Totally agree with this post! White females and wealthy white males are the most priviledged group in society. Many white guys are very disadvantaged on the sexual market as well as the economic market (there are more women attending university than men) Also to, along with Oriental woman getting plastic surgery for rounder eyes, black girls wanting straight hair, a lot of white girls want to dress getto, white guys emulate black music and envy the masculinity of black guys ( swagger and sex appeal).
Their is no such thing as white privilege, not one law, not one grant, scholarship, is dedicated to white people but their are for minorities in the US despite it being 63% white. Their is no evidence of any kind of white privilege, its just something that racist people with rampant victim complexes come up with to make themselves feel better about their own failings (That's why the top highest earners in the US are from asia (indian Filipino etc.) because they focus on being successful and earning what they get not on finding ways to force others to give them what they want instead of working for it).
Of course it exists. And laws were dedicated to "White" people a few decades ago. I can list them. Did you know that American Indians did not even have the right to speak their own language until the 1970s?
But when we talk about privilege, we are talking social norms anyway. The funny thing is that this has nothing to do with people's failings as you obviously did not read the take. You just seem to follow the same script most of the anti-PC crowd follows.
This guy is not complaining that he did not succeed. I would venture a guess that he is even more successful than you or the average anti-PC ranter. But he can't even go out in public without being harassed because he isn't "White". The weird thing is that the anti-PC crowd agrees with treating him this way while simultaneously denying "White" privilege.
It starts looong before college, hon. You know those anti-segregation laws that enforce equal education for all? When I was a child in the 90's, we had to be bused an hour and a half each way every day to go to a white school. Why? the segregation laws weren't working, and all of the education money was being funneled to the white schools. The education provided to lack children was extremely inadequate.
Now, tell me how many white children go to run down schools that cannot even afford books or the bare minimum needed to provide a decent education to their children? I'd be hard pressed to find any.
Also, black people aren't getting ahead with those items provided. They are trying to catch up to what you had a chance at already. I read a research paper that showed that it takes families about 7 generations to go from rich to poor or vice versa. Blacks have not had 7 generation to recover from slavery or Jim Crow laws. Many whites have had endless generations to improve their lot.
Name me one law to date that creates discrimination that was not put in place to appease people like yourself? Just one? You can't. Not to long ago their was discrimination against the Irish too, and Italians. Do they get to have special privileges as well or do they not have the right skin tone for it? Their is no discrimination to day in our society that is measurable in any meaningful way. The black community is riddled with crime and poverty which is entirely the fault of the black community. Those barred windows are not their to keep the white people out and we both know it, its because blacks are more likely to commit crimes by an insane margin. We also know that has nothing to do with poverty because while poverty increase crime rates, the increase is not nearly enough to explain the black communities rampant crime, but fatherlessness does explain it. Your community has done nothing but wallow in self pity, blame every one else for your own actions then demands special treatment
African Immigrants do better then white native born and white immigrants, so we know for a fact that their is no racial discrimination that is baring any minority in this nation and that has been proved time and time again. As I have already pointed out its minorities who are in the top earning groups NOT whites. You just need that as an excuse to explain why you have failed (hint, you never tried). We have been through this before if you recall, it ended with you ranting and spewing racist statements at me, you where wrong then you are wrong now. https://youtu.be/SzHd5bmEdU4 https://youtu.be/Bc_gy0b4UM8 https://youtu.be/Tb2iFikOwYU
@wolfcat87 How many white children go to run down schools? Are you kidding me? Their are more poor whites in this nation then all other poor minorities COMBINED. So that's an absurd claim to make. In fact black women are more likely to go to college then the "evil racist" white men. In fact lets ask our selves how many white only scholarships are their? None. How many minority only scholarships are their? Countless. How many white only grants are their? None. How many minority only grants are their? Countless. Then you have the fact that schools discriminate against whites as when one enrolls in a college or university whites get the equivalent of -180 points on their SAT scores when it pertains to acceptance, blacks get a +200. Then you have the free lunch programs, free transportation etc. for predominantly black students. Do you think white people get any of that? Of course not because while whites pay the most in taxes they don't get any special programs to help them.
@wolfcat87 I appreciate you telling me how easy I have it because of my skin color by the way, no really that's not racist in the slightest (it is). You don't need seven generations, that's idiotic, most of the wealthy people in our nation started out blue collar then became million to billionaires. Also I'm the first person in my family to graduate highschool in about three generations. Also I was born in spring field Illinois, wich is run down and filled with poor white people. Oh yeah, sorry we can't call ourselves poor because that would detract from your pity party. I was handed nothing (well except having to deal with people like you who blatently make racist claims and try to tell me how easy my life was despite the fact that I am poor, was born into an even poorer family and not one god damn person in this nation could possible give half of a fuck that whites are also suffering from poverty.
@wolfcat87 What did you think the magical white fairy comes to white people and puts $100 dollar bills under the pillow every night? Or did you just think we receive checks from the government every month simply because we are white? Where the hell do you think money comes from? Have you never been to a rural area in your life? How about Appalachia which is nothing but poor white people (most from the loss of the mines, yeah severly grueling dangerous labor they did that to feed their family and the pay was crap but now even that's gone) with poor schools. Hell in places like England its WHITES who are falling behind because of the rampant pity party many minorities throw every time they are not handed what ever crap they want this time. The irony is minorities are dominating, black women are the second most likely to go to college of ALL groups only behind white women (who make up far more of the population). But some how your still discriminated against?
You're barking up the wrong tree. I'm not white or black, but I've been raised with families of both colors. Nothing i say will be as biased as what a white or black person may say. I'm as neutral as can be.
It does not matter is there's no law about it now. When people put it into practice, then it becomes just as bad. When two criminals, white and black, go to court for the exact same crime, then statistically the black person will get the longer sentence. If that isn't as legal as it can get while still not putting things into law, then you're really turning a blind eye. A black teen committed suicide after he was arrested on suspicion of stealing a backpack, he was thrown into Riker's prison (one of the worst prisons in the country) and locked into solitary confinement for 2 years!!! He was never even given a trial. Now, tell me how many white people this happens to? His mental health had been demolished by the experience.
Even Native Americans and Mexicans have similar issues.
Even dark Mexicans and Native Americans face similar issues. There is a reservation school in my state that is about to be sued. they placed a majority of white teachers and administration on the reservation. That is not the issue. The issue is they started punishing kids for no reason. One white student was putting her hair in a pony tail and lost control of her hair band. It shot across the room and landed at the feet of a native student. The student bent to pick it up to return it, and the teacher had them suspended for assault with a deadly weapon... That's just one in a long list of the things that darker children go through.
That does not include what our parents and grandparents went through and are still recovering from. Blacks and other dark minorities have compounded issues over generations. No matter how hard they work, these issues cannot be overcome by one generation of hard work that way it can be in any white family. These aren't self imposed conditions for generations
The poor white neighborhoods are often like classy motels compared to poor black neighborhoods. How many have you visited or lived in? I welcome you to my state to peruse the poor white areas. No one really struggles here unless they decide to. The poor white schools are fully supplied and fully staffed. Hmmm...
I do agree that the black community has its faults. Every community does. The problem lies in people of pother colors assuming all black people are bad because some black people have faults. The white communities have major meth and drug problems, but I don't assume every white person is a violent meth head. I don't refuse jobs, housing, friendship, etc to all whites, because some whites have issues. That is the difference. How often do you see anyone online say, "No whites, I choose not to associate with whites?" I see it all the time in reference to blacks. How often do you hear whites being called cockroaches? I hear it about Mexicans. They can make 90k and be refused homes.
Hmmm... You like to overlook things quite a bit. My state is 95% white. Any citizen of my state gets a free ride to college. Yet, most black people, due to every generation before mine being held back economically, cannot afford to relocate to a state where they get a free ride. So, again, there's no white only on paper. The system made it available to whites only and only people who are economically capable of getting here. No one outside of any white family has prevented whites from coming to my state to get a free education.
The Irish migration was in the mid 1800's. That was a good 170 years ago. Jim Crow was 50 years ago. Anti-Italian sentiment was also concentrated around that time. Can you not do the math to compute who has had more time to recover? Get back to me in about 120 years about whether or not blacks have recovered financially and socially...
My community? Nah, every community is my community. There are millions of hard working black people.
The lack of fathers has a lot to do with what the WHITE government dictated about family aide in the mid 1900's. Oh, you don't know about that? Let me help you. Blacks were not allowed to have good jobs. They could work from sun up till sun down, and they would not have enough to provide for their children. In order to receive welfare at its start, you had to be a single mother with children. You could not have a father for your children. So, women had to choose their man or choose their children. Most chose to be able to feed their children. Their aide would be revoked if they were caught with a man. This created a whole generation of fatherless black children. All of these children raised with no father no longer knew what a father should be much less how to choose one or how to be one their selves. That is how the black community became fatherless.
On top of that is the aforementioned excessive sentencing that had been admitted to by review boards across the country where blacks were given longer sentences than comparable whites. Even if a man wanted to be a father, those excessive sentences would cut him out automatically. Very gradually the black community is recovering from all of this, but the fact that you don't bother to learn the history and then begrudge people their right to recover and to get help to recover from something that was forced onto them for hundreds of years is beyond me. If you work sun up to sundown, do you expect to be able to feed your children? I see a lot of Mexicans working just as hard as the blacks and still being put down economically. Like I said, I've seen Mexicans who made 90k be turned down by a white person for a rental, because the person assumed bad things based on how dark them are. They fit with the Native American plight, because darker Mexicans are just mixed Native Americans.
Also, white ethnicities do have scholarships for their heritages... www.scholarships.com/.../irish Funny how that works. Irish and Italian are both there.
Immigrants in general do better... They have not had the same issues that U. S. minorities have had. It's incomparable.
My 95 % white state has free lunch programs and free transportation to schools... I've been to 41 states, and all of them had it. I honestly don't know where you live that does not have it...
Again, the score adjustment is due to the fact that blacks do not get the same quality of schools as white kids do. If you can make it through schools that do not have books or computers, had the worst staff to student ratio, no tutoring or intervention programs, and score nearly as high as someone who did, you are very likely a genius.
Don't put words in my mouth. Try settling down and listening instead of crying about yourself. Did anyone enslave or create laws to keep your ancestors from being able to work hard to get ahead in life? Have you been turned down for jobs, housing, friendships, etc for being white? Have you been punished at school or in court excessively for being white? Is anything in life stopping you but you? No.
No one said whites have it easy. The only statement being made is that your life is not being made harder for being white. Your skin color is not against you from birth. I'm not sure if you can comprehend the difference between that and what you want to think people are saying white privilege is. My white relatives have been doing great for generations. Never once have they had any issue because of their skin, and they thrive because of that. My black relatives have jumped ahead since Jim Crow was removed, but healing and success take time. All barriers based on color need to be removed.
Illinois, huh. I'm just seeing that. I've avoided anything near Chicago. lol. It's a cesspool. My ex has been buying up property in Chicago though.
Again, no one said whites cannot be poor. That has never been stated. anything you derive like that is clearly in your own head, and it shows a distinct lack of understanding of the differences between your struggles and those of others. Just because you struggle does not mean other people do not struggle more. A Muslim girl comes to the U. S., has had her vagina cut off without anesthesia due to her culture, is punished in the head by a white man in a hospital, is spit on by strangers in public, struggles with her family at home, is bullied and attacked at school. Does her misery detract from yours? Do her struggles based on her heritage when she gets here mean that you don't have struggles unrelated to your heritage? Is it racist to say you have different struggles? No. It's fact.
I'm not going to speak on England, because this conversation is strictly about the U. S. Other countries have entirely different issues. My sister in law's dad was a miner. My best friend was from Arkansas. Neither of them had the struggles that black people did even though they were poor. It's incomparable. No one showed up to lynch, beat, or rape them in the night. If a crime was committed, they were able to report it to the police. In a black neighborhood, it can take police up to 3 hours to arrive after a call. The police station only being 2 blocks away... Just completely incomparable.
Look at the numbers for those stats. I actually had this discussion on another of Roland's posts. Without combing through his posts to find it.. The summary was that the title of the article that first reported that was misleading. I posted a link to all of the stats and everything. I don't have time now.
While more likely to attend, whites are still far more likely to complete higher degrees.
@wolfcat87 No you never said that, you said poor blacks don't get good education, I stated that their are more poor whites, and that their neighborhood schools are just as if not more dilapidated and unfunded as blacks schools. That was your argument, in fact lets be perfectly honest here, your argument IS that whites have it easier because they are white, that is what white privilege is and how the term is used and that is factually incorrect. I realize that in our current society its completely okay and even encouraged to be racist towards white people, but that doesn't mean its morally right. That's all these arguments are.
@wolfcat87 As for other people struggling sure, their are absolutely other people who struggle more. Hell their is a very good possibility I am struggling more then you ever have (I was born poor, first to graduate highschool in several generations, was beaten raped starved and just generally tortured for most of my early childhood and I don't get special privileges like special grants and scholarships and ease of hiring and admittance like you and other minorities have while also being blamed for every bad thing in every ones life they have ever experienced even simply because the color of my skin while also having all of my suffering being ignored) and you probably have not experienced half the pain and suffering that I have. Doesn't mean that some one else doesn't have it worse then me, but it doesn't mean that if you have a certain skin color your suddenly better/worse off, that's racism which your spewing out.
@wolfcat87 So I do find it interesting that you talk about how others have it worse but you don't include yourself in that category, you consider yourself as one of those who has it worse when in all likely hood you have had it easier then two thirds of the human population. Yes I have it way better then so many other people its unbelievable. I have had the privilege of being born in the US, that has given me a near infinite number of advantages that some one born say in an Africa, specifically the more war torn regions or the tribal areas, have. It puts me in a better position then many Asian people and those who are in communistic nations, most people in the middle east etc. But then that also applies to all people who live in the west not just whites, that includes you. Claiming that one group is in total worse off then another using only their "race" as a barometer to that is ABSURD! Is Obama worse off then me as well? How about Larry Elder? Thomas Sowell? Every rapper?
@wolfcat87 Every black actor? How about the 35,000 black millionaires? Are they also worse off then whites? Just for reference that's 13% of the black population that is millionaires, for whites its 15% of their population are millionaires. Their are 41.7 million blacks in the US, in comparison their are 230 million whites. In short, they are comparable percentages of rich blacks and whites, the only difference is that their is over 5x more whites then blacks. That's why it seems like they are better off, because they have more people. Their are more poor white children then poor black children: http://nccp.org/media/releases/release_34.html Their are more poor whites then their are poor blacks: breakingbrown.com/.../ Yet interestingly the rates of welfare are about equal between the two groups (roughly 30%).
@wolfcat87 Yet some how its white people who have it easy, white people who are "privileged" because again, that is what that term means. As for your "different struggles", that is self inflicted. Its due to fatherlessness which over 65% of black children will not have a father figure in their lives, at least not reliably. marriage rates are even lower at about 40% for black women which further creates broken homes (also abortion is significantly more common in the black community which creates a host of health problems). The fatherlessness creates increased rates of criminality, substance abuse, academic failure, suicide, depression, poverty (because one income house hold combined with academic failure ensures generational poverty), promiscuity (which can be seen in "black" music and culture which also happens to perpetuate the damn problem), and even physical health problems (probably due to higher cordisol levels (stress hormones) which wear the body down faster).
@wolfcat87 This is a choice those in the black community have made, its a choice they have endorsed and defended tooth and nail. No one made you do it you chose it. And before you pull the "but slavery" argument, Irish where in the same boat, literally they where forced into servitude in the America's, they don't have these problems (in fact white slavery was stopped around the 1850's (the ottomans loved to enslave whites (which is where we get the term slave to begin with as its derived from the word slav or Slavic i. e. a group of white people who where enslaved by so many different groups that their very name became synonymous with the act of forced subjugation), about as much as Africans loved enslaving Africans.) and yet we do not see these problems in the white community. In fact we didn't even see it in the black community until the late 70s early 80s right when the war on poverty hit and welfare programs that specifically required women to be single mothers in order to get
@wolfcat87 money where created and specifically targeted the black community. This was exploited by some women, and allowed for other women to take greater risks in whom they had relationships with as it created a safety net for them. Then when those children who where raised in fatherless homes reached puberty they started acting out, which is when the increased rates of crime drugs poverty occurred. You where more likely to have an intact family in the black community 100 years ago then you are now. Again, this is a choice the black community inflicted on itself (and yes I would agree that the left has not helped in this as they continue to endorse piss poor behavior (because it gets them votes) and scream racism when ever any one wants to mention this fact so that real change can occur). Its not "white privilege", its a god damn choice which is why African immigrants fair better then most whites and almost all native born blacks despite them being black. This is a FACT.
@wolfcat87 As for lynchings, when was the last one? Not fucking recent. Who else was lynched, you know by the democraticly aligned KKK? Oh yeah white republicans. That's right, whites WHERE lynched. But again, when was the last one? Not fucking recently. Out of all the people lynched from the end of the civil war to now, are about 4,743, about 1297 of those where white which is about 30% and it was because they spoke out against racism and lynching (I know, not all white people where and are racist pieces of shit? Crazy!). That leaves us with 3436 blacks who where lynched in the past that's in 153 years, 3436 blacks where lynched, almost all of those where more then two generations ago, and then factor in that about 9, 252 blacks are killed by other blacks per year on average (over the course of the past 35 years) which is more then double all blacks killed by lynchings over the course of 153 years, we can safely say that the problem IS NOT WHITE PRIVILEGE.
@wolfcat87 As for the claims of police, the fact of the matter is that blacks are FAR more likely to hinder investigations, not cooperate which causes many issues. The whole notion of don't trust police and don't cooperate with them, that entire culture hinders any real attempt to fix the black community (then the black community that refuses to cooperate, refuses to testify, refuses to give any information about incidence turns around and claims that its all the polices fault even though its clearly not). Also fun fact a police officer is 20% more likely to be shot by a black person then a black person is to be shot by the cops so their goes any notion of "evil racist cops" you might come up with. Its YOUR FAULT. I don't mean that because of your race, I say that because of your attitude, its the refusal to acknowledge the facts, the insane victim complex and the rampant racism (blacks are actually 2x as likely to commit a hate crime then whites are) that's causing the problems, not
@wolfcat87 this mythical unprovable undefinable "white privilege" that you go on about being the source of all your suffering even as every other group passes you by in health, happiness, wealth and over all productivity even and especially OTHER BLACKS. Their is your problem, a victim can never be anything more then a victim and until you stop being one your going to wallow in self pity and demand that others do for you what you refuse to do for yourself. Stop using your racism as an excuse for piss poor behavior and act like an adult.
Irish were not enslaved for 200 yeahs, and they were indentured. If an indentured slave ran off, their whiteness allowed them to get away much more easily than black slaves who could be captured and resold even once free. Even free blacks who were never slaves could be caught and sold.
Yeah, don't bring Eurasia into a debate about the U. S. I'm 100% sure you are not familiar with the current ethnic issues in Turkey or Syria or even how their past developed when you are unclear on our own history.
African slavery did exist, but it was nothing like American slavery. Try again.
Ahhh, now you think there were no problems in the black community before the 70's... Hmmm... You also admit that welfare programs contributed, but you still pretend that the issue was entirely on blacks. Let me tell you, white families that went into those programs suffered the same long term father issues. It was not abuse, it was how the system guidelines were set up to keep women on them instead of helping.
@wolfcat87 Indentured servants of irish descent where treated worse then black slaves. They where believed to be less "docile" and "lazier" then black slaves. That's why they where given more dangerous tasks. As for indentured servitude, that's correct they where indentured, I mean they had a gun to their head when they where forced to sign their life away and shipped off against their will, but it was indentured technically. But then so where all black "slaves" before 1657. What happened in 1657? Well Anthony Johnson, a black man with his five indentured servants, four white irish and one black, was awarded his black indentured servant as a slave because he ran off and tried to violate his agreement. That's right a black plantation owner owned a black slave and white "slaves"(because you want to get technical but then also want to claim that blacks where slave for most of history too some how even though they where also indentured).
Those programs kept people dependent. The difference is that white people were not in the same high need category of blacks at that time. Why? They were not legally kept poor. So, whites who were poor were due to their own decisions and not the government. You love to continue ignoring that fact. The fact that only 50 years ago The white communities where blacks lived beat them, killed them, lynched them, raped them, etc. All legally. You love to ignore the fact that the laws changing did not change the people who still wanted that system to stay. Those people only recently started dying, and their children are still alive today.
In this day and age, we still have teachers like this: nypost.com/.../
But, you still want to pretend that no one hates blacks or tries to hold them back. There are whole websites designed to hate minorities. https://www.stormfront.org/forum/index.php
African immigrants can afford to fly thousands of miles to live in a new country. They are either very well off already, in which case the system has no effect, or they are so poor that even being poor here makes no difference to them. They've started out with a completely different system, got an early education away from whites who hate them and want to ruin their lives, and AGAIN did not suffer through 200 years of issues that American blacks did.
As you point this out though, what's your family's excuse for being piss poor? You're so happily pointing out immigrants. No one in the world to hold them back, and your family still chose to be broke. Your anger should be at your family, it should not be at people who sure as heck did not hold you back in any way.
@wolfcat87 Also fun fact 48% of free blacks owned slaves, on average about five and as Anthony Johnson shows, they where not their spouses. How many whites owned slaves? Oh yeah it was 1.5%. Wow, that really changes the narrative doesn't it? I mean Africans created the slave trade, sold off their African neighbors (as any African could tell you) then when they where free they got themselves slaves and created plantations. Meanwhile few whites owned slaves and whites also fought and died to end slavery, then forced other groups to get rid of their slaves, like the native americans (who refused to do so and only did it because of the evil white peoples significantly larger army. Also the evil white people told them they should make the slaves citizens of their nations, the natives refused not wanting to taint their blood with that of slaves. Very noble of them) and every other nation in the world as slavery predated the written word and existed every where their where humans.
@wolfcat87 Also fun fact, the last nation to ban slavery was Mauritania, an African nation (which where tied with most relectuant to end slavery with the Middle east) which banned it in 81, that's 1981 because you know evil racist white people. So yeah, lets not talk about "not knowing your own history" as I have thrown out more history then you ever knew existed. Never said racism didn't exist, never said blacks didn't have issues, I said the current issues are recent developments which go all the way back to welfare programs. You don't see the same problems in white families as blacks because whites would not tolerate that behavior, no one was sitting their coddling whites, no one was sitting their saying that its okay that they just can't help giving in to their urges. So yeah as I said their where some people who are contributing to the problem, I also mentioned that those people are put in power by blacks so you have to own up to your own actions.
@wolfcat87 African slavery was like American slavery, but you know worse. Same with the slave trade in the middle east where most slaves died before ever reaching their destinations due to the ottomans (modern day Turks (which again, I pointed out that they where also prone to the whole racism thing and mistreatment of people and you then suggested I didn't know anything about it even though I already made mention of it (you should really start paying attention before going on your racist rants) tendency to emasculate male slaves (cutting off the penis as well as the testicals) which usually resulted in lethal blood loss or lethal infection as well as managing to rape women to death. If you where going to be a slave, being owned by the rare white slave owner (as I previously mentioned) was preferable as their where laws that actually protected slaves to some degree.
Post links that prove that 48% of all free blacks owned slaves. A slave cost as much as a new car back then, so your claim would imply that 48% of free blacks were as rich as 1.5% of all whites... If that is true, then there's the even larger question of why whites decided to stay poor instead of working their way up in a world that hated blacks...
Whites did not fight and die to end slavery. Whites fought and died to maintain the Union. HUGE difference there. Lincoln only freed the slaves to weaken the Confederacy. Very few whites supported ending slavery when the Civil War began, and only the desire to end the war faster provided enough white support to make it happen.
No slavery in the world compared to what whites did to the world. They managed to kill about 63 million people worldwide... in the name of racism and slavery. Tell me anyone else who did that? In Africa, North America, Australia, Central America, South America, and the Caribbean. Look it up.
Woah, that is waaaaay too much to read this late at night. I have an exam tomorrow.
Again, you miss all of the points. The fact that you are so upset that other people had it worse instead of just accepting it is not an attack on you that others had it worse is just insane. I could talk to you until the cows come home, but your severe cultural bias leaves you incapable of putting yourself in the shoes of anyone else for even a minute. That means logical debate is pointless.
Again, I will say, I do not include myself in this for a reason. I've already stated that I am not black or white. Therefore, unlike you, I am an impartial party. I certainly do have white privilege though. I see no reason to deny it. I use it to my full advantage. It's only your own fault if you are too busy whining that it's not real to use it yourself. XD
Have a nice night, hon. Good luck with your quest to hate others and place blame somewhere. That's certainly not the point of the term white privilege.
@wolfcat87 Also black slaves had about the same life expectancy in the US as free citizens, in south America (where most slaves went (only about 5% went to the US)) where lower. So again, African slavery and the slavery of others was different then white slavery, namely being that whites where less likely to kill them and had fewer of them and had an over whelming aversion to them, with the exception of the rich democrats (who where racist and honestly still are). But then that's not all whites or even half of whites its, well as I pointed out only 1% of them owned slaves as opposed to half of all free blacks. Just because I am putting things in context doesn't mean I am suggesting it wasn't bad, nor am I suggesting it was okay, I know how people like yourself like to do that, either whites hate themselves and are demeened and treated like shit or they are racist in your eyes, but that's not reality.
Uh, no. The mortality rate for Black slave babies was extremely high. Between that and the intense work conditions, their life expectancy at some points was only 2 years from the start of their enslavement. White slaves were too easy to sympathize with, because They were still considered human. Blacks were animals.
I know what percent owned slaves. I don't dispute that number. I've been on another of Roland's posts defending whites, because I know that some northern whites really helped the Civil Rights movement. I'll happily jump in to correct both sides when they are wrong.
No one who is not racist will say that all whites were or are out to get blacks. That's not what this is. So many people try to misinterpret white privilege to mean something it is not. You guys let it feed into your insecurity. It's not asking for something special. it's not out to hate anyone. At the end of the day, it's pointing out the inequality in order to draw attention to it to fix it. That's it.
Personally, I know that blacks can get ahead with a lot of luck. I also know the numbers. 20 years ago there were less than 5 female CEO's of major companies in the U. S. There were even less blacks. Now, there are about 20 female CEO's of major companies in the U. S. There are less black male and female CEO's than that. When tracing up the ladder and interviewing company heads, it's still very clear that both women and minorities are kept out of promotions.
It's things like that. When a black, female CEO of Sam's Club stated that she wanted to fix this by refusing to deal with companies that only promoted white males, she was bashed for being a racist. Even though her policy would support companies with white female management and leadership. Think about that. Had a white woman said it, she would have been applauded. Instead, people boycotted Sam's Club and demanded this rare woman be fired. Because of the color of her skin and her fight for equality for women and minorities.
@wolfcat87 I really don't feel like going through all of this when we both know you will never listen, never consider the facts (I mean you haven't yet why the hell would you start now?) etc. But what your saying is absolutely racist (let me guess you can't be racist because you have white friends?), their is no disputing that. You are blaming all whites because your saying that we are given special benefits for our whiteness, benefits which cannot actually be explained, measured or otherwise quantified while dismissing all the benefits which can be explained (as I have done), measured (as I have shown the statistics), and quantified. Your racist, he is racist, that's just what it is. As a white man I am experienced with societies racism towards whites, especially from blacks (which is why blacks are twice as likely to commit hate crimes against whites then whites are against blacks, again despite being only 13% of the population).
@wolfcat87 However to address some of your statements, no slaves life spans where actually pretty descent only being about a year or two off of the standard in the US: 4.bp.blogspot.com/.../...ations%2Bline%2Bgraph.png Yes infant mortality was a huge issue, but that was a huge issue for everyone, that's why it was common to have ten kids, because most would die before reaching adult hood.(in fact their life expectancy was not much lower then in some places in Africa today). As for your statement of "some northern whites", that's inaccurate, many whites fought against slavery. In fact the quakers had outlawed it outright, many states had as well (we are talking millions of people ) and their where fights every time a new territory was made a state to try and make it an abolishiness state. MOST people where against slavery, but the rich where not and that makes the difference.
@wolfcat87 Blacks can't get ahead with a lot of luck, that's idiotically stupid. They can get ahead by staying in school, not having kids out of wedlock (currently 72% of all blacks are born out of wedlock), not break the law (50% of all murders are commited by blacks, most crime in fact is commited by blacks despite the fact that they are only 13% of the population) and get a job. That's it, that's secret, be a proper parent, stay in school, don't be an asshole. Not luck, just the same shit we expect from every single other human being in the world. Hence, again, African immigrants succeeding where native born blacks fail miserably, because they do those things, you know not be a piece of shit, be proper parents, go to school, work hard. That's why they out earn most whites. atlantablackstar.com/.../ Which I have pointed out before, which you ignored because you where to busy throwing a pity party.
@wolfcat87 As for your claims of CEO's, their is at reason why their are significantly more white CEO's, you ready for it? 63% of the US population is WHITE! Which one is more likely to stay in school, whites or blacks? WHITES! ERGO WHITES ARE GOING TO BE MORE LIKELY TO BE CEO'S BECAUSE THEY ARE THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE POPULATION, THEY ARE FAR MORE LIKELY TO STAY IN SCHOOL AND GO TO COLLEGE, LESS LIKELY TO COMMIT CRIMES, AND THUS MORE LIKELY TO BE CHOSEN TO BE A CEO OF A GOD DAMN COMPANY! Common sense should have told you that. As for the claims of "Women CEO's" that's because women don't want to work the 100 work weeks to be CEO's as all data has shown. When a woman goes hey we should only hire black women as CEO's and other positions, YES THATS RACIST! How do you not understand that? If you are choosing some one for an occupation purely on their race and not merit, then your showing a preferential treatment towards that race and thus are racist. COMMON FUCKING SENSE!
@wolfcat87 ITs not equality if your being preferential. Your not saying hey we should hire some one because they are capable your saying we should hire some one because they happen to have the right shade of skin. HOW THE FUCK IS THAT NOT RACIST? Don't pretend like your that fucking stupid to not figure it out. By that reasoning their is nothing wrong with white people hiring only white people, just because they are showing a preferential treatment towards some one of the same skin color doesn't mean they are racist. Oh wait, YES IT FUCKING DOES! You are racist, you are incredibly racist and I am done with this your a terrible human being you despise whites because you literally have to believe that all whites are racist and conspiring against you to make the shit arguments you are making but what is worse is that you think even less of blacks.
@wolfcat87 You demand that white people use their white people magic to fix black peoples lives because they are to stupid and weak to do it on their own. Well that's bullshit, their is no reason why you can't be held accountable for your actions. Their is no reason why you can't look at your community and decide that it needs to be fixed and you know actually do something to fix it instead of bitching and whining and demanding that you get even more special privileges which the ones you already have didn't do a damn thing (because the problem is you not the rest of the world). You want white people to take responsibility for your fuck ups, like not being their for your children (again, over 70% of children born out of wedlock, 65% raised without a father etc. etc.), making excuses for the rampant crimes how its not your fault (because all the bars on the fucking windows in Chicago is to keep out all the racist white people and cops right?),
@wolfcat87 you want white people to take responsibility for all of the bullshit your community pulls BUT you refuse to allow us to have any kind of authority. WHy is that do you think? Because if we had the authority your community would be fixed, because we wouldn't tolerate you murdering each other (again, blacks kill almost three times as many blacks who where lynched over the period of 153 years annually), we would demand that you stay in school, if you decided to act like a piece of shit you would be punished for it etc. no differently then we would treat white people. You want to be treated differently you want the privilege but none of the responsibilities and that's why your communities are shit, that's why the only ones that actually succeed in the black community are the ones who abandon the shitty victim culture of the black community or where never raised in it. ITs your fault, you fix your own fucking problem and stop blaming white people for it (again, its really racist).
Weird. How in the world does Wolfcat87 want "White" people to take repsonsibility for her "bs"?
She is half-"White".
Does she have to be pure "White" or a full "White" to avoid being a victim when she talks about "White" privilege? How does it work over there in raciology?
You're racist for assuming my race... Did you really just say that my excuse for not being racist is because I "have white friends"? What color am I? I've stated quite a few facts. I am literally the only unbiased person i this conversation, and that makes you the person unable to come to terms with facts.
Roland gets it. I am half white. My father's family is Norwegian/French/British. My grandmother's French/British family has been here since the American Revolution, and my grandfather's Norwegian side migrated here a few generations back. I spent my life in both worlds, so I am one of a small number of people able to see these issues impartially. I've seen the detail of how both worlds work. I'm not white or black, but I am both.
Also, I'm not really looking for a pity party. I certainly do not need any pity. I do well for myself and am better off than most Americans in general. This is still due in part to my white privilege.
You jumped from my statement that some whites helped with the Civil Rights Movement to most whites being anti slavery...
I know my history, love. Being passively against something does not equal being actively for something. Most of us are against the huge issue of gradually increasing plastic in our environment. Most of us still choose plastic bags and containers to buy while shopping... Anti-Slavery and Pro-Civil Rights had very similar responses. Look at the masses of people marching on D. C. to watch MLK speak... The crowd is not mostly white. Yet, our population most certainly was white. Therefore, most whites did not get involved in the civil Rights Movement. The Civil War was to maintain the union. Lincoln was only able to free slaves as a war tactic. Impossible in peace times
I can agree with the ideas that people should stay in school and not commit crimes. The problem with that reasoning is that most black people do stay in school and do not commit crimes. So... why are those people still struggling? Why are they still facing discrimination? You clearly ignored my comment about the inability for women and minorities to promote in many companies even though they certainly are qualified. Your blinders are on.
As for children outside of marriage... That is certainly nothing to prevent good parenting or success. One of my female friends was able to collect two bachelor's degrees. She had two children outside of marriage and two while married. People should be good parents. Marriage is not a requirement.
"The Pew Research Survey also indicated foreign born Blacks were older, more educated than Black Americans and more likely to be married." As your article states; they are older, married, and educated before arriving here. They were able to skip this mess.
That is not the reason for more white CEO's. Not to mention, your racial hatred has blinded you to the female part of the story much like the people who attacked the black CEO when she said she was for helping females of all colors who were also underrepresented. There are hundreds of CEO's. For only just over 20 total to be female or a minority shows an extreme misrepresentation of our population. So, genius, what's your reasoning for there to be so few white women? The CEO's who did make it were interviewed. They all agree that there is an extreme bias. Promotions past middle management become extremely political and are dominated by white males. It's not about education or qualifications at that point.
2% peak for black CEO's. Blacks make up 14% of the population. If we adjust for number of degrees per ethnicity, (graduate degrees per race - whites 10.8%, blacks 6.1%)... Something is wrong.
@wolfcat87 I also find it interesting that you say I have a racial hatred even as you blame white people for everything. Also I didn't ignore any component to the CEO question, I actually pointed out quite clearly that women don't want the jobs, its a choice, and their is no bias that we can see. Some one saying their is doesn't make it a fact, it just makes them a virtue signaling asshole who is trying to win brownie points by pandering to people like yourself who expect every one to lift you up and make your life better while you sit on your ass doing nothing but act like a fucking parasite. Also, again, I stated that their where plenty of other minority groups doing just fine amongs those Africans. How is that racial? How can I be filled with racial hatred when I point to one group of blacks and say they are being successful and then point to another and say they are not? How is that racist?
@wolfcat87 Your blaming all white people and saying blacks are worthless and can't do anything for themselves and I'm saying no, their is no group that is inherently bad, blacks are perfectly capable and we know they are because you have plenty of blacks who are capable (like Thomas Sowell, Larry Elder, African immigrants, etc. etc.) and I'm racist? You hate every one yourself included because of skin color, and I'm the racist? Yeah I'm done here.
... Did you just say "You think blacks stay in school? you think they don't commit crimes?" Ummm... Darling, there are people of every color who drop out of school and commit crimes. that in no way means the majority of people of any color do those things... That was a very racist statement to make.
Did you even read this link that you provided showing exactly what I stated about college degrees? Your own resource backs my stance that there should be a higher number of black CEO's. Why are there not? Could it possibly be due to people like you that run around screaming that all black people are high school drop out murderers? Hmm... There are 37,144,530 non-Hispanic blacks. If they were all murdering people, then most people would be dead in this country. There are only about 5,000 murders a year according to FBI stats. So, clearly, most blacks are not murdering anyone. If you cannot see how racist your posts have become at this point, then you are delusional.
Also, this is certainly not about all whites. Most whites are great people who are not racist. There certainly are racist whites like you though who should take the time to confront your own racial bias and where it might be stemming from. Very often it's rooted in ignorance or fear, sometimes it stems from a lack of appreciation of your own culture. Which is it in your case? Do you have an inner shame of your family's history and over compensate by redirecting that hate and shame at others? I certainly feel no shame or hate towards your ancestors. I love mine, and I feel no reason to misdirect hatred at you.
Your links about fathers show that you truly missed my point. I never said that fathers are not valuable. Also, not marrying does not mean a father is not around. Also, I certainly was not wrong in saying that single mothers can and do work and go to college while raising their children. Over 2 million single moms attend college every year.
Remember, I never claimed all white people are anything. That statement only occurred in your own mind. Feel free to read everything I wrote. Once you have done so, and see that you are imagining things, you should take the time to wonder why everyone you assume is black is saying they think all white people are racist to you... That is exactly what happened here. You assumed I was black, and then you assumed I was insulting white people and making negative comments about whites... Perhaps you should seek therapy for these inner demons. My state is 95% white, I chose to live here. I'm half white. Clearly, my issue isn't with whites.
My family is half white. My husband is white. My children are white. My in-laws are white. I live in a 95% white state voluntarily. Many of my friends are white due to my location. Most of my exes are white due to my location.
When you continue to insist that somehow I hate whites, it's kind of hilarious. I've never hated on whites (or any race) in my life. It truly would be self hate, and I was raised to love myself, my history, both of my family trees, and all people.
@Political_dude Asians are not Caucasians. Just cause their skin is white doesn't make them white. They're Asian which is completely different then white like me
The Caucasian race (also Caucasoid,[1] or Europid)[2] is a grouping of human beings historically regarded as a biological taxon, which, depending on which of the historical race classifications used, have usually included some or all of the ancient and modern populations of Europe, the Caucasus, Asia Minor, North Africa, the Horn of Africa, Western Asia, Central Asia and South Asia.
@NoBullsh1t well almost none of the terms we use are definitively the correct race or color for the person. I mean we use African American for black people when a shit ton of white people are African as well. Almost none of the terms we use are used properly
@NoBullsh1t Exactly. Only north Americans think that caucasians are white skinned people. In reality, north Africans are Caucasians too.
I'll give you another example to prove how wrong north Americans are: Asian refers to anyone living in Asia (including Indian, Japan, Pakistan, China , UAE etc) but when you say "Asian" in North America, it refers to China, Japan and people with small eyes. That's not true. Indians are Asians too and so Pakistanis
@kittycat119 in Asia? No. Because Russia is whole big nation divided in Europe and Asia. They belong to whole different ethic groups so you can't really include them.
Oh Absolutely. Asians far outnumber everyone else. You would think we would see more of them in Hollywood movies, especially sci-fi flick about earth in the future.
@kittycat119 Because we group people by their chosen group identity. Would a "White" African identify with being more with being "White" or being African. If it is African, why in the world do we bother with the term "White"?
Obviously the term "White", means a lot to them. So let them have their designation Kitty. There is no objective standard for grouping human outside the science call genetics.
Genetic groups are objectively determined and they are called haplogroups.
I'm Caucasian and I was profiled a number of times as a teenager when I would be out driving my car (which was actually my father's old car and in his name). They'd see me as a teenager driving, run the license plate (it would come back with my dad's information), and I'd get pulled over. Then, after requesting my license, registration, and proof of insurance, see the same name on everything (I'm named after my father), ask if I have permission to drive the car and/or did I alter documents. Then, since I was pulled over, wanting to know if they could search the vehicle. This happened to me 4 to 6 times as a teenager until I got my own car in my name. I was also stopped and questioned once in Manhattan in my mid-20s because I fit the description of someone they were looking for that was harassing college students.
@wil-i-am Well, I don't think you are going to convince anti-PC people with empathy. They do not give empathy. They can only demand it. My argument is constructed for non-"Whites". If you are young and you are not "White", you need to understand the racist stereotypes that could affect you.
This 14 year-old young man was nearly shot and killed because he knocked on the door of a person who steadfastly believes in racist stereotypes.
His mother in my opinion needed to explain to him that he could be shot and killed because of someone's beliefs about his supposed "race".
@RolandCuthbert That's a term created in a safe space on a college campus to bring in more money and student loans on the backs of the taxpayers so perpetual students can stay in college forever, contribute nothing useful to society, and do nothing productive with their lives other than polishing their couches with their asses.
O. J. Simpson, Robert Blake, Michael Jackson, Bill Clinton, Bill Cosby, Donald Trump. What's the connection?
"Green Privilege".
Now, if you want to say more Caucasians have Green Privilege than non-Caucasians, and it's the results from the acts of those that lived in previous centuries, probably certainly so. However, the bottom line is, today, 21st century, it's "Green Privilege" and nothing else.
No, it was created to bring in anything. Look, if you think your tax dollars go to unproductive people, you need to call your congressman and get on the phone to Trump. Tell them to stop it. I thought they were fixing that. It costs more money to go to college now than it costs to buy a house. You think it should cost more. . . or?
As for the actual privilege conversation, I am sure that rich people have privilege. I have seen it. I have consulted with many corporations. I have seen rich people get stuff for free. . . simply because they are rich. And it doesn't make any sense. Why give rich people free stuff? They could simply buy it.
But anyway. Yes, I am sure that many "caucasians". . . I assume you mean "White" people, have green privilege. But they also have another privilege that has nothing to do with money. According to most "Whites", they cannot be profiled for negative behaviors.
@RolandCuthbert No, I'm talking about people who go to college with the goal of being nothing more than perpetual students. If you go to college for at least 12 years and you don't earn a Doctorate, you've wasted your time and taxpayers' dollars. Learn a trade, as I have. We are shorthanded in this country on construction personnel, teachers, and nurses. Instead, people want to be useless lifetime students working on "studies" or if they leave college, want white-collar positions with unrealistic expectations, salaries, and vacation time.
Who are these "whites" that claim they can't be profiled? Ultra-liberals, that blame whites for everything under the sun? Or ultra-conservatives, that believe whites can do no wrong? I say both. This is why I say that the 10% of people that are too far to the left, and the 10% of people that are too far to the right, are the loudest and most annoying 20% of the population that ruin everything for the 80% of the people in the middle that can figure...
I don't even know what to say about that newest conspiracy. Taxpayer dollars? Learn a trade?
What?
This is another tangential conversation. Actually, let me take that back. This conversation has nothing to do with "White" privilege. Why don't you create a take about this conspiracy to take your taxpayer dollars by making kids go to college and get advanced degrees?
As for "White" privilege, I am saying it is largely a function of society and that non-"Whites" must deal with it and figure out a way to get around it.
@RolandCuthbert No my point is that they DON'T get advanced degrees... or any sort of degrees at all. They just waste taxpayers' dollars as perpetual students for decades.
You keep calling what I'm stating is a conspiracy. There is no conspiracy. It's a FACT that there's a shortage of blue-collar workers, teachers, and nurses in this country. It's the only reason Trump carried Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, and West Virginia.
So what I'm stating is a conspiracy and your Take isn't a conspiracy (or at least, an excuse)? Seems like arrogant presumption on your part...
Sir, I don't of any students who go to school and don't get any degrees. I just don't. My niece is getting her doctorate in psychology. My other niece has a BA in Business. My nephew got a degree in mechanical engineering.
The last one just refused to stay in school. Now he just works odd jobs.
I don't know what we are talking about at this point.
If there is a shortage of blue collar workers, it isn't anyone's fault but the industries that need blue collar workers.
Why would I want to work a job for $75,000 when I can have a starting salary twice that as s security engineer?
Why would I want to work a job and be terrified that any day it could be replaced by automation or by outsourcing? And when it eventually is. . . everyone would blame me for being out of work.
I couldn't counsel kids today to get a blue collar job. No way.
@RolandCuthbert That's too bad you feel that way, because I make a six figure salary, I'm a full-time single parent, financially support my retired parents with my son and myself, and I have benefits. I'm right up there with the doctors and lawyers... but without having to pay back student loans and pay malpractice insurance bills.
You did not just post me claiming that you make six figures. And on top of that you say "bad you feel that way".
Uhm. . . I own my own technology consulting company. I make well over six figures. I have traveled to three different continents.
I would never counsel a kid to go into a blue collar job. you are 42 years old. Why would I do that to a college kid? They can make six figures out of the gate with the right skills. And no one gets brownie points for taking one for "team". They only get blame. That is how American society works. And if/when American society can get smart enough to work differently, then I think we might realize some better results.
Until then, my motto is, look out for number one first. Because no one else will.
@RolandCuthbert So tech, by definition, is the advancement of communication, computers, automation, and the virtual security needed to protect it. No way that could ever be outsourced or automated, huh?
There are no brownie points, or "white privilege" (which is my point). Only work and "green privilege".
I'm 42 NOW, but I've been at the career for nearly 20 years. It didn't just happen with no work or skill or training or dedication.
Yes "... six figures out of the gate WITH THE RIGHT SKILLS..." which does not include "Gender Studies" or "The History Of XYZ Privilege" of which most 20-somethings don't have or learn. Unemployment and Xbox, here we come!
You seem to have a very condescending view of blue-collar work. Tell me, did you yourself put up the building (s) you work in? Or the planes you've flown in coming and going between three continents? Supply the electricity that runs the computers? The plumbing? The walls, floors, ceilings?
Hey, it could be outsourced. So which one will be outsourced first? Your job or mine? Don't you have two factors to worry about? Outsourcing and automation? I only have one. And if I want to stay ahead of the curve, my butt had better be in training at least twice a year. Which I do.
So this isn't about "White" privilege?
If blue collar jobs are not being filled that has nothing to do with college kids. At this moment, there are people who claim they do not have job or job that pay enough. Who's fault is that? Who deserves that blame other than the people who are looking for betters jobs and the industry that is looking for workers?
I know I can't blame any one for my issues. I do not have that "privilege".
If the welding industry needs workers, they had better get their butts out to job fairs with appropriate training offers. They had better work college campuses and poor neighborhoods where people need better employment.
Right? So do what you have to do to keep a job. As for no one being irreplaceable I don't even understand what your point is with regards to employment. You began this tangent to whine on behalf of the blue-collar industry.
Well, if they don't know how to market for themselves who's fault that?
Mine?
What the hey? I counsel kids in the tech space. And yes, they can be replaced, so they had better do whatever they can to learn the latest tech every single year. My job requires re-training.
You cannot prepare for every scenario, but if you do not do what you can, no one is going to feel sorry for you.
@RolandCuthbert You don't have to worry automation? I know enough about the tech that computers write code on their own all the time. Computers programmed by other computers. Only a matter of time. Like I stated previously, no one is irreplaceable.
Why does a blue-collar job search have to be in poor neighborhoods? I was raised in a middle-class suburb of New York City. So a blue-collar career can only appeal to a poor person? Or to someone with no other possible options?
Sorry, but I only see "white COLLAR privilege" here. I also suddenly see two attractive blue-collar positions opening. One comes with a proverbial shovel, the other with the proverbial foot and proverbial mouth...
Oh, so you know the tech field? So yes, AI can write its own code. So who is supposed to design AI platforms? And what naive programmer would design a system without any way for a human to modify or control it? Perhaps far in the future we would trust AI to totally run on its own. But doing so now? It obvious why we cannot.
AI does not have common sense. And it never will. We don't even know how our minds work, how in the world can be design a computer system to know the dynamic ever changing ever present standard of common sense in our everyday world.
I don't know what we are arguing at this point.
Can you tell me?
You are not asking about blue collar job search in poor neighborhoods. I don't think you know what you asking at this point. Didn't you say the blue collar industry is desperate for workers?
Hmmm. . . where are people desperate for better paying jobs?
@RolandCuthbert Yes I dinked and dabbled in the tech industry many years ago before I became an electrician. Also considered becoming a meteorologist or a pharmacist or even getting into sports radio. My mind likes to be in a lot of places at the same time. However, I really happen to like working with my hands and being on job sites.
You brought up looking for welders in poor neighborhoods, not me. If a blue-collar career can uplift a dedicated poor person, I'm absolutely all for it... but again... only a poor person can find satisfaction in a blue-collar job? Why not from any walk of life? There are plenty of people wasting time and taxpayers' dollars in college that should be learning trades instead. I'm not whining about anything. I aslo didn't start out by asking any questions. I'm debunking this notion of "white privilege" when in reality it's "green privilege" and while doing so, seemed to uncovered your distain for blue-collar careers.
So I am confused. Why are you telling me this when you were just defending the blue collar industry? Please connect the dots.
I am sure many people like working with their hands. I would like to play video games all day. I have to do what makes money.
You don't seem to really have a point. You claimed that the blue collar industry was looking for workers. So why not look where people are looking higher paying jobs. You seem intent on convincing college students to give up their endeavor and become blue collar.
Yes, that is whining. If you don't want your tax dollars going to colleges, keep voting for politicians who cut funding for college and who help colleges to raise rates. Getting an education saved my life. I won't support that. In fact, education helps to open people's eyes and to give them more information about the world they live in.
@RolandCuthbert No, claiming "white privilege" when in reality it's "green privilege" is whining.
I'm all for higher education when it actually leads the person to a real degree that makes that individual an actual productive member of society and gives them the ability to pay back their student loans.
We can totally agree to disagree but it doesn't change the fact that you lost the argument.
Also, they have a Video Game League now. You should look into it.
None of this stuff connects. You talked about blue collar jobs. .. not because they were jobs of the poor but because they pay what you think is a lot of money. That's cool.
What does that have to do with green privilege.
This guy probably makes more money than both of us.
It did not matter when it came to profiling him for being an illegal immigrant. He has to know he can/will be profiled again. And he must be prepared for that.
That statement is just not dealing with reality for a non-"White" family in America. It would be silly for me tell my son, he could be profiled for being an illegal immigrant. Stereotypes about "Black" people do not work that way.
@RolandCuthbert You can post all the YouTube videos you want. You evidently feel guilty about something because you posted this Take about a false narrative.
You see, I don't care if you don't care, the take isn't written for you.
It is written to warn people about "White" privilege and the people who will justify it. You are so offended, you are even angry that people have to make modifications to their lives because of it. I like the Captain American Sikh guy, he combats it in a very unique way.
That is just a fact of life. Whether you like it or not. . . acknowledge it or not. It isn't even about being right or wrong.
@RolandCuthbert It has nothing to do with caring. It has to do with the manipulation of reality. What you're writing about is based on YouTube videos (not the end-all, be-all of actual fact) and nonsensical terminology invented by college professors. There is no "white privilege". Only "green privilege".
Oh I agree, it isn't about "caring". I don't care that you don't care. I don't care if you aware. I don't care if you agree.
It ain't about you.
The Sikh Captain America isn't a college professor. He is a software consultant.
But again, it isn't like anything you posted me is based in rational thinking. I see now why you dislike college education. Because it doesn't lend itself to your brand of politics.
But even that doesn't matter. Not sure why you tried to sneak that into our conversation about "White" privilege.
@RolandCuthbert It's not about politics. It's about reality... of which, apparently, you're not a fan. Politics and politicians are full of shit.
Ah so you admit most modern college education has morphed into nothing more than about pushing a certain brand of victim politics and no longer about what it's supposed to be about... actual reality and actual advanced education. Suggesting that someone would "dislike college education" only because of potential political alignment is perfect evidence of only supporting specific education and information that reinforces a bias against reality.
Again you also keep mentioning "white privilege" like it's based in actual reality. Just because you post an opinionated Take based on selective narrative and YouTube videos that anyone with an Ethernet connection can upload, doesn't make any of it actual, factual, reality.
I'm sorry that I've dismissed your misguided diatribe on contrived nonsensical terminology so easily.
No, there is a definite political bent about college and education. As you have claimed here that college does not educate, but it pushes political views. And I have no doubt that climate change and a flat earth might be your agenda also.
And all of that is summed to be "victim politics".
That's cool.
Not going to argue with that kind of logic.
And no, my argument is not built on youtube videos. You are not very enlightened, so I sought to try to find material that you could understand.
But again, I don't need your agreement to post my take or to have an opinion. Sorry if you are so offended.
Obviously there's climate change. Has pollution slightly skewed this always ongoing phenomenon? Of course... but people measure things based on their insignificant tiny existence. The Earth was changing before humans, and will continue to change long after humans are gone. The human race is like fleas on a dog's ass... if the Earth wants to shake us off tomorrow (the Yosemite volcano completely blowing its top comes to mind... it's long overdue), it can do so with no effort. It's more arrogant presumption that humans could irreversibly damage and simultaneously miraculously "correct" a gigantic molten magnetic metal rock spinning in an endless vacuum. The Giant Red Spot on Jupiter has been shrinking for decades... is that human-skewed? Things change. Also, eventually the Sun will transition out of its Yellow Star phase and into a Red Giant which will consume the entire inner Solar System... including the Earth.
You're allowed to have and post your inaccurate opinion (s) all you want...
... it's a free country... unless we do what you want and turn to communism.
By the way, the tech industry (where you're getting your aforementioned six figure salary) is one of the leading causes of pollution, with all of those factories and refineries mass producing all of those metal and plastic devices that need all of that tech security. Maybe I've isolated your guilt?
Yep capitalism sucks... except when it's looking out for #1... which to your credit, you at least admitted that much...
Like I said, if you don't even believe in verifiable scientific facts, how in the world can we have a conversation?
I am in the tech business. You know how many corporate CEOs have questioned my conclusions? You can only present factual evidence and assessments. People will either believe you or not.
But I certainly don't argue with them. If anyone questions my conclusion after my research, they probably would be a pretty horrible client anyway.
Not my problem, I advocate green technologies only. I have built two data centers and power consumption, heat, etc. are all factors I deal with. If we can focus on building better low power consumption technologies, we can start to deal with heat generated by data centers.
I could turn this discussion into a tech conversation if you wish. We have superconductors on the way. We are making chips and microprocessors smaller and smaller. We are on the brink of being able to do computing in the quantum realm.
That the great thing about tech. It never ever stops. It just keeps right on going. And it has been my joy ever since I saw my first computer at age of 10.
Not sure what any of that has to do with communism. But if you like it, you can move to Russia. Been there several times.
Fascinating society. Did you know the average Russian lives on $400 bucks a month?
$400 sounds about right... because there's nothing to buy there. Result of a silly, failed, and obsolete ideology.
So nothing I said about the Earth, Sun, and Solar System is verifiable? Oh really? Perhaps you should swap your microscope for a telescope sometime.
Computer locations (the "data centers" you mentioned... we call them co-locates for short) will always need industrial air conditioning. I've installed and supplied the 3-phase, 480 power for a number of them. Lucrative, for sure... but definitely not energy conservation friendly.
Speaking of heat control and containment, you mean those pesky superconductors are still on their way? Been that way for a while. I remember learning about them in the 1990s in high school. If only they could bring up their operating temperatures to something a little closer to room temperature from nearly absolute zero. Tech definitely keeps going. I find it fascinating... but the exponential heat it creates as it gets smaller is a big hurtle.
And I know about the sun, moon, too. But I don't know how to calculate an orbit of a planet using Einstein's equations. I don't know how calculate Lorentz contractions near the speed of light.
Physicists know how to do that stuff. They have went to school and have gotten the education to do it. I went to school and I got a different education. I know computer technology. I can configure any firewall on the market. I am expert at the configuration of several hypervisors. I am a certified Cisco, Microsoft, Commvault, Zerto, engineer/professional. I have years of training in my discipline. I have managed project teams in migrations and integration projects all over the U. S. and overseas.
And when I speak on technology topics, I speak with expertise.
And unless you know a bit about my field, don't proceed to debate me from some nonsensical viewpoint.
And I feel that way about anyone who has become an expert in their chosen field. I don't know everything. Nor do I have to.
Of course they need cooling. That's why we need better technologies for power consumption. If we can run the equipment cooler, they will need less air conditioning. They will also run faster. I have no expertise as an electrician. It was never anything I was interested in. I just know what we are trying to do in the tech field.
And these superconductors are already here. We just have to find a way to mass produce them. I don't think you have heard of this material before. This material can be 1 single atom thick.
I worked tech before my electrical apprenticeship. I enjoy the work and the micro-physics, it's super fascinating, but it's suit-and-tie nerd work. Brain is there, but never could sit still long enough to make a career. I have built a few computers over the years from scratch for fun (MicroCenter is nerd heaven, I love that place), merged a few laptops, debugged a few hard drives file by file, never got deep into encryption or writing code (time-consuming when pursued for hobby and not career).
Anyway, career paths have nothing to do with the fact that communism (and also fascism for that matter), are both extremist failed nonsense and "white privilege" is non-existent.
I forgot to ask... how did you get Joe Montana to sit down for a video for your Take?
Well, MicroCenter used to be a hangout for me. Not anymore. There are a couple of tech organizations I have joined. They have some cool initiatives. I go to midTech once a year.
I think it is quite evident those terms are meaningless. You can stick a put a feather in your hat and call it communism or fascism. It doesn't matter. A lot of people are tribal, they will accept any kind of dictatorship, authoritarian regime, autocratic, restrictive totalitarian. . . it doesn't matter, as long as their tribe is seen as being number one.
And I think I have proven "White" privilege. Again, I don't need your permission for what I have to gird myself for or how I have to plan my success. And non-"Whites" need to make those plans accordingly, lest they pay the price.
Joe Montana?
That wasn't even funny.
Baseem is very funny. You should look up his stuff. He is also quite courageous. It is a miracle he is alive.
Isn't it at least just as likely that people alienate themselves in their own minds with their "identities" and perceive themselves to be persecuted?
Also I can't help appreciate the irony that this take also validates arguments from people who see themselves as under attack for being white. With "white people" feeling blamed like they're most numerous/dominating group when they're not the largest demographic at all, aren't you also validating any notions that one of these days a segment of the population is going to tell them they're all racist and go around lynching them for it?
Oh, but there is a difference right? There is a reality that non-"Whites" have to deal with. And from your view, isn't that reality the only logical objective and rational conclusion that anyone of any supposed "race" or culture could come to?
But if "White" people were profiled for crime or for terrorism, would you consider that to be racist. . . or the weird concept reverse racism?
Not really. Though it depends on the circumstances. If it's because the culture doesn't like fair skinned people and decides they're criminals then yes. If it's because there's predominately white terrorist group posing an imminent threat that's operating in a majority non-white country then I'm not too bothered about people being suspicious of me.
You are avoiding the issue. You feel that it is rational and logical to profile non-"White" groups based upon certain criteria. But there is no rational nor logical basis to profile "White" people. evidenced by the statement that about pre-dominantly "White" terrorist group, etc.
It doesn't matter that you believe you have the right to do this based upon what you consider evidence, which is the very definition and demonstration of privilege anyway. It only matters that this standard exists and you believe it is acceptable.
Non-"Whites" must navigate this standard and navigate whatever policies, rules, or devices created by the people who share your feelings.
Everyone does follow the same rules and policies, but not everyone is exactly the same. Basically worst case scenario it's an inconvenience, so very far from a difference in "privilege." Some people are too tall to fit in bus seats. Some people are more susceptible to skin cancer when they go outside and need for fork out for sunscreen. The problems are trivial, acknowledging some kind of privilege doesn't do any good.
And if you were profiled, would it be a simple inconvenience? Like if people looked at you and thought it was reasonable to assume you were an illegal immigrant? I am not sure what being too tall or being susceptile to skin cancer has to do with the steadfast nonsensical belief that people who look a certain way are prone to certain actions or certain beliefs.
And painfully few people, despite your claims, would agree that just because they fit someone's subjective definition of a racial grouping, that means that they are prone to negative behaviors.
The anti-PC group's, founding principle is that "White" people are exempt from this type of profiling.
"steadfast nonsensical belief" But we're not talking about nonsense, we're talking a effective means of identifying people. If it's not nonsense then it's in the same realm as small inconveniences you have to deal with because that's reality.
"reasonable to assume you were an illegal immigrant" Again, not nonsense if it is relevant. So then the only problem is acting on assumptions -- There's already policy for that. -Can you please show me some identification? Sure, here you go. -All good, move along.
"racial grouping, that means that they are prone to negative behaviors." That's why race is not the primary factor by which people area profiled. Profiling doesn't mean prone to negative behaviours because of race. This is what I'm talking about when it comes to perception of persecution; it couldn't be that there's a practical reality to contend with, no, it has to be "steadfast nonsensical belief" against me.
I am not here to convince you that racism is wrong. That isn't my job. I only created the take to show how "White" privilege manifests. You are telling me that logically and rationally "White" people cannot be profiled for negative behaviors or beliefs and somehow that is not "White" privilege.
And that is astounding.
Right, so you wouldn't mind being at a restaurant and in front of everyone being asked to prove that you are a U. S. citizen. How can I believe that when you are insulted that being "White" and not having police profile you, not being accused of being a terrorist, etc. is privilege?
Of course you would lose your mind over having to prove your citizenship again and again.
I know I would. So why would I lie?
But it doesn't really matter. The take isn't to convince you. It is to illuminate the issue for people who can think rationally.
I didn't say white people aren't profiled for negative behaviours. You're deciding that everyone else is making decisions based on race.
"in front of everyone being asked to prove that you are a U. S. citizen?" Nope. It's kind of inappropriate to ask and just bring it up, but if they're the authorities and they're really going to push it (and assuming they're in their rights to) then fine, they can check and I'd be proud about it. You could also ask them to prove they're a citizen or that they're cops or whatever.
Depends on the nature of the profiling as I've explained before. Everyone is profiled, it makes resources able to be better distributed. You're also profiled by way more than anything else so why aren't you complaining about that?
I'd rather the tedium of that than accept immigrants that undermine my efforts to assimilate into the culture and to go through the proper procedures to earn my citizenship by ignoring all that and entering illegally. How about you stop having so many illegal immigrants instead of complaining that you have to prove your citizenship? That would be a much better solution to the issue.
Lie about what? What are you even talking about?
People who can think rationally recognise the vapidity of your trivial complaints.
You are not reading. You do not believe "White" people should be profiled for negative beliefs or behaviors. Please read my responses. This is very important.
What do you mean if they are the "authorities"? Five Latinas were out at dinner at a nice restaurant. Before they could be served the waiter demanded they prove they were U. S. citizens.
Can we get back to discussing "White" privilege?
I don't understand your last statement.
So your point is that people can and should profile you when they think they need to?
Your statement is nonsensical. I was talking about "White" privilege. Create a take about illegal immigration if that is your area of concern. The issue is you are not going to be profiled for being an illegal immigrant. If you were, you would dislike it. I know I would.
As for complaining, please understand, I could care less about your assessment of the take. I am not MLK Jr. That simply is not my job. I am not going to sing to you "we shall overcome". There is a saying I learned long ago, if you think I was sent to tell you kind things you are wrong sir. Good tiding are given from different kinds of people than me. . . to other kinds of people than you, in different situations than these.
Moving on.. . racist stereotypes target different groups of non-"Whites" in different ways. I would not be profiled for being an illegal immigrant. Profiling would target me for being a criminal. The first time that happened to me I was really naive and that could have ended my life. But I learned that I needed to be much more careful around people who could have racist views. "White" people don't have to worry about such things. The anti-PC crowd does not believe that the privilege of individuality extends to non-"Whites".
Excuse me, why is reverse racism a "weird concept?" You don't deem non-whites capable of racism? White cracker, no welfare for the privileged, promote only your brother and mother right, weird concept.
"profiled for negative beliefs or behaviors" "Profiled" doesn't mean whatever negative characteristic you feel like sticking to someone, it's statistically significant behaviour - and even then profiling should only be done where necessary. If I'm going through an airport, I expect to be profiled, I'm going to avoid suspicious behaviour and be cooperative wherever I can.
"waiter demanded they prove they were U. S. citizens." Wow, that case really doesn't support your position. Firstly, the waiter asked for proof of residency, that's a little different from proof of citizenship, doesn't really matter though. Secondly and more importantly, the waiter was fired -- and specifically because those actions were not reflective of company policy or acceptable social norms. Third, if it's not the authorities asking for proof then you are under no obligation to prove anything.
"discussing White privilege" I am talking about white privilege. My position is that -- depending on definition -- it generally falls under one of two categories: imaginary or irrelevant.
"people can and should profile?" People can and do. In most situations you can and should give people the benefit of the doubt. e. g that classmate of mine seems a bit weird but I'm sure he's good people. But if you're approached by a shifty character in the middle of the night then you're going to be more careful. With countless people going through airports everyday profiling is a good way to know who to keep an eye on and apply security resources effectively. e. g Here's a dude, middle aged, traveling alone, wearing a large sweater on a warm day and looking around nervously, let's make sure security keeps an eye on him.
"illegal immigration" You brought up immigration. Few if any would be suspected of being illegal immigrants if there wasn't an illegal immigrant problem. "you would dislike it" Depends on the situation if disliking it even matters. I dislike being pulled over for random breath tests, I also dislike being hit in the face by strangers for no reason. Both have happened to me but in only one of those situations is a complaint actually valid.
"As for complaining" I was after good sense, not good tidings. Why you thought that saying was applicable here indicates a lack of the former on your part.
"affirm" Your affirmation is hollow. You're affirming whining.
"people who could have racist views" People could be bad people. Amazing. No one is arguing that racism or racist stereotypes is bad.
"The anti-PC crowd does not believe that the privilege of individuality extends to non-whites" One of the defining points in the anti-PC platform that distinguishes it is it's insistence on a universally applied principle of individuality, so really, what are you on about? You're sorting people into groups (hence the name) based on how privileged you perceive their race to be.. but you're the one supporting individualism here? Okay, mate.
I cannot reason with racism. I am not here to convince you that racism is wrong. Why are you not reading the take?
You are here defending profiling. Profiling of who? And what stastically significant behavior?
So wait you are not "White" and you expect to be profiled. You are okay with it and you do everything you can to avoid looking suspicious and be cooperative? What does being cooperative mean? Do you surrender your rights as a citizen? Do you understand that maybe you don't have as many rights as people who are "White" have?
"Wow, that case really doesn't support your position. Firstly, the waiter asked for proof of residency, that's a little different from proof of citizenship, doesn't really matter though. Secondly and more importantly, the waiter was fired -- and specifically because those actions were not reflective of company policy or acceptable social norms. Third, if it's not the authorities asking for proof then you are under no obligation to prove anything."
Of course this supports my position. Because we are talking about what the waiter believed. Your beliefs are important too. And people who are not "White" must be aware of your beliefs. The waiter could have easily been a judge, a police officer, a lawyer, it doesn't matter.
And your first point is just off. I am African-American, no one has ever asked me or any "Black" person I know for proof of residency. Racist stereotypes target us differently.
But you have proven "White" privilege in almost every post. It doesn't matter if you think it is imaginary or irrelevant. You believe in the principles of privilege. You think non-"Whites" must do what is necessary to deal with it.
And I have said the same exact thing. But you didn't read the take. The only difference between you and I, is that you are nonsensical in saying non-"Whites" need to modify their behavior to negotiate the privilege depending upon the racist stereotypes that affect their specific group, while at the same time you claim the reason why they have to do so does not exist.
It is like beating someone with a baseball bat and then claiming the bat you used was imaginary.
I absolutely did not bring up illegal immigration. Please do not pretend to be dense. I said you could not be profiled for being an illegal immigrant. Do you actually believe that statement is in defense of or against illegal immigration? This is how nonsensical tangential conversations get created.
So if you cannot address the point, please do not create the distraction of another conversation.
So can you be profiled for being an illegal immigrant? All your other statements are irrelevant.
No, affirmations are not whining. They are merely supporting of obvious facts. And to debate you, I didn't even need to bring any other evidence. I just needed your statements.
You are definitely confused. :D
Racist stereotypes are bad. But profiling based upon racist stereotypes is good?
Of course anti-PC people do not believe in applying principles of individuality. You just explained it thoroughly in a post. That people need to know what they will be profiled for. They need to avoid the specific suspicious behavior of that group. They need to know they will not be an individual. They need to know as you say about the "statistically significant" behaviors, that people who look like them are capable of. And the nonsensical thing is that your profiling isn't separating people into groups. Somehow, my method of getting to know them and how they group identify separates them into groups.
I can only support individualism where people insist upon being individuals. When they tell me they are "White", "Black", Latino, or Asian-American, etc. they are not telling me about individualism.
They are telling me about groups. And most importantly, HOW THEY SEE THEMSELVES.
"statistically significant behavior" "Here's a dude, middle aged, traveling alone, wearing a large sweater on a warm day and looking around nervously." That's statistically significant behaviour. People with criminal intent tend to act abnormally and you can spot that.
"I am not here to convince you that racism is wrong" I know, you're trying to convince me it exists where it doesn't.
"you expect to be profiled?" I'm a human, so I expect to be profiled. "cooperative" means don't fight security personal doing their job protecting everyone, myself included. "Do you understand that maybe you don't have as many rights as people who are "White" have?" I don't surrender my rights, I have all the same rights. Do you understand that maybe you do as well?
"Did you not just prove "White" privilege?" No, but it's hardly surprising you'd think that. The very first thing I said here was to suggest that you insist on alienating yourself and cling to the idea that you're persecuted regardless of whether it's true or not.
"Of course this supports my position." We've established that what the waiter believed is not an accepted norm. That case highlights just how infrequently such things occur and the negative attitude people have towards them.
"The waiter could have easily been a judge, a police officer, a lawyer" No, they couldn't because the standards of conduct people entering into those positions are higher than wait staff. Even if they did get into those positions it doesn't matter if they're the most racist person in the world as long as they consistently apply themselves impartially. Furthermore, if they did something like the waiter then they'd get worse treatment, I'm sure they'd never work in the justice system again among other penalties.
"Racist stereotypes" Profiling is not the same as racist stereotypes. Again, we go back to statistically significant data. It's not racist if it's reflective of reality. The prevalence of racist stereotypes is right where we'd expect it be for a society that disapproves of the waiters actions; rare, it's not even close to the norm.
"no one has ever asked me for proof of residency" So what? Doesn't mean you don't need to have it -- and in other situations is doesn't mean you need to give it.
"You think non-"Whites" must do what is necessary to deal with it." I believe everyone must do what is necessary to deal with whatever they face. You think victim-hood (and not even necessarily your own; other people's victim-hood) permits you special treatment.
"non-"Whites" need to modify their behavior" No, *people* need to modify their behavior to be civil in a civil society. Not acting like a criminal goes a long way to not being treated like a criminal.
"you claim the reason why they have to do so does not exist." I'm claiming *your* reason why they (as well as everyone else) have to doesn't exist. So good job. Almost there. It's like the bat was imaginary and so was the beating. It is that simple. Hence the name.
"illegal immigration" It is you who is dense if you think the perception of a person as an illegal immigrant has nothing to do with the prevalance of people who are illegal immigrants.
"believe that statement is in defense of or against illegal immigration" No, nothing I said was meant to suggest that you were for or against it. The point was that you can't ignore it. This flows neatly into...
"you cannot address the point" I am, you're deciding that I'm addressing a different point. So there's some juicy irony in you saying that I'm creating distractions.
"So can you be profiled for being an illegal immigrant?" You can be profiled for anything and it's never definite, it's more or less likely that you possess a certain trait.
"obvious facts" Obvious facts like the earth is flat. It's so obvious.
"to debate you, I didn't even need to bring any other evidence. I just needed your statements. You are definitely confused." Likewise.
"profiling based upon racist stereotypes is good?" Profiling that is not based upon racist stereotypes is good. Been my position the whole time.
"They need to avoid the specific suspicious behavior of that group." Didn't say that, you're changing my points again. Although if the "group" you're talking about is criminals then yes, avoid the behaviour of criminals.
"They need to know as you say about the "statistically significant" behaviors" They don't *need* to, generally just not doing anything criminal and then not worrying about it is all it takes. Applies to everyone. But it doesn't hurt to know what cops/security are looking for so you can make their job easier by rightly avoiding suspicion. For example try not to leave bags unattended, that invites security, not to mention thieves.
"your profiling isn't separating people into groups" It infers the likelihood of any particular trait to an individual based on the coalescence of numerous observations from that individual. Grouping would be ineffective, we want to know about individuals.
"my method of getting to know them and how they group identify separates them into groups." ..."how they group identify" I'm trying to identify individuals and you're making statements in the manner of black people this and white people that. I'm also arguing that people "group identify" to cling to minority/victim-hood/persecuted status: You're persecuting yourself more than anything else is.
Uhm, no I don't need to have it when I go out dining.
What special treatment have I demanded from you? Or anyone in this take? Again, you are just nonsensical in what you wish to discuss. You want to make this all about you. I care as little about you as you care about me. I didn't even create this take for you. I engaged you because I thought you deserved a response.
Skin colors do not act like criminals. You introduced the statistically significant behaviors argument. Which again is nonsense. Now you deny it. Why?
? Of course not. You could be a judge or police officer. With this notion of statistically significant behaviors floating around in your head. Non-"White" people need to be aware that people like you can wield tremendous power in this society. Its just the way it is. And they need to be modify their behavior as you said, to make sure they don't set you off.
Right, you think race is reflective of reality. Even thought it has been scientifically disproven. As for this waiter, he was only fired once the Latinas share their experience on facebook, which you would probably call whining anyway. But you don't address the issue. He thought he was doing the right thing.
You can keep saying it, it won't make it true. Talking about people being mistaken for being an illegal immigrant has nothing to do with a conversation about immigrants legal or not. A person can be born and raised in this country and be mistaken for an illegal immigrant. I am sure he was against illegal immigration also.
Yes It's a problem, but I think in the scheme of things it's not as big of an issue as the gap between rich and poor. I also want to point out "They don't have creams to darker their skin color" d3r2zleywq7959.cloudfront.net/.../...26_xlarge.jpg
yes they are. They are trying at least in part to attain a colour that matches a lot of black people. Not to mention those that seek an alternative solution like melatonin injections.
Sorry. I do not accept that argument. I know of no study supporting your assertion that "White" people tan to try to look black or brown. It is like saying "Black" women wear blonde wigs to look "White". If that were true, I would post supporting evidence. But there is no evidence for that.
Trump and John Boehner are "White" men and proud to be "White" men.
Fake tan is a wealth and class response, not a race one. Historically, white nobles would wear zinc based make up to appear as pale as possible, this would show they were wealthy enough to not have to work outside in the fields and gain a tan. As things have changed, and flights abroad originally being expensive, fake tan helps imply you've been able to afford a holiday abroad at whatever time of year.
It may hold as a socilogical theorem but the question is how you use it, and what conclusions you draw from it.
How strong influence is it, and when is it of lesser dignity than other social rifts? That needs to be pinpointed.
I think for one thing, it should be stated is that social standing and wealth tops this any time of day, meaning people should only apply this on their own respective social standing. You can't put a homeless white guy on level with Donald Trump ever for example.
We should mind the effect of racial bias where we stand. but we have fuck all responsibility for the people that stand above us, or to pretend there's a relation based on "skin color club". Because there isn't much of any.
Like higher ups in media, hollywood, government, echelons of rich people. They all stand above me regardless of gender, skin color or sexual orientation. They are not mine to care for, be invested in, or apologize for.
If you get pulled over by the same cop... your black and I am white. Same offense, same road, etc... I get let off with a warning, you get a ticket. It wasn't white privilege that prevented me from getting a ticket, it was the cop's racism. I had NOTHING to do with it. So I put little value on "White" Privilege as a real thing, This sample just has the appearance of privilege, but really its the racism of the "Privilege" granter. Saying I am privileged is saying I have some control over it. Nope... Put blame where is belongs..
I don't think that I am blaming you for "White" privilege. In many ways it is a function of our society. And non-"Whites" need to be prepared to deal with it.
That observation has set off a firestorm on this take.
But thanks for your post. It seems to be a reasonable response to what I am driving at.
"White privilege" is nothing more than polite speak for white hate and racism, just like male privilege is nice speak for sexism and hatred of men. It's a hoax. A smoke screen to hide racial bias, bigotry, and general scum baggery. Anyone who seriously believes in it is a racist scum bag.
I just don't see it that way. And I keep getting hit with bags of "White" guilt over "White" privilege. It isn't about hatred. Sure, discussions about "White" privilege bring racists out of the woodwork. But this isn't about them. This is just about privilege and how it manifests.
There have been dozens of thread about its non-existence. I just wanted to set the record straight.
Yes, discussion about "white privilege" do bring racists out of the woodwork. It brings all the people who hate white people out of the woodwork because they're the only ones dumb enough to buy into this crap. "White privilege" does not exist. The record is already straight.
"Privilege" cannot be broken down into race. I'm white and was born into a lower middle class family that has had to go paycheck to paycheck without much money for anything beyond necessities. There are whites that have it even worse off than I have, and at the same time there are non-white people who have great lives. To break everything down into race doesn't make sense as people from all races will have good lives and some will struggle.
Of course it can. Here you are telling me about lower middle class and poor "Whites". They have existed since this nation was a nation. They were there at the start of the Revolutionary War. They were in the Civil War, Jim Crow, the Civil Rights eras.
We are talking about "privilege". Do you agree that "Whites" can and should be profiled? Do you think "White" people have any negative behaviors/beliefs as a group?
Do rich Arab-Americans avoid the stigma of being terrorists? Do rich Latinos avoid having to prove they are American citizens?
I don't think anyone of any race should be profiled. Not all Arab-Americans are automatically thought of as terrorists, and not all Latinos are thought of as being illegal. But sure it happens to some. Some white people do profile people of certain races in those ways, kind of like how some minorities profile all white people as racist even when the vast majority aren't.
Look, I appreciate your sentiments. But non-"White" people would be ill-served by pretending "White" privilege does not exist. There are kind "Whites" everywhere in society. Good people, people who are just regular human beings like everyone else. I wonder if I should create a take dedicated to "White" folks. The good, the bad, the real, the fake. . . and the human.
Many non-"Whites" simply cannot afford the luxury of pretending "White" privilege does not exist.
Gabrielle Union talked about what she does to counsel her sons when they have to deal with police officers. Because that advice can save their lives.
I'm sorry but I fail to see how minorities are ill-served to pretend white privilege doesn't exist. It doesn't and minorities who constantly push the white privilege narrative, I believe, are only serving to increase the divisiveness that an idea like this brings. I don't see how they or anyone can benefit from a society that is so divided, more so than if we all come together and say some people, regardless of race, are born into better situations than others, some have to work harder than others, but if we set goals and work to achieve them anyone can achieve anything they want to in this country.
Thats from the Washington Post, an extremely left leaning paper that would love to push the white privilege narrative. Sort the victims by race, you will see twice as many white people were shot by cops last year than black people.
Why are black people so afraid of cops when white people are shot by them twice as often? I'm a heat fan and love D-Wade, but he and Gabrielle are misinformed on this one.
Also why don't we hear about any white people being shot by cops? It really shows how the media also wants to push this white privilege narrative. Police brutality is often one of if not the biggest argument that white privilege exists, yet white people are more often the victims of it.
We could also start going into how minorities have privilege through affirmative action programs and are handed college admissions and jobs simply for not being white. That is basically the definition of discrimination.
My main point is even if there are some disadvantages statistically faced by blacks or any minority, they really aren't that disadvantageous, and really are offset by disadvantages face by whites and programs set in place to basically hand minorities educations or jobs, regardless of whether they've earned them.
I am sure not all "White" people believe that Arabs are terrorist. I am sure not all "White" people that Latinos are all "illegals". I have many "White" friends and loved one in my life. The don't believe in such silliness. That is not the point. Look at my take, there are literally dozens of people arguing on behalf of being able to profile non-"Whites" for as one says. . . statistically signficant behaviors. That is a factor that non-"White" people have to deal with. That's just the way it is. And if these people do not take precautions the results can be devastating.
You are going to tell me what Gabrielle Union should or should not tell her sons? You are not dealing with reality. For your claims about police brutality look at the bottom graphic. But this goes way beyond police. Florida is an open-carry state. And her son could be shot because a person claims, they had to "stand their ground".
Michael Dunn shot a "Black" teenager dead because of loud music.
And for the last point, about Affirmative Action programs, are you saying before AA, all hiring was done based on merit and that somehow, some way today, all "White" people miraculously only hire on merit.
Not that I am defending AA. I have no problem with it and I am pretty sure that under Trump the Department of Labor has ended such federal programs. In addition, the Republicans hold most of the governorships and and legislatures in this nation. So keep voting Republican, they will get rid of all AA programs.
It used to be a dream of mine that "Black" people would look more to each other for employment opportunities and build the necessary infrastructure. But I am sure you would consider that to be racist.
Not all white people are racist, but white people have been killed for being white. Any person from a certain race could be shot because of a trait that is an unfair stereotype for their race, even when they themselves don't exhibit said trait. You probably remember the Dylan Roof shooting a while back at a black church. Terrible, awful, racist act that probably 99% of white people thought was despicable. Well in 2017 a black man shot up a white church near Nashville in an act of revenge for the racist acts of Dylan Roof. Probably not one person in that white church supported Roofs act, but they were profiled as such because they were white like Roof. where was their privilege?
Gabrielle Union may tell her son's whatever she likes, I'm just saying white people can be stereotyped just easily as black people. and you're right it's not just
Police, white people could also just as easily be shot in an open carry state for "being racist." Like that's my point, it's not a one way street, this stuff can and does happen to people of all races.
Also I'd need a source on President Trump ending AA, nothing I could find supported that statement. I'm not saying white people always hired on merit before, they absolutely didn't, but there are employment discrimination laws now. Why isn't equality enough? Why should non whites get hired because of their skin color of there is a more qualified white candidate? The logic flawed. If you hire someone because they are black, you're not hiring someone because they're white. No matter how you twist that, it's discrimination. Nothing wrong with diversity itself, but there is with diversity for the sake of diversity.
And yes I would view your last statement as racist. How is that any different from white people looking to white people for employment opportunities?
And my supporting documentation. Why would I a "Black" person claim that I am harassed by being profiled for being an illegal immigrant? I am not. Nor is that an issue for the "Black" community. I am not profiled for being a terrorist. That is not the racist stereotype commonly held about my community.
As for AA, these programs started being dismantled years ago.
And Trump's administration has went even further releasing a justice department memo stating. . . “investigations and possible litigation related to intentional race-based discrimination in college and university admissions.”
And if you want to argue about dismantling AA programs, you won't find a person to debate you in this discussion. The mere fact that America even thought it had to have AA supports my views on "White" privilege.
You keep talking about "quality" as though this is something commonly practiced. It isn't. I mean you don't even talk like you work in the United States. People generally get employed because they know other people. I have hired "White" people myself. Not because I did some exhaustive search to find "quality". I did it because I trusted friends, colleagues, and people I worked with. Sometimes I found a perfect fit. Sometimes, I did not. But I sided with documentation provided from people I knew.
To pretend this is not commonplace is simply not being realistic. And if you are talking about these types of relationships, then "White" privilege becomes evident.
Especially given that racist stereotypes, no matter how common sense they appear to be to some people, are so pervasive in this society. It is something non-"Whites" must contend with and overcome.
And of course, "Black" empowerment would be racist to you. Because the anti-PC crowd can only articulate what is wrong with the "Black" community. To say that "Blacks" fail here or there is not racist. It is only when a "Black" person articulates what should be done to combat these problems, does the charge of racism appear to be valid to you.
And that isn't being hypocritical right?
It is a weird deal. Racism talks about the inferiority of non-"Whites" all the time. But it seems to need to keep non-"Whites" in a specific box so that it can always go to an argument that racist stereotypes are true. . . based upon nutty racist statistics gathering.
Fun Fact: White people were actually a whole third of the planet's population prior to WWI. The war decimated white peoples' numbers, and they still haven't recovered a hundred years after the end of the war.
On topic: I honestly wonder if people in power ie: Academics, politicians keep making these sorts of decisions to feature white people, so that way they can pin it on White Americans, and keep racial tension high. Basically, if Americans of all skin colours were living together without any tension, they would quickly realise that people are fucking them over. Because I know tonnes of Americans, black and white, and they all just consider themselves American.
Are you going to post something in response to my take, or did you want to start your own? There is a select up at the type on the menu, "post". then select "share my take".
I like to call it majority "privilege" or representation. Now that whites are becoming a minority in the US and other English speaking multicultural countries all that will change. The need for representation is only natural but I think everyone would've done the same; build a country to feed their needs and mirrors their image.
I don't think that much will change. South Africa had a system of apartheid and years after it, after the majority "Black" population still lags behind the average "White" person.
Just a guess: Maybe they just failed to compete with the whites in there? Look at Zimbabwe who in 2014 (I think it was 2014) disowned and dispelled all whites. Then the entire agriculture infrastructure broke down and the black people there had to starve to the mpoint that the president was begging for the whites to come back. I mean, after they were gone - the blacks could have easily do the same job. Why didn't they though?
And South Africa is about to do the very same thing of planning to disown and dispel whites. And it probably will just go the very same path.
@FakeName123 Uhm, we were talking about "White" privilege.
I know all about racism and racist assertions. I am only saying that your steadfast belief in racist assertions is all the proof I need for establishing the existence of "White" privilege.
its interesting how many people think they know it all, and speak things with such certainty, when in reality many people have never been anywhere else outside of their city or state and have not experienced the other cultures from different parts of the world... please save up some money, take a trip to another state or country, and note the cultural dynamics, and witness for yourself what goes on, instead of holding certain opinions that you really have no basis in credibility and rely on what you read on instagram
Uhm, I have been all over the United States, Canada, Europe, and the Caribbean.
I was speaking specifically of the U. S. And I have to tell you to please, read the take. Stop focusing on the title. I have a simple premise and I give the reasons for my position.
Okay, I agree with you that black people do get more discriminated than white people, especially by law enforcement. We live in a nasty world, with nasty people, and it is so preposterous that so many nasty people feel the need to harm others for being non-white. That does not mean though that all white people are this way, when people say white privilege, it annoys me because I think, oh, they think my life is all gold and roses. And we must not forget that racism happens both ways, as you can read from some people's comments. You seem like a smart man, and you do not seem racist, but do you see an issue with a world where non-whites think it is okay to say cracker, and then defend themselves by saying "white privilege?"
@DianaWest Uhm, well. . . I know a lot of "White" people. I can pretty much guarantee the vast majority do not think non-"Whites" should be profiled for negative beliefs or behaviors. I just created the take because there were so many questions, etc. created here claiming "White" privilege does not exist.
I am not here to argue racism. I just wanted to illustrate "White" privilege. If you want to create a general take on racism I will definitely participate. I post about tangential issues of racism. Because I think the whole racism debate is pretty much settled and the sides pretty much have their positions defined.
I don't think that it is okay to call "White" people racist names. I would never try to justify that. And that poster in the other thread. . . I don't think she would defend herself by claiming "White" privilege.
Another racist rant; lovely. " It is weird that people who have a deep belief in raciology don't recognize the consequences that go along with those beliefs." What, like making up nonsense about so-called "privilege"? IS there racism? Absolutely. There's people who believe in the Flat Earth theory, too; doesn't make it true.
This whole myTake assumes it's conclusion is a tail-chasing romp through every racist ideology that has ever existed, and then says "See? That means privilege exists!" Worse, it deliberately conflates race with culture, as if that somehow proves it's point. the writer is guilty of exactly the crime he or she decries; racism.
How do I deliberately conflate "race with culture". If you believe in race, that is on you. I believe in culture. And I believe that raciologists are simply people who confuse race with culture. Every raciologist in existence claims that people who are members of different races have different beliefs and behaviors.
Have you ever used a dictionary?
Have you ever looked up the definition of culture?
the customary beliefs, social forms, and material traits of a racial, religious, or social group; also : the characteristic features of everyday existence (such as diversions or a way of life) shared by people in a place or time
The dominant culture is. . . mostly "White". I don't know why we would pretend it is otherwise.
But yes, I would have to say it is influenced by African-American Culture. Some norms in African-American Culture eventually get adopted into the dominant culture. Some people call it cultural appropriation, which of course, is silly. Cultures have intermingled and adopted each other's norms for centuries.
The dominant culture gets contributions from all sub-cultures here in America. Latin, Asian-American, American Indian, etc.
In truth, we are changing. But it is not right to pretend there isn't much resistance to that change.
And truthfully, honestly, I don't know if the resistance is totally wrong.
Good, we progress. But it goes deeper than that. The culture isn't white; it has no skin tone. Your PERCEPTION of it is that it's "White" In fact, ANYONE can be part of the dominant culture. As long as you continue to tie culture to race, you'll keep falling into that same trap. You have to break free of the idea that your skin determines your culture to leave your racism behind.
I have a doctor at the VA who may or may not be black. I can't tell. And honestly, I don't care. He's part of the dominant culture. He speaks with a flat Mid-western accent, he knows his stuff, he answers question with patience and listens attentively. I take his advice, because he's smarter than I am (no great feat, admittedly ;) ). I don't just respect him, I hold him in esteem.
I have a neighbor, across the hall from my apartment. Lovely woman. Another member of the mainstream culture. She has a little Yorkie; and I hear her going out and coming back after walking the dog. She is black. Doesn't matter.
The point is, that as long as you conflate culture, especially the dominant culture, with race, you're going to be a racist. Please don't do that. Don't deliberately exclude yourself from the dominant culture. That's WHY you think in racial terms. Instead, join it, and leave race by the wayside where it belongs.
Well, if you want to get into the whole culture thing, "White" people aren't even white. They are some other color. We call "White" people "White" because that is the name they choose for themselves. It is respectful to call people the term they choose to refer to themselves as.
I don't tie my culture to race. Are you so far gone, that you think African-Americans are a race? I don't know to say to that. Many people with dark skin do not participate in African-American Culture. I don't call them "Black" or African-American. I call them what they choose to be called. Some people recognize a cultural connection among all those who are descended from a culture based in Africa. That's cool too. I don't believe in that.
And you can skip all these individual experiences. It isn't teaching me anything. Just tell me what is your issue with my position.
No, I am not racist. I mean you can call me racist, I don't really care. The definition of racism is in the dictionary. I don't even believe in your concept of race.
I believe in culture.
And I don't even try to rank one culture over another. What benefit would that serve me?
As for excluding myself, that is just silly. Non-"Whites" must educate themselves on "White" privilege. You can call it racist to try to stop us. But a "Black" parent knows they must educate their children on what to do when the encounter the police. Latinos know they have to inform each other of their rights when they are profiled as being illegals.
It is funny that you focus on the "Black" stuff. Is there a reason for that?
"The dominant culture is. . . mostly "White". I don't know why we would pretend it is otherwise."
"So let's run down a quick list of "White" privilege shall we?" "1. All schools, even those where your people/children are not a majority, need to focus on the history that supremely concerned with and glorifies what you have deemed "your people". "2. Social norms, graces, standards, etc. must comply to what "White" society deems normal and acceptable." "3. The amazing thing about "Whiteness" is its ability to project universally. People's most beautiful in the world lists are a great example. The most beautiful people in the entire world, for years, were only or mostly "White". "White" people, if you are a raciologist, are not even the majority of the human race." ""White" privilege is being able to be evaluated by only the good that your supposed "race" has done. But never the bad. Many "White" people do not believe they can be profiled for any negative behavior."
"And almost all of those "White" people disbelieve in "White" privilege. " "6. Most "Whites" will never feel shame about being a member of their own culture. Most will never know what it is like to not want to be a member of your own ethnic group. "White" people don't have discussions about what is wrong with "White" people. The "culture" (as you all have noted, I claim "White" people is merely a cultural designation) isn't capable of that kind of debate. But among Asian-Americans, African-Americans, Latin-Americans, American Indians, Arab-Americans, those discussions are common. Most "Whites" are pretty comfortable in their own skin. They don't have surgery on their eyelids to look like Asians or try to take creams to darker their skin color. In the non-"White" experience there are always themes of the struggle to accept yourself, your culture, and your history."
These are all YOUR thoughts. I'm not the one with a fixation on race. That's you. This is YOUR concept of race.
I'm saying that for you to claim you are not race-focused is laughable, when you can't even discuss your cultural opinions without labeling them by race.
Race is not real. I told you this in the beginning. "Black" people, "White" people. . . those are merely cultural designations. I can prove that race isn't real. I have links to dozens of studies if you need them.
Straw man argument. Of COURSE race isn't "real". I never claimed otherwise. What I'm saying is that as long as you continue to use the race labels to support your argument, even if applying them to "cultures" instead of actual people, you're still a racist. It's a bait and switch tactic. "Oh, I don't mean people! I mean culture!" but you still use the same old racist arguments and racist labels. You still talking about blacks, and latinos, vs "white culture". the fact is, there IS no "white culture". There's a dominant culture, but it's multiracial and multiethnic. You labeling it "white" doesn't change that. get over yourself, please. I will not reply again.
Well. . . if you never claimed otherwise, why do you keep telling me I confuse race with culture? It isn't my problem if people look at my skin color and make assumptions about my behavior. I think if people want to know a bit about my culture, they should ask me about how I identify. That might tell them something about me.
I don't care what you think of my use of "race" labels. My skin isn't black no matter what delusion you are trying to perpetrate. And I am pretty sure "White" people don't have white skin.
They call themselves "White" because they recognize a cultural connection to each other. To pretend otherwise isn't playing with a full deck of cards.
And I quote;
"Historical research has shown that the idea of "race" has always carried more meanings than mere physical differences;" American Anthropological Association.
That is an absolute fact of racial categories. They represent more than physical difference, no matter what insanity you peddle here.
I'm biracial and I see no white privilege. I see whites who have it worse than me and other people of color who have it better. I see racism in all groups and also a lot of people of different races who love each other like family and friends.
Hm i am from country where is very little black people and is a bit distant to tbis very western culture and as I read this I am just thinking that people are really bored or they have ran out of ideas to argue about. It is same to me as lgbt, multiple gender and pronouns, or 3Rd wave of feminism. It looks like nonsense and I always hoped that just very little people actually cares about those and that those ho do are just really loud.
Absolutely. This is why I appreciate this contribution. You clearly carefully put it together in interest open discussion with no animosity. There should be many more like this. I would like to respond more to the content of this post when I have more time to dedicate.
What Girls & Guys Said
Opinion
70Opinion
Totally agree with this post! White females and wealthy white
males are the most priviledged group in society. Many white guys are very disadvantaged on the sexual market as well as the economic market (there are more women attending university than men)
Also to, along with Oriental woman getting plastic surgery for rounder eyes, black girls wanting straight hair, a lot of white girls want to dress getto, white guys emulate black music and envy the masculinity of black guys ( swagger and sex appeal).
Their is no such thing as white privilege, not one law, not one grant, scholarship, is dedicated to white people but their are for minorities in the US despite it being 63% white. Their is no evidence of any kind of white privilege, its just something that racist people with rampant victim complexes come up with to make themselves feel better about their own failings (That's why the top highest earners in the US are from asia (indian Filipino etc.) because they focus on being successful and earning what they get not on finding ways to force others to give them what they want instead of working for it).
Of course it exists. And laws were dedicated to "White" people a few decades ago. I can list them. Did you know that American Indians did not even have the right to speak their own language until the 1970s?
But when we talk about privilege, we are talking social norms anyway. The funny thing is that this has nothing to do with people's failings as you obviously did not read the take. You just seem to follow the same script most of the anti-PC crowd follows.
This guy is not complaining that he did not succeed. I would venture a guess that he is even more successful than you or the average anti-PC ranter. But he can't even go out in public without being harassed because he isn't "White". The weird thing is that the anti-PC crowd agrees with treating him this way while simultaneously denying "White" privilege.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAhXoZd_sAM
It starts looong before college, hon. You know those anti-segregation laws that enforce equal education for all? When I was a child in the 90's, we had to be bused an hour and a half each way every day to go to a white school. Why? the segregation laws weren't working, and all of the education money was being funneled to the white schools. The education provided to lack children was extremely inadequate.
Now, tell me how many white children go to run down schools that cannot even afford books or the bare minimum needed to provide a decent education to their children? I'd be hard pressed to find any.
Also, black people aren't getting ahead with those items provided. They are trying to catch up to what you had a chance at already. I read a research paper that showed that it takes families about 7 generations to go from rich to poor or vice versa. Blacks have not had 7 generation to recover from slavery or Jim Crow laws. Many whites have had endless generations to improve their lot.
Name me one law to date that creates discrimination that was not put in place to appease people like yourself? Just one? You can't. Not to long ago their was discrimination against the Irish too, and Italians. Do they get to have special privileges as well or do they not have the right skin tone for it? Their is no discrimination to day in our society that is measurable in any meaningful way. The black community is riddled with crime and poverty which is entirely the fault of the black community. Those barred windows are not their to keep the white people out and we both know it, its because blacks are more likely to commit crimes by an insane margin. We also know that has nothing to do with poverty because while poverty increase crime rates, the increase is not nearly enough to explain the black communities rampant crime, but fatherlessness does explain it. Your community has done nothing but wallow in self pity, blame every one else for your own actions then demands special treatment
African Immigrants do better then white native born and white immigrants, so we know for a fact that their is no racial discrimination that is baring any minority in this nation and that has been proved time and time again. As I have already pointed out its minorities who are in the top earning groups NOT whites. You just need that as an excuse to explain why you have failed (hint, you never tried). We have been through this before if you recall, it ended with you ranting and spewing racist statements at me, you where wrong then you are wrong now.
https://youtu.be/SzHd5bmEdU4
https://youtu.be/Bc_gy0b4UM8
https://youtu.be/Tb2iFikOwYU
@wolfcat87 How many white children go to run down schools? Are you kidding me? Their are more poor whites in this nation then all other poor minorities COMBINED. So that's an absurd claim to make. In fact black women are more likely to go to college then the "evil racist" white men. In fact lets ask our selves how many white only scholarships are their? None. How many minority only scholarships are their? Countless. How many white only grants are their? None. How many minority only grants are their? Countless. Then you have the fact that schools discriminate against whites as when one enrolls in a college or university whites get the equivalent of -180 points on their SAT scores when it pertains to acceptance, blacks get a +200. Then you have the free lunch programs, free transportation etc. for predominantly black students. Do you think white people get any of that? Of course not because while whites pay the most in taxes they don't get any special programs to help them.
@wolfcat87 I appreciate you telling me how easy I have it because of my skin color by the way, no really that's not racist in the slightest (it is). You don't need seven generations, that's idiotic, most of the wealthy people in our nation started out blue collar then became million to billionaires. Also I'm the first person in my family to graduate highschool in about three generations. Also I was born in spring field Illinois, wich is run down and filled with poor white people. Oh yeah, sorry we can't call ourselves poor because that would detract from your pity party. I was handed nothing (well except having to deal with people like you who blatently make racist claims and try to tell me how easy my life was despite the fact that I am poor, was born into an even poorer family and not one god damn person in this nation could possible give half of a fuck that whites are also suffering from poverty.
@wolfcat87 What did you think the magical white fairy comes to white people and puts $100 dollar bills under the pillow every night? Or did you just think we receive checks from the government every month simply because we are white? Where the hell do you think money comes from? Have you never been to a rural area in your life? How about Appalachia which is nothing but poor white people (most from the loss of the mines, yeah severly grueling dangerous labor they did that to feed their family and the pay was crap but now even that's gone) with poor schools. Hell in places like England its WHITES who are falling behind because of the rampant pity party many minorities throw every time they are not handed what ever crap they want this time. The irony is minorities are dominating, black women are the second most likely to go to college of ALL groups only behind white women (who make up far more of the population). But some how your still discriminated against?
You're barking up the wrong tree. I'm not white or black, but I've been raised with families of both colors. Nothing i say will be as biased as what a white or black person may say. I'm as neutral as can be.
It does not matter is there's no law about it now. When people put it into practice, then it becomes just as bad. When two criminals, white and black, go to court for the exact same crime, then statistically the black person will get the longer sentence. If that isn't as legal as it can get while still not putting things into law, then you're really turning a blind eye. A black teen committed suicide after he was arrested on suspicion of stealing a backpack, he was thrown into Riker's prison (one of the worst prisons in the country) and locked into solitary confinement for 2 years!!! He was never even given a trial. Now, tell me how many white people this happens to? His mental health had been demolished by the experience.
Even Native Americans and Mexicans have similar issues.
Even dark Mexicans and Native Americans face similar issues. There is a reservation school in my state that is about to be sued. they placed a majority of white teachers and administration on the reservation. That is not the issue. The issue is they started punishing kids for no reason. One white student was putting her hair in a pony tail and lost control of her hair band. It shot across the room and landed at the feet of a native student. The student bent to pick it up to return it, and the teacher had them suspended for assault with a deadly weapon... That's just one in a long list of the things that darker children go through.
That does not include what our parents and grandparents went through and are still recovering from. Blacks and other dark minorities have compounded issues over generations. No matter how hard they work, these issues cannot be overcome by one generation of hard work that way it can be in any white family. These aren't self imposed conditions for generations
The poor white neighborhoods are often like classy motels compared to poor black neighborhoods. How many have you visited or lived in? I welcome you to my state to peruse the poor white areas. No one really struggles here unless they decide to. The poor white schools are fully supplied and fully staffed. Hmmm...
I do agree that the black community has its faults. Every community does. The problem lies in people of pother colors assuming all black people are bad because some black people have faults. The white communities have major meth and drug problems, but I don't assume every white person is a violent meth head. I don't refuse jobs, housing, friendship, etc to all whites, because some whites have issues. That is the difference. How often do you see anyone online say, "No whites, I choose not to associate with whites?" I see it all the time in reference to blacks. How often do you hear whites being called cockroaches? I hear it about Mexicans. They can make 90k and be refused homes.
Hmmm... You like to overlook things quite a bit. My state is 95% white. Any citizen of my state gets a free ride to college. Yet, most black people, due to every generation before mine being held back economically, cannot afford to relocate to a state where they get a free ride. So, again, there's no white only on paper. The system made it available to whites only and only people who are economically capable of getting here. No one outside of any white family has prevented whites from coming to my state to get a free education.
The Irish migration was in the mid 1800's. That was a good 170 years ago. Jim Crow was 50 years ago. Anti-Italian sentiment was also concentrated around that time. Can you not do the math to compute who has had more time to recover? Get back to me in about 120 years about whether or not blacks have recovered financially and socially...
My community? Nah, every community is my community. There are millions of hard working black people.
The lack of fathers has a lot to do with what the WHITE government dictated about family aide in the mid 1900's. Oh, you don't know about that? Let me help you. Blacks were not allowed to have good jobs. They could work from sun up till sun down, and they would not have enough to provide for their children. In order to receive welfare at its start, you had to be a single mother with children. You could not have a father for your children. So, women had to choose their man or choose their children. Most chose to be able to feed their children. Their aide would be revoked if they were caught with a man. This created a whole generation of fatherless black children. All of these children raised with no father no longer knew what a father should be much less how to choose one or how to be one their selves. That is how the black community became fatherless.
On top of that is the aforementioned excessive sentencing that had been admitted to by review boards across the country where blacks were given longer sentences than comparable whites. Even if a man wanted to be a father, those excessive sentences would cut him out automatically. Very gradually the black community is recovering from all of this, but the fact that you don't bother to learn the history and then begrudge people their right to recover and to get help to recover from something that was forced onto them for hundreds of years is beyond me. If you work sun up to sundown, do you expect to be able to feed your children? I see a lot of Mexicans working just as hard as the blacks and still being put down economically. Like I said, I've seen Mexicans who made 90k be turned down by a white person for a rental, because the person assumed bad things based on how dark them are. They fit with the Native American plight, because darker Mexicans are just mixed Native Americans.
Also, white ethnicities do have scholarships for their heritages...
www.scholarships.com/.../irish
Funny how that works. Irish and Italian are both there.
Immigrants in general do better... They have not had the same issues that U. S. minorities have had. It's incomparable.
My 95 % white state has free lunch programs and free transportation to schools... I've been to 41 states, and all of them had it. I honestly don't know where you live that does not have it...
Again, the score adjustment is due to the fact that blacks do not get the same quality of schools as white kids do. If you can make it through schools that do not have books or computers, had the worst staff to student ratio, no tutoring or intervention programs, and score nearly as high as someone who did, you are very likely a genius.
Don't put words in my mouth. Try settling down and listening instead of crying about yourself. Did anyone enslave or create laws to keep your ancestors from being able to work hard to get ahead in life? Have you been turned down for jobs, housing, friendships, etc for being white? Have you been punished at school or in court excessively for being white? Is anything in life stopping you but you? No.
No one said whites have it easy. The only statement being made is that your life is not being made harder for being white. Your skin color is not against you from birth. I'm not sure if you can comprehend the difference between that and what you want to think people are saying white privilege is. My white relatives have been doing great for generations. Never once have they had any issue because of their skin, and they thrive because of that. My black relatives have jumped ahead since Jim Crow was removed, but healing and success take time. All barriers based on color need to be removed.
Illinois, huh. I'm just seeing that. I've avoided anything near Chicago. lol. It's a cesspool. My ex has been buying up property in Chicago though.
Again, no one said whites cannot be poor. That has never been stated. anything you derive like that is clearly in your own head, and it shows a distinct lack of understanding of the differences between your struggles and those of others. Just because you struggle does not mean other people do not struggle more. A Muslim girl comes to the U. S., has had her vagina cut off without anesthesia due to her culture, is punished in the head by a white man in a hospital, is spit on by strangers in public, struggles with her family at home, is bullied and attacked at school. Does her misery detract from yours? Do her struggles based on her heritage when she gets here mean that you don't have struggles unrelated to your heritage? Is it racist to say you have different struggles? No. It's fact.
Blacks want white struggles. It's so simple.
I'm not going to speak on England, because this conversation is strictly about the U. S. Other countries have entirely different issues. My sister in law's dad was a miner. My best friend was from Arkansas. Neither of them had the struggles that black people did even though they were poor. It's incomparable. No one showed up to lynch, beat, or rape them in the night. If a crime was committed, they were able to report it to the police. In a black neighborhood, it can take police up to 3 hours to arrive after a call. The police station only being 2 blocks away... Just completely incomparable.
Look at the numbers for those stats. I actually had this discussion on another of Roland's posts. Without combing through his posts to find it.. The summary was that the title of the article that first reported that was misleading. I posted a link to all of the stats and everything. I don't have time now.
While more likely to attend, whites are still far more likely to complete higher degrees.
@wolfcat87 No you never said that, you said poor blacks don't get good education, I stated that their are more poor whites, and that their neighborhood schools are just as if not more dilapidated and unfunded as blacks schools. That was your argument, in fact lets be perfectly honest here, your argument IS that whites have it easier because they are white, that is what white privilege is and how the term is used and that is factually incorrect. I realize that in our current society its completely okay and even encouraged to be racist towards white people, but that doesn't mean its morally right. That's all these arguments are.
@wolfcat87 As for other people struggling sure, their are absolutely other people who struggle more. Hell their is a very good possibility I am struggling more then you ever have (I was born poor, first to graduate highschool in several generations, was beaten raped starved and just generally tortured for most of my early childhood and I don't get special privileges like special grants and scholarships and ease of hiring and admittance like you and other minorities have while also being blamed for every bad thing in every ones life they have ever experienced even simply because the color of my skin while also having all of my suffering being ignored) and you probably have not experienced half the pain and suffering that I have. Doesn't mean that some one else doesn't have it worse then me, but it doesn't mean that if you have a certain skin color your suddenly better/worse off, that's racism which your spewing out.
@wolfcat87 So I do find it interesting that you talk about how others have it worse but you don't include yourself in that category, you consider yourself as one of those who has it worse when in all likely hood you have had it easier then two thirds of the human population. Yes I have it way better then so many other people its unbelievable. I have had the privilege of being born in the US, that has given me a near infinite number of advantages that some one born say in an Africa, specifically the more war torn regions or the tribal areas, have. It puts me in a better position then many Asian people and those who are in communistic nations, most people in the middle east etc. But then that also applies to all people who live in the west not just whites, that includes you. Claiming that one group is in total worse off then another using only their "race" as a barometer to that is ABSURD! Is Obama worse off then me as well? How about Larry Elder? Thomas Sowell? Every rapper?
@wolfcat87 Every black actor? How about the 35,000 black millionaires? Are they also worse off then whites? Just for reference that's 13% of the black population that is millionaires, for whites its 15% of their population are millionaires. Their are 41.7 million blacks in the US, in comparison their are 230 million whites. In short, they are comparable percentages of rich blacks and whites, the only difference is that their is over 5x more whites then blacks. That's why it seems like they are better off, because they have more people. Their are more poor white children then poor black children: http://nccp.org/media/releases/release_34.html
Their are more poor whites then their are poor blacks: breakingbrown.com/.../
Yet interestingly the rates of welfare are about equal between the two groups (roughly 30%).
@wolfcat87 Yet some how its white people who have it easy, white people who are "privileged" because again, that is what that term means. As for your "different struggles", that is self inflicted. Its due to fatherlessness which over 65% of black children will not have a father figure in their lives, at least not reliably. marriage rates are even lower at about 40% for black women which further creates broken homes (also abortion is significantly more common in the black community which creates a host of health problems). The fatherlessness creates increased rates of criminality, substance abuse, academic failure, suicide, depression, poverty (because one income house hold combined with academic failure ensures generational poverty), promiscuity (which can be seen in "black" music and culture which also happens to perpetuate the damn problem), and even physical health problems (probably due to higher cordisol levels (stress hormones) which wear the body down faster).
@wolfcat87 This is a choice those in the black community have made, its a choice they have endorsed and defended tooth and nail. No one made you do it you chose it. And before you pull the "but slavery" argument, Irish where in the same boat, literally they where forced into servitude in the America's, they don't have these problems (in fact white slavery was stopped around the 1850's (the ottomans loved to enslave whites (which is where we get the term slave to begin with as its derived from the word slav or Slavic i. e. a group of white people who where enslaved by so many different groups that their very name became synonymous with the act of forced subjugation), about as much as Africans loved enslaving Africans.) and yet we do not see these problems in the white community. In fact we didn't even see it in the black community until the late 70s early 80s right when the war on poverty hit and welfare programs that specifically required women to be single mothers in order to get
@wolfcat87 money where created and specifically targeted the black community. This was exploited by some women, and allowed for other women to take greater risks in whom they had relationships with as it created a safety net for them. Then when those children who where raised in fatherless homes reached puberty they started acting out, which is when the increased rates of crime drugs poverty occurred. You where more likely to have an intact family in the black community 100 years ago then you are now. Again, this is a choice the black community inflicted on itself (and yes I would agree that the left has not helped in this as they continue to endorse piss poor behavior (because it gets them votes) and scream racism when ever any one wants to mention this fact so that real change can occur). Its not "white privilege", its a god damn choice which is why African immigrants fair better then most whites and almost all native born blacks despite them being black. This is a FACT.
@wolfcat87 As for lynchings, when was the last one? Not fucking recent. Who else was lynched, you know by the democraticly aligned KKK? Oh yeah white republicans. That's right, whites WHERE lynched. But again, when was the last one? Not fucking recently. Out of all the people lynched from the end of the civil war to now, are about 4,743, about 1297 of those where white which is about 30% and it was because they spoke out against racism and lynching (I know, not all white people where and are racist pieces of shit? Crazy!). That leaves us with 3436 blacks who where lynched in the past that's in 153 years, 3436 blacks where lynched, almost all of those where more then two generations ago, and then factor in that about 9, 252 blacks are killed by other blacks per year on average (over the course of the past 35 years) which is more then double all blacks killed by lynchings over the course of 153 years, we can safely say that the problem IS NOT WHITE PRIVILEGE.
@wolfcat87 As for the claims of police, the fact of the matter is that blacks are FAR more likely to hinder investigations, not cooperate which causes many issues. The whole notion of don't trust police and don't cooperate with them, that entire culture hinders any real attempt to fix the black community (then the black community that refuses to cooperate, refuses to testify, refuses to give any information about incidence turns around and claims that its all the polices fault even though its clearly not). Also fun fact a police officer is 20% more likely to be shot by a black person then a black person is to be shot by the cops so their goes any notion of "evil racist cops" you might come up with. Its YOUR FAULT. I don't mean that because of your race, I say that because of your attitude, its the refusal to acknowledge the facts, the insane victim complex and the rampant racism (blacks are actually 2x as likely to commit a hate crime then whites are) that's causing the problems, not
@wolfcat87 this mythical unprovable undefinable "white privilege" that you go on about being the source of all your suffering even as every other group passes you by in health, happiness, wealth and over all productivity even and especially OTHER BLACKS. Their is your problem, a victim can never be anything more then a victim and until you stop being one your going to wallow in self pity and demand that others do for you what you refuse to do for yourself. Stop using your racism as an excuse for piss poor behavior and act like an adult.
Irish were not enslaved for 200 yeahs, and they were indentured. If an indentured slave ran off, their whiteness allowed them to get away much more easily than black slaves who could be captured and resold even once free. Even free blacks who were never slaves could be caught and sold.
Yeah, don't bring Eurasia into a debate about the U. S. I'm 100% sure you are not familiar with the current ethnic issues in Turkey or Syria or even how their past developed when you are unclear on our own history.
African slavery did exist, but it was nothing like American slavery. Try again.
Ahhh, now you think there were no problems in the black community before the 70's... Hmmm... You also admit that welfare programs contributed, but you still pretend that the issue was entirely on blacks. Let me tell you, white families that went into those programs suffered the same long term father issues. It was not abuse, it was how the system guidelines were set up to keep women on them instead of helping.
@wolfcat87 Indentured servants of irish descent where treated worse then black slaves. They where believed to be less "docile" and "lazier" then black slaves. That's why they where given more dangerous tasks. As for indentured servitude, that's correct they where indentured, I mean they had a gun to their head when they where forced to sign their life away and shipped off against their will, but it was indentured technically. But then so where all black "slaves" before 1657. What happened in 1657? Well Anthony Johnson, a black man with his five indentured servants, four white irish and one black, was awarded his black indentured servant as a slave because he ran off and tried to violate his agreement. That's right a black plantation owner owned a black slave and white "slaves"(because you want to get technical but then also want to claim that blacks where slave for most of history too some how even though they where also indentured).
Those programs kept people dependent. The difference is that white people were not in the same high need category of blacks at that time. Why? They were not legally kept poor. So, whites who were poor were due to their own decisions and not the government. You love to continue ignoring that fact. The fact that only 50 years ago The white communities where blacks lived beat them, killed them, lynched them, raped them, etc. All legally. You love to ignore the fact that the laws changing did not change the people who still wanted that system to stay. Those people only recently started dying, and their children are still alive today.
In this day and age, we still have teachers like this:
nypost.com/.../
But, you still want to pretend that no one hates blacks or tries to hold them back. There are whole websites designed to hate minorities.
https://www.stormfront.org/forum/index.php
How many to hate whites?
African immigrants can afford to fly thousands of miles to live in a new country. They are either very well off already, in which case the system has no effect, or they are so poor that even being poor here makes no difference to them. They've started out with a completely different system, got an early education away from whites who hate them and want to ruin their lives, and AGAIN did not suffer through 200 years of issues that American blacks did.
As you point this out though, what's your family's excuse for being piss poor? You're so happily pointing out immigrants. No one in the world to hold them back, and your family still chose to be broke. Your anger should be at your family, it should not be at people who sure as heck did not hold you back in any way.
@wolfcat87 Also fun fact 48% of free blacks owned slaves, on average about five and as Anthony Johnson shows, they where not their spouses. How many whites owned slaves? Oh yeah it was 1.5%. Wow, that really changes the narrative doesn't it? I mean Africans created the slave trade, sold off their African neighbors (as any African could tell you) then when they where free they got themselves slaves and created plantations. Meanwhile few whites owned slaves and whites also fought and died to end slavery, then forced other groups to get rid of their slaves, like the native americans (who refused to do so and only did it because of the evil white peoples significantly larger army. Also the evil white people told them they should make the slaves citizens of their nations, the natives refused not wanting to taint their blood with that of slaves. Very noble of them) and every other nation in the world as slavery predated the written word and existed every where their where humans.
@wolfcat87 Also fun fact, the last nation to ban slavery was Mauritania, an African nation (which where tied with most relectuant to end slavery with the Middle east) which banned it in 81, that's 1981 because you know evil racist white people. So yeah, lets not talk about "not knowing your own history" as I have thrown out more history then you ever knew existed. Never said racism didn't exist, never said blacks didn't have issues, I said the current issues are recent developments which go all the way back to welfare programs. You don't see the same problems in white families as blacks because whites would not tolerate that behavior, no one was sitting their coddling whites, no one was sitting their saying that its okay that they just can't help giving in to their urges. So yeah as I said their where some people who are contributing to the problem, I also mentioned that those people are put in power by blacks so you have to own up to your own actions.
@wolfcat87 African slavery was like American slavery, but you know worse. Same with the slave trade in the middle east where most slaves died before ever reaching their destinations due to the ottomans (modern day Turks (which again, I pointed out that they where also prone to the whole racism thing and mistreatment of people and you then suggested I didn't know anything about it even though I already made mention of it (you should really start paying attention before going on your racist rants) tendency to emasculate male slaves (cutting off the penis as well as the testicals) which usually resulted in lethal blood loss or lethal infection as well as managing to rape women to death. If you where going to be a slave, being owned by the rare white slave owner (as I previously mentioned) was preferable as their where laws that actually protected slaves to some degree.
Post links that prove that 48% of all free blacks owned slaves. A slave cost as much as a new car back then, so your claim would imply that 48% of free blacks were as rich as 1.5% of all whites... If that is true, then there's the even larger question of why whites decided to stay poor instead of working their way up in a world that hated blacks...
Whites did not fight and die to end slavery. Whites fought and died to maintain the Union. HUGE difference there. Lincoln only freed the slaves to weaken the Confederacy. Very few whites supported ending slavery when the Civil War began, and only the desire to end the war faster provided enough white support to make it happen.
No slavery in the world compared to what whites did to the world. They managed to kill about 63 million people worldwide... in the name of racism and slavery. Tell me anyone else who did that? In Africa, North America, Australia, Central America, South America, and the Caribbean. Look it up.
Woah, that is waaaaay too much to read this late at night. I have an exam tomorrow.
Again, you miss all of the points. The fact that you are so upset that other people had it worse instead of just accepting it is not an attack on you that others had it worse is just insane. I could talk to you until the cows come home, but your severe cultural bias leaves you incapable of putting yourself in the shoes of anyone else for even a minute. That means logical debate is pointless.
Again, I will say, I do not include myself in this for a reason. I've already stated that I am not black or white. Therefore, unlike you, I am an impartial party. I certainly do have white privilege though. I see no reason to deny it. I use it to my full advantage. It's only your own fault if you are too busy whining that it's not real to use it yourself. XD
Have a nice night, hon. Good luck with your quest to hate others and place blame somewhere. That's certainly not the point of the term white privilege.
@wolfcat87 Also black slaves had about the same life expectancy in the US as free citizens, in south America (where most slaves went (only about 5% went to the US)) where lower. So again, African slavery and the slavery of others was different then white slavery, namely being that whites where less likely to kill them and had fewer of them and had an over whelming aversion to them, with the exception of the rich democrats (who where racist and honestly still are). But then that's not all whites or even half of whites its, well as I pointed out only 1% of them owned slaves as opposed to half of all free blacks. Just because I am putting things in context doesn't mean I am suggesting it wasn't bad, nor am I suggesting it was okay, I know how people like yourself like to do that, either whites hate themselves and are demeened and treated like shit or they are racist in your eyes, but that's not reality.
Uh, no. The mortality rate for Black slave babies was extremely high. Between that and the intense work conditions, their life expectancy at some points was only 2 years from the start of their enslavement. White slaves were too easy to sympathize with, because They were still considered human. Blacks were animals.
I know what percent owned slaves. I don't dispute that number. I've been on another of Roland's posts defending whites, because I know that some northern whites really helped the Civil Rights movement. I'll happily jump in to correct both sides when they are wrong.
No one who is not racist will say that all whites were or are out to get blacks. That's not what this is. So many people try to misinterpret white privilege to mean something it is not. You guys let it feed into your insecurity. It's not asking for something special. it's not out to hate anyone. At the end of the day, it's pointing out the inequality in order to draw attention to it to fix it. That's it.
Personally, I know that blacks can get ahead with a lot of luck. I also know the numbers.
20 years ago there were less than 5 female CEO's of major companies in the U. S.
There were even less blacks.
Now, there are about 20 female CEO's of major companies in the U. S.
There are less black male and female CEO's than that.
When tracing up the ladder and interviewing company heads, it's still very clear that both women and minorities are kept out of promotions.
It's things like that. When a black, female CEO of Sam's Club stated that she wanted to fix this by refusing to deal with companies that only promoted white males, she was bashed for being a racist. Even though her policy would support companies with white female management and leadership. Think about that. Had a white woman said it, she would have been applauded. Instead, people boycotted Sam's Club and demanded this rare woman be fired. Because of the color of her skin and her fight for equality for women and minorities.
@wolfcat87 I really don't feel like going through all of this when we both know you will never listen, never consider the facts (I mean you haven't yet why the hell would you start now?) etc. But what your saying is absolutely racist (let me guess you can't be racist because you have white friends?), their is no disputing that. You are blaming all whites because your saying that we are given special benefits for our whiteness, benefits which cannot actually be explained, measured or otherwise quantified while dismissing all the benefits which can be explained (as I have done), measured (as I have shown the statistics), and quantified. Your racist, he is racist, that's just what it is. As a white man I am experienced with societies racism towards whites, especially from blacks (which is why blacks are twice as likely to commit hate crimes against whites then whites are against blacks, again despite being only 13% of the population).
@wolfcat87 However to address some of your statements, no slaves life spans where actually pretty descent only being about a year or two off of the standard in the US: 4.bp.blogspot.com/.../...ations%2Bline%2Bgraph.png
Yes infant mortality was a huge issue, but that was a huge issue for everyone, that's why it was common to have ten kids, because most would die before reaching adult hood.(in fact their life expectancy was not much lower then in some places in Africa today). As for your statement of "some northern whites", that's inaccurate, many whites fought against slavery. In fact the quakers had outlawed it outright, many states had as well (we are talking millions of people ) and their where fights every time a new territory was made a state to try and make it an abolishiness state. MOST people where against slavery, but the rich where not and that makes the difference.
@wolfcat87 Blacks can't get ahead with a lot of luck, that's idiotically stupid. They can get ahead by staying in school, not having kids out of wedlock (currently 72% of all blacks are born out of wedlock), not break the law (50% of all murders are commited by blacks, most crime in fact is commited by blacks despite the fact that they are only 13% of the population) and get a job. That's it, that's secret, be a proper parent, stay in school, don't be an asshole. Not luck, just the same shit we expect from every single other human being in the world. Hence, again, African immigrants succeeding where native born blacks fail miserably, because they do those things, you know not be a piece of shit, be proper parents, go to school, work hard. That's why they out earn most whites. atlantablackstar.com/.../
Which I have pointed out before, which you ignored because you where to busy throwing a pity party.
@wolfcat87 As for your claims of CEO's, their is at reason why their are significantly more white CEO's, you ready for it? 63% of the US population is WHITE! Which one is more likely to stay in school, whites or blacks? WHITES! ERGO WHITES ARE GOING TO BE MORE LIKELY TO BE CEO'S BECAUSE THEY ARE THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE POPULATION, THEY ARE FAR MORE LIKELY TO STAY IN SCHOOL AND GO TO COLLEGE, LESS LIKELY TO COMMIT CRIMES, AND THUS MORE LIKELY TO BE CHOSEN TO BE A CEO OF A GOD DAMN COMPANY! Common sense should have told you that. As for the claims of "Women CEO's" that's because women don't want to work the 100 work weeks to be CEO's as all data has shown. When a woman goes hey we should only hire black women as CEO's and other positions, YES THATS RACIST! How do you not understand that? If you are choosing some one for an occupation purely on their race and not merit, then your showing a preferential treatment towards that race and thus are racist. COMMON FUCKING SENSE!
@wolfcat87 ITs not equality if your being preferential. Your not saying hey we should hire some one because they are capable your saying we should hire some one because they happen to have the right shade of skin. HOW THE FUCK IS THAT NOT RACIST? Don't pretend like your that fucking stupid to not figure it out. By that reasoning their is nothing wrong with white people hiring only white people, just because they are showing a preferential treatment towards some one of the same skin color doesn't mean they are racist. Oh wait, YES IT FUCKING DOES! You are racist, you are incredibly racist and I am done with this your a terrible human being you despise whites because you literally have to believe that all whites are racist and conspiring against you to make the shit arguments you are making but what is worse is that you think even less of blacks.
@wolfcat87 You demand that white people use their white people magic to fix black peoples lives because they are to stupid and weak to do it on their own. Well that's bullshit, their is no reason why you can't be held accountable for your actions. Their is no reason why you can't look at your community and decide that it needs to be fixed and you know actually do something to fix it instead of bitching and whining and demanding that you get even more special privileges which the ones you already have didn't do a damn thing (because the problem is you not the rest of the world). You want white people to take responsibility for your fuck ups, like not being their for your children (again, over 70% of children born out of wedlock, 65% raised without a father etc. etc.), making excuses for the rampant crimes how its not your fault (because all the bars on the fucking windows in Chicago is to keep out all the racist white people and cops right?),
@wolfcat87 you want white people to take responsibility for all of the bullshit your community pulls BUT you refuse to allow us to have any kind of authority. WHy is that do you think? Because if we had the authority your community would be fixed, because we wouldn't tolerate you murdering each other (again, blacks kill almost three times as many blacks who where lynched over the period of 153 years annually), we would demand that you stay in school, if you decided to act like a piece of shit you would be punished for it etc. no differently then we would treat white people. You want to be treated differently you want the privilege but none of the responsibilities and that's why your communities are shit, that's why the only ones that actually succeed in the black community are the ones who abandon the shitty victim culture of the black community or where never raised in it. ITs your fault, you fix your own fucking problem and stop blaming white people for it (again, its really racist).
I have seen every single one of these videos. I know Thomas Sowell's work very well.
None of this refutes my points. African immigrants must negotiate "White" privilege the same as every other non-"White' person in America.
Please read the take. I put a lot of effort into it. Again, the point is "White" privilege exists and it must be negotiated.
Weird. How in the world does Wolfcat87 want "White" people to take repsonsibility for her "bs"?
She is half-"White".
Does she have to be pure "White" or a full "White" to avoid being a victim when she talks about "White" privilege? How does it work over there in raciology?
You're racist for assuming my race... Did you really just say that my excuse for not being racist is because I "have white friends"? What color am I? I've stated quite a few facts. I am literally the only unbiased person i this conversation, and that makes you the person unable to come to terms with facts.
Roland gets it. I am half white. My father's family is Norwegian/French/British. My grandmother's French/British family has been here since the American Revolution, and my grandfather's Norwegian side migrated here a few generations back. I spent my life in both worlds, so I am one of a small number of people able to see these issues impartially. I've seen the detail of how both worlds work. I'm not white or black, but I am both.
Also, I'm not really looking for a pity party. I certainly do not need any pity. I do well for myself and am better off than most Americans in general. This is still due in part to my white privilege.
You jumped from my statement that some whites helped with the Civil Rights Movement to most whites being anti slavery...
I know my history, love. Being passively against something does not equal being actively for something. Most of us are against the huge issue of gradually increasing plastic in our environment. Most of us still choose plastic bags and containers to buy while shopping... Anti-Slavery and Pro-Civil Rights had very similar responses. Look at the masses of people marching on D. C. to watch MLK speak... The crowd is not mostly white. Yet, our population most certainly was white. Therefore, most whites did not get involved in the civil Rights Movement. The Civil War was to maintain the union. Lincoln was only able to free slaves as a war tactic. Impossible in peace times
I can agree with the ideas that people should stay in school and not commit crimes. The problem with that reasoning is that most black people do stay in school and do not commit crimes. So... why are those people still struggling? Why are they still facing discrimination? You clearly ignored my comment about the inability for women and minorities to promote in many companies even though they certainly are qualified. Your blinders are on.
As for children outside of marriage... That is certainly nothing to prevent good parenting or success. One of my female friends was able to collect two bachelor's degrees. She had two children outside of marriage and two while married. People should be good parents. Marriage is not a requirement.
"The Pew Research Survey also indicated foreign born Blacks were older, more educated than Black Americans and more likely to be married."
As your article states; they are older, married, and educated before arriving here. They were able to skip this mess.
That is not the reason for more white CEO's. Not to mention, your racial hatred has blinded you to the female part of the story much like the people who attacked the black CEO when she said she was for helping females of all colors who were also underrepresented. There are hundreds of CEO's. For only just over 20 total to be female or a minority shows an extreme misrepresentation of our population. So, genius, what's your reasoning for there to be so few white women? The CEO's who did make it were interviewed. They all agree that there is an extreme bias. Promotions past middle management become extremely political and are dominated by white males. It's not about education or qualifications at that point.
www.theatlantic.com/.../
2% peak for black CEO's. Blacks make up 14% of the population. If we adjust for number of degrees per ethnicity, (graduate degrees per race - whites 10.8%, blacks 6.1%)... Something is wrong.
@wolfcat87 Really, blacks stay in school? They don't commit crimes? You think statistics back that up? Or are you just pulling that out of your ass because you don't like the idea of not being a victim to anything but poor choices? Lets look at the stats: https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/htus8008.pdf
books.google.co.uk/books
www.washingtonpost.com/.../?utm_term=.aded4e6ef67c
www.nationalreview.com/.../
www.childtrends.org/.../
fivethirtyeight.com/.../
@wolfcat87 www.dailywire.com/.../7-statistics-you-need-know-about-black-black-crime-aaron-bandler
www.photius.com/.../facts_on_fatherless_kids.html
thefatherlessgeneration.wordpress.com/statistics/
www.theatlantic.com/.../
www.fathers.com/.../
So no, you where wrong on all accounts, but then at this point it shouldn't be that suprising. Stop claiming all white people are racist (you are), stop claiming society is out to get you (its not, you are pampered compared to most every other group both as a black person and a woman), stop making excuses because all it does is hurt the black community. Currently I'm helping raise a black child, I can guaren-fucking-tee that his father is a dead beat, has talked to him maybe twice in a year and its really fucked him up. It really does matter.
@wolfcat87 I also find it interesting that you say I have a racial hatred even as you blame white people for everything. Also I didn't ignore any component to the CEO question, I actually pointed out quite clearly that women don't want the jobs, its a choice, and their is no bias that we can see. Some one saying their is doesn't make it a fact, it just makes them a virtue signaling asshole who is trying to win brownie points by pandering to people like yourself who expect every one to lift you up and make your life better while you sit on your ass doing nothing but act like a fucking parasite. Also, again, I stated that their where plenty of other minority groups doing just fine amongs those Africans. How is that racial? How can I be filled with racial hatred when I point to one group of blacks and say they are being successful and then point to another and say they are not? How is that racist?
@wolfcat87 Your blaming all white people and saying blacks are worthless and can't do anything for themselves and I'm saying no, their is no group that is inherently bad, blacks are perfectly capable and we know they are because you have plenty of blacks who are capable (like Thomas Sowell, Larry Elder, African immigrants, etc. etc.) and I'm racist? You hate every one yourself included because of skin color, and I'm the racist? Yeah I'm done here.
You are not answering my question. If she is at least half "White", how is she blaming all "White" people? Would you say she is blaming herself?
Half of herself?
How does it work in raciology land?
... Did you just say "You think blacks stay in school? you think they don't commit crimes?" Ummm... Darling, there are people of every color who drop out of school and commit crimes. that in no way means the majority of people of any color do those things... That was a very racist statement to make.
Did you even read this link that you provided showing exactly what I stated about college degrees? Your own resource backs my stance that there should be a higher number of black CEO's. Why are there not? Could it possibly be due to people like you that run around screaming that all black people are high school drop out murderers? Hmm... There are 37,144,530 non-Hispanic blacks. If they were all murdering people, then most people would be dead in this country. There are only about 5,000 murders a year according to FBI stats. So, clearly, most blacks are not murdering anyone. If you cannot see how racist your posts have become at this point, then you are delusional.
fivethirtyeight.com/.../
Here's your own link back at you.
Also, this is certainly not about all whites. Most whites are great people who are not racist. There certainly are racist whites like you though who should take the time to confront your own racial bias and where it might be stemming from. Very often it's rooted in ignorance or fear, sometimes it stems from a lack of appreciation of your own culture. Which is it in your case? Do you have an inner shame of your family's history and over compensate by redirecting that hate and shame at others? I certainly feel no shame or hate towards your ancestors. I love mine, and I feel no reason to misdirect hatred at you.
Your links about fathers show that you truly missed my point. I never said that fathers are not valuable. Also, not marrying does not mean a father is not around. Also, I certainly was not wrong in saying that single mothers can and do work and go to college while raising their children. Over 2 million single moms attend college every year.
Remember, I never claimed all white people are anything. That statement only occurred in your own mind. Feel free to read everything I wrote. Once you have done so, and see that you are imagining things, you should take the time to wonder why everyone you assume is black is saying they think all white people are racist to you... That is exactly what happened here. You assumed I was black, and then you assumed I was insulting white people and making negative comments about whites... Perhaps you should seek therapy for these inner demons. My state is 95% white, I chose to live here. I'm half white. Clearly, my issue isn't with whites.
Also, since you are stuck on this...
My family is half white.
My husband is white.
My children are white.
My in-laws are white.
I live in a 95% white state voluntarily.
Many of my friends are white due to my location.
Most of my exes are white due to my location.
When you continue to insist that somehow I hate whites, it's kind of hilarious. I've never hated on whites (or any race) in my life. It truly would be self hate, and I was raised to love myself, my history, both of my family trees, and all people.
I like where you pointed out that white isn't even the majority race of the world. Actually, I just looked it up. It's mostly Asian. Lol
Well not exactly. Asian isn't a race. To be specific, except for north Asia, Asians are caucasians
@Political_dude Asians are not Caucasians. Just cause their skin is white doesn't make them white. They're Asian which is completely different then white like me
@kittycat119
The Caucasian race (also Caucasoid,[1] or Europid)[2] is a grouping of human beings historically regarded as a biological taxon, which, depending on which of the historical race classifications used, have usually included some or all of the ancient and modern populations of Europe, the Caucasus, Asia Minor, North Africa, the Horn of Africa, Western Asia, Central Asia and South Asia.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caucasian_race
Sorry for wikipedia but it is the easiest link available
@Political_dude then by that logic a ton of African people are Caucasians. And I don't mean the white south Africans either.
@kittycat119 What he's saying, I think, is that Caucasian isn't exclusively "white"
@NoBullsh1t well almost none of the terms we use are definitively the correct race or color for the person. I mean we use African American for black people when a shit ton of white people are African as well. Almost none of the terms we use are used properly
@NoBullsh1t Exactly. Only north Americans think that caucasians are white skinned people. In reality, north Africans are Caucasians too.
I'll give you another example to prove how wrong north Americans are:
Asian refers to anyone living in Asia (including Indian, Japan, Pakistan, China , UAE etc) but when you say "Asian" in North America, it refers to China, Japan and people with small eyes. That's not true. Indians are Asians too and so Pakistanis
@Political_dude and some of Russia
@kittycat119 in Asia? No. Because Russia is whole big nation divided in Europe and Asia. They belong to whole different ethic groups so you can't really include them.
True. Race is not defined by colour. Instead by body features like shape of skull
@Political_dude actually the part of Russia in Asian those people are considered Asian. Or Asian something. But they're still Asians.
@Political_dude hence how I can be the whitest Hispanic person ever and loon like a ghost 👻
Oh Absolutely. Asians far outnumber everyone else. You would think we would see more of them in Hollywood movies, especially sci-fi flick about earth in the future.
Won't we all be looking kind of Asian?
@Political_dude Yeah, you are still talking about race nonsense.
Dude, you are Indian. Indian isn't a race. And stop posting Wikipedia. I can make an entry in Wikipedia.
You are too smart for this nonsense. Post something from an actual scientist.
@kittycat119 Because we group people by their chosen group identity. Would a "White" African identify with being more with being "White" or being African. If it is African, why in the world do we bother with the term "White"?
Obviously the term "White", means a lot to them. So let them have their designation Kitty. There is no objective standard for grouping human outside the science call genetics.
Genetic groups are objectively determined and they are called haplogroups.
www.kerchner.com/.../...grationmap_(FTDNA2006).jpg
I'm Caucasian and I was profiled a number of times as a teenager when I would be out driving my car (which was actually my father's old car and in his name). They'd see me as a teenager driving, run the license plate (it would come back with my dad's information), and I'd get pulled over. Then, after requesting my license, registration, and proof of insurance, see the same name on everything (I'm named after my father), ask if I have permission to drive the car and/or did I alter documents. Then, since I was pulled over, wanting to know if they could search the vehicle. This happened to me 4 to 6 times as a teenager until I got my own car in my name. I was also stopped and questioned once in Manhattan in my mid-20s because I fit the description of someone they were looking for that was harassing college students.
Why are you telling me about being profiled as a teenager?
I guess I don't understand the point of your post.
Do security guards in wallmart give dirt looks to you? If not, you aren't racial profiled. you are white.
1.) I don't think I've ever been in a Walmart.
2.) I get dirty looks all the time.
Not cos your race
@wil-i-am Well, I don't think you are going to convince anti-PC people with empathy. They do not give empathy. They can only demand it. My argument is constructed for non-"Whites". If you are young and you are not "White", you need to understand the racist stereotypes that could affect you.
This 14 year-old young man was nearly shot and killed because he knocked on the door of a person who steadfastly believes in racist stereotypes.
His mother in my opinion needed to explain to him that he could be shot and killed because of someone's beliefs about his supposed "race".
Understanding "White" Privilege: What is so Hard to Understand? ↗
I have plenty of empathy... and also plenty of common sense. My point was that anyone can be profiled anywhere at any time.
Also, "cos" is not a word.
But of course, anyone can be profiled at anytime. How does that disprove "White" privilege?
@RolandCuthbert That's a term created in a safe space on a college campus to bring in more money and student loans on the backs of the taxpayers so perpetual students can stay in college forever, contribute nothing useful to society, and do nothing productive with their lives other than polishing their couches with their asses.
O. J. Simpson, Robert Blake, Michael Jackson, Bill Clinton, Bill Cosby, Donald Trump. What's the connection?
"Green Privilege".
Now, if you want to say more Caucasians have Green Privilege than non-Caucasians, and it's the results from the acts of those that lived in previous centuries, probably certainly so. However, the bottom line is, today, 21st century, it's "Green Privilege" and nothing else.
No, it was created to bring in anything. Look, if you think your tax dollars go to unproductive people, you need to call your congressman and get on the phone to Trump. Tell them to stop it. I thought they were fixing that. It costs more money to go to college now than it costs to buy a house. You think it should cost more. . . or?
As for the actual privilege conversation, I am sure that rich people have privilege. I have seen it. I have consulted with many corporations. I have seen rich people get stuff for free. . . simply because they are rich. And it doesn't make any sense. Why give rich people free stuff? They could simply buy it.
But anyway. Yes, I am sure that many "caucasians". . . I assume you mean "White" people, have green privilege. But they also have another privilege that has nothing to do with money. According to most "Whites", they cannot be profiled for negative behaviors.
@RolandCuthbert No, I'm talking about people who go to college with the goal of being nothing more than perpetual students. If you go to college for at least 12 years and you don't earn a Doctorate, you've wasted your time and taxpayers' dollars. Learn a trade, as I have. We are shorthanded in this country on construction personnel, teachers, and nurses. Instead, people want to be useless lifetime students working on "studies" or if they leave college, want white-collar positions with unrealistic expectations, salaries, and vacation time.
Who are these "whites" that claim they can't be profiled? Ultra-liberals, that blame whites for everything under the sun? Or ultra-conservatives, that believe whites can do no wrong? I say both. This is why I say that the 10% of people that are too far to the left, and the 10% of people that are too far to the right, are the loudest and most annoying 20% of the population that ruin everything for the 80% of the people in the middle that can figure...
... most things out in a common sense way.
I don't even know what to say about that newest conspiracy. Taxpayer dollars? Learn a trade?
What?
This is another tangential conversation. Actually, let me take that back. This conversation has nothing to do with "White" privilege. Why don't you create a take about this conspiracy to take your taxpayer dollars by making kids go to college and get advanced degrees?
As for "White" privilege, I am saying it is largely a function of society and that non-"Whites" must deal with it and figure out a way to get around it.
Not sure what take read. But mine is up there.
@RolandCuthbert No my point is that they DON'T get advanced degrees... or any sort of degrees at all. They just waste taxpayers' dollars as perpetual students for decades.
You keep calling what I'm stating is a conspiracy. There is no conspiracy. It's a FACT that there's a shortage of blue-collar workers, teachers, and nurses in this country. It's the only reason Trump carried Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, and West Virginia.
So what I'm stating is a conspiracy and your Take isn't a conspiracy (or at least, an excuse)? Seems like arrogant presumption on your part...
Sir, I don't of any students who go to school and don't get any degrees. I just don't. My niece is getting her doctorate in psychology. My other niece has a BA in Business. My nephew got a degree in mechanical engineering.
The last one just refused to stay in school. Now he just works odd jobs.
I don't know what we are talking about at this point.
If there is a shortage of blue collar workers, it isn't anyone's fault but the industries that need blue collar workers.
Why would I want to work a job for $75,000 when I can have a starting salary twice that as s security engineer?
Why would I want to work a job and be terrified that any day it could be replaced by automation or by outsourcing? And when it eventually is. . . everyone would blame me for being out of work.
I couldn't counsel kids today to get a blue collar job. No way.
@RolandCuthbert That's too bad you feel that way, because I make a six figure salary, I'm a full-time single parent, financially support my retired parents with my son and myself, and I have benefits. I'm right up there with the doctors and lawyers... but without having to pay back student loans and pay malpractice insurance bills.
@RolandCuthbert Also, counseling students or working as a security engineer can't be automated and/or outsourced?
You did not just post me claiming that you make six figures. And on top of that you say "bad you feel that way".
Uhm. . . I own my own technology consulting company. I make well over six figures. I have traveled to three different continents.
I would never counsel a kid to go into a blue collar job. you are 42 years old. Why would I do that to a college kid? They can make six figures out of the gate with the right skills. And no one gets brownie points for taking one for "team". They only get blame. That is how American society works. And if/when American society can get smart enough to work differently, then I think we might realize some better results.
Until then, my motto is, look out for number one first. Because no one else will.
Uhm, you have no idea what I mean by "security", do you? I work in the tech sector, sir.
www.computerweekly.com/.../Demand-for-security-consultancy-on-the-rise
Gartner has been looking into what the rest of this year holds for the security market and concluded that consultancy and outsourcing are in demand.
@RolandCuthbert So tech, by definition, is the advancement of communication, computers, automation, and the virtual security needed to protect it. No way that could ever be outsourced or automated, huh?
There are no brownie points, or "white privilege" (which is my point). Only work and "green privilege".
I'm 42 NOW, but I've been at the career for nearly 20 years. It didn't just happen with no work or skill or training or dedication.
Yes "... six figures out of the gate WITH THE RIGHT SKILLS..." which does not include "Gender Studies" or "The History Of XYZ Privilege" of which most 20-somethings don't have or learn. Unemployment and Xbox, here we come!
You seem to have a very condescending view of blue-collar work. Tell me, did you yourself put up the building (s) you work in? Or the planes you've flown in coming and going between three continents? Supply the electricity that runs the computers? The plumbing? The walls, floors, ceilings?
Yes always look out for #1, just as I do...
... because no one, NO ONE, is irreplaceable... regardless of anything...
Hey, it could be outsourced. So which one will be outsourced first? Your job or mine? Don't you have two factors to worry about? Outsourcing and automation? I only have one. And if I want to stay ahead of the curve, my butt had better be in training at least twice a year. Which I do.
So this isn't about "White" privilege?
If blue collar jobs are not being filled that has nothing to do with college kids. At this moment, there are people who claim they do not have job or job that pay enough. Who's fault is that? Who deserves that blame other than the people who are looking for betters jobs and the industry that is looking for workers?
I know I can't blame any one for my issues. I do not have that "privilege".
If the welding industry needs workers, they had better get their butts out to job fairs with appropriate training offers. They had better work college campuses and poor neighborhoods where people need better employment.
Or they can keep whining.
Right? So do what you have to do to keep a job. As for no one being irreplaceable I don't even understand what your point is with regards to employment. You began this tangent to whine on behalf of the blue-collar industry.
Well, if they don't know how to market for themselves who's fault that?
Mine?
What the hey? I counsel kids in the tech space. And yes, they can be replaced, so they had better do whatever they can to learn the latest tech every single year. My job requires re-training.
You cannot prepare for every scenario, but if you do not do what you can, no one is going to feel sorry for you.
Period.
www.reuters.com/.../awaiting-trumps-coal-comeback-miners-reject-retraining-idUSKBN1D14G0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7ei-BFM6c8
@RolandCuthbert You don't have to worry automation? I know enough about the tech that computers write code on their own all the time. Computers programmed by other computers. Only a matter of time. Like I stated previously, no one is irreplaceable.
Why does a blue-collar job search have to be in poor neighborhoods? I was raised in a middle-class suburb of New York City. So a blue-collar career can only appeal to a poor person? Or to someone with no other possible options?
Sorry, but I only see "white COLLAR privilege" here. I also suddenly see two attractive blue-collar positions opening. One comes with a proverbial shovel, the other with the proverbial foot and proverbial mouth...
Oh, so you know the tech field? So yes, AI can write its own code. So who is supposed to design AI platforms? And what naive programmer would design a system without any way for a human to modify or control it? Perhaps far in the future we would trust AI to totally run on its own. But doing so now? It obvious why we cannot.
AI does not have common sense. And it never will. We don't even know how our minds work, how in the world can be design a computer system to know the dynamic ever changing ever present standard of common sense in our everyday world.
I don't know what we are arguing at this point.
Can you tell me?
You are not asking about blue collar job search in poor neighborhoods. I don't think you know what you asking at this point. Didn't you say the blue collar industry is desperate for workers?
Hmmm. . . where are people desperate for better paying jobs?
@RolandCuthbert Yes I dinked and dabbled in the tech industry many years ago before I became an electrician. Also considered becoming a meteorologist or a pharmacist or even getting into sports radio. My mind likes to be in a lot of places at the same time. However, I really happen to like working with my hands and being on job sites.
You brought up looking for welders in poor neighborhoods, not me. If a blue-collar career can uplift a dedicated poor person, I'm absolutely all for it... but again... only a poor person can find satisfaction in a blue-collar job? Why not from any walk of life? There are plenty of people wasting time and taxpayers' dollars in college that should be learning trades instead. I'm not whining about anything. I aslo didn't start out by asking any questions. I'm debunking this notion of "white privilege" when in reality it's "green privilege" and while doing so, seemed to uncovered your distain for blue-collar careers.
"Blue" and "green" are all that matters.
So I am confused. Why are you telling me this when you were just defending the blue collar industry? Please connect the dots.
I am sure many people like working with their hands. I would like to play video games all day. I have to do what makes money.
You don't seem to really have a point. You claimed that the blue collar industry was looking for workers. So why not look where people are looking higher paying jobs. You seem intent on convincing college students to give up their endeavor and become blue collar.
Yes, that is whining. If you don't want your tax dollars going to colleges, keep voting for politicians who cut funding for college and who help colleges to raise rates. Getting an education saved my life. I won't support that. In fact, education helps to open people's eyes and to give them more information about the world they live in.
If you don't like that. We totally disagree.
And this has nothing to do with my take.
@RolandCuthbert No, claiming "white privilege" when in reality it's "green privilege" is whining.
I'm all for higher education when it actually leads the person to a real degree that makes that individual an actual productive member of society and gives them the ability to pay back their student loans.
We can totally agree to disagree but it doesn't change the fact that you lost the argument.
Also, they have a Video Game League now. You should look into it.
None of this stuff connects. You talked about blue collar jobs. .. not because they were jobs of the poor but because they pay what you think is a lot of money. That's cool.
What does that have to do with green privilege.
This guy probably makes more money than both of us.
It did not matter when it came to profiling him for being an illegal immigrant. He has to know he can/will be profiled again. And he must be prepared for that.
The take was just that simple.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAhXoZd_sAM&t=133s
@RolandCuthbert Anyone can be profiled anywhere at any time.
Okay I'm done. Later.
That statement is just not dealing with reality for a non-"White" family in America. It would be silly for me tell my son, he could be profiled for being an illegal immigrant. Stereotypes about "Black" people do not work that way.
@RolandCuthbert I'm sorry, but if you have a guilty conscience about something, that's between you and your therapist.
What does that even mean?
Why did you waste all this time? You never even wanted to talk about the take.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E5-GWQKBBxM
@RolandCuthbert You can post all the YouTube videos you want. You evidently feel guilty about something because you posted this Take about a false narrative.
And exactly what I would feel guilty about?
:D
You see, I don't care if you don't care, the take isn't written for you.
It is written to warn people about "White" privilege and the people who will justify it. You are so offended, you are even angry that people have to make modifications to their lives because of it. I like the Captain American Sikh guy, he combats it in a very unique way.
That is just a fact of life. Whether you like it or not. . . acknowledge it or not. It isn't even about being right or wrong.
It is about being safe and secure.
But make it all about you.
It's what you do apparently.
@RolandCuthbert It has nothing to do with caring. It has to do with the manipulation of reality. What you're writing about is based on YouTube videos (not the end-all, be-all of actual fact) and nonsensical terminology invented by college professors. There is no "white privilege". Only "green privilege".
Oh I agree, it isn't about "caring". I don't care that you don't care. I don't care if you aware. I don't care if you agree.
It ain't about you.
The Sikh Captain America isn't a college professor. He is a software consultant.
But again, it isn't like anything you posted me is based in rational thinking. I see now why you dislike college education. Because it doesn't lend itself to your brand of politics.
But even that doesn't matter. Not sure why you tried to sneak that into our conversation about "White" privilege.
@RolandCuthbert It's not about politics. It's about reality... of which, apparently, you're not a fan. Politics and politicians are full of shit.
Ah so you admit most modern college education has morphed into nothing more than about pushing a certain brand of victim politics and no longer about what it's supposed to be about... actual reality and actual advanced education. Suggesting that someone would "dislike college education" only because of potential political alignment is perfect evidence of only supporting specific education and information that reinforces a bias against reality.
Again you also keep mentioning "white privilege" like it's based in actual reality. Just because you post an opinionated Take based on selective narrative and YouTube videos that anyone with an Ethernet connection can upload, doesn't make any of it actual, factual, reality.
I'm sorry that I've dismissed your misguided diatribe on contrived nonsensical terminology so easily.
No, there is a definite political bent about college and education. As you have claimed here that college does not educate, but it pushes political views. And I have no doubt that climate change and a flat earth might be your agenda also.
And all of that is summed to be "victim politics".
That's cool.
Not going to argue with that kind of logic.
And no, my argument is not built on youtube videos. You are not very enlightened, so I sought to try to find material that you could understand.
But again, I don't need your agreement to post my take or to have an opinion. Sorry if you are so offended.
Obviously there's climate change. Has pollution slightly skewed this always ongoing phenomenon? Of course... but people measure things based on their insignificant tiny existence. The Earth was changing before humans, and will continue to change long after humans are gone. The human race is like fleas on a dog's ass... if the Earth wants to shake us off tomorrow (the Yosemite volcano completely blowing its top comes to mind... it's long overdue), it can do so with no effort. It's more arrogant presumption that humans could irreversibly damage and simultaneously miraculously "correct" a gigantic molten magnetic metal rock spinning in an endless vacuum. The Giant Red Spot on Jupiter has been shrinking for decades... is that human-skewed? Things change. Also, eventually the Sun will transition out of its Yellow Star phase and into a Red Giant which will consume the entire inner Solar System... including the Earth.
You're allowed to have and post your inaccurate opinion (s) all you want...
... it's a free country... unless we do what you want and turn to communism.
By the way, the tech industry (where you're getting your aforementioned six figure salary) is one of the leading causes of pollution, with all of those factories and refineries mass producing all of those metal and plastic devices that need all of that tech security. Maybe I've isolated your guilt?
Yep capitalism sucks... except when it's looking out for #1... which to your credit, you at least admitted that much...
Like I said, if you don't even believe in verifiable scientific facts, how in the world can we have a conversation?
I am in the tech business. You know how many corporate CEOs have questioned my conclusions? You can only present factual evidence and assessments. People will either believe you or not.
But I certainly don't argue with them. If anyone questions my conclusion after my research, they probably would be a pretty horrible client anyway.
Not my problem, I advocate green technologies only. I have built two data centers and power consumption, heat, etc. are all factors I deal with. If we can focus on building better low power consumption technologies, we can start to deal with heat generated by data centers.
I could turn this discussion into a tech conversation if you wish. We have superconductors on the way. We are making chips and microprocessors smaller and smaller. We are on the brink of being able to do computing in the quantum realm.
That the great thing about tech. It never ever stops. It just keeps right on going. And it has been my joy ever since I saw my first computer at age of 10.
Not sure what any of that has to do with communism. But if you like it, you can move to Russia. Been there several times.
Fascinating society. Did you know the average Russian lives on $400 bucks a month?
$400 sounds about right... because there's nothing to buy there. Result of a silly, failed, and obsolete ideology.
So nothing I said about the Earth, Sun, and Solar System is verifiable? Oh really? Perhaps you should swap your microscope for a telescope sometime.
Computer locations (the "data centers" you mentioned... we call them co-locates for short) will always need industrial air conditioning. I've installed and supplied the 3-phase, 480 power for a number of them. Lucrative, for sure... but definitely not energy conservation friendly.
Speaking of heat control and containment, you mean those pesky superconductors are still on their way? Been that way for a while. I remember learning about them in the 1990s in high school. If only they could bring up their operating temperatures to something a little closer to room temperature from nearly absolute zero. Tech definitely keeps going. I find it fascinating... but the exponential heat it creates as it gets smaller is a big hurtle.
And I know about the sun, moon, too. But I don't know how to calculate an orbit of a planet using Einstein's equations. I don't know how calculate Lorentz contractions near the speed of light.
Physicists know how to do that stuff. They have went to school and have gotten the education to do it. I went to school and I got a different education. I know computer technology. I can configure any firewall on the market. I am expert at the configuration of several hypervisors. I am a certified Cisco, Microsoft, Commvault, Zerto, engineer/professional. I have years of training in my discipline. I have managed project teams in migrations and integration projects all over the U. S. and overseas.
And when I speak on technology topics, I speak with expertise.
And unless you know a bit about my field, don't proceed to debate me from some nonsensical viewpoint.
And I feel that way about anyone who has become an expert in their chosen field. I don't know everything. Nor do I have to.
Of course they need cooling. That's why we need better technologies for power consumption. If we can run the equipment cooler, they will need less air conditioning. They will also run faster. I have no expertise as an electrician. It was never anything I was interested in. I just know what we are trying to do in the tech field.
And these superconductors are already here. We just have to find a way to mass produce them. I don't think you have heard of this material before. This material can be 1 single atom thick.
I worked tech before my electrical apprenticeship. I enjoy the work and the micro-physics, it's super fascinating, but it's suit-and-tie nerd work. Brain is there, but never could sit still long enough to make a career. I have built a few computers over the years from scratch for fun (MicroCenter is nerd heaven, I love that place), merged a few laptops, debugged a few hard drives file by file, never got deep into encryption or writing code (time-consuming when pursued for hobby and not career).
Anyway, career paths have nothing to do with the fact that communism (and also fascism for that matter), are both extremist failed nonsense and "white privilege" is non-existent.
I forgot to ask... how did you get Joe Montana to sit down for a video for your Take?
Well, MicroCenter used to be a hangout for me. Not anymore. There are a couple of tech organizations I have joined. They have some cool initiatives. I go to midTech once a year.
I think it is quite evident those terms are meaningless. You can stick a put a feather in your hat and call it communism or fascism. It doesn't matter. A lot of people are tribal, they will accept any kind of dictatorship, authoritarian regime, autocratic, restrictive totalitarian. . . it doesn't matter, as long as their tribe is seen as being number one.
And I think I have proven "White" privilege. Again, I don't need your permission for what I have to gird myself for or how I have to plan my success. And non-"Whites" need to make those plans accordingly, lest they pay the price.
Joe Montana?
That wasn't even funny.
Baseem is very funny. You should look up his stuff. He is also quite courageous. It is a miracle he is alive.
Isn't it at least just as likely that people alienate themselves in their own minds with their "identities" and perceive themselves to be persecuted?
Also I can't help appreciate the irony that this take also validates arguments from people who see themselves as under attack for being white. With "white people" feeling blamed like they're most numerous/dominating group when they're not the largest demographic at all, aren't you also validating any notions that one of these days a segment of the population is going to tell them they're all racist and go around lynching them for it?
Oh, but there is a difference right? There is a reality that non-"Whites" have to deal with. And from your view, isn't that reality the only logical objective and rational conclusion that anyone of any supposed "race" or culture could come to?
But if "White" people were profiled for crime or for terrorism, would you consider that to be racist. . . or the weird concept reverse racism?
What difference and what conclusion?
Not really. Though it depends on the circumstances. If it's because the culture doesn't like fair skinned people and decides they're criminals then yes. If it's because there's predominately white terrorist group posing an imminent threat that's operating in a majority non-white country then I'm not too bothered about people being suspicious of me.
You are avoiding the issue. You feel that it is rational and logical to profile non-"White" groups based upon certain criteria. But there is no rational nor logical basis to profile "White" people. evidenced by the statement that about pre-dominantly "White" terrorist group, etc.
It doesn't matter that you believe you have the right to do this based upon what you consider evidence, which is the very definition and demonstration of privilege anyway. It only matters that this standard exists and you believe it is acceptable.
Non-"Whites" must navigate this standard and navigate whatever policies, rules, or devices created by the people who share your feelings.
"Whites" according to your own logic, do not.
So there is a good reason to profile people?
Everyone does follow the same rules and policies, but not everyone is exactly the same. Basically worst case scenario it's an inconvenience, so very far from a difference in "privilege." Some people are too tall to fit in bus seats. Some people are more susceptible to skin cancer when they go outside and need for fork out for sunscreen. The problems are trivial, acknowledging some kind of privilege doesn't do any good.
Are you asking me?
And if you were profiled, would it be a simple inconvenience? Like if people looked at you and thought it was reasonable to assume you were an illegal immigrant? I am not sure what being too tall or being susceptile to skin cancer has to do with the steadfast nonsensical belief that people who look a certain way are prone to certain actions or certain beliefs.
And painfully few people, despite your claims, would agree that just because they fit someone's subjective definition of a racial grouping, that means that they are prone to negative behaviors.
The anti-PC group's, founding principle is that "White" people are exempt from this type of profiling.
Hence the name. . .
"steadfast nonsensical belief"
But we're not talking about nonsense, we're talking a effective means of identifying people. If it's not nonsense then it's in the same realm as small inconveniences you have to deal with because that's reality.
"reasonable to assume you were an illegal immigrant"
Again, not nonsense if it is relevant. So then the only problem is acting on assumptions -- There's already policy for that.
-Can you please show me some identification?
Sure, here you go.
-All good, move along.
"racial grouping, that means that they are prone to negative behaviors."
That's why race is not the primary factor by which people area profiled. Profiling doesn't mean prone to negative behaviours because of race. This is what I'm talking about when it comes to perception of persecution; it couldn't be that there's a practical reality to contend with, no, it has to be "steadfast nonsensical belief" against me.
"founding principle"
What?
Also, they're not exempt so...
I am not here to convince you that racism is wrong. That isn't my job. I only created the take to show how "White" privilege manifests. You are telling me that logically and rationally "White" people cannot be profiled for negative behaviors or beliefs and somehow that is not "White" privilege.
And that is astounding.
Right, so you wouldn't mind being at a restaurant and in front of everyone being asked to prove that you are a U. S. citizen. How can I believe that when you are insulted that being "White" and not having police profile you, not being accused of being a terrorist, etc. is privilege?
Of course you would lose your mind over having to prove your citizenship again and again.
I know I would. So why would I lie?
But it doesn't really matter. The take isn't to convince you. It is to illuminate the issue for people who can think rationally.
I didn't say white people aren't profiled for negative behaviours. You're deciding that everyone else is making decisions based on race.
"in front of everyone being asked to prove that you are a U. S. citizen?"
Nope. It's kind of inappropriate to ask and just bring it up, but if they're the authorities and they're really going to push it (and assuming they're in their rights to) then fine, they can check and I'd be proud about it. You could also ask them to prove they're a citizen or that they're cops or whatever.
Depends on the nature of the profiling as I've explained before. Everyone is profiled, it makes resources able to be better distributed. You're also profiled by way more than anything else so why aren't you complaining about that?
I'd rather the tedium of that than accept immigrants that undermine my efforts to assimilate into the culture and to go through the proper procedures to earn my citizenship by ignoring all that and entering illegally. How about you stop having so many illegal immigrants instead of complaining that you have to prove your citizenship? That would be a much better solution to the issue.
Lie about what? What are you even talking about?
People who can think rationally recognise the vapidity of your trivial complaints.
You are not reading. You do not believe "White" people should be profiled for negative beliefs or behaviors. Please read my responses. This is very important.
What do you mean if they are the "authorities"? Five Latinas were out at dinner at a nice restaurant. Before they could be served the waiter demanded they prove they were U. S. citizens.
Can we get back to discussing "White" privilege?
I don't understand your last statement.
So your point is that people can and should profile you when they think they need to?
Maybe you need to go and collect your thoughts.
Your statement is nonsensical. I was talking about "White" privilege. Create a take about illegal immigration if that is your area of concern. The issue is you are not going to be profiled for being an illegal immigrant. If you were, you would dislike it. I know I would.
As for complaining, please understand, I could care less about your assessment of the take. I am not MLK Jr. That simply is not my job. I am not going to sing to you "we shall overcome". There is a saying I learned long ago, if you think I was sent to tell you kind things you are wrong sir. Good tiding are given from different kinds of people than me. . . to other kinds of people than you, in different situations than these.
I did not come to complain. I came to affirm.
Moving on.. . racist stereotypes target different groups of non-"Whites" in different ways. I would not be profiled for being an illegal immigrant. Profiling would target me for being a criminal. The first time that happened to me I was really naive and that could have ended my life. But I learned that I needed to be much more careful around people who could have racist views. "White" people don't have to worry about such things. The anti-PC crowd does not believe that the privilege of individuality extends to non-"Whites".
Again. . .
Hence the name. . .
Excuse me, why is reverse racism a "weird concept?" You don't deem non-whites capable of racism? White cracker, no welfare for the privileged, promote only your brother and mother right, weird concept.
@DianaWest?
Uhm. . . what you are talking about?
White people are not being attacked men. You must work to an equal society just it.
"profiled for negative beliefs or behaviors"
"Profiled" doesn't mean whatever negative characteristic you feel like sticking to someone, it's statistically significant behaviour - and even then profiling should only be done where necessary. If I'm going through an airport, I expect to be profiled, I'm going to avoid suspicious behaviour and be cooperative wherever I can.
"waiter demanded they prove they were U. S. citizens."
Wow, that case really doesn't support your position. Firstly, the waiter asked for proof of residency, that's a little different from proof of citizenship, doesn't really matter though. Secondly and more importantly, the waiter was fired -- and specifically because those actions were not reflective of company policy or acceptable social norms. Third, if it's not the authorities asking for proof then you are under no obligation to prove anything.
"discussing White privilege"
I am talking about white privilege. My position is that -- depending on definition -- it generally falls under one of two categories: imaginary or irrelevant.
"people can and should profile?"
People can and do. In most situations you can and should give people the benefit of the doubt. e. g that classmate of mine seems a bit weird but I'm sure he's good people. But if you're approached by a shifty character in the middle of the night then you're going to be more careful. With countless people going through airports everyday profiling is a good way to know who to keep an eye on and apply security resources effectively. e. g Here's a dude, middle aged, traveling alone, wearing a large sweater on a warm day and looking around nervously, let's make sure security keeps an eye on him.
"illegal immigration"
You brought up immigration.
Few if any would be suspected of being illegal immigrants if there wasn't an illegal immigrant problem.
"you would dislike it"
Depends on the situation if disliking it even matters. I dislike being pulled over for random breath tests, I also dislike being hit in the face by strangers for no reason. Both have happened to me but in only one of those situations is a complaint actually valid.
"As for complaining"
I was after good sense, not good tidings. Why you thought that saying was applicable here indicates a lack of the former on your part.
"affirm"
Your affirmation is hollow. You're affirming whining.
"people who could have racist views"
People could be bad people. Amazing.
No one is arguing that racism or racist stereotypes is bad.
"The anti-PC crowd does not believe that the privilege of individuality extends to non-whites"
One of the defining points in the anti-PC platform that distinguishes it is it's insistence on a universally applied principle of individuality, so really, what are you on about? You're sorting people into groups (hence the name) based on how privileged you perceive their race to be.. but you're the one supporting individualism here? Okay, mate.
What in the world are you talking about? :D
I cannot reason with racism. I am not here to convince you that racism is wrong. Why are you not reading the take?
You are here defending profiling. Profiling of who? And what stastically significant behavior?
So wait you are not "White" and you expect to be profiled. You are okay with it and you do everything you can to avoid looking suspicious and be cooperative? What does being cooperative mean? Do you surrender your rights as a citizen? Do you understand that maybe you don't have as many rights as people who are "White" have?
Did you not just prove "White" privilege?
?
"Wow, that case really doesn't support your position. Firstly, the waiter asked for proof of residency, that's a little different from proof of citizenship, doesn't really matter though. Secondly and more importantly, the waiter was fired -- and specifically because those actions were not reflective of company policy or acceptable social norms. Third, if it's not the authorities asking for proof then you are under no obligation to prove anything."
Of course this supports my position. Because we are talking about what the waiter believed. Your beliefs are important too. And people who are not "White" must be aware of your beliefs. The waiter could have easily been a judge, a police officer, a lawyer, it doesn't matter.
And your first point is just off. I am African-American, no one has ever asked me or any "Black" person I know for proof of residency. Racist stereotypes target us differently.
But you have proven "White" privilege in almost every post. It doesn't matter if you think it is imaginary or irrelevant. You believe in the principles of privilege. You think non-"Whites" must do what is necessary to deal with it.
And I have said the same exact thing. But you didn't read the take. The only difference between you and I, is that you are nonsensical in saying non-"Whites" need to modify their behavior to negotiate the privilege depending upon the racist stereotypes that affect their specific group, while at the same time you claim the reason why they have to do so does not exist.
It is like beating someone with a baseball bat and then claiming the bat you used was imaginary.
It is that simple.
Hence the name.
I absolutely did not bring up illegal immigration. Please do not pretend to be dense. I said you could not be profiled for being an illegal immigrant. Do you actually believe that statement is in defense of or against illegal immigration? This is how nonsensical tangential conversations get created.
So if you cannot address the point, please do not create the distraction of another conversation.
So can you be profiled for being an illegal immigrant? All your other statements are irrelevant.
No, affirmations are not whining. They are merely supporting of obvious facts. And to debate you, I didn't even need to bring any other evidence. I just needed your statements.
You are definitely confused. :D
Racist stereotypes are bad. But profiling based upon racist stereotypes is good?
Wow. . . .
Of course anti-PC people do not believe in applying principles of individuality. You just explained it thoroughly in a post. That people need to know what they will be profiled for. They need to avoid the specific suspicious behavior of that group. They need to know they will not be an individual. They need to know as you say about the "statistically significant" behaviors, that people who look like them are capable of. And the nonsensical thing is that your profiling isn't separating people into groups. Somehow, my method of getting to know them and how they group identify separates them into groups.
I can only support individualism where people insist upon being individuals. When they tell me they are "White", "Black", Latino, or Asian-American, etc. they are not telling me about individualism.
They are telling me about groups. And most importantly, HOW THEY SEE THEMSELVES.
"Profiling of who?"
Literally everyone.
"statistically significant behavior"
"Here's a dude, middle aged, traveling alone, wearing a large sweater on a warm day and looking around nervously." That's statistically significant behaviour. People with criminal intent tend to act abnormally and you can spot that.
"I am not here to convince you that racism is wrong"
I know, you're trying to convince me it exists where it doesn't.
"you expect to be profiled?"
I'm a human, so I expect to be profiled.
"cooperative" means don't fight security personal doing their job protecting everyone, myself included.
"Do you understand that maybe you don't have as many rights as people who are "White" have?"
I don't surrender my rights, I have all the same rights. Do you understand that maybe you do as well?
"Did you not just prove "White" privilege?"
No, but it's hardly surprising you'd think that. The very first thing I said here was to suggest that you insist on alienating yourself and cling to the idea that you're persecuted regardless of whether it's true or not.
"Of course this supports my position."
We've established that what the waiter believed is not an accepted norm. That case highlights just how infrequently such things occur and the negative attitude people have towards them.
"The waiter could have easily been a judge, a police officer, a lawyer"
No, they couldn't because the standards of conduct people entering into those positions are higher than wait staff. Even if they did get into those positions it doesn't matter if they're the most racist person in the world as long as they consistently apply themselves impartially. Furthermore, if they did something like the waiter then they'd get worse treatment, I'm sure they'd never work in the justice system again among other penalties.
"Racist stereotypes"
Profiling is not the same as racist stereotypes. Again, we go back to statistically significant data. It's not racist if it's reflective of reality. The prevalence of racist stereotypes is right where we'd expect it be for a society that disapproves of the waiters actions; rare, it's not even close to the norm.
"no one has ever asked me for proof of residency"
So what? Doesn't mean you don't need to have it -- and in other situations is doesn't mean you need to give it.
"You think non-"Whites" must do what is necessary to deal with it."
I believe everyone must do what is necessary to deal with whatever they face. You think victim-hood (and not even necessarily your own; other people's victim-hood) permits you special treatment.
"non-"Whites" need to modify their behavior"
No, *people* need to modify their behavior to be civil in a civil society. Not acting like a criminal goes a long way to not being treated like a criminal.
"you claim the reason why they have to do so does not exist."
I'm claiming *your* reason why they (as well as everyone else) have to doesn't exist. So good job. Almost there.
It's like the bat was imaginary and so was the beating. It is that simple. Hence the name.
"illegal immigration"
It is you who is dense if you think the perception of a person as an illegal immigrant has nothing to do with the prevalance of people who are illegal immigrants.
"believe that statement is in defense of or against illegal immigration"
No, nothing I said was meant to suggest that you were for or against it. The point was that you can't ignore it.
This flows neatly into...
"you cannot address the point"
I am, you're deciding that I'm addressing a different point. So there's some juicy irony in you saying that I'm creating distractions.
"So can you be profiled for being an illegal immigrant?"
You can be profiled for anything and it's never definite, it's more or less likely that you possess a certain trait.
"obvious facts"
Obvious facts like the earth is flat. It's so obvious.
"to debate you, I didn't even need to bring any other evidence. I just needed your statements. You are definitely confused."
Likewise.
"profiling based upon racist stereotypes is good?"
Profiling that is not based upon racist stereotypes is good.
Been my position the whole time.
"They need to avoid the specific suspicious behavior of that group."
Didn't say that, you're changing my points again.
Although if the "group" you're talking about is criminals then yes, avoid the behaviour of criminals.
"They need to know as you say about the "statistically significant" behaviors"
They don't *need* to, generally just not doing anything criminal and then not worrying about it is all it takes. Applies to everyone. But it doesn't hurt to know what cops/security are looking for so you can make their job easier by rightly avoiding suspicion. For example try not to leave bags unattended, that invites security, not to mention thieves.
"your profiling isn't separating people into groups"
It infers the likelihood of any particular trait to an individual based on the coalescence of numerous observations from that individual. Grouping would be ineffective, we want to know about individuals.
"my method of getting to know them and how they group identify separates them into groups."
..."how they group identify"
I'm trying to identify individuals and you're making statements in the manner of black people this and white people that.
I'm also arguing that people "group identify" to cling to minority/victim-hood/persecuted status: You're persecuting yourself more than anything else is.
Uhm, no I don't need to have it when I go out dining.
What special treatment have I demanded from you? Or anyone in this take? Again, you are just nonsensical in what you wish to discuss. You want to make this all about you. I care as little about you as you care about me. I didn't even create this take for you. I engaged you because I thought you deserved a response.
Skin colors do not act like criminals. You introduced the statistically significant behaviors argument. Which again is nonsense. Now you deny it. Why?
? Of course not. You could be a judge or police officer. With this notion of statistically significant behaviors floating around in your head. Non-"White" people need to be aware that people like you can wield tremendous power in this society. Its just the way it is. And they need to be modify their behavior as you said, to make sure they don't set you off.
Right, you think race is reflective of reality. Even thought it has been scientifically disproven. As for this waiter, he was only fired once the Latinas share their experience on facebook, which you would probably call whining anyway. But you don't address the issue. He thought he was doing the right thing.
Where would he get such an idea?
You can keep saying it, it won't make it true. Talking about people being mistaken for being an illegal immigrant has nothing to do with a conversation about immigrants legal or not. A person can be born and raised in this country and be mistaken for an illegal immigrant. I am sure he was against illegal immigration also.
diplopundit.net/.../
So now you don't if you can be profiled for being an illegal immigrant after telling me about statistically significant behaviors?
What are you afraid of?
You are anonymous here. No one knows you. If there were facebook, I could understand why you would be "careful".
No, I didn't change your points. You said it, own it please. Be an adult. Stop saying stuff then two posts later claim you didn't say it.
It isn't being honest.
Nonsensical statements like criminals are profiled for being criminals aren't really worth responding to.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAhXoZd_sAM
Yes It's a problem, but I think in the scheme of things it's not as big of an issue as the gap between rich and poor. I also want to point out "They don't have creams to darker their skin color"
d3r2zleywq7959.cloudfront.net/.../...26_xlarge.jpg
I was going to mention that was well :)
Oh and be careful, this guy seems to be a black supremacist.
I wrote a respectful, well thought out opinion that was fair to all people but he didn't like that.
He wrote: GaG isn't the kind of place where you talk about these things in the way that I do. That's why I have gotten this kind of response.
Elitist.
@lilaqua That is a spray tan. Are you saying people who spray tan are trying to look like brown or black people?
s.abcnews.com/.../uni_romney_tan_120921_wmain.jpg
It is funny that this woman is participating in the thread started by you. Yet she has me blocked and I cannot respond to.
ooops. . . sorry
I cannot respond to her. I don't understand where this charge of "Black" supremacy comes from.
Where on earth have I claimed "Black" people are better than "White" people?
What in the world is going on here?
yes they are. They are trying at least in part to attain a colour that matches a lot of black people. Not to mention those that seek an alternative solution like melatonin injections.
Sorry. I do not accept that argument. I know of no study supporting your assertion that "White" people tan to try to look black or brown. It is like saying "Black" women wear blonde wigs to look "White". If that were true, I would post supporting evidence. But there is no evidence for that.
Trump and John Boehner are "White" men and proud to be "White" men.
imeanwhat.com/.../Picture-12.png
www.motherjones.com/.../trumps-tan.jpg
Fake tan is a wealth and class response, not a race one. Historically, white nobles would wear zinc based make up to appear as pale as possible, this would show they were wealthy enough to not have to work outside in the fields and gain a tan.
As things have changed, and flights abroad originally being expensive, fake tan helps imply you've been able to afford a holiday abroad at whatever time of year.
It may hold as a socilogical theorem but the question is how you use it, and what conclusions you draw from it.
How strong influence is it, and when is it of lesser dignity than other social rifts? That needs to be pinpointed.
I think for one thing, it should be stated is that social standing and wealth tops this any time of day, meaning people should only apply this on their own respective social standing.
You can't put a homeless white guy on level with Donald Trump ever for example.
We should mind the effect of racial bias where we stand. but we have fuck all responsibility for the people that stand above us, or to pretend there's a relation based on "skin color club". Because there isn't much of any.
Like higher ups in media, hollywood, government, echelons of rich people. They all stand above me regardless of gender, skin color or sexual orientation. They are not mine to care for, be invested in, or apologize for.
If you get pulled over by the same cop... your black and I am white. Same offense, same road, etc... I get let off with a warning, you get a ticket. It wasn't white privilege that prevented me from getting a ticket, it was the cop's racism. I had NOTHING to do with it. So I put little value on "White" Privilege as a real thing, This sample just has the appearance of privilege, but really its the racism of the "Privilege" granter. Saying I am privileged is saying I have some control over it. Nope... Put blame where is belongs..
I don't think that I am blaming you for "White" privilege. In many ways it is a function of our society. And non-"Whites" need to be prepared to deal with it.
That observation has set off a firestorm on this take.
But thanks for your post. It seems to be a reasonable response to what I am driving at.
"White privilege" is nothing more than polite speak for white hate and racism, just like male privilege is nice speak for sexism and hatred of men. It's a hoax. A smoke screen to hide racial bias, bigotry, and general scum baggery. Anyone who seriously believes in it is a racist scum bag.
I just don't see it that way. And I keep getting hit with bags of "White" guilt over "White" privilege. It isn't about hatred. Sure, discussions about "White" privilege bring racists out of the woodwork. But this isn't about them. This is just about privilege and how it manifests.
There have been dozens of thread about its non-existence. I just wanted to set the record straight.
Yes, discussion about "white privilege" do bring racists out of the woodwork. It brings all the people who hate white people out of the woodwork because they're the only ones dumb enough to buy into this crap. "White privilege" does not exist. The record is already straight.
"Privilege" cannot be broken down into race. I'm white and was born into a lower middle class family that has had to go paycheck to paycheck without much money for anything beyond necessities. There are whites that have it even worse off than I have, and at the same time there are non-white people who have great lives. To break everything down into race doesn't make sense as people from all races will have good lives and some will struggle.
Of course it can. Here you are telling me about lower middle class and poor "Whites". They have existed since this nation was a nation. They were there at the start of the Revolutionary War. They were in the Civil War, Jim Crow, the Civil Rights eras.
We are talking about "privilege". Do you agree that "Whites" can and should be profiled? Do you think "White" people have any negative behaviors/beliefs as a group?
Do rich Arab-Americans avoid the stigma of being terrorists? Do rich Latinos avoid having to prove they are American citizens?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXkrVCmZikY
whats an icee?
I don't think anyone of any race should be profiled. Not all Arab-Americans are automatically thought of as terrorists, and not all Latinos are thought of as being illegal. But sure it happens to some. Some white people do profile people of certain races in those ways, kind of like how some minorities profile all white people as racist even when the vast majority aren't.
Look, I appreciate your sentiments. But non-"White" people would be ill-served by pretending "White" privilege does not exist. There are kind "Whites" everywhere in society. Good people, people who are just regular human beings like everyone else. I wonder if I should create a take dedicated to "White" folks. The good, the bad, the real, the fake. . . and the human.
Many non-"Whites" simply cannot afford the luxury of pretending "White" privilege does not exist.
Gabrielle Union talked about what she does to counsel her sons when they have to deal with police officers. Because that advice can save their lives.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7vpXuyE6-g
I'm sorry but I fail to see how minorities are ill-served to pretend white privilege doesn't exist. It doesn't and minorities who constantly push the white privilege narrative, I believe, are only serving to increase the divisiveness that an idea like this brings. I don't see how they or anyone can benefit from a society that is so divided, more so than if we all come together and say some people, regardless of race, are born into better situations than others, some have to work harder than others, but if we set goals and work to achieve them anyone can achieve anything they want to in this country.
Also since you brought up the whole cop thing: www.washingtonpost.com/.../
Thats from the Washington Post, an extremely left leaning paper that would love to push the white privilege narrative. Sort the victims by race, you will see twice as many white people were shot by cops last year than black people.
Why are black people so afraid of cops when white people are shot by them twice as often? I'm a heat fan and love D-Wade, but he and Gabrielle are misinformed on this one.
Also why don't we hear about any white people being shot by cops? It really shows how the media also wants to push this white privilege narrative. Police brutality is often one of if not the biggest argument that white privilege exists, yet white people are more often the victims of it.
We could also start going into how minorities have privilege through affirmative action programs and are handed college admissions and jobs simply for not being white. That is basically the definition of discrimination.
My main point is even if there are some disadvantages statistically faced by blacks or any minority, they really aren't that disadvantageous, and really are offset by disadvantages face by whites and programs set in place to basically hand minorities educations or jobs, regardless of whether they've earned them.
What?
I am sure not all "White" people believe that Arabs are terrorist. I am sure not all "White" people that Latinos are all "illegals". I have many "White" friends and loved one in my life. The don't believe in such silliness. That is not the point. Look at my take, there are literally dozens of people arguing on behalf of being able to profile non-"Whites" for as one says. . . statistically signficant behaviors. That is a factor that non-"White" people have to deal with. That's just the way it is. And if these people do not take precautions the results can be devastating.
www.youtube.com/watch
You are going to tell me what Gabrielle Union should or should not tell her sons? You are not dealing with reality. For your claims about police brutality look at the bottom graphic. But this goes way beyond police. Florida is an open-carry state. And her son could be shot because a person claims, they had to "stand their ground".
Michael Dunn shot a "Black" teenager dead because of loud music.
www.dailymail.co.uk/.../...cted-degree-murder.html
i.dailymail.co.uk/.../...a_McBath_mother_of_Jo.jpg
cdn.vox-cdn.com/.../...%20killings%20by%20race.png
And for the last point, about Affirmative Action programs, are you saying before AA, all hiring was done based on merit and that somehow, some way today, all "White" people miraculously only hire on merit.
Not that I am defending AA. I have no problem with it and I am pretty sure that under Trump the Department of Labor has ended such federal programs. In addition, the Republicans hold most of the governorships and and legislatures in this nation. So keep voting Republican, they will get rid of all AA programs.
It used to be a dream of mine that "Black" people would look more to each other for employment opportunities and build the necessary infrastructure. But I am sure you would consider that to be racist.
Not all white people are racist, but white people have been killed for being white. Any person from a certain race could be shot because of a trait that is an unfair stereotype for their race, even when they themselves don't exhibit said trait. You probably remember the Dylan Roof shooting a while back at a black church. Terrible, awful, racist act that probably 99% of white people thought was despicable. Well in 2017 a black man shot up a white church near Nashville in an act of revenge for the racist acts of Dylan Roof. Probably not one person in that white church supported Roofs act, but they were profiled as such because they were white like Roof. where was their privilege?
www.chieftain.com/.../...6c-992d-a6f777c7527f.html
Gabrielle Union may tell her son's whatever she likes, I'm just saying white people can be stereotyped just easily as black people. and you're right it's not just
Police, white people could also just as easily be shot in an open carry state for "being racist." Like that's my point, it's not a one way street, this stuff can and does happen to people of all races.
Also I'd need a source on President Trump ending AA, nothing I could find supported that statement. I'm not saying white people always hired on merit before, they absolutely didn't, but there are employment discrimination laws now. Why isn't equality enough? Why should non whites get hired because of their skin color of there is a more qualified white candidate? The logic flawed. If you hire someone because they are black, you're not hiring someone because they're white. No matter how you twist that, it's discrimination. Nothing wrong with diversity itself, but there is with diversity for the sake of diversity.
And yes I would view your last statement as racist. How is that any different from white people looking to white people for employment opportunities?
According to what or whom?
And my supporting documentation. Why would I a "Black" person claim that I am harassed by being profiled for being an illegal immigrant? I am not. Nor is that an issue for the "Black" community. I am not profiled for being a terrorist. That is not the racist stereotype commonly held about my community.
As for AA, these programs started being dismantled years ago.
www.pewresearch.org/.../
And Trump's administration has went even further releasing a justice department memo stating. . . “investigations and possible litigation related to intentional race-based discrimination in college and university admissions.”
And if you want to argue about dismantling AA programs, you won't find a person to debate you in this discussion. The mere fact that America even thought it had to have AA supports my views on "White" privilege.
You keep talking about "quality" as though this is something commonly practiced. It isn't. I mean you don't even talk like you work in the United States. People generally get employed because they know other people. I have hired "White" people myself. Not because I did some exhaustive search to find "quality". I did it because I trusted friends, colleagues, and people I worked with. Sometimes I found a perfect fit. Sometimes, I did not. But I sided with documentation provided from people I knew.
To pretend this is not commonplace is simply not being realistic. And if you are talking about these types of relationships, then "White" privilege becomes evident.
Especially given that racist stereotypes, no matter how common sense they appear to be to some people, are so pervasive in this society. It is something non-"Whites" must contend with and overcome.
And of course, "Black" empowerment would be racist to you. Because the anti-PC crowd can only articulate what is wrong with the "Black" community. To say that "Blacks" fail here or there is not racist. It is only when a "Black" person articulates what should be done to combat these problems, does the charge of racism appear to be valid to you.
And that isn't being hypocritical right?
It is a weird deal. Racism talks about the inferiority of non-"Whites" all the time. But it seems to need to keep non-"Whites" in a specific box so that it can always go to an argument that racist stereotypes are true. . . based upon nutty racist statistics gathering.
Fun Fact: White people were actually a whole third of the planet's population prior to WWI. The war decimated white peoples' numbers, and they still haven't recovered a hundred years after the end of the war.
On topic: I honestly wonder if people in power ie: Academics, politicians keep making these sorts of decisions to feature white people, so that way they can pin it on White Americans, and keep racial tension high. Basically, if Americans of all skin colours were living together without any tension, they would quickly realise that people are fucking them over. Because I know tonnes of Americans, black and white, and they all just consider themselves American.
Are you going to post something in response to my take, or did you want to start your own? There is a select up at the type on the menu, "post". then select "share my take".
Fuck off, you bloody yank. Would you prefer if I just said "fuckin white people"
I don't get it.
https://i.imgflip.com/kw17v.jpg
i.pinimg.com/.../...512b30f8cb3f31b08c5534abd0.gif
media1.tenor.com/.../tenor.gif?itemid=7549367
Those are some good meme!
Haha!
I like to call it majority "privilege" or representation. Now that whites are becoming a minority in the US and other English speaking multicultural countries all that will change. The need for representation is only natural but I think everyone would've done the same; build a country to feed their needs and mirrors their image.
anyone in the position of power*
I don't think that much will change. South Africa had a system of apartheid and years after it, after the majority "Black" population still lags behind the average "White" person.
www.nytimes.com/.../...rica-economy-apartheid.html
Just a guess: Maybe they just failed to compete with the whites in there? Look at Zimbabwe who in 2014 (I think it was 2014) disowned and dispelled all whites. Then the entire agriculture infrastructure broke down and the black people there had to starve to the mpoint that the president was begging for the whites to come back. I mean, after they were gone - the blacks could have easily do the same job. Why didn't they though?
And South Africa is about to do the very same thing of planning to disown and dispel whites. And it probably will just go the very same path.
@FakeName123 Uhm, we were talking about "White" privilege.
I know all about racism and racist assertions. I am only saying that your steadfast belief in racist assertions is all the proof I need for establishing the existence of "White" privilege.
Gee whiz!
"your facts are proof for your racism"
i0.kym-cdn.com/.../WTFAMIREADING.JPG
@FakeName123 Racists are really boring.
memegenerator.net/.../boring.jpg
Miscegenation — The Final Solution to the White Privilege Problem.
@Margillard :D Margillard. . . the magical thing is this.
We are all the same now.
Have you ever seen Rick and Morty?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIcsk2ZoaTY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIcsk2ZoaTY
its interesting how many people think they know it all, and speak things with such certainty, when in reality many people have never been anywhere else outside of their city or state and have not experienced the other cultures from different parts of the world... please save up some money, take a trip to another state or country, and note the cultural dynamics, and witness for yourself what goes on, instead of holding certain opinions that you really have no basis in credibility and rely on what you read on instagram
Uhm, I have been all over the United States, Canada, Europe, and the Caribbean.
I was speaking specifically of the U. S. And I have to tell you to please, read the take. Stop focusing on the title. I have a simple premise and I give the reasons for my position.
Okay, I agree with you that black people do get more discriminated than white people, especially by law enforcement. We live in a nasty world, with nasty people, and it is so preposterous that so many nasty people feel the need to harm others for being non-white. That does not mean though that all white people are this way, when people say white privilege, it annoys me because I think, oh, they think my life is all gold and roses. And we must not forget that racism happens both ways, as you can read from some people's comments. You seem like a smart man, and you do not seem racist, but do you see an issue with a world where non-whites think it is okay to say cracker, and then defend themselves by saying "white privilege?"
@DianaWest Uhm, well. . . I know a lot of "White" people. I can pretty much guarantee the vast majority do not think non-"Whites" should be profiled for negative beliefs or behaviors. I just created the take because there were so many questions, etc. created here claiming "White" privilege does not exist.
I am not here to argue racism. I just wanted to illustrate "White" privilege. If you want to create a general take on racism I will definitely participate. I post about tangential issues of racism. Because I think the whole racism debate is pretty much settled and the sides pretty much have their positions defined.
I don't think that it is okay to call "White" people racist names. I would never try to justify that. And that poster in the other thread. . . I don't think she would defend herself by claiming "White" privilege.
Another racist rant; lovely. " It is weird that people who have a deep belief in raciology don't recognize the consequences that go along with those beliefs." What, like making up nonsense about so-called "privilege"? IS there racism? Absolutely. There's people who believe in the Flat Earth theory, too; doesn't make it true.
This whole myTake assumes it's conclusion is a tail-chasing romp through every racist ideology that has ever existed, and then says "See? That means privilege exists!" Worse, it deliberately conflates race with culture, as if that somehow proves it's point. the writer is guilty of exactly the crime he or she decries; racism.
How do I deliberately conflate "race with culture". If you believe in race, that is on you. I believe in culture. And I believe that raciologists are simply people who confuse race with culture. Every raciologist in existence claims that people who are members of different races have different beliefs and behaviors.
Have you ever used a dictionary?
Have you ever looked up the definition of culture?
the customary beliefs, social forms, and material traits of a racial, religious, or social group; also : the characteristic features of everyday existence (such as diversions or a way of life) shared by people in a place or time
Read the take, please.
Because to you, the "dominant culture" is White. So all you've done is switch the labels. You're still stuck on race as the principle issue.
Well, if we could speak honestly for a minute.
The dominant culture is. . . mostly "White". I don't know why we would pretend it is otherwise.
But yes, I would have to say it is influenced by African-American Culture. Some norms in African-American Culture eventually get adopted into the dominant culture. Some people call it cultural appropriation, which of course, is silly. Cultures have intermingled and adopted each other's norms for centuries.
The dominant culture gets contributions from all sub-cultures here in America. Latin, Asian-American, American Indian, etc.
In truth, we are changing. But it is not right to pretend there isn't much resistance to that change.
And truthfully, honestly, I don't know if the resistance is totally wrong.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-u7FCdna_c
Good, we progress. But it goes deeper than that. The culture isn't white; it has no skin tone. Your PERCEPTION of it is that it's "White" In fact, ANYONE can be part of the dominant culture. As long as you continue to tie culture to race, you'll keep falling into that same trap. You have to break free of the idea that your skin determines your culture to leave your racism behind.
I have a doctor at the VA who may or may not be black. I can't tell. And honestly, I don't care. He's part of the dominant culture. He speaks with a flat Mid-western accent, he knows his stuff, he answers question with patience and listens attentively. I take his advice, because he's smarter than I am (no great feat, admittedly ;) ). I don't just respect him, I hold him in esteem.
I have a neighbor, across the hall from my apartment. Lovely woman. Another member of the mainstream culture. She has a little Yorkie; and I hear her going out and coming back after walking the dog. She is black. Doesn't matter.
The point is, that as long as you conflate culture, especially the dominant culture, with race, you're going to be a racist. Please don't do that. Don't deliberately exclude yourself from the dominant culture. That's WHY you think in racial terms. Instead, join it, and leave race by the wayside where it belongs.
Well, if you want to get into the whole culture thing, "White" people aren't even white. They are some other color. We call "White" people "White" because that is the name they choose for themselves. It is respectful to call people the term they choose to refer to themselves as.
I don't tie my culture to race. Are you so far gone, that you think African-Americans are a race? I don't know to say to that. Many people with dark skin do not participate in African-American Culture. I don't call them "Black" or African-American. I call them what they choose to be called. Some people recognize a cultural connection among all those who are descended from a culture based in Africa. That's cool too. I don't believe in that.
And you can skip all these individual experiences. It isn't teaching me anything. Just tell me what is your issue with my position.
No, I am not racist. I mean you can call me racist, I don't really care. The definition of racism is in the dictionary. I don't even believe in your concept of race.
I believe in culture.
And I don't even try to rank one culture over another. What benefit would that serve me?
As for excluding myself, that is just silly. Non-"Whites" must educate themselves on "White" privilege. You can call it racist to try to stop us. But a "Black" parent knows they must educate their children on what to do when the encounter the police. Latinos know they have to inform each other of their rights when they are profiled as being illegals.
It is funny that you focus on the "Black" stuff. Is there a reason for that?
"The dominant culture is. . . mostly "White". I don't know why we would pretend it is otherwise."
"So let's run down a quick list of "White" privilege shall we?"
"1. All schools, even those where your people/children are not a majority, need to focus on the history that supremely concerned with and glorifies what you have deemed "your people".
"2. Social norms, graces, standards, etc. must comply to what "White" society deems normal and acceptable."
"3. The amazing thing about "Whiteness" is its ability to project universally. People's most beautiful in the world lists are a great example. The most beautiful people in the entire world, for years, were only or mostly "White". "White" people, if you are a raciologist, are not even the majority of the human race."
""White" privilege is being able to be evaluated by only the good that your supposed "race" has done. But never the bad. Many "White" people do not believe they can be profiled for any negative behavior."
"And almost all of those "White" people disbelieve in "White" privilege. "
"6. Most "Whites" will never feel shame about being a member of their own culture. Most will never know what it is like to not want to be a member of your own ethnic group. "White" people don't have discussions about what is wrong with "White" people. The "culture" (as you all have noted, I claim "White" people is merely a cultural designation) isn't capable of that kind of debate. But among Asian-Americans, African-Americans, Latin-Americans, American Indians, Arab-Americans, those discussions are common. Most "Whites" are pretty comfortable in their own skin. They don't have surgery on their eyelids to look like Asians or try to take creams to darker their skin color. In the non-"White" experience there are always themes of the struggle to accept yourself, your culture, and your history."
These are all YOUR thoughts. I'm not the one with a fixation on race. That's you. This is YOUR concept of race.
What you posting that stuff for? Are you saying you disagree that is the case?
I'm saying that for you to claim you are not race-focused is laughable, when you can't even discuss your cultural opinions without labeling them by race.
No sir. I don't use "race". I use "culture".
I guess you missed the quotes.
But I mean, no you have turned non-sensical.
Race is not real. I told you this in the beginning. "Black" people, "White" people. . . those are merely cultural designations. I can prove that race isn't real. I have links to dozens of studies if you need them.
Straw man argument. Of COURSE race isn't "real". I never claimed otherwise. What I'm saying is that as long as you continue to use the race labels to support your argument, even if applying them to "cultures" instead of actual people, you're still a racist. It's a bait and switch tactic. "Oh, I don't mean people! I mean culture!" but you still use the same old racist arguments and racist labels. You still talking about blacks, and latinos, vs "white culture". the fact is, there IS no "white culture". There's a dominant culture, but it's multiracial and multiethnic. You labeling it "white" doesn't change that. get over yourself, please. I will not reply again.
Well. . . if you never claimed otherwise, why do you keep telling me I confuse race with culture? It isn't my problem if people look at my skin color and make assumptions about my behavior. I think if people want to know a bit about my culture, they should ask me about how I identify. That might tell them something about me.
I don't care what you think of my use of "race" labels. My skin isn't black no matter what delusion you are trying to perpetrate. And I am pretty sure "White" people don't have white skin.
They call themselves "White" because they recognize a cultural connection to each other. To pretend otherwise isn't playing with a full deck of cards.
And I quote;
"Historical research has shown that the idea of "race" has always carried more meanings than mere physical differences;" American Anthropological Association.
That is an absolute fact of racial categories. They represent more than physical difference, no matter what insanity you peddle here.
I'm biracial and I see no white privilege. I see whites who have it worse than me and other people of color who have it better. I see racism in all groups and also a lot of people of different races who love each other like family and friends.
Sir, you are not addressing a single thing in my post.
Please look at my points.
Hm i am from country where is very little black people and is a bit distant to tbis very western culture and as I read this I am just thinking that people are really bored or they have ran out of ideas to argue about. It is same to me as lgbt, multiple gender and pronouns, or 3Rd wave of feminism. It looks like nonsense and I always hoped that just very little people actually cares about those and that those ho do are just really loud.
Yeah people care so little about these things. That's why I have been responding to posts non-stop for days.
Maybe, they care a lot. But if you live in another nation, good for you!
:)
Excellent! Well written. The racism on this site is appalling! Not surprising in a country that elected a racist president.
Yo but this is global lol
Well, there maybe a lot of racist posters. I think that is probably because of the ability to be anonymous and not have to very verify your identity.
But there are more good people here than bad. I think we need to recognize that.
Yay!
Agreed.
Crikey... Someome who can actually put a decent point across!
Well said... I hope just one person looks at the subject a little differently after reading this take.
I can only try. And yes. . . one person has seen thing differently because of this take.
Thanks for posting!
:D
Yes yes, well done! I have no disagreement. You did a very thorough decent job. Indeed very graceful.
Thank you ☀️🌟☀️
Thank you madam. My goodness. Look at the response to this thread.
Do you think we need to talk about race and culture more?
Absolutely. This is why I appreciate this contribution. You clearly carefully put it together in interest open discussion with no animosity. There should be many more like this. I would like to respond more to the content of this post when I have more time to dedicate.
Well, I will try. Maybe I will try to do something lighter. So much hurt and pain out there.