What do you think about female characters with skimpy outfits in video games or in other forms of entertainment? Does it bother you?

[YHL6965]

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+1 y

Since I had to say it multiple times, why is this supposedly an issue when there are male characters like the following in the same games :
www.avoidingthepuddle.com/.../...06_1531988514.png
new.pcinvasion.com/.../..._20180406_1533309113.jpg

Also, people know the difference between real life and virtual worlds and they know women aren't just sexual objects, even if they like skimpy outfits.

[yoshi_wanna_ask]

Yes, I do. I think the issue is kinda for four reasons:
1. Disrespect & misrepresentation - A lot of people feel empowered through video games. They have a chance to express themselves, cooperate and grow their skill. Each person looks for a character to identify with or customise. But almost all women don't look or wear outfits like this, just, regular clothes. Maybe something with a bit of flair but when the only option is a different coloured bikini, with even in-game characters making comments about looks/outfits, it sends a very clear message that just makes you feel very uncomfortable, cheap & disrespected. Some games, that often have a variety of female characters, are able to make some characters with these styles & it's not too much of a problem but having it as an industry standard is kind of like if it was common for all male characters to wear cuffs, chains or muzzles. It's not reflective of reality & it just doesn't need to be a thing.

2. Subconscious Bias
Okay, so we're pretty inundated with sexuality in Western society. A woman who may have been called gorgeous 50 years ago might be considered 'basic' today because she's too plain. Media & games have an effect on the way we see the world and if not just some but every video game girl people are exposed is a 10/10, wearing almost nothing & fawning all over them they've pretty much not even met a human but some kind of alien pet that looks like a woman. You develop connections to game characters & thinking that most real people look & act like this could be deeply damaging to the person, their partners & even society.

3. Cultural/sexual appropriation - Yes certain outfits existed at certain times, but much like today they were only wore by certain people at certain times for certain reasons and a lot of the skimpy 'cultural outfits' that are chosen usually turn out to have been worn by slaves or prostitutes (ie. not the way a woman would dress if she was allowed to choose) while ignoring all other kinds of outfit options for the characters. If it was just about expression, there would be lots of different kinds and not the same kind over and over.

I think, given the way that people are and that we love pushing boundaries and things that are bad for us there's always going to be these kinds of games no matter what but if there was some kind of industry standard or board that rewarded or funded games for changing things up maybe we could have more games like To The Moon or Unravel or Undertale with some really great characters again.

[yoshi_wanna_ask]

I meant 3 reasons haha

[DWD1994]

"But almost all women don't look or wear outfits like this, just, regular clothes. "

Its a video game. It's not meant to be a realistic depiction of reality.

"Okay, so we're pretty inundated with sexuality in Western society. A woman who may have been called gorgeous 50 years ago might be considered 'basic' today because she's too plain. Media & games have an effect on the way we see the world and if not just some but every video game girl people are exposed is a 10/10, wearing almost nothing & fawning all over them they've pretty much not even met a human but some kind of alien pet that looks like a woman."

Women's insecurities and sexual hangups aren't my problem.

"3. Cultural/sexual appropriation - Yes certain outfits existed at certain times, but much like today they were only wore by certain people at certain times for certain reasons and a lot of the skimpy 'cultural outfits' that are chosen usually turn out to have been worn by slaves or prostitutes (ie. not the way a woman would dress if she was allowed to choose) while ignoring all other kinds of outfit options for the characters."

And? Why should I care? I care more about artistic freedom than I care about catering to feelings.

"I think, given the way that people are and that we love pushing boundaries and things that are bad for us there's always going to be these kinds of games no matter what but if there was some kind of industry standard or board that rewarded or funded games for changing things up maybe we could have more games like To The Moon or Unravel or Undertale with some really great characters again."

Things are fine the way they are. If you like those games, then play those games.

[YHL6965]

Judging by your answer, you must not play video games often and you seem to struggle when it comes to differentiating a virtual world with real life. Besides, your opinion is basically canned thoughts from modern feminism so I won't even bother arguing.

[yoshi_wanna_ask]

@DWD1994 I like how level headed your comments were. I'm fine if we disagree, like I said these are going to be around no matter what because there's always an audience for them, I just wish there was a bit more variety. I don't think these should 'rules' when it comes to video games or anything but simply what I think about the characters and the outfits. Thanks for being so level headed.

[yoshi_wanna_ask]

Hi, these are simply my thoughts about the characters, outfits & effects I've seen them have on people around. I've been playing video games for about 30 years now, everything from Animal Crossing to Prey (which, was awesome). Unlike a lot of others who have an issue though, I don't blame, any of this, on guys, which unfortunately tends to happen a lot, but that game devs/managers tend to use hyper-unrealistic characters and stick to only one kind of outfit or model instead of making it one of many. Overwatch and Fortnite have been great for changing that up buut they're not exactly story type characters. There's a lot of improvements that can still be made.

[YHL6965]

Thanks for being reasonable about this and not going completely overboard like some commenters did. I don't understand what point you are trying to make though. Take Soul Calibur 6 for example (all of the characters I showed are from this game) : there are a lot of revealing outfits, but they are very varied, unique and creative. This game also offers more covering outfits if you like so I don't see why these outfits would be an issue.

[yoshi_wanna_ask]

Yep and the question asked what we think about these characters and how we feel about these outfits. So I *think* while there will always be an audience for these characters and outfits in games I'd like to see just as many game options with characters like Kara (Detroit Become Human) or Abigail Walker (Infamous SS) where there's a lot more depth, reality and variety like the male characters have. The fact that if I want to choose a female often (not always) she's spandex clad with her own flotation device or in a bikini & that's the entire character gets really old really quick.

If it's part of a set of options though, like the game you talked about, then that's at least reasonable. It's when their outfit/skimpy look *is* their entire character that it makes me, and a number of women feel like this about the the game. Which sucks because they're often really good games. But, like me, a lot of them will end up choosing male characters because they're just more interesting, believable and relatable.

[YHL6965]

Understandable. However, I think that games where characters are only here for their looks are kind of rare. From my own experience, even if a character has a skimpy outfit, they still have a story, their own personality and a lot of other aspects about them that are interesting about them.

[yoshi_wanna_ask]

I have completely the opposite experience. More often than not they may have a few lines of dialogue for the MC if they have any lines at all. There are innumerable characters, even today, just there for their looks. They don't add anything to the game or story except for a handful of MMORPG's but whether it's console, PC, even mobile, it's still common through all of them. If you're playing games where even these characters are given something to add to the game, that's great & like I said, they're not going anywhere any time soon, but it doesn't change that sexist, disrespected feeling or how awkward it is, when there is no other choice.

Just a little bit of variety & progress, would make a lot of difference.

[YHL6965]

I think using "sexist" to describe is a bit extreme though. I understand it can feel frustrating but saying it's sexism is a bit too much in my opinion.

[Kaytiee]

“Almost all women don’t look for”

I don’t fully clothe my giro characters, I make them look like a badass with a sexy flair.

Don’t speak for all women when you are one.

[Kaytiee]

Lol so many girls getting triggered, I love making my female character look like a sexy badass.
How can some girls feel threatened over a bloody videogame?
And people who say It's there for males eyes, well DUH have you seen the eyecandy in movies? It's fucking everywhere so stop pointing the finger at videogames LOL.

[Dali-chan]

I always asked my self how the heck can they fight and run with a combinaison like that, while I won’t be even able to stand up without failing with an iron bra

[YHL6965]

Well, they sure won't trip on excessive cloth or something ^^

[ImagineSketchy]

It strongly depends on the game and what exactly the female does... Ivy in Soul Calibur for example (where the pic is from) just makes no sense, isn't practical and serves 0 combat purpose. All of her vital spots are exposed except for one (where the chest strap comes together to hold the brassiere/corset combo protects from very few things, but it can help).
Harming her wouldn't be a problem generally speaking. Sure her sword is also a whip and can extend as a result, but she has moves that have her at incredibly close range. The lack of clothing does allow for her movements to be much less restricted though, so she has that going for her.

Think in terms of an assassin like Quiet from MGS5. She has that "plot based" skin condition where she needs to have her skin exposed to the oxygen or else she basically dies... She is a sniper/assassin and she isn't involved in combat most of the time. It's in and out. She typically wears a bikini with a utility belt for her various rounds of ammo...

All in all, it only bothers me when it doesn't fit the game or the character. I don't care otherwise and don't mind a bit of eye candy here and there.
Don't get me started on Dead or Alive though... Nor the vacation ones. Nothing but women in bikinis prouncing about a beach. Fan service and eye candy galore. Truly a guilty pleasure.

[YHL6965]

But Soul Calibur does not make sense in the first place : swords bigger than humans, whip swords that would definitely not work in real life, portective armor that would not make sense in real life.

[ImagineSketchy]

Despite it not making sense, it does not mean that the clothing has to be so outlandish. That goes for any game. I'm all for looking cool, hot or whatever... But at the same time, my own combat training just makes me think "Wow... You wear that when you fight?"
Say Ivy were in Street Fighter, Tekken or King of Fighters, I wouldn't have an issue with it.
She's against people with swords, knives and other sharp weapons. Most of the people are not equipped to deal with that. As much as I love SC for nostalgia... It just was odd.

[YHL6965]

Yeah but why look for immersion and sense in a game that is not made to have either of these things? I mean you could argue that characters in fighting games like Street Fighter should wear padded clothing and things like that to be armored but they don't because the game does not want to make sense. Also, that's putting aside all the hadoukens and all.

[ImagineSketchy]

I don't think they need padded clothing in Street Fighter or Tekken for that matter. I can't help but look at those things.

[YHL6965]

But it does not make sense not to want protection for a fight, right? My point is that games don't have to make sense.

[ADFSDF1996]

The Radical liberal/progressive crowd gets offended by everything.

I pointed this out recently, it’s ironic considering that there were times when feminists demanded that women be allowed to wear revealing clothing. Now that women can wear revealing clothing, the feminists suddenly think it’s a “problem” and are trying to tell women what they can and can’t wear.

Also, many video game characters are ridiculously overpowered. It’s not like the female video game characters are just there for aesthetic appeal.

It’s also a double standard considering that the same folks who whine about sexy female characters don’t seem to have a problem with male video game characters wearing revealing clothing and having unrealistic body proportions.

That being said, the folks who are offended by sexy female characters need to relax, it’s not like video game characters are real people. Not to mention that nobody is forcing the female voice actresses and mocaps to star in those roles, they took the roles under their own free will.

[ncannon18]

Nope. Those female characters who wear skimpy and sexualized outfits in video games don't really bother me at all. And for the most part I think that this type of entertainment in video gaming is what's helping many video game developers make lots of money. Some people enjoy this type of entertainment in gaming while others don't for their own personal reasons. Many different art styles has been around for many years from then till now & it's brought in a lot of precious art & creations to the table in which a lot of people enjoy looking at from time to time too. Even famous professional artists & designers really do try putting their art creations to good use in video games mostly to test them out & to see how well their creative designs look in the eyes of the crowd who enjoy art themselves

[Anonymous]

Here’s my take on this made up issue. Nobody complains about male fictional characters who are overly sexualized. Like, Christian Bale in Dark Knight, Or Superman Or Black Panther and so many more examples. The guys are either so muscular and in incredible shape with a 6 pack or handsome while wearing tights and spandex. I mean it’s the same thing. Who cares who honestly cares. If you get offended by a video game or fictional character then you have problems. I don’t mean to get heated or angry but if the game is geared towards men why does it matter if the women characters are dressed in sexy outfits. That’s what sells that’s what guys are into. And I know a lot of trolls are going to say some BS about how if a women is in shape or actually looks good than people don’t take her seriously or women are more than their looks. Everybody knows that , almost everyone is in agreement with that. If anything it should be empowering to women by it saying a woman can look good and kick ass too. That makes them cooler. Sorry for getting heated again but this SJW twitter arguments and “social issues” that basically no one cares about are annoying.

[ShortCircuit]

It's kind of annoying to be honest. If I wanted to see a girl in a skimpy outfit (or entirely nude for that matter), then I'd just watch porn. Game devs putting skimpy outfits on their female characters serves no purpose besides forcing me to check over my shoulder every 30 seconds while I'm trying to play a game I like.

Keep porn and games separate ffs--or at least make it that game's specific, express purpose. Don't make a good game, but then riddle it with NSFW content so I can't play it with/near anyone else.

[YHL6965]

Why do you care that much about what others think of what you are playing?

[ShortCircuit]

Because I have a reputation to uphold? lol

[YHL6965]

Yes but if you spend your whole life worrying about what others think, I'm not sure if it will make you happier.

[ShortCircuit]

I don't spend my whole life on it. I spend a healthy amount on it, so I have a well-established social network that will open doors for me in the future. And financial, social, and romantic success makes me happy.

[shephardjhon]

Name ONE recent AAA game OUTSIDE JAPAN that still has that in 2019.
Mortal Kombat is reducing female characters due to this fake outrage. Mortal Kombat, the game that resulted in the creation of the ESRB, is backing off. If you want to have this conversation, have it IN CONTEXT of the kind of game you are talking about.
Gamers love to compare games to movies so lets do that. Even for Japan it does feel out of place when they do it to a serious horror game but on the opposite end it feels out of place when MK11 does the opposite. Its like remaking Striptese without any nudity or not having any or complaining about Magic Mike having nudity. Filmmakers put in skimpy outfits if it fits the tone, game developers should do the same.
Japan is still at the level of stupidity that they do it to every game while the US has gone puritan and don't do it in games which require it. If the tone is MK 11, you NEED to do it, if the tone is Last of Us you must NOT do it.

[YHL6965]

I agree that context is important.

[shephardjhon]

I just saw some of the women's replies and I have to ask a favour. Can you re-write the question and mention context. Eg. mention examples of games where it is appropriate (MK series, Street Fighter series, Soul Calibur, God of War, Red Alert series, any campy game) and ones where it isn't (Last of Us, C & C generals, Fallout series, Sykrim, Bioshock, any serious game) and ones where it depends on scenes (Witcher, Grand Theft Auto). I am interested to know how their opinion changes if you add context.

[YHL6965]

I don't think it would matter because most women offended by this don't even play video games and are kind of ignorant on the topic.

[ImJustCurious13]

Eh, Neutral, if the player likes it, then the player likes it, and if you don't like it, then don't play the game, don't even acknowledge its existence. Funny how people talk about oversexualized female characters but never talk about the over masculine male characters. But games are supposed to be fun and unrealistic, it's why people play them in the first place.

[YHL6965]

Definitely agree, nobody bats an eye at overly muscular or exposed male characters and why should we be bothered by all this in the first place? It's amazing how some people like to create problems out of thin air.

[AuroraRoseat]

They're not over-sexualized. Those characters are meant to embody archaic gender stereotypes as to what a man is supposed to be. There's a big difference between the two. Not to mention that there are games that are moving away from that male stereotype (the Bruce Wayne in the Tell-Tale series is nothing like in the Arkham games).

And it isn't "problems out of thin air". People internalize the message that they aren't good enough unless if they embody the characteristics or physical features of these characters (or like people on television) which creates a negative self-image. An example is the girl on here who said that seeing it makes her want to work out.

WHY does she feel that way? Because society promotes women with disproportional bodies? This is the issue.

[YHL6965]

@AuroraRoseat Literally the same thing can be said about male characters yet nobody gives a crap. If she wants to work out, that's her decision, it's not like society is forcing her or something.

[ImJustCurious13]

@AuroraRoseat I didn't say the male characters were oversexualized I said they were over masculine. They give an over exaggerated view on masculinity and it affects men because men want to have their disproportional bodies, and fitness companies exploit this behavior to get men to buy their overpriced products.

[DWD1994]

@AuroraRoseat
"An example is the girl on here who said that seeing it makes her want to work out.

WHY does she feel that way? Because society promotes women with disproportional bodies? This is the issue."

Thats not my problem. Another person's insecurities and sexual hangups and issues with the human body is their issue alone.

[AuroraRoseat]

@OP It's a societal issue because it is caused by society and negatively impacts individuals. That's how you know it's not an individual issue. That's just like our current society being the cause for rising poverty and saying "Well, that's the fault of those impoverished people". It's moronic and untrue. If people are assaulted with constant negative feedback about themselves and, unfortunately, internalize it (like some do without realizing), cause a negative psychological impact to the point that it can lead to debilitating health issues (body dysmporhic disorders for one). It's really inane of you to blame those men and women who are suffering from this instead of the actual cause.

My point is that objectification (to where men treat women as sexual objects) and the pictures of these men are NOT the same. CLEARLY people care. Just because you don't see or know it tells me a couple of things.

@ 13: Why give a false comparison then? One is promoting the objectification of women and the other is promoting out-dated stereotypes. You're asking about why people are worried about one thing and not the other. They can't be compared. They both have negative consequences though.

The majority of those with body image issues ARE women (an overwhelming amount. More than 80 percent) and we are assaulted with visual ads that are meant to be ingrained and make us feel less self-worth to buy into their products and into that toxic mindset. The rest are men who are now starting to feel what women have constantly been feeling for decades. The issue is that new video games are TONING DOWN those hyper-muscular men to embody a more realistic view while the women in skimpy outfits are still shown.

So your comparison doesn't hold true to me. It's literally complaining.

[AuroraRoseat]

To add to my point, new video games (even in MK11) are showing women more covered up. It's unnecessary and I think the gaming industry understands that. They're not pandering to the straight white male demographic anymore: they understand that gamers are more diverse and must adopt to retain their base.

[AuroraRoseat]

@DWD1994 Ugh. You're such a hateful useless waste of life anyway. Go back to your sex robots, being an incel, or whatever you do because you're unlikely to be beneficial in any capacity aside from feeding the animals that help with decomposition.

[DWD1994]

@AuroraRoseat
"Ugh. You're such a hateful useless waste of life anyway. Go back to your sex robots, being an incel, or whatever you do because you're unlikely to be beneficial in any capacity aside from feeding the animals that help with decomposition."

Lol, not an incel. I just hate when idiots piss on art with political propaganda. Also ironic you call me an incel considering you're doing the exact same things incels do, blaming society for their problems.

[YHL6965]

@AuroraRoseat You are deforming my words there, what I meant is you internalizing something is your issue, society does not promote anything. Sure most men are pictured as muscular and all while I am not. Do I care? No because nobody forces me to be that way and I choose to be who I want to be.

Also, I think you got the order wrong. It does not cause insecurities, insecurities cause these individuals to blame "society", the invisible enemy to lash out at the world while the problem is internal and stems from insecurity, lack of self-confidence and a bad self-image.

[YHL6965]

@AuroraRoseat Also, it's funny how you make it sound like it's such a big deal for women but you don't seem to really care about men there.

[AuroraRoseat]

@DWD1994 LOL. Sure kid.

@OP 1) Deforming isn't the right word. And no, sorry. There have been studies done on this surrounding body dysmorphia. If you don't think that society can change people's attitudes in various ways, you are dead wrong. One only needs to look back through U. S. history and see how negative application of stereotypes to various races leads them to be treated how they are today.

You think it's a personal issue. It really isn't. You are factually incorrect and all your opinion does is continue to harm those people that need help.

[YHL6965]

@AuroraRoseat We agree on the fact they need help dealing with their problems because blaming society and everyone else is just a sign of you having a problem but refusing to deal with it. I'm not claiming every problem is like that but I'm sorry, a virtual character wearing a virtual outfit is not that big of a deal, especially when it's not part of a majority.

[DWD1994]

@AuroraRoseat Your sexual hangups and insecurities regarding the human body aren't my problem or anyone else's.

Sorry but I value creativity, preservation of art and artistic freedom over catering to people's feelings.

[AuroraRoseat]

@DWD1994 Lol. Again, sure kid.

@OP And again, you are wrong. That's your opinion. When it starts to affect a number of people in a negative manner, that is a problem. It shouldn't continue. I comprehend what those wo/men are saying and I hear them when they say unfortunate statements like "I NEED to get big like him" or "I HAVE to work out to look good". These are problem statements.

To let them continue will only create a problem later on and that doesn't make for a healthier society.

[DWD1994]

@AuroraRoseat Its true though. Artistic freedom is more important than catering to feelings.

If you're gonna sperg out and be rendered a sweating crying mess over an attractive pixelated woman with big tits, then you have some sexual hangups you aren't addressing and are instead projecting those insecurities onto society rather than dealing with them.

[YHL6965]

@AuroraRoseat Yes but just because insecurities are common does not mean that they come from society. Yes some things in society can feed these insecurities but, ultimately, insecurities are solved on an individual scale because each person has their own insecurities and need to deal with them. Just because you try to reduce things that feed insecurities like skimpy outfits does not mean that these people won't be insecure and that the problem is gone. That's why I say this is people's problem and that it's not society's fault, even though some things in society might feed insecurities.

[AuroraRoseat]

@DWD1994 I'm going to speak in small words so you understand. Hurting people is not good. People see media representations (is that too big) all the time and it can cause bad feelings in these people. It makes them feel like they are not good enough.

Big boys can treat big girls very badly if they... big word time... sexually objectify the big girls in the games. This bleeds into reality. I don't know if a loser like you can understand it but it happens. :/
www.tandfonline.com/.../08824096.2018.1525351

[AuroraRoseat]

@OP You'd still be wrong. Everyone is insecure in some manner. But plenty of people have developed insecurities for THIS issue because of the negative portrayal. It doesn't matter: if society negatively affects people in some way, it is the cause whether or not insecurity of this manner was present.

The women's outfits causes this while leading to an additional issue: violence and sexism towards us based off it. I introduced the latter to that other fool. There's nothing more to discuss in my opinion. You are honestly factually incorrect if you think that society is completely blameless when it is the cause for plenty of strife: including this one in many people.

[DWD1994]

@AuroraRoseat

This is no different than right-wing fox news propaganda claiming violence in video games is what causes school shootings.

Also the study you linked had little variables to go off of. It claims that when the men played 1st person shooter games with sexualized females, it supposedly increased hostile sexism. We're not given any variables other than that the game had sexualized females. This is exactly what happens when you take too many social science classes, you end up forgetting about REAL science.

Also if these games actually did have an actual negative impact regarding hostile sexism and men hurting women, don't you find it odd that countries like Japan (which have the same games as us, some of which have even more graphic sexual content) have a much lower crime rate compared to countries like the U. S?

"People see media representations (is that too big) all the time and it can cause bad feelings in these people. It makes them feel like they are not good enough."

Like I said before, that's not my problem. I care more about artistic freedom than I care about catering to feelings.

[YHL6965]

@AuroraRoseat I never said society has 0 responsibility, all I'm saying is insecurities are an internal problem tied to the individual and, if you have insecurities, it is your personal issue and it's something that can only be solved on a personal level. No matter how much you change society, an insecure person will still be an insecure person. Society is just providing "insecurity amplifiers" (even that could be argued) but they only bother people with insecurities. It's like a multiplication, 0 * 165 = 0. Even if you pick something higher than 165, if you just don't care about what others think, you will be fine.

Before you say "But some people care about what others think", you can learn how not to and, frankly, you live a happier and healthier life once you have learned this power.

Also, like I said, I don't like restraining the majority in the name of a minority's problems.

[DWD1994]

@AuroraRoseat What you're arguing for is a pipedream. You can't control how people think or what games they choose to make or how they decide to channel their creativity If someone likes drawing sexualized women, they're going to continue doing it.

[AuroraRoseat]

@DWD1994 Look it up, kid. Look it up. People internalize things all the time. How do you think that the whites and blacks that joined forces together were broken apart post-Reconstruction Era? Through negative media bias towards blacks that separated them.

But I knew you were an idiot so it's literally a waste of time talking to you. So you're done.

@OP Again you're wrong. The poverty example is similar. Some people would blame them for their plight but ignore what caused them to be in it. It's not an individual issue. It would be an individual issue if society had nothing to do with it. But it does. That's the issue. Find out what makes something a social issue. Maybe you'll understand or stubbornly disagree. You're still wrong.

[DWD1994]

@AuroraRoseat

"Look it up, kid. Look it up. People internalize things all the time. How do you think that the whites and blacks that joined forces together were broken apart post-Reconstruction Era? Through negative media bias towards blacks that separated them.

But I knew you were an idiot so it's literally a waste of time talking to you. So you're done."

I'm an idiot because I pointed out how your stats aren't reliable?

[AuroraRoseat]

@OP You're also making the mistake about assuming that their insecurities can be turned off with simple logic. It doesn't work like that.

I am happy but I think people like you two are toxic and aren't beneficial in the slightest, only caring about your selfish whims. I'm not that type of person.

[DWD1994]

@AuroraRoseat

Calling us selfish is just projection on your end. You're the one demanding that society kowtow to your demands and insecurities.

Also guess what? I love drawing sexualized women and I'm going to KEEP doing it whether you like it or not :)

[YHL6965]

@AuroraRoseat You are assuming too many things about me and these assumptions are wrong. I know insecurities aren't dealt with logic and I never claimed so. However, you compared poverty, a logical, more objective problem to insecurities a completely emotional and irrational problem. And then you claim I'm the one using logic for the wrong thing?

Also, you're calling me stubborn but you are the one repeating that I'm wrong.

I don't see how insecurities compare to poverty in any way because the factors are vastly different.

I'm not selfish or caring only about myself, it's just that insecurities are a psychological issue like many others and only the individual can solve their own insecurities. Ask a therapist about it, they'll tell you.

[AuroraRoseat]

@OP There are medical studies that show this. There are physicians who will tell you. The problems are the same and should be dealt with in the same manner. They're not different: both are social issues because they negatively affect individuals. Poverty causes psychological distress as well as insecurity, did you know that? That would be called irrational by you because it's something that needs to be dealt with individually.

No. Not all insecurities are the same especially when plenty of them have been caused by society. It's irrational to claim that it's the person's fault for developing it when society is outputting negative messages.

I think that you're caustic since you would rather continue to enjoy what you like in the guise of it being the individual's fault for developing something that they might never had had before rather than empathizing with individuals who are suffering.

[DWD1994]

@AuroraRoseat

"I think that you're caustic since you would rather continue to enjoy what you like in the guise of it being the individual's fault for developing something that they might never had had before rather than empathizing with individuals who are suffering."

You're damn right. If you think I'm gonna promote censorship of art simply because it hurt someone's feelings, you got another thing comin.

[YHL6965]

@AuroraRoseat You know what? I'm going to stop bothering with you because you like your strawmen a lot and I don't have the patience to deal with that. Besides, I highly doubt your knowledge when it comes to psychological issues judging by how you talk about this. Also, blaming society, a big group or an invisible force is usually the easy way out of personal problems and a lot of bitter people use that. Anyway, I'm done because I feel like we won't get anything out of this and I would rather spend my time into more constructive things.

[AuroraRoseat]

--You clearly don't know the definition of the fallacy. I'm not misconstruing anything. Whatever makes you feel better.
--Doubt whatever you want. It doesn't make you any less illogical and wrong when studies have shown this trend and reasons given by psychologists/therapists who have treated those with body dysmorphia.
---You show your ignorance while blaming innocent people. While that argument is used, it isn't a hidden entity. It's the justice system, mass media--individuals who interact and embody a common culture. It can have a negative influence on the overall population.

You're repulsive.

[DWD1994]

This whole thread is a testament to the fact that incels and feminists really are just 2 sides of the same coin. Evolutionary fuckups blaming everyone else in society for their problems and refusing to better themselves.

[Screenwriter]

OK, these guys are hypermasculinized, but, again, they're not sexy, attractive. They have ugly faces, weight lifter bodies. Or wear masks so you can't even SEE their faces...

[YHL6965]

@DWD1994 I definitely agree with you on that. Also, as we just saw here again, there is no use in trying to discuss with them.

[YHL6965]

@Screenwriter The same could be aid about female characters, we could claim they are unattractive too because it's something subjective. Look she has a mask too :

[Screenwriter]

The male characters appear to have on far more "gear" that hides their bodies, while this particular female, though she has a mask on, shows off her body quite clearly. Her face isn't covered enough for it to be unrecognizable as an attractive face. The male characters do not have a Brad Pitt facial or body vibe. They look like gorillas. Angry gorillas. But, the females have a bustier version of Ms. Tomb Raider. It's a double standard.

[DWD1994]

I agree. At this point, its basically just arguing with feelings. The stats she showed to prove her point weren't reliable as there are so many variables to consider in which the study she linked doesn't address.

Who were the men in the study? What were their backgrounds? What were their ethnicities? Were they religious? Did these men have any sort of negative experiences with women from the past such as abusive mothers, sisters or girlfriends? The article she linked doesn't address any of this.

The argument itself is fallacious because she's drawing conclusions based off of a premise that hasn't been proven.

So many people say that these video games have influence over others but they don't take into account that many could be influenced in a positive manner by it. I'm not denying that media can influence people's behavior but the assumption here is that the influence is always negative which isn't the case.

[DWD1994]

@Screenwriter I dont see either portrayals as problems because its art. Art shouldn't be censored.

[YHL6965]

@DWD1994 These studies that usually go in favor of progressivism usually omit key factor so that results would look in their favor. Progressivism survives on hasty conclusions, misused science and all sorts of nonsense.

Also, it's funny because these people think others can't distinguish virtual world and real life while they are the one mistaking virtual world for real life. All of this is not real, it's an artistic choice and it does not reflect on reality that much.

Furthermore, as someone who wants to be a video game developer, I agree that video games can bring many good things, probably more good things than bad things to this world.

[YHL6965]

@Screenwriter How about this :

[Screenwriter]

yeah, he almost compares to the skimpily clad busty female...

[IlyaTheImpaler]

It depends on the setting, I mean if I have the power of an almighty magic user I'd shoot zombies and dragons in my underwear too.
In terms of immersion, in a fantasy setting with heavy political Machiavellianism (like Witcher) female magic users (sorceresses, witches) typically want to gain positions of power in the court, they want to manipulate kings and and influence politics so they usually dress as provocatively as possible, while augmenting combat ability with magic. In games without a politics system it's just fan service lol

[StylesbyDR]

The outfits are so skimpy these days sometimes i wonder why they just dont go all in and remove the outfits entirely. I mean thats what the people buying them really want right, thats why their getting the outfits showing as much skin as possible.

I dunno. I dont care much for them. However they often portray visions of women that dont exist which probably messess with the expectations of upcomming men on what a women should look like. Who knows.

[YHL6965]

I think men know how to distinct virtual women from real one so I'm not sure if their expectations would be affected that much.

[Clo917]

I'm not offended nor do I care. They're outfits in a virtual game on a virtual, often cartoon-looking character, what's to be offended over?

[YHL6965]

Wow, it's as if the virtual world and real life were 2 different things. ^^ Seriously though, I'm glad to see a girl that says this, I was getting tired of all these offended opinions.

[Cybernizer]

It only bothers me when these women are some sort of powerful soldier or front line fighter. I'm pretty sure a metal bra will not protect against a raging orc twice their size swinging a battleaxe through them. I get it, horny men like these kinds of games, but seriously.. Stop giving the knights lingerie!

[YHL6965]

But not all games are supposed to make sense. Skimpy outfits still make more sense than magic or oversized swords for example.

[Anonymous]

No, it doesn't bother me, I like it ;)

[FriendlyEnigma]

Never really cared just cuz they got shirtless men there too, fan service is fan service meant to be sexual. If it was just skimpy clothed women, thay would be an issue, but I've seen games where the dude literally has just a speedo on as a fighter 😂😂 so i guess its pretty equal

[YHL6965]

Well, from the same game than the one in the picture :

[FriendlyEnigma]

Yeah exactly, you can't really preach unfairness to women, literally both genders got everything hanging out lol 😂

[Poppykate]

Lol 😂... because it’s sooooo real! 🤔 Going by the length of that lap protection thingy that the big guy is wearing... his ‘sword’ would be twice as big as the biggest porn star... or perhaps it would be just for show and he would be the size of a button mushroom. 🍄 🤔

[hafinjun]

he's probably half Cherokee then

[SirRexington]

Even when I was a kid I wasn't a fan of it. It didn't make sense to me that they would wear that and it does appeal to the male fantasy but I'm not gonna go nuts protesting it. I just don't play thise games or play as those characters.

And isn't telling a girl she shouldn't dress like that suppressing her sexuality?

[PinkPenguin]

I don't really care. Maybe more about the realistic aspect that her armor won't protect her should someone stab her. And I find it hillarious when her chest is bigger than her head. It makes her head look very small. I personally would never wear something like that. To each their own.

[ChefCurry]

Someone sounds jealous over a digital art

[Kaneki05]

Nothing wrong with it. And some girls would. if they could pull it off, there is a thing called cosplay this is wide know and people defo do it there and these are normal people not characters that have powers.
I am pretty sure if your were a character from a game you wouldn't mind been hot and half naked and powerful and cool looking.

Ethier way i know i would want me to look hot and badass. So nothing wrong with playing as characters who fill that role.

[rose_lynnn]

I mean, the makers of the game do it on purpose to get people to play the game. It doesn't bother me that much because there is a difference between real life and virtual games. However, if it is done wrong it could be sexualizing women in the wrong way. It just doesn't really matter tbh because guys aren't going to be playing the game just for the skimpy outfit the animated character is wearing

[Lliam]

Doesn't bother me at all. The images are exaggerated caricatures of the human form and the outfits are just plain over the top. It's pure silliness.
One girl in this threat said some of the outfits make the greatest Halloween costumes. I would love to see her Halloween costume. I'd love to see any girl wearing stuff like that in public. :-)

[BlackRoseFairy]

It gives you an opportunity to play a role that you wouldn't be in real life for sure.
After all it's virtual, right?
I wouldn't make a big deal out of it, as long as there is the option to choose your characterr. sometimes you want something more representative to reality, and sometimes just to escape from it.

So if your character of choice is an elf necromancer that walks around among ogre brutes and lizard rogues, then I don't see why it should be an issue 🤷‍♀️

[ThisDudeHere]

I have a simple rule - if the looks of characters in the media that I'm consuming is bothering me - I stop consuming said media.
If I don't like how women are dressed in a video game and it bothers me to the point that I can't play the game, I'll just not play the game. I don't see a reason to make a fuss about it.

[EpicDweeb]

Depends on the game. I think it's dumb a lot of the time simply because "armor" in games generally looks like it does diddly squat to actually provide protection. Like... if you're gonna make a girl look skimpy, at least let it reflect in her character traits.