Why do engineers hate theoretical physicists?

[sjoes006]

I guess it is because they like law and order and fear the unknown. Things seem to need to be black and white for them. Your thoughts?

[Conrad_Kelsiven]

I have a very 'engineer' mindset, and I have a lot of friends with the 'theoretical physicist' mindset. I don't hate them, but they rarely make sense to me when discussing ideas.

Why?
Well, take designing a building in my architecture course. These guys want to use steel framing because it 'theoretically' carries more load, and is cheaper per- pound of support. That is great and all, except... when building a one story building that doesn't require that much structural strength, and so is cheaper to make out of wood.

This quote might also help sum it up. "Anyone build a bridge, but it takes an engineer to build a bridge that almost stands." Just because something isn't the most 'effective' way to do something, doesn't mean it isn't the most 'efficient' way of doing it.

Theoretical Physicists and Engineers often diverge when it comes to resources, like time, money, people, etc. Yes, one way IS more powerful/effective/sound, but in a minimalist world, sometimes ducktape is all you need to patch a hole.

[Hans222]

I guess because they like to try it out and make things work... not theoretical but practical :D

[Anonymous]

Engineers hate everyone. 😛

[atomique]

Yes and no. *Smile while looking at rubbish specs*

[ak666]

I'm a software engineer if that counts who worked with some physicists on dynamics engines. I wouldn't say I "hate" them but we speak a different language.

Software is about large-scale organization, design, cleanliness. If there's research, it's to find like a better applied solution algorithmically, and the ideal solution isn't always ideal on the whiteboard, but ideal in code (maintainability, efficiency, etc).

Scientists are kind of more on the whiteboard, tend to thrive in the theoretical realm. Mostly I was working with brilliant people with horrific code that acceptably demonstrated their theories, but was a mess in terms of efficiency and maintainability.

So I considered them brilliant people, but with a very different language, different kind of focus.

[ak666]

I think the tension is between theory vs. practicality, between what works well on paper vs. what works well in practice, and that tension just kind of exists between engineering and science in general: practicality (engineering) vs. science (theory).

[Dubhlann]

Best answered with this joke:

Milk production at a dairy farm was low, so the farmer wrote to the local university, asking for help from academia. A multidisciplinary team of professors was assembled, headed by a theoretical physicist, and two weeks of intensive on-site investigation took place. The scholars then returned to the university, notebooks crammed with data, where the task of writing the report was left to the team leader. Shortly thereafter the physicist returned to the farm, saying to the farmer, "I have the solution, but it only works in the case of spherical cows in a vacuum".

[lericah]

Well it's a wide brush your painting with there. If you've truly been here a while you will realize generalizations don't apply properly when you fail to scale them appropriately.

That said the problem with "theoretical physics" is that while many parts of it are based on sound mathematical principles the fact is the term "theoretical" is a bad term. Theory implies it is a series of related hypotheses proven through experimentation and replicated multiple times which "theoretical physics" is not. In most cases the hypothesis cannot be tested given todays limitations or it cannot be tested given the laws of physics. What has been tested is often no longer put under the umbrella term theoretical physics.
The multiple "theories" under "theoretical physics" as we often hear in magazines is contradictory theories which have individual coalesced hypothesises that have been proven but these theories are also blended in with other theories and hypothesis which are unproven or untested.

[astrOnaut01]

Technically I'm not an engineer yet, but I have no problem with theoretical physicists just because of their career choice. In fact I find it interesting

The only example of a feud between scientific professions, that I can think of, is between Sheldon and Howard.

[sjoes006]

It isn't a feud and Sheldon is a horrible excuse for a Physicist. I haven't watched that show in years but isn't that the point?

Every engineer I've ever known hates or doesn't even understand quantum mechanics yet alone astrophysics.

[astrOnaut01]

TBBT is the only example I can think of, bad as it is.

Well, they're difficult concepts, I don't blame them. I'd like to understand quantum mechanics, if it's any consolation lol

[sjoes006]

Thanks for the reply. I guess that is why my guy is so apathetic.

You would like to understand it but it is still a field we know little about so it isn't like- okay now I know it the end.

I guess what draws me to it is because we don't but we are discovering so many things that fly in the face of common human observation.

I love hearing Weinberg speak because he will speak to you on what he knows, what he possibly predicts for the future and what no body knows. He is approaching 90.

I can also tell by his lack of excitement that he doesn't feel to keen on any version of strong theory out there. But he knows he won't be alive to see it of he's wrong. He just tells you like a grandparent would what they know, what they were, and what they'd like to see as well as want.

He is a big science guy. His dying wish seems to be for an alliance amongst countries for even bigger colliders in the future.

[sjoes006]

I don't know at work I'm very practical but nothing excites me more than advances in particle physics. And it is rare that I find anyone who can speak on the topic with me or even cares.

My boyfriend gets upset with me for having an unexcited face when we do his things. But what ticks me off is that we almost always do his things and I'm happy to do them. But if I get bored or stressed about something I make my 'bad face'.

He's knows that AstroPhysics is my biggest interest as it was also my Dad's. And he makes a bad Dave through all of it. Even when I looked at him with pure glee after certain things said. He knows for me this is my favorite mind.

When I've seen him that happy I'm happy just to be there and see him beam.

[detlef]

That sounds like a good question for a departmental party where alcohol is being served. :)

They don't, of course, as a rule. In fact I know several people who are both.

Not many engineers hate Einstein, Feynman, Hawking. The work of many engineers depends on the work of theoretical physicists (and vice versa).

Friction can arise in collaboration but that's always true of collaboration.

[sjoes006]

When I say hate I guess I just mean look down on them and think they are day dreamers.

[detlef]

I read down the page that you were inspired to ask this by that friend you took to the event.

All engineers are different. I've got three in my family. All three are very open-minded and would have enjoyed the event.

There's a line from Star Trek Voyager that I think about a lot: "It may be the warriors who get the glory, but it's the engineers who build societies." Every physicist I've ever known understands that as well.

It's a symbiosis.

[BertMacklinFBI]

they probably just got too much obvious shit to disagree with right off the bat, and some might translate that into hate, just to keep the point clear right off the bat.

[gapminder]

Engineers know form and quantifiable precision. Theoretical physicists think outside that realm.

[sjoes006]

I guess so but experimental physicists are more about precision and they find a way to work together.

[gapminder]

I agree, but even Steven Hawking admits that being aphysicist requires an open mind and somewhat of an imagination.

[sjoes006]

Hawking is way overrated if he wasn't in that chair no one would care.

[gapminder]

What's more is now that Einstein's theory of relativity has been proven. Why do we call it a "theory"? So I wonder why the anymosity as well because all engineering equations were at one time based upon a theory.

[TadCurious]

Maybe it's hard for them to accept quantum mechanics. But then even Einstein didn't fully accept quantum mechanics. That's still amazing to me every time I think about it.

[sjoes006]

Well it certainly took a while for me to get on board with it. But as far as Einstein goes my favorite professors notes that any decent grad student today understand Einsteings relativity better than Einstein did.

I guess engineers like what is tangible. If we had enough money things would take off more than they already have at places like CERN. The smaller we look 'more expensive it gets.

It's not because it is hard I guess they just don't care.

[atomique]

I don't hate theoretical physicists. I do fear the unknown. Some solutions come from the gray area.

[ConsultantIsBack]

Just different interests and a different lens they view a problem

[joeb73]

Engineers have to work with it will work not it should work. Would you like to fly in a plain that will work or one that might work

[QuestionMan]

Because engineers can test their theories while theoretical physicists sit around doing math all day.

[sjoes006]

That's not why but it is very abstract.

[Anonymous]

because they are jealous thats why! engineers are all about control and mastering the elements.. physics guys are about asking questions and growing their knowledge base.

[frederikwinter]

You are absolutely wrong. First they don't hate theoretical physicists. Second they love their background theories and a lot of their findings. Third they use some of their findings to create useful apparatus to be used by most of you.

[Anonymous]

I know some physicists and I know some engineers.

They get along really well.

[sjoes006]

I mean when talking shop. I couldn't get one of my engineering friends interested in astrophysics to save my life.

[Anonymous]

One is solid and the other is theory but still never knew their was a hate to it.

[Anonymous]

Some theoretical physicists tend to consider engineers as kinda better mechanics. But theoretical physicists get paid less.

[Omar5881]

I wished to study theoretical physics and astrophysics but sadly I am going for engineering 😢

[Blueeyes81]

You watch to much big bang theory.

[sjoes006]

No I discovered this horribleness when I took one with me to hear Steven Weinberg do a panel and Q & A. I thought he would like it but I could tell he was bored and didn't know what was going on.

He was one of the only people who refused to give a standing ovation to the most brilliant theoretical physicists living today.

Prof Weinberg didn't just speak on his discipline he spoke on many things.

[blondfrog]

I didn't know that lol.