So I have heard from the red pill community and from other men, the theories behind how and why women practice hypergamy. But I'm curious as to why/if men seek out hypogamous relationships?
Hypergamy: the action of marrying or forming a sexual relationship with a person of a superior sociological or educational background
Hypogamy: marriage into a lower caste, class, or social group
Updates
+1 y
I did not word my question very well. What I'm trying to ask is about whether there is an indirect selection occurring here. What I mean by that is when it comes to marriage, besides youth and beauty, are men more inclined to select a woman who is not as career oriented and as high status as them, because that could potentially impact some of the other qualities that they put more value on, such as a nurturing caretaker, homemaker, mother, etc.
I think the flaw in this question is outlined in the update... namely "are men more inclined to select a woman who is not as career oriented and as high a status as them." The error in logic here is in assuming that career makes status.
That's applying the standards a woman has for a man to a man's choice in woman. You could have no career and still be high status to a man, so men are arguably just as hypergamous as women, but we're not using the same criteria.
I served with a young lady who was injured in Iraq, years later when I saw her again she was a phenomenal stay at home mom whose child was far outpacing public or private school. Her third grader spoke 4 languages conversationally and was doing 7th grade math, her home was immaculate, she was active in the PTA as well as multiple local charities and the museum. She did all this while still fitting quite nicely in the clothes she wore when she served. She didn't have any career since she wasn't working, but I'd hardly say her husband "settled" in any way for her, and I don't know any man who would consider her "a lower caste, class, or social group" than her husband.
1
3 Reply
Asker
+1 y
Thank you so much for your insight. I've been off the market and married for years, so this is all unfamiliar to me. I'm just trying to understand out of curiosity, plus I think it makes for an interesting discussion. I'm sure my ignorance on the topic is abundantly clear. 𤣠But I appreciate you pointing out flaws without criticizing me. Honestly, I had a difficult time trying to figure out how to phrase my question and how to use some of these terms. It was not my intention to insinuate that men value career (I now realize that I did). More questioning if the things that they do value tend to coincide with that.
Absolutely! And thank YOU for the courtesy. So often (especially on social media) the slightest disagreement (or possible hint of something which one day may be fostered into a disagreement) leads to near world war three. Always seemed a bit excessive for my liking.
I'm not sure quite when/why/how society shifted. When I talk to old WWII vets, they never saw someone's defining characteristic (or worth) as their career. Not just the ones that served but their non-vet friends as well. "Ol' Jimmy's a good man. Always stands by his word. Martha over in Copperton, sweetest lady you'll ever meet and always has lemonade for a stranger. Bobby Norton is always one the community could count on to coordinate everybody to come together in a pinch."
Those were the sorts of comments that one would say to another to "sell" someone as a potential suitor. A great many relationships were initiated by someone vouching for someone else because of the personal interactions they had and the person's reputation. Never in any of those situations did what they do for a living come into play. Now certainly if someone was in a high earning profession that has always carried some weight because it's assumed if you marry the doctor you're not going to have problems with the home being foreclosed upon and there will regularly be food on the table. The same could be said about the foreman at the plant too, however, because there was secure pay coming in.
I've dated attorneys, doctors (MD and PhD), investment bankers, writers, cemetery managers, one lady owned a trucking company. None of that was of anything more than passing interest. I care WHO you are, I don't care WHAT you are. Have a weird day at work and want to talk about it? Sure go ahead. Do I inherently care that you have a conference next week, no... oh you'll be out of town... gotcha. That's relevant. Several of the people I've seriously dated didn't even know what I do for a living outside of "something for the government". It's boring. It's not really "soundbite compatible" and I'm actually way more interested to share that I found a great new cafe/wine shop/ critter on the way home than what I did in "the office."
Now, I take care of myself physically, am even-tempered and level-headed. Those aren't BECAUSE of my job, although I suspect my job has reinforced those, and would think once we get past the "do I have to worry about the house ever being repossessed" those are traits that higher caliber women value, but you can't really ask that as easily as "so how much money do you make?" (Usually, the time I ready myself to call it an early night).
I suppose I've rambled enough, and there's a rescue kitten who has been rubbing my face now for some time so I really ought go give her some attention. The best to you.
@BoobSlayer she tried stealing my coom jar but the motion sensor on my battery powered portable testicle cooler was triggered, and the 100 watt cooling fan activated which was noisy enough to wake me up.
Actually, now I do remember the Lord Bean2k21 posting about his slaves a few times. You must have a photographic memory. May his gospel live on forever! www.girlsaskguys.com/user/bean2k21/questions
They don't, a lot of women just don't comprehend that men dont generally classify women by how much money they make.
4
1 Reply
Asker
+1 y
I don't believe that they do. Well most of them. I'm asking simply out of curiosity because I see men on the red pill corner of the internet who take issue with women prioritizing careers and becoming high earners. I'm trying to understand how they factor that into their dating and if so, why?
Omfg!!! What was I thinking? This whole time I thought my husband wanted me to be a stay at home mother to raise my children! I somehow convinced myself that I wanted to be in their lives to!! I even thanked my husband (like an idiot) for picking up a second job so I could stay at home to help my son with his learning disability, when this whole time, I could have just worked to pay someone else to do it. My whole life is a lie. I only wish I had someone like you at the beginning of my life (yesterday) to warn me about this terrible mistake. I'm going to go cry myself to sleep now. Tomorrow I will tell my husband that I'm now an independent woman and dye my hair blue.
You SHOULD have your own separate money. Oh well. Guess weâll have to see how that shT goes. Iâm sorry you birthed a disabled son. Shouldâve stayed off the crack when pregnant
Why should I have my own separate money at the expense of my children's security, development, and happiness? Why would I do that when I don't have to? I would literally sacrifice my life for them without any hesitation if they needed it, so risking the possibility that I could be financially unstable in the future means actually nothing to me. I was working before and I will work after. I also have a degree. I'm not going to magically lose my ability to function as an adult if my marriage doesn't work out.
But what am I saying. I'm just silly victim of men. I have it wrong and you have it right. You are clearly a very happy, emotionally secure, independent woman who is exceedingly mature for her age. You are probably very educated and well off financially in your career. I have so much to learn from you.
I'll see you at the next feminist rally, mmkay? đ
Iâm not a feminist. My mother had me late at age 38. When she married my father she thought he was a good guy. She married him within a year of knowing him. Later in life as I grew up, Iâd say ages 10-18 is when the abuse of my father towards my mother began. He became an alcoholic & was always verbally abusive to my mother and us his 2 daughters. My father had 2 jobs due to not having a career or degree. Heâd yell/ shout at the top of his lungs. He developed OCD and would constantly punish us for the most insignificant of things. It became a never ending nightmare for all of us. And guess what? My mother, the broke housewife who didnât have her own money saved up⌠the one that wanted to be a stay at home mom. The one that didnât have any sort of savings or cash of her own at all. She had no choice but to stay with the abusive husband. Sheâs not even from this nation. So she truly had nowhere to run. My sister and I had to also tolerate the contrast yelling and drinking from Dad. The constant punishments. My Dad would make Mom cry almost every other day with the things heâd say to her. The tone of voice he used. The utter insane yelling. Later when I was 15, my sister and I would beg my Mom to divorce our Dad. Weâd beg her to DIVORCE HIM! And her response was always; âI donât have anywhere to goâ. Sheâs still with him to this day. Now at my age of 25 we have found out that he had given her HPV, Turns out he was always cheating on her as well, all throughout. Still⌠Mom had nowhere to go due to no money. And HPV could give you cancer. My sister and I developed trauma from this never ending abuse growing up. We developed anxiety. My sister started cutting, and I developed depression.
Yeah⌠Maybe I donât know anything. Iâm just a stupid feminist liberal. A stupid 25 year old. đ¤ˇđťââď¸ Maybe I should paint my hair weird colors just to show that Iâm against a woman not having her own and having some sort of independence, and saving of her own, for when God forbid a man abused the poor broke wife. Stay at home lazy wife. Iâm just one of these insane libtard, liberals, sjw, feminists, lgbt clowns 𤥠RIGHT?
@emyywolf more than half of humans are not as evil as that sick fuck. And those who are sick fucks, their children usually are as traumatized as you, whether they're boys or girls, and also their moms can be sick cunts, but not all men with sick moms become misogynist incels for life, it's unfuckable. Consider some psychedelics or some shit that helped others.. posting over and over the same misandry does not make progress.
@RoosterBreast What are you even talking about? đ¤đ¤đ¤ I donât understand. What misandry? What did I say that was so misandrist? Point to me where I said something misandrist? đ¤đ¤đ¤
@RoosterBreast He WAS a good strong role model. He had a good moral compass and was very strict. Teaching us right from wrong. But at the same time he was still an alcoholic who came from his 2 jobs frustrated and would take it out on all of us. When I graduated HS alongside my sister in 2016; he completely changed. He became good again. I don't know wtf happened to him. I donât know if he got an exorcism or some shit like that. However the damage is done. I will forever remember those screams. Forever remember the fear that took place when he returned home from work. Weâd all hide when he came home and my mom would have to make the house spotless because God forbid he found a stain.
USUALLY, STATISTICALLY men want a broke housewife for control. This has been studied time after time. I saw it myself. For utter control and manipulation. Itâs not me making it up off the top of my head. đ¤Śđťââď¸ Usually a man can get away with more bs when heâs the sole breadwinner in the home and the one who controls all finances. I still remember when my mom would take us to the supermarket or some bs like that as little girls. And sheâd literally have to call Dad to even buy icecream for us. Iâd NEVER want to have to put up with that shit, dare I choose to have a kid. I canât imagine me calling the atm to purchase something for my child. đ¤Śđťââď¸đ¤Śđťââď¸đ¤Śđťââď¸ I canât fucking fathom that. ShTs like prison.
âHey prison warden can I go outside to get some air?â Iâm just not f-king doing it. Itâs the same reason those self proclaimed PassPort-BRos go to poorer nations to seek women who financially need them. Itâs for complete control. They could get a woman whoâs well-off, whoâs rich, whoâs in his level. But thatâs TOO INTIMIDATING for those men, and usually they feel insecure. Basically they know that the woman can up and leave the moment he messes up and brings std to her. đ¤Ą
@roosterbreast Call it misandry all you want. Either way Iâm speaking facts. You not liking what I have to say isnât my problem at all. Some people can accept it for what it is and move along. Others take offense to it and b-ch and cry. đź
Biologically women SHOULD be housewifeâs, they SHOULD be stay at home mothers who nurture and raise the children well. We SHOULD BE. Women are the ones who naturally become disabled during pregnancy/ childbirth & after childbirth. We do need a protector and soldier to keep us safe. In our time of vulnerability. And as our young vulnerable child grows. A man that works and a wife that stays at home with the children is invaluable. However men today arenât trustworthy anymore. And thatâs if they ever were. With how men behave, and how untrustworthy you all are. Women are more and more turned off by this. And rather not become mothers at all. Youâre all corrupt. Itâs not misandry. Itâs reality for what it is.
And like I said; women canât sniff out every dog walking the streets to ensure heâs an Angel form the the Heavens. Weâre not magicians or have mind-reading abilities. Like I said; my own mother thought she picked out a good nerdy guy. The good nerdy guy changed years later when I was 10 and we lived through hell for the next decade!
Sarcasm aside Emyy, I am genuinely sorry that you had to grow up like that. No one in the world deserves that trauma. And I can actually relate to where you are coming from. My dad also cheated on my mother constantly and he also gave my mom HPV. But instead of my mother being forced to stay married to my POS dad, he just up and left, abandoning us with nothing and no money. We lost our car, we lost our apartment, and we relied on handouts from family and charity to help us eat. So, I do feel for you and I actually do understand your point. Like you, I learned it the hard way. But I chose a better partner than my mother and I know with every ounce of my being that even if he wanted to divorce me, he would never leave me and my children out on the streets. Not everyone is that lucky, and I acknowledge that, but there ARE men out there that are like that. Of course, I still recognize that I have put myself in a vulnerable position, and I have my own trauma to remind me of that. But that is also why I got my degree. I finished that while being a stay at home mother. I have networked, and I have planned, and I have worked on my professional skills all since being at home. That's the best I can do to prepare for the worst, while still being at home with my kids who NEED me.
I just wished we could have had a productive conversation about that, because there are women out there that do need that warning.
Tbh, I'm glad you're not a crazy feminist. 𤣠I do think you are smart and capable, and you can call me an idiot, a clown, tell me it's my fault I will have homeless disabled crack babies, or whatever that you feel you need to do, but I'm going to wish the best for you. You deserve better than what you have experienced, and I mean that.
@roosterbreast My sister for example; she chose to get pregnant with a guy who doesnât have a career or degree. My sister herself has no career or degree. Heâs gonna have to get 2 jobs. Sheâs due this July. Sheâs about to put her child through the same BS we went through growing up. And again; this guy sheâs with looks like the nice sweet simpy nerd. The so-called Good Guy. Mr. Nice Guy. đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸ Guess weâll have to see how that shT goes. I tell her what could happen seeing what happened with Mom. But oh well. She doesnât listen. đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸đ¤ˇđťââď¸ Iâm not about to get an ATM husband who can tell me yes or no if I want to purchase something. Iâm not doing it. And if I EVER have a child, Iâm gonna make sure I have savings and Iâd rent out apartments to people to ensure I can GET OUT if I have to. đ
Ok here is my confession. What you're both saying is my mom's story. Grandpa left her, her younger sister, and her mom alone... for a hottie, then when that other woman divorce raped him he returned, or at least wanted to, and they never forgave him. So my mom got daddy issues and married someone she knew was an asshole, lazy sloth, stole alcohol to visit a prostitute with it as a teen, but wore this on his ego: Would you date a masculine guy who has Proverbs 13:24 on his profile? â
And lots of shit I better not talk about.
So did i go through what i better bot talk about, and it's in no way less fucked up than your stories.
But I know that humans can be better, I know that most are better, at least in the area I'm living in now.
Not all men seek to have total control, those are either mentally fucked or they're mentally fucked in a different way, and don't trust you because you don't trust them.
To me these hierarchies don't even exist. As @PraviteliNahuiValite said, in his opinion here:
Oh, paycheck? That's what you humans call that thing that magically appears in your bank account every once in a while, right? Me no have that problem, me just fuck whoever, whenever, wherever! Me no need no stinking paycheck! Me just need my trusty dick and a willing partner! Me don't care if you broke, busted, or disgusted, as long as you down to get pounded like a cheap steak! Me no judge, me just fuck! So let's forget about money and start talking about the real currency of life: orgasms! Me no care if @undisciplined_slave is rich or poor, me would fuck her in a mansion or a dumpster, as long as we both cum hard! Ha ha ha!
@emyywolf have you noticed how we both have daddy issues and went balls deep into loominati tranny conspiracy theories? People who don't have daddy issues aren't as good with conspiracy theories.
In the past I messaged you something about asymmetries but you didn't make it clear whether you confirm it to be exactly true for you @emyywolf or not. Do you struggle with asymmetries?
My pink account kinda explained a bit here but the question will vanish in 12 hours so save it if you find it useful:
Rooster, thank you for sharing. I'm sorry that you had to go through something similar. It's terrible and it does unfortunately happen. But I am happy to see you maintain a positive outlook on things. As far as the rest of your post, 𤣠I don't really have a take. But all the same, I wish you the best as well. Thanks for chiming in. âşď¸
Look, all Iâm saying is that. If youâre gonna be a stay at home mother. Make sure you have some sort of generational wealth passed down to you from family saved somewhere. Make sure you have some money buried somewhere. And Iâm talking about a GOOD AMOUNT. Iâm talking about at the very least 50K. đś Make sure you have your own car that you own, and is under your name 𫵠You never know if your husband changes. Like I said; my Dad came home from work frustrated and would take it out on us. You need to know your way with firearms too.
@roosterbreast I donât have Daddy Issues. Just because my Dad was an a-hole growing up DOES NOT = Daddy Issues. Daddy Issues is when your father abandons you and leaves you without that father figure. Iâm thankful my Dad was in my life & sometimes Iâm not because he was a jerk. But he did teach me many things I wouldnât otherwise know today. If he left us and completely disappeared, THEN MAYBE I wouldâve became the crazy blue-haired feminist snowflake. You donât even know the definition of these words. So maybe donât use them and make yourself look stupid. You sound like the average undesirable man whoâs salty that women donât give it to him. Itâs why you side with these passport bros, you side with the RedPill propaganda, you side with these so-called alpha dogs. You side with FRESH&Fit. And I always hear you talking about women being sâts when they have body count of 7, because you yourselfs canât even get there. 𤥠Itâs the same reason youâre seeking for a poor/ broke/ naive housewife, tradwife who doesnât know any better. And you always get pissed when I call you out.
So yeah. Keep talking to me like Iâm stupid and Iâm gonna keep talking to you like youâre stupid. đ By the way Fresh&Fit were exposed for being gay. Yes the two main misogynist that shit-talk women day in and day out. Yes the some ones you praise. Yes those were exposed for sucking WHITE đ. https://youtu.be/tT_c_9WqUNs
@emyywolf ok, I stopped reading when you said that I side with the misogynist shit.
I clearly stated in this very thread, and all other threads of yours that I joined, that if anything then i have more daddy issues than mommy issues, and no, it's up to me how i choose to define it, all words are made up by humans at the end of day, so I have daddy issues because I'm paranoid about men trying to harm me, and that's how I define it.
And you describe very well what these hateful misogynist pigs are, which is why I follow you.
When it comes to getting laid, I literally can not walk through a school hallway without a bunch of women whom I don't know cat calling me, but from my upbringing I suddenly can't get rid of the idea that "sex is a waste of time". And as a result I walk through hallways with a raging hard-on, but reject absolutely everyone no matter what.
I built myself a battery powered testicle cooler, or should I say freezer, that fluctuates on a relay on and off to get the testes cold and let them heat back up again, like a contrast shower or switching between a cold plunge and sauna, except for the testes. I'm experimenting what it's going to do to the reproductive system and testosterone levels as I've not found any published research of this type, whether it's good or harmful, I won't be surprised if I become infertile from this, but I will run the test for the benefit of all the other fitness freaks interested in it who think it's too risky to lose fertility.
Because they didn't grow up with parents that hated each other since before you're even born. I did, and they talked about divorce before I was born but were stuck because they believed a divorce will make them burn in hell. So then my mommy is the type that kept trying to make me pray for forgiveness for having wet dreams, as she saw cumstains on my underwear, even when I was in high school. And that disgusted me so much that in high school was exactly the reason why I quit being religious, it felt too threatening, all too retarded. Soon I found what holistic healers teach about spirituality.
But at the end, I try not to project all these things on women and men. I know I have got lots of unfucking of my mind to do. To a degree it's unavoidable, as you said "the damage has been done" and I've got a bag full of 5MEODMT right here on the table which is legal in Canada, I'm going to keep unfucking myself, day after day, and maybe eventually I will not have any more temptations to assume shitty things about strangers.
I already more than halfway unfucked my body. Which I described in the pink opinion from my alt account named "purring vibrator", which I linked in that guy's "how do I look" question. Most people with this shit, i mean similar shit because no one has exactly that. Most people never find a solution and i found it, and i suspected you have something similar based on the facial asymmetry on your facebook photo.
The majority of women in a good/well established career have one or more of these traits that are seen as bad by most men:
Past 30, values money more than people close to her and will break plans with people if it is profitable financially to her or for her career advancement, looks down on people that make less than her (talks badly about them behind their back, including her own friends and family members), is never satisfied and repeatedly nags the man to make more money/advance in career even if he is happy with his current work, may have large student loan debt that she expects the man to partially or fully pay for, even if she is working.
Men often value different things in a partner, such as being trustworthy, affectionate, available (not using all of her time and energy for work so she puts in very little effort into the relationship), and they don't want a woman that is stressed out from work because she will often bring it home and take it out on him, and most men want a woman that shares an interest in a couple of his hobbies so they can enjoy them together.
1
1 Reply
Asker
+1 y
Thank you for your input. This was one of the things that I have heard from men that I was trying to better understand. Appreciate it.
Because men care about having a life partner of inner value. We're used to making money and having to map out life, so we're not really interested in a woman's financial value, and aren't interested in women who think of human beings in terms of financial value either. Women should try it. There are tons more to a man than just whatever he makes or has. Any woman who wants a man based on only what he makes or can provide has shown me she doesn't really value him on the inside.
1
1 Reply
Asker
+1 y
Great advice and I agree. There are so many valuable qualities that a man can have that I would argue are exceedingly more important than his SES.
1. it is the natural outcome of single female hypergamy and a corresponding reduction of options for single men. That is, if they are nearly all "punching up", men as a result end up "punching down". (Punch is probably a poor choice of words, but you get the idea).
2. Many men are more than happy to have a lady of a lower socioeconomic situation, as long as she is kind. Kindness goes a long way.
3. To a lesser extent, men are more than happy to have a lady of a lower socioeconomic situation, if she is stunning. But stunning only lasts so long and we all get old.
1
1 Reply
Asker
+1 y
That makes sense to me. Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this. âşď¸
It's a well studied and accepted fact that women seek a man who either makes good money, or has the qualities that mean he is likely to make good money in the future. That means a man who is wealthy and/or has high a paying job and/or is well educated and/or has high social status. All those things are attractive to women. But not to men
Men seek women who are attractive and youthful and have the qualities that will make them good nurturers and mothers. Men don't want providers and protectors like women do.
These male and female mating behaviors are genetically coded in our DNA and are the result of millions of years of natural selection. They won't change just because of societal evolution or technological advancements.
Men don't seek hypogamous relationships. They seek good women who will make good wives and mothers to their children, just like all their male ancestors did. Everything men find attractive in women comes down to that.
4
4 Reply
Asker
+1 y
I agree with you and I see now that I should have been more clear with my question. What I mean to ask is not if men value status and career, but if they value/seek a lack of one because a high status woman who is career oriented may not be as available or interested in being a homemaker, nurturer, stay at home mother, or other qualities that they may be looking for when they want to settle down.
Yes, to varying degrees. It depends on the man and his priorities. If he's a family oriented man looking for a life partner to start a family with, then yes, he is most likely to intentionally avoid ambitious career oriented women because those women's priorities are not consistent with his.
There are men who don't want kids, or think they don't, and those guys tend to be a little more accepting of career women. But they will likely still value the feminine qualities that make a woman a good mother. Ambitious career women often lack those qualities in their personality makeup, or they don't value them in themselves so they've never tried to develop those components of their personality. And that makes them unattractive to most men.
There is an enduring myth that men are intimidated by "strong women" and "successful women". They're not intimidated by them, they just aren't attracted to them because they lack the feminine qualities that men naturally find attractive in women and/or their priorities are inconsistent with men's.
Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts on this. Funny that you brought up intimidation because I was also curious about that as well! Makes sense to me. Thank you.
I grew up in a wealthy family and always dated girls from the same "social class." I mean there was no way my family would have accepted otherwise. When I left home and was exposed to girls from less affluent backgrounds I loved it. There seemed to be a major difference with them. They were more appreciative of the little things, more "earthy," less demanding of material things (or maybe it was just that the material things they wanted seemed less challenging to provide), less spoiled, easier to make happy, had better senses of humor, were more "real" and honest. That was my impression. Since then I have really had no interest in the type of woman I dated in my youth. Once you go hypogamous you never go back (or something like that!).
Thanks for sharing. It is really interesting to hear about your experience. I have heard some men talk about differences in personality traits when it comes to the woman's status and background, but it's not something I have experience with, so, I'm intrigued by your perspective. Do you find that these 'appreciative,' 'earthy,' and 'honest' qualities fade with time, once a woman has been brought up into wealth (through dating or marriage), and gets more accustomed to a upper class lifestyle?
What a great question. In general no. I think many of the traits you have that develop in your youth as a function of the way you are raised stay with you. There is a certain depth that comes with having the kind of challenges in life that people from the "lower social strata" (I kind of hate that term) experience that shapes them for life.
Of course all of this is a generalization. I cannot say that some of the wealthy people I have known did not have extraordinary depth too. But narrowly focusing on just the romantic part of the relationships I have had with women who came from less than affluent families, there is a certain kind of flavor to it... call it umami... that makes a dynamic I find very attractive.
it's not because men actually care about a woman's height or her money or fame, it's because women care about a man's height, money and fame so he would likely have better chances of success with women who are below in height, money and fame because those women would be looking for men who are above them in height, money and fame
aww, i was interpreted hypo-gamy as marriage-less like hypotherm+monogamy!! but that is not what you meant so i think men prefer/SEEK hypogomy, mine to delay commitment. they do NOT seek hypogamy yours, but the hypergamy girls find them, and in that same itbis his hypo, and men just "go with it". but not seek.
Wait, that's confusing. Is that not an American definition of 'class' ie based on socioeconomic status rather than 'breeding', cultural cultivation, moral and spiritual development etc.
I think men who respect themselves keep high standards. But it is true to say that men appreciate different things to women. But I certainly wouldn't marry some bimbo just because she's young and attractive. Like she needs to be a decent person with some sense of inner cultivation.
1
3 Reply
Asker
+1 y
Thanks for your thoughts on this. I'm curious. Hypothetically, if you had two 24 year old women, both are beautiful and equally appealing to you. The only difference is that one is a lawyer and one is a receptionist. Which one would you choose to marry (if you had to) and why? Based on your background, where you are at in life, and your future goals.
Well, a lawyer just isn't appealing to me. It has certain connotations, like, the women seem to be hard head, materialistic and demanding in a partner. I like nurturing and soft women. Does their work take over their life? Again, a career can be distracting from a woman's nurturing and spiritual qualities. Receptionist has certain connotations, also. I have a good friend who works in a supermarket and I respect her tremendously.
So really, there's too many variables to give a straight answer there. So again, all I can see is that I'm not automatically awed or impressed by a lawyer. Nor a doctor. There seems to be a lot of career women left on the shelf on dating websites, not to be horrible. Just an observation.
Interesting! Yeah, there are definitely a lot of factors at play here which is why I thought it might make for an interesting discussion. I do appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts on this. Thank you
Men in general don't care about her social status (rich/poor family). They look for other qualities, maybe, you could make the presupposition that women with a higher social status are more career oriented instead of becomming a house wife (-material) but I wouldn't go that far
I think because of hypergamy men are hypogamous. I think a lot of men would pursue women with a higher social status if we believed they would give us their attention but women who are more career oriented tend to be perceived with more âmasculineâ traits.
1
2 Reply
Asker
+1 y
Interesting. I have heard men say that. Is it the focus on career itself that is perceived as a masculine trait? Or some other personality trait (s) that tend to go with that?
If I had to guess Iâd say personality traits. I think people who are high achieving tend to be more disagreeable which can be seen as combative when itâs coming from women. I think women tend to like disagreeableness more in men than men like it in women.
Wow I didn't thought about it but maybe you are right... I mean, a man will be in love with whoever he will fall in love, we are like that, but its also true that a man feel more manly if he is a provider and a good form of being that is being with a low class woman... Interesting...
1
1 Reply
Asker
+1 y
It is interesting to think about (I think), because their seems to be different qualities that men value that are indirectly associated with the woman's status or economic position. And yes, it hasn't really been mentioned on here but I think that being a provider and protector is a quality that a lot of men value in themselves and I am curious as to how/if that is affected by the status, independence, or economic achievements of the woman. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Lol, every man I dated was below my station according to wealth.
But also they were just white men with yellow fever or only into me because I was bi.
Most of the kind of men who "purposefully date down" do it because they fetishize power difference, but don't consciously realize it.
It's why I no longer date cishet white men. They're statistically a poor match for me. Also I have stronger romantic pull towards women.
1
0 Reply
Anonymous
(36-45)
+1 y
What matters to men for marriage is if she's wife material, if she's never been a slut, if she has morals and values and doesn't fuck just to get herself off. No guy worth anything is going to commit to some wh0re that's given her pussy to friends with benefits and fuckboys.
Your problem, like most women today, is that you think the things women value in men are the same things men value in women. Nothing could be further from the truth.
It's sad that modern women have lost sight of what makes them valuable to men.
1
5 Reply
Asker
+1 y
I don't believe that at all. The question was "why/if?' Not my beliefs one way or there other.
Your question was based on the false assumption that men who don't marrying women of a higher caste, class or social group are hypogamous. But that only holds true for women, because those things are only valuable to women in a mate.
If a man marries a woman of a higher caste, class or social group who doesn't offer him any value as a woman, THAT is hypogamous.
It's all about the value men and women bring to each other, and your questions clearly shows you don't understand what men value in women.
Then help me understand. I'm genuinely asking out of curiosity. Not trying to insinuate anything or push any narrative. To me, men value youth, beauty, fertility, care taking/nurturing abilities, compassion, homemaking, etc.
I'm not a man, so you tell me?
Also, maybe it's just on the red pill side of the internet, but I see men talk negatively about women who are high earners or at least prioritize careers. Men may not seek low earners, but do you believe some men avoid high earners?
Your list of the things men value in women is pretty accurate.
And you're also correct that most men are not interested in high earning or career driven women. Think about it... if men value women who value family, nurturing qualities and homemaking, why would they want an ambitious career woman who tend to make poor mothers and would rather pay other people to raise her children for her? The two things are irreconcilable?
You can call it red pill or misogyny or whatever you want, but it is the natural thing for men to desire in a mate. It will always be so. Modern women are a compromise to men at best.
𤣠I don't think the term 'misogyny' has ever even been in my vocabulary. The truth is, I have no skin in this game. I'm a stay at home mother of 3. I became a homemaker after I married my husband (8 years older) when I was 20 years old. He picked me up as a barista, he was a fire fighter paramedic. We have been married now for almost 13 years. I live a pretty traditional life, so being called a modern women is a first for me but I understand. Lol
So yes, what you said makes perfect sense to me, and I guess gets down to the heart of what I was (unsuccessfully) trying to ask. I think we agree on what men value in relationships, and that some of those qualities might be negatively impacted when a woman is career focused or high earning, such as availability for motherhood and possibly their quality of mothering abilities. So, if, hypothetically, the qualities that men value are impacted by the woman's status, when it comes to marriage (not sex), do they consider dating down?
I've also seen red pill guys describe high earning modern women to be more "masculine" "aggressive" "argumentative" etc. I have no idea about that but if a man believes that, would it be another incentive for him to select a woman of a "lower" status?
I am very far removed from the modern dating scene so again, I'm just curious and trying to understand. I've also had a half a bottle of wine, so I hope I'm making sense.
It seems to me to be a case of beggars can't be choosy. So we sometimes take what we can get.
I sometimes took it as a probability about being out of leagues in the past for really nonsensical arguments or excuses and stopped believing in it way too late.
Not being hypergamous does not make someone hypogamous. I think men just don't look for the same things women look for in a partner, but that's not hypogamy. It's a misuse of the term.
1
2 Reply
Asker
+1 y
I understand that and I actually agree with you. Men value different things than women do. They also value many different qualities. As do women, who may make their primary selection based on hypergamy, but who are also looking for other qualities in a good husband. What I'm trying to ask is about whether their is indirect selection occurring here. What I mean by that is when it comes to marriage, besides youth and beauty, are men more inclined to select a woman who is not as career oriented and as high status as them, because that could potentially impact some of the other qualities that they put more value on, such as a nurturing caretaker, homemaker, mother, etc.
It's not that men seek hypogamy out, it's just what happens because those are the options available to them.
1
0 Reply
Anonymous
(30-35)
+1 y
Iâd rather date someone who isnât as successful as I am. When women make more than their partners the likelihood of divorce increases dramatically. Also if sheâs that career oriented how would we ever have time to spend together.
Girl's Behavior 
Guy's Behavior 
Flirting 
Dating 
Relationships 
Fashion & Beauty 
Health & Fitness 
Marriage & Weddings 
Shopping & Gifts 
Technology & Internet 
Break Up & Divorce 
Education & Career 
Entertainment & Arts 
Family & Friends 
Food & Beverage 
Hobbies & Leisure 
Other 
Religion & Spirituality 
Society & Politics 
Sports 
Travel 
Trending & News 
Most Helpful Opinions