How Men's Rights and the Men's Rights Movement Are A Lie

How Men's Rights and the Men's Rights Movement Are A Lie

When I was growing up in my teen years I was like many young guys who felt slighted and unhappy by society for the way it seemed to esteem women and feminism, and I started going on a mission of my own to hate, blame, and attack feminism and any kind of rights or advantage for women. I was even writing my own book that was supposed to be about the evil of feminism and the plot against men, which would’ve been no different than all the other in-the-minority books other men wrote that nobody cared about either back then.

I got caught up in the modern day lie that men were being badly beaten by society, covertly being worked against, and were in desperate need of rights. Is it true that society and the system have failed men and is unfair to them in some ways? Definitely. But eventually I had to see what was really going on, and you’ll see too.

Campaigning as a victim gets you sympathy…

Don’t get me wrong - although I’m not a follower of Men's Rights I certainly am not an advocate or believer in feminism either. Feminism has a shameful history of racism and is notorious for using the focus of rape as terrorism in universities and society and whining about how women still have a long way to go.

How Men's Rights and the Men's Rights Movement Are A Lie

So having said that, men who favor or are active in the Men’s Rights movement know that portraying yourself as a victim, casualty, or affected individual can get you some kind of sympathy. They saw how feminists have done this for years and have been successful at it, so they decided they would start trying it: magnify the issue of male anorexia (in the very early 2000s this was a short-lived cry for attention) because “even boys are negatively influenced by images in the media,” highlight male rape victims as an enormous issue that gets ignored, cry about the difficulties of being a man so people can take it more seriously, dot dot dot. Unfortunately, trying to make males look like a victimized or affected demographic has not been very successful for MRAs.

How Men's Rights and the Men's Rights Movement Are A Lie

Once I started seeing what the Men’s Rights movement was doing with the victim/injured party thing, I took a step back and had to ask myself: is this how men are supposed to be taken seriously? By making ourselves look helpless and in need?

Men are still in control…

As much as many men - and also some women - want to blame feminism or women’s advances for how masculinity has been short-changed, the ultimate truth is that men are still largely the ones causing this. Men are giving women and women’s terrorist groups too much credit. They achieve nothing without a power structure deciding to take them seriously. Are there moments and areas of life where women really are the bad guys with some kind of control and screw men over? Most definitely, but on the larger scale of things, men are allowing unfairness to hurt their own gender.

How Men's Rights and the Men's Rights Movement Are A Lie

Government, the justice system, the employment world, the media, even the medical system, and everything else, is still largely run, decided, and controlled by men. It all basically is an IlluMANati. Men who run the courts are the ones who give favor to women in divorce and custody cases. They give female pedophiles and teachers lighter sentences for rape because deep down those men are aroused by women being sexual with young boys. They give female murderers less years in prison. Male police officers have also taken sex from women who wanted to avoid a speeding ticket or write up. Employers give women the job over a man who was more qualified because they feel that women are a better image, or because she gave sex for the position, or because the boss thought she was attractive.

How Men's Rights and the Men's Rights Movement Are A Lie

Men are the ones who hurt other men with their decisions and rules. Women and feminists have the right to cry all they want about what they feel is wrong towards their gender and what they think should change or be given to them, or how they feel about men, but ultimately men are the ones who have the most power to decide. And what they decide is to favor or esteem women where they don’t care about men being put down.

To be sure, women are not blameless and are without a doubt dirty crooks of their own doing and they do exploit men and exploit men’s disadvantages, but men in control still aren’t in a hurry to stop that either.

Men are giving women too much credit…

As I said before, men accredit women with too much power. They complain about women having some kind of might or influence a lot more than they really do. The problem is that men choose to give in to what women are doing. And by complaining, men actually satisfy women. Whether they say it or think it or not, women like that men are believing females to be powerful, influential, persuasive, etc. And they like that men are frustrated by it.

How Men's Rights and the Men's Rights Movement Are A Lie

In these times I find it sad to hear guys being jealous of women’s orgasms, women getting sex, getting dates, or accrediting women with some higher power that they perceive them as having in an envious way. These guys think they are somehow guilting women or insulting them with a sideways tactic, when the truth is that women actually like it that those things bother guys, and that’s how women get power. And they eat it up. Guys make masculinity seem more powerless and inferior than they really are, not realizing that it satisfies the female ego.

Men created the rights…

So they can give them. I’m not saying that men do have all the rights or have everything perfectly, there are certainly things that men should be given or should have to deal with less, but my point is at the end of the day the power structure is still mostly male and they can decide.

How Men's Rights and the Men's Rights Movement Are A Lie

But have you also noticed that the only things men have started to get a break with are matters of effeminate similarities? If men talk about it alone no one cares, but if it gets the approval of feminists who will also cry about it then people will start to listen, like with men being stay at home dads or being transgender. Even domestic violence against men and male sexual assault victimization has been taken more seriously - which I do think is good - but only because there have been women who also cried about it, and because it’s an area where a man is the helpless one.

How Men's Rights and the Men's Rights Movement Are A Lie

In situations where men are more commonly being wronged and overlooked and women really are the crooks or unfairly favored ones, are still not the areas that our male dominated power structure is in a hurry to fix.

#MensRightsBologna


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  • Ok but you clearly still sympathize with the cause of MRA's, you're just critiquing the tactics.

    Modern Western culture is a spiritual hellhole. It makes everybody miserable, even its most empowered and privileged: straight cis white men. It isolates people and makes them fear and resent each other. Even the billionaires are miserable.

    Now look at in-tact indigenous cultures all over the world. (I have to specify "in-tact", because your culture has decimated and corrupted almost all of ours.) Everyone knows their role, and has a spiritual connection with eachnither, the earth, and their ancestors. Men and women aren't fighting each other. There is no class structure, no drug abuse, no prostitution, and very little violence and crime compared to these moder urban wastelands you call civilization.

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    • Very true points.

    • Just curious. What are examples of "in-tact indigenous cultures all over the world" where "Everyone knows their role, and has a spiritual connection with each other, the earth, and their ancestors. Men and women aren't fighting each other. There is no class structure, no drug abuse, no prostitution, and very little violence and crime compared to these modern urban wastelands you call civilization."? Not up for debate, just genuinely curious. I would like to find a place like that.

  • Have you ever wonder why old white men are still in charge mostly even though half the votes would come from women?

    Is it because the women vote for the men instead of women? Or maybe women didn't make good popular politicians? Or maybe people have this image that men should be and decided that men fitting into this mold would be okay?

    Just ask yourself: is there something a man shouldn't do but you don't feel as much negativity when a woman do it?

    If a wife beats her husband then it's funny. If a husband beats a wife then it's domestic violence. Shouldn't they both be illegal and get treat with the same disgust?

    If a guy wears a pink dress then he is a freak but a woman wear men's clothing then she's curious or dyke.

    Where is the equality?

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Most Helpful Girls

  • The biggest issue is that it's basically impossible to get men to care about issues that negatively effect men. They just don't care, not most of them anyway. They don't care enough to get passionate about it, like women do. Maybe their pride gets in the way of admitting that something is wrong? They want to protect women, and they see the issues of need in men as a sign of weakness. "Suck it up and deal with it" is the attitude of many men, including those in power. Only a minority of men really care, and as long as it remains a minority, they will not be taken seriously.

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    • This is also true.

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    • I think sex is the issue, not fragile masculinity. Feminism has caused all the oppression men have today.

    • Men simply like the concept of survival of the fittest and nobody, feminism neither, is probably going to change our nature as a whole anytime soon.

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What Girls & Guys Said

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  • So much of this is true

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  • TLDR for this post in case someone doesn't bother to read through this.

    "We men should blame ourselves for giving women power. What kind of a pussy cares about injustices or societal issues."

    For a thirty-year-old man you have the edginess and understanding of a high schooler.

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    • Orrrrrrr maybe it's the men whining and acting like high schoolers about the facts.

    • What facts would those be? In the United States incarcerated men and college-aged of women face a very real threat of sexual assault. That's not "whining."

    • The facts that men are oppressing other men in the areas I stated in this Take. And men should blame themselves for letting women exploit them, yes. I care about societal issues, just not MGTOW bullshit or any of that bologna from angry Paul Elam followers.

  • These men understand how weak they are to the power of female sexuality. When we say jump they ask how high. That’s a part of nature. Men serve to pursue and take care of women.

    Men’s rights are just angry that this has progressed to benefit women more than men.

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    • It used to happen back in 19's now the guys have evolved in to pussy hungry shit... and they will do anything to have it. When they got bored of your taste they will simply just leave you but Woman are traumatized by this experience, She believes how can a man turn from personal slave to the absolute hater,
      Well Darling he was hungry for V and now he is attracted to another one... You are 30+ so I think you have pretty good idea about these experiences.

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    • Lol. Dont be salty for not having a real man by your side.

    • I do have one.

  • You: "Men's rights and Women's rights movements are just crybabies"
    Also you: *proceeds to cry about men's rights and women's rights movements*

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    • Exactly. Men feel threatened that they might end up in the same social and economic situations that women were once in. They are acting out due to realize their loss of control. The total control was never meant to be theirs to begin with. And as a result of the destruction of trust and healthy relationship between men and women, feminism happened. There’s no way it was ever not going to happen. In fact, I think we’re lucky that feminism hasn’t been more aggressive. Because I know I might be provoked to do wicked things if a man ever so much as thought he could own me like property.

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    • No way.

    • Uh, they aren't. There is a certain degree of male oppression, but it has never been as bad as womens. Not that their oppression is invalid, but it's not the same.

  • You make it sound like every guy who supports men’s rights portrays himself as a victim but that’s not true. It’s known - as you mention - that men are the ones enforcing unfair law/rules on other guys but who has ever claimed that was not the case? You can find tons of videos talking about those kinds of guys

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    • Right. But the majority of people who are aiming at women as the problem are men.

    • @ManOnFire Woman tend to be part of said problems. For example when woman screams rape , man must prove hi didn't do it. Woman at most of times are treated as victims even if she was agressor, and men as agresors even when they did nothing and endured female abuse. That said there are mens problems like prostata cancer, high suicide rate, work related deaths where woman aren't responsible for. MRA is great thing as long as it dont turns into feminist bulshit...

  • I could see where you were going with this in some of the parts, and some parts I didn't agree with at all. In the end I don't think it's fair to say the Men's Rights Movement is a "lie", how can it be a lie when it's true that men still have certain disadvantages in society that should be addressed?

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  • Spit out the kool-aid bub. It's poison and it won't get you laid.

    Western women are the most privileged group of humans to ever exist.
    If ANY of the shit you said was valid, we wouldn't be the group with the endless list of actual issues.

    How Men's Rights and the Men's Rights Movement Are A Lie

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    • But you have to ask yourself: WHY are Western women the most priveleged? Because men have allowed it.

    • Western women are only "privileged" like a housecat is "privileged". They're pets.

  • There are secret legal corridors within the United States with strict male prominence and of pro men’s rights. Please don’t say women wield all power, just compare the scandals of Hilary Clinton to that of Trump. Who had dire repercussions that should answer itself.

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    • I never said women wield all the power.

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    • Yes absolutely

    • Nobody likes or is that prepared for radical changes. Nor do they happen unless it benefits all concerned.

  • Well no one talks about handout anymore.
    It's not men/women being wronged. We need to look at both with the same eye and consider that the other person is a human like us.
    I think it will promote more rational thinking and we will be free of gender rights and we'll figure in human rights.

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  • I see what you're saying. The Men's Rights movement is trying to equalize marriage so that men don't have to pay women after a divorce, because a divorce defeats the purpose of the financial bind of marriage. I'm unaware of men's freedom being infringed aside from marriage laws.

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    • Most of the time, men don't have to pay women after a divorce unless the men are stupid. Stupidity brings its proper rewards.

  • I have always mentioned the Man leading the flock of sheep/protecting it while again the man attacking as predators. While the woman think they are anything but in reality they are just Sheep to blind to see the one giving the orders and the one breaking the rules.
    Typical idiotic woman believing they achieved anything and the whole modern system of dating actually favours men too. We always dream of having sex with multiple woman without marriage and any responsibility while the woman are the one serious about relationships.
    We somehow make them believe them its freedom and good for them but in reality their CLOCK is ticking very fast towards the 30+ limit and after that, She will lose her beauty and man will stop looking at her for good.
    While we got unlimited age to play and I have noticed woman always become serious about marriage stuff at 30's even successful and rich ones but their prime time is gone by Now.

    I don't believe the Man's rights movement is a lie they do raise some very serious issues and they have to play the pathetic game to gain attention otherwise. Who is gona believe them? and they are still leagues behind the MeeTOO publicity stunt.

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  • this is a very complicated issue. i just wish GaG could detect irrational men and women and keep them from joining the conversation then we could have discussed it peacefully.

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  • True, those in power over many jurisdictions are still majority men and women still do have their issues, but this article does neither addresses nor refutes the issues of concern Men's Rights activists discuss:
    • unequal laws on divorce, alimony, child-custody, child-support
    • lack of gender-neutral anti-rape legislation
    • lack of concern/funding for male-illness medical-research than for women's (ex. funding for breast-cancer vs. prostate-cancer research)
    • disturbingly-lower male academic-performance while honor-students are generally female (generally in the West)
    • 1-sided mandatory military service directed mostly to only 1 gender
    • etc.

    And if they try to address these issues, can you imagine who will immediately object and brand the law-makers as woman-hating misogynists?

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    • I did address it, by noting that these issues are in men's hands to fix but they're not really trying to.

      "And if they try to address these issues, can you imagine who will immediately object and brand the law-makers as woman-hating misogynists?"
      - That is also true.

  • It's not a lie, but it is true that for the most part society as a whole doesn't really give a shit about men, especially the men in power. The idea that the men in charge do, that they do what they can to benefit men over women they way feminists think they do, is a lie.

    Because of this it's pointless to complain as a man expecting sympathy and real change. Even the people who pretend they do care about men will mock men for complaining. They'll tell men to be more open about feelings, then they'll be the first to call men whiners, losers, and incels for doing so.

    As a man all you can do is see what's going on and behave accordingly. The things mens rights activists complain about can mostly be avoided. Unfair divorce laws? You can't get divorced if you don't get married. Or just don't date feminists, idiots, slutty women, damaged women.

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  • A men's rights support group is like a drug dependency group. Walk away from your addiction to pussy. I don't need a support group. The key is being willing to do without sex unless the package that goes with it is good. There's plenty else to do with your time and a good fap once in a while will slake off the thirst.

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  • I agree to a point. Yes the power is given away by men. Yes - it's not ok to play the victim (even if you have been one). Everyone has a voice though.. and people voicing their concerns might stop the pendulum swinging the total other way...

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  • The Family court system is still rigged against men so I am all for Men's rights on that front!

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  • Lost me when you said men are mostly in control. Just because men are in some ways biased against other men, doesn't mean it isn't an issue worth addressing.

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    • Then what is the purpose of democracy where men with bias can rule with authority greater than a king?

  • I support MRA, there was no need for MRA before Feminism.
    The premise of Feminism being about "equality" is bullshit. What has been or ever will be equal between men and women? Men are strong, virulent, masculine, and have invented everything ever.
    Women are beautiful, feminine, never invented anything. I don't hate women.
    But where is equality? Women being masculine? Strong? Stoic? Doing heavy laborious work? Does a delicate, beautiful, submissive man make the juices flow ladies?
    There were no problems before feminism. Women and men gladly lived the stereotypical gender role from their birth to death. It wasn't until feminism agitating women into believing they were oppressed.
    I am old enough to remember women who were pre-feminist movement. They were extremely pleasant to be around, they were generally happy and fulfilled, had many children (Same father), and grandchildren. They were happy to cook meals, do laundry, clean the house, and knew their husband making decisions would not be a detriment to her... and their husbands were happy to provide an income, a house, transportation, discipline. Very few people were displeased living this way.
    The crux of the problem is agitating women into believing they would be better off if they had the same responsibilities as men, the same expectations, the same rights. That women are not equipped physically nor mentally to endure the labor force for an extended period of time, seems to have taken a large toll on women, especially from a psychological depression view. I have read consistently that up to +70% of all women are diagnosed with depression, a lot higher statistically than men who are under 5%.
    Women who deny the label of "Feminist", often are the most ardent feminists. Ask an anti-feminist label woman if she believes men and women are "equal", which is the definition of feminism, and she will wholeheartedly believe women are equal to men in every way, and will become militantly angry if you try to disprove her. So all women are feminists, with the possibility a few stray women are not.
    Feminism isn't even about "equality" anyway. It has always been about female supremacy over men from the beginning. Women enjoyed special rights and privileges before feminism that men never had. Sure, at one time women couldn't vote, but she didn't get drafted into war and lose her life or limbs. She was esteemed as a mother and wife. She didn't have to labor in coal mines, or factories, or any other physically demanding, dangerous career. Before feminism, men loved their wives, which is more than I can say about the unlovable women of today, who are impossible to tolerate, who will marry a man, have children, and steal his wealth and children, and speak condescendingly towards him forever. Yeah, I live that life now. An ex-wife who left for no reason, stole my kids and the last 13 years at $1200 a month, plus 10s of thousands through "equity".
    You can say, all women are not like that, but that is the biggest crock of shit. While all women haven't divorce raped their husbands, the rest dominate their husbands so thoroughly that it leaves him emasculated nonetheless.
    I heard a preacher once complain that he was upset because the single members of his congregation were having more sex than the married ones. Let that sink in. Isn't that really proving that women dominating their husbands leads to his emasculation, leaves him unexciting, as he is reduced to beta-man... "yes dear, yes dear"... says the emasculated married man.
    The MRA movement , even though I am for men's rights, is like pissing in the wind. So long as women are given privilege in family courts, men put in jail for having an argument with his wife, women are given special privilege in everything, by the elected and non-elected rulers, it is a fruitless battle. Total collapse of the society seems to be the only redemptive course.
    Men did not vote to give these privileges to women, that is a fallacy. It was a top-down determination.

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  • Congratulations on making yourself part of the problem. Evil women do exist. Tide Munchers like you, and corrupt judges, are the reason these women seem all-powerful.

    Worse than the slave owners, were those in denial that anything was wrong with the slave trade.

    You are on the wrong side of eternity, if you don't learn some empathy.

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  • Reasonable.
    Third wave feminism is about hating men. That is all.

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  • Just like feminism it's a lie. They're all about double standards. Downvoting this comment will just prove the double standards I'm talking about and I can already see it.

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  • I totally agree with no doubts.
    Men created rights.
    Men are giving too much to women.

    Men dont realise their true form of value.
    Man can be beyond anything!

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  • Victims are loser.

    Im not a loser! Feminist are...

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  • You're right. I'm not a victim. I'm in control. That's why I won't be signing a marriage contract that takes away that control. I have seen men both in my family and outside my family who have had their entire lives destroyed by marriage, so I'm opting out.

    I mean if a girl truly loved me then she wouldn't need me to sign a one-sided contract in order to be with me. She should care about my future success and well-being.

    "The problem is that men choose to give in to what women are doing."
    I couldn't agree more. Opt-out.

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  • It's not the men's fault really or the women. It's cultural Marxist interference in society. This is their legacy among other very bad things. What they seek is abnormal and produces bizarre and malevolent results.

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  • I don't see why guys always feel the need to talk about these kinda things tbh...

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    • If women can talk about these kinds of things, why can't men?

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    • @Justcallmealy All I will say is this, apart from what these others are saying because they don't sound very experienced, that it seems to be you have no regard for men period. I mean you basically brush it off as something you believe men shouldn't care about or be concerned about, and even 3 other women didn't agree with you.

      This Take does note that men do contribute to men's problems, but that doesn't mean men's problems are necessarily invalid or shouldn't be talked about.

    • *congratulations. It's about time you just realize started something you don't even wanna finish

  • Sorry, but I am still a strong supporter of men's rights and will continue to fight against feminist hatred towards us. As for the men in courts, they need to be fired because they are being controlled by feminist lies and ideologies that have been spreading for years if not decades. We need to replace them with conservative men who don't listen to liberal sh*t. And replacing them with female judges will only make things worst because women will emotionally feel and believe more in what misandrists say and give more pu55y passes. Men are the oppressed ones in society. Women have all the benefits in health, business, jobs, media, etc. That needs to be stopped! We need more men's marches, activists, protests, everything we can. More conservative leaders is a must. A must. President, vice president, judges, CEO's and so on. ♂️
    #mensrights #redpill #himtoo #mra

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  • I don’t agree that (most) women love and eat up negative attention and I don’t agree that women (in general) are dirty crooks.

    Those are just my opinions. Maybe I’m biased because I’m a woman... but most females aren’t soul sucking vampires out to get men for the sake of privilege and dominance.

    But anyways, I support your overall message. I’ve been saying this so many times on here. Men are the ones who are in control, at large. And most of the oppression they face is their own fault for allowing themselves to be doormats. And y’all love to claim how women have no respect but honestly some of you whiners just don’t deserve any.

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  • I think you should watch the movie the red pill, that is an eye opener on some REAL problems that the men's rights movement want to deal with.

    Such as men's sucidie's rate being MUCH higher than women's and the power women have when it comes to divorce and child custody.

    That movie really blew my mind on some things

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    • It was actually on TV about a week ago in my area and I came in on the last 10 or 15 minutes.

  • Growing up and even until i was 30 i had never heard of mens right movements or that women had it better in todays society.

    Only when i started looking it up on Youtube did i learn about it.

    My life experience has mostly been very please t despite the 'gynocentric' society they say that we live in

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  • The real enemy of men are men themselves and not women, it's the high chair men who act like lapdogs to women

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  • Most are paid by the right wing to distract people from all the horrible shit that Republicans are doing.

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  • There's a lot of good stuff in here; I disagree with some of what you wrote regarding the justice system and lighter sentences, as there are often exteunating circumstances in every case. I also think overuse of the term "pedophile" actually hurts everyone, but hurts males more with its stupidity. But the reasons you mentioned for *why* older females who have sex with teen dudes get lighter sentences is partially true, but you got the why of it wrong-- it's because we as males want sex more, that we see that in a different light. Pretty simple.

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  • 4d

    Men have gone through more suffering than women in history, I'm just going to say that

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  • Male dominated power structure... idgafa fuck what gender the shepherds are, the average man has to walk on eggshells around women because of the way the game is set

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  • This sounds like a male's version of a feminist group

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  • It's a sad day when men won't support other men when they are miss treated with such things as alimony and child support.

    It's a crime to be a white male.

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  • I'm still waiting for people to wake up and to get together in unison so we can stop fighting over such dumb topics. It's nothing but division tactics.

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  • So SOME men being in charge of a system invalidates claims by other individual men who are screwed by said system? That is illogical, collectivist nonsense.

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    • Oh it's much more than just SOME men.

    • No, it isn't. It is SOME men, and women make up a majority of the electorate.

    • but neither men nor women are a monolithic block. People are individuals, and individuals deserve to be treated equally under the law, period.

  • This article is superficial to the point that it becomes wilfully ignorant of the facts.
    It is a crock of shit, written by a blue-pill soy boy.

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    • Rather than expressing your opposing view using indecent language like a twelve year old, why don't you present your views then like a decent human being?

    • @Aki6000
      Indecent language? 🤣
      Most of the people who use this site lack the education and demonstrated cognative capacity to understant a fact-based argument.

    • However there are also those who are capable of understanding and if you are not willing to present a fact-based argument to those, then isn't it better to just not say anything since your reply simply does not add anything of value to the table. In fact, I almost mistook you for one of those people who 'lack the education and demonstrated cognitive capacity to understand a fact-based argument' when I saw your comment.

  • WHat... the fuck is going on here...

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    • He's making the personal political.. He was an "MRA" because he was full of hate, so he thinks that's what MRA's are all about. So now he's trying to say he supports MRAs but is not an MRA because he previously identified as one because of his emotional issues.

      Or something like that..

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    • 7d

      @Jager66 *facepalm* I don't support MRAs period.

    • 7d

      @ManOnFire Sorry, my bad. Thought you were just making a common mistake. Didn't realize you are a legit self loather.

  • Delete your account

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  • You're right single fathers having their children taken from them because they get cancer is a prime example of how men have all the rights.

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  • So what? You aren't going to achieve anything by contemplating about these things online. Achieve prosperity and wealth for yourself and loved ones rather than trying to win society's losing battle.
    Its okay to think about yourself first, its okay to be 'selfish' as long as you aren't harming anyone.
    Only losers, leechers and other sad people will tell you to think about them first.
    Help yourself first and then think about helping others. Make money and then found a private school for example.

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  • Open your local law book, find every right every single person has. These activists must be illiterate.

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  • Although I agree with a lot of things you say, that does not mean that men's rights movements are lies. The complaints are very legitimate. I agree with the fact that most of this is due to decisions taken by men mostly, most of these men are manipulated in some way to treat women as weaker beings that would need special care, which is contradictory with the "egalitarian" view that feminism is trying to push.

    To me, if all these men taking decisions actually had some honor, pride and self-respect, men would not suffer these consequences as much.

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  • The idea that someone who disagrees with you must be "lying" is itself a lie.

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  • I can tell that you're either uneducated or dumb and stupid one or the other.

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  • you threw the rock, let's see how many hit dogs yelp

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