Why Don't Guys Want to Pay for the First Date Anymore?

Why Don't Guys Want to Pay for the First Date Anymore?

I know what you’re thinking: “Omg, again with this first date stuff. Can we PLEASE talk about something else?” This topic has been huge the past few days on this website, and has been big everywhere else for eternity. People still wonder who should pay for the first date, and make up conclusions in their head of how it should go.

Some girls (and some guys even) still think that the guy should always pay for the first date no matter what. Some even try to justify it with flawed and fallacious arguments. This had inclined me to believe that guys simply did not want to pay at all anymore and wanted to go their own way (which is understandable) as I read through some of the comments on this myTake: Why You Should Man Up and Pay For the First Date

It also led me to ask my own question (Guys, do you mind paying the bill for the first date?), and the results were rather surprising. 56% of the guys who had answered said that they have no issue whatsoever with going into their wallet and pulling out a 50 dollar bill to cover the costs of them and their lady. With all the responses on that myTake, I thought that most guys were against the idea. This seemed like a paradox.

So, do guys mind paying the bill or do they don't?

As I read through the responses, it let me understand why guys only open their wallets for certain, special chicks, so I decided to write a short article on my findings.

Why Don't Guys Want to Pay for the First Date Anymore?

Why aren’t guys paying for the first date anymore?

They don’t like the sense of entitlement that some girls have.

Let’s be real, nobody is entitled to anyone’s money, and you’re especially not entitled to it from a guy you probably met a few weeks prior. Girls who act that they are entitled to a free meal just for the simple fact that they are a woman are a huge turn off, and are one of the reasons that guys don’t want to pay for their meal: Entitlement is NOT attractive. They don’t want to open their wallets to a female who acts like a princess and carries the expectation of a free meal from them. The fact that some women EXPECT a free meal is what has guys turning up their noses at paying, and this is what pisses most guys off the most about this whole thing.

Why Don't Guys Want to Pay for the First Date Anymore?

They don’t want to feel used.

I’m sure you don’t want to feel used, but HE doesn’t either. Feeling used is a pretty shitty feeling. Expecting a man to pay is sort of dehumanizing, and it’s like you’re using him for a free meal. This is probably what men feel like when you ask them, “Aren’t you going to pay for tonight?” He is not an ATM, or the provider of a free meal to you, he is a person too. He probably made the effort to ask you out on the date and to take you to this nice, fancy restaurant, and you repay him with the ingrained notion of expecting him to pay for your food? The first thing that needs to go is that sense of entitlement. Women are not entitled to free meals just because we have a vagina between our legs. Stop using him as your personal bank, get rid of the expectation of him whiping out his wallet to pay, and take initiative to pay for your own meal. You’ll probably be 10 times more attractive to him by not looking like a damsel in distress and he may even come back for a second date.

Why Don't Guys Want to Pay for the First Date Anymore?

They feel as if girls don’t want true equality, and only want the benefits.

Sorry, ladies, but this is not the early 1900s anymore. Times are changing, fast. The brave ladies in history fought so hard for what we have today. We have equal rights, and are finally equal to men. However, we don’t want to take on the whole responsibility of being truly equal. We want the good points of being equal, but we leave out the bad, which includes some of us having the hardwired expectation of having a man pay for our meal.

That’s like making a peanut butter and jelly sandwich, but cutting off the crust because you don’t like it.

Why Don't Guys Want to Pay for the First Date Anymore?


Yeah, it’s “traditional” and “chivalrous” to have a macho manly man pay for your meal, but chivalry is not only for woman and it applies to everyone. Also, traditional is not always better and to argue that it’s traditional is an appeal to tradition fallacy, as if you really wanted to be truly traditional, you would want to give up your rights as a woman all together that your fellow females fought so hard to give you. Stay at home with the kids. Quit your job. Maybe when you get home you could spread your legs since you want to be traditional.

Why Don't Guys Want to Pay for the First Date Anymore?

The point that I am trying to make here is that… most guys don’t even mind paying, and are all for the idea if the girl doesn’t act entitled to it, and doesn’t try to make up bullshit arguments to try to justify why paying the bill is a REQUIREMENT...because there’s no valid reason as to why guys should be obligated to pay.

Why Don't Guys Want to Pay for the First Date Anymore?

If a guy pays for you, it’s most likely because he WANTS to and LIKES you. He thinks you’re a good person personality wise and just wants to be nice. Also, it’s probably because he didn’t sense the entitlement wafting off of you in billows. He probably will come back for a second date because he feels as if you’re worth it.

So, if he pays, it’s a privilege, not a right. Cherish it, and maybe buy him dessert afterwards as he was not obligated to do so.

If not, be prepared to go in half, or if you’re that generous, pay for the both of you. Equality for everyone.

Why Don't Guys Want to Pay for the First Date Anymore?

These are just my thoughts on this argument. Do you have any other reasons? Do you disagree? If so, please be RESPECTFUL.

Thanks for reading. :)

#FirstDate #Equality

Why Don't Guys Want to Pay for the First Date Anymore?
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Most Helpful Girl

  • SuperGamingLady
    This is an awesome Take and I enjoyed reading it very much. You raise some legit points that I totally agree with. Definitely.
    I personally feel like the guy shouldn't have to pay. If he insists on it, yes, okay, awesome, but I ALWAYS ask to split. I thought it was just good manners to at least offer to pay for your meal, and I don't even mind paying for it if he's short with money/whatever. My friend has an awesome deal with her significant other that one pays for one date, and the other pays for the next one, and so on. It works for them *shrugs*. EXPECTING the other half to pay for your meal/time/whatever isn't okay, especially if you pull a move where you don't bring your purse (trust me, I'm sure it's happened). You're never going to go wrong if you ask to split the bill, I'm just saying.

    I know historically it's been expected and significant that the man pays for the date, but does it *really* matter who pays for what? You're going for the experience and (hopefully) a fun date! Live a little!

    Bottom line: just don't be an asshole lol.
    Like 7 People
    Is this still revelant?
    • Thank you and I totally agree with you.

    • No worries! Thank you for responding :)

    • Bri070

      Really good answers, very pleasantly surprised! The first two points are the main reasons why you won't get a second date, but I'll be paying for the first date because it was a bargain to find out what type of woman it is before it goes any further.

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What Girls & Guys Said

  • Prof_Don
    Here's the thing : most men don't mind paying for a woman on a date if he really likes her, and feels that she genuinely appreciates the gesture.

    It is the EXPECTATION of this, that makes men feel sour and disheartened. What was originally viewed as a kind generous gesture, many women see as an absolute requirement.
    Like 21 People
    • Yep that's exactly what I said in the myTake.

    • This^^

    • Whenever I've had a girlfriend, it really didn't matter who pays for what down the line, but for the first date, I've always felt the same. We'd always split the bill because we're on equal terms, and at some points I would pay it all if I know I am much better off than the girl in question.

      But being EXPECTED to pay for it is like "yo guy, first date things, pay up" which ruins any sort of romantic momentum that might have existed.

      It is just anticlimatic to have somebody bitch about a thing like that, and I think that a girl absolutely expecting sombody to pay for her shows what she's like more than the guy not being in the mentality to pay for everything does. Basically, it's much worse, and is summed well in what Prof_Don said.

    • Show All
  • LittleSally
    I agree... And I know many women who are 'feminists' yet they expect for the guy to pay... which doesn't make sense to me.
    Like 9 People
    • Yep I thought feminism was about female liberation. :/ They should have no issue splitting the bill ya know?

  • SunsetStar
    I was always taught if you take someone on a date, you offer to pay. If you're taken on a date, you offer to pay your share, but permit the other person to pay if they insist. Unfortunately in our society we still have the idea that men do the asking and women respond, which biases this towards men paying.
    Like 4 People
    • That's a great principle to live by. I agree. :) I would definitely offer to pay if I went on a date.

  • SirenDep
    Exactly my thoughts! When the bill comes, both should get their wallets out to pay. Then they should split the bill or pay for their own, unless one is inclined to pay for the other. A woman should not have an expectation for the man to pay, unless he made it clear to her he would do so.
    Like 3 People
  • bedroomdweller
    What? Pay for the first date, an obligation? You know girl, STFU. I'm tired of this bullshit, this "who pays on the first date" really gets on the back of my neck. You don't even know what you are talking about.

    You know what, you can GTFO here with these lame arguments just stop, for your own good or else I'm just...
    lol I'm just kidding. I agree to this. The refusal on paying is basically a response to women's behavior. The whole thing is just men tired on pandering, and putting women on a pedestal. The entitlement, and just recurrent princess complex most women display now has a lot of men fucking tired and saying "you want equality? Here you go". This is just an example of it, but men in general have wisen up to a lot of other female behaviors.

    "However, we don’t want to take on the whole responsibility of being truly equal. We want the good points of being equal, but we leave out the bad, which includes some of us having the hardwired expectation of having a man pay for our meal."

    Preach. My point is this actually applies to a lot of stuff other than this expectation of paying for their meal.

    Good take.
    Like 2 People
  • pr3ttybr0wn
    From what I gather, a guy who can afford it will pay if he thinks your worth it.

    The problem is, a lot of men are complaining about paying for dates with women they think aren't worth it. If that's the case, and she isn't "worth it", why waste her time or try to get her in the first place?

    I began to notice a difference in the attitudes of a man who would happily pay for a date with no question, and a man who tried to nickel and dime his way with you. Guys who don't value you or like you won't wanna pay. They think it's a problem. Avoid the guys who want to spend time with you but are overly suspicious that you're money grubbing and using him for a $20 meal. Those tend to be the guys who really aren't going to treat you right anyway.

    I hear that guys are saying "they dont like women who EXPECT them to pay", but I mean, you asked her out right? I would expect a guy who asked me out to like me enough to do that without a problem... because if you don't like me like that, why are you asking me out? I don't feel that I'm wrong to expect a guy's interest in me to be genuine. If so, then I would rather that type avoid me.

    *Does this make sense or nah?
    LikeDisagree 3 People
    • Bottom line is: I'm not telling what to do and every man is different. Do what you feel is right. I shouldn't be stopping my you.

    • CrashDF

      What do you do for the guy in exchange? Don't say the usual two comments you have to bring something to the table and nothing in your response says what you do to deserve getting $100's to $1,000's spent on you. What makes you so special? With your type you always think of yourself never about what the other receives that's why you only spoke about getting the billed paid for by someone else in other worlds valuing you. How do you value others? by the way I was a feminist till I was 36 when I saw the vast majority of my female friends utterly destroy their husbands, boyfriends taking them for ever Dollar they had while they cheated on them the entire time. I'm white collared 6 feet and in shape and I was on the shy side so these married, in LTR women everywhere thought it was ok to rub their chests against me, make lewd comments and see if I was interested in a one night stand. Virtually all of them would have slept with me, I gave up on being a father I did everything right and listening to trash comments like yours... I hope you wake up one day and see the damage your type have done. You think your so liberated and empowered we'll the wall is coming for just like all the rest. by the way I'll still be rocking a 6 pack well into my 50's don't cry when you see guys like me with 20 year olds. You don't deserve us, your not good enough :)

  • brain5000
    This was a good Take. You cover some good points.

    One thing I'll readily admit to that other men might not is that we have feelings, and we grow attached to the person we're with.

    All too often, I have gone through the process of paying for an elaborate meal and activity, coming up with conversation, emotionally bonding and even having sex -- only to get ghosted or dumped after one or two dates.

    If any of you women have ever gone through the feeling of being used or unjustly hurt, imagine if you went through all of that and also *paid* for it.

    I know men are supposed to only want to get laid. If I pay good money and don't have sex for five or more dates, that's terrible too. Either way it feels like a no-win situation. Either way someone feels used and hurt.

    The only way I see it working is if we treat it like we're hanging out as friends. This is totally doable now. @redeyemindtricks has even written about how that's how she started with her husband - with walks through parks and free/cheap stuff. This is totally doable and works. It's proven.

    I get that women want to feel special. They like to be pampered. Guess what? So do guys. Money shouldn't matter.

    And look, I get there are still some guys out there who want to keep the traditional ways, along with some girls. This debate isn't going to end today.

    I happen to believe that burdening one gender with the responsibility of footing the bill and filling the role of the provider is bad. It's bad for each one of us, bad for both genders, bad for the institution of the family, bad for feminism, bad for MGTOW, and bad for society. It's just a terrible idea. It's outdated, obsolete, and not a part of today's real world.

    It goes on, because rich guys can buy whatever they want. That probably won't ever change, but there are only so many millionaires and billionaires. The rules that apply to them will never apply to the rest of us, why should that one?

    Is your dating life going well?
    Like 1 Person
    • brain5000

      If you know anything at all about history, you know that living life as a woman in the United States saying "I don't believe in feminism" while you work in jobs other than teaching and nursing, or bent over a hot stove and changing diapers... means you haven't a clue about what feminism is. If you're studying for a decent career or going to work every day, you're a feminist and you owe a debt to feminists who came before.

    • lambdoor

      thing is why should I go out with a guy not willing to provide for me and spoil me when so many others do?

    • brain5000

      @lambdoor Point taken. Because it dehumanizes the guy. Because you want to maintain his humanity, just as you want him to see you as a person with thoughts and feelings, and not as his sex toy or whatever.

    • Show All
  • DominizZle1311
    I feel as though if I send the invite to have breakfast, lunch or dinner then I should be the one who pays because it was MY idea for us to go and eat. Now if he sends the invite then he should pay because it was HIS idea. Now if we both decide to pay for our own meals then we do so, but that often doesn't happen.
    Like 2 People
    • Seems like a good principle :)

    • I try my best to be fair when it comes to that :)

    • CrashDF

      How often do you see girls asking men out? how often do you see them paying? Exactly. The only acceptable or reasonable thing a women would ever maybe do is split the bill.

  • pavlove
    What I'm realizing based on the reactions from my own Take is that it's just a personal choice. I would pay for all these girls because I was raised to believe that's what men do but even when I started getting paid way more than I needed to take a girl anywhere I wanted to take her... it still didn't sit well with me. The reason is because it's not me. I'm an actual bonefied feminist and I want a woman who in many ways is my equal. Not every man has to be like me and I don't have to be like every man. But the problem is men like me feeling pressured to do something they're not truly comfortable with on a psychological level because we don't date to take care of someone, we date to get to know them and then once they're our girlfriends that becomes something entirely different. That's just men liek me. I also know women who DO NOT want a man paying for them for any reason. Rainbowfangirl i think if you want a man to pay then you should stick with that. I personally don't understand how you can want equality but want a man paying but that's just me.
    LikeDisagree 5 People
    • I understand that. I wrote this based upon the answers I received on my question. Most of the guys on my question expressed the sense of entitlement that many girls have wafting off them and it turns them away from paying. I should have mentioned societal pressure but I forgot that. Oops. That would have been a good point to add. I did not express that I want a man to pay for me because I plan to take care of myself and make 6 figures.

      And also I don't mind paying for the whole meal for a guy and I've expressed that before. But I'll be fine with splitting the bill. :P

    • *bonafide

  • ShortCircuit
    I agree with every last point. I am just glad there is finally a woman willing to stick up for us on this subject.

    Maybe all of those stubborn, hypocritical women will listen to YOU, because God knows they won't hear US out.
    Like 3 People
    • Thanks I'm glad you liked it.

    • snowangle

      It's up to those in positions of privilege to speak up for those who aren't. There are some areas in life where men are privileged and some where women are.

    • @snowangle but that's doesn't give the person a right to treat someone less of who they are

    • Show All
  • madhatters4
    good take. really appreciate the effort you put into understanding the various reasons guys do or don't want to pay.

    as i said in my response to your previous questions; i always offered to pay for the first date but really appreciated when a woman offered or demanded to split.
    Like 1 Person
    • Yes, you're welcome. :)

    • Is it more attractive when she offers?

    • it is to me. i like a woman who is independent and doesn't subscribe to old ideas of gender roles

  • Rahdle
    Personally I'll always offer to pay. Cuz if it's someone I want to take on a date, it's worth it. I work, I have money, I can pay for our meal. If she wants to, I'm not gonna stop her. Or I'll pay for it and she can leave a tip. That's always fun. I feel like this shouldn't be as big of a deal as it is
    Like 1 Person
  • Redstang88
    There we go. You got it figured out.
    Like 4 People
  • SovereignessofVamps
    Whoever asks pays... or you can just pay for yourself anyway. I wouldn't want a guy to pay for me the 1st time I met him! I would want him to do that after he's my boyfriend. Him paying on the 1st date is creepy to me. Or not creepy, but I wouldn't like it since it comes off like he wants some big commitment. It'd scare me off.
    LikeDisagree 3 People
    • Yep! You guys can figure that out yourselves when the time comes. :)

  • SpecialAgentStone
    This expectation is only still existing because men as a group continue to fulfill that expectation. This is just basic psychology. And is also the irony in all of this. It's not women who have the keys in their hands to steer the dating world into fairer waters, it's men. And only men.

    Men pay because they think it's expected of them. They think it's expected because other men do as well. They fear they will be looked down upon because they don't conform to the same rules as most other men do. It's called peer pressure and isn't just observable in the dating world but everywhere. You don't want to fall out of line, it makes most people feel uncomfortable.

    This is why social changes of any nature are so slow. It takes a few brave humans who are willing to break the rules of a given society and slowly over time more and more will follow until it becomes the norm.

    It was the same with women and their traditional roles as well. A man's expectation that the woman HAS TO be a traditional, subservient housewife who's dependent on his money changed once women collectively decided to not put up with those demands any longer. Note that it wasn't men who started that change, it was mostly women. A few women started it and more and more followed them.

    In short, those expectations come from the other gender's willingness to fulfill that expectation. Which means that the only way this expectation will ever change is when men as a group collectively decide to split the bill. It will never work otherwise. It doesn't matter how independent you raise women and how much money they earn. If you're a female CEO but you go on 10 dates and 10 men INSIST on paying for you and spending $100 and more on each date, that will be seen as normal and become expected regardless of whether it makes any sense or not and regardless of whether it is fair or not. Men feed that expectation with their willingness to conform to it. And there will be people waiting in line who will try to use that imbalance to their advantage.

    As was highlighted in the other thread, in several European countries that's not even a topic anymore, the bill is split by default. Women see it as completely normal for no other reason than because it is what usually happens.

    So if you think this or any other expectation is unfair, then don't let these expectations lead you to think you should conform to them. Just let her pay.
    Like 2 People
    • hahanoway

      Brilliant analysis. Exactly this. And it can also applied to other things as well, such as guys being expected to ask girls out. When I was in Stockholm I was amazed by how many 8/10, 9/10 and 10/10 hotties would approach guys in clubs and openly talk about wanting sex. It felt absolutely unreal. I asked them why they did this is and they almost in a chorus said because guys don't approach us anymore lol.

      If the weather in Sweden wasn't that bad I would have gladly stayed longer.

    • I was referring to American girls. At my school, we have a dance called Sadie Hopkins, and the GIRL must ask the GUY to the dance, not vice versa.

  • TripleAce
    I had 4 dates lined up in one week. I paid for all 4, total cost maybe 300$. While one of my dates also had 5 dates within 2 weeks. Her total cost 0$

    Unfortunately women will always expect it because there will always be some joe blow waiting in line to pay for her
    Like 2 People
    • Yeah I wish we didn't expect it. :( I mean it would be a pleasant surprise.

    • hahanoway

      Damn, why do you spend so much on dates? Just take a walk in the park or drink coffee. Or split the bill. Why would you want to end up with a girl who expects you to pay for her?

    • That is why my first dates are always free, or a cup of coffee. It really weeds out those gold diggers!

    • Show All
  • WalterRadio
    If the guy you are talking to doesn't want to pay, find a different guy who will. It is a competition, so differentiate between the winners and losers.

    The flip side advice for guys is, if a girl doesn't want to have sex right away, find a different girl who will. It is a competition, so differentiate between the winners and losers.
    Disagree 10 People
    • amphet11

      Prostitution by very definition! Sad really.

    • that's not the way to solve that problem.

    • @amphet11
      "Prostitution by very definition!"
      No different than marriage.

    • Show All
  • Lopezz1999
    You have nailed it in all points- couldn't have said it better myself. I must ask though, what has led you, a woman, to speak for men that have been oppressed on this subject?
    Like 3 People
    • Well, I grew up with a father who used my mother for her wallet and I've noticed woman doing
      The same thing. They always say they want a "sugar daddy"
      and stuff which just seemed wrong to me. I've always believed in splitting the bill or fluctuating between us when we go out to eat. I just think it's the right thing to do.

  • WhaChaChaKing
    I really don't get the big deal. Are women that fucking cheap? Just split the damn bill.
    LikeDisagree 12 People
  • Other_Tommy_Wiseau
    The reason is because women didn't have jobs or cars or income to even go on dates. Therefore it was more of a necessity than actually chivalry. But yeah, I agree with everything here
    Like 5 People
  • JohnDoe3000
    Yes, these points are exactly the points some of us (myself included) were trying to make. So I think this is a great myTake: you explained it really well!
    Like 4 People
  • Death_of_rats
    thank god... i was beginning to lose hope with this site.

    Really nice take, and im glad that this was written by a woman, because when men voice these arguments, we apparently need to man up and deal with it.
    Like 2 People
  • mostwomenshouldstfu
    Oh my, tired of this power struggle crap. Incoming rant:

    There is one positive to male pussification and female empowerment that I think gets overlooked, the shrinking power discrepancy between genders makes the world a bit less dangerous for women and should alleviate some of that fear women constantly shoulder. I think you'd see males get softer and females get stronger (humans have generally been shrinking anyway). Male testosterone levels are generally dipping as well. And it would make men more vulnerable than they have been. So there won't be as much need for controlling mind games, from women. For women it would mean more work, and generally less for men, effort wise.

    Be forewarned, count your blessings oil shales were cracked. This paradigm shift is contingent upon fossil fuels. So, I suggest every person who wants to embrace this push for increased funding for energy prospecting outside of the earth biosphere, or reduce population. This way of life is unsustainable without external energy (there's not enough renewables to sustain this at current world pop.) Unless the crazy f***s in Geneva have some huge breakthrough. That may sound crackpot, but it's the truth, for all first world countries. This also means 2nd, 3rd world cultures are INCOMPATIBLE, and their intolerance of Western tolerance CANNOT be allowed (sorry Muhammad you f***ing a**hole).

    I don't trust the f***s on this site with this model any farther than I can throw them. There are too many lurkers with ulterior motives and I've seen too many women hurt by men who exploit them. Until I see fewer catcalls, fewer men abandoning women, more men helping out more with child rearing, less time f***ing around watching TV or playing video games, fewer men abusing women, men taking better care of themselves, fewer men sitting on their a** avoiding child support, closure of the gender lifespan gap, elimination of gender preference in workforce placement via affirmative action, end of this gender war crap, women genuinely taking on more challenging roles in workforce, women being more involved in financial contribution, women more confident in carrying themselves in public, women treating themselves more respectably and responsibly as opposed to sluts or mooches (goes for men too), I remain skeptical. I'd pray that this would reduce divorce rates seeing as how there would be a more collaborative effort.

    In conclusion, I'll pay for the d*** first date, for the time being, f***. Rant over.
    Disagree 1 Person
    • I wasn't telling you want to do dude. Do what you want lol. 😂
      If a guy insists on paying I won't stop em.

  • Notorisch_Arschloch
    Why don't guys adhere to the social contract of yesteryear?

    Well, women's half of that social contract included not having another man's kids, not having had more miles of dick run through them than Usain Bolt has run, and weighing what the FUCK ALL of you OUGHT to and VERY EASILY CAN weigh.

    Gee. Wonder why.
    Disagree 1 Person
    • Let me guess... you didn't read the take? Try reading past the title because I was actually DEFENDING your right to not have to pay for women. ;)

    • lambdoor

      You sound bitter.

    • No, I did, and I caught that. Throwing in with it, as it were.

    • Show All
  • Tanuron
    Not long ago I saw a youtube vid of some feminist show that (somehow) aired/airs on tv somewhere. How on earth that is even allowed I dont know, but to my point. Pretty much every woman there thought this one guy was like satan reincarnated for wanting to split the bill on a date. Like "Oh no you didnt!". Whined that it was just $20 , saying he was cheap etc, but what makes that them then, who can't even pay $10. Disgusting really, I dont get how crap like that is even allowed on tv. But yeah, jeez, honestly. Considring how entitled so many people seem to be, men everywhere should stop paying for first dates completely, think that would be interesting to see how things would progress if that happen. Maybe people would start to actually appreciate that someone simply bought you dinner. I know I always do, the few times someone paid for me for a meal.

    But one obvious thing though, if men everywhere are expected to always pay on dates, first dates etc. Like anyone who is a regular dater for example, seriously that would get expensive. A proper meal for two people is what over there, 40 dollars or so? Say if you go on 50 dates in a year, thats already $2000 dollars. Half of it, well spent on yourself, sure. but other half if no luck, result or nothing worthwhile that came from it, those other $1000 you might as well wiped your ass with them, cause spent on nothing in a way, guess could view it as donations perhaps, lol.

    But in either case, I dont see why anyone really, at least not any adult, wouldn't Want to pay for their own food. Just seem like the most respectable thing to do. In the same way you clean up your own mess, you pay for your own food. While its fine if whoever wants to pay for it all, just dont act or feel entitled to it, certainly not cause of your gender. Which yeah I know many would think regarding a guy that he's not really a gentleman if he dosent pay, personally I dont see how it makes a woman a lady if she expects to be paid for.
    Like 1 Person
  • mistixs
    well i certainly hope that men are ready then to put equal amounts of time, money & energy into their appearance
    LikeDisagree 11 People
    • The ones that work out frequently certainly put in as much or more time and energy into it.

    • I bet they do but that can be a good counter argument against it.

    • QooLipBite

      Well they're probably gonna be spending too much time and energy earning the money that you're gonna be using up.

    • Show All
  • genuinlysensitive
    I pay, I don't mind paying, but unfortunately, due to being used for free dinners by way too many women, when you go on a first date with me it will either be free or a cup of coffee.

    I really agree with this: "So, if he pays, it’s a privilege, not a right. Cherish it..."

    People need to do more cherishing, and less competing, and playing the victim in relationships.
    Like 2 People
  • sxh967
    I pay for my girlfriend most of the time at restaurants etc but she pays most of the time at the supermarket. I probably pay 2:1 more than she does on average but it doesn't bother me. There's something inherently empowering about picking up the bill for you and your girlfriend.

    In contrast, I would absolutely hate it if my girlfriend went out with her male friends and they paid for her. It would just feel like an insult to me. Maybe people disagree with that and think I'm being petty, but there are some red lines that I don't want crossed, and other guys treating my girlfriend is one of those red lines.

    In terms of first dates, I generally agree with your main post. If a girl just pretends to take out her purse and pretend to pay, that's enough for me to go and pay it. I would be really turned off if the girl sat there looking at me, expecting me to pay unless I had already implied earlier that I was going to pay (which I wouldn't do because I'm not that stupid).

    I think paying for your girlfriend when you go out together is part of your 'territory' before you get married. Once you get married, you might actually have joint bank accounts etc so in that situation it doesn't matter who physically pays because it's all coming from the same account :)

    I know in some Asian cultures, the man earns most of the money but the woman manages the money and so the woman is most likely the one to pay at the counter at least once they get married.
  • UnknownReflection
    As i have said many other times. I comment as it seems i am the only male on this community that is far far far away from this topic.
    I really like this take. It's reasonable and make sense.
    But i don't understand why this should be such a huge deal? it's a simple payment. I have many more important factors to look after than being worried about a simple meal payment. Besides, How about men stop dating with a thousand of girls randomly so they don't feel used anymore? also try find a reasonable girl, remove someone who look at you as ATM device or hold the financial capability as a value in a relationship, choose women who are understandable and reasonable, those who are communicative and having a better inner beauty. There is a tone of them out there.
    My rules are simple, first of all there shouldn't be any MUST.
    -It is my principle to pay for my dates.
    -If someone look what i am doing as a duty, i will kick them out.
    -If someone ask to split or share, i will have no problem.
    -It is my principle to pay, but maybe i am going through a phase of financial difficulty, if a girl i am interacting with can't understand it, i don't lose anything, she doesn't hold the same values and she is not interested in me, she is interested in my pocket and back accounts. Means she is not worthy. Thus i simply keep someone who cares about me not piece of paper.
    It is not that hard to do so.
    • It's not a huge deal. ;)

    • Not to you! you are addressing the matter reasonably!
      That part of my words appointed to many people in this community who take this as a first world problem!! in half of a month being part of this community i am constantly exposing to this topic and i just don't get it why we should take it too hard. But you have some good points which i did not know. For instance, some of them reasons you represented on the behalf of men who are complaining the first date payment. I did not know some of their thoughts cause as i have said, i am not into it much and i have clear rules to keep it simple. It was good to take this journey on your article.

  • Abe90
    We get it already. Men should pay for the first dates. This is like the third or fourth post that I've seen about men paying on the first date. Drop it already and ask other things or talk about something different
    Disagree 3 People
    • You didn't read one word. You just saw the title and deciding to give this ignorant response. Go and actually read what I wrote because I was actually DEFENDING men and their right to NOT pay. Thanks. That's why you should read past the title, no? -_-

    • Abe90

      Right, cuz I'm ignorant for being annoyed with seeing something that's constantly been asked this past week.

      Call me an ass, rude, or whatever, deep down, I don't care. I didn't read past the first sentence because of redundancy. A lot of the times, I get a laugh at people's responses because they easily get offended and it makes laugh. Use creativity, stop being a follower and ask something different. Oh yea, I forgot to mention, you're a moron

    • Well that's on you. :) You shouldn't call people you don't know morons because you're mad something that happened in your life. It's not my fault you're miserable on the inside.

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  • JustCallMeLeon
    This is the best fking article i have ever read about this subject. Its like im seeing my thoughts on paper. The fact you're also just 18means you're really smart and ahead of your time. Ladies, take notes here.
    Like 1 Person
  • PurpleTeardrops2
    Honestly for this to be such a serious/sour discussion in American dating is so sad and unnecessary
    LikeDisagree 5 People
  • Itsmeyay
    Nailed it, want equal rights, get equal rights, want tradition, live like you mean it, go home and wait for me until I say otherwise. Guys paying is not a right, not even privilege, it's an act of good will, a favor. Some women dont deserve a favor, some guys will still pay, no matter. Just not take another date, be thankful, some guys won't even pay, it's their right, have respect. discuss this before you go on a date if you feel strongly about a certain point and don't want to be surprised. There is no more right or wrong way, get over it. I personally will pay and don't mind weather a woman feels compelled to help or obligated to get a free lunch. If I ask her and she goes where I choose and relies on me to make her night interesting, I don't even care what she believes as long as we enjoy ourselves. Even though I do feel better if I pay it seems more natural to me. Never had anyone pay for me yet but would try if I got the opportunity. Just once probably because I probably won't feel comfortable with it. But we will have that experience together and it will help us to get to know each other better. (not first date because first impressions last and I don't want to be remembered like that), just my opinion.
  • rihannanavy
    Pay for your own. It's hard out here. The first date is iffy. What if I don't want to go on a second date with you again? A guy just paid for a horrible or boring date. You don't know what you're getting. If it's the second or third okay Mabey. Whoever is insisting at that point
    Like 1 Person
  • valeriewen
    Personally I wouldn't really mind sharing the bill - even for the first date.
    But most guys would just turn down my offer anyway.

    It is equality for me - not sure how all the other guys would think. I heard that some even treat it as rejection/friendzoned.
    Like 1 Person
  • yotes-of-472
    Because he doesn't like feeling burdened to have to do it and he's tired of a pussywhipped culture and society like me and wants to put this crap to rest.

    Geez, can't you see it? Why should that bother you? If you don't like it, find a weak man that will put you first no matter what and will be your total slave.
    Disagree 2 People
    • ^^^ This guy didn't read shit I said and if he would have read, he would have known that I was defending his right to not have to pay! Wow, see what reading can do?

      Guys who didn't read counter: 6

    • Well I see 2 pictures that shows women thinking it is odd that she can't get her way. Plus, I am seeing the way you word your question. It makes me think subconsciously that you want a man to come up with an answer that supports men paying on 1st dates as it would turn you on but secretly want to bash a man that doesn't agree. It's a no win situation and I read it but my answers aren't always compatible with what you type. I interpret the article differently when you throw pictures in it that is misleading.

    • I used different pictures. When gag features stuff they sometimes change the pictures around. Sorry for misleading you.

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  • IceCubedude
    if you act entitled i won't pay , i won't give you the time of the day and i will actually do my best to take from you, if you are nice, caring and genuinely dont even care about the money most men will galdly pick up the check ( it shows when we ask you to go somewhere cheap and you make all kinds of excuses to go else where that is much fancier )
    Like 1 Person
  • yunali
    There are lots of instincts and feelings surrounding the courting process on both sides. But the reason is really just economics. Paying for a date with a woman used to be the norm because men far out earned women, so if you wanted to take one out, you had to "take care of her" on the date. This gave pleasing feelings to both genders making women feel protected and men feeling like providers... But it had nothing to do with those feelings.

    Today, such feelings still push men to pay and women to desire that he pays, but because they are no longer based on an economic reality of how genders earn and are provided for, the practice is loosing grip on the dating world.
    Like 2 People
    • Well if it has nothing to do with those feelings then why did they answer my question in that way?

    • yunali

      Feelings are often an afterthought of our financial situations. It's not that they don't matter, it's just sad that they don't.

    • Well I believe it is

  • GingerGuy
    I think for first dates especially, each should pay for their own meal/bill.
    Like 2 People
  • rjroy3
    1. My dad was/is good with women.
    2. When I was old enough to date he said don't pay for the girl, because if she likes you then your company should be enough.

    That hasn't failed me yet and I've never lost a girl or date, because I didn't pay for the first date. I don't know if guys ever "wanted" to pay unless they were taught to do so and it felt like the right thing to do because that's what they were taught or they're doing it to buy a girls affection. That's a lesson all men should learn. That if you want a girl to like you for you do not try and buy her affection.
    Like 2 People
    • That's a good way to find a woman who will stay with you no matter what.

    • rjroy3

      Better sooner than later right? lol

  • VictoriousSausage
    i don't mind paying for the first date, but sometimes i can't and need to split it, otherwise, you know, we can't pay. i'll usually offer to pay for it though, if she wants to split it or pay it herself then i'm okay with that, i may ask if she's sure, but if she gives the go-ahead then it's all good, a really nice take by the way. a little one-sided, but i know you were targeting a specific problem.
  • Unit1
    Splendid! It makes me smile on the inside when I see women addressing this issue AND YOU UNDERSTAND PERFECTLY WHY!
    Not to demotivate anything but it isn't rocket science either. Entitlement and being used is a huge turn OFF!
    Splitting the bill on the first date is the way to go - it's a symbol of both putting effort into it and are both interested in it.

    Excellent job RainbowFanGirl :D Rainbow Dash must be proud of you :)

    Oh and by the way: This GIF cf.girlsaskguys.com/.../...9-8af0-7f1850128ac2.gif is cool XD :D
    Like 2 People
    • Thank you :) And I love that gif too lol I also love that song

    • Unit1

      Wow, I see you received some heat from the bitter guys (who just skipped the contents of this take and ran over their keyboards).
      And I also see you dealing with it with class and style! That's pretty impressive for 18 years I must say :) ♥

      Keep it up!

  • cth96190
    A question that should be asked is: how many men are interested in a first date, or any form of interaction with women?
    Every day, more men walk away from the plantation and go their own way.
    LikeDisagree 2 People
  • Blitzkrieger
    i would only pay for a girls food on a date, regardless of it being the first or not if i already knew her for a long time. i mean why would i buy food for a person that i dont even know i am going to see again? that makes no sense to me.

    also girls expecting me to do anything is kind of a red flag to me. nobody should be obligated to open a door or to pay for someone's food for anyone. sure it is nice, but the moment it feels like an obligation that is the moment it stops being nice. you are not doing it anymore because it is nice, you are doing it because its expected.

    on top of all of this. i want to go out and have a fun relaxing time, why would i need to feel pressured to impress anyone? i am just there to chill, dont like me? then go away.
    LikeDisagree 4 People
    • Yep that's what I said in the take. It's the EXPECTATION of having the guy paying is what turns many guys away from the idea.

    • yeah i agree with that. thats how i feel about it. its a little agitating to be honest. it spoils the mood.

    • I mean having the guy pay is super nice, but it's not cool to expect them to pay. According to the responses on my question and the other myTake, that's why most guys went off of the author because she seemed like she EXPECTED it or thought that he was obligated to pay.

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  • llorando
    What people forget is, Guys originally paid for dates not because women where entitled to a free meal but because most women didn't work so they didn't have the money or means to pay for dates. But now days that's not so much the case as men and women both equally work, so men and women should both equally pay for dates, or at the very least the one doing the asking out pay for the first date. I remember seeing a question where a female G@Ger was b*tching and complaining cause the guy she asked out didn't offer to pay for the date.
    Like 2 People
    • That also makes sense and I forgot to mention that.

    • llorando

      No worries, most people nowadays forget/overlook that part, .

  • kickme
    feminism has masculinized women and feminized men. The modern man might also expect women to fight their battles too.

    Personally, I will pay the bill and expect that she will spread her legs when she gets home and if she doesn't like that arrangemnt, their are planty of women in other countries who have been raised correctly
    LikeDisagree 2 People
  • FatherJack
    Spot on !! You are mature beyond your years , there are people my age that still act like they are back in primary school !! Whoever invites should pay to be fair , as they are your guest ( common to most cultures ) , but for a first date , keep it simple & inexpensive as this puts far less pressure on BOTH parties , & either party can quickly eject ( it's NOT only the woman that does the choosing !! ) I would be gone pronto without a word , if I had a " date " with a phone zombie that was glued to phone , for one example. As a single , FT working dad , dating is out of the question , but that's how I would conduct any first meetings. BOTH parties have to DESERVE a second date !
    Like 1 Person
  • Mrwoo99
    We DONT have to anymore that's why and I refuse to pay for you self entitled feminazi's. Why should I invest in you women when you women never invest nothing in dating. Why dont women this time instead approach men, lead the interaction, earn our respect and pay for our meal for a change because I'm not doing that shit no more.

    Dating is unequal and unfair to men and I refuse to participate. In the meantime I am fine paying to bang hot model escorts rather than spend money on you so you can blow me off for chad thunder cock and not even refund me my money.
    LikeDisagree 4 People
    • Lmao. Someone didn't read a word I said because I was defending your right to not to have to pay. 😂

    • Mrwoo99

      I didn't read it, only the title.

    • How about taking a deep breath, reading through the myTake and coming back after you calmed down? :)

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  • sodababe
    Honestly just... it could not matter less. If you're unhappy about it, just split it!
    Like 4 People
  • Twalli
    I pay for most things on our dates. I don't think many guys have an issue with this. The issue arises with the price of the first date (it should be well under $75) and if the woman will ever pay for something. I want to see a woman who expects the man to pay for everything to accept what else happened when the man paid for everything?
    Like 1 Person