Public breastfeeding, yay or nay?

[MsElizabeth96]

So, what's your stance on this old debate?
Do you think it's acceptable for mother's to breast feed their babies in public? Add your reasoning behind your opinion in the comments.

(Image: Olivia Wilde And son Otis, Glamour Magazine, September 2014)

It's perfectly acceptable, nothing inappropriate about showing breasts when feeding

It's ok as long as she's modest about it, and covers herself as best she can

I Personally don't like seeing it, but it's a mother's right to do it, I just look away

There should be designated spaces for it in public places, but i shouldn't be done publicly in general

It's ok in certain places, but not all (. e. g. Restaurants)

I'm On the fence about the issue

I Don't agree with it, babies should be fed at home or using a bottle of pumped breast milk or formula

[aamina_m]

Honestly I never thought about it and never cared until so many women started taking ridiculous photos and sharing them all over social media and turning it into an issue.

There is always someone who will have a problem with something and then everyone turns it into an issue.

You can't force everyone to have the same opinion as you, which is what everyone on social media tries to do these days. It's like you can't have an opinion anymore.

For me? I don't give a shit what other people do if it's not harming someone else. I don't know if I would ever do it in public, I would definitely buy one of those cover up thingies. I would prefer that so perverted men and lesbians won't look at me in perverted ways. I grew up with a lot of stalkers so for me I'd prefer to keep the perverts as far away from me as possible.

If other people don't care and welcome the stares and the perverts, that's fine. But just as someone can't expect someone to hide their breastfeeding, breastfeeding women can't expect the perverts to maintain their distance. Sorry. That's just life and how it is. Can't fix or change everyone and everything.

I've learned how to keep the stalkers away. I know they will always exist and there isn't much I can do about it, I can only do what I learned to prevent them from stalking me.

[AzureGirl]

Fun story: I work in a gift shop/book store in the visitor center of my town. There was a lady hanging out around the jewelry corner breast feeding her baby. She wasn't blocking anyone's way or distracting anyone, she was just feeding her child. Some of my coworkers and I prepared ourselves for some jerk to see it and start complaining to us. Thankfully it didn't happen.

My opinion: it's perfectly acceptable. It's just a baby getting fed, nothing to freak out about.

[MsElizabeth96]

Was she walking around while breast feeding the baby?

[AzureGirl]

No she was just standing between the two jewelry racks we have so she was out of the way of others who were trying to walk around and look.

[Anonymous]

If you have a blanket for privacy then I think it's perfectly acceptable. It is kind of a shock to walk through a mall and just see boobs, fact is they have become more than just feeding bags and that is never going to change, you wouldn't walk around without a top on so why would you expose yourself while breast feeding.

[MsElizabeth96]

I Agree, but I think we also have to remember that it may not always be that easy to make sure you're constantly covered while also trying to get the boob out, and hold the baby to feed them. So we'd have to be understanding of any mother who has the odd nip-slip, can't be helped and just part of life.

[Opinion Owner]

Yes of course if they are actually trying and it happens no biggie.

[ak666]

I generally don't understand the inconsistency between why it's okay to show breasts in a breastfeeding context but not walk around topless. One of the things I think needs to happen for public breastfeeding to work is to desexualize breasts to some extent. That's easier if women are walking around topless quite often and men just get used to seeing breasts all the time.

[ak666]

The reason it got outlawed in Japan when it was formerly legal was that breasts were still considered sexualized to quite a degree and probably inviting a lot of sexual attraction from very creepy people. So a woman exposing breasts for others to see was considered "lewd" because topless nudity was considered exposing herself. And that also ended unisex baths, boys and girls showering together in schools, etc. I think it could work if you go all the way the opposite way to where nudity becomes no big deal whatsoever -- the nude body no longer becomes so sexualized.

[Opinion Owner]

@ak666 that would never happen though. Besides I don't want to live in a world where my breasts don't get any sexual attention xD

[ak666]

I think that's where the issue gets awkward for me. As long as breasts are sexualized a very open society where breastfeeding is the norm but toplessness is not tends to invite anything from sexual responses from creepy guys and young guys who don't see exposed boobs that often to disgusted responses from those who want the woman to put her breasts away.

In Japan the women weren't always modest about it. They didn't try to hide the nipple. It was common to see women very exposed like this:
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/YfxodYN0MnE/hqdefault.jpg

[jacquesvol]

@ak666 So what?

[ak666]

@jacquesvol Agreed! But I'm not the one to convince. It's the people in the U. S. who would outrage over seeing such a photo publicly displayed on a billboard, or on a children's cartoon network during an advertisement. Those are the ones who will often seek to shun and censor public breastfeeding.

[May10th1994]

The female breast's purpose first and foremost is to feed children if she should have them. It's really only in modern society that suddenly breasts showing is inappropriate, and sexual. Breastfeeding a child in public is no different than bottle feeding a child in public. Just two different sources.

[legs_n_sheets]

I agree 100%. 👍

[ak666]

Where's the "other" option? I think it's perfectly acceptable and should be encouraged in a completely non-modest way long as the woman is in decent shape and not too old. If she is not in such good shape or kind of old and wrinkly, I think still okay but maybe she should be more modest about it.

It's like guys should be allowed to pee on the street but probably you should be more modest if you're like an old man. If you're like Brad Pitt, you should just be able to pee in front of everyone.

[ak666]

Same kind of thing for like sex in public. I think it is fine as long as the couple looks reasonably nice. If they're like an old or fat or very unattractive couple, maybe it is better if they're a bit more discreet.

[MsElizabeth96]

Troll fishing for an argument, don't catch the bait people

[ak666]

No argument fishing. Makes sense no? To me it's like farting on an elevator. It should *not* be illegal whatsoever, but common courtesy is to hold it.

[MsElizabeth96]

Dude, no one's gonna believe you actually think that how acceptable feeding/peeing/sex is in public is based on how attractive the person is, no one is dumb enough to hold that view. Nice try.

[ak666]

I'm not saying in terms of law. But I mean like if a woman wears a bikini or a guy walks around in a speedo, we just naturally tend to kind of have an "ick!" reaction if they're really overweight or something. So I'm kind of in favor of those being less modest to be on the more attractive side, but not *by law*, just kind of by common courtesy.

[MsElizabeth96]

Again, nice try. But I'm Gonna give you the respect of not believing you're that stupid.

[ak666]

I'm kind of talking about the darker side in our human nature but if you see a grandma wearing a thong or an old fat man wearing a speedo, there is kind of a "gross! They should learn some modesty!" reaction to it, no? Don't we all have that, or does everyone just say, "Oh, it's totally natural and they're free to wear whatever they want."

[ak666]

For me I come from a country where breastfeeding was originally completely legal -- Shizuoka in the 80s. And there was still kind of greater modesty for women not so attractive back then. The attractive ones would just kind of take their boobs right out for everyone to see on the train. And I think it's similar to how we kind of have that natural bias for a woman young and attractive woman wearing very sexy clothes vs. a very old and unattractive and maybe morbidly obese woman wearing very sexy clothes.

[ak666]

Basically I think lack of modesty is something one *earns* through being attractive whether it's for flaunting breasts or a man wearing a speedo. Maybe it's not right but I think that's just how all but the most open-minded people living in a nudist colony will think. As long as flashing skin has a sexual appeal to it, people will generally tend to not appreciate it so much if the person doing it is less attractive.

[jacquesvol]

Feeding a baby isn't having sex in public.

[MsElizabeth96]

@jacquesvol Noo, don't fall for it, don't feed the troll!! :D

[jacquesvol]

@MsElizabeth96
The breastfeeding question is an old one

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgqzE5M5trM

[ak666]

@jacquesvol Very true -- I was being a tad silly there. But they had public breastfeeding in Japan at one point when I was a child, and they outlawed it later.

I was thinking the argument was suggesting that women should not be topless all the time but just for breastfeeding. And I think that's where things get awkward. At that point breasts are still considered very sexual, and a lot of guys are going to look if Olivia Wilde takes her breasts out on a public train or elevator.

Meanwhile if lots of women go around topless and we start working towards like a nudist colony, everything related to nudity and seeing the human figure do all kinds of natural things no longer becomes offensive to anyone. It becomes like an everyday thing.

But it's hard for breastfeeding to turn into an everyday thing when we still sexualize breasts.

[ak666]

@jacquesvol To me it's one of those "we can't have the best of both worlds" things and why people stopped doing it in Japan. Either female nudity (or at least the state of being topless) is no longer sexual at all (would probably end topless bars permanently), or it is, and breastfeeding becomes lewd. To go all the way to the side where it is no longer considered sexual at all, it's far easier if women walk around topless quite often and we just get used to seeing exposed breasts every day, as is the case of those living in nudist colonies, primitive tribes, etc. It's hard to be right in the middle of that.

[ak666]

Another thing I think people are having a hard time imagining if they haven't lived in societies where this is legal and wildly practiced while the breast is simultaneously sexualized is that some will women, especially desperate single mothers, will start to very openly expose their breasts as an attention-seeking tactic. I mean like taking both breasts out for a single baby while smiling at men looking at her tits. That becomes a non-issue if breasts aren't sexualized, but as long as we consider it like a woman is exposing herself to show her breasts, we get that awkward issue where breastfeeding in a very non-modest way is kind of analogous to showing off your naked body.

[ak666]

[...] where this is legal and wildly [/widely] practiced while the breast is simultaneously sexualized [...]
[...] sexualized is that some will [/wilder] women, especially desperate single mothers, will start to very openly expose their breasts [...]

[TakeMaker]

Sorry but that just means you're looking at the mother in a sexual way. Her appearance should have zero influence on her right to do anything.

I find your opinion hideous, shall you be quiet so I don't have to hear it? No.

Your attitude is hideous. Truly hideous... reducing someone's rights to be about their appearance... Jesus Christ.

[ak666]

@TakeMaker I was trolling a bit to be honest. :-D

It was a failed attempt at satire but offense is something *taken* often rather than given. As long as we sexualize breasts and nudity, grandma in a thong tends to kind of repulse us in the same way a very undesirable woman might do the same when she whips both breasts out in public to breastfeed.

The reason the practice stopped in Japan was because of that awkwardness between sexualizing breasts but having mothers displaying their breasts in public. It becomes a non-issue in a nudist colony, for example, where breasts are neither sexualized nor considered repulsive even if grandma is displaying them.

I pointed out things like peeing in public or having sex in public since technically there's nothing to be offended by this either. The same, "it's completely natural" argument can apply there. We *take* offense, these things don't necessary *give* offense.

[TakeMaker]

Peeing in public is unhygienic, having sex in public is not accepted because children will see it. Feeding a child is something a child should see as a natural thing, normal. Some dude fucking his misses in the arse while everyone around tries to eat a sandwich is not the same thing.

Japan is fucked up, they have some fucked up gender issues.

[TakeMaker]

And that offense thing isn't strictly true, trust me I give offense sometimes.

[ak666]

@TakeMaker The thing is, having lived in a place where this was *widely accepted* and then considered "indecent exposure" during the span of my lifetime, some of the issues I'm pointing out are genuine problems we'll likely have if the same was done in other countries unless breasts and possibly nudity in general can be desexualized.

The joke about attractive people boils down to how we consider "indecent exposure". Again, we tend to be biased towards attractiveness. We might not complain when a beautiful young woman walks around in a thong or a good-looking man in a speedo. It might be a bit different if heavy grandpas and grandmas did that.

We're generally more prone to consider "indecent exposure" when we're repulsed by the person.

[ak666]

@TakeMaker What I meant about taking offense was simply cases like, say, a passionate couple having sex publicly on the beach or in a park. They're not necessarily trying to offend people, it might just be a completely natural act between two lovers who do not mean to offend. People *take* offense in that context.

The awkwardness I see here is that we live in a sexually-repressed society. Meanwhile, we sexualize female breasts while wanting to simultaneously expose them for breastfeeding without it considered indecent exposure. That's where the incompatibility lies and that's how these types of things became no longer acceptable in countries that formerly allowed public breastfeeding.

They couldn't get all the way to the point of treating nudity like a nudist colony, e. g.

[TakeMaker]

I don't see these acts as offensive, inappropriate perhaps but they aren't offensive.

[ak666]

@TakeMaker I agree. But "inappropriate" is wildly subjective based on a cultural values. If I try to be reasonable and not just jesting in my post, I'd say the idea that female breasts are very sexually-appealing and coveted parts of women while simultaneously allowing exceptions for their exposure leads to an incompatibility where we have to get rid of one or the other. I'm in favor of going totally to the way where women can comfortably walk around topless.

But that does require us to overcome hurdles. If not unattractive people (I was really joking about that), think about a young boy seeing his teacher's breasts. Think about a brother seeing his sister's breasts. A teenage boy seeing his mother's breasts still.

A lot of us would still be incredibly uncomfortable by this idea, and that discomfort must be overcome if we generally want widely-accepted breastfeeding, because a lot of mothers will generally tend to lose all sense of modesty with its wide acceptance.

[ak666]

@TakeMaker Same goes for the men uncomfortable right now if they shared topless photos of their wives or girlfriends. We're left in this awkward transitioning phase but it's not necessarily correct to just think that widely accepting public breastfeeding will do the trick. Where Japan failed as opposed to nudist colonies or primitive tribes was that it continued to sexualize female breasts. So I really think this can only work if we can desexualize breasts, put topless bars out of business, get to a point where boyfriends and husbands don't mind showing topless pictures of their wives thinking nothing of it, where brothers don't mind seeing their sister's breasts, etc. etc. We must desexualize the female breasts. It's totally possible but requires more than widely accepting public breastfeeding.

[TakeMaker]

I'm quite sure my brothers have seen my boobs and my mom's boobs. Why would that be a problem?

It doesn't have to be a total acceptance at all, you can easily have breasts being sexualized AND used to feed people. It's like saying you can't piss at a urinal because other men will see your dick and think sexy thoughts. So what? Let them. I have no issue with people privately thinking sexual thoughts. You can't Thought Police people.

[TakeMaker]

All people have to do is not feel like they have the right to harass someone feeding their child. THAT'S the offensive thing, THAT'S what attitude we should be changing, attitudes about breasts don't need to change, they are for feeding and sexy times.

[ak666]

@TakeMaker It's not thought policing I'm suggesting but changing society to be open to it. In Japan they were doing some of those things right like you did in your family, along with boys and girls showering together in schools up until junior high school or so (but stopping at this point was probably a bad idea).

I'm actually pro-public breastfeeding but it's just that I think it needs a bit more to work out than mothers embracing a "so what?" attitude. I do like the "so what?" style of approach, the "I don't give a damn if I show someone my privates" kind of thing, but it doesn't necessarily erase a lot of people's idea of lewd conduct overnight.

[TakeMaker]

We just have to make it so the shameful thing is making the lewd comments. I don't think there's really any need to desexualise breasts. You can't, they are part of most people's sex lives, even if that woman is a mom and feeds her kid.

If we start desexualising humans to one another there will be no more humans.

[ak666]

@TakeMaker I wouldn't suggest if it weren't possible. If we look at some primitives tribes out there like the Himba, the women are topless all the time. They might even find it an oddity that we are willing to invest resources into seeing topless women in a strip club. And such a society can easily have breast-feeding without running into all kinds of social conflicts along the way. Breasts are everyday things, every woman exposes them there.

Nudist colonies are another example. They don't cease to have sex all of a sudden when the male and female figure is taken out of a sexualized context when everyone in that colony of all ages and sizes are nude all the time.

[TakeMaker]

I just don't see the need to go to that extreme.

[Red_Arrow]

@TakeMaker - If I see a woman in a real tight shirt, I will notice her breasts and they are sexual to me at that moment. But they are covered and considered appropriate. And nothing wrong with my seeing that and seeing the sexual side. It would be wrong of me to be lewd or say something like that. So as long as my response is appropriate, then there is nothing offensive. I think if the woman is openly breast feeding, it should be the same way. She is within her right to do so, it is appropriate, people will notice but so what, and all is well as long as there are no lewd or shaming remarks.

[TakeMaker]

@Red_Arrow exactly, there's no problem with you looking at boobs and thinking they look sexy, but people need to feel it isn't acceptable to comment on breastfeeding in a lewd manner.

[ak666]

@TakeMaker >> I just don't see the need to go to that extreme.

It might be possible to prevent the same kind of incident that started gradually happening in Japan but I don't know how else.

There were points in cultures, for example, where a woman's bare arms were considered extremely sexual. And women covered up their arms.

That was overcome when there was increasing acceptance of the idea that bare arms aren't so sexual. Bare arms had to lose their power to cause men to be incredibly aroused to kind of gain widespread acceptance. And now we don't think anything about a woman exposing her arms, but they lost that sexual power on the way.

Any body part can actually be made like this. Sexuality derived from nudity is often more of a conditioned response rather than a natural one. Humans were designed to just walk around naked without causing everyone to get a hard-on or to offend others for exposure. But we don't get to that state without losing some of the sexual power of nudity.

[ak666]

@TakeMaker The ultimate conflict I see if we just move to the bare arms example is that let's say you made a special exception for women to expose their arms (say for gardening). Meanwhile all sorts of other women are rolling up their sleeves to sexually arouse men. That's the awkward state of mid-transition where arms are still being overtly sexualized while boys and young men and maybe even old ones start getting turned on by women gardening while mothers with their kids might be getting offended and say, "We have children here! This is so inappropriate! Have some decency and cover up!"

... and that's where all the social conflicts happen. I like the idea of just everyone embracing a "so what?" mentality, but it's the people who take offense that end up ruining it for everyone. And everyone takes offense at all kinds of things which don't actually hurt them in the slightest, from a person getting offended by a woman exposing her breasts to the woman getting offended by men staring.

[TakeMaker]

But arms have a purpose, do we pander to the insane?

I'm sorry, I just can't really get the arms thing and respond to it because it's so idiotic.

The problem is that people are nasty to those feeding their child. No one else's opinion matters to me, I just think a mother feeding her child is the most important person in the whole equation.

I don't really understand what point you're trying to make.

[ak666]

@TakeMaker In what sense is it idiotic? There are Asian cultures where traditionally women rolled up their sleeves to arouse men. The point of that is that to accept bare arms everywhere in such a society first required losing the idea that bare arms are a source of arousal.

[ak666]

@TakeMaker What I'm trying to say is that you have to take away the idea that something is offensive or lewd or sexual to prevent it from becoming censored in society. When breasts are sexual and lewd and offensive, there will be those seeking to censor, and they will often succeed. It requires at least a much bolder transformation than everyone thinks to make wide breastfeeding in public truly accepted. Again in Japan it's not even illegal for women to expose breasts in public, the reason it has turned into an obscurity is because it started becoming considerably inappropriate as breasts became increasingly sexualized.

[ak666]

@TakeMaker I don't think you realize the extent to which sexuality derived from nudity is socially conditioned. So many people just think that breasts being sexualized is just how human beings are programmed. That is completely false.

You can even build a society where a woman's pinkie toe is considered a very sexual thing to expose. And if women arbitrarily decided to wear sandals in such a culture, there would be an outrage until this idea that women's pinkie toes are so sexual is tossed out the window.

Breast exposure is the same way. It will cause an outrage as long as breasts are so sexualized in nature.

[TakeMaker]

I disagree, because I don't get aroused when my pinky toe is touched. I don't get aroused from my arms being seen/touched. Breasts are sexual because they turn you on when touched, they are "used" during sex because they arouse the woman.

The answer is not to desexualise breasts, that's a ridiculous extreme to go to. Why do you think desexualising breasts is a better idea than making people realise it isn't acceptable to make rude and hurtful comments to someone feeding their child?

The nudity thing is a prime example, nudists don't totally ignore a banging pair of titties, they do notice they just don't say anything because it's inappropriate. That's how it should be, yes they're tits, big deal... lets just get on with life.

I don't get offended if I see a penis pissing, it isn't being used for sex and I don't care. It also doesn't arouse me in anyway. Why can't people accept the fact the bob can be both sexual and useful?

[ak666]

@TakeMaker >> I don't get offended if I see a penis pissing, it isn't being used for sex and I don't care. It also doesn't arouse me in anyway. Why can't people accept the fact the bob can be both sexual and useful?

There we are agreed. I'm not one who will be protesting when women start exposing breasts. When I was talking about "desexualization" I did not mean from the sense of touch, merely the sense of sight.

I'll try to put it like this. I think we'll be truly ready for public breastfeeding becoming widely accepted and no longer shamed when we can, for example, show a soap advertisement on a children's cartoon network involving a topless woman rubbing soap over her body (bare breasts included) without it being censored.

And I actually look forward to that day. I'm not one of those who will be offended be those freeing the nipple. It's just those who seek to censor I'm worried about. They are very effective at creating social conflicts.

[TakeMaker]

I agree that the shock of seeing a tit should be lessened, but with that I don't think we need to stop seeing boobs as sexual things.

I agree on the advert front too, here in the UK you can show a bare bottom with no issues, over in the states they blurr out ass crack... ridiculous how conservative a nation the states is considering it has an enormous porn industry and seems to encourage young women to dress provocatively and act like hookers and strippers to get attention.

[jacquesvol]

@ak666 If she's that old she probably won't have a baby and full (milk) breasts aren't wrinkly. Brad Pitt? I've never seen his Peter. Just another wiener, I suppose in my opinion all those I've seen look alike. But I never meet them 'full action, all systems go!'
Do I smell ageism there?

[ak666]

@TakeMaker >> I agree on the advert front too [...]

I think we're seeing things on quite an event level at this point. The U. S. is exactly the country I had in mind that I don't think is "ready" to handle wide acceptance of public breastfeeding.

Did you see how the country reacted over, say, Janet Jackson's "wardrobe malfunction"? Meanwhile imagine if there were women all over that stadium breastfeeding their babies and likewise getting caught here and there on live television. In the U. S. the bare female breast is so overtly sexualized while simultaneously deemed so inappropriate for certain types of exposure, especially in settings that might involve children watching.

Another thing about wide acceptance of breastfeeding is that it doesn't necessarily stop at babies. In Japan I saw some mothers breastfeeding children who are 3 or 4 years old, e. g., in public, while I was a little boy. It does require a nation to be really open to seeing female breasts in a non-threatening way.

[ak666]

@jacquesvol >> Do I smell ageism there?

I was just being silly and attempting to play devil's advocate. There are still a lot of people I see in the U. S. complaining about, say, a very obese middle-aged woman wearing a micro-bikini at Wal-Mart.

I'm used to nudity of all sorts (male and female, variety of ages and shapes) from figure drawing. And that's another example of where we had to look at nudity in a non-sexual way in order to be open-minded enough to go to the class and draw naked people. And there was actually a fear I had initially when it came to attractive female nudes where I thought I would be sexually aroused. Instead, in that context, I found it wasn't very sexual at all. I just went straight to drawing the figure.

The problem to me is that too many people will seek to censor, say, a nude woman showering in a soap/shampoo commercial on a network designed for children in the U. S. There would be too much outrage, and such a country is not ready to free the tits.

[ak666]

None of this relates to what I personally believe. It's just based on how I think people would react in a country that is outraged over an accidental wardrobe malfunction leading to a middle-aged singer's breasts being exposed on live television.

It's where I really think bare breasts have to be accepted on, say, public billboards where everyone can see without people paying much mind to it, not even religious types or parents with children who see the billboard. I think bare breasts have to be acceptable in advertisements even on religious or children networks without stirring up an angry mob rioting and seeking censorship.

I'm actually for public breastfeeding. I thought it was nice in Japan when I was a child, though at that age I was just fascinated seeing women's boobs everywhere. But it became deemed inappropriate primarily because of people who were too aroused seeing those breasts and because of the same type of people who got outraged at Janet Jackson's wardrobe malfunction.

[JuicyBrain]

I have no problem with women breastfeeding in public as long as they don't have a problem with me staring at their breasts while they do it.
Most people who are against it are against it because their natural reaction is to look, yet, it is seen as inapropriate to look so the shame falls on them and they don't like that, therefore they are against it. If women want the right to breastfeed in public, they should accept that they will be stared at. This way, everybody is happy.

[thewanderingme]

creepy if you actually think "yay" when seeing a woman breastfeeding her child.

douchy if you are immature enough to be upset by it.

it's not really a yay or nay thing, just a natural, healthy, beautiful way for a woman to take proper care of her baby.

[thewanderingme]

lol at not bring ok in a restaurant. everyone but baby gets to eat.

[funny_strange_man]

I have no problem with it because babies have to eat.
@ak666 Who is to decide who is attractive? People find different things attractive from hair length/color/style, height, race, ethnicity, amount of tattoos and or piercings, what the tattoos are og and where at, what is pierced, stretch marks or not, birthmarks or not, size, body shape etc.
@April10 Do not go into public then if you do not want to see any ones boobs. Women wear see through tops and dresses, low cup tops and dress, tops and dresses with little coverage. On the beach women wear swimsuits with little coverage.

[ak666]

I was trying to be a bit of a superficial dick trying to make a point, but I realized maybe not all people have lived in societies where public breastfeeding was widely accepted and common-place. There's issues they might be missing like that some women will use that to very blatantly show off their breasts. In that case, I'm thinking maybe it's not so good if the woman is so lacking in modesty if she looks like this:

images.uncyclomedia.co/.../...omen-bbw-singles.jpg

... in Japan in the 80s most of the woman who just kind of take off their whole shirt and expose both boobs in a park filled with people were generally not bad-looking. I'd be kind of grossed out if they looked like the women in the above pic.

... unless we got so used to seeing all kinds of women naked. That's the awkward boundary to me where breasts are either sexualized or they're not. If they're not and we're used to seeing topless women every single day, probably we wouldn't be bothered by naked grandmas.

[ak666]

... and likewise topless bars would go out of business and so forth. To me if we live in a society where topless bars go out of business, I think public breastfeeding of a completely non-modest sort is okay along with women walking topless everywhere.

[ak666]

So basically if we live in a society where topless bars go out of business because it's so commonplace to see topless women everywhere, all my arguments become moot about kind of common courtesy suggesting that only reasonably attractive women show off their breasts to everyone when they feed a baby.

We will be so used to seeing breasts in a non-sexual context that none of us will even get so excited even by Olivia Wilde taking both breasts out in an elevator in a completely non-modest way to feed one baby, and none of us will get traumatized out if a woman who has boobs that sag to her waist does the same.

[Anpu23]

I support the right for women to go topless for any reason in public (as long as it is also appropriate for a man in the same situation), breast feeding is perfectly natural, and I don't get why some people have issues with it. I also believe that anything in public view is not private and any idea of "eye control" is contrary to democracy. So if a woman chooses to go topless, or feed her children, it is also the right of anyone to look at her for whatever reason they choose.

[May10th1994]

Yes but there is a difference between staring and just looking for a few seconds. Staring at a breastfeeding woman would be creepy AF.

[May10th1994]

Though, in reality, the biggest problem isn't people looking at all. Most breastfeeding mothers deal with people not wanting to see it, and saying they're disgusting.

[Anpu23]

@May10th1994 Perhaps, but there is the issue of choices and consequences. I don't want to run into the situation in England where "David Cameron is backing a pledge to criminalise “verbal, non-verbal or physical” harassment, drawn up by the Council of Europe’s convention on violence against women." (source www.express.co.uk/.../How-wolf-whistling-could-get-you-a-criminal-record) It should never be a crime to LOOK at someone, and it would be to easy to criminalize LOOKING as non-verbal harassment and as the intent of the looker is nothing compared to the perception of the lookee (think about it "he was 'rape staring' at me" and the guy was reading a billboard over her shoulder, but has no way to prove it.)

[May10th1994]

I don't think looking at someone should be a crime, but, if someone is purposely staring at someone, and are asked to stop, but won't, it's complicated. What are you supposed to do in that situation? A lot of the times I've personally asked guys to stop looking at me, or stop following me, or stop calling at me, they get very aggressive and frighten me.

Obviously if someone isn't really looking at me, and/or apologizes and then stops, it's different, I'll be fine, because they stopped and/or apologized. I don't jump to conclusions, I try and give people a chance to explain themselves.

[Anpu23]

@May10th1994 I can see both points, it's hard because it comes down to intent. And intent is so hard to prove legally. So I just make the caveat that if you want #freethenipple you must accept the fact that guys are going to look.

[ak666]

@May10th1994 It's generally that awkward transition when freeing the nipple where guys are going to be looking until breasts are no longer considered so sexual. After some time and with newer generations, that should happen. In such a society topless bars would go bankrupt, as there would be no longer anything special about seeing exposed breasts.

So if women started becoming topless all the time, it's only really awkward in the early stages. As children are raised thinking that is completely normal for women to walk around topless and breastfeed, it will no longer be such a big deal. Guys won't stare quite as much then.

Currently breasts are so sexualized right now that it's understandable if some guys, especially young ones, will be gawking at your breasts with their eyes wide. They'll have a hard time resisting the urge to look -- they'll be trying but probably coming right back on your boobs every chance they get.

[May10th1994]

@ak666 I just personally don't understand the "guys will be guys" idea you seem to have. I'm sexually attracted to women but I don't stare at their chests. I don't think there's any excuse for staring at anyone and making them uncomfortable, for any reason. Maybe the urge would be hard to resist, but, the reason humans are considered much high beings is because of our ability to resist it. "Difficult to resist." isn't an excuse either way.

[ak666]

@May10th1994 Generally guys my age can avoid doing that where public breastfeeding and toplessness is very common. When I was much younger though and still a virgin, and seeing women far more exposed than Olivia Wilde in that above picture in Shizuoka during the 80s, it was incredibly hard not to stare. I was looking at something amazing, like a sunset.

[ak666]

@May10th1994 ... but in Shizuoka, while public breastfeeding was *very* common, toplessness was not. So I was not accustomed as a boy and young man to seeing breasts *that* often. It was still a rarity and something that amazed me.

[May10th1994]

@ak666 The difference is the sunset isn't a living breathing person who is uncomfortable. Is what I'm getting at. If a guy /really/ can't resist staring at a womans tits, he probably has some problems he needs to get figured out.

[ak666]

@May10th1994 That's where I might have to reach back to suggest "guys being guys". I mean it's not a big deal anymore to me at all. I've seen boobs on a daily basis showering together with women, been to topless bars and got used to women walking around topless, took figure drawing where I had to see both men and women naked without any sexuality associated, etc. But it took some training at least when, simultaneously, just seeing a topless scene in a movie with a celebrity is supposed to be so incredibly sexy.

It's where I think there's this transitioning period with a new generation to kind of train them that breasts aren't so amazing and sexual things to look at. Basically breasts are as special as society treats them. In tribes like The Himba, no one cares about seeing boobies since they're exposed daily. Right now people tend to care a bit.

[Anpu23]

@May10th1994 it's interesting to think that you can control others. You can only control yourself and every action has possible consequences, you do not own those consequences. To assume that ithers will behave the way you would like them to is to set yourself up for failure. Every individual will react how they react, and I am afraid that others will try and regulate behavior via the legal system. That is why I link the two. Yes, there are people who need to grow up, but it's hardly your job to assume that they have.

To me it is insane to take a risk, then expect others to bear the cost of that risk. If I am stupid enough to try a very dangerous ski train with no skiing experience, it is not fair to close that trail to others when I F#\!# myself up. Others should not be expected to modify their behavior to make you comfortable. If you are uncomfortable it's your responsibility to either change your behavior or accept their behavior.

[May10th1994]

You seriously make no sense. There is no comparison to someone doing something inherently stupid and then facing consequences, versus someone having a body and using it for it's natural purposes and then being stared at. No one should have to put up with someone making them uncomfortable, when they've done nothing to warrant it.

[ak666]

@May10th1994 I'm kind of in between you two and I think @Anpu23 is arguing purely from a level-headed legal perspective, you more from a moral one.

I'd agree that it's not nice to stare at someone if they're uncomfortable. I just want to lay the case that it's typically going to happen in a society that treats breasts as very sexual things, not everyday sights, if some woman decides to go around topless. It becomes easier as everyone starts to do it and people get used to it.

When I was a boy in Shizuoka and seeing lovely ladies breastfeeding with both nipples out and only one baby, I had no malicious intent when I kind of caught myself staring. It was not to make her uncomfortable. It was just so incredibly rare to see that even when public breastfeeding was quite commonplace. Simultaneously I was being conditioned to think that seeing a woman's breasts is so special when we have a rated R movie where the girl takes off her top, shows her boobs, and the scene fades out.

[ak666]

@May10th1994 It's harder to flip the scenario and try to make a fair one when the sexes reverse. But there are some joke videos out there where good-looking guys wear a prosthetic and tight-fitting shorts to make it look like they have a massive tent formed from a massive erection. And in those videos you can find women staring almost helplessly as the guy walks around like this. Those women were also not necessarily staring to try to make him uncomfortable, there was not necessarily any malicious intent behind it. It's just such an unusual thing to see and probably accompanied by some sexual thoughts here and there. Again that would probably lose its power if many men walked around wearing shorts all the time with blue-balls and massive erections. We tend to sexualize things or take offense to things based on how common or rare of an occurrence they are. In both cases people kind of *take* offense or *take* sexual interest. Offense and sexuality is not necessarily *given*.

[April10]

I don't want to see someone's boobs in public even if there's a child attached to it. The space they're in doesn't belong to them, it's not their living room. There are other people and they need to be more considerate. By all means breastfeed, but is it a big deal to cover it?

[MsElizabeth96]

Well, which option did you pick? Because you opinion seems to match the second but only a guy's selected that?

[April10]

I voted C. I don't want to see it and I personally wouldn't do it. But it's her choice.

[Kaylyne]

Am absolutely all for it, and will be doing it myself hopefully one day fairly soon.

[MsElizabeth96]

Are you expecting, :D or just planning for a baby?

[Kaylyne]

@MsElizabeth96 We have been desperately trying all year for a family, sadly with no luck.
Maybe it's just not meant to be. :(

[MsElizabeth96]

Aww, keep trying, it can take time for some people. If still not look see your doctor, maybe you can get help.

[Kaylyne]

@MsElizabeth96 Believe you me, we have both seen all the doctors, specialists and I've seen my gyno, and have told that there is absolutely nothing wrong with either of us.
It's simply a case of if it's God's will then it will happen, or more to the point TIME.

[truthbeknown]

I have no problem at all. BUT!!! Some women seem to forget they are in PUBLIC and think they are still entitled to 100% privacy. People will look at you! Don't give people a dirty look because they notice you breastfeeding as if they have no right to look!

[dogbert444]

I think it's all down to the mother. SOme are quite happy to show it all. Others are very discrete. Others prefer privacy.

As for other people, they are the problem. My mum has always said the younger generations are much more tollerant, like my sis and I. Older people can be less tollerant sometimes, but again, it depends on individual attitudes.

[fauchelevent]

Totally acceptable, in my opinion. It's not like you can see all her tit because there's a baby in the way, and I've seen people show almost as much just for cleavage.

[justbanANNAz]

i voted B. i dont see why a mother can't cover herself in public just for the sake of being considerate. there's nothing wrong or scary about boobs, sure, but if I'm a mother, i consider breastfeeding an intimate moment, and i dont want to share that with the world.

[outmyroom]

Why is it wrong? If a child needs to eat social norm should be pushed aside.

[Anonymous]

Do you want this to happen to women?

https://i.imgur.com/9yIAKW1.gif

37.media.tumblr.com/.../...OlZ1rhwe3do8_r1_400.gif

https://i.imgur.com/njN5bSK.gif

i1104.photobucket.com/.../jimcarreybreastfeed.gif

https://youtu.be/FMMtr0AY6us

[jacquesvol]

Something wrong with that guy, not with breastfeeding.

[LunaLawliet]

It is the way nature intended.

[MsElizabeth96]

I Agree

[legs_n_sheets]

Voted A. Women breastfeeding their children should do it freely, without having to be bothered to cover up. There's nothing obscene, and far less sexual about it, and people who see it as such have issues.

[jacquesvol]

@Legs_n_sheets
My opinion too.

[RJGraveyTrain]

No, they need to let their babies starve.

I see no issue with it, it's completely natural.

[vonasaurus]

she's feeding her baby; remind me again how that's weird.

[Miezko]

I'm not like owe ill gross! But I'm also not for it. I think it's kind of like farting, not that they're similar body functions or anything like that, but they can be offensive to some and in my opinion are best done somewhere private. But I also think it's like farting in that some people make it out to be a much bigger deal than it really is.

[Karōshi]

I think it's okay as long as they're discreet about it. However I take issue with posh restaurants, not because of the breastfeeding, it's because bringing a baby to a swanky place is out of order, people might have saved up for a special night and a crying baby ruins the atmosphere, if you can afford a posh dinner you can afford someone to look after the kid while you're there, if you don't wanna do that don't go.

[ForeverAloneBrah]

I don't really have anything against it. If the baby is hungry and the Mother breast feeds her child then I don't see why anyone would have anything against it. I probably would be a bit shocked to see it happening at a restaurant but I wouldn't give the woman grief about it, I'd simply just stare at my food and carry on eating.

[Drooogie4]

I dont really have an issue with nudity, period. Especially for something like that.
Please, feed your child. It shouldn't have stigma.

The only thing is when its like, a three year old being breastfed. Like ouch... teeth...

[aamina_m]

ha! I've seen that before. weird...

[HaveNoName]

As long as her breasts are completely covered, she she not be stopped. The picture shown above is definitely a NO NO.

[HaveNoName]

I wonder what the downvoters want? Absolute restriction? That can be cruel for the kid.

[jacquesvol]

Does seeing breasts hurt people in any way? :-o

[HaveNoName]

@jacquesvol in a modest society, it does. And at one point in time, it will hurt no one more than the women herself. Of course me being a believer and you otherwise, we know where the difference of opinion lies. So let's agree to disagree :)

[jacquesvol]

@Have on and... modest society? In Iran seeing a woman's hair is supposed to hurt. In Afghanistan it's her face that hurts Afghans...

[jacquesvol]

@HaveNoName

[HaveNoName]

@jacquesvol Iran and Saudi Arabia are extreme cases. Afghanistan is not even a society (anymore). I generally don't take Iran and Saudi Arabia as an example because THAT is what everybody thinks is normal example of Muslim society.

[jacquesvol]

Compare to Amish country then