The truth about modern Equalitarians and Humanist (a. k. a. Equali-nazis)

[Anonymous]

I've been wanting to touch on this for sometime. I'm sure you have seen these users posting on GAG calling themselves "humanist" or "equalitarians". They call everything and everyone sexist who don't agree with them. They write an anti-feminst myTake once a day. They search for anti-rape articles and make it about the lack of the adjective "male" instead of about the subject at hand.

Egalitarianism is a belief that everybody is equal. Anthropological evidence suggests that most prehistoric hunter-gatherer societies were egalitarian, and that patriarchy did not develop until many years after. Egalitarianism is an all-encompassing label for various forms of social justice such as feminism, anti-racism, LGBTQ, freedom of religion, etc. If you call yourself an egalitarian then you must support all of those causes.

Many modern day “egalitarians” do not understand what the term truly means and even believe egalitarianism is a synonym for humanism. They focus more on the rights of cisgender, straight, white males than everyone else which is incredibly contradictory to the whole concept. This bias stems from the fact that the majority of these “egalitarians” are the aforementioned - using egalitarianism as an excuse to hold onto power as the most privileged people in the world, to turn a blind eye to minority groups and shut them down.

The concept of egalitarianism is a fair one but the aim to solve everything makes it unable to ever concentrate on just one thing, leading to nothing be solved in the end. This is why different movements are needed to target each issue. Most Western nations are egalitarian in name but there is no "true" egalitarian society as patriarchy still exists, homosexuals are not given basic civil rights, the list goes on.

I wish I could list the users who claim to be equalitarians but that might be construed as an attack and have this myTake removed. But you can basically find these users spewing hate on the feminist movement and calling anyone who disagree's with them a "feminist". They claim to be an egalitarian but hate feminism while pandering to a white, straight, cisgender, male audience. This is one of the major faults of many people who call themselves an “egalitarian”. Feminism is equality - it is a form of egalitarianism and if you do not believe in it then you are not actually an egalitarian but an idiot using it’s name to benefit yourself. Try searching up the word and understand what it really means rather than focus all your attention and believe everything you see from a bunch of radicals.

They never talk about the benefits of LGBTQ, anti-racism, etc. and instead, may talk about how the minorities oppress cisgender, straight, white males (which doesn’t make sense as they are the ones in the positions of power and cannot oppress themselves - this is like an almighty king feeling helpless when a bunch of peasants haven’t given him some wool).

These so-called egalitarians derail conversations from feminism to MRAs. In fact, most egalitarians are about men’s rights while totally booting everyone else out of the image. Egalitarianism is about EVERYONE’S rights. Why so much expenditure on that one group and that one group alone? This yet again, shows their privilege.

Just like how "Equalitarians" say feminism now isn't the same as in the 1920's neither is this. Equalitarians (or Equali-nazi's) are the biggest hypocrites.

[Anonymous]

Egalitarians don't hate modern feminism, they hate feminist extremists and don't agree with the concept of "rooting for one team." Everybody has an issue with every single movement no matter how well intended. Spewing hate about equalitarianism and feminism is all the same shit.

As an egalitarian I actually believe there is benefit to having specific groups that focus on specific issues and I don't feminist hate - I just personally feel passionate about a wider range beyond just women and beyond just men. It's just like a true feminist complaining about being labeled a femininazi: you're taking the extremists or the people who poorly represent the group and take their word over the word of the actual well meaning members of the group.

Honestly this take is kind of hypocritical but I can see why you wrote it, a lot of people take being a part of a specific group as a way of preaching superiority, but that's an issue with people, not necessarily the group itself.

[jjmarvin]

Yup true egalitarianism supports feminism.

[myTake Owner]

I post at least 5 myTakes contradicting what you said from members of your group. Heck you can read the comments and see you people responding exactly how I said they would when someone doesn't agree with you.

[Opinion Owner]

You contradicted yourself enough for me to not take you seriously quite frankly.

[myTake Owner]

Funny, that's what myTake was pointing out. How most of the equalitarians on this site contradict themselves. But I didn't post this expecting those guilty of it to become enlightened. I knew they would disagree and attack. Not everyone is willing to take a step back and look at themselves. If you don't want to believe it then that's you.

[QuestionMan]

Egalitarianism -a social philosophy advocating the removal of inequalities among people
Humanism - a philosophical and ethical stance that emphasizes the value and agency of human beings, individually and collectively, and generally prefers critical thinking and evidence (rationalism, empiricism) over unthinking acceptance of dogma or superstition.

These are principles I live by. I don't care who you are or what you look like, if you act like an asshole I'll call you out on it. I don't care if you're gay or a woman or some weird gender neutral being.

[Anonymous]

Except no, this all doesn't make sense.

For example, if men's right's is actually a big issue then it makes perfect sense to pay attention to that.

By the same token Feminism should be just as much men's rights advocates as men's rights advocates are.

The fact is they are pretty much for all these good things, anti-racism etc. But the reason they are distinguished as equalist or egalitarian or whatever is because they don't what to be associated with feminism. That's the one they generally don't like, so naturally self-identified egalitarians are going to seem more like MRAs, what's wrong with that? What's so wrong about men's rights? Again, shouldn't Feminists also call themselves MRAs?

People get so caught up in the goddamn dictionary definitions of things and never actually make a point. Definitions say egalitarianism and feminism should be lumped together but many feminists reject that because quite a few egalitarians are the people who deliberately distant themselves from feminism. The real use of the words is probably more actually described by the belief in this all-oppressive patriarchy or kyriarchy thing. Feminists believe, egalitarians do not.

Feminism is such broad camp and there's this constant arguing about definitions and what words we get to call ourselves that it's meaningless. You have to choose what aspect of feminism you're specifically talking about when defining it. Context people, context.

It's mostly the feminist activists that are what drive people away from feminism to call themselves egalitarians, not the silent majority that *actually* represent equality. Anyone can call themselves a feminist, all it takes is a vague believe in "equality," then suddenly you're drinking the kool-aid of the "bullshit branch of feminism."

I'd call myself egalitarian, I typically don't like identifying as a feminist but if you have a good grasp of what "equity feminism" is then I'd be ok to identify as that. I think the silent majority of feminists are actually equity feminists for the most part. There's feminism as a vague idea of equality and then there's Feminism as a political movement and ideology, they are very different things and that's what I think most don't realise.

It's pretty straightforward really; egalitarians that don't call themselves feminists generally support all the things you listed... except feminism, because as a movement and ideology it's full of shit and the dictionary definition doesn't describe every detail of it.

[Jager66]

Very well said!!!

[myTake Owner]

Another prime example of the users I was writing about.

[Opinion Owner]

Ooo, prime? I like that, sounds cool. I take it as a compliment. A prime example of an egalitarian, sweet.

So are you going to offer counterargument or are you just going to point at me and cry 'bad man'?

Name any basic principle you think is within the philosophy that is Egalitarianism and we can talk about it, any of those "forms of social justice"(btw isn't men's rights one of those forms?). I think you'll fine me as fair as they come, although I suspect if there is a point of contention it will be regarding formal equality vs. substantive equality.

[myTake Owner]

So you just agreed that you are a hypocrite. Nice.

Counter argument for what? You proved my point in this myTake. Users are posting say equilitarians are not what I said but you proved I was right. Thanks again for being a prime example of the hypocrisy.

[Opinion Owner]

Point out my hypocrisy then, show me the error of my ways.

[sdistotallyme]

It's funny to see the take owner act all defensive and in denial. She won't listen or admit to any anything that contradicts her take. Nothing. Typical feminist mantra "the woman is never wrong". .

[Opinion Owner]

I found a video that I think fits nicely for this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpPebV2ZqwQ

[myTake Owner]

@sdistotallyme & anonymous you two only claim I'm in denial because your have done exactly what I said you people would do when someone opposes you. FYI I'm not a feminist.

[Opinion Owner]

It's not about you being a feminist. It's about why other people don't want to associate with feminism.

Did I outright claim you were in denial? I invited you to a discussion.

And I don't think I have done 'what you said,' you're just saying I have but you should have no problem pointing it out for me. I would love to be proven wrong, seriously, if my worldview differs from reality then I welcome enlightenment.

[myTake Owner]

Writing the feminist movement and ideology is full of shit and then posting a video "disproving a feminist with a feminist" which shows you believe I'm a feminist. As I mentioned in the myTake that is a common defense tactic used by equalitarians on here when you defend feminist or disagree with them.

[Opinion Owner]

No. Let me break it down for you. I said those who identify as egalitarians distinct from feminists often don't like feminism (call them full of shit) and the video is me saying 'here's why.' If you didn't bother to look past the title of the video then I can be a little more understanding of your mistake.

My point is that such people have all the equality values of egalitarianism but don't see those values well represented in feminism thus opt out of the feminist label.

"Feminist" has so many varying and conflicting connotations, and so many differing viewpoints speaking under that label that finding a less nebulous term makes things clearer for everyone.

[Opinion Owner]

Oh and again, this has nothing to do with whether or not you're a feminist. I'm not talking about you, I'm talking about people who call themselves egalitarians but don't really like feminism - which you expressed an opinion of.

[ShadowStaff]

I try not to be offensive when saying this but- this take is full of lard. Similarly to many feminists takes that do not take the time to well explain what aspect of feminism they are referring to, for feminists themselves did not support of women rights equally such as Asian, latino and African americans- and if you don't believe me look up the historical marches where they asked black women to stay in the back or leave, told Asian women to go back to china even they all weren't chinese and seen latino women as less than them and that is just one example of the inequalities of feminism. Your definition or let's say perception of a humanist or equalitarian is wayyyyy off the mark. Simply because you are a humanist or equalitarian doesn't mean you support all and everything equally- i mean listen to yourself does that make any sense. There will in society always bee socially sanctioned behaviors that are deemed unacceptable. To try and downplay an humanist or equalitarian because there are limits to equality if simply playing word games. Being female, male, or of a race or even in some cases a nationality is something by birth that cannot be changed you cannot lump them with autonomous choice mandates such as homosexuality, heterosexuality, extremists, hate groups, terrorist organization, etc. They are not the same, even being an humanist, egalitarian or feminist is a CHOICE. You can't suddenly downplay groups that admit this and say they agree with the choices that they make" hey equalitarian I'm a murderer; a terrorist; or a rapist why aren't you supporting me equally? " what type of faux is that.
Futhermore I don't know what scientists and anthropologists your talking about, early social groups, societies typically starting as hunter-gathering communites were some of the furthest from equalitarian, patriarch or matriarchs. You can think of Hunter gather as synonym for Male and Female, where physical limits were objectively set due to natural biology. Females and males had hugely different jobs because they were not stupid to argue or desire to prove a point of I can do what you can do- SURVIVAL was their sole purpose. And the males AND females worked together to survive not to be equal. How could females be hunters if they become pregnant for 9 months and go into labor how would people survive their 9 months of pregnancy. How could men give birth or let alone provide their young with sustenance until their bodies grew older to eat tougher foods?

[myTake Owner]

If you can't except the truth then that's on you.

[Azara]

lets sweet, does being a humanist mean you support human rights for all humans.. yup. i would say it definitely does.

[ShadowStaff]

@Azara Yea but that's the problem what is the definition of human rights and which humans get to dictate and define 'Human Rights'. Not to mention there are different types of humanist for example a secular humanist vs non-secular. You can only supports ones rights insofar as when they clash with another's. It's common sense in the ideal of agency, or freedom- even an anarchist would understand that. So no Humanist does not mean you generally support all and any human right or human standard how would that even make sense.

[Anno_Domini]

"If you can't except the truth then that's on you."

Accept.*

[myTake Owner]

@Anno_Domini Tell that to auto correct.

[Maik567]

I'm an egalitarian who thinks both feminism and masculism (or mens rights activism) are outdated in first world countries. And the fact that you start your post with a huge straw man argument where you come up with this imaginary person and make it seem that all, or even some egalitarians are like that, makes me already not want to read it because you most likely won't have any real arguments.

And the prehistorical hunter-gatherer groups couldn't even be called a society with today's standards and you can bet your ass that the decisions made by those individual groups were mostly made by men.

Egalitarianism is an ideology, the belief that all people should be treated as equals, and that's all it is. It doesn't mean you have to actively support or participate in events to be an egalitarian. As long as you believe that everyone should be treated as equals that's enough to be an egalitarian.

This whole post is attacking people who only use egalitarianism as an excuse to say or do things which have nothing to do with egalitarianism, but yet your post's title is talking about the modern egalitarians, you are absolutely ridiculous. The vast majority of egalitarians actually believe that everyone should be equal, you are trying to black paint all egalitarians because of some small group that aren't even really egalitarian, are you kidding me?

And you saying that egalitarians aren't effective because they are trying to focus on everything is pure bullshit, what are you basing that on exactly? Many egalitarian organizations have specialized departments for certain issues, you make all these claims but you haven't even done enough research to spell "egalitarian" right half of the time.

And let me teach you about the difference between feminism and egalitarianism since you seem so absolutely misinformed. Feminism: The advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social and economic equality to men. That is why I'm an egalitarian instead of a feminist, because I'm an advocate of equality based on all different things, not just because you're a woman. Feminism is focused on women's rights and I feel we are at a point where we should start focusing on everyone's rights.

This whole post is such a fucking joke honestly, all it is a huge fucking straw man argument, instead of making any actual points you just spew some straight up bullshit, like " In fact, most egalitarians are about men’s rights while totally booting everyone else out of the image."

[myTake Owner]

To bad you would have learned something and become a better person.

[Maik567]

I obviously did read it, I just said that the start already made me not wanna read it. And its kinda ironic how you say that when you didn't read what I wrote.

[myTake Owner]

I'm not obligated to. To bad you can't grasp what I wrote however.

[Maik567]

How would you know if I grasped it or not when you didn't read what I said?

And what's the point of writing this post if you're not gonna read the answers? Just so you could rant about it?

[myTake Owner]

Didn't realize I owed you anything. FYI if I truly didn'the want responses I would've selected not to allow users to post. I'm just not interested in anything you have to say.

[Maik567]

When did I say you owed me something? I asked you a fucking question, you're looking for an excuse to bitch at me lol.

And if you can say that you aren't interested in anything I have to say without even reading what I said, then yeah you obviously are not interested in responses, at least in responses that disagree with your opinion. And if your opinion is so fragile that you won't even bother reading opposing views do you really expect anyone to take you seriously?

[ras144]

Darling myTakeOwner, I'm not surprised the hypocrites will defend their hypocritical stance. They will defend their BS stance and call your take a "Logical fallacy", but have no problem using those same "logical fallacies" to justify why think feminists are inferior.

[Maik567]

@ras144 Funny how you make all these claims that my views are hypocritical or that I'm using logical fallacies, yet you can't give me a single example. Where exactly is the hypocrisy in my post. And why do you keep putting logical fallacies into quotations, do you not think they exist lol?

[myTake Owner]

@Maik567 So now I'm bitching? I state I'm not interested in what you wrote and you get upset. You don't have to say "you owe me" to make it obvious that you're upset that I don't want to waste the time to read whatever you wasted your time writing. Get over it. All you're doing is re-writing what the other equalitarians wrote. Come back when you have actually written a myTake.

@ras144 Thank you.

[Maik567]

Yeah you are bitching, I never even implied that you owed me an answer, that all came from your head. And me being upset? Yeah, straight from your imagination as well, you're not interested in reading a counter argument because you know you didn't even make a real argument, all you did was come up with a comical misinterpretation of what egalitarianism is and tried to use it to black paint all egalitarians. So instead of actually defending anything you said, you like to pretend that Im saying you owe me something, when I never said anything close to that. I just said that you are completely fucking ridiculous when you say that "To bad you would have learned something and become a better person." When you're obviously not interested at all in hearing the opposing opinion, you're too set on your ways.

[myTake Owner]

I don't have to defend anything. It's true and you are living proof. Thanks for again for posting. Helps me get around listing user names.

[Maik567]

"It's true because I say so" Is basically what you're saying. You don't actually wanna defend your opinions because you know that they aren't actually based on anything, much easier to say stuff "It's true and you are living proof". Even though a lot of the stuff you said was objectively wrong and not based on anything.

"most egalitarians are about men’s rights" Like can you explain where you got that ridiculous statement from? Or did you just come up with it in the moment and try to state is as a fact?

I'm not gonna say stupid shit like "you're the living proof" because I know that you can't judge a group based on individuals, unlike your ignorant ass. You are just a single idiot among feminists and I know that not all feminists are as ignorant as you. And I literally couldn't care less about being on your list.

[myTake Owner]

Sorry not sorry kid but you are a living example of the people I'm referring to. It's interesting that you claim to have read this myTake and continue to act in such a manner. Deal with the reality of this and change yourself for the better.

[Maik567]

Lol you have to be a fucking troll. I'm pretty sure you didn't even read your own mytake at this point since you're talking so much out of your ass. The things you say are not true just because you say they are true, thats not how reality works. But you are obviously completely delusional about reality anyway since you keep making these stupid claims. You are the one who has to result to calling me a kid, in a desperate way to make my arguments seem less legitimate. The only reality of this is that you wanted to complain so you wrote an idiotic mytake which has nothing to do with actual egalitarians, you're just annoyed because you think that everyone should identify as a feminist and if they dont you come up with fictional reasons why they are a bad person. You are a fucking joke.

[myTake Owner]

I understand you're hurt and having a difficult time understanding that you have some internal and external problems you have to work out but you'll eventually get through it and mature as a person. Maybe then you can become a person who truly believes in equality instead of one that brings a bad light on the entire group. Personal attacks and profanity because I pointed out some flaws? Not very becoming of an "equalitarian".

[Maik567]

Lol, ok I gotta admit you fucking fooled me. I should have known you were a troll.

[myTake Owner]

If that's what you want to believe in order to hide from the truth then I can't stop you. You're only hurting yourself.

[Maik567]

Yeah right lol. You took it so far its pretty obvious you're a troll. You wouldn't know the truth even if it hit you in the face.

[myTake Owner]

Took what far? Saying you need to evolve into a better person or being rejected? You gotta learn in life calling people names isn't going to get you what you want.

[Maik567]

Your stupid act obviously. Nobody your age is that stupid.

[myTake Owner]

And there it is again. Your immaturity is your ultimate undoing. Feels like I'm responding to a child who lied about their age in order to be taken more seriously.

[Maik567]

See, all your responses are like this, you can't make any actual arguments or even respond to mine, so you try to be dismissive with. When you can't make a single argument to defend your opinions in like 20 messages, you should know how fucking immature you really are.

[myTake Owner]

Respond to what arguments? Most of you either posted why you are justified in hating feminism or why you hate women. I said my piece. If you don't agree oh well. I'm not gonna argue with you people when you are so deep in the ground with your hypocrisy you can't even see the light. If you want a mature answer then give a mature response. Also clearly you haven't read all my response and are being selective. Not a surprise though considering what you do.

[Maik567]

This is why you're such an obvious troll, because we both know I didn't say shit about feminism and you say I hate women. I can fucking guarantee you that you hate women a lot more than I do, you're a fucking angry child.

[myTake Owner]

And here we are again. You realize people can read your post and see what you wrote, right? Okay then. But now to add onto it you accuse me of hating women. I have to admit I didn't expect someone to make such an outlandish comment. But I guess that's all you could figure out to say since calling me a feminist or sexist is out played on this forum. But it's nice to see how bitter and immature you are.

[Maik567]

Again, you can't give me a single fucking example because there are none, you're pulling literally all of this out of your ass. Give me one example where I said that I hate feminism or that I hate women.

But I know you won't because I never said anything like that, the reason you are saying shit like that is because of your self hatred. You hate yourself so much that you see everyone else as an enemy. You literally made a post to attack egalitarians who literally believe that everyone should be treated equally, and you decided to attack them because why the fuck not? You are a hateful sad person.

[myTake Owner]

Read your your own original post. You can't read now?

Now you just proved you didn't read this myTake. Now instead of being a women hater I now suffer from self hatred. You just keep reflecting. Like I originally posted "To bad you would have learned something and become a better person." You're pretty classless.

[Maik567]

I read your mytake and the self hatred is fucking blatant, and yeah you are a woman, your self hatred comes from your hatred of women, are you dumb?

You are projecting your own insecurities here like crazy, you know that you could become a better person if you actually gave any thought to this shit, but instead you just come up with fake facts and when someone calls you out on them you just ignore it. You are a complete joke and no one with a brain would take you seriously. This mytake wasn't about making a point or changing minds, it was because you are full of hate and you wanted to bitch about something, thats all it is.

[myTake Owner]

Hahaha! 😂 That'she pretty funny. Not only are you people accusing me of being a sexist & feminist but now of self hatred and the hatred of women. By the way that would be called "internalized sexism". Your quick to call someone dumb when you don't even known what it's called. Also this makes it ten times clearer you didn'the read this myTake.

I will say that it'should pretty interesting that your comments and word choices match those of misogynist. You really are a wolf in sheep's clothing posing as an equalitarian. Congratulations on revealing your true self.👍

[Maik567]

Hatred of women is called misogyny, not "internalized sexism", this is why I call you dumb.

"your comments and word choices match those of misogynist."

Another outrageous claim with no evidence or even examples behind it, and since when did you get to decide anyway which word choices count as misogynistic lol, until you can actually give a single example, keep your stupid bullshit to yourself.

[myTake Owner]

Oh my gosh. This is sad. Let me explain this so maybe you can understand. If you accuse a woman of hating her herself and hating other women then that is internalized sexism.

I can say the same to you. Until you can provide examples keep your misogynistic attitude and beliefs to yourself.

[Maik567]

I've given you countless examples, I gave you an example in my last message for fucks sake. And internalized sexism is where sexism has almost been forced into you by your upbringing, but I think your sexism stems from your self hatred, which is not related to that.

You are the only misogynist here, let me tell you that.

[myTake Owner]

You gave no examples because there are none of me showing internalized sexism. You only accused me of it.

Nah, your vulgarity and attacks on women commonly used by misogynist is the only proof needed that you are indeed a misogynist.

[Maik567]

Yeah because you don't have internalized sexism genius, you just hate yourself and other women.

And your vulgarity and attacks on men AND women is the only proof needed that you are a horrible person.

[myTake Owner]

I already told you I don't have internalized sexism and you still can't comprehend the stupidity you wrote.

I haven't used any vulgarity on men or women so there is no proof. You can make up stuff all you want but the proof of your disgraceful actions is in your post, genius. :)

[Maik567]

You're obviously just in denial sweetie. You clearly hate yourself and other women.

You have used plenty of vulgarity and attacked men and women for this whole time, face it you are fucking sexist.

[myTake Owner]

You can continue saying that but it's clear you're a misogynist.

Nah, your the only sexist one. Proof is in what you've written in this post. Maybe if GAG allowed for editing you could back up your lies by erasing your hate filled words but you can't. :)

[Maik567]

No no, you dont seem to understand. You being a misogynist and hating yourself too has nothing to do with me being a misogynist sweetie.

Every single thing youve said has been sexist, there's like 20 comments worth of proof of that, just go back and read what you said if you want evidence.

[myTake Owner]

You can continue saying that but it's clear you're a misogynist. Misogynist men always do what you do.

Nah, your the only sexist one. Proof is in what you've written in this post. Maybe if GAG allowed for editing you could back up your lies by erasing your hate filled words but you can't. You can try to reflect but it's obvious to anyone who chooses to read.

[Maik567]

No no, you dont seem to understand. You being a misogynist and hating yourself too has nothing to do with me being a misogynist sweetie.

Every single thing youve said has been sexist, there's like 21 comments worth of proof of that, just go back and read what you said if you want evidence.

[myTake Owner]

You can continue saying that but it's clear you're a misogynist. Misogynist men always do what you do, sweetie.

Nah, your the only sexist one. Proof is in what you've written in this post. Maybe if GAG allowed for editing you could back up your lies by erasing your hate filled words but you can't. You can try to reflect but it's obvious to anyone who chooses to read.

[Maik567]

No no, you dont seem to understand. You being a misogynist and hating yourself too has nothing to do with me being a misogynist sweetie.

Every single thing youve said has been sexist, there's like 22 comments worth of proof of that, just go back and read what you said if you want evidence.

[myTake Owner]

You can continue saying that but it's clear you're a misogynist. Misogynist men always do what you do, sweetie. <3

Nah, your the only sexist one. Proof is in what you've written in this post. Maybe if GAG allowed for editing you could back up your lies by erasing your hate filled words but you can't. You can try to reflect but it's obvious to anyone who chooses to read.

[Maik567]

Yeah not gonna waste any more time on this. Pretty good troll tho.

[myTake Owner]

Says the misogynist troll.

[Maik567]

You can see my profile that Im not a troll, you're an anonymous cause you're a troll.

[myTake Owner]

Common troll response from a misogynist troll on GAG.

[Entity]

"Egalitarianism is a belief that everybody is equal."

If one studies philosophy it's far, far more complex than this. Dictionary definitions are terrible when discussing these things. I say that because the entirety of this is built off of a generalized concept of usually more narrowed foci. Egalitarianism, for the most part today, is more political/economic for instance than social/cultural. That's a huge, huge difference.

The same is true with Humanism. It isn't just a matter of taking a general definition since there are so many, in philosophy anyway, variations of this particular concept that there's no one single way to look at the matter. The general concept cannot (and should not) fit "all causes and purposes"; the irony is that when people do this they come to the same circular arguments and make the same mistakes no matter which side of the fence they are on.

"Anthropological evidence suggests that most prehistoric hunter-gatherer societies were egalitarian, and that patriarchy did not develop until many years after.", I would have to see this. I'm imagining that this is specifically referring to political egalitarianism where "all voices mattered" in decision making versus say, economic, because that would terminate systems of barter and trade but also create problems with sharing resources depending on size of the groups you refer. I'm not a big fan of "backwards attribution"; egalitarianism didn't exist then, as a philosophy, and it's questionable if a scientist worth his salt would attribute what likely was just an optimal condition as a philosophical outlook.

It's sort of like how you shared in school before you knew anything about ethics. It just so happened to benefit you; it does not make you an ethically aware and enlightened being though.

This isn't a criticism of this in particular, though it uses this as a platform, but just a statement of what is wrong with the whole of the arguments made. Everyone is making up how philosophy works and my goodness it would pay if anyone actually read something more scholarly than rants by other fools and Dictionary. com or whatever source they are using. Try the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy for instance.

[myTake Owner]

Well that's your opinion.

[Entity]

It is.

Unfortunately not all opinions are created equally. Some are created from thin air, even!

[myTake Owner]

I can see that from the the responses.

[Rawrzz]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRsYwu8uD4I&list=PLytTJqkSQqtr7BqC1Jf4nv3g2yDfu7Xmd

82% of America doesn't give a fuck what you think and believes in 'equality', not 'feminism'--which does not equal equality.

I'm just going to point out your own nonsense, instead of really endeavoring to explain how I think you're wrong.

"They call everything and everyone sexist who don't agree with them. They write an anti-feminst myTake once a day."

"Feminism is equality - it is a form of egalitarianism and if you do not believe in it then you are not actually an egalitarian but an idiot using it’s name to benefit yourself" I. e., you're not only sexist if you're not a feminist, you're plain anti-equality. Sorta hypocritical right there. And by sorta, I mean overwhelmingly and directly hypocritical.

Basically, you're really stupid. Because I don't want to waste anymore time on these stupid mytakes. Believe what you want. Most of society doesn't agree with you.

[myTake Owner]

You hate that someone pointed out how much of a hatemonger you are. So I'm not surprised by your response.

[jjmarvin]

Feminism is equality - it is a form of egalitarianism and if you do not believe in it then you are not actually an egalitarian but an idiot using it’s name to benefit yourself

Please point out the hypocrisy because that just sounds like logic. Just because you're an activist for one groups equality doesn't mean you don't love everybody.

[Rawrzz]

Believe what you want anon. Your post has a lot more hate in it than mine, if you ask me. And if you think I'm a hatemonger, then you clearly didn't watch the video I posted.

@jjmarvin I directly spelled it out, bro. Try reading it again. And, do your own research and determine whether or not feminism is legitimate. I'll make the claim again: feminism is not equality. Now it's your decision whether you want to figure out whether or not that claim is ridiculous or incorrect or if you just want to ignore it. If you like, you can look up GirlAsksWhat on youtube, along with more Factual Feminist videos--the Factual Feminist really isn't a feminist, in my opinion, but she's what feminists should be--GAW is basically the definition of pro gender-equality anti-feminism. Or not. Or you can just believe whatever. I really don't care.

[jjmarvin]

Feminism is equality though.

[Azara]

well anon, you're being kind of aggressive and belligerent for someone who's not subsumed by hate.

[myTake Owner]

I don't need to watch the video you re-posted that someone else made. Reading what you wrote is enough to let me know the type of person you are. Like I said "I'm not surprised by your response".

[Rawrzz]

Referencing other peoples' opinions is innately invalid, now, eh? You might benefit from other peoples' opinions and empirical information. That's how humanity works: we learn from each other. You refuse to watch what someone else made, because you fear having to commit to a counter-argument and simply wish to enlighten those misfortune souls who happen to share the entirely incorrect opinion. No? As the typical mytake, in my opinion.

Like I said. Believe what you want. My post was borne out of a pure frustration and general anger at the bullshit in life. I bear you no ill will; nor am I invested in what you choose to believe. Though, I do think you're incorrect. And, plainly put, you really don't know what kind of person I am: whatsoever. You might, however, be able to determine the mood I was in when I posted. Though, considering what kind of a mood I was in, and the video I chose to post, you might more accurately determine what type of person I am. A human. Just. Like. You.

[myTake Owner]

You don't seem to benefit from others opinions yet you want me to take yours seriously. That's rich. You guys always insult people and then want them to engage in a counter argument. If you want to debate someone then grow up. I'm not gonna waste my time counter arguing about a video with someone who responds the way you did. To sum up everything you've said it's this, "Your stupid now watch my video."
You can blame what you said on your mood all you want but the point is you said it. It's a reflection of you.

[Rawrzz]

I did consider your opinion. I consider all opinions, even the ones I see as stupid. I was a hardcore feminist for basically my entire life until a couple years ago when I listened to some anti-feminist arguments. Via the rationality and history-encompassing fact-based arguments of Karen Straughan, I changed my opinion based on someone else's. I have done so many times. Too many times, honestly.

The difference is I read all of what you had to say, and you ignored part of my argument.

Us guys, huh. Pretty wide generalization there. You sure you're not a misandrist? Some guy stab you in the heart? I get it. Though, taking it out on the entire male population probably isn't healthy. Unless you were using that as a gender-neutral statement. You tell me to grow up, but I already explained I was in a bad mood when I posted, if not out right apologizing for coming off brashly. It's one of my character flaws.

Yeah. It does reflect on me. So does everything else.

[myTake Owner]

My apologies. I forgot you need to choose your words wisely around equalitarians. A common slang like "you guys" referring to a group of people instead of literally meaning a group of guys is in turn interpreted as an attack on the male race which then gets you labeled a misandrist. I should write another myTake on words you can'take say around equalitarians.

That wasn't apologizing. That was an excuse. If you wanted to apologize then do it.

[Rawrzz]

Yep. Pretty much like saying "you people" to black people. Try it. Tell me how it works out for ya.

I even clarified in your defense, despite your horrid word choice. "Unless you were using that as a gender-neutral statement." Yet, you still attempted to use it to attack me, quite a leap of an insult, honestly. You're kind of a bitch, huh? I mean, I'm a dick, no doubt; but you're a bitch, too. Like I said. Human. Alas, I'm done. Believe what you want and leave me in peace.

And na. If you would have met me with some common decency, as I attempted, then I would have. Perhaps you should take a look at yourself as much as you like to do with other people?

See. I tried here. I honestly don't know why you continue to bat at me. You're arguing no points, simply making attacks on my character and trying to flip my words around however you can. Tiresome, and I'm bored of it

[myTake Owner]

Actually it's not the same since equalitarians come from different nationalities and backgrounds. Nice try.
Not as much as a leap I could say for you. Calling me a bitch because I'm a woman is as sexist as it comes. Would you call a man a bitch? Nope.

You never started out with decency. You're one of those people who demands respect even after insulting others. Ridiculous. Maybe you people should do the same instead of attacking feminist. You are free to stop but you attacked me as a person first as seen in your original post.

[Rawrzz]

I would certainly and have absolutely called men bitches and cunts. Go ahead and look at my questions. You'll find one asking if calling a man a cunt is equalist, and find everyone saying it's gender neutral. You just talk out of your ass.

You're the one who's held a grudge for, what, 5 days? Ma ii.

[myTake Owner]

That's the thing with talking out of your ass. You claim you would but haven't. You refer to me as a bitch and call yourself a dick. Hence you're sexist.

What grudge? You want respect and I said you don't deserve it based on your responses. What's so hard to understand?

[Rawrzz]

Bla bla bla. Sexism this, sexism that. There are women who are not bitches; there are women who are cunts. We can both agree to say fuck off, because I see no value in this quasi-conversation, anymore. You're boring me, now. Vanish forever.

[myTake Owner]

Feel free to vanish forever. If you're bored then stop responding. Calling women any of those is rude and sexist FYI.

[Anonymous]

There is a natural order of male/female relations. Males are by and large in control of it. Dominant and subdominant males and then submissive women. Go back to primitive communities now or in the past to see the natural order. Modern civilization was created by enlightened men to protect themselves and their families against that natural order. This spawned the 60's Civil Rights, Womens' Liberation movements and Environmental movements; all, says this Conservative Republican, legitimate social activism leading to positive change. The problem is that most of us are ultimately self-serving and corrupt, distorting these virtuous movements into power plays: "Black Lives Matter", "Warmists" and, particularly, the Feminist movements; all of which employ gradualism and deception leading to single end points of government forced entitlement and control. Without government force, all 3 would disappear in a wind of objective truth and individual merit. Hopefully, the positive outcomes of equal opportunity (not outcomes) and cleaner air (not silly carbon regulation) will not be casualties of what many believe is existential social change brought about by financial collapse we are beginning to see in Europe. Feminism, in its various repugnant forms, will be the first to go because it is a poor reproductive strategy and socially cohesive world view. That is not to say women should be barefoot, pregnant and in the kitchen, but much their 10,000 year relationship with men will be restored. If you look at the stylized relationship of married couples out of the 50's and earliest 60's on TV land, there is much to recommend it for most men and women. There was a voluntary division of duties that benefitted everyone and we are lesser for its loss. Those people won WW2, got us to the moon, produced the wealthiest and powerful nation in history and defeated the Soviet Union, only to begin a death spiral as various movements have become corrupt and now take their toll. And the most destructive of them is Feminism which now undermines social fabric throughout the West.

Strange days have found us
Strange days have tracked us down
They're going to destroy
Our casual joys
We shall go on playing
Or find a new town

---Jim Morrison

[milightman]

Actually, historically speaking, especially in ancient times, the world was more of a matriarchy and Women were worshipped for being able to give birth. They used to be valued as a centrifuge of creating life. But we started to transition where males shared control, and you would see a back and forth between male and female control through first born. Then this ambiguous religion came in out of no where, made a mess in Egypt, and started to change the order of things that focused solely on Men. But I can't give that one the blame, since other developments elsewhere started to shift things into a patriarchy.

[Azara]

This was great! I was expecting it to be anther 'im asm equalist kill all feminists. ' bc i only saw the t shirt in the picture.

any very well written, and i appreciate someone bringing this up. you also made very good clear points. though saying that is somewhat meaningless on this site on the internet in general, bc all kinds of bullshit gets promoted for being good clear points. but still, you really did :)

It gets arduous responding to ten posts a day about the exact same bigoted -hiding under the veil of equality- self satisfied propaganda. its really nice to see someone writing in support for people, instead of anti people posts, trying to point out how they are the _real_ supporters of history bc they are color blind sex blind , just blind blind. basically claiming, to be for equality, one must be ignorant and accepting unless you already have power, then protect it at all costs'... or the more honest ones who say they support equality as an idea but only to the extent they allow, as they are obviously put on this earth to be superior. im paraphrasing but not by much ;p

thanks for the post. its nice to read something without getting annoyed one single time.. really refreshing and on point. i basically dont want to look at the answers, it will ruin my peace ;-)

i dont even care if someone calls themselves a feminist a communist a liberal an engineer, buddhist or a cat in a former life.. what pisses me off is when they just say whatever they feel like -well actually copy what someone els wrote or said - and call it how the world work's without really thinking about what they are saying, or bothering to consider how it no way is coherent with pro- people world., thinking in most cases seems to mean how can i say this to successfully, promote my prejudice,

[myTake Owner]

Thank you and I'm glad you enjoyed it. <3

[AdamThomas]

Only a tiny minority of white men hold power, and they can oppress other white men, especially poor white men. The idea that we're all privileged is stupid.

And as for "all that expenditure on that one group and that one group alone" showing their privilege, if you look at actual expenditure in real life, you'll see that most is spent on women's issues. One example being domestic violence - here in the UK men make up 40% of DV victims. Feminists argue that this statistic I wrong and that it's somewhere between 2-10%. There are 4000 women's shelters here, and 25 for men. That isn't even 1%. And that's just one example. There's nowhere near as much support for men in any of our issues, but plenty for women. Now I bet you're going to tell me that women don't have privilege, that those who have privilege can't see it, and that that's why I think the way I do, without seeing your own hypocrisy.

I'm not an egalitarian/humanist/equalitarian anyway, it's all a load of shit. I don't expect any of this to change, I don't expect that we will ever be treated equally, nor do I think we're all born equal.

[myTake Owner]

Well as an equalitarian you already sealed your fate to live in the dark.

[AdamThomas]

I'm not an equalitarian.

[heavensgift2girls]

I will do you a favor. I am one of those people you want to attack but are afraid to, and I am proud of it. Here is the problem. Feminism claims to be for equality for both genders, but only advocates for women. The idea that feminism is for equality constantly derails male arguments for equality all the time. Anytime men have an issue feminists try to shut us up and tell us to support their cause, because "real feminism" is for true equality. Then they only advocate for women's issues and men don't get any help. If we are going to have a movement for equality, then it needs to be for actual equality, and not a women's advocacy movement, that pretends to be for equality.

If feminism wasn't lying about supporting men's issues, and was only seen as a female advocacy movement then I wouldn't have a problem with it. Such movements have a place. Then again it wouldn't have nearly as many supporters if it did that. After all why would I support a movement that is exclusively for female issues, when women aren't going to support male issues? If you want others to care about your issues, then you need to care about their issues. This is the reason feminism is dying. The egalitarian movement is growing because the feminist movement for so long preached about being a movement for equality and not delivering on that promise.

[myTake Owner]

Maybe one day you can become a better person but until that day enjoy living in darkness.

[heavensgift2girls]

Lol Yes, because believing that men and women both need to be advocated for in order to have equality means my life is full of darkness.

[myTake Owner]

Except you don't believe that. You can lie to the world but you're only hurting yourself.

[heavensgift2girls]

I do believe that, nor am I hurting myself. I love the person I am. I am not unreasonable just because I expect male issues to be taken as seriously as female issues.

[Anpu23]

I am neither "equalitarian" nor "humanist" though I am anti-feminist. I'm not working for some kind of "equality" or "gender normalizing" I'm working to stop an anti-men movement that has not only harmed myself but millions of other people. As for LGBT most LGBT people that I know are associated with the so called "mens movement" (I'f you need references I can provide them) as that movement has done more for them then feminism. I find it disturbing that feminists seem to think that they are the only ones that can discuss gender issues, and that they are the end all be all hope for both men and women to find social justice (isn't that like saying that men have no right to advocate for themselves?). As the feminist movement has made men in the form of the "patriarchy" the modern bugbear and source of all ills in the west asking them to help men is kind of like asking the Nazis to work for the betterment of the Jewish people (I don't make the comparison lightly, as Hitler used the Jews [in the form of Zionism] as a scapegoat for German problems, Feminism uses men [in the form of the Patriarchy] for the source of western problems).

[Possible_Mate]

how about we just be fair to all people would that be hard? has feminism gone to far in the west yes. i think so, we are at a pretty good place right now compared to other places in the world.
do men's issues need to be taken seriously? yes, because men are people and they do face problems that shouldn't be disregarded just because of their gender.
are men and women the same? no obviously not. do they still deserve respect, and to be treated like humans; no matter what their race, gender, sexuality, religion.
as long as they're not harming anyone else with what they do.
we can still be different and get along.
look at that i figured out the answer: don't be an asshole! wow!

[rjroy3]

The problem is you're saying feminism = equal rights. When egalitarian = equal rights. That's your mistake that makes this take not a persuasive one.

Feminism is "equality" through female liberation.
Egalitarianism is equality through liberating anyone from any inequality.

They're not the same thing. Egalitarians are probably woman's rights just as much as men's rights. Feminism is prohibited women's rights and says it's about equality when in reality it doesn't do a damn thing for men rights.

[myTake Owner]

That's your opinion and spoken like a true equalitarian.

[rjroy3]

Just realized the auto correct when I typed "pro". Wow that's some bad typos lol

[vishna]

I think we should all stop generalizing and approach movements and ideas we don't adhere to with a descriptive scholarly approach rather than a prescriptive approach.

I think this is a solid MyTake. You make some good points. I have to admit, I have seen a lot of bad talking on feminists on this site from males who claim to be egalitarians but generally seem to be apathetic, at best, to the plight of others.

[myTake Owner]

Thank you. It's so annoying when you see it on a daily basis.

[AleDeEurope]

Oh wow, another feminazi Take that if you're not a Feminist you're wrong.
My god, shut up. You're complaining about egalitarians hating on feminism while you hate on egalitarians. You're a hypocrite.
What a waste of Take, I thought you were gonna say something real and interesting, but it's just another time-waster.

[ras144]

So she's a hypocrite by calling out hypocrites? You're the one making no sense.

[myTake Owner]

Actually I'm not a feminist but thanks for proving my point. I don't agree with you so I'm automatically a "feminazi". Just like @ras144 said, how am I a hypocrite for calling you out on your hypocrisy? All you are doing is backing up what I wrote with proof.

[AleDeEurope]

@ras144 She's a hypocrite because she said all egalitarians do is criticize feminism, while everything she did in this Take is criticize egalitarians. Is it so difficult to see?

Seriously, do you even re-read what you write? xD

[Falling4UTC]

What I got from the take is that some people who call themselves egalatarians aren't supportive of some forms of egalatarianism, ( like feminism) which completely shows they aren't one. She is simply attempting to inform people on the true definition on egalatarianism, because some people are unclear on the definition. At least, that's what I got from the take.

[myTake Owner]

@Falling4UTC Exactly

[WhatTheHellAmy]

Okay, I understand your hate, some people hate us just because we want equal rights for men and women but they can't stand the "fem" part of the word..

I am a feminist, egalitarian, equalitarian, humanist, whatever the fuck you wanna call it.

I want girls to be able to study in some African countries, I want men stop being labelled as "rapists", I want equal work opportunities for both sexes, and many other shit.

So... whoever who wants the same, I'll be with them and there isn't a way I'll hate someone for wanting such thing, I mean... how can I hate someone who wants a better world? (and here comes "blah blah, feminists don't want a better world blah blah).

I hate feminazis and the "macho" thing (machistas).

The other day I found a pic... they said a girl raped a man and stupid bitches were like "you go girl" I was like "wtf is wrong with these assholes?"

[jjmarvin]

The fact that people can't understand feminist doesn't have to be the only focus for one person is mind boggling. Its that lack of understanding, i believe, that leads people to falsly acuse feminism of being supremist. That and our culture of judging a group by radicals who hijack movements for hatespeech.

[ComDom]

"Egalitarianism is an all-encompassing label for various forms of social justice such as feminism, anti-racism, LGBTQ, freedom of religion, etc. If you call yourself an egalitarian then you must support all of those causes."

Feminism is a supremacist cult... So no. LGBTQ and freedom of religion are about choices so again no. Egalitarianism is saying that, before choices are made, we all equally human and deserving of the same opportunities.

Humanist and Egalitarian are completely unrelated. Humanism opposes religion. Also the "Patriarchy" according to Feminism is nothing more than dogmatic nonsense. It does not exist. If anything it's starting to lean more in the other direction. Finally, "cisgendered" isn't a thing. Heterosexuality is normal, LGBT is not. Most, if not all, claims feminists make about privilege are at best unsubstantiated and at worst distractions from the damage that monstrosity has caused.

[myTake Owner]

I can't help you if you choose to live in denial.

[ComDom]

The only denial above is the disapproval of Feminist propaganda. If anyone is in denial (of the truth) it would be Feminists.

[Minxxie]

It's basically like saying "Yeah so I don't give a shit about anyone's else's struggles and I like to silence minority groups. But I also like to pretend I am a good person while sitting on my ass and contributing nothing to improve society which is what I claim I want to do! ... I also enjoy being a fake intellectual and getting into pointless arguments! woo!"

[Loligirl]

Exactly. "Egalitarianism" and "Humanism" in a nutshell= Slacktivism.

You're either for Feminism or against it, there's no middle ground.

[Minxxie]

@Loligirl My professor literally went on a rant about this the other day he said it was just trying to silence those minorities who need help and denying that anything is wrong. He compared being "egalitarian" as sitting there with your fingers in your ears saying "lalalalalalala" while people beg you for help.

[myTake Owner]

Haha! That's awesome. I wish I was at that lecture.

[Riverock]

"The concept of egalitarianism is a fair one but the aim to solve everything makes it unable to ever concentrate on just one thing, leading to nothing be solved in the end. This is why different movements are needed to target each issue."

That is actually an excellent point. Well done. :)

It's hard to generalise people who identify with a certain label (feminists or egalitarians) but the behaviour you describe is silly (assuming you don't mean me :P).

I don't identify as a feminist and I have issues with some common things in feminism but I don't identify as an egalitarian either because the label seems rather empty and pointless.

[VampireEmpress]

this is so true. whenever I've seen someone talk about agreeing with equality, it's always from a pov of agreeing with men's issues or a more traditional society's pov.

where are the mytakes from male equalists promoting gays' rights or gay marriage? or from female equalists, saying they refuse to have a traditional marriage since the divorce laws can be so unfair for men?

where are the people even arguing about your mytake, by saying most equalists aren't mostly promoting men's rights?

the guys' replies are really interesting to read actually. they're incapable of even giving you a real reply or arguing... and you have zero replies from the girls.

I think you wrote this really, really well and I <3 it. I'm stealing the term equal-nazis from you (not to write anything, just to use irl)... I don't even like most mytakes on here, but this one was awesomely written.

[myTake Owner]

Thank you and no problem. ❤

[jjmarvin]

"whenever I've seen someone talk about agreeing with equality, it's always from a pov of agreeing with men's issues or a more traditional society's pov. "

Then you have never seen me post lol. I did exactly that and got more downs than ups. I support all the rights movements and talk about the rights of other demographics at least 5x more than my own. I spread positivity on here whenever possible. And there are others like me on here. I think your anger is not letting you see them. I think when people are angry at the opposite gender it's very easy to stay in that simple and safe place of "I'm the good one and everybody against me is bad" but that's damaging. The world is much more complicated.

[VampireEmpress]

@Marvin if you're straight, have you ever written about gay's rights or gay marriage? which is like the most taboo topic on the planet for straight guys... or even women.

[VampireEmpress]

@jjmarvin

[jjmarvin]

Yes extensively. I've talked about lgbt+ rights and women's rights probably the most out of anything, but i spread positivity about everybody's freedoms whether it's racial/gender/class or whatever.

[VampireEmpress]

@jjmarvin really? interesting then... so have you also talked about men's rights from the lgbt side? that's what I meant in my original comment, since it's not even a thought to most straight guys.

[Octavius]

Actually one major issue that is brought up about men in the LGBTQ community is how lesbian orientation is much more accepted than male homosexual orientation. Whereas lesbians are cheered at when they do sexual acts to each other for straight people to see (yes I know it's objectification) the male equivalent is being beat half to death and then strung up to a post and left to die in the cold.

[Mártainn]

I think many "egalitarians" distance themselves from feminism because of a small but very loud obnoxious minority in the broad feminist movement, not because of feminism itself. I'm talking about those paraniod, misandrist radicals who give feminism a bad name and, apparently, are overpresented in the public perception of feminism. They repulse many people.
And I think many are upset because feminists don't address men's issues very much, although they say they do, so many people think they are getting lied to. I'm not saying those "egalitarians" you address in your take are better, but that's what gives feminism some of it's bad PR.

[myTake Owner]

I acasually said something similar in another myTake that talked about feminism. I brought up thearly fact some misandrist call themselves feminist and create the stereotypes we see. But the myTake Owner disagreed.