The "Friendzone" Does Not Exist the Way You Think It Does

[been_waiting]

Questions about the "Friend Zone" are littering GaG.

Guys (and some girls) are asking "What can I do to get out of the Friendzone? How can I avoid being 'placed' in the Friendzone?"

https://www.girlsaskguys.com/sexual-behavior/q1298286-girls-what-gets-you-thinking-about-a-guy-as-more-then-just-a-friend#

The answer is this: fucking nothing.

All the Friendzone is, is a platonic relationship between two people, in which one person has romantic feelings for the other that are simply not reciprocated.

Think back to a time when you have met a person you do not want to date. It really shouldn't be that hard. Think of any person you've encountered that you do not feel romantic feelings for. I'm sure you can think of a crap ton.

If this person is not attractive to you, mentally or physically, and your personalities do not click, what could that person do to make you want them?

Not shit. If someone "falls" for another person because they're being showered with gifts and being put on a pedastal, that relationship is gonna be one-sided garbage. You don't fall for someone because they bought you a teddy bear. You don't fall for someone because they compliment you. You may like the attention, but you don't truly like them.

So guys and girls, if someone does not like you, don't waste your time trying to "Woo" them.

Let's move on to another point.

I've seen too many guys on here say that their female FRIENDS are using them for "emotional intimacy."

Well look here son, that's what FRIENDS do!!!!

Guys like to complain: "She tells me all her problems, especially ones about guys, and she asks for advice and stuff...and I listen...yet she won't date me!"

Welp, that would be because she is not interested in you romantically, and you two are in a platonic relationship, and that's what people in platonic relationships do.

Listen: if you do not want to be friends with a girl because it is too painful for you to be just friends with a girl you like, then you are not obligated to maintain that friendship. You do not have to talk nor listen to her.

If a chick says a guy is using her for sex, everyone and they mama wants to say that she's letting herself be used.

Well if a chick is "using" you for friendship then you are letting yourself be used. Walk away.

*Just because you are a decent human who helps a friend out, does not mean you are entitled to sex and/or a relationship with that person.*

Imagine if your gay male best friend was like "bro, I totally listen you when you're upset. It's about time you suck my dick for all my troubles."

Clearly that's not how it works.

That's all for today.

[R3d_Anonymous]

Amen. Getting friendzoned just simply means that she didn't like you back. If she did, you wouldn't be friendzoned!

It's a fallacy, to think you can manipulate yourself out of the friendzone. You can't. It just happens if it's meant to be.

There are also couples that started as friends. Those were meant to be, so they eventually evolved into a couple.

[been_waiting]

Thanks yo for agreeing

[johnvanjohn]

yup. a solid relationship requires more than just passion, it requires friendship.

[aamy811]

THANK YOU!!! I've tried to say exactly this to so many guys. People can just be friends. And just because your nice doesn't mean you get sex or a relationship.
Also I hate all the guys who are like "I'm tired of being the nice guy" real nice guys aren't nice for a reward, they're nice because they just enjoy being a good person.

[been_waiting]

You are exactly right

[scrappygirl]

yeah most of those so called nice guys aren't actually nice guys. they just think they are because they are pushovers but judging from this site they aren't nice. I've read so many aggressive questions on this site by so called nice guys. you can tell theyre bitter.

[aamy811]

@scrappygirl oh yeah. Just because you hung out with her and listened to her one time you diserve sec or a relationship. Lol no, she's already rewarding you with friendship

[mrf284212]

I noticed these Take things and skimmed a few. This is the first I read. Definitely taking a more scientific view. I say that because, I recently did some research on gravity and they kind of worded the law part of the definition similar to how you worded friendzone. Not that I'm comparing those two concepts, just that scientists describe laws as what is actually happening, and that's what you described. Hopefully that made sense.

I'm not noticing any imprecision in your word usage. Sorry I worded that like that lol. I just like to focus on those things, so I can develop an argument against views, or parts of views. I like to find clarity in what a person means, and as far as I can tell, it has a high level of clarity. I won't say 100%, because there should always be a margin of error. Lol, I read that as I did my gravity research.

I guess I should say my point of view in this comment as well, assuming that's the point of these. Two words are sufficient enough for that; no need to embellish. I agree... with a minor margin of error. Sorry I almost clicked submit, but I was compelled to clarify. Also, sorry for embellishing to eight words, with a "..." in between. I forget what those are called.

[been_waiting]

Haha no need for an apology. I appreciate your comment. And it is an ellipses

[mrf284212]

Lol I kept searching to find what it's called, but every way I tried to search, google just wanted to give me the definition of the other words in my search. I know I looked it up before, but I just could not remember the name, or how I looked it up. Thanks for yourTake, for your comment, and for informing me of ellipses.

[soneoak]

Dayum, where's the upvote/5star/ 11/10 for this article?

Absolutely correct. The worst one was where it was kind of reversed friendzone?

I was being a nice guy, going out to meals with her, doing fun stuff occasionally when bored (no sex)... and then when I 'friendzoned' her, she exploded on me.

I mean, wtf? I thought I made it pretty clear early on that I didn't have any romantic interest in her! Sigh.

Maybe all the other 'nice guys' out there went and treated her nice or whatever the crap when they were interested in her and she thought that any guy that did that = interested in her romantically.

Please, I was pretty darn clear where you were in my friendzone. And no, there isn't a way to get out of it. Making me 'chase' you is definitely the reverse of the example too. (smacking a machine so coins fall out of it until sex falls out as well... just doesn't work that way).

[been_waiting]

👍👍👍👍👍

[forgottenmonkey]

I think it is a very very real place. The thing I disagree with is how you get there. Any girl you meet you have a chance to date starting the second you meet her. Its your own fault not hers if you throw the wrong signs. Especially if you become close friends that is all the worse because you probably had way more than the potential to get her into a relationship. There are exceptions to this of course some girls only date a very very specific look or type and even the most awesome sexy compatible guys will not show up on that radar. I had a girl, my high school crush, man did I like her and man did I end up in the friendzone. It was my fault plus she was seeing someone at the time. Years later we met again and started hanging out a lot. Because I use to be in the friendzone I totally missed all the signs that things had changed and only after we stopped hanging out did I realize she probably had been interested in me the second time around. But I don't think that would of happened if it wasn't for the time apart.

[forgottenmonkey]

Also I agree with basically everything you said. I think the point for most guys which you are missing is not that boo woo she doesn't like me back its the frustration of getting a label and someone being unwiling to change it. Like I said it all starts moment one and the problem or at least what I see as a problem aka the "friend zone" is not that I have an issue with only being friends its more when women are unwilling to change the title of a relationship once its locked in. If you become a friend no matter what happens you will always be a friend even if they do start to like you in that way. Its a multi-sided thing where I understand guys views on it and the female view both are right to some degree just missing the other half.

[Anonymous]

I get this all the time. Men always think I'm friend zoning them. I'm already in a relationship. Most of these men know this too and yet they keep trying to pursue me. I've never flirted or shown any signs that I'm interested, and yet somehow I led them on. Most of these men I've just had conversations with. It's like they think only single women are allowed to talk to them. I'm just generally a friendly person. I can talk to anyone and I will. I have a colleague who is obsessed with me. He's known from the start that I have a boyfriend. I've led him on apparently because we can 'relate' to each other.

[been_waiting]

Exactly 😞

[scrappygirl]

i dont really believe that. somehow you led the guys on.

[Byakuyarko]

I am tempted to be offended at your dismissive attitude towards simps and blue pill losers... But nah... Those suckers deserve the friendzone...
The way I keep out of the friendzone is by forgoing any sort relationship with women that isn't professional. Women friends in general are too easily offended, expect too many favours without reciprocating proportionately, have no qualms about using us guys for their evil machinations, and worst of all, want to change your habits and attitudes if it doesn't sit well with general gynocentric consensus.
Contrary to what you believe, men do not use each other as emotional tampons. All the platonic (?) cuddling and spooning and soul-swapping that women like to engage with each other. Yeah... all that disgusting touching and feeling... It is unacceptable for you girls to behave that way with their guy friends. If a guy behaved that way with another guy, he would be what you would call in scientific terms; a "gayhomofag"
Another unacceptable behaviour: cockblocking... If we are acceptable as your friends, there is no reason for you to deem us unworthy of your hotter and significantly more available female friends. Ugly girls do this in spades...
And Lose the condescending attitude, sweetheart... Not very nice

[been_waiting]

Oh lord. You are demonstrating the stupid attitude that I'm talking about in my post

[Byakuyarko]

try a longer reply... Refute the points I make if you want.

[been_waiting]

You started off saying "the way I keep out of the friend zone is..."
Well in my Take I'm trying to tell you that certain actions don't put you IN the friendzone nor take you out. All the friend zone is is nonreciprocated feelings (must I type it all twice?)
Then you go on to talk about how evil women are. Really? You do realize that that makes you a misogynist?
Also you said this: "women expect too many favours without reciprocating proportionately,"
What about guys who expect sex and love because they listened to a girl cry? Even though that's what friends are supposed to do?
Then you say this: "Contrary to what you believe, men do not use each other as emotional tampons. All the platonic (?) cuddling and spooning and soul-swapping that women like to engage with each other. Yeah... all that disgusting touching and feeling... It is unacceptable for you girls to behave that way with their guy friends."
That's what friendship IS to women. If you don't like it then don't

[been_waiting]

Befriend women. Its just that simple.

[been_waiting]

Then this: "Another unacceptable behaviour: cockblocking... If we are acceptable as your friends, there is no reason for you to deem us unworthy of your hotter and significantly more available female friends." Wtf hell? I've never heard of this happening? But you can talk to and fuck whatever woman consents. If you're letting another girl get in the way that's your fault

[Byakuyarko]

Type it as many times as you want... Your definition of friend zone is incomplete. And since you do not cite any of your sources for your definition, let me give you a cited definition. www.urbandictionary.com/define.php
I realise full well that I'm a misogynist. I am a misanthrope. I hate all of humanity. Am I supposed to be ashamed of it?
You conveniently left out the part about languishing in a maze of platonic tomfoolery. The only reason you women want to be friends with an interested guy whom you won't date, is simply because of the petty ego boost.
You women will avoid responsibility at all costs. You mean female friends never cockblock their guy friends when they try to score with their hotter friends? That's some legendary level of denial.

[been_waiting]

Yeah I'm ignoring you from now on. There's no point in arguing with you.

[Xonen]

LOL he cited urban dictionary... Take Owner, I'm on your side with this one but the cockblocking part is true to some degree. Sometimes when I'm just talking with a female friend i'll make some aimless comment like "wow, girl2 is so attractive... hadn't noticed before". If girl2 happens to be a close friend of hers, she gets sort of defensive and says things like "NO you can't have girl2". I hadn't really made much of it until I read this comment though so it's clearly not something major.

[Xonen]

OH but I'd like to add that they wholeheartedly endorse (or "ship" as they say) their friends who they aren't as close to.

[been_waiting]

@Xonen thank you! I mean seriously he can't say I need a source for the definition. The point of this post is to say that I disagree with the term "friend zone" and what it implies. He's clearly not the brightest crayon in the box 💁

[R3d_Anonymous]

lol, I know right. He cited URBAN DICTIONARY, like seriously. I am laughing out loud. What has this world come to?

[aficionado]

@been_waiting
It all boils down to this - Men would never want to be 'just friends' with women unless they're unavailable for a relationship (for whatever reason), Women, on the other hand, don't really mind being friends with men (irrespective of whether they're available or not). And due to this, we have all the 'friendzone' mayhem and chaos.
You drove home an excellent point when you mentioned that no one is obliged to remain in the friendzone, the same way no one is obliged to be romantically attracted to anyone else. Even after being friendzoned (which is the same as being rejected), most guys stick around and 'pretend' to be friends, hoping that the girl may change her mind, but that never happens. They're simply wasting their time. Instead, they could just tell her something like "I already have enough friends, so I'm not looking for any more. Thank you" and leave with their head held high.

[been_waiting]

I agree.

[Anonymous]

This MyTake is very awesome, but I especially love "If a chick says a guy is using her for sex, everyone and they mama wants to say that she's letting herself be used.
Well if a chick is "using" you for friendship then you are letting yourself be used. Walk away."

And the final comment is awesome... In real life, 90% of the guys don't mention either one of those points!

[been_waiting]

Thanks 😊

[kheserthorpe]

"guys on here say that their female FRIENDS are using them for "emotional intimacy."

Well look here son, that's what FRIENDS do!!!"

That's actually not a standard part of male-male relationships. It's only done in exceptional circumstances and if a guy was constantly moaning to his friends they'd stop being friends.

I am not suggesting that it means guys who do this are owed sex.

I am saying that what seems to be normal 'friend' behavior seems much more emotionally intimate (and often one way in terms of support) to inexperienced guys involved. And that's a source of their confusion.

[been_waiting]

Men are aware that women like to talk about their problems. If not they find out real quick once they befriend one. So... if you are friends with someone and you KNOW what they want out of the friendship (emotional intimacy) you can't turn around and complain about it- if you don't want the same thing then don't continue the friendship

[kheserthorpe]

I think the complaints usually come from very inexperienced guys. They've probably been told something like 'men and women are the same'.

[been_waiting]

Perhaps so

[mrf284212]

I'm a little confused how talking about ones problems is not a standard of any friendship, even male-male ones. Every conversation I have with both genders, they basically talk about the same stuff. Yes they might use different terminology or different expressions, but the content is the same. Some people are a little more emotional and some use more insults, but once you take out some of the less relevant parts of the conversation; it's the same stuff.

[front2back]

This take is going to be a painful truth for a lot of guys.

[been_waiting]

Hope so

[scrappygirl]

i actually have some guys in the friend zone. i dont want to date them but i like them enough to still be friends with them. i just will never see them romantically. i do admit that i probably have made them think we can have something more but its not my fauly. im just a very touchy feely person. im like that with girls and guys. i just love being flirty with both guys and girls. guys just think it means something more thats all. i made out with one of my girl firneds once when i was drunk and she didn't think it meant something more. if i did that with a guy though he thinks it does.

so i know its my fault that guys do end up thinking that but i do kind of like the attention. :) i dont accept gifts though.

[Bluemax]

"Guys (and some girls) are asking 'What can I do to get out of the Friendzone? How can I avoid being 'placed' in the Friendzone?'... fucking nothing."

Well, that's not true and you even went so far as to disprove your own answer. There is something you can do, as you quite correctly pointed out. You can walk away. You can also make your intentions clear from the start so as to avoid miscommunication.

Just as you said, been_waiting, that it doesn't make sense to allow yourself to get used, it also doesn't make sense to actually want to remain friends with someone you know who is hurting in your very presence. I don't know why people don't walk away from friendships that hurt, both rejector and rejectee alike.

[been_waiting]

Walking away isn't really avoiding the friend zone itself, its just avoiding the situation altogether.

Its like saying "there's a way to prevent food poisoning. Its called 'don't eat'"

I think you're looking for a problem with my take which is cool I guess 😏

I never said girls are justified in making a guy stay friends with them either. But as for WANTING to- I know a dude who's been through a lot and doesn't have many people in his life and he asked me out but I rejected him. I am keeping him as a friend because he's a good friend and because he deserves someone to be there for him. However, its on his terms. I told him he was not obligated to be my friend.

[Bluemax]

Walking away is my answer to "What can I do to get out of the Friendzone?" and it seems to be yours as well. It is a wise one. Making your intentions clear from the start is my answer to "How can I avoid being 'placed' in the Friendzone?"

"I think you're looking for a problem with my take which is cool I guess"
And you would be wrong to think so. I agree with most of what you said. I usually speak up at length about things I disagree with.

"I never said girls are justified in making a guy stay friends with them either"
Yes, I know you never said that. I'm simply adding my two cents to what you said. People can take it or leave it. I felt compelled to add it because this is something seldom discussed in the many friend zone questions, takes, and opinions. Perhaps in certain circumstances it's not appropriate to suggest the person remain friends...

[been_waiting]

Well, my take is mostly directed at the guys. They can make the decision to walk away even if the girl is asking for friendship but I agree it isn't brought up enough.

I'm glad we agree. Thanks for your comments.

[Bluemax]

"Its like saying 'there's a way to prevent food poisoning. Its called 'don't eat'"
No, it's not at all like saying that. It is PRECISELY like saying the way out of the friend zone is to walk away, and the way to avoid the friend zone is to be up front in the future.

[Bluemax]

By the way, I think it's altogether appropriate what you did with your friend.

[been_waiting]

I see what you're saying, but guys are trying to find little tips and tricks to avoid through friend zone and go straight to the "fuck and or date" zone and I'm trying to say that's not how that works.
But, again I understand what you're saying.

And good, I'm glad you see it that way.

[Bluemax]

Another GAGer put it in an interesting way. He said that guys finding ways out of the friend zone are like people who want the cheat codes to some game. I thought he was onto something there. Of course, there are no cheat codes to a person's heart, now are there?

[been_waiting]

Thank you. I'm gonna use that next time

[TheWiseOwl]

Oh the friend zone exists and it exists in the way men think it does to suggest otherwise is complete nonsense.

However I don't blame girls for the friend zone stuff, I blame the men who are too cowardly and too stupid to realise that its them and not the women that place themselves in this zone.

Guys who 'be friend' women under false pretenses or who get rejected by a girl and then proceed to linger around like a fart hoping she changes her mind deserve nothing.

Men can blame women for the friend zone all they like but it is the men who put themselves in the zone in the first place.

[Azara]

That all falls under the category of her not being into him. And there's no getting out of it.

If she liked him to begin with she'd say something even if he didn't make a move... You're having difficulty moving away from the idea that the friend zone is the problem of a man not properly taking control of the situation.

As apposed to a problrm if one person not being into the other.

And the way you explain it is no different than how misguided guys explain it. That they did ior didn't do something and they list there "in" and how to get it back. The situation is she's not intersted and its time to move on.

[TheWiseOwl]

The friend zone is where a guy who like a girl ends up when the girl isn't interested and in them and they refuse to see the wood from the trees and remove themselves from her presence. It's that simple.

The friend zone can only exist if the guy refuses to remove himself completely from the girl's presence.

I get rejected a lot and yet I have have never been friend zoned and why? I don't linger around her, I don't try and be her friend. I say hello to her and I then ignore her. If she tries starting a conversation with me, I'm aloof, cold and disinterested before shutting her down if she has removed herself from my presence. I send her the message of "fuck off and talk to someone else", it's a very clear message and each of those women have understood it in the layman terms. I agree with you that Men should accept defeat at the first hurdle, you're right and men who befriend a woman because they are too scared to face a straight off the cuff rejection need to grow some balls.

[Anonymous]

Interesting. It won't stop those questions though. XD

Tbf I think the line of thinking that a woman's affections can be created though compliments and actions comes from the idea that guys have to initiate things and they have to 'earn' women (tbf, plenty of women believe this is true). Then when guys encounter a girl they like but who doesn't like them, they feel like if they work hard enough, she'll 'have to like them'.

I think it would be better for everyone if we removed the stigma surrounding girls initiating things and the expectation of guys doing it.

[been_waiting]

Perhaps so.

[Anonymous]

@"Well look here son, that's what FRIENDS do!!!"

I was with you up until there, but that's where you're 100% wrong, and here's the problem with friendzone "friendships" and why they're hypocritical: With true friends this support aspect is bidirectional, you could rely every bit as much on the other person to be there for you as vice versa. With friendzone "friendships", forget about it being anything other than one-directional. If you're stuck in the friendzone, ask the female "friend" to help you move, or be there for you in a tough time, or to help fix your computer or car or whatever, and you'll soon know how much of a "friend" she is.

Ladies, stop pretending that most of you don't just use guys like this in one-directional setups, and do the right thing and don't maintain a 'friendship' just because you like the attention etc. and have someone to help you move or fix your car.

[HeartsBloodDupre]

But... If you honestly think she's being manipulative or isn't being fair, then WHY would you do things for her? Why not end the 'friendship'? Take some personal responsibility, and if you really don't want to do anything for her, then just simply DON'T!

[Opinion Owner]

It's both a user's responsibility not to use other people, and the responsibility of someone who is being used to assert themselves.

The reality is I won't put up with it now, but I used to in my younger days, I have zero time for friendzone "friendships", life's too short. But the vague promise and allure of a woman you have unrequited feelings for, particularly when she knows just when to dial up the flirtiness just enough to keep you interested and thinking there is something for you at the end of the line, is clearly difficult for many men, younger ones in particular, to resist.

[alenx619]

i think a guy gets friendzoned because they did not make moves when the girl was giving hints and the girl had decided she would not be making the first move I've friendzoned a lot and to get out of it it would take a really good excuse as to why you did not make any moves or the wrong moves when the boy or girl waved you in.

[been_waiting]

😒😒😒😒

[alenx619]

what is that u posted?

[been_waiting]

An emoji.

You missed the point of the take.

Have a nice day/night

[scrappygirl]

not really because I've had plenty of men make the moves but i just wasn't interested beyond friendship.

[James0]

Sums up the issue of friends zone nicely, now if only those guys can understand will be the answer

[Scrambled]

I sit on the throne of friendship zone and know this post is right. I have many female friends. I let go of the fact that I could have any of them in a romantic way but still loved their company. My FB is more women than men and I think I was the inadvertent catalyst to many relationships in my friendship group.

[existing_not_living]

The friend zone is such a stupid concept. So is "nice guys finish last."

[Scrambled]

Nice guys do finish last, that's a given.

[WpCurious]

That is not true @scrambled. Have you ever thought that maybe it's not the fact that you're a nice guy that girls don't want to date you, maybe it's something else. There could be loads of reasons why girls won't date a guy, but him being nice is definitely not one of them.

[Scrambled]

It's not even about relationships, it's business, play, life in general. Nice guys are impalas (type of African antelope that all the predators eat) in a world of lions.

[Scrambled]

Hey I see you from Namibia! So you know my impala analogy.

[Scrambled]

I'm South African... and girls there definitely don't go for nice guys. They go for what I call "aggressor males" and I don't blame them. In a godless country like sa, you need all the aggression one can get.

[existing_not_living]

Well, I'm from the US and my boyfriend is super nice and sweet. He's a total gentleman. He even texts me just to say hi because he misses me. He never pressures me to do anything I don't want to do either. He's a "nice guy," but he certainly did not finish last. @Scrambled

[Scrambled]

You from the US... not SA, different worlds.

[existing_not_living]

Well, that's why I added that I was from the US. To let you know that I don't live in your "world". It still applies though, that nice guys don't finish last. @Scrambled

[Scrambled]

Disagree... even green day said it, "nice guys finish last" lol had to throw an American in there

[Anonymous]

I've never understood why men don't use the so-called friendzone to their advantage to meet friends or friends of friends of the girl. Networking is half the battle of finding someone.

[M_A_X]

Are you kidding? Because EVERY man you've ever met has been guilty of liking the wrong girl before. You like a girl, but her friend likes you. You tell the first girl (you're the man which means you have to make the moves because chances are they won't, ever), ruining your chances with both of them. Once you've gone for one girl in a group of friends, you're pretty much barred from going after any of the others, by the group, or they'll see you as a bastard and then they'll spread that around, decreasing your chances further

[Opinion Owner]

Not necessarily. I think it depends on several factors. Most "friend zoned" guys pretend to be just friends first. Or perhaps he is just someone around the girl a lot, like a coworker or classmate. In that case, even if he expresses interest, she will be more than happy to introduce him to others if she thinks he's a decent person. If he tries to proposition her sexually without much prior interaction or gets too aggressive after her rejection, then no, she won't pass him along as a good candidate.

Doing cold approaches shouldn't get a guy in the friend zone. Just move on, in that case.

[Scrambled]

I had tons of chick friends, none went for me. In hindsight though... networking did help all my friends... I bought them into the network. All my friends are with the girls I liked.

[existing_not_living]

@M_A_X @Scrambled --- I met my current boyfriend through my best GIRL friend. She introduced us because she thought we were the perfect match. Anon is right. You are wrong.

[Scrambled]

I didn't say you were wrong. My networks helped many of my friends hook up. Not me though. Leveraging networks is even a pick up artists great weapon.

[Anonymous]

The point is known by everyone. People complain about it from emotional thinking over logical thinking. Some people may have needed to here this though, so well done.
Next time I'd advise a less hostile tone though.