Why I Don’t Feel Bad for Nice Guys in the Friend Zone

[ChronicThinker]

Dear “nice guys” in the “friendzone” while their “true love” is dating an “asshole.” I don’t feel bad for you, and even if people on the internet blow smoke up your ass, most of them don’t feel bad for you either. I don’t feel bad for you because your story has been told 100 times over, and most of the time it’s your own damn fault you’re in the position you’re in.

You met a girl who was probably out of your league or perhaps even within it. That’s fine, anything can happen, right? After all, you have something that no other guy has: you’re nice, and you “respect” women. True, any time they reject you or just want to continue being friends, you take to trashing their relationship, demonizing their boyfriend like he’s the scum of the earth, and maybe even blame her for being naïve or even a bitch herself. Because women can’t make decisions about who they want to date – it’s totally up to the nice guy, who knows what she deserves and what she needs. (Not a feminist)

It isn’t because she was never attracted to you in the first place and only ever saw you as a friend, it’s only because she loves being abused by men who aren’t nearly as superior as you are. All they are, are assholes who mistreat her, with no redeeming qualities whatsoever other than their perfect physiques and fuckboy attitudes. You know this because your love has complained about him being an asshole to you before, that must mean he’s a piece of shit, right? It totally couldn’t be that the two of them were fighting and that human beings are naturally biased, especially when upset, that maybe she overreacted and painted him in an exaggerated light. I mean, no one has ever lost themselves in the heat of an argument and called their partner an asshole, no one.

It isn’t even possible that this asshole fuckboy plowing your true love has redeeming qualities that you’ve never seen because you don’t actually know him on an intimate level. You just know he’s popular, outspoken, and a piece of shit scum asshole as you have rightfully deemed him. He can’t be ambitious, he can’t be kind-hearted, genuine, outspoken or fun. Just an asshole.

Woe is you when the breakup finally comes. You leave no breathing space for your love because you are meant for her, meaning respecting her boundaries and the fact she just got out of a relationship is not necessary for you. You thrust your hidden love at her only to be rejected. What? This doesn’t make sense, you are her true love! She should have known all along you were meant for one another! What a horrible woman! A bitch! No, no, she’s just too naïve to know that you’re meant for each other, right?

I mean, it definitely isn’t because you approached her to be friends and behaved like “one of the girls” or perhaps even like a brother to her. That was just your strategy, after all, you had to rack up all of those nice guy points by doing her favours to win her love. That way, if she rejected you, you could hold those kind gestures over her head and hopefully guilt her into being with you.

But alas, it doesn’t work. You are left alone, wronged unrightfully and alone. So you find a new girl, and you do it all again … only to get heartbroken again … and end up on the internet, bitching, moaning, and complaining.

Boo wah.

For anyone too dense to get this, this was satire to piss off fake-ass nice guys on the internet. All in good fun, don’t get your period. Love Jane <3

[belarus]

Yes, obviously you consider yourself a plane spoke tell-it -like-it is kinda girl, but I think the narcissism and self involvement is crushing your brain. Few if any things in life are crystal clear/ black and white as you seem to be suggesting. There are guys who are just as you describe them (cry babies) but many who are far more complex with an understated style because they don't feel as though they need to advertise their assets. I know many women who detest them because they want the "easy" extrovert who does ALL the work for the so they can sit back and pick and choose. You are obviously one. So keep on believing that your words are prose and the world cannot spin without your wisdom to guide us. You're a cliche. God help the poor bastard who hooked up with you.

PS Sarcasm is a great mask for ignorance!

[Porcelaine]

thoroughly perfect answer except for the last line about sarcasm. this girl is just a simple cliche, her arrogance and poor choice in guys will lead her nowhere

[somewheresomeway]

@Porcelaine don’t worry she’ll get older one day. When that happens and she starts losing her looks and power then she’ll really be up a shit storm. Good looks will fade but a shitty personality won’t.

[LuckyEnough]

Bwahaaha, hooray!

A woman not from the mindset of the typical "hotgirl". Oh my holy fuck, I didn't think any women (lol, and you're the youngest to reply!) were gonna call these girls out. I'm working on a reply to the op, figured an alpha male who is not an asshole should chime in s okkmewhere too.

[belarus]

@LuckyEnough These labels are so broad and general; nice guys, bad girls, alpha, beta, douche, phony... it's as if everyone fits neatly into one category or another. Human beings are far too complex for that (yes, even the dumb ones). I've always believed we are a combination of all of the above in varying degrees. Not to mention our tastes and preferences. Some "nice guys" are insincere but most are NOT. Some girls are harsh and judgmental but most are NOT. Hopefully as years go by we change for the better. I realize this isn't always true but if we would all cut each other a little slack, who knows, we might just find the guy/girl of our dreams.

[somewheresomeway]

I agree. Most people take a mental shortcut and throw out labels. Sorry but many women are notorious for this. They will throw out a label and then adjust their judgement/emotions to the guy’s actions afterwards.

[belarus]

Oh I see! Now you say you were just "trolling" the guys. How convenient! No wonder you won' t respond to the feed back. I think it's called cowardice!

[somewheresomeway]

Cowardice? I agreed to your insight. I thought it was spot on.

I reflecting from my personal experiences with meeting women. They will quickly say “oh you are the quiet one”, “you are the punk” or you are the “nice one” much quicker than other guys I know. Then from there they will adjust there judgement to that first impression.

You and I know that’s wrong. People are much more complicated then that.

[belarus]

@somewheresomeway Sorry, I was speaking to the asker when I said cowardice. She posts a trollish question and won't even respond to the comments.

[somewheresomeway]

Yep and that proves that she is secretly disgusted with herself.

I don’t mind hearing the ugly truth when it’s presented factual and thoughtfully. Nice guys can be boring. Nice guys can turn off girls by being lack of challenge. Nice guys can lack masculinity.

But also more women need to take responsibility for their piss poor dating decisions. She doesn’t want to.

[errorgoodnameunfound]

Dear ChronicThinker,
I am just a guy who sees shit in both women and men equally. And hate both equally. I ask you, oh dear Queen of sarcasm, does that satisfy you?

Sincerely,
Not Even Good Enough to Come Up with a Username

P. S. I am sorry dear queen that knows everything if this does not please you, truly I am. I am just a shitty nice guy. Whatdoya expect? :)

[ChronicThinker]

Yeah that made my day.

[errorgoodnameunfound]

I may not agree with everything you say, but I am glad we can both have a bit of humor. That is true victory your highness :D

[ChronicThinker]

Agreed, I like it when people sass me lol.

[errorgoodnameunfound]

I am beyond happy about that as I know many who would not take kindly to my comment. I salute you my queen! #1 fan! In fact, I even found your Instagram and Snapchat! Add me @NiceGuyVirgin and snap at PenisandnoholeYET

[ChronicThinker]

I sincerely doubt that, as I don't have instagram or snapchat lol.

[errorgoodnameunfound]

With all due respect your highness, I SMELL BULLSHIT! But it is ok, as I will stalk my dear queen another way. #niceguypower

[FýrdracaDócincel]

I see your main point and I agree with it.

But do disagree on account of the "redeeming qualities" part. Now, I'm sure these guys DO have redeeming qualities and that they're not just these pureblood douchebags.
However I find it odd how easy it looks for this to be used as an argument.

Everybody has good and bad to them. In this case, I believe it's worth mentioning the illogic with which gets focused on.
------------------
Say you have GuyA and GuyB.

GuyA treats most people pretty arrogantly, but treats a small handful of people who are close to him with much more respect.

GuyB treats most people with respect most of the time. But he still has the occasional laps in judgement and he has a few people here and there that he cannot stand.

I've noticed a consistent pattern when you get a comparison like this.
Most girls would look at GuyA and say "He's hardened on the outside but I bet he has a heart of gold," then look at GuyB and say "What a fake piece of shit."

Now, does GuyA have a heart of gold? Maybe.
Is GuyB a fake piece of shit?
Again, maybe.

The fact remains that these girls reached the conclusions they did because of the reversed psychology that they've been conditioned by society to use in their judgements.

It is equally likely that GuyA is a bit of a sociopath.
It is equally likely that GuyB is a genuinely good guy who has his moments.

But those possibilities don't normally get considered because of what these girls are fist-fed since day one.

It leads to some pretty convoluted thought processes. I mean, think about it, what's the most common response to someone trashing on a GuyA?

"Just because he's an asshole to you doesn't mean he's an asshole to her!"

Maybe I'm just a deviant.. but if I found out that my girlfriend was giving people a hard time without good justification, she'd be GONE.
ESPECIALLY if she was that way towards my friends.

So you'll forgive me if I don't understand how these girls have such an easy time waving off that sort of thing.. even when their male friends are being treated like garbage.

[BlackMaleYou]

Smart mofucker

[Tomblebee]

@BlackMaleYou Are you being sarcastic?

[FýrdracaDócincel]

@Tomblebee
He upvoted me so no not really.

[Tomblebee]

Its hard to tell from the outside. Who dat downvoter aye

[FýrdracaDócincel]

@Tomblebee
Currently asking myself the same thing.
Surprise surprise, I'm not getting an answer.

[Ouroboros8Fate]

Lol, reading this definitely made me laugh.
You may have some good points and sure some of the points you've addressed may be true. But just like not all of one group of people are bad, not all "nice guys" are like that.

The group of nice guys you listed off sound like the faux nice guys who use pity to try and get their way in things but normally lack the confidence and courage to actually get what they want or they are just want attention.
I myself have been and still am the nice guy. I believe in treating women and people in general with respect and hope for the same in return. I still live with a chivalrous mindset and aim to be a decent guy and gentleman.

I do cheesy/simple things like treating people to things, cooking for people, helping people out, being there for people to talk/lend an ear, hold a door, etc. Doesn't really matter... hell I hold doors for men, women, old, young, doesn't really matter. It's called being polite and considerate of those around you.

But because of my past and hardships i've experienced I put on weight and now I'm a heavyset guy with not much in the form of confidence/self-esteem or self-worth for that matter... but that's because I've had a lot of people in my life such as "Friends", "Family", and even strangers put me down and ridicule/belittle me or talk behind me back but act a different way in my presence.

That being said I haven't had much luck when it comes to relationships... friends, romance, family a like. Could be anxiety, depression, etc. Who knows really. I've grown bitter and resentful, sure. It happens when the people you care for end up stabbing you in the back or spitting in your face.

Anyways I've been there done that. Even though I've been single my entire life and haven't really had anything more than a couple day fling to a week or so "Relationship", don't really consider myself to been in any relationships. I've been there, done that. I've been that friend-zoned guy who gets strung along to be the personal "best friend" or relationship counselor/ personal diary. I've heard it all and seen it all... and called it all. I've seen girls in abusive relationships that didn't leave the guy they were with even though he hit her or did cruel things to her... and she refused to take my advice. And you know what? What I said would happen ended up normally happening 90% of the time.

I honestly just don't like seeing people get hurt. So i try to help people. I kind of gave up on pursuing dead ends.

[Ouroboros8Fate]

Another thing I forgot to add.
A lot of women out there who are in abusive relationships tend to have this psychological attraction to a Stockholm syndrome type behavior. They go for specific guys who all tend to have something in common or relate to someone who had either a positive or negative influence on their life, such as a parent, relative or someone they knew.

Even though a lot of women like to play the "Boys drool, Girls Rule" or women don't need men, all men are pigs and stupid/predictable and only think with their dicks. You know... the average Feminist. Those women who had a bad relationship experience with a guy or two and suddenly became a lesbian and hate men because we're all the same.

There are tons of those girls/women who fall for those "assholes/douche-bags" traps. It's like a mind game. They show you what you want to see and once they have you hooked they break you down and lower your self confidence so you never leave them. Meanwhile they do whatever they want.

[StrangerByTheDay]

dear @ChronicThinker , that was amazing. well said.
i "respect" people in general, and mostly women. as i said in the previous article, they are my kryptonite. i'm a straight man, not a small boy who still thinks girls are disgusting. lol. i agree with u if u mean "treating her with respect to expect something in return is wrong", because it is. for me, it is just a part of who i am. if i like a girl, i try to gently approach her, and my first reaction is a handshake and a smile. eye contact.
if she does not like me, then i respect her decision and move on with my life accepting it.
if a girl gets mad because of what i did, i get hurt, yes, but not mad at her. i try to ask her for an explanation for me to understand what went wrong and learn from the experience :-) (we all learn from our mistakes)
i get called most of the time labels like "nice guy"... or get told that i am too nice. where is the problem is it is a part of who i am?
if my friend likes to be abused, then it is her decision after all. i am here to listen to her and try to help her without expecting anything in return.
if her guy is abusing her and she wants my honest opinion, i would tell her to find someone who would treat her better coz she is my friend, i know her and she deserves better (even if it is not me)
it goes the same for me, if i need a help from her i expect her to be totally honest with me and give me advice.
if a girl treats me with respect and is nice with me, knowing she likes me, for who i am, then i would wrap her like a big sandwich and eat her alone :-D... lol.. it was a joke, not a serial killer.
i have many problems. i am single. i am alone. etc...
it does not stop me from being who i am.
it does not stop me respecting others.
it does not stop me from going out alone and meeting strangers and have a good time till i find THE ONE.
maybe respecting women more than i should makes me less manly, but i dont care.
i am locked inside myself a bit. i dont like to be hurt. i have been hurt a lot before in my life. sometimes my fault. sometimes not. i learn and keep on moving.
i lost my father when i was 11 years old. i had to be responsible at a young age. i bypassed that teenage love phase. never tasted it. maybe i want to experience that innocent childish love feeling. i dont know. but who i am is who i am.
it would be nice to know what u think of my opnion dear @ChronicThinker :-)
honesty is required :-P

[thatguyfromtoronto]

Great points, I automatically assumed you were just going to bash nice guys based off your title and the first few lines of your post but it goes to show you, boys and girls, read everything before judging. Anyhow, I agree with many of your statements. See, I fell into that category of I'm a nice guy and I got played and rejected by girls and it frustrated me. I'm turning 32 years old this June and yes I am not married, nor do I have a girlfriend but I realized something through the bad, which is, is it really worth it to deal with all that b. s, to begin with?

This is where guys have to have self-worth within themselves and not get played or take things personally, obviously, a girl who cheats or manipulates you hurts, love hurts at times and we all go through it, some worse than others. But being a nice guy doesn't mean you finish last and I truly believe that, there's a difference between being a nice guy who helps his parents, respects women, helps the poor and donates to third world countries compared to being a doormat or a person with no backbone.

I liked this girl a lot and she rejected me, she treated me like crap, she was a stone cold bitch and I am not going to repeat the horrible things she has done, in short, she was an annoying rash in my life and as I got older I realized I could do better. I wasted my time talking to her about her guy problems and etc and that's one thing guys should remember, don't be her "friend" through thick and thin because of a lot of girls who are fucked in the head or grew up in a dysfunctional environment or have daddy issues are often the girls/women who will cause mental anguish in your lives and it takes a confident, strong-minded girl to say, no, I will not deal with guys like that and I WILL be a better person overall.

I agree girls/women are free to make their own decisions, I understand that when it comes to guys it comes down to chemistry and if she's not feeling it, a guy can't force it. But for me, I tried dating apps, meeting girls through other people, work, school and other places and nothing worked. So I just asked God, please give me the strength to go through life without a girlfriend or wife.

The negative feedback I got from girls were, I'm not strong enough (I hit the gym), I am not religious enough (I studied religion and became one with God), I wasn't good at school (I got into law school) in addition, I am considerate, funny, I cook good food, I listen and other positive traits, Im worth it

[tommyvegas7618]

Well, there is some truth to what you say, Chronicthinker, but most of those nice guys out there typically are just plainly nice guys who are really shy and couldn't be anything but whom they are. The fact that a lot of women are not attracted to them due to their lack of confidence or lack of being aggressive about what they want does not mean, per se , that they are creepy, sex hounds. Every guys thinks the same, basically and all think about sex. Some straight up ask for it, and then some beg for it ( and Usually don't get it). I feel sorry for them mostly, since most of the guys I know like this, are just shy and want to make nookie just like any other guy. Yes, m they lack balls in the girl asking out department, but I feel most of them are great dudes with no confidence. Assuming they are all only being nice to get laid I think is wrong; but I do agree anyone who does rack up all of those nice guy points by doing her favors to win her love and not because he is just cool, is one, an idiot because women usually see through that shit and two, sleezy as one girl stated.

[Sspaulding728]

We dont approach you because of the way y'all act towards us when we do. We get a wtf you doin here look. OR you'll just get up and leave. Or we end up on a #metoo page just for saying "hi beautiful"(Which is now apparently sexual harassment). And you wonder why women get called bitches sometimes. We dont like getting treated rudely just like y'all dont. You think your so much better. But want equality? here's a suggestion. Dont expect to make the same as steve whose been there 10 years when you just started your job. Get ready to take on the extra work that comes with the job. We gotta deal with the same shit. it just doesn't work that way. Im considered a nice guy. And no not a fake one. I was raised on the older traditions as i was raised mainly by my grandparents. anything else i learned was from dealing with it in real life. Which lets all face it. it ain't easy. I can stand up for myself, and fuck all night long if i need to w/o some stupid pill. I like to say i might not be Fred Flintstone but i can sure af make your bed rock. But because y'all wanna assume or go after the opposite of what you say you really want, you'll never get to find out. I mean come on. Your only bringing it on yourselves. as are we to an extent. I was lucky enough to have recently hopefully found my Player 2 in life and hopfully i get to grow old with her. But you never know because things can happen. Another life saying... SHIT HAPPENS...

[anonchubbs]

too ignorant. i love how you're ridiculing the metoo movement whilst calling yourself a nice guy. i might be wrong, but you seem to be part of the category that: pretends to be nice to satisfy themselves, plays victim when girl is unattracted, is an outright asshole--moreso than he claims her boyfriend to be.

[performerwannabe]

@anonchubbs couldn't have said it better myself.

[Sspaulding728]

@anonchubbs Ignorant? Nah. And its the truth. A guy can't even compliment a girl nowadays w/o either having to worry about getting hit with some sort of sexual harassment and you can't deny y'all dont pull some double standard bull shit. So dont even go there. Also both of y'all are too damn young to know shit about how the world works. You just go off of what you see on the news and whatever trash tv is on nowadays. I am a nice guy. But I can also be an ass hole when i need to be. I generally try to stay the nice path because i dont like being an asshole but i will speak up and stand up for myself or someone else if i have to.

[performerwannabe]

Here's the thing, I'm a person that likes to observe things rather than live in the moment. I've only ever been to two parties in the last 4 years and I was sexually harassed both times.
You're blowing things out of proportion and trying to make us look like we are not to be talked with.
The fact that I don't personally like people complimenting me does NOT mean that I would consider that getting harassed. Annoyed, maybe but there is no such thing as pressing charges because someone is simply a bit annoying.
I find cat calling disgusting yet I don't know if that could be classified as harassment either, maybe if the things the person said are very inappropriate.
I am not sexist in anyway, double standards shouldn't be applied, not here and not anywhere else. The fact that some government laws or society standards favor women in certain areas does not mean that all females support those laws or standards. Some of us actually believe in equality.

[Sspaulding728]

@performerwannabe It sucks that you had to deal with that. But still. You say you observe stuff. Can you not see how women have become? And what I meant with the double standard is theyll let Rico Suave hit on them and compliment them all day. But as soon as average Dave comes in and says something even remotely similar he's suddenly a creep or a bad guy. And yes. It happens more than you think. Hell. I was walking with my gay friend a while back into a Petco one day. He saw some chick he knew and whistled at her. She looked at me and gave me this I will gut you and devour your soul look. Like her shit didn't stink. Untill she saw who whistled at her. Then she was all smiles and laughing. In reality it kind of hurt my feelings a little. Im all for equality. Shit i wish everyone would treat each other with respect. The world would be a lot better place. But because people gotta be stupid itll never happen.

[performerwannabe]

Well, I wouldn't like it either if a stranger whistled at me. I probably wouldn't turn my head at all, I'm not a dog that someone can whistle at to get my attention.
I assume that when she realized it was her acquaintance, which happens to be gay, she was happy to see him and she probably knew that he didn't mean it like that. Having a complete stranger do it is kinda creepy, don't you think?

[Sspaulding728]

@performerwannabe I grew up in a time where it was ok and not frowned upon. It only became not ok when it was ugly women not getting cat called and they got butt hurt over it.

[performerwannabe]

I don't think that's the case. I'm ugly and I've been cat called before, a few times. It didn't feel satisfying at all, it was just a weird moment and my immediate thoughts were "what the eff is wrong with these people?".
I wouldn't feel jealous of attractive women if guys weren't hitting on me with such gross methods, I'd rather become a cat lady and live on my book case than having to deal with that often.

[MrMysteryMan]

Exactly. "Bad boys", aren't really bad usually, at least the ones women really want. The difference between a so called "bad boy" and a "nice boy" is attitude, charm and confidence. Depth is the biggest thing. In personality, outlook, life experience and emotions. Not just smiles and cute, "hello, you look nice today". As well, our minds are more broader and there are reasons we aren't "pure as gold", since life really isn't so black and white or "Disney". Don't get me wrong, I never really want to hurt anyone, but I'm pretty stubborn and understand what type attracts me. I'm very sexual and love how sensual women can be. I hunger for the one that can capture my intellect and at the same time drain my desires. I will be true to most and definitely to the one I absolutely am head over heals for, who excites my interests, churns my sensuality and entertains my mind. I'm not for all women and not all women care for me. But I love to see what women I can attract. I love to delve deep into their desires and see how much I can entice them to come up to the surface.

I'm more of a unseeming

[somewheresomeway]

Yeah I'm sure all the girls out there who hang out with a nice guy are completely naive & blind that nice guy wants her despite having razor sharp intuition (and knowing 99.99% of the time). Instead of doing the RIGHT THING and TELLING the nice guy you only see him as a friend, you play dumb pretending he's completely fine with the predicament he's in. After all women never abuse all the attention, validation, free meals, free counseling, etc. the "nice guy" has by beating around the bush and stringing him along. Nah that never happens, never.

Alright, it's COMPLETELY FINE TO FRIEND ZONE A GUY. I ACTUALLY AGREE WITH YOU. But it's your prerogative to FUCKING TELL HIM where he stands. Straight men don't approach women "just to be friends" WHY DON'T YOU FUCKING GET THAT?

If you have the class to tell him the truth he will either accept it or if he's smart he'll move on. If he tries to get out of the friend zone than the onus is on him. Then and only THEN you can apply this lengthy diatribe on him.

Straight men gain nothing with being in friendships with women they are attracted to except pain. Women and men can be friendly, but not friends. There are somethings women discuss among each other they don't bring up in front of men and vice versa.

[DanoMR98]

You are actually wrong. What women want and what they will say they want are completely different.

"Nice guys" are men who have been raised by women, and who were taught as tweens and teens by their feminist moms a fairy tale about what women want.

Men who get what they want are men who know that women are basically objects. Who gives a shit what they like or want? They'd never tell you anyway. Life to a woman is about being financially supported and validated. Everything is a means to those two ends.

[BigAl1982]

LOL blue pill problems.

It's shit like this that makes me eternally grateful I was never a beta male feminist soy boy following her around while holding her purse in the mall. These blue pills basically turn every vagina in the the Sahara.

You really want to know why girls fuck assholes? Our lizard brain has changed little in a million years, and her lizard brain tells her you're weak and sensitive-- subpar for making children with. That's why when she says she's glad you cried while watching the Notebook but deep down she has nothing but contempt and disdain and she finds you sexually repugnant.

[NoFcks2Give]

Male feminist makes me physically ill. Like rage crawling up my fucking spine.

[Jayson101]

@NoFcks2Give Me too dude!

[littlebutswole]

lol yeah gotta love those "nice guys" a truly nice guy would continue to be your friend and not make you feel guilty because they care about you and want to be around you even if it will never involve sex. i feel bad because i liked my guy friend, but didn't want to tell him because i thought i would lose him as a friend and later i found out that he had liked me too but gave up.

[FýrdracaDócincel]

"A truly nice guy would continue to be your friend.."

What if he realized it just wasn't gonna happen so he took off because he knew he'd probably always be attracted to her.. not as any sort of manipulation tactic, but to avoid future bullsh*t?

[littlebutswole]

@FýrdracaDócincel i guess that too, he just shouldn't start yelling at her for not liking him and leave all angry. if he just wants to drift or leave quietly to avoid being hurt more than he can do that, to take care of himself. and if the girl really cares she will say something. honestly though, as someone who has spent 2 years hopelessly in love with my best friend who had no idea, even if he didn't feel the same way nothing would keep me from being his friend. but yeah, there is a difference between a nice guy and a nice guy that is in love. if he's just a nice guy caught up in a bad situation he should leave, but if he's in love he wouldn't

[FýrdracaDócincel]

There we go.

[Guanfei]

So a nice guy would have to put his feeling aside and be continuously hurt by seeing you with someone else, just because leaving would be selfish and mean?
His well-being doesn't count, he can only care about yours?

[FýrdracaDócincel]

@Guanfei
No.
Her and I literally just established that.

[thecd1979]

So very well said. The "nice guys" just don't get that it takes more than just being nice to get on a attractive good girls radar. If being nice was all it took to snag up a partner then everyone would be with someone. You gotta be interesting, gotta stand out a little, show them you stand for something and aren't a pushover that's just gonna do the "yeah, uh huh, and ok when talking to her. A man that isn't afraid to speak his mind, rock the boat a little, and is confident around not just women but other guys as well. It just never fails that all the guys who complain and whine about this are the ones that are overweight, have terrible hygiene, lack confidence, and have no interests outside of anything that doesn't involve a computer screen or game controller. I've known my share of these guys.

[LMNOP123]

Hence why when I know a dude likes me and I would never in a million years date him, I wouldn't become his friend in the first place. Easy. No false hope, no unreturned favours, no misread signals, it's perfect. Straight up let him know you're not interested. It solves a whole lot of problems.
Of course there's dummies who still bother you, thinking you're playing hard to get. The good thing is most guys will get the message when you don't pay them any mind. The former is the 1%.

[brocklee]

Thank you!

[Porcelaine]

@brocklee brilliant answer. if you're not into the guy who likes you, don't be his friend because 90% of the time he will be secretly hoping and still waiting for chance

[Porcelaine]

I meant that for @LMNOP123 lol

[somewheresomeway]

Amen.

[LuckyEnough]

Disclaimer: Alpha male here, pretty much always have been. Feel like the minority in here, but someone's got to throw the beta guys a bone.

Thank you for pointing out an obvious oversight. The woman's role in this betamale/niceguy/orbiter relationship. Many do seem to keep one or two guys in the wings that have no chance. All the compliments, favors, attention, etc must be hard to say no to, even if a date is...

[somewheresomeway]

@LuckyEnough a lot of these younger guys just don’t know any better. They were brainwashed at a early age to kiss girls asses (I was). Just takes a few horrible experiences to change. Nowadays if I feel friendzone bullshit coming on I’m gone faster than fat girls in Dodge ball.

But you’re right. Women don’t get called out for taking advantage of this. They are partially to blame

[brocklee]

I know a woman that maintains a couple orbiters at all times. When one splits out of frustration, a replacement is never far behind. These guys have NO chance. I asked her what the hell her problem is and she said "Hey, I tell them right away we are only friends. If they choose to read into things and perceive things in any other way, it isn't my fault or problem."

[somewheresomeway]

@brocklee I wised up to that shit in my late 20s. At least she had the class to be straight up with them. 90 percent of the women I encountered don’t do that. They can’t say no to the free meals, favors and attention.

[brocklee]

@somewheresomeway I agree, but I see a "loophole". These guys hear the "friends" thing early on, but if it isn't repeated, they assume they are making progress. I asked this woman why she didn't reiterate that point often.. she feels that she was clear in the beginning and if these guys read into things and assume different, it isn't her problem. I know she takes pleasure in having guys pining for her. She has laughed about one in particular that told her "I will wait for you." She said to me "Let's see how long he can last." Now if I go and tell this guy what I experienced, he will think I am trying to get him out of the picture. He is in for one hell of a ride.

[somewheresomeway]

@brocklee how old are these guys who are getting played?

I was much them when I was young and dumb and brainwashed (I was raised by a domineering mother). But after a few hard lessons I started reading between the lines in my late 20s. Dating is war unfortunately. But I’m no longer being a casualty.

[brocklee]

@somewheresomeway Mostly 30's. She recently had a guy in his mid 20's hanging around, but after a year, he wised up. The guy that has been holding out for 10 years, he is in his 40's now. The guy that said "he will wait".. he is in his early 30's.

The problem is she is gorgeous on the outside, totally fucked on the inside. These losers want a hot girlfriend no matter what the cost. I guess they see it as an investment.. just wait until they get their shot and she will never leave them (as she proudly tells anyone that will listen she has never left a guy).

[brocklee]

And I wouldn't say she is playing them so much as they are playing themselves. While she should be telling them it is strictly platonic all the time, she only does when they confront her wanting more. Otherwise she treats them like she treats her girlfriends... but they read into her actions. "Oh, she is smiling and telling me deep stuff while touching her hair, she must be into me. I will wait until her current relationship is on the rocks and rescue her."

[somewheresomeway]

@brocklee stories like that make me feel better for my earlier fuck ups. Nowadays I can smell that shit from a mile away. I just ghost them.

[DumbandDumbber]

I dislike anyone who complains in general. If something is wrong or you don't like something in your life change it, stop bitching around and feel like the world owes you something. Nobody owes you anthing, you either take it or be discarded.

PS: I see a lot of girls lately adressing this 'nice guy complains' problem, it took a while.

[ChupacabraGuy]

Spoken like a true gent and upstanding guy.

[Chaoseverywhere]

Nice guys don't worry, I was once like you, then some b*tch friendzone me? you know what I did?

I go around and get rejected 100x until I don't give a fuck anymore about them. I don't care about them. Suddenly, b*tches rain from the sky!! You don't have to do that, you just have to understand the lesson.

Here's what i learnt
1. YOU COME FIRST, NOT SOME HO (she message you? your dog message u, you message your dog first)
2. NO. FUCKS. GIVEN. EVER (she cry? you tell her stop it, you're trying to masturbate)
3. Congratuations, you became a man.

[thecd1979]

Yes sir, I was once like that too. Things changed when I guess you could say I finally grew up and just started worrying about me. Going to school, work, focusing on my goals and plans and really not giving a shit about trying to snag up a woman. That's when they honestly started paying attention to me and then I finally understood why those guys I saw that got with the girls really didn't make a big deal outta it. It was some hard lessons learned for me. Most of these guys are gonna learn the hard way.

[SirRexington]

I usually like your responses, and normally if we were talking about fake nice guys who only act nice to get in a girls pants, I'd agree.

But talking about actual nice guys whose poor souls get manipulated and then let down after having their time wasted and disrespected by a girl they thought they trusted, of course they will get mad. So would you. It's not that they aren't nice, it's that they are frustrating and feel betrayed. Their love is taken from them and she doesn't care. That's bound to piss someone off.

[Ouroboros8Fate]

That's kind of my situation. I totally agree with you. A lot of the authentic nice guys who truly try to treat everyone with respect/kindness end up getting labeled or automatically categorized in the "FAKE" category with all the assholes/manipulative men/people. And it doesn't matter how much you try to help someone... you can lead a horse to water, but you can't force it to drink.
And that sort of "I told you so moment" comes up and it ends up backfiring on you and you are suddenly the bad guy who should have minded his own business. It's frustrating really... And it really makes a lot of nice/sincere people become bitter or start to doubt and become paranoid of anything/anyone. Hell, unless a girl is upfront and obvious with it... I'd never know she was hitting on me. And if I start seeing something that has happened to me in the past... I get kind of a Fight or Flight response and start to get those red flags set off... like "if it's too good to be true, it probably is."

[SirRexington]

@Ouroboros8Fate also I don't see the issue with wanting to be her friend. Relationships built on friendships are usually the strongest bonds and longest lasting. You are friends for a reason, it's because you get along well and are compatible m

[Ouroboros8Fate]

Yeah I agree 100%. That's my outlook on relationships as well. Hell another reason why I've been single for so long is because I even feel awkward just sleeping with a girl that I just met or anything like that because I don't want to end up hurting her feelings or giving her the wrong impressions. I'm the kind of guy who actually has a moral consciousness when it comes to stuff like that since I sincerely want to actually find someone to fall in love with for a long term relationship. I'm cheesy like that and don't really strive on sleeping with as many women as i can. It's just hard with this day and age since so many scorned women have this sense of all men being the same or pigs and of course they don't want us men to categorize or assume their thoughts, emotions or actions but they are doing just that, hypocrisy at its finest. I guess for me it's also hard being friends with a lot of girls especially when I'm single because i'm afraid of developing feelings that won't be mutual.

[SirRexington]

@Ouroboros8Fate also women are all about accepting slutty behavior instead of shaming it. So that makes it hard to find a good girl too.

[Ouroboros8Fate]

@SirRexington Yeah, sadly music and media has influenced and made a lot of people embrace that kind of attitude/mentality. People think it's like a game and you get some kind of personal achievements if you sleep with more people... but a lot of people fail to realize that just like a Rose, a flower known and symbolizing love and beauty... it still withers and dies. It's outer beauty isn't immortal since it is a living thing that dies over time. People get so wrapped up in someones beauty and forget about those "thorns". Sure I agree you should at least be attracted to the person in some way. But too many people are hung up on visual attraction... and don't actually take the time to get to know someone. Outer beauty fades and dies over time with age but Inner beauty will always be there till the day you die.

[FinalVow]

very accurate that is why I am not that type of nice guy lol I am the guy that happens to be nice a lot of the time. I spent a lot of time trying to avoid being like my birth dad and to some extent I succeeded I certainly don't act like he does. I generally just tell people what kind of a person I am and let them tell me where I fall in terms of a category. I can't stand the "nice" guys who claim that shit and bully someone behind there back. A nice guy is supposed to be someone who is not judgmental, rude, derisive, stuck up, demeaning, etc... I love how you put those "nice" guys out to dry very well done.

[Cryostatic]

"she was never attracted to you in the first place"

Boom.

This little nugget right here. It doesn't matter if you're nice, or if you're an asshole, what matters is if she's attracted, and she'll know within the first few seconds of seeing you whether or not she's attracted.

Being all the nice in the world isn't going to create attraction, and neither is deciding to be an asshole instead.

[somewheresomeway]

True. But the tragedy is when she initially attracted to the nice guy but his personality turns her off. Had that happen multiple times when I was younger until I learned challenge.

[Kuraj]

Well, I don't know.
This sounds a lot like bitching, moaning and complaining to me, too.

Are you sure your subconscious isn't just reflecting, because deep down you know the "nice guys" are right, in that the breakup always "finally comes" for you because your choice in partner sucks balls, and you hate the fact?

[OfDeath]

Lol that's exactly what it is. Why would she even bother writing this if it wasn't lol

[Username678]

Basically what she is saying that nice guys should grow a set of balls and approach a girl like a man, after she has healed after a break up, not like a girl -oh please be with me.
And that they label women as bitches because they don’t want to date them. You cannot control who you are attracted too.
It is tiring and in the end you start to actually believe this guy. You must be this superficial, you must have high standards for wanting a sophisticated and handsome man , why not settle with someone who doesn’t know how to be a man even though you are not attracted to him? After all, his love is so strong that it must be true. It is you who is stupid for chasing after attraction.

[OfDeath]

@Username678 https://youtu.be/geVYIHOat5ol

[Username678]

@OfDeath 1. it doesn't work 2. why on earth would I waste minutes of my life watching a video on youtube since reading a response requires much less time.
When a nice guy starts chasing you , he suffocates you.
OVERALL I think we should have a better perspective on this and how we feel when a nice guy is running around trying to prove everyone wrong. Men don't even realise that they are jerks sometimes until you tell it to their face.

[somewheresomeway]

@Username678 approach a woman "like a man" and maybe be unlucky enough to be labeled a creep and later be featured in some girl's #metoo post?

Alright that's an exaggeration. But you have to be acknowledge that our society is turning would be good men into "nice guys" because NOBODY is teaching young boys on what women REALLY want. They are getting brainwashed and setup for failure thanks to feminism and delusional movies/TV. In the movies the nice guy gets the girl, but not in real life.

[Username678]

@somewheresomeway how is approaching a woman being a creep?
I would say , being a « nice guy » and stalking a girl, being by her side every step of the way is f**** creepy.
If the men you describe only watch television instead of going out and actually seeing how it works when yeah. Those are losers who don’t even try to live a little to get a girl.
Tv doesn’t have anything to do with the lack of confidence in a guy though. Instead they will nag you.

[somewheresomeway]

@Username678 nagging and suffocating a girl is creepy and huge turn off I'll admit. I'm pained to say I once did this to a girl in college that I was crazy in love with. I thought being persistent would change her mind (you see this shit in the movies all the time) but I couldn't be anymore wrong.

But when I went silent she would every once in a while call me and even asked me to hang out sometimes. She even came over to my house in the evening when nobody was around. At that point she was seeing some other guy and I was VERY DEEP in the friend zone. I thought I could convince her to think otherwise. She even threw me hints occasionally (she told me to she wanted to see one of my wrestling moves).

The horrifying ugly truth is that girl wanted to keep me around to make her new boyfriend jealous and she loved the borderline creepy but consistent compliments and attention I gave her. She never once looked me in the eye and said "I only see you as a friend".

[Username678]

@somewheresomeway well. That is called user. com.
Nice combination, a nice guy and a user who uses a nice guy...

[somewheresomeway]

@Username678 yeah but no calls those bitches out. Society gives them a free pass. Young men are not being taught on how to avoid them but girls are taught at very young age on what to look for while dating.

[Username678]

@somewheresomeway “girls are tought at a very young age” I grew up without a father , was called a bitch at school because I refused to go out with a boy at school. Nobody taught me how to interact with men.
You just go do it and learn,
Oh , your family didn’t teach you, boohoo.
So know you will cry about how a b**** was bad to you when you were a nice guy instead of growing a set of balls and start being a man

[somewheresomeway]

@Username678 here we go. Instead of having a spirited debate you lower yourself and start throwing insults because my argument doesn’t suit your “emotion”
despite never personally insulting you. Don’t use facts or compare experiences. Just be a moron and make assumptions.

You have no fucking idea of what kind of upbringing I had.

[OfDeath]

@Username678 it's a video of the never ending story theme song. The pont being that you harp on and nobody cares.

[Username678]

@OfDeath Oh yeah, that’s the easy way out.

[Username678]

@somewheresomeway blame it all on upbringing and other people. It’s never you who is to blame. Same old story.

[somewheresomeway]

@Username678 well you were just complaining about being called a "bitch" in school for not wanting to go out with a boy. I was called much worse for trying to approach. Laughed at, mocked, called a creep behind my back, etc.

Now that doesn't always happen (but it did happen often enough). I remember confidently approaching the girl I lost my virginity too back in HS and not being afraid to put my hand on her (she liked it). But unfortunately, most women automatically assume guys can read their minds if they like them or not. So if we don't approach we are too passive, nice or "gay" or if we do approach and it's not welcomed we "creeps" or worse.

Guys are LOGICAL. At a young age we absorb what we are taught in school (which is usually feministic) on what women want. They "say" they want to be friends first. They say "to be polite". They "say" they want a nice guy. But we all find out the hard way that's a huge lie.

[Username678]

@somewheresomeway « you were just complaining about being called a bitch »
« Just »
This is how you are a nice guy? Have always put the struggles of other people behind yours? I was labelled « the bitch » that’s how people knew who they are talking about.
Not complaining though, i took it upon myself to form my opinion and go out in order to see how the world functions. Not basing everything on what I saw/heard in high school. If i did I would go mad and think that all guys want is sex /screw you over/hate you.
Based on your answers your perception of female interaction comes from high school +television.

[Username678]

eh... not that I really care if someone on the internet will grow a set of balls instead of whining how bad he had it, how damaged he is bla bla bla.
We all been though hell and back ffs, get up and be a man.

[somewheresomeway]

@Username678 well why don’t tell all the metoo bitches to quit marching, wearing vagina costumes and instead of being a professional victim focus on accomplishing something in their lives. You don’t see guys doing that shit.

[Username678]

@somewheresomeway nice calling women bitches lol

[Username678]

@somewheresomeway vagina costumes lol wtf

[somewheresomeway]

@Username678 oh I know it’s so horrible they being called bitches. Meanwhile women (and other guys) call guys every name in book (creeps, douchebags, etc) and not even think twice about it.

[10dsw]

@somewheresomeway Lol stop feeding this poor woman. She's just some nobody who chooses to blame her own insecurities and issues on men

[somewheresomeway]

@10dsw actually you're right. Sometimes I like to ventilate but it's like debating with an adolescent who just hit puberty. When they don't get their way they throw hormone-fueled temper tantrums.

Sadly there are many other women out there just like her... even in their 30s.

[10dsw]

@somewheresomeway Over years of meeting with random women: "Man up", "grow some balls", etc., -> these lines are the biggest indicator of shitty undesirable women. Real women don't have to fall back to using sexual or gender based comebacks.

[somewheresomeway]

@10dsw it's their go to when they are losing a factual argument. Their insufficient brains can't handle it so they resort to that bullshit. Then they go around an embrace feminism and again their mental capacity is completely incapable of seeing the hypocrisy. Smdh.

[Username678]

@10dsw well, I don’t know about you but my daddy wasn’t in my life, my mommy needed help instead of helping me and un the end i had to grow a set of balls instead of complaining and trashing other people:telling them how undesirable they are etc etc.
I have achieved what I wanted and am happy with my lover but people complaining « how bad they got it in life and what bitches we are » seriously gets on my nerve sometimes. But again , this is internet, so who cares?
Bla-bla-bla bla bla-bla

Apples potatoes

[10dsw]

@Username678 You sound like an incredibly troubled person. Woe is me

[Username678]

@10dsw dude, we are writing posts on the internet.
Like it or not-every single person in this thread is troubled.

[belarus]

@Username678 You're ridiculous!

[Sspaulding728]

@Username678 Feminazi much? You say this but im sensing otherwise. Especially after reading you get put in your place by OfDeath. You clearly have daddy issues. and i get the feeling your just trying to be hard. Or thug or whatever as a defensive mechanism. Im considered a nice guy. And no not the fake ones. The ones that were brought up on older traditions. I was raised by my grandparents. What i learned was from them and experiencing life itself. And ill admit. The way you women act towards us when we approch you... Shit. You give us this look like excuse me. wtf you doin here. Or we just get treated rudely. And you wonder why women get called a bitch sometimes. I might be a nice guy but it doesn't make me a loser either. I've probably done more in my life than you have in the last 5 of yours.

[Username678]

@Sspaulding728 LOL sure, a Theory of every woman without a father having daddy issues xD lol classic
Same old, man... same old...
lets play a game- how many men in this thread haven’t got laid in the past 7 days?:D
One, two, three... GO!

[Username678]

@Sspaulding728 and here you go again generalising us all:,)...
Saying I’m a bitch and then expecting a decent reply lol, gaslighting much.

[somewheresomeway]

@Username678 you are wasting too much time on here. You should be working on your vagina costume for next years women’s rights march.

[Username678]

@somewheresomeway aaaand... you lost a game :Dddddd

[somewheresomeway]

@Username678 in 10 years you will have nothing but your cats

[Username678]

@somewheresomeway lol im a dog person but ok

[Sspaulding728]

@Username678 I never called you a bitch. It was a generalization of all the women that give the rude/bitch attitude.. there's a difference. Kind of like Y'all has many meanings. And believe me youd know if id call you a bitch because i would. Without hesitation. I might be a nice guy but i won't be disrespected.

[Username678]

@Sspaulding728 “I called you ALL bitches but not YOU in particular” lol , passive aggressive much

[Sspaulding728]

@Username678 your over reading stuff. which is a typical female trait. I said "Only the ones that are rude." there's no need for it. AT ALL. And yeah i can be passive aggressive sometimes. Its for peoples own good.

[Username678]

@Sspaulding728 in you last comment you didn’t say -only the ones though.
You just generalised females...
Well... anyway... you lost a game too and this thread became boring

[Sspaulding728]

@Username678 It was a generalization of all the women that give the rude/bitch attitude.. quit getting shit twisted. another female tactic. twisting shit up.

[Sspaulding728]

@Username678 The way you women act towards us when we approch you... Shit. You give us this look like excuse me. wtf you doin here. Or we just get treated rudely. And you wonder why women get called a bitch sometimes. I dont see in here anywhere where im calling all women bitches. Just the ones that are rude or deserve it. Like i said. your trying to twist shit up. which this is where my age i guess comes in. i guess because i can see right through it. You should try and lose this hard or thug attitude your trying to exuberate because all it makes you do is look ugly.

[Username678]

@Sspaulding728 when you say -you , women.
Instead you could say-some women or , well, most women or women like you. , yours just sounds like gaslighting.

If I say-you men only care about sex and using us-

And then go on telling how it wasn’t directed towards you lol I can imagine the backfire in this thread.
These statements are childish, man, I never said something like that even when I was 17 and men called me bitch cause I didn’t want to sleep with them.

I was a virgin in a school uniform and never acted bitchy, didn’t give them the attitude or whatever , just was afraid of sex so I stayed quiet. Still -I’m a bitch :D there’s no freakin’ way out of this lol
Doesn’t mean that I will be mad at all the men in the world lol. You see all the shit going on in college and life in general but you don’t go around saying -men are bastards, they only want to use you and only care about looks, oh we are so poor and innocent in this world controlled by men-
boohoo, cry me a river, bullshit

[Username678]

Not saying that someone is 100 pr right or wrong here but I have a dissertation to write so I’m out. This could go on forever and is useless and quite addictive since it’s easy to shout on the internet.
Good luck getting laid ;) finding a partner who you can do it with regularly with , I know I do 🙃 and he’s not an asshole or bitch or a manipulator or whatever. Vagina string thing or smth lol
Seriously, man, this shit is getting ridiculous, how are you not seeing this lol

[bacca400]

Former "nice guy" here. It was my fault. So I fixed it. I'm much happier now.

I try to help people get past this as I know exactly what it's like, but people who will not go out of their comfort zone will never make progress. Confidence is not given, it is earned, by going out of your comfort zone. And I found I was the meanest person in the room to myself. So I had to stop the "stinking thinking".

Now I'm very happy with the wife I've chosen.

Sorry if it's not what you wanted to hear. But it is your fault.