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How does feminism help men? (Page 2)
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You have to define feminism first. If you mean "equality feminism" then that helps men by lessening the assumption that we will pay for everything all the time. If you mean feminazism, then from what I can see that only helps men who want to shun the responsibility for the children they help create. It does it by pushing abortion-on-demand up to point of birth.
Equality feminism is not a thing, because it NEVER existed.
feminism
[ˈfeməˌnizəm]
NOUN
the advocacy of women's rights on the basis of the equality of the sexes.
It should but it dosent I also belive its a bad name for a now corrupt cause
"feminism helps men too"
Oh yes, by totally buggering marriage feminists have made it so now men can take jobs that give us just enough to be comfortable, by having to support a family, take on debt through mortgages, pursue any hobby we wish, just by being a bachelor and interacting or not with women as the mood takes them.
Edit there should be a 'not' before 'having to support a family, take on debt through mortgages'
It's not about "proving" anything. I believe that nobody wins unless everybody wins. Feminism simply allows people to be judged more by their humanity than their gender.
And yet the opposite seems to be happening here in 2019, since men can be blamed for all sorts of things under the guise of "toxic masculinity". Thanks to feminism, some employers are actively hiring less men and more women because some Human Resources intern threatened to sue the executive board for "not being inclusive enough". Of course, the *ideal* is that people be judge on character, not on gender or race. But people beating their chests about "inclusivity and diversity" (usually also feminists) are focused almost ENTIRELY on race, gender, and sexual orientation. If you're not a gay black woman, or a transgender Asian demisexual, then they don't want you around the workforce. Being a straight white man is, in these people's eyes, equivalent to being a black man in 1930s America. It's segregation in reverse.
(Please note: I'm not levelling this critique at you personally, and you're right on that either everybody wins or nobody wins. But not everyone in feminist movement is as level-headed and reasonable as you are. Maybe it's just this cultural tipping point we're at, where everyone wants to be offended by everything, and nothing is ever "woke" enough to satisfy the twitter mobs.)
p. s. despite the downvotes you're getting from guys on here, I actually agree with the first two parts of your statement, so upvoting on that basis. It can't be easy to defend something you're passionate about to a room full of people who have already decided you're wrong, so I respect the position you're taking even if I don't agree with parts of it.
@SomeGuyCalledTom Thank you. I am not out to get anyone and if someone who is innocent gets hurt in the name of feminism, I am truly sorry. Can people be too "woke"? Well of course. I think, too often, we look at the most outrageous things people say or do and attribute that to everyone who labels themselves a "feminist" or what have you. People have the absolute right to disagree with me or downvote me but I feel confident in my beliefs.
that sounds perfectly logical to me, people can overgeneralise a bit too much with hot button topics like this. A little rationality from both sides can go a long way.
It helps men to be more considerate and understanding of women's feelings of wanting to be treated fairly.
That's just a benefit for women with extra steps. I can't take "consideration and understanding" to the bank, it doesn't DO anything for me, besides making me... "nicer"... maybe? I'm not saying men should NOT be considerate or understanding of women's legitimate issues. But the question specifically relates to how MEN BENEFIT personally from feminism.
You can disagree with me if you like, but something tells me from how your comment got ratio'd that I'm not the only guy who sees it that way.
women's feelings dictate how they are treated, if they want to be treated unequally.
Bruh, fight for our rights too, then we'll talk.
It's fucking 2019, you're treated fairly by the majority of young men.
Feminism should be the fight for equality but it seems some use that word for domination over men and other issues. So do i think equality helps men? i think so. There's just more opportunities on both sides with equality.
How tho?
How does equality help everyone? Is that what you're asking?
I misread, I'm beyond stupid.
It doesn't. Its meant to silence Men its meant to demean them. Nothing good comes from feminism.
It was never meant for men only women to try and define roles in society.
It doesn't. Feminism has done its job in giving women equality like voting rights etc decades ago. Modern feminism can go back to hell. It's not needed anymore.
Never have I heard a feminist talk about male depression, suicide rates, inequality in family courts, preferential treatment in the prison system or male deaths in the workplace. Feminism is not beneficial for men, it never has been.
Feminism helps soft, weak men but isn't beneficial to the rest of us. Feminists claiming it helps men is strategic bullshit talk.
It doesn't. Men done epic poetry, paintings, sculptures, architecture but all their emotion and logic in it and then came the feminist saying the man ought to change because he is toxic. Feminists are people who advocate slave mentality as liberation. They are barbarians.
Nope! But I am not understanding why it should. If men want to help men, men need to come up with an actual movement that helps men.
We are not really good at that kind of thing.
Yet feminism says it's for equality...
Oh! Wait! I forgot, we can't exactly do that because we'll be belittled endlessly, have counter protests at every event, and be called "male supremicists" by the media. This all happened in Australia already.
Nah we can. But men secretly are happy with the system of employment, the entertainment industry, our political structure etc. That’s why we never created a movement for equality. Right? Feminism was started and created by women. Not men.
Because we liked the status quo.
And I have some advice for you. Try being a man. Trying having integrity and some honesty about this.
I need you to elaborate on your statement "be a man". What do you actually mean?
And, I must elaborate on my question. This question was made because of the influx of TED TALK speeches that have said that "feminism helps men".
Oh, I created a take on "Masculine traits". You know. . . on that being a man thing.
What Are Masculine Traits? ↗
I was surprised that so many of you young fellas as GaG think being a man is supposed to be about whining about feminism. Weirdness.
And they are wrong. Feminism was not invented to "help" men.
We have to invent a movement to help men. But the truth again, is that we did not think we needed help. Because the systems in place, were to our liking. Mostly.
One for the Boys! Samuel L. Jackson's Charity Focuses on Men's Health Issues ↗
This organization "helps" men. Unfortunately, it was started by a woman. I know I would not start an organization to help women.
I know it wasn't invented to help men, old-timer, but if the majority says they are for equality, and feminists create TED TALKS saying "men need feminism", what am I actually gaining?
I whine against feminism from a neutral standpoint and from the experience of my problems being ignored while EVERYONE ELSE gets charities, days, and even months to support them.
Look, man, I get what you're trying to say here, you got good ideas and good intentions, but I myself am fed up with stuff like the lack of abused men's shelters, not enough representation for abused men, and no voice.
And I am extremely offended that feminists would claim that "toxic masculinity" is the main problem instead of their own ignorance, and that they are for equality but have not donated anything to men.
There is only believed to be TWO shelters in the USA for abused men, yet there is an agency for abused women in every single one of your states.
There's about 2 in Canada as well, all unfunded by the government.
I'm not a political man, but I want only simple things out of the bountiful resources that our countries have on hand. I am extremely sorry for the pandering.
Well young whipper snapper. . . if you know feminism was not created to help men. . . why all the whining? Oh, so you actually admit to whining.
Wow. That's amazing. Well, at least you are honest.
But yeah, stay here and whine about how women don't create men's shelters. You don't seem to understand how hilarious you sound. Well. . . there is sad too. I uncertain as to which is worse.
But if men do not help themselves. . . they really can't complain about anyone else not helping them. It ain't like we lack the resources, dude. But well. . . it isn't like you practice that thing that men are supposed be good at. . .
"logic".
.
no feminism doesn't help men cos they hate men😒
Feminism disturbs a natural order that has existed for millennia around the world with brief interruptions in Rome, Babylon and Egypt that were symptomatic of the decomposition of those cultures. It is now participating in the decline of the West.
It doesn't. In fact, feminism the way it looks like today is detrimental to both men and women; especially men.
Feminism helps men.
Sure it does.
and eating that extra spicy monster bean burrito when you have hemorrhoids also helps you.
I do hope that this is going against "toxic masculinity".
Well they can certainly be better mothers if they have a richer set of skills and knowledge. Making them better prepared to offer a valuable education for the next generation of men.
BAM, I proved it.
I'd say they believe that demonizing men is their way to help men. They're just gonna explain it with their feelings.
And i would like to point out those "feminists" who claims what egalitarian do. Saying feminism is about equality when there is a male counterpart to feminism and an opposite to equality. And do they think that calling feminism equality is fair not realizing that there actually demonstrating superiority meaning they still believe that we are living in a patriarchal world where women are still oppressed. How sad
Also I wanna point out those "feminists" who helps men are actually egalitarians calling themselves feminists. There's a big difference by the way. It's just like saying "I'm an MGTOW who helps women"
A rising tide floats all boats.
If we make the oppressed half of the population a better situation, we all win as a society and social species.
Is this satire?
Nope, not at all. Are you genuinely saying you don't believe that helping part of our society will help all of it?
Egalitarianism would be best suited for you.
And you seem to think that feminism isn't in support of egalitarianism.
Egalitarianism is the philosophical sociological concept
Feminism is the movement.
Why feminism specifically over other isms? Because it was one of the early equality movements, it became somewhat cohesive, as a movement it promotes egalitarianism
And what is wrong with starting work toward egalitarianism with one of the traditionally most downtrodden groups?
The very fact that so many males get all squirmy about feminism shows right there that we still have a long way to go.
Ever wonder why no-one batts an eye when women wear traditionally male clothes, yet if a male dresses in traditionally female clothes everyone looses their mind?
Start by raising those most knocked down in society, everyone will have their situation improved.
So, women are oppressed.
When has feminism, as a movement, actively accomplished something for the sake of equality, that would help men, but would not benefit women?
I think I'd interpret that quote differently. If we help everyone have a better situation overall, it'll help the oppressed people too, no matter who they are.
@SwordShield if feminism as a movement were to be promoting actions that did not benefit women, these actions, by definition would not be egalitarian. Just as the actions that benefit women, benefit all of society. If they do not, then those actions should not be supported. Because they would be oppressive to one group or another or several.
@Boppy Sure, but why not lift the least privilidged to be more equal and everyone wins without leaving the positioning.
Or is the idea of letting others have theirs somehow reduces the value of your privilige?
Letting others have rights doesn't reduce your own.
My idea was that if we help everyone hit certain benchmarks (not living in poverty, access to education), then we won't need to know which groups are worse off, as everyone at rock bottom gets lifted by the tide.
@Boppy just classifying by different groupings, but sure. Group by socio-economic. or educational level
Thing is you need to know who you are helping in some form or another, so you can give them the required help
Hah, ya got me. I think it's a more direct metric than the usual groups (gender, skin color). :p
I do read the quote as encouraging unaimed improvements, but hey, I'm not gonna get upset if you prefer a different interpretation.
@Boppy
Unaimed improvements are great and all... but you get far more bang for your buck by targeting improvements at where they are needed.
Hit the problem with a scalpel instead of a meat mallet.
I'm not saying the quote is gospel, it's just a quote.
I see the quote as meaning something different.
You have missed my point, entirely.
I would rather believe that smoking is healthy for lung than modern misandrist feminism helps men.
Making us stop worrying about things that are considered "UnMaNlY" like crying, being submissive, shy etc... and when women are independent you don't have to give them money they have their own well paid jobs
It is literally biological that we don't cry as much, such as deeper tear ducts.
Horseshit... we do cry. I mean, when we're sad we feel like we wanna cry but we keep it inside which is unhealthy by the way
I never said we don't, but we keep it inside because we are men. If any of us has bad feelings, we need to talk with someone about it.
It's called feminism but the definition is equal rights treatment and pay for all. It doesn't exclude anyone.
The only, help I can see is I see who is who more clearer.
Do not even go close to feminist as they will find some stupid point to prove...
Other then that not much...
Access to free contraceptives benefits men as well as women.
Pay parity benefits entire families, not just women.
I have some women friends. My friend that works at Walgreens, yes. She tries to help me find a girlfriend. I have many women friends, but married or have a relationship.
It helps men just as much as it helps women... Which is not even slightly.
feminisms in its core value yes, 3rd wave not so much
Might have been the case forty years ago; can't see how it helps us now unless our goal is to die alone and afraid.
Showed us women are just as full of shit as men and really aren't better than us. It released a lot of tension and in men.
It helps feminine men. Its against masculine men. Feminism says its ok for men to cry, be gay, turn into trannies, etc stuff like that. The vast majority of men don't want to cry or be gay or wear a dress so no it does not help men.
Maybe because it makes there be 2 incomes in the home instead of only 1.
That actually made life worse for everyone.
@MrLogical Why is that? (I'm not a feminist, by the way.)
Wages were cut in half because the employers couldn't afford to pay the same rate at double the number of employees. The solution was then to cut wages in half of what they were, which is a huge part of why we have such horrible wage stagnation now.
So what does that mean for the men? They had the same amount of work and half the pay.
For women? They had no choice but to find jobs because you could no longer live off of one wage, which has also had a horribly negative affect on parenting. I'm sure you have heard all the issues with this generation, give it time, it will be worse and worse because kids are hardly being raised by those who should be doing it.
How does this affect both genders? Wage stagnation is a big one, as mentioned. People who are in a relationship they are no longer happy in (or even worse, abusive relationships) often feel trapped economically because they can't afford to live on 1 wage. So they either suffer in current relationships, are forced to move back into their parents house (if possible), or they hop into another relationship when they aren't emotionally ready.
All of these things lead to horrible parenting, kids will grow up thinking their childhood was good/normal (it's not, shouldn't be normal), and will only have a spiraling affect downward towards a worsening future.
You could argue that because women entered the workforce it gave them at least *some* power in leaving a bad relationship. But if it did, why don't they? (Because it really didn't, again, wage stagnation and wages being worth half what they used to be in terms of buying power. Half is probably overstating it.) But even then women sacrificed their power of choice on choosing men and who to marry/date/cohabitate with and now do it out of necessity because both men and women are desperately just trying to afford bills, and you can't do it on a single persons wage. Also, since men are now so desperate to find women they are even more cunning, lying their way into relationships and more or less entrapping women out of economic desperation. Women also lost the most important time of their child's life for... What? What we have now is better? I don't think so, personally.
I have no issue with women in the workplace, but society was better off with someone raising the kids. I hope it goes back to that someday, some how. Kids need parents, was cutting wages worth them losing that? I say no.
Yeah but you can't force women to be a house wife
Shinka, I never suggested that tho. I don't know the solution to the problem, I can just see it exists.
Yeah, 2 incomes which bring half as much.
It doesn't, that's the whole point of feminism. It only drives women's "issues".
Not once has feminism helped me. If anything I've watched as men have been marginalized and vilified. I've never been a "woman hater" but radical feminism has made of me an enemy
It doesn't. It's an attempt to coerce people into being passive betamales, which quite hypocritically, most women dislike when it comes to dating. It's just another way to willingly leave evolution
It gives the women something to talk about while the boxing is on.
When a lady is caught making a fake rape accusation, we attack her for her bullshit against men.
I see women doing what you said, but any of them were feminist.
I've literally never seen a feminist defend a man against false accusations, if anything they're in the wings carrying placards like "believe all women"
Then you’re seeing some shitty feminists, and I’m sorry for that
Doubt you are
Why is that?
is there any other kind of feminist?
Because women don't care about men only what a man can contribute to her life
I never saw a feminist do this, I usually see them double down on the notion that all women should be believed and that false allegations are not a big deal.
Go against the legal system instead! A lenient 1 year sentence was dealt out to a woman who ruined 2 men's lives.
It turns the men into simpering simps and simpletons.
Feminism has never even helped women.
That's false women used to be nothing but house wives and paired up with men to keep them company now women choose who they want and what they want to do instead of being forced and having no choice feminism has helped women go from 3rd class citizens to 1st
@Cocacolaaddict that's not historically true. Most people were 3rd class citizens anyway. In arranged marriages young men don't choose their wives either their parents do. So what exactly has feminism ever done for women?
Hmm if that's true then not so much but what about the added rights that theyv been getting over the years like the right to vote not to mention the law I'd in favour of women like women usually win court cases against men the judges take the woman's side (not every single time yes sometimes the men win) but mostly its women who win judges and police officers take the women's side if a woman accuses a man of rape rather then find all the evidence first then automatically assume and treat the man with guilty and disgust simply because he was accused. what has feminism done for women? It has warped the minds of people to be in favour of women
@Cocacolaaddict in most countries men only got the right to vote in last 200 years and even then it was only men with property, that changed in about 1900.
The main reason that the majority of women reject feminism is because every woman is some man's daughter, sister, mother, aunt, girlfriend, wife, cousin, friend, grandmother.
Dosent stop feminists
Feminism are useless even for women so...
Feminism is essentially equality. Right now only half the population (men) have the best opportunities to innovate, start companies, etc. if we give equality to all 100%, that means more jobs for everyone, including men.
Hopefully one day men won’t have to worry about giving up half there stuff and/or alimony.
It doesn't. At all. There's no wave of feminism that actually fought for men's rights despite calling itself a movement for equality
I am not feminist. But they helped by frees men from gender roles like a man should not be a womans financial slave or he should not be forced by society to provide the woman? I do not know more sorry
Yeah, so that women have to pay the bills equally, on top of bearing the children & doing all the housework. Very fair
Women have right on o the men their married too to provide, pay bills and still allow his women to work optionally if she wants and take her pay home 100% without helping with Bill's.
@mistixs I'd likely keel over if someone I was involved with ever lifted a finger around the home. Lord knows growing up my mother stopped around when I was 7. It really catches me off guard when even a women friend so much as performs the simple act of bringing me a drink. It truly is a foreign experience since I I so used to women doing pretty much nothing but being present. Kind of like having a pet. I have to both entertain and feed them. So I got a female dog. At least she doesn't grow roots in front of a television.
Wtf i dont get the dislikes by butthurt men
**MannMitAntworten you german?
You know, as a single guy I don't see how any of this helps me.
What do you mean?
Not me... I didn't hit dislike. Just a comment.
@shinka1y234 Nein.
"frees men from gender roles like a man should not be a womans financial slave or he should not be forced by society to provide the woman" I mean, none of this applies to single guys.
Married, sure. But not single.
feminism gives women the equal right to get blown into dust in a desert in Iraq from an IED. so that's good, right?
Men are more able to show emotion now instead of holding it in. They are able to have a more active role raising kids making these relationships stronger than when only moms were doing the child rearing.
1) No we still can't show emotion. I've never heard any woman say "Oh my God, his crying makes me hot". Women say "You should show more emotion" like they say "Sure go out with your friends. It doesn't matter to me :)".
Men showing emotions disgust women a woman will lose all respect for a crying man
@Hypnos0929 I was waiting for this response. No I don't ridicule men for crying. When I see a man crying I figure he's hit is limit. I prefer being with a man who shows his emotions versus having him end up with emotional problems because of it or having a heart attack or something.
@Cocacolaaddict No I respect a man who cries. I figure he's hit his limit at that point. It is a lot better than a man going and getting drunk or being depressed and withdrawn or worse. I a
tell me what you're thinking = give me ammunition for the next time we have an argument
But can you say the majority of women think that way?
The emotional response is a false flag. What you mean is that feminism has asked men to surpress their natural response to emotional distress and instead emote how women emote. In other words ignore your own biological response to emotional stimulation and instead respond how women naturally respond to emotions. Otherwise it is called toxic, or suppression.
@JSG4_ actually my ex did that to me. I told him something and I asked that he never bring it up in a fight because it was painful to me. He did bring it up in an argument.
@Hypnos0929 I have no idea but that is how I function. I think there are more women than you think that get hurt by seeing their man cry.
@Anpu23 I'm not saying men have to run around crying all the time. If a man cries a lot he's either depressed or has some coping skills issues. I'm talking about when a man cries because he's legitimately sad or afraid like when he loses his job after 30 years, some he knows is sick or dies, if his child is having problems, things like that. Real reasons that anyone would cry. If a man starts crying all the time when it isn't his norm it's time to get it checked out medically.
You misunderstood, according to FMRI men's emotional centers are tied to the areas for action and movement, while women's centers are tied to communication. Therefore it seems to be natural for guys to act on their emotions while it seems to be natural for women to talk about there emotions.
Therefore a constructive way for men to address emotional distress would be something physical, working out, building something etc. Yet these behaviors have been labeled as avoidance or to take a more popularistic term toxic. Therefore this campaign to get guys to open up is actually counter to biology and not helpful, instead it is a control technique to force men to emote in a way that women relate to. And is probably effecting the emotional health of many men.
@Anpu23 ah that makes sense. I do believe there is some truth to that. I meant more like a brief crying spell if something came up. Most men aren't prone to talk in great depth about something unless it is pretty overwhelming.
Side Note: i think if boys (well girls too) had more time to be active like when I was in school with three recesses and free playing instead of organized activities all the time I think that there would be more well balanced boys and men.
Oh! You made a typo! What you actually meant to say was "be more feminine so you don't kill yourself".
it doesn't help men, it helps women, I thought that was the point of it in the first place...
It doesn't help men or women.
Sorry down voters youv been out voted
It does not help ME, for sure. But if it helps THEM - fine with me.
It doesn't. All it does , is put men down for daring to exist
It doesn't help men. It makes them more effeminate.
It empowers men to turn into a woman. Come on man it's 2019 you can't be asking these questions, it's common sense.
Looks like some people didn't understand what I meant.
If the increasing numbers of confident, capable, assertive, sexually liberated women who aren't afraid to shine isn't enough proof for you, nothing ever will be!
Bruuuuh.
I said, how does it help us.
Wow, so many fake female accounts in here, it seems some long haired incel sissy has been very busy 😂😂😂
Oh? Prove it.
LOL, dude, you know it already, I don't need to prove to you, cause you're one of them :D
You have only three followers, and you're following only 10 people, if we disregard the admins, almost all the others (both male and female) are duplicate accounts of one and the same male chauvinist, a bitter and pitiful incel, who is using proxies, or VPN, or a software for hiding IP, in order to prevent them from discovering your little secret... but unfortunately for you, that trick doesn't work on me, I can see right through you ;)
PS - I also know about the others, you have a full grid of them, including at least one of the mods, male, 36 years old, sounds familiar? 😈 I can go on you know 😁
Yup, dude, you have no life ;)
Meh, whatever you want to think. I'm no chauvinist.
You can go on, but I doubt that any of it will mean anything because I'm not an alt.
In fact, this is most likely a tactic to wind me up. Nice try, how about you answer the question?
Also, those longwinded posts with all those passive-aggressive emojis make it look like you are quite mad. Relax, watch some relaxing videos, then come back and answer my question if you want to.
Ah you're no chauvinist, really? Wow, I'm stunned :D
Sure you aren't, oh, does that mean you're the original and all the others are your alts? Good to know ;)
Tactic to wind you up, interesting, I never thought of that... I guess it's cause of your experience, after all, you're 103 years old 😂
Aha, passive-aggressive emojis, I heard that one before, but from some of your alts :P
No problem, here are some of the answers:
www.dailyedge.ie/.../
Note that those accomplishments are deeds of actual feminism, not feminazis (every sane person knows the difference).
That article is legit pandering and guesses.
Hate to break it to you, women have been in the workforce for literally AGES.
And, one more thing before I leave, how can you prove I have alts?
The article is legit, most men agree (except incels, mgtow, religious fanatics and their duplicate accounts) ;)
I know that women have been in the workforce for ages, I never said they weren't.
You're hiding it pretty well, but it took you awhile to answer this, which means you were busy with your other profiles :D
I was doing something called living and sleeping. Goodbye.
Seriously? You sleep very long, like Summer hibernation... okey dokey, if you say so dude... Goodbye :)
It only helps far left cowardly liberal beta males nobody else
loving the downvotes but see telling the truth gets you downvotes
Feminism shows us the true toxicity of twats and allows an intelligent man to proceed accordingly during any interactions with them.
feminists need to forget the discrimination a few hundred years ago and remember if you are failing in life its your own fault not societies
Anyone giving actual reasons to why it does help men is a fucking idiot lmao
Feminism actually doesn't help either gender lol
Well modern girls now will deppthroat and do anal thanks to feminism!
This dude.