also met several doctors who fit this template too.

However, on the 28th of August, in Kaepernick's post-game interview, the transcript shows Colin's motivation for kneeling is specifically police brutality.

I find this troubling because the last fourth of July picnic I attended we didn't sing praise for police. In fact, when we read the constitution and the bill of rights there are even sections that are written to prevent America from becoming a police state, such as the right to create one's own militia and barring cruel and unusual punishment and the creation of a judicial system but with separate governing bodies. So call me crazy but why does Kaepernick decide that the anthem represents cops alone? Why not burn a flag? Or write an essay? Or burn a bible?

The history of the Anthem

The battle of Fort McHenry

Written by Francis Scott Keys. Keys, was a slave owner and advocated against the anti slave movement. However he was also one of the foremost defense attorneys of individual blacks at the time.

Regardless of his personal life and or convictions, the song was not considered an anthem until it became the battle song for the union during the civil war. It became an anti-confederacy song as to many it embodied what freedom for all meant to the men and women who fought hard to end slavery in America and maintain a unified U.S.

Civil war troops

Knowing this history it is hard for me to label the National Anthem a pro politician or pro police song. Its history suggests to me it is a pro soldier song. To me it is in fact a pro people and citizen song.

Thus in my opinion to refuse to stand for the anthem because you desire police reform is almost as comparable to protesting Dunkin Donuts because Chipotle had a salmonella outbreak. Yes! Chipotle needs to better inspect their product, but boycotting Dunkin Donuts will not change anything because other then being a fast food chain, this is where the correlation ends. In fact, protesting Dunkin Donuts could lead to that retailer suffering, thus eliminating an alternative to a chain that has served unhealthy food.

Pro Soldier

Let's touch on this. Colin told CNN late August when teammate Boone spoke out and called his protest anti armed forces, that the quarterback himself supported veterans, just not a country that swept oppression under the rug. In fact, according to an article on the Huffington Post website many veterans are backing Colin's right to kneel. So why don't I agree with it?

Firstly, when we consider recent protests and the population most greatly impacted: While the aforementioned suggests there is no socio economic class unaffected, the suggestion of recent press is inner city black men of lower socio economic means are most often targeted.

A wonderful book, "Lies My teacher Told Us," discusses that one reason people in this demographic attend college much less often is not intellect, but often opportunity. Many schools in such districts do not have supplies, curriculum, educators and funds to provide college prep for its students.

Furthermore, the importance of college was stressed even more so in Senator Bernie Saunders proposition during the Democratic primaries when he proclaimed free college as one of the big issues he was bringing to the table.

Yes, there are scholarships for the top students in almost every school, but what about a school that doesn't offer Algebra 2 even? What about the top 10 percent? What does a smart, but not genius level child have to do to compete against a student that has better scores, not because that better scoring student is more intelligent, but simply because he or she went to a richer school district?

The military currently provides an option for these students who are bright, but simply don't have the money to pay for college classes that are required for entrance. And with lack of federal aid and loans available currently, this might be the only option for some young bright minds who are smart bit didn't get opportunity because of their neighborhood.

College offers greater opportunities

While Colin might look cool kneeling, please consider how the career military drill sergeant will interpret the high school football players right to protest displayed proudly on his Facebook. There are consequences that real people need to be prepared for. For instance, decades later, those accused of skirting the Vietnam draft, including most recently Donald Trump, face judgement by some. A protest can be worthy as can feeling you are a part of a change, but there is nothing to stop your future employer from holding this against you.

Furthermore its one thing for a wealthy adult such as Kaepernick to incur reaction and criticism, but what of the very youth he is fighting for the better treatment of?

For instance, the arch diocese of Camden, NJ, recently sent out a memo telling its students anyone taking a knee would be suspended three games for disrespectful conduct. It's great to say they should respect freedom of speech, but is this not a life lesson of the real world? In a real job you speak out against your boss you get fired. You wear a shirt that doesn't follow dress code you get sent home.

In conclusion, this is a tough and touchy subject. I'm sure there are other opinions that are opposite of mine. I do respect that Colin Kaepernick has the right to share his. And I don't deny there is a need for reform. I just don't think this particular way makes much sense.

This has occurred through out history. Many times in a fighting for equality or freedom are there movements that bring about change and others that accomplish little but to leave others befuddled.

Only time will tell with this newest movement, but I for one will not be encouraging my child to take a knee. However, I will be making sure they are a champion for anti-racism. I just don't see disrespecting the national anthem as the best way to do that.

[WhiteSteve]

See here's the thing: I don't believe "freedom" is fought for and won for us through war. They just train you to think it is. Absolute freedom comes inherently with a heartbeat and brain activity, it's just up to us as individuals to protect it for ourselves. Bowing to any government, even a benevolent one, is an infringement on your inherent freedom. Wars are, always have been, and always will be about money, territory, resources, and political (and sometimes religious) influence. But a government knows that none of their people will go duck bullets on the other side of the world for their interests if you say that's what it's about, so instead, you condition the population to believe that they would be overtaken by savages if the government wasn't there to protect them, and also promoting hero worship of veterans by civilians, so this climate of nationalism is fostered. We've literally been conditioned from our formative years to believe this, through our government-controlled schools, and plucking at the collective emotional heartstrings of the population with these grand displays of patriotism. I mean, I'd start off asking why we start sporting events with a pro-America rally in the first place, but that's all part of the brainwash. Not for nothing, but if you told someone that North Korea or some other "enemy" was singing anthems or pledging allegiance or having some grand militaristic gesture like flying fighter jets over a stadium, we'd be talking about how awful and scary it is. Same thing as we do, but it's different because we don't like them and view their political system as a threat to ours. (Not saying North Korea is a great place, I'm just saying that we pick and choose what we like and don't like, and if you think the rivalry has anything to do with making sure the population of North Korea is safe, guess again.) And furthermore, we're taught to ostracize and shame unpatriotic citizens as these horrible ingrates, and throw bullshit at them to make them feel guilty about dead or wounded soldiers. It's like "how DARE you", and that's ridiculous. And I'm not knocking the military on individual levels. I respect the courage and conviction it takes to fight in a war, I just think they've been misguided as well to believe that they're fighting for one thing when it's really another.

The point is Kap and others know this is the shock value (however ridiculous it is that it shocks people) necessary to create conversation.

[raininthedance09]

To understand the full “Star Spangled Banner” story, you have to understand the author. Key was an aristocrat and city prosecutor in Washington. He was, like most enlightened men at the time, not against slavery; he just thought that since blacks were mentally inferior, masters should treat them with more Christian kindness. He supported sending free blacks (not slaves) back to Africa and, with a few exceptions, was about as pro-slavery, anti-black and anti-abolitionist as you could get at the time.
Of particular note was Key’s opposition to the idea of the Colonial Marines. The Marines were a battalion of runaway slaves who joined with the British Royal Army in exchange for their freedom. The Marines were not only a terrifying example of what slaves would do if given the chance, but also a repudiation of the white superiority that men like Key were so invested in.
All of these ideas and concepts came together around Aug. 24, 1815, at the Battle of Bladensburg, where Key, who was serving as a lieutenant at the time, ran into a battalion of Colonial Marines.

[raininthedance09]

His troops were taken to the woodshed by the very black folks he disdained, and he fled back to his home in Georgetown to lick his wounds. The British troops, emboldened by their victory in Bladensburg, then marched into Washington, D. C., burning the Library of Congress, the Capitol Building and the White House. You can imagine that Key was very much in his feelings seeing black soldiers trampling on the city he so desperately loved. A few weeks later, in September of 1815, far from being a captive, Key was on a British boat begging for the release of one of his friends, a doctor named William Beanes. Key was on the boat waiting to see if the British would release his friend when he observed the bloody battle of Fort McHenry in Baltimore on Sept. 13, 1815. America lost the battle but managed to inflict heavy casualties on the British in the process. This inspired Key to write “The Star-Spangled Banner” right then and there, but no one remembers that he wrote a full third stanza

[raininthedance09]

... decrying the former slaves who were now working for the British army:

And where is that band who so vauntingly swore,
That the havoc of war and the battle’s confusion
A home and a Country should leave us no more?
Their blood has wash’d out their foul footstep’s pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

In other words, Key was saying that the blood of all the former slaves and “hirelings” on the battlefield will wash away the pollution of the British invaders. With Key still bitter that some black soldiers got the best of him a few weeks earlier, “The Star-Spangled Banner” is as much a patriotic song as it is a diss track to black people who had the audacity to fight for their freedom. Perhaps that’s why it took almost 100 years for the song to become the national anthem.

[newbie2015]

Yes. This line does exist. The British sadly did not kindly free the oppressed though. To paint the U. Sm as the villain and a Brits as a savior is untrue and naive. The only way the black slaves were able to "earn" their freedom (and i think its an overtly offensive concept because i do believe on freedom as a god given right) was to fight for the British and possibly die. If they didn't die they were free. However, do not rewrite history. In the song (it was never a poem) the English were not the kind people. What they did would be what was once called indentured servitude. English treated everyone from the colonies to India with disrespect and made lots of promises they had no intention of keeping. It’s kinda why U. S. declared independence in the first place.

They also employed Hessian's as mercenaries.

I do believe i cited Key's beliefs above. I do not deny them.

[raininthedance09]

Knowing what the author believed in, I can't praise him or something that rooted from racism.

[newbie2015]

Thats fine. Another funny tidbit that you omutted was an interesting case U. S. vrs Crandell. After the D. C. snow riots Keys decided to take on a new target for inciting them. And you guessed it! It was a slave!

Why is this important? The defending attorneys got Crandell declared not guilty. How? Well they used Keys words against him! As i mentioned prior to becoming a prosecutor he was a lawyer who represented many blacks. "[they] read aloud a statement on the evils of slavery. When the court demanded to know its relevance, Bradley[the defending attorney] revealed that the words had come from the mouth of Key himself years earlier."

Ironically these years earlier was also the time the anthem was written. This historical context is extremely relevant when deciding how racist the anthem is in my opinion

[FINTECH2000]

@Asker The anthem comes from a foundation of racism... point blank.

[FINTECH2000]

@Asker funny how you try to justify racist behaviour.

[Saoirse_Nua]

Good take but just the point about the National Anthem, a thing I only learned the other day, there are verses shaved off the popular rendition of "The Star Spangled Banner" - Pay particular to the 3rd verse, when the British came their commander offered black slaves freedom if they joined with the British. The third verse is about the black slaves that did.
Instructional video and full text of "The Star Spangled Banner"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhqKr8-5JBQ

THE STAR SPANGLED BANNER
Say can you see, by the dawn’s early light,
What so proudly we hail’d at the twilight’s last gleaming,
Whose broad stripes and bright stars through the perilous fight
O’er the ramparts we watch’d were so gallantly streaming?
And the rocket’s red glare, the bombs bursting in air,
Gave proof through the night that our flag was still there,
O say does that star-spangled banner yet wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave?

On the shore dimly seen through the mists of the deep
Where the foe’s haughty host in dread silence reposes,
What is that which the breeze, o’er the towering steep,
As it fitfully blows, half conceals, half discloses?
Now it catches the gleam of the morning’s first beam,
In full glory reflected now shines in the stream,
’Tis the star-spangled banner - O long may it wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave!

And where is that band who so vauntingly swore,
That the havoc of war and the battle’s confusion
A home and a Country should leave us no more?
Their blood has wash’d out their foul footstep’s pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

O thus be it ever when freemen shall stand
Between their lov’d home and the war’s desolation!
Blest with vict’ry and peace may the heav’n rescued land
Praise the power that hath made and preserv’d us a nation!
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
And this be our motto - “In God is our trust,”
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

[newbie2015]

Please see my response to this very point below. The Brits said, fight for us or stay a slave. They never once offered to free them free of cost. Indentured servitude has never been my idea of moral superiority...

And please read about keys own views and how his positions changed over time per his own words and assertations. Its almost like basing an opinion of Wagner for his arguments with Nietzsche. If you only view an isolated event you are essentially quote hunting.

[Other_Tommy_Wiseau]

There's a lot to digest, but I'll start by laughing at the fact y'all read the constitution and bill of rights on the 4th... That's literally a 1st to me 😂😂😂

Next is that he didn't decide the anthem represents cops, it represents freedom and quality (land of the free). So to say that the "land of the free" is a place that still allows social injustice, has failed inner cities and education and still allows for people who openly shoot innocent people, especially minorities is what he and many see as a hypocritical society. So he's not standing for the hypocrisy we continually see in society. He's not saluting a flag that represents America, but isn't consistent in which it supposedly stands for (pun intended). We say "liberty and justice for all", yet even you acknowledge liberty and justice for all. And that starts with cops killing the people they are supposed to protect and serve

As for the military thing, the military isn't exactly for everyone, hence why they got rid of the draft. There are other alternatives as well. While the military has programs. Think about it this way; you go to college because you want an education and be able to make more money. Engineering is a great way to make money. So if you want to make bank, you and everyone should just go to school for engineering... Or accounting, finance, whatever. Doesn't make sense, does it? Engineering isn't for everyone same as the military isn't for everyone

The other is this: "In a real job you speak out against your boss you get fired. You wear a shirt that doesn't follow dress code you get sent home"

That's true, but in the real world, especially public entities and institutions, you aren't allowed to violate certain rights. Moreover, not everything your boss says needs to be done. If he tells you to do something illegal, that's aiding and abetting

I also think it makes a lot of sense. Not in that the method makes sense, but the idea has done what he said he wants to do, or at least begin, which is having a conversion and also doing something. Trust me. As a fan of the NFL and watches more ESPN than 1 should probably be proud of, I was surprised this gained any traction at all... I mean you have sides criticizing that he was a nobody, but was that close from winning a Superbowl

[Other_Tommy_Wiseau]

And I also highly doubt an employer will know or care that you took a knee for the national anthem. Moreover, I find it actually more disturbing if they hold it against you to work within your constitutional right to show support for the betterment of society. That's like holding peaceful protest against the hippies for their sentiment of the draft and perversion of the Vietnam war, which was actually a war fought over basically nothing

I also had 1 more point, but I forgot 😑

[newbie2015]

Thpughtful responde appreciated.

I will just adress the one point. I cited the military because of its g. i. bill. Its one of very few ways to go to college for almost nothing. I know many men and women of all races who enlisted for this singular benefit. Being career military is an entirely different route

[Other_Tommy_Wiseau]

Well yeah, but seems totally illogical. Now, there's opportunity benefits, but doesn't help the personal 1. In fact, it might even more detrimental. For instance, you have to get up at 5am. You have to run. You have to do school work on top of it. You have a strict schedule... While some may be able to suck it up, others can't. Not because they can't, but because it's not conducive to their benefit

So, I could've gotten a free ride to college. Got recruited in track and 1 of the top jumpers in the country. I decided not to. Nevermind some of the other bullshit (I had a specific criteria of schools), I wanted a social life, I knew I needed to focus on my school work, I had (have) a messed up back/ankles/knees/etc... And I didn't love it. I didn't love the sport. Yeah, I had the physical ability and believe I could've been an all American (I competed against a few Rio Olympians), but me doing it would've made me depressed and cause my school work to suffer. It's not that black and white

[Other_Tommy_Wiseau]

I'm convinced I would've failed out or quit anyways despite me being very bright, them having study halls, programs to help athletes keep up and get good grades. Same thing. You don't know how everyone will react. Take your worst subject in school and forcing you to do that major. Sure it's only temporary, but could you really see yourself powering through that shit?

[newbie2015]

As far as employers they would sure care if your employer was jerry Jones haha

[Other_Tommy_Wiseau]

Tryna cut deep, huh? We got more problems than his opinions 😭

[newbie2015]

Plus I HATE the cowboys! But i respect his decision to cut people who don't follow his rules. Its a conundrum

[Other_Tommy_Wiseau]

Now we got problems 😁... I thought you were checking out my profile... Also, that's ironic. Half our defense is suspended right now and in the 90s to mid 2000s, our entire thing was signing players who didn't follow the rules

[newbie2015]

Alas my quick google fact checking just told me Jones never said this! Urban legend ha. My bad!

[Other_Tommy_Wiseau]

He spoke out against it, but that was it

[newbie2015]

And you are a cowboys fan!!! Oh no! Way more offensive then kneeling for anything ;) i am teasing of course

[Other_Tommy_Wiseau]

As long as you ain't a bama, gator, georgia, lsu, notre dame, vandy (like those exist 😂), cocks, cheaters... Patriots, eagles, giants or foreskins fan, I'll be fine

[WhiteSteve]

That whole track scholarship thing reminded me of Higher Learning.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qietwObvVKM
Fudge might be Ice Cube's most underrated movie character ever, great performance.

[Anonymous]

I don't think Colin Kaepernick chose to rally "against the flag" because it represents cops, or the constitution, or what have you, but more so because the way he has chosen to protest is an incredibly visible and public one which he knew he could do alone, which would get media attention, that could be repeated, and that would probably go viral... and now, you and I are talking about it.

I do feel like the problem with posts like these is exactly what someone on some show said... everyone is so upset that Colin Kaepernick is taking a knee, but how many of those same people are upset about the reason he is protesting as all but validated a scant what two weeks later in a video of a man being gunned down with his hands above his head and the comments made by the news reporters over head knowing nothing about the man other than he was black. Where are the posts that actually address real cases of discrimination, racism, and judicial injustice? All we seem to do is not address the actual issues here, except to disagree or agree with someone taking a knee as a right or not a right to protest.

If anything Colin Kaepernick has done the job he intended, which is to call further attention to the issue, but sadly we just have us sitting around talking about a flag or some right to knee as opposed to what each of us as a society can do to ensure that there is actually more equality in this world.

[Opinion Owner]

One more note... in the school you mentioned, it was the football coach who went to the principal to draw up those papers to try and ban his team members, many of them black, from kneeling even though NO player had actually been planning or expressed any desire to kneel in protest. He is the one that actually made that "an issue," not the players themselves. Also when you choose to protest, no matter your age or your socio-economic standing, you do so because you believe in what you are protesting against and you hope to see changes. It is a risk you take that you or your chances in life may or may not be affected, but you do so because you feel it is right. We cannot start teacher young people or anyone that they should fear doing what they feel is right... we have a whole history of people from all around the world, even to this day, that must make choices to fight against injustice even if no one else will.

[Dan21196]

Three points:
One: I fought in Iraq. The best sight over there was when we were coming back to the camp and seeing a huge America flag flying. I knew that once I got there I'd be safe. I knew I could relax and I wouldn't have to worry about being killed. You fundamentally change when you realize the others are actually trying to kill you. Try to imagine that when you walk down the street. Look at the person on the other side and tell yourself that he is going to kill you. Being under the flag took all that stress away.
Two: I didn't fight for you to protest. I hate protesters. I fought so me and the guys in my squad could come home.
Three: Kaep... You are going to disrespect the flag of the country that gives you the opportunity to make $114,000,000+? Go to some other country it you're not happy.

[NJ_Casanova]

Just stopped by to say how stupid of a "protest" it is. You hate the police, protest outside the station. If you want new laws march on congress/the white house. Sitting when the "pledge of allegiance" is played is spitting in the face of EVERYBODY who has fought and died for this country , the people that gave him his freedom of speech. Also... he's at work.. not on his free time so yes he can be told what to do. NFL should just do like the one team owner and play it before the team is on the field.

[cipher42]

You realize that freedom of speech is the very reason he CAN kneel during the anthem? Honestly I think its actually more disrespectful to criticize someone for properly exercising the freedom of speech that people fought and died for. Honestly what's your point? That people died for our right to freedom of speech and therefore we shouldn't use it? Do you see how contradictory that is?

Also, you don't seem to even understand how activism works. Anything that raises awareness for a certain issue is good activism, and surely this is raising awareness. So stop criticizing the guy for properly using his freedom of speech in a perfectly reasonable way.

[newbie2015]

@cipher42. The best part of the first amendment is i get the right to criticize him :) it does work both ways...

[LindsayRB91rds]

If you want to be technical, the first amendment doesn't say anything about your right to criticize another person. It simply says that the government can't pass any laws against your speaking out against the government. The players kneeling during the pledge are doing so because the NFL is allowing them to (for all sorts of reasons, including public outcry if they disallow it). You can criticize them here because GaG is allowing you to.

They have a fair point and we ought to be talking about the issues. The protest has consequences though, and the attendance in person and through TV of the NFL games is now down as much as 14% depending on what source you read. Yep, you can protest before a game and the league won't stop you. The NFL is losing millions in revenue so I guess we'll see what happens.

[LindsayRB91rds]

Sorry - national anthem. I have no idea why I typed 'pledge'. I must have been thinking the dining room table needs to be dusted & waxed.

[cipher42]

@LindsayRB91rds: Buddy, I'm probably at least ten times more informed about the constitution than you are, and I'll tell you that your right to criticize other people is VERY much covered under the first amendment. And no, it's not about speaking out against the government, it's about speaking about basically anything. Now, it is true that the first amendment is only relevant for matters of the government itself punishing you, but given that we've literally had court cases about issues like mandated standing during the pledge or the anthem, I'd say that it is certainly relevant here.

Basically, go ahead and criticize him if you want, but leave the first amendment out of it. In any case, I personally think his stance is legitimate, and that the way he's protecting is perfectly fine since it's wholly within his rights and not hurting anyone directly.

[LindsayRB91rds]

@cipher42 Cool - we're buddies now. I could always use a new buddy.

You do claim a lot of expertise for a 19yr old. Since you do, I'll not bother you with details we talked about in a college class. Remember though, that football players are employees of the NFL and the specific NFL team. They have to play by the rules. IF the NFL requires standing for the anthem, they have to or they get fined, booted, suspended or something. So far that hasn't happened and we'll see what happens going forward. The NHL has already said that players doing this in their league won't play. Some school districts have told players the same thing.

We're all allowed to have opinions and voice them if GaG allows us to (it's their soapbox and their rules) and we don't slander or defame anyone. Please go ahead and say something scholarly as the last word. And again, thanks for letting me be your buddy!

[Pyrofox]

I like this Mytake the only thing I wanna make sure is that people who hate on the 49er's know that you can keep hating on them. But your falling to the level of the people who led to the kneeling in the first place. If you wanted to be the better person then talk it out respectfully or your only adding to the issue.

Humanity honestly sucks at fixing things as we are mostly lazy and tend to take the easiest fastest route out of the issue. Its not enough for something silent to go on we all gotta go further and just rage over it. I constantly wonder when will humanity as a whole learn to stop pouring lighter fluid on a fire.

But I see where you come from yet I also want to point out this whole issue just confirms even more that. US society is more split than equal.

[madhatters4]

great take. very even keel. i like you support his right to demonstrate a protest in a non-violent way. i don't agree with his method but i also don't disrespect him for doing so.

i feel that those saying he is disrespecting soldiers aren't in a position to say such things. many soldiers protest issues in our country, many support his protest many don't but i think to say it's disrespectful to soldiers, as if that is all the anthem or the flag stands for, is an unfair projection of one's own feelings

i think suggesting his protest is a disrespect to america don't consider the fact that america was founded by dissenters. it was founded by people who directly protested against a government they felt was opressing them. so in essence Kaepernick's protest is one of the more American things we do.

again i don't agree with his method but i staunchly defend and support his right to protest in a way that is non-violent and not against the law

[Anonymous]

(Fuck thw typos and grammar) that flag stand for America not the military

Have u notice that only white people have a problem with this.
And that one or two uncle tom.

If u are pro america then this shouldn't be a issue.

Mummand ali did the same thing. When the u. s was treating black bad and he died this year. Racism and hate still exist and your crazy not to think so.

That flag dont mean shit to people who get oppressed. And he's not only talking blacks Hispanics Or women or Muslim or middle eastern people etc

Lets be honest here people in the miltary are fighting for them selfs and there family. No one is forcing them and if they were people would have issue with that. If people really carwd then there wouldn't be homeless gets. Black people who faught in the military come back and gotta sit in the back of the bus and get treated like shit when they come home.

[newbie2015]

One of the things im involved closely with is assistong vets in obtaining benefits post return. Perhaps some are self serving. But I've heard stories to disway this belief as the rule.

Ali you cite was one of the more prominant figures who chose not to go to vietnam though drafted, much like trump

[nog6422]

@newbie2015 Veterinarians don't really need assisting.

[newbie2015]

@nog642. No. But veterans do

[newbie2015]

@nog642 and what you said about the treatment of vets us why they need advocates... For instance assistance reacclimating after returning from war. Help getting va benefits health and monetary. Support and psycho social programs.

[nog6422]

@newbie2015 I didn't say anything about that. Maybe you're confusing me for the opinion owner.

[newbie2015]

@nog642 apologies. Meant OP

[Waffles731]

Like at
@Other_Tommy_Wiseau
Said, Why on earth do you read the Constitution.
"I find this troubling because the last fourth of July picnic I attended we didn't sing praise for police. In fact, when we read the constitution and the bill of rights there are even sections that are written to prevent America from becoming a police state,"
I thin think but am not quite sure that you probably just read the bill of rights section because, I doubt you sit around and read about how Congress gets to levy taxes, how the federal courts are supposed to work, and all that shit.

[SleepingSnorlax]

I have no problem with him not standing or any other athletes or celebrities bot standing for the antham
I love this country as much as the next guy but im not one of those kids that act like they love it because its a cool thing to do and dont think about the protest at all
I got into an argument with a kid becuase he said these guys were disrespecting the country by not standing... meanwhile his freaking profile pic on fb was him sitting ontop of a flag drapped over his jeep with his feet on it... like... are you kidding?
People complain they dont want violent protest
Then when people start protesting peacfully by sitting or kneeling for the antham they complain even more
Soldiers dont fight and die for a song they fight and die to protect your freedom. Including the freedom to stand or sit or do what ever you want during those 2 mins

[AthleticMom]

Please don't publicize assholes anymore, be the spotlight intended to be bad or good. Someone has warped their brains, they haven't traveled to live in other countries enough to compare and appreciate. If I were judge, they would serve as ground troops on front lines for two years, then come back to freedom to do whatever the hell bS they want.

[Anonymous]

This all started because some shitty quarterback who lost his stuff and was benched. He wasn't getting any attention so he did this. He doesn't give a shit about oppressed people. He is a millionaire football player who was raised by rich white people. What the hell does he know about being oppressed?

[Jersey2]

This ^^

[Anonymous]

Well, America means so many things to different types of people. If people won't stand, oh well. I won't get bent out of shape about it. As long as citizens treat each other right and keep violence down, that's all that should really matter.

This video explains a different perspective.

https://www.facebook.com/durtey/videos/706389332841825/?hc_ref=NEWSFEED

[Castleguy25]

Lol, typical "I don't see nothing wrong" mantra. Kaep is doing because of the police state we live in. When he was talking about why he's kneeling, it was referenced to the fact that there is no equal justice for people of color. Everytime someone protests in this country, majority of white people complain about it. As soon as someone tells the truth about America, people get mad. The point of this was to spark a conversation and as usual people have their head in the their ass.

[Reach500]

You said, "When I think America, I don't think Cops" and that you don't see why he would kneel during the anthem to protest police brutality. The thing is, the fact that police brutality is tolerated and that police who are clearly in the wrong are rarely brought to justice is evidence of the systemic American racism that he is protesting.

[relaxrelax]

the people of the US
where people who actually believed in GOD

but are founding fathers where masons
George Washington
Benjamin Franklin
James Monroe
etc the list goes on

the tricked good people to fight for freedom of religion
which was the worst mistake ever

[cipher42]

? Are you saying we shouldn't have freedom of religion? I don't think I quite follow

[relaxrelax]

no we shouldn't have freedom of religion
right now we are allowing Syrians into the country

some are good
some are bad

they are gonna force the US to follow there beliefs or kill for it
if i ran the country i wouldn't allow them in, they cause to many issues
and if they tried to force there way in kill them

cause some of them are here to change are beliefs
and destroy the US, cause they are stupid

and no matter what beliefs cause many things
so no freedom of religion
cause religion is a belief

MY WAY OR GET THE HECK OUT MY HOUSE

[Anonymous]

The reason he really did it is because he was on the verge of being let go so he's getting media attention on himself as a desperate act to stay.

[vekin]

I never heared before about this kind of protest untill some days ago when they spoke about it on a talk show... I wouldn't do such kind of protest but it's a innocent kind of protest so I don;t see anythign wrong with it

[nog6422]

Taking a knee is pretty uncomfortable, I'd rather sit down in a chair.

[IsraelJordan]

lmao

[anonman32]

lol in Europe bending the knee would be a sign of respect since it was tradition to bend to the knee for a king.