Why Many Men Are Upset about Paying on the First Date

[Anonymous]

Dating is an important aspect of forming romantic relationships. First impressions are everything and we all want to impress whoever we are trying to date. So you would think that men would have no problem paying for a date right? We are starting to see a shift in society, men are no longer enthusiastic about dating and especially PAYING for them. What has happened? Is there something women can do? Here is mytake and theory behind what is happening.

1. Women's entitlement

I think this is the #1 reason men dislike paying for any date. When you see women calling men cheap, then DEMAND and EXPECT men to pay for you, it gives men a negative feeling toward you. I always tell women that the best way to get what you want is to not demand it. You are giving off an aura of entitlement and it's extremely unattractive.

2. Women flake a lot, and dating is getting more expensive than ever

First dates have a high failure rate, just ask most men. The fact is most of the time she will not be interested and flake. That is fine, but when dates can cost anywhere from 20-75 dollars, that can add up fast especially for younger men. My suggestion for men and women is agree to a low cost date like coffee or a picnic on the beach.

3. Evolution of gender roles and hypocrisy

Let's face it, times are changing. Women are obtaining more power than they ever had in history and both genders are unsure how to handle this. Many women have the same privileges men have had, but also want to keep the old ones they had. This makes men VERY disgruntled about the dating scene. Before you get your pitchforks, I think it's good women have more rights. That being said you can't just have everything you want. More traditional men will want more traditional women, and those are the men who tend to court more. My suggestion for this phenomenon is to listen to each other and COMPROMISE. I never understood how we can't just listen and compromise for each other. If you can't come to an agreement then you aren't meant for each other.

[yoshi_wanna_ask]

I get where you're coming from, it can be discouraging & draining. But I think it's a bit ridiculous men are *required* to pay for the first date. If anything I'd like to see the first two as just getting to know each other & he can pay for the third if he wants to. It is a good reminder though to tell my next date that I respect him but I'll be paying for my part of the date. Then if he really wants to he can jump in but maybe relax a little more otherwise.

[coachTanthony]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71o3hq6iSPM&t=101s

[yoshi_wanna_ask]

I *LOVE* this. I love it! I'm horrified that the girl was expecting him to call her boyfriend an ass for not wanting to pay after 4 - 5 *months* of dating! That guy is gentleman.

[Tdieseler]

Thats because women are selfish little self-made whores. who like to pretend they aren't lol.
Ok seriously... yea.. men are upset about that whole paying thing, cuz its not like men dont want to pay, its just irritating when its expected. Lets not talk about those gold-digging whores that think that putting out after a date is a fucking taboo... but are happy as fuck to go for high-shelf everything if the man is paying, and wonder why the man feels like he has earned "some". And younger men dont get it, i know i didn't when i was like 19-20... spending like 150$ to $300 on a single date, just to never hear from that bitch again...
I totally agree with you last couple of sentences... compromise and listen to each other... but yea... because that is something women are good at right? listening and compromising lol...
I just dont give a fuck anymore... I've done something a lot of men should do, and that is to transcend the vagina... because women think as long as they have it, they are constantly right... and stupid ass guys never say anything because they want to fuck it. you should hear the awkward silence i hear when i ask anyone... man or woman... i ask em "take away the pussy, what else does a woman have to offer"... dude... do it and see... cuz the real answer is "not much"...
lol... fuck that first date... its almost always a bad investment and women dont get it, cuz they never pay for shit.

[Anonymous]

You do realise dating is a crutch for men who aren't in the top 20% of men?

Women care about 3 things:
1. LOOKS (height and face)
2. MONEY
3. SOCIAL STATUS

The whole point of dating scene was that if you couldn't attract a woman with your looks like say this guy would:

https://i.imgur.com/JTISSaA.png

Who would get the pussy with a higher success rate than other men without dropping a cent.

You would need to go out on dates to show off your provider qualities (money) and indirectly status which she may fish out of you in conversation by asking you what you do for a living or look at the kind of clothes you wear/car.

Dating is essentially prostitution but covered under romance and for the men not attractive enough this is the game and how it is setup for you. There is an alternative though. You can say FUCK YOU to dating and hamster wheel and just get escorts if all you really want is SEX.

TRUTH HURTS.

[amphet11]

A lot of the women don't realize that they pretty much describe themselves as prostitutes in their posts, yet will disagree with your answer.

[Crapulux]

@amphet11 The upvotes and downvotes in this post tell a nice little story LOL

[brain5000]

Excellent. Short and to the point.

Had you chosen to deep-dive into "why men hate paying for the first date 102," you could also have mentioned that this tradition started during a time when cold-approach was the way women and men met, while today online dating and apps have made it so that the guy has to pay up to $75 just to meet someone in person. He also has to start wooing her before he knows whether he is interested in her. It's backwards.

Women might argue that they also have to pay more money for clothes and makeup, and spend a lot of time and labor making themselves look nice for men. Again, this is a tradition that started in the days when they didn't have to do this just to meet a guy, or if they did (. e. g. clubbing), there were no guarantees. Now it is all backwards - with dating and online apps, they have to spend the money and do the work just to meet someone in person.

Yes, ladies, I think we agree that is crazy. So don't -- you're just meeting someone for the first time. Dress the way you would if you were going out in public normally. Trust me, you look great in your jeans with your hair tied back and glasses too.

[Anonymous]

You are right and wrong. Here's the thing. Guys do most of the chasing, so girls have options. So if you ask a girl out to dinner and she is more "traditional" and you don't pay, she'll just date another guy who would, because she has OPTIONS.

When you got 8,9 guys asking you out, you can set a higher standard and be more picky because what one guy doesn't do, another one will. Now I have to be clear. I'm not saying its right... I'm saying this is reality, and to say society is changing, well its changing very very slowly because I've never met a guy who wanted to split the bill on the first date.

[myTake Owner]

Guys have options too, are you implying they don't?

[Opinion Owner]

Yes. Women have way more options in the dating world than guys.
How many women ask you out a week?

[myTake Owner]

Women never ask out men, it doesn't mean I don't have options. In fact I have more options in a way since I can ask out women and women have to wait for someone to ask them

[Opinion Owner]

Well I don't have to ask anyone out or even wait to be asked out because I get on average 3 request a week, and so do most of my female friends. When my social media was public, it would be a lot more.
As long as guys keep "chasing", women will always have the upper hand when it comes to dating. Some men may not want to pay for a first day, but there are a lot that have no problem do it. So do whatever you thing is best for you.

[myTake Owner]

But the one disadvantage is you don't choose, they choose you.

[Opinion Owner]

I turn them down 99.9 % of the time. The 2 guys I dated (long term), I'm the one who made the first move.

I don't think you are getting my point. This isn't about me or even you... I'm just explaining how the dating world works.

[myTake Owner]

Well I'm saying you're wrong that women have more options. If you compare similar attractiveness levels it's relatively even

[Opinion Owner]

How many women ask you out a week again? Oh right zero.
WOMEN HAVE MORE OPTIONS IN THE DATING WORLD.

I don't know why you are taking this personal. IT is what it is.

[myTake Owner]

That doesn't mean I get ZERO dates. Is this a hard concept for you?

[Robin48]

Disagree. Just because someone asks you out does not mean they pay the bill, or pay your other bills.

[Lopezz1999]

Opinion Owner, the reason why girls move on to someone else just because they don't pay for the first date has more reasoning than you think. If you choose to move on from someone that doesn't pay, it means you were never attracted to him to begin with. Unless you actually expect someone that you're attracted to to pay for your food on a date, you won't care whether or not he doesn't pay for your food/you'd be much more willing to pay for yourself, or for him since you wouldn't want him to find you cheap, much like guys do the same thing whenever they pay for a girl on a date. If you like a guy, you will be more willing to pay for yourself. If you like a guy, you'd be more willing to pay for yourself and him. If you don't like a guy, you wouldn't care to pay for him, and this is why guys do not like paying for a girl on the first date. Many know that it ruins his chances with you altogether, and the guys are right to suspect that nothing will continue on, even if he pays for you.

[TripleAce]

Yup... solid truth
this is exactly it in a women's perspective

[dontknow12]

Two things for you opinion owner, one, you sound like you never pay for dates, and two, if you care so much about money then I suppose all your relationships are shallow.

[MrNameless]

Most guys don't ask splitting the bill, because it would lower the chance of a second date. They would be seen as perceived as cheap. It's ingrained in our culture sadly.

[MrNameless]

You are right that its something that can't be changed.. At least not fast.

But I will say this.. I'm too old to chase girls. I'm a grown man, not a teenager. I'll ask a girl out and pay. The moment I feel like there's some games or "chasing" I'll stop. I don't have time to waste looking for a serious relationship with a girl with an inflated sense of ego.

[Tony1974]

That's because you call him cheap and tell all your girlfriends. He'll never get a date again. Best bet for most men is to ignore you all. You're all hoes until proven otherwise. Men now have their own shit tests.

[amphet11]

I would rather go on other dates with women that don't expect me to pay, as in if you refuse me a second date because I didn't pay, well good, as I wouldn't want the second date in that case anyway. And use your power when you can, as when you hit about 35, the male attention will dry up very fast.

[amphet11]

I don't get a date every week, but I know guys that sleep with multiple women a weak.

[amphet11]

*week

[timesplittersxsxd]

We have our options, there are more women on this planet then men so we have more options. Another arrogant and conceited misandrist. And another pink anon 18 to 24.

[Robin48]

@Lopezz1999
So she goes on the first date in knowing he paying it. Then she drops him. and finds another male to take her out and then she drop him. I am totally aware how females play this game. To totally benefit herself.

[FatherJack]

I have to agree , women are desired by men , men are NOT generally desired by women , & has to tick far more boxes , than vice versa. Women DO have far more options , to a woman , men are overabundant & ten a penny !!

[Opinion Owner]

@dontknow12 did you even read my responses? I guess not.

[Opinion Owner]

Its sad that all you boys are missing my point completely. I NEVER said this is the way it should be. I said this is the way it is in the real world. If you guys can just stop for a second and comprehend before getting offended, you all might learn something and be better off.

[Robin48]

Thank you, brother. We see it over and over. Most females see their side and their side only. It all to benefit their self. You wonder why they have so much relationship issues with other females and males.

[Robin48]

Women point is what she what us to said. Mind control in the USA is a federal crime. So think about it.

[dontknow12]

Ok but here's the thing though, would you ever split the bill? If not then you're basically like all the girls you described.

[Robin48]

@dontknow12
If two people go out on activities. They need to split the bill. That is a moral ethic values thing to do. True love is not using others for self-gain or self-seeking is a sin against God.

[AleDeEurope]

I'm not upset about paying, I'm upset about the fact they think because I'm a man I have to pay. It's like me telling them they gotta clean and cook, and suck my dick whenever I want, because they're a woman. It's that entitlement that you talked about. It's the hypocrisy of "I'm a modern strong and independent woman... but since I benefit from this, I'm gonna support it, even though it's outdated and sexist"

I have absolutely no problem paying for the first date... if the girl was fun, put effort into the date, and wasn't an entitled cunt.
There's girls who spend the whole date on their phones and still expect the guy to pay. Like fuck you, bitch lol I'd tell the waiter to split the check in half. I pay my part, you pay yours.

Girls seem to forget that just because we asked you if you wanted to go on a date, doesn't mean we actually like you, it just means we have an interest in you, and just like I gotta win you on the date, you gotta win me too. It's a two-way thing.

[myTake Owner]

That's what I was trying to say, the actual paying part isn't the main issue

[AleDeEurope]

Yeah, and I agree with you. Most guys are more than happy to pay. We do our part, as long as she does her part too.

[MikkiM]

I think men are not upset about paying for their first date

Thats their number one RESPONSIBILITY as a guy

but Their something that made them feel HARASSED thats why they turn out to be upset

its because us girls, give too much EXPECTATION OF A GUY, of what we usually value, that we dont ever know, the personality of the guy we are in front to.

They became upset, as guys feels like, they felt insecurities with their selves, and guess that they haven't met the standard of the woman they are dating with

[backdoorman]

Why is it the man's responsibility to pay for the date? Please try to answer without being hypocritical or sexist. Go on...

[myTake Owner]

This is the entitlement aspect that I was talking about. Your grammar is poor so maybe I'm not reading this correctly.

[MikkiM]

@backdoorman, im not being hypocritical or sexist, its because its much easier for a woman, not to step on ego for a guy,

girls can act kindness, they could always pay,
but if you'll start just dating for the first time or knowing your date yet,..

it would be easier to give guys their chance to pay first

and it doesn't mean, that girls should always be treated in expensive dates,..
if you're dating a right girl,.. she will not demand for something, but she will accept you for who you are

I hope you won't misunderstood what i mean by this comment i post

[MikkiM]

what you mean? Im giving comment for the perspective of woman like me, im not mis judging what a guy means or feels

[backdoorman]

That's not what you said originally. Your words were "Thats their number one RESPONSIBILITY as a guy". Can you explain what you meant by that?

[MikkiM]

@backdoorman ,.. well yeah,. its a responsibility.., for me its an act of BEING MANLY

and i dont mean, if you are not this kind of person,,

its just that, its much easier to give space for a mans ego

well,.. in the case if a guy doesn't have money for the date,
it will be more nice if you tell the girl honestly, that there's no budget for expensive dates

Real girls will understand that,. and they would offer to pay if they are understanding enough

^_^ dont get upset my friend :)
Its just my opinion about it, but i dont mean to harsh or be one sided with my opinions

[backdoorman]

You said "its a responsibility.., for me its an act of BEING MANLY".

And then you said "its just that, its much easier to give space for a mans ego".

Those two statements are very different and I'm wondering how you reconcile them in your mind. I suspect you recognize the sexism in the first statement and are trying to soften the blow by trying to put it back on men with the second statement.

No, I'm not upset at all. I'm just pointing out your sexism. I don't mean that in a judgmental way. Some women just seem to have a hard time seeing it for what it is. They only "see" sexism when they perceive women as the ones who are harmed by it but for some reason they are unable to recognize it when they themselves are the ones being sexist.

Anyway, thanks for chatting. :)

[MikkiM]

@backdoorman I dont even know what sexism means, Im not asking out my needs as a woman,..

We do need a lot of understand for a man, to understand men,..

If I will say that, IM A WOMAN and I will pay for the first date,.. i think that will be rude,..
I say that, if its a first date, i think thats easier to perceive that as a Responsibility of a guy

I didn't say that guy should pay, all the time
its for the first date and getting to know stage

[backdoorman]

I just realized you are from the Philippines so your culture may be different. If your views are still the same in 10 years, then I'll call you sexist. For now I will cut you some slack. :)

Cheers

[MikkiM]

@backdoorman thats rude, you dont even know what my comment really means, dont take it too personally my friend

[backdoorman]

I didn't mean to be rude at all. Just pointing out that we live in different cultures and it's pretty clear your comments and attitudes are a reflection of your culture, as are mine.

I'm pretty sure I know exactly what you were saying though.

[MikkiM]

@backdoorman if you perceive the world as sexist and slack then you might end up with that tought all your years...

im not challenging you or anything, and what if im from the philippines
thats bringing the topic to far and your taking this too personal for you

open up your mind my friend im trying to understand you, if you think im slack then you think wrong,..

All men need attention,.
And i know what you mean that men should be valued like the women who cares for men

Money is not always the talk in it, its respect and trust

[MikkiM]

@backdoorman Dont bring out topic that is not related with the questions and what we are talking about, if you dont want me to mis-interpret you,.. If your sure and understand me, why'd you ever bring out topics like thats too personal to say to a person,.. thats too personal to comment that way my friend

[backdoorman]

My comment was not personal at all. I'm not sure why you are taking offense at the fact that you and I live in different cultures, which affects the way we see things. It sounds like you live in a much more traditional culture. Nothing wrong with that. Where I live most women want to get rid of gender roles because they are sexist. That's all. No offense meant my friend.

[backdoorman]

What topic are you referring to that is "too personal"?

[MikkiM]

what you mean? Im giving comment for the perspective of woman like me, im not mis judging what a guy means or feels..

[Lopezz1999]

It's to be more many to pay for a woman? I'm going to need you to explain to me how this makes any sense..

[MikkiM]

@Lopezz1999 what you mean? i dont understand? haha :3

[Lopezz1999]

Oh sorry, manly*. Misspelled lol

[Lopezz1999]

Thing is though, I don't pay for women to show respect for them. I pay for them if I like them, and only if they like me just as much. I show respect to people by giving them the respect that they deserve, and that doesn't make me any less manly, or any more manly by paying for her when it's time to go out. I also can't pay for someone if the chances for a second date aren't definite either. It would suck to pay for someone's food knowing that you wouldn't see them again, right?

[MikkiM]

@Lopezz1999 yeah, I think that way,.

I see man as providers,. and if I woman acts like a provider,.. I think most of the time woman would stepped over on a man.

its not that man always have to pay for dates,.. if you know your date well already, its easier to open up topic to became balance with things,..
But if its first dates, it would be an act of Kindness of a man if he pay first for first dates

well,. act of manliness is like being man enough to handle relationships, and that a girl should lower herself as a woman

Most, thats why our generation turn nowadays, woman became bossy around, because most of them dont know how to respect their man as a man.

[Lopezz1999]

Ah I see.. as a guy, I tend to avoid being a provider, especially for girls that I'm not in a relationship in. I want to be a lover to a woman.. someone to help make a woman feel good about herself by sharing romantic and sexual tension by fulfilling her romantic and sexual desires while keeping my own personality intact. Doing so does not require to pay for a girl, however it does require me to make her feel respected. I can do so easily without having to pay for one, risking money.

[MikkiM]

@Lopezz1999 Cool at a young age you know how to became enough with the age on you, well but in reality, when you date older women

you have to adjust yourself with it,. one day you'll have a family on your own and be a husband and a father,..

You have to learn this one day,.

But i guess being a teenager, doesn't required this at all, I understand when i was teenager i dont have money at all, and i had to pay for my dates with my ex, i never known what im looking at why,

i guess you dont have to act manly while in that aged, but you have to show her your responsible and keep that fulfilling her romantic needs

I guess you will be a man to many woman :)

[Lopezz1999]

@MikkiM Do you mean that I'll be providing for older woman?

[MikkiM]

@Lopezz1999 when you grow up ^_^

or I mean when you grow older,

older woman became too over-expecting, dont let them take control on you

for now as a teenager,
show them your responsible enough,

so girls or boys will never criticized on you as a person

but be careful many boys might get jealous if you got that title " of a man to many woman"

^_^ hehe

[Lopezz1999]

Aha thank you, and yeah.. I won't be letting that happen. You're a pretty respectable woman yourself. Are you new to GirlsAskGuys?

[MikkiM]

@Lopezz1999 yeah im new, i think its pretty cool in here, but somehow, other people feels hard to get along :)

[Lopezz1999]

@MikkiM Ah, don't sweat it. There are some genuinely friendly people here. Maybe try sharing opinions on trivial preference questions or polls? Or there is a "How do I look" topic that you could check out guy's and girls looks. I'm sure the dudes here will appreciate your opinions lol

[MrNameless]

No, its because women like you demand equality but still expect men to be old fashioned and pay everything or them and treat them like princesses. You can't have it both ways.

[MrNameless]

That's so fucking sexist to say that its a "responsibility of a guy" to fit in gender roles.. Notabl ask and pay for the first date. WHY should it be their responsibility in the 21st century when women can make a living for themselves in the western world?

It's as ludicicrious as a me saying something like its a girl's responsibility to make me a sandwich/cook food whenever I ask, or do all the house chores, to put out etc

It isn't.

[MikkiM]

@MrNameless I dont know , why you guys get so upset for paying for the first date,. I understand that maybe you've dated a girl who expect so much from you,.

I know we are in the 21st century,.. where girls can make their own money, and thats why
they become too independent to their selves to dont need a man to pay out for them
The role of a woman and man been forgotten, and most woman stepped on mans ego as most woman becoming Strong and too independent woman

I was just thinking that its easier to tell its a responsibility of a guy, as in act of treat and respect for the girl

its like you buy a drink for a woman in the bar,

Im not misjudging guys,. that they should pay or couldn't pay,.. its just trusting and respecting guys whom to pay first

anyway dont date high maintainance woman,. they will always demand for a luxurious dates..

i think its just a little penny to act KINDNESS as a man for a woman you'll be with
some woman will let man pay, cause its simply being SUBMISSIVE

[timesplittersxsxd]

Yes and your responsibility as a woman is to look pretty and not voice an opinion, i mean look how dumb you make yourself look when you do, so stfu.

[MikkiM]

@timesplittersxsxd im not even giving opinion for the man,.

its for the girls anyway

[Comawhite666]

I've always offered to pay for myself, but 90% of the time the guys I have been out with have paid quite willingly, even when I offered to buy the second drink or something else. If they're being generous enough to do that then I'm not going to shun that and demand I pay for myself.

[YourFutureEx]

Yu-Gi-Oh! Fan? 😍

[Comawhite666]

@YourFutureEx Haha Yes! :D

[Lopezz1999]

That isn't why men are pissed here, but I still liked nevertheless. It's when women expect men to pay for them.

[Bandit74]

The fact that they expect/ feel entitled to it is definitely a big part of why it irritates me. It also implies that her time is more valuable and that I need to compensate her for choosing to spend it with me.

The other factor is that they aren't really consistent in holding that expectation. The same girl who might expect me to pay to take her out has probably sent nudes and or spread her legs for guys who didn't have to spend any money on her. It sends the message that she doesn't perceive me as being as valuable as the other guys she has been with. Like I am not worthy of going on a second date with her unless I spend money on her, meanwhile she allowed other guys to go a lot further than a second date without having to spending a dime. I mean if given a choice I find it A LOT more flattering to be one of the guys who she didn't expect to spend money on her.

There are a couple other reasons why I dislike that expectation, but what I listed so far are the biggest ones.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

On point.👏👏👏👏

[BubbleBoy69]

An average female has tons of men chasing her. And it only gets worse as you move up. If you don't believe me then set up a female account on okcupid and watch how many men come to you like flies.

If she picks you or accept your offer then she is doing u a favour as she could have picked another guy. So basically her time is more valuable than yours.

[juststrollin]

Why not only go on dates with a woman you would pay for? I would not go on a date with someone i wouldn't...:/ I have a huge work ethic love making money so i dobnt see why men are so mad. If I could choose any guy i thougt was hot to take out and try to win over i would find it fun. Its hard because a man should like a woman more so its annoying to me. But, biologically men are hunters and cannot take a woman being like this so its hard to for me to learn to chill out, ughhh You get exactly what you want woman can hardly go man shopping lol

[dwhttydfan10]

so would you pay for the guy on the first date if you had assurance the guy would pay by date 3?

[juststrollin]

@dwhttydfan10 Heck yes I would and I have offered to buy guys i found attractive stuff... i live giving though, and its not a big deal to me xD. Its funny because I am a good looking girl so it just weirds them out lol ah but w/e im gonna be rich <3 sooo lol

[dwhttydfan10]

interesting you are rare :) good luck to you

[juststrollin]

@dwhttydfan10 thanks, one guy i thought was that cute wouldn't let me... it seems like the good ones won't lol... but ty np^^

[browning1996]

I think its a thing of tradition. Men are expected to have the money, so they're expected to pay for the woman. However, I've been in situations where I've offered to pay my share instead of having him do it all because its the first 'date' so I treat it casually, like a hangout.

Plus, you have cases like online dating for instance, which my friend does. She'll go on dates with guys, realize by the end of the date she doesn't want to see them again, but the guy has already paid for everything. I find that a bit unfair, but hey if the guy is willing and has money, thats up to them

[I-am-a-nobody]

1) I was always fine with paying. I asked her out, right?
It shows I can provide for my woman. Mock if you want, but this model made for more enduring marriages and more stable families.
2) So, if the woman flakes, you saved a whole lot of emotional investment. A good date doesn't cost all that much. If you're spending $75 on a first date, you're nuts.
3) I'm more traditional, so the non-traditional women got sorted out early, anyway.

So glad that dating stage is over.

[flypaper]

Haha me too... dating seems so much more complicated now.

[Anonymous]

That's why I go with simple coffee dates if I have a few extra bucks to spare. Being in university leaves me broke. Since most women expect a man to pay for a first date having no money and dating gets you nowhere. On top of that even having money to take women on dates doesn't necessarily lead to anything past a first date and it gets expensive if you go on a string of first dates or continuing to date one women just to find out one day that she's never had an interest in you.

It'd actually just be nice if women could pay half on dste or just go on dates that require no money what so ever.

On top of that flaking is annoying. If you're not interested just say so so I don't waste my time waiting around for you at a place where you'll never show up.

Dating just gets exhausting

[BubbleBoy69]

still paying for the pussy.

[Opinion Owner]

@BubbleBoy69 Still beats a whole dinner date and movie. A buck or two for a coffee with a woman on an occasion isn't too expensive. Plus if she want's to pay for her own coffee even better. You can also spend money hanging out with friends so it doesn't seem bad.

[Cavewoman]

Thanks very much for sharing ☺I don't know but in our culture, if a man didn't pay for the first date, he would have probably missed his chance with his date even if he tried to make up for it later on as the mentality of the women here is that if the man didn't pay for the first date, it is a clear indicator of his lack of romantic interest and she would move on. This mentality seemed deeply rooted among all the females I know :(

[MrNameless]

Agreed. Entitlment is the biggest thing. In the western world, women don't need men to make a living anymore. It's not the 1800s. They have to realize that they can't expect old fashioned gentleman that pays and does everything for her in dates, but demand equality in the same time, because it isn't equal at all.

[vonasaurus]

whoever does the asking should pay, or at least offer.

that said, antiquated social norms still frown on women who behave "aggressively", meaning those who ask men on dates or show interest.

i also find it funny how a lot of guys on here complain that "modern women aren't wife material" and then get upset because the women they choose (the housewife type who still believes in old-fashioned gender roles) don't want to pay their own way. bit strange, if you ask me.

[Mercules_J]

I don't ever see forums where men voice their disdain about paying for a first date but I think men are mad about it silently, especially knowing he may never see her again. That's why he may be mad, due to it being the last time he sees her.

[Lopezz1999]

Yes.

[Lopezz1999]

I really like how a woman decided to downvote this opinion lol

[Mercules_J]

Yes, I don't see how either. I didn't even made a rude comment about a woman. Just how a man may feel.

[Lopezz1999]

Yeah.. I guess she doesn't care about a man's feelings lol

[Vero123]

I think if the man asks you out he should definitely pay. However if the women asks the man out she should pay. I find that philosophy to be fair. I have never asked a guy out but so far any guy that has asked me out has paid.

[Lopezz1999]

So you'd rather have men definitely pay 99% of the time?

[myTake Owner]

catch 22, women don't ask men out

[Vero123]

If you asked a woman to go out with you why would you expect her to pay? Think about it lol. Since men ask women out more than women ask men out maybe that is where the generalization comes from that men should pay..

[Lopezz1999]

No, the generalization is that people (women), expect men to ask women out. Women want men to ask women out. And now, women want men to pay for dates, despite the hypocrisy in the statement "whoever asks, pays".

[Vero123]

@Lopezz1999 That's unfortunate.. If I asked out someone I would definitely pay unless he insisted on paying. My boyfriend never lets me pay when we go it and sometimes it even gets annoying because I feel like I should be contributing lol. It's nice but not needed I love him anyway haha.

[Lopezz1999]

The only problem is that "if". It's not going to happen.. it's highly unlikely that a woman were to ask for a first date with a guy. There's no point in arguing with it, it just won't happen. Because of this, guys will have to pay for you on every first date, if you were to go by this belief... and actually, it typically lowers the chances of anything more happening with him and her.

[Vero123]

@Lopezz1999 Yeah because if someone I went out with expected me to pay for him after HE asked me out that would be weird... sorry it just would be it makes no sense. I could see each paying for themselves but you don't ask someone on a date or in any instance and expect them to pay for you.. that's ridiculous.. and it has nothing to do with gender.. if women don't ask men out whatever it is what guys have to deal with sorry lol.. If I had to pay for the guy there won't be another date. I would pay for myself but not for the person who asked me there in the first place..

[MrNameless]

How often do girls ever ask guys out? Once in a blue moon? And pays? Once in every a thousand years. lol Its not gonna happen. Girls are still trained to have the guy to do everything for them. Chase, pay and make up plans for the dates.

[Lopezz1999]

It doesn't matter. He's going to expect you to pay for your shit regardless. If he must pay for your time, he'd know that you're not attracted, since you're not courteous enough to even pay for your own food, since you don't like him. It has nothing to do with "expectancy" that you won't give him a second date.

[Tony1974]

@Lopezz1999 The only time women ask men out in my personal experience, is when they hit the wall and their "options" are dwindling. They have no choice but to adapt or be alone.

[Lopezz1999]

@Tony1974 Actually, that's great to know lol

[Tony1974]

@Lopezz1999 Knowledge becomes wisdom when passed on!

[flypaper]

Yes, this is what I always believed as well. I have never been on a date that I didn't plan and pay on (I always turned people down and if I was interested asked them out on my terms). If the guy doesn't feel comfortable with me paying we split then for me it turns into a hangout and I used to lose interest. I am married now so thank goodness I don't have to worry about this crap anymore -lol.

[Lopezz1999]

@flypaper By all means, I'll let a woman pay. Though if she does, and she seems to have really enjoyed the date, I'll definitely be treating her well later that night.

[Vero123]

@MrNameless Yeah because if he asks you out why wouldn't he make the plans/at least pay for himself? This is dumb hahaha

[Vero123]

@Lopezz1999 Uggghhhh where are the days when there were many gentlemen around lmao.. my beliefs still stand lol.. mainly because it's common courtesy.. I am sure there are women that use men for money but that is such a generalization and I don't do such thing.. but when asked on a date the guy should do the ethical thing and pay since he did the asking.. this is dumb lol

[Lopezz1999]

They are very common. Guys pay for dates.. especially first dates almost all the time. If a woman expects a man to pay for her out of courtesy or any other reason, it isn't a good sign that she cares about whether or not she sees him again. When most guys pay for girls, it's because they want to, and when I see a woman pay for a guy on a first date that he asked for, that is a good sign.. believe it or not.

[flypaper]

@Lopezz1999

But yeah I always asked, so I always paid (I like to be in control esp. in the beginning of the relationship - power move, and I like to be able to have control over the place). My dates always went well because I was extreme picky about who I asked on them. I take my time sexually in a relationship (nice and slow) and really like to build up chemistry and trust early on (hence prefering to ask so that I get to set the tone and not feel rushed) all I want from him is the knowledge he had a great night and if he was interested in something real. I always dated for a relationship, not for fun or sport.

There is nothing wrong with people who prefer to be asked, they generally are more submissive and like the person that they will be with to be in the power seat. The first date is kind of like a metaphor for the rest of the relationship in my opinion.

[Lopezz1999]

Very nice. I appreciate your point of view.

[FatherJack]

Simple solution is stick to a low cost / no cost 1st date that does not put pressure on BOTH parties & allows for an easy eject for either party , if thing do not go well. This also allows men to weed out the users & gold diggers. Whoever invites should pay & plan the date.

[frozenhorizon]

#2 Is the only reason I dislike it. I can't usually tell if the girl has a serious interest or if she's just messing around by going on a first date with me. I don't want to pay for her if her intention was never to go on a second date to begin with, you know?

I've never experienced #1.

[TacosRAwesome]

I don't see why people can't treat a first date like a hangout with a new friend and have all these stupid rules. I've never heard of friendships breaking up because someone didn't pay for the other person.

[dwhttydfan10]

do you always pay for your friends when you first meet or do you go dutch? if you always pay than we should meet lol :)

[TacosRAwesome]

@dwhttydfan10 no when I go with frienfs we each pay for our own stuff, unless its drinks and in that case everyone buys a round.