Are you surprised, that our current generation rejects marriage and kids?

[Anonymous]

yes

no

not really

other

[AMS700CX4u2]

Many reasons are possible. I think after WWII women began to feel their economic strength. After all Rosie the Riveter, is the one that the Germans contribute the Allies victory to. We had an endless supply of war materials. When the war was over many females continued to work to give their families greater economic advantage. This represents a huge shift priorities. WE demonstrated for our children an attitude that suggested that they (Children) were a burden. By the 1980's the me generation had appeared. Divorce rates started to skyrocket. Children started playing their parents against one another to get the things they wanted. The culture changed from a people oriented population to a material oriented population. Children got to watch the constant struggle between parents and wanted no part of a relationship similar to their parents. Nobody wanted kids, everybody wanted sex and the safest way to accomplish that was through same sex relationships. So is all of this a consequence of war. How many wars did we participate in just to keep our country out of a depression? At some point things became more important than people. This is having political impact as well. Affluent people do not have large families. Smaller families allows more available cash for things and education. But Cash does not vote. People do. Consider the family who migrates from a nation where large families are the norm. Once they become citizens their families remain large and the tendency to have large families continues for a few generations. People vote. It is a mess and the sequelae are significant.

[Asker]

Huh. Tell that to the mafia governments of Italy, Russia and any other country ending with "stan". There it is oligarchy, not democracy.

[Haha456]

you're such an idiot living in the clouds. Do you realize women stay married in the 1940s and hundreds od years prior because they couldnt leave their shitty husbands? They didn't have the means to survive on their own due to lack of education. Its not until the 1980s where it was more common for women to hold jobs, when rates of divorce started to increase.

You keep talking about how good it is to having large families. Do you realize the cost of raising children has increased drastically over the past few decades. Buying an ice cream for 3 kids increased from 15 cents to 18- 21 dollars. Cost of college tuition in 2022 almost doubled from what it was in 2000. We can't afford huge families any more.

[Calenderagressive]

@Haha456 amen

[AMS700CX4u2]

@Haha456 I was not offering any justification for the way things were. A question was asked and by my observation these are some of the factors that explain why. Sorry to have upset you

[Haha456]

@AMS700CX4u2

I don't know what makes you think I'm upset. I'm just teaching you something that you have no clue about.

[ManOnFire]

Not surprised. The cost of living is higher than it was 40 years ago. I was even alarmed to hear a study on the radio one day saying that the majority of people in their 20s and 30s these days are working 2 jobs or renting a room in someone else's house because they can't afford their own place. I respect the older generation and their wisdom, but they truly do not understand how it is for younger people trying to make it in today's world. When they were growing up through the economic boom after WWII, they didn't have to worry about credit score, having more than one job, or trying to have your own place.

American gov, which claims we are the wealthiest nation, should be ashamed that one job is not enough to help people survive and that anyone should have to rent a room because the rate of rent for a 1 bedroom is too high.

I don't reject marriage, but I'm not exactly open to having kids like I once was. Not because I don't like them but because the world we're living in isn't a place I'd want to raise kids, and it's getting worse.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

I saw the other day a man's hair cut in the 60's was 40 cents.

Here in Miami is now $25 for a standard hair cut and another $5 if you want to cut your facial hair.

My barber started cutting my hair for $15, then she told me $20 and last month she told me is $25 now. 🙄

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

And you are easily looking at $1,000 a month for a rat and roaches infested disgusting and ugly apartment here in Miami not to mention the criminals that shoot their gun in the air in the buildings at 1AM... trust I know from experience since I lived in one.

[Asker]

@Hispanic-Cool-Guy wasn't Miami supposed to be a beach Paradise like in the Scarface movie? Or is it Pretty much only possible to live like in Paradise in Miami if one belongs to a drug dealing cartel?

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

Hollywood movies and reality are two totally different things.

[Asker]

@Hispanic-Cool-Guy i know that but still. My point was whether Miami was or is supposed to be a beach paradise. In the sense whether i should consider taking vacation there.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

Yes. Come visit us.

[ManOnFire]

@Hispanic-Cool-Guy Florida is generally a cheaper state than others, but the fact that a haircut has gone up indicates rates are definitely rising. Most of our apartments up north are already over $1,000.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@ManOnFire: Miami isn't cheap as the rest of the state. I just got a new hair cut, now the rate is $30.

The owner increased the rate yet again. 😛

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

Meant. 🙄🙄

[ManOnFire]

@Hispanic-Cool-Guy I get that. But even Miami is still cheaper than our cities up here. Not even sure your barber even needed to raise her rates like that.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

She's not the owner of the shop.

[Haha456]

@Hispanic-Cool-Guy

I live in NYC. 25 dollars for a quality hair cut is considered cheap. here over where I live is at least 30 bucks minimum plus tip. Average price is probably 55 to 75 bucks

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@Haha456: That's insane. I used to tip but with the prices as they are forget about it. 😏

[Haha456]

@Hispanic-Cool-Guy

houses here in nyc are the biggest rip off ever. Average price is a a little over a million dollars for one of the ugliest, shabbiest , smallest houses you would probably ever see in your life. The lowest price here is 800k but usually there's something really wrong with the house or area if it were to cost that cheap.

Its only a matter of time before i move out and buy a rental property in arizona, florida, texas, or nevada.

[Haha456]

@Hispanic-Cool-Guy

young people have been fleeing this place by the masses. 70% of the kids that I grew up with are no longer living here. It just goes to tell you what is so seriously wrong with our city

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@Haha456 yeah I know about the housing. I seen it online. A 1 million dollar house looks like it's in the hood. Lol.. crazy.

[Haha456]

1. Over the past few decades, its been proven that our generation of people cannot stay married. why get married when we can't stay married?

2. Nowadays women are more educated than ever before. 50 years ago women had to stay married to shitty husband because they had no chance for education therefore, lacked the means to survive on their own. Modern women who make good salaries do not need men to survive.

3. Kids are unaffordable. Cost of living has increased drastically while wages have stayed the same over the past few decades. This means having a family is becoming increasingly expensive. Not many people want to condemn themselves to a broke life just to raise a few kids.

[Asker]

All good points!

[KrakenAttackin]

@haha456 Yup, it's sooooooo expensive, especially when you order door-dash six+ times a week, have to always have the latest iPhone/iPad, insist on a newer or leased car, have to have that swanky condo, and on, and on.

People who want to have families have to understand how to economize (i. e. try cooking at home!) buy a home you can actually afford and start building equity, even if it means a longer commute, economize in shopping and overall living. How TF do you think your grandparents had families?

[monorprise]

1: In the past few decades more and more people's understanding and definition of 'marriage' has changed from a permanent bond for the security of family to a mere friendship of mutual conveniences. Why would you expect it to be any more enduring?

After all if "love" is defined as a infatuation (a feeling) and also the "propose of marriage", then such "Marriage" can never be more meaningful or binding than a friendship which is likewise based upon such mutually feelings and advantage.

Unfortunately children if they were lucky enough to even be born have faced the consequences of a lack of said security and support that comes form the effective abolition of Marriage as an institution.

2: Said abuse was as rare then as it is today, that said the more richly raise or better educated a woman the fewer men she will admire and thus the harder it will be for her to find and maintain a happy marriage. Such is why female education and childhood living standards has for hundreds of years been the main driver of sub-replacement level birthrates. Even Adam Smith in the Wealth of Nations written in 1776 noticed this family behavior among the then starting brutish middle class and wealthy.

[Ironic_Method]

@KrakenAttackin the relative cost of living and food was far cheaper 70 years ago. It only took one 40 hour/week job to support a family with 2 kids. The cost of EVERYTHING has risen much higher than wages, it's not this weird "eating out every night and needing to spend frivolously" like you imagine.

[Haha456]

@KrakenAttackin

because even if you stopped leasing cars, stop shopping, stop eating out, you still wouldn't have enough money to sufficiently support children. Supporting kids is more than just about feeding and clothing them. Its also about providing them a decent education and buying them laptops, phones.

50 years ago, kids weren't expensive. Any dumbass who failed in school back then could afford a nice home and a car. However , if the same dumbass existed nowadays, he would be struggling to make a living, unable to support children, living off of welfare. It would take him several lifetimes of savings to afford a house. Cost of college has risen drastically since the year 2000. We have over a trillion dollars in student loans.

Doordash deliveries has increased due to the rise in young millennial working professionals. Professionals usually eat dinner at their desks working overtime. Deliveries make dinner possible for these people. Or professionals also tend to carry their work home with them , which is something that has never happened in the old days. They don't have time to cook like people did before.

Over the past 20 years, nobody wants to go into the trades any more. Its seem as hard laborious work for the uneducated, dummies who failed in school (which is true to a certain large extent). Young adults want to be CEOs and superstars, not plumbers cleaning out poop out of a clogged pipe.

[Haha456]

@KrakenAttackin

if you take a look around, over 90% of trade workers are over the age of 50.

[Haha456]

@monorprise

actually, most modern men prefer a woman who is educated and has a decent job. Cost of living is high nowadays; most men aren't looking for another liability as a wife. They're looking for someone who can make his life easier, not harder supporting a family.

[KrakenAttackin]

@haha456 A wife is always a liability, the question is how much and is she worth it.

[Haha456]

@KrakenAttackin

you can either pick a useful wife or a useless wife. your life, your choice.

[Alcoholic_Wannabe]

@KrakenAttackin
Your strawmen are out of fucking control. Even people who live frugally are struggling.

[Haha456]

@KrakenAttackin

100,000 dollars used to be a lot of money back then. Now it is borderline poor.

[19magic]

I don't know about the US but in the last three months pretty much all food has increased in price by about 20% to 150%. You need two incomes to support a family. Uniforms are expensive too, for my sister to go to high school £200 was spent on uniform and PE kit, let alone clubs, food travel, trips etc that kids all want to do.

[Alcoholic_Wannabe]

@19magic
Must be nice to only need two incomes.

Anyway...

[Screenwriter]

You don't have to get married. You can have a domestic partnership. Commit to each other and make legal arrangements for your distribution of property and to take care of children.

However, more education, unless it's in a field that pays very well like medicine or IT, does NOT mean a good salary. Though more women are entering medicine and some areas of STEM, they are still a minority in those areas.

There are more college degreed women than there were 40 years ago, as there are more college educated people 16.2% vs. 37%, . However, it takes more education to navigate an increasingly technological world. And a bachelor's degree is only slightly better than a high school diploma.

Specialized degrees such as law degrees, engineering degrees or architectural degrees or medical degrees guarantee much higher salaries than bachelors in zoology, biology, English, history or political science.

[Screenwriter]

The cost of living hadn't increased significantly in the past 40 years until this year when the Ukraine war began and gas and food prices zoomed in conjunction with the pandemic issue. So the cost of having children wasn't affected either.

Though salaries haven't recently kept up with inflation, if you want children, you have to have a vision with a partner about the present and the future. Sure, there are people who don't plan a family, but it IS done and it can be done with relatively good results.

It's according to what you want and how you see yourself. At 24, I couldn't see myself as being a parent. At 35, I did and four years later I was. You sacrifice somewhat to help your children. If you aren't able to do this ever, sure, you shouldn't be a parent.

My reason: My parents did a fine job and were very good parents. They werent perfect, but I think very good is about the best most people can be at parenting. There are many pitfalls. But they financed it and our college educations and saved money so that they left us nest eggs.

Parenting isn't a condemnation to being broke. Spending and saving poorly is the only way you condemn yourself to that. Not having a good-enough education to get and keep a good job is another way you condemn yourself to being broke. You can't blame that on children. If you want them you have to plan for them and for the general expenses that come with them.

I bought savings bonds. Others invest in CDs, savings accounts, money markets, the stock market, 401ks and education savings accounts.

There are many ways to be prepared. Diving into it isn't the way to do it. And you have to be two people with a vision of having a "family life." Taking your kids on family vacations, to see grandparents and relatives, to see as much of the world as you can afford to show them.

It's doable.

[Haha456]

@Screenwriter

You might only notice the sharp price increase in goods right now but Inflation has always existed. The cost of a college education doubled over the past 30 years. Our wages have been almost the same over 30 years. Taxes have also been higher than ever before causing a max exodus of young professionals fleeing new york and california (historically a bustling home to the smartest, most productive, innovative companies). Its a clear indication life is no longer the same as decades ago.

Life getting more expensive also means people going back to graduate school to further their education. This also explains why modern young folks are all about making money instead of having a family. The more expensive the cost of living, the more money you will need to make to maintain a good lifestyle.

And trust me on this, as a young millenial myself, I don't deserve to be broke, struggling to support children if I had spent my entire life breaking my ass in school trying to get amazing grades so that I can get into a great college, then continuing to work myself to death in college so that I can ensure that I get a good job after college. Then realizing how hard the world is so that I have to return to school again so that I can enjoy a better life.

This is a lifetime's worth of hard work. I don't deserve to go back being broke again , just by having 3 kids and a stay home spouse to support.

[Screenwriter]

You don't have to have three kids. Why would even entertain that many? One or two is plenty. I went back to school too, but I only have one child. And I'm still working part time. I expect to keep working until I can't work anymore.

Sure life is more expensive, but this has always been true. I'm talking about significant change according to the Consumer Price Index. They've been discussing this for the past few months on NPR.

And it also is according to what you mean as having a comfortable life, too. My parents raised us rather simply. We had a nice home, but few of the fancier creature comforts of today. I have central air. My parents had a few window units. My walls and ceiling ar insulated and I have a standing seam roof. My parents had a composite slate roof and no wall insulation. I have a digital thermostat. My dad had a mechanical one. I have a new laptop. My dad had no computer. Of course some of this is generational. Tastes and desires change along with the culture.

I want to get solar panels and a battery storage so I can go off grid when power goes out. But this is in the offing. Expense. So, I live more simply for THIS age. I'm not subscribed to music libraries so I have all my music on my phone. I'd like to, but again, it's an expense I'm not willing to pay.

It's the choices you make that eliminate you from doing or achieving some goals.

If you want something badly enough, you'll make the sacrifice. Not one that bankrupts you, but requires you to live more frugally.

[RiseofArtemis]

You thinking women can survive on their own today is somehow funny. Women will always depend on men and once the economy is dead which it will be soon. Women will be running after men to save them. Don't be blinded by your freedom, you should use what you have now to make your natural job easier. Money is just a tool, not a way to free yourself of men.

Modern day economy is manipulated and it's probably the cause of the globalization which caused this to happen in the first place.

[Haha456]

@Screenwriter

our current generation is quite different from yours. the millenial and gen z generation hold a very different mindset along with a completely different set of goals compared to the older generation. My generation worked harder than your generation to make it in life. It is significantly more difficult to make a comfortable life today than 35 years ago. So as a result, many of us had to work extremely hard since a young age in order to ensure a comfortable life when we grow up. By the time we graduate from college, cost of living / taxes has risen again. Things are less pleasant than we expected. So we return back to school, or if we don't go back to school, we hold side bustles or side businesses. This explains why so many young professionals are workaholics or order delivery so much. We simply do not have as much leisure as we once did back during the old days. We don't have time to cook. Eating at the desk is the new norm. Or eating in front of our laptops after carrying our work home. This type of stuff was almost unheard of 30 years ago.

When you have a generation who has worked so hard for what they have, they're not likely to want to return to the old , poor, broke life. The more time, effort, dedication that you sacrifice, the more fruits of your labor that you expect.

Our current generation cares more about ambition, education, success, living a fulfilling life rather than to spend time with family. And its due to the fact that people need to work harder than ever to be able to make it in life. So the concept of hard work is drilled into this generation since a very young age. "The sky is the limit" type mentality.

[Screenwriter]

@RiseofArtemis No one has ever said women are trying to free themselves of men. Women certainly can financially support themselves. I do, as I have for most of my adult life, whether married or single. However, there are women who CANNOT support themselves for one reason or another: young children, no job, a job that's not lucrative. My mother and father made the same salary though he had a high school education and she had a masters' degree. But what mattered was they pooled their resources and supported their family.

[Haha456]

@Screenwriter

my generation focuses on early retirement, amassing wealth, living life to the fullest, doing the things we love, seeing "The sky is the limit". Rather than simply popping out a few kids and calling it "The End".

[Haha456]

@Screenwriter

very few women with masters degrees stay home. Typically stay home moms are uneducated women with no career prospects. Because reality is, if she had great money making potential, she wouldn't be staying home. These women stay home because they know they won't make any money if they worked as a maid or a cashier anyways.

[RiseofArtemis]

@haha456 What are you gonna do if the economy dies and there is no one to help you. Children are humans natural retirement plan. What todays generation does is self destructive and only helps the giant corporations to become even more powerful. You will come to a point where you will realize your mistake and dread the consequences. Nature doesn't take it easy with those who don't follow its laws.

[TenderFantasy]

Not if you're a Mexican. And before I get mobbed with pitchforks, I am just telling the truth! Where I live I see all kinds of MEXICANS either pregnant in their late teens or early twenties and giving birth to 5/6 kids!

Also, I am of minority race so once again, I am NOT being racist! Hardly do I see Asians doing the same (living 2 to 3 families in one house or having multiple generatiions, maybe SEVERAL under one roof) and then working low wage jobs (a lot of them), but little Pancho and Maria (20 and 18) just found out they are PREGNANT! While working at Taco Bell and just graduated High School!

[Haha456]

@RiseofArtemis

if you think kids are retirement plans think again. Kids can leave the state because they found employment opportunities else where. 70% of the kids that I grew up with in my school is gone after finding employment in other states. It begins as early as 18 when they leave for college. This is when they discover a whole world of opportunity away from home.

Best retirement plan is to amass as much money as possible when you are young, so you don't have to work until old age.

[Haha456]

@TenderFantasy

I'm Asian. The Asian you are speaking of are the FOB straight from china types. Not Asian americans. Typically Asians come to america being poor immigrants. But they usually end up making a lot money due to hard work and ambition. Asian americans actually make the most money out of working whites, hispanics, and blacks. Asians also dominate the ivy league colleges / medical schools too. We get picked on for being nerdy in school but its the nerd that gets the last laugh

[Screenwriter]

Electrical work has nothing to do with plumbing, which my son tried. He's settled on electrical. If you watch This Old House, there are loads of programs getting youngsters, and I mean kids out of high school into trades. It's not for dummies. You miswire something and burn down a house and you're liable: which is why these folks have insurance and you should hire master plumbers or someone who gets their work checked by a master electrician/plumber/HVAC person. CEOs have plenty of headaches. Nice thing about the trades: people are glad to see you, happy when you fix what's wrong, glad to pay you for the work and you take nothing home with you. And you are paid a significant amount of money.

[KrakenAttackin]

Blaming previous generations for your failings is not a winning strategy.

[Haha456]

@Screenwriter

You're living in the clouds. 90% of trade workers are old guys in their late 40s to 60s. There a lot concern about not enough of a pipeline of young people taking trade jobs after these baby boomers retire. Traditionally, its kids who can't do well in school, do not have the brains to take on college , who join the trades. Jobs such as construction, painting, plumbing, carpentry, elevator mechanics are for the not so bright. These jobs do not require much academic intelligence or high test scores, but it does require a certain level of tactile skill and social skills.

Even millionaire businessman kevin o leary said "if your son isn't very good at school but yet has great people skills, the trades will be a very good option for him".

Trade jobs are harsh, difficult, physical labor which is uncomfortable, or even straight up dangerous. Nobody grows up to say they want to clean poop out of a clogged pipe all day. Everyone wants to sit in a comfy chair with air conditioner, white collar job, CEO executive gets all the prestige.
I'm not saying trade work can't be lucrative but its usually a second back up option for kids who aren't successful in academics.

[Screenwriter]

My parents retired early on teacher and post office salaries and having two children was never the end of their lives or their interests. They traveled after we left for college, sometimes visiting us in far flung places where we lived while young adults, somtimes going where they liked. They lived life to the fullest too and I'm doing my best to do the same, though, as things ARE more expensive, my having a job remains important, even at my age. In fact, I have two part-time jobs. I went back to school to get a master's degree when my kid entered high school.

And I don't know anyone of ANY age who doesn't want to "live life to the fullest." Are you so naive as to think ANY generation doesn't desire this or that you're the first to struggle with the idea of raising children or the costs?

My son wore and STILL wears second-hand clothing I buy at Goodwill and other thrift stores. Since he was a toddler. I do too. I've NEVER owned a new car. Never want to. My 2006 Honda stick Civic works fine. And because it has no bells and whistles, it is low-maintenance. As is my 1922 house that needs new painting, but little else.

There are ways to be frugal AND comfortable. It is according to what you want and want to accomplish.

And it's true, there are some people struggling with two or three jobs for each parent.

[Haha456]

@Screenwriter

You can make a lot of money in trades because there simply aren't enough tradesmen out there. When demand is high but supply of workers is low, you can charge anything you want.
But keep in mind, it is back breaking work and many of these guys can't work until old age.
By the time guys are in their early 50s, they're very much struggling to continue their work.

[Haha456]

@Screenwriter

Electrical work requires a lot of attention to detail, which is something that not everyone has, but you really do not need immense brains to become one. There are so many other fields that require much more brains than that.

[Haha456]

@Screenwriter

[And I don't know anyone of ANY age who doesn't want to "live life to the fullest." Are you so naive as to think ANY generation doesn't desire this or that you're the first to struggle with the idea of raising children or the costs?]

What I mean to say was : millenials / gen z have opportunities that your generation never got to enjoy. Did you have the opportunity to invest 100 a month for 25 years so you can retire a millionaire? no you didn't. There was no robinhood or TD ameritrade widely open to retail investors. If you had this opportunity, you would be able to own a car, travel anywhere you want, be able to buy your son some nice clothes instead of clothes he doesn't care for. you wouldn't have to work beyond the age of 50 if you had the same opportunities millenials / gen z are enjoying today.

Your generation is not focused on investing to building personal wealth but rather working and saving for retirement until the age of 65. You work to make corporations richer, gen z work to make themselves richer.

[Haha456]

@Screenwriter

[My son wore and STILL wears second-hand clothing I buy at Goodwill and other thrift stores. Since he was a toddler. I do too. I've NEVER owned a new car. Never want to. My 2006 Honda stick Civic works fine. And because it has no bells and whistles, it is low-maintenance. As is my 1922 house that needs new painting, but little else.

There are ways to be frugal AND comfortable. It is according to what you want and want to accomplish.]

do you realize how difficult it is to get anywhere without a car? do you realize how annoying and difficult public Transporation is? When I was a kid, my parents walked 10 miles in the snow to bring me to school on a daily basis because we couldn't afford buy a bus ticket for each and every one of us. My parents never got to eat at restaurants their entire lives because it was too expensive. My father has never ever went shopping for clothes his entire life because he wanted to save money. My mother used to sew and patch back up rips and holes in his pants and under. You don't think that it would make me happy to see my own father receive something nice for his birthday?

who the hell goes around saying they want to give their kids secondhand clothes instead of clothes they actually want to wear? we all want to give our loved ones the best.

I'm buy a car next year and I would be able to travel anywhere I want. See anything I want. Never have to stand in the cold freezing waiting for the bus. Never have to wake up half an hour early to wait for the bus. My commute to work would be significantly shorter. And I would have no regrets about being able to afford a car.

[Screenwriter]

And you're incorrect again, because my son has done HVAC, plumbing and electrical work and is 27 years old. HVAC is dirty, as is plumbing. But his main concern was that plumbing used some chemicals to seal pipes that are toxic. He also didn't like being dirty all day. HVAC, with its crawling in attics is uncomfortable. It can be physical work, but it doesn't require excessive strength. It requires dogged determination. Every day is not a day cleaning out feces. In fact, few are. Most of it is drains clogged with hair or a child's toy or something else. And since plumbers now have cameras they can deploy into pipes to find and see the clogs, their lives are much easier.

HVAC means a lot of crawling around in attics among insulation, so you need coveralls to prevent getting particles onto your skin and the work is hot and dirty in summer. Again, no excessive carrying or strength involved. Anyone, male or female can do it.

I

[Screenwriter]

My son only wears clothing he WANTS to wear. If he doesn't LIKE my offerings, he doesn't take them. He shops secondhand too! As I do. I usually find Brooks Brothers UNWORN shirts at thrift shops for $5 to $10. Shirts that usually cost $40 to $70 from Brooks. This is called economizing.

And TD Ameritrade existed when I was young too. As did ALL KINDS of investment opportunities. If my son didn't want to wear the occasional things I've found for him, he would refuse them and in most cases I could return them or wear them myself. Luckily, we have similar tastes and he keeps EVERYTHING I offer.

Anyone can save $100 a month to invest or make an emergency fund THEN invest. I also did this when I was first working after college. But emergencies, divorce, severe illness and the like came along and those savings were eroded.

I'm sure you can become a millionaire if you have an undisturbed, perfect life. If that's your goal, fine. But anyone can have a family and survive well if THAT is their goal. You do not have to go bankrupt because of one or two children. They do not need expensive toys or clothes. Kids get used to what you're able to give them. WHen my son wants something brand new, he goes out and gets it. But he drives an old van and is saving for a better vehicle. It gets him there while he's working toward something else. He invests in bitcoin and other investments. We have discussions about the newer investments. You have to keep abreast.

[Screenwriter]

He's interested in writing music, not in being a CEO. There are many others his age who have similar goals. I don't know if or when he'll have a kid or two. I hope he has one. It would be nice to see his good genes carried on and he has good family to support him: lots of cousins.

If you have none of these things, and didn't have a good family life yourself, I can see how you wouldn't want to share your life with a new generation.

Every generation has its difficulties to face. But life is a great thing. I'm glad I've had a son. He's having a good life. He's shared that with me, friends and family. His old van and formerly worn and new clothes are good enough, just as my old car and formerly worn clothes are good enough.

WHen my savings top our, I'll be looking at investments again myself and the two of us will probably debate where our money is going. Maybe I'll try bitcoin.

But the point is not to be sour on life. It is a fabulous gift worth sharing with a family. But if you don't, that, again, is your choice. But all millennials and gen z s don't want CEO lives. I personally didn't want a family until my late 30s, but am glad I had my son. HE's been a gift too.

Good luck to you.

[Haha456]

@Screenwriter

Retail trading was not popular back then during the 1980s and 1990s. The only way for a retail trader to trade back then was through working at the new york stock exchange, which 95% of the people weren't on. I personally know of an old trader in his 50s who told me that back then there was practically nobody trading unless they were super wealthy or a wall street expert. Today everyone is trading. Even 16 yr old kids are trading.

Right now, I am in the process of saving up to buy a home to rent out to others. This is called passive income. Gen z and millennials are trying to convert most of their income from "earned income through a job" to "passive income- where they get to sit around, and money still lines their pockets". This is the first generation to do this type of stuff.

We have opportunities that you never had. Your son has opportunities you never had.

I'm not trying to brag. I'm not that pompous or arrogant. but I'm trying to educate you that your generation is not the same as this generation.

[Screenwriter]

I am making passive income through my rental unit. I did this 26 years ago. Doing this is nothing new. It's been going on for hundreds of years. BUy a property with several units that pay for your mortgage or pay you extra money so you work less or can invest more. An old guy in his 50s! In the 80s and 90s Fidelity, Vanguard, Charles Schwab and a dozen more major firms managed diverse portfolios for young investors that consisted of stocks, bonds, mutuals, CDs, 401ks and more.

I was alive then and investing in Fidelity. So, please don't say your generation is doing something new. You're doing something that even MY parents, born in the 1920s were doing in the 1950s.

People who educated themselves about investments made these choices. My parents did, I've done it and my son is doing it. It's nothing new. It's just not something everybody does. You do need to save to do this and have that emergency fund. You can do this with and without children. Make it a goal and it can be done. Has nothing to do with what generation you are or were.

Good luck with your narrow-mindedness, though.

[Haha456]

@Screenwriter

I"m sorry, ma'am. If you have been investing through fidelity and renting units out your entire life and you're still buying your son clothes at a thrift shop, it means you've made some serious mistakes in life. Or you could very well be lying.

Rental units, investing in through financial institutions have always existed but there's also ecommerce, affiliate marketing, creating social media content, streaming video games on youtube, side hustle designing yoga mats, cups for amazon who does all the work to mass produce products with your old designs. Many of these people who do these things work full time jobs

none of these things existed in your generation.

[Screenwriter]

No one is saying there are not NEW things to do and invest in for work and financial gain, and of course, people side hustle. That also has always been done.

Just because I no longer have those earlier investments doesn't mean I did something wrong. Sometimes people become ill. Then they have to deplete those investments and savings.

I don't care if I were a millionaire. I LIKE finding great bargains at thrift stores. It's fun. Estate sales are fun too. Why pay more when you don't have to? A new car loses 20% of its value in your first year of owning it. A used car that's 5 years old and has low mileage is a better buy.

I live in an old house that has good bones and whose value is solid. I drive an old car that gets good gas mileage. It has no bells and whistles, but works well and gets me where I need to go. $2800 was the price. It's valued at more than that.

I'm OK with my life and don't need spanking new anything. If that's what you want, you do you. I think you'll waste a lot of money, though.

[Haha456]

@Screenwriter

there's nothing wrong with admitting that side hustles / passive income wasn't popular in your generation. You just look like a fool by denying it. Anyone with exposure to the internet and social media today knows that passive income is currently popping more than ever before. Side hustles or passive income wasn't widely celebrated in your generation. There are significantly more ways to make passive income today than 30 years ago.

I honestly doubt you invested in fidelity nor do you own a rental unit. Do you really expect me to believe that someone so savvy of a financial planner throughout life would end up having to go to the discount store to buy some second hand clothes for her son?

The story just doesn't add up.

[Haha456]

@Screenwriter

The biggest benefits to passive income is not about driving that luxury brand new sports car or buying luxury clothing.

Having a lot passive income allows me to be able to control what I do in my life. If I made 2000 dollars a week, I wouldn't have to work 40 hours a week faced in front of my moody boss all day. I can work 16 hours a week so I can spend more time with my children. It would also allow me more time to go on vacations. I wouldn't have to spend my life at the office.

[TenderFantasy]

No, my generation (Generation Y aka Millennials), A LOT of them have married and even had children. Some out of wedlock too. Blame hormones for that haha. Anway, I think it's about maybe half and half? From what I know (I am an older Millennial born in '84 so I also experienced a lot of Gen X stuff too), maybe like 45 to 50% are parents (married or not), and the other half are like Single and Childfree or 'Single and Ready to Mingle', not to mention a Workaholic, Travel Buff, Alcohol Buff, History Buff, Movie Buff, Video Game Buff, Social Media Buff, you name it, etc. etc. Lol.

[OlderAndWiser]

So no young people are getting married or having kids? That's quite a surprise to me.

[TonightYouu]

Yep it’s so bad in Japan parents are doing like animal planet and just putting the boy in a room with the girl and hoping nature will take its course

The yakuza gang culture in Japan is dying because they can’t recruit any young members

They interviewed 20 something year old Japanese men and they all said they’d rather collect manga and play video games than date

Its normal when the girls don’t want to but if guys don’t want to that’s a big problem

[Asker]

@TonightYouu i think they are mad because they're not getting that money from us. They know children make us bound to be a money factory with no way out.

[TonightYouu]

I didn’t even think about that

[OlderAndWiser]

@TonightYouu glad this isn’t Japan

[Asker]

@TonightYouu Yeah, you're welcome.

[TonightYouu]

Well I brought that up because someone said they’re glad this is only happening in the west but give it a few years that where a lot of the world will be

So many people are going to die alone

[Apple1996]

There's a lot of gen z that are getting married young and having kids. I'm starting to believe that this is purely a millennial thing to not want marriage/kids

[OlderAndWiser]

@Apple1996 yeah, I don’t really see this as a significant trend. It gets talked about way too much so people thinks it’s more prevalent than it actually is

[monorprise]

That they can't afford what they are told are the prerequisites to a family is not surprising. Our Governments have after all:
1: The Federal Government debased the currency on a large scale due to overspending resulting in large amounts of inflation since they ran out of gold in 1971.

2: The Federal Government further undermined the value of unskilled labor via the introduction of an enormous amount of equally unskilled competition both thou large scale immigration and free trade deals with largely unskilled countries. Both of which substantially reduced the competitively value and thus income of almost everyone starting their careers.

3: Many if not most local and State Governments via too limited zoning, permitting, and costly regulations have dramatically reduced the supply of housing in many if not most key markets both reducing mobility and effective disposable income dramatically. Some states Like California have gone to such extremes that working people must live on the streets.

It is extremely costly to work in the USA today far more costly than it was 50-80 years ago.
That makes i financially unrealistic for many and very difficult for anyone who have what we are told are the prerequisites to a family in the form of stable food and shelter.

That people would respond to this by abandoning the most basic and essential of life processes rather than lower their standards really is surprising and reflect upon population of kids as disconnect from reality as we know most of their sources of information had been.

[19magic]

Tell me if this sounds like the federal gov:

So our gov used to have lots of houses for the lower income family's in the 70s/80s they had a bit of a shortage of money so they came up with the scheme of rent to buy, anyone who lived in a council house for 10 years can request the right to buy so seems like a win win, council gets quick income and individuals get their own house. Except that the council didn't reinvest the money into new builds or new plots. And the money started to run out again as they're not getting the regular rent income and they cost more than they can earn. This creates the housing crisis where 100s are now bidding on a single gov owned property.

Plus you have loads of investors owning houses as homes are the biggest money earners out there. And there's no rent caps or anything so even in a medium sized city a one bed is still anywhere from 500-600, a two bed is 700-1200. And you're not allowed to alter the place at all: no paint or wallpaper, no carpets, no shelves on walls, or picture frames and you're working so hard for something that's not your own and they're allowed to keep increasing the rent each year to price you out of living there.

Is that pretty similar to your area

[19magic]

Damn I just looked it up £-$ 1-1.14 I remember it being 1.8 only a decade or so ago

[monorprise]

@19magic We have 2+ independent Governments that play different roles with a different story in different places.

I know the Feds and probably a few city/states will buy and give away houses to poor people known as Section 8 for the Feds. The Federal Section 8 houses are known for being a disaster which few people want to live near due to soo many of the people they rent to being into crime or drugs.

Ironically they are not suppose to allow such druggies and criminals to live there but the administration being soo distant from the actual place and its leaders consistently elected for unrelated issues like war and peace, by distant majorities there is almost no concern for what actually happens.

It sounds like the United Kingdom does a better job with local governments involved, and allowing people to own said houses thus moving up the economic latter. Federal Section 8 oblige you to remain poor or earn money under the table, hence the crime.
Regardless this a form of dole (today incorrectly called "welfare") which is not connected to the housing issues in this country.

The housing issues in the USA are mostly a directly result of cities & states refusing to issue an acquitted numbers of permits for ANYONE to build and them along with the Fed's zoning & regulating what little is issues into far too high a price range. (effectively ignoring the starter home market)

This is mostly a local issue, as there are many areas in the country such as the south & mid-west where you can still find plenty of starter homes. The Federal and State regulations simply make it much more difficult to actually build a new starter home.

[AngelBritney]

I used to want a kid and being married.

That changed after I witnessed how having a child is. Not only the loudness, less sleep, dirt, tantrums, diaper changes but they also get sick faster and then you're sick, too.

I have enough problems with my health the last years (for a lifetime) and having a child now would be bad for me and the child, too.

Add the costs and that you have to give up your former life almost completely. If you're old there is no guarantee that they will visit you often or care about you.

Marriage on the other hand doesn't make any sense anymore. What changes in your relationship actively after the wedding? You get some more money (tax) when you work and maybe some more benefits. But the divorce rate has raised so much and I don't want to go through that drama.
A wedding doesn't avoid cheating or makes your partner a better partner.

So neither a baby or marriage are THE guarantee that your relationship will stay in a good state.

I really wanted that perfect, typical family life with marriage, house and a kid but reality came and the changes the last years made me realize I don't need a marriage or a child.

[Asker]

Wholeheartedly I welcome you to the club. We think very much alike about both matters. Except I wanted neither then and now still.
Was the transition painful to you?

[KrakenAttackin]

@AngelBritney. When you get a little older you will likely want a man as a retirement plan. He will probably want children. I hope you have the strength to resit both so you are not just another shitty wife and mother.

[Haha456]

If you're having a baby, just thinking about what you have to gain personally from it. Then you're not having a child for the right reasons. Being a parent is a very self sacrificial role where in you should be happy to put your childs needs above your own. If there was one slice of pizza left, you're hungry and you can't afford to order more. You will want to give that last piece for your child. Love is about giving. I would still take on the hard work of raising kids even if they won't stay with me until the day I die. Because kids just inspire so much joy in me

[Haha456]

@KrakenAttackin

Here goes your sexism again, woman hater

[Jay3344]

Apart from the psychological burden that is passed from parents who have unresolved issues to children - perpetuating an almost continues karmic like effect over generations, pressing issues like Global warming caused by humans, genocide that is almost fostered at the behest of the arms industries, environmental destruction across the globe, acidification of the ocean, increasing extreme and consistent destructive weather events, Overpopulation, extinction of animal species across the globe, hyper concentration of wealth in the hands of only a few people who hoard it, decline in economic opportunity and mobility, overstimulation of children with electronics, surveillance states, extreme nationalism and swings towards far right and far left politics, multiple health crises across the planet, plastic pollution and its effects in the human body, fresh water reduction from poor practices, monoculture focus destroying biodiversity, I mean the list goes on and on to the point where marriage and kids doesn’t look so appealing. Ah the Information Age!

[Apple1996]

Not surprised since so many people's parents have lied to them about relationships and having kids. I constantly hear parents telling their kids never get married it'll end in divorce, don't have kids they're expensive.

Reality is that you can make your marriage work if you put effort into it. And kids are only as expensive as you make them. They don't need fancy iPhones and expensive private schools. Live within your means and kids aren't expensive. Don't be a asshole in your relationship and it'll probably work out. These things aren't as difficult as people make them seem.

[TenderFantasy]

Wow you're very mature for your age Apple1996. How'd you do that lol.

[Apple1996]

@TenderFantasy having 4 kids has made me mature fast lol

[Fuentes]

Have you checked statistics on divorce? Who is the one who ask for a divorce? After looking at that it is way smarter for a person to not be married. Kids are very expensive especially in this high inflation.

[dolemite89]

so if i live within my means and my kid gets cancer, what then? or if i’m a good husband and my wife just randomly decides to leave and take half my shit and the kids what then? 🤔 and not everybody lives in the south where it’s dirt cheap by the way.

[Calenderagressive]

I still won't be able to afford kids I'm barely going by as it is

[Apple1996]

@Fuentes haha yeah I have seen that most women want the divorce usually cuz the husband stops putting in effort

[Apple1996]

@dolemite89 if your kid gets cancer then you'll most likely be able to get treated for free. Even adult cancer those bills get written off after a few years of not paying. My mom had over 1 mil from her cancer and it got written off from not paying for so long.
And you do realize I haven't always lived in the south... I'm just living here now cuz of my husband's job

[Apple1996]

@Calenderagressive I afforded kid while not even having a job

[Asker]

With the exception of iPhone These are how tired wagecucks making 800 dollars a month are made. You wouldn't date a guy making 800 bucks that couldn't afford university.

[Apple1996]

I don't think most people can afford college in general. Regardless of phones and their job but yes iphones/expensive phones are such a freaking waste. There's always a cheaper option.

[Asker]

Ok i just checked. It looks like McDonald's average full time pay is 1600 dollars after tax at around over 11 dollars per hour and hitting 23K annually.

[Apple1996]

Dang my husband only makes slightly more then that 😂 might as well be working McDonalds

[Fuentes]

@Apple1996 so if the stats are not in a man's favor in marriage, why would people get married? You just wouldn't waste your time & money. That's like telling someone to live in southside Chicago. Yeah theirs a high chance you may be murdered or violently robbed but you should do it anyway lol

[Asker]

OK, fair enough. I believe you. If it's not about the money then surely about something else.

[Apple1996]

@Fuentes because during a marriage all of the benefits are for the man. They only get fucked afterwards if it doesn't work out. For men it's worth the risk to get the benefits during the marriage.

[Asker]

What even are those benefits?

[Fuentes]

@Apple1996 lol the benefits of child support, alimony, giving up everything you worked hard for & built? Not being able to see your kids. Theirs no benefits for a man in marriage, especially in this new climate of high inflation lol if you divorced your man today you would take everything & he would barely see his kids. All courts rule in favor of a mother & that's a fact.

Also you should tell the @asker what your husband does for work lol so he fully understands because you left one important key peice of information out lol

[Apple1996]

Benefits are better health, more successful, lives longer, overall happier. Most women devote their married life to taking care of there husband's so everything I listed tends to fall into place for men cuz their wives make it that way. (Women tend to suffer cuz they neglect their own needs cuz of how much they are caring for their husband's)

If you wanted more in depth benefits there are lots of articles out there about it. Search up benefits for a man during a marriage.

[Apple1996]

@Fuentes my husband is in the army and at this point its turning into a real shit deal. They told us due to inflation that everyone should go get on food stamps

[Fuentes]

@Apple1996 but a lot of stuff is covered from BAH with dependants infact they recently raised it in some areas this year & your health insurance is decent for the children & you have a house roof over your head which is tax free. I would only see food stamps an an option as a newly enlisted folks who are new couples to E-1 to E -3, I'm sure your husband has been in the Army long enough now to make board as a NCO already. Which means more money if he is.

Not every man here talking about marriage in today's climate has alil extra benefits to help subside working a low wage job lol so to them yes it's about the money.

[Apple1996]

@Fuentes housing and Healthcare is a fucked over system especially in the army. All the houses on base full of lead and mold. Most move too often to buy a house off base.
The healthcare is a mess. Either pay to go off base or risk getting the shit care on base where they ignore just about everything and don't have legit doctors caring for the patients.
My husband does have some rank but still qualify for food stamps if we wanted too.
It's overall not a good job. My husband is more doing it cuz this is what he wants to do with his life. We definitely ain't here for the benefits..

And you may not think men get things out of marriage but it's proven thing. Like I'm not crazy for the idea of marriage legally but long term partner is the same thing If you don't wanna risk the legal marriage part.

[Fuentes]

That's what I'm saying in marriage with benefits you can use a off base living and he can go off and go there, while you still remain with benefits and pay cheaper rent in a cheaper area while making above min wage. You said you're in the south as right now therefore rent is cheaper then most areas & you're not trapped in any leases incase you need to move.

I'm telling you this isn't the same for the common man & the insurance is better then dudes and poor people living off medicaid that is a fact I said it was "decent" not the best. The argument people are making under this post was the regular average min wage worker can't afford marriage just like they can't afford insurance for the kids, y'all don't share the same benefits as you think therefore marriage works better in your favor as of now but you think cause yours is working everyone else's should work lol despite the stats infact our current military divorce rates are super high.

All I'm saying is their is facts behind this marriage defiance in today's climate that can be supported.

[Asker]

Nevermind, the money topic is not finished here. You'd cheat for 10 million dollars.
Would you CHEAT on your partner for 10 Million Dollars? ↗

[Apple1996]

@Fuentes here it is unfortunately too overpopulated to even find a off base rental that will fit our family. Looked for the first two years living here. At this point I'm just waiting to move. Hoping for better housing options at the next place.
And nah I had better insurance from the government when I was jobless. I'd honestly give anything to go back to having acutal decent doctors for my kids. Medicaid covers nice shit for real lol

And yeah military relationships tend to have lots of issues. People get divorced and remarried back to back like it's some sort of game

[Apple1996]

@Asker are you offering me that or what?

[Fuentes]

@Apple1996 I would like to know where medicaid profited you better lol I grew up dirt poor in WA and you know I grew up off that and the Dr's were all horrid and stupid. Even the eye Dr's were worse as a kid. Shit even in California people complain and theirs many news stories if Dr's just finesessing the system and charging unnecessary things cause it's free and not helping their patients at all lol it's super bad when I seen it.

[Asker]

better health - we can get that being unmarried and without putting the woman on constant strain to cook and clean. we can do that too and more and not have the woman do everything herself.

more successful - define successful?

lives longer - highly doubt that on those corporate drones, who clock in 10-12 hours in order to provide money. They pass out earlier and women generally outlive men.

overall happier - ditto above.

marriage seems to be a complicated downgrade of everything. more everything of the bad stuff and considering the high divorce rates i am convinced people are either into masochism or want to turn up the difficulty level of living life. Apparently life is not hard enough for them.

[Apple1996]

@Fuentes sounds like you just had a bad experience or maybe it was different back in the day. Like I gave birth at the best hospital in my area and had amazing peds for my son. They took great care of us and it was all covered.
My other births have not compared. I'm questioning just paying for a homebirth to avoid the hospital all together

[Apple1996]

@Asker I'm not the one saying any of those things are benefits. It's just the stats that are out there. You wanna fight about it talk to whoever did those studies. 😆 only thing I can confirm that they seem true in my own marriage. My husband is getting a lot more out of it then I am

[Fuentes]

@Apple1996 is your hometown small then that will make a lot of sense because ofc Dr's would do their job cause they'll take any money they can get but also u could be right our eras are very different and things could have changed but I don't know about that hahaha I got kaiser and here in California with kaiser I don't wait for anything at all and I can go to the Dr's at anytime and get what I need done & I have my daughter on my insurance too so she gets to go to good Dr's back at her home with her mom lol. I don't know about today but back then medicaid was never the business

[Asker]

I don't envy him one bit. I'm not gonna get cheated on :)

[Apple1996]

@Fuentes nah I grew up in the Cincinnati area. Not small at all for Ohio.
I know a lot of medical laws changed when Obama was in. Not just Obama care but all gov medical got better. I was pregnant with my oldest during that time so it was probably a lot worse before that

[Apple1996]

Well it's not like I'm a cheater. That question was obviously for fun

[Asker]

Imagine a divorce prank. On the other hand I think you won't be scared if it happens.

[Apple1996]

Not sure what a divorce prank is but okay. And nah if it did happen then I'd be ready to be a single mom for my kids.

[Fuentes]

Lol nah it sounds like Ohio just has better Healthcare only u would not live there tho hahaha I'm forever westcoast now I'm retiring out here haha

[Calenderagressive]

YOU GET PAID 11 DOLLARS PER HOUR?

[Apple1996]

@Calenderagressive I get paid 0 dollars a hour

[Jamie05rhs]

Actually, kids DO need private school. If you don't want them to turn into fuckups.

[Apple1996]

@Jamie05rhs nah in my opinion homeschooling is the best option. Literally every person I know that was homeschooled is pretty decently successful and overall a nice person.
Private school kids turn into assholes as adults. Always depressed and not having good lives.
Public school is a mix. Never know how those kids will end up

[Fuentes]

@Apple1996 homeschooling? Lol just look how most of these people on GaG act.

[Apple1996]

@Fuentes there are a few people I've met on here that were homeschooled.. they seem better off then most

[Fuentes]

Lol being virgins and socially celibate and only social online is the worse way to grow up haha. at least in private school they will not be socially awkward.

[Apple1996]

@Fuentes all the ones I know here are girls. They are in relationships so def not virgins. Now I'm about to do a poll cuz I feel like there's gotta be homeschooled guys that just don't talk about it

[Fuentes]

Most woman will not be virgins I'm talking about the men and boys lol women never have to worry about that.

[Jamie05rhs]

"there are a few people I've met on here that were homeschooled.. they seem better off then most"
@Apple1996 Thanks for the compliment. Lol

[Jamie05rhs]

"Lol being virgins and socially celibate and only social online is the worse way to grow up haha. at least in private school they will not be socially awkward."
@Fuentes I agree with you.

[Jamie05rhs]

@Apple1996 The girls get into relationships because men ask women and not the other way around.

[Apple1996]

@Jamie05rhs weird cuz I asked my husband out first. I wasn't home schooled tho just public and online school

[Jamie05rhs]

@Apple1996 You are not the average woman.

[Jamie05rhs]

(That's a good thing, by the way.)

[Apple1996]

@Jamie05rhs ah nah I feel like I'm super average but thanks lol😊

[Fuentes]

@Apple1996 you just don't realize you're a rare type of women who stays in a marriage even though divorce rate is super high and a women who will stay at home and take care of the kids and not complain they had hopes and dreams and the man stopped it all. So they need a divorce haha that's why you see it so different but Hella dudes are struggling I ain't but I see it lol

[Jamie05rhs]

@Fuentes You're 100% right. For example, the one who shall not be named divorced her husband because he tried to start a business and she got annoyed by that.

[Fuentes]

@Jamie05rhs yup it's super crazy it's like that.

[Jamie05rhs]

Yup. #deezhoesaintloyal

[Dazed0N0Confused]

I don't believe in marriage, not with the current rate of divorce & infidelity & so forth. It only helps with taxes, if you ask me.

Kids... Who has the money nowadays to raise kids? Me apparently 😅 just had my first a several months ago & if you're not ready to give up your freedoms & any extra cash, don't have kids. I didn't want kids, you can ask ANYONE who knows me about how I didn't want kids, but once I found out I was pregnant I had a talk with my SO & we agreed to bring the pregnancy to term. Now we have a very happy, spoiled & incredibly loved little boy & I couldn't be happier.

[lightbulb27]

no, our society is going down hill, public school turned to crap from already crap, we threw God out, Jesus got "chucked" for science, threw out discipline, threw out a bunch of stuff. Introduced science, the kardashians, junk tv, and a bunch of other junk media... what ya expect. and these kids have been screwed over by the govt inflating and stealing and society living beyond its means for a long time, meanwhile... the ship sinks and the rich get richer.

but to be fair, they didn't live through WWII... so maybe it wasn't so bad... relatively speaking.

I hope they can find their way...

[RiseofArtemis]

People should look into the fall of Rome and we will see a lot of similar things to now. The next thing to come will be the bachelor tax because men refuse to marry and be a womens pay pig for their college degree to pay them off. The reason why people don't or rather men avoid marriage is because the government gave too many negatives to the contract which could destroy the mans life.

Fix the problem and don't complain about the consequences which are just the natural way men do to avoid possible danger to their wellbeing. When something is so blatantly broken and unjust, we avoid it at all costs. The marriage laws and contract are an extremely biased contract which benefits the one breaking it mostly.

[Calenderagressive]

This is not how rome ended

[ODC2112]

Nobody ever wanted marriage and children, but before you were forced to have marriage under penalty of social stigma and the children came because there were no contraceptives and the marriage was stable. Now that there is no social stigma if you are not married and have sex with someone and can not have children with contraceptives or abortion, the truth comes out. Furthermore, marriage is a joke, since it dissolves with no problem of children not having any.
Ah, society will collapse as it did in the past in the Roman Empire, when the traditional Roman family was destroyed.

[Anonymous]

I refuse to have children if I can't afford them, and with how things have been going downhill since the concept of Reaganomics (trickle down economics) was introduced, I expect I'll never have the joy of having kids. People could afford a single income in the 50s because they were supported by the policies of the Dems, like FDR, set in the 30s.

Today after seeing marriages fail, ending either in joyless marriages or in vicious divorce, and with most of the benefits being able to be extracted by simple cohabitation, my generation is very apprehensive about marriage.

We are too busy working a full and part time job to keep our heads above water to worry about making babies to feed.

[Twalli]

The concept of supply-side ecomics has been arournd a lot longer than Reagan, much less the US. Regan was the president when all the concepts were put together in the way they were, but they weren't new ideas. Ibn Khaldun, David Hume, Jonathan Swift, Adam Smith, and Alexander Hamilton helped create the complete concept that was put into place.

[TenderFantasy]

Interesting never knew that.

[Opinion Owner]

@Twalli of course they have been, but they haven't been exclusively endorsed by an entire party to the detriment of the people in the United States until Reagan, at least not since the 30 year period between the crash in the 1890s until the 1920s, which resulted in a horrific situation internationally, and created the perfect storm for WWII.

[Jamie05rhs]

@Twalli Is that the same Jonathan Swift who wrote Gulliver's Travels?

[Twalli]

@Jamie05rhs I don't know when Gulliver's Travels was written. I can check. I think it might be a different one depending on the book's age.

[Jamie05rhs]

@Twalli Okay. Lmk what you find out.

[Twalli]

@Jamie05rhs Yes, at least the people were around in the same time and both were satirists. So I am almost 100% sure they were the same person. Hamilton was the founding father, David Hume and Adam Smith are the same ones you heard about in history.

[Jamie05rhs]

@Twalli Nice!

[desperatelyhungry]

No economy is bullshit. Men are bs. Women are bs. Pregnancy is bs. Kids are bs. I say good for my generation. A lot of people, especially women who a lot of the times end up with the kids, get dragged into poverty or can’t drag themselves out of poverty because of kids. I would rather see you dig yourself out and then have kids and not barely survive then slum it for the rest of you and their lives

[Anonymous]

I know a lot of people in my generation that are getting married and popping babies out… but personally, not for me. I don’t want those crotch demons, nor do I want to spend money and time just to have a piece of paper that says me and my partner are together, and then potentially go through divorce in the future and lose half my shit.

[Asker]

Wow. And that coming from a pink? I think I am in love now.

[LuvLuv89]

No, and you can't place high blame on the economy. Under the current US led empire we've had ups and downs, but still managed to get on with marriage, and family. These days the removal of the "nuclear family" and rising cases of broken families have made marriage & family far less idealized. The cause of broken families being Liberal values.

[Calenderagressive]

Nah we can because that's the biggest cause

[Asker]

How hypocritical to condemn blaming and then resort to blaming to Even more irrelevant things.

[Jamie05rhs]

I think @LuvLuv89 and @Calenderagressive are both right.

[LuvLuv89]

Asker, I didn't condemn "blaming". You'd have to be society-illiterate, or obstinate to fail to see the cultural and political factors guiding our behavior on such matters. Economically, we've had far worse... but we're far more materialistic now. The "$1000 phone" vs setting up your financial wellbeing to support a family years before it happens. I'm not saying place no blame on the economy... I'm saying it's nowhere near a primary cause. Liberals like to blame the economy for the failures of their neo-progressive ideology instead of taking responsibility. Keep on drinking the Cool-aid (well, it was actually Flavor Aid)... you should know what happens next.

[Asker]

All i get from that is that you probably hate liberals.

[LuvLuv89]

Asker, that certainly makes sense given you have no argument of your own. How could you understand someone elses if you can't articulate your own. If Liberals (or whoever... Ukraine supporters?) thought 2 + 2 = 5, and I stated 2 + 2 = 4... you'd be saying the exact same thing.

[Asker]

I'm saying i don't think you're making sense dragging politics into it. Sure there are the government elite taking more money for themselves and printing money leading to inflation. But that also happened outside the US.

[LuvLuv89]

Asker, yeah you're right. I should leave political ideology & culture out of answering a question relevant to generational views on marriage and family, haha.

[Asker]

Well there is same sex marriage in the west and Europe but multi marriage is only in the Islamic States 😛

[Calenderagressive]

But it isn't irrelevant

[Calenderagressive]

Wait wrong conversation lol

[ShadezMcgee]

Not surprised, but I feel school and wages aren't the sole cause. The fact is we have an entire generation that is based on instant gratification and want everything now. Promiscuity and no incentive for marriages these days since a lot of people can't communicate for shit are bigger causes than just education and wages.

[BCRanger10]

Between bad examples from their own parents, a discouragingly high divorce rate, anti-marriage and anti-family messaging in news and pop culture, a distorted understanding of what marriage is, pornography and twisted messaging on the ends of sex, transgenderism, and a host of other issues in today's culture, no, it's not surprising.

[Adam1978]

I don't believe in the fact that they don't want kids. But they don't need marriage for it. I am not surprised at all at the development, it's well deserved and earned. Ie what you seed is what you harvest. It just takes two generations to really reflect on the world.

[Rania05]

And then many faintly regrets not adopting or not having biological kids by the time they hit 50s

[Calenderagressive]

@Rania05 but that's when we'll be able to afford kids

[Rania05]

Exactly, they don't realize what effort and toll it would've taken from the back then anymore, they just go into pure regret over a decision that made them well-clothed and full

[Adam1978]

The price of a kid is very different depending on where you live. It's still feasible to have kids in Europe without being rich. Because all you need is feed an cloth them, society is backing you with a lot of the other stuff.

[Rania05]

Still expensive no matter where you go when you want the best for your kids and aren't some abusive sh*t

[Adam1978]

Spoiling kids are clearly not what is best for them. So if you take that as a cost you will be paying on both ends.

[Sour-rose]

I'm not surprised tho. I know I personally, don't want them money munchers. Or drama in my life. But the world is horrible enough as it is and from what I've seen of the past, marriage and changing names is all ways to just give your entire wallet to someone.

And they will gladly take it, by force if they can.

[Calenderagressive]

Nah we don't need you're money we're fine living off of a couple cents a hour because when you were young that could afford a living right? Oh my bad it's no longer four cents it's eight dollars in terms of today money

[LazerBean]

No. Obviously when promiscuity rises, having morals is frowned upon, and everyone is encouraged to be a narcissist, marriage rates are going to suffer because there is no point to it to such people.

[bamesjond0069]

It's not about costs. It's about morals and culture. My grandpa build a 2br 1ba house for his family and as they had more kids they added a room addition with 2 more bedrooms. So 4br 1 ba. He built it all himself.

These days people are so materialistic they won't have one child because a 4br 3ba is too small and they want a bigger yard for the dog first and a new car. Smh.

[Calenderagressive]

Nah not that champ

[Alcoholic_Wannabe]

I fail to see the connection between struggling to live and wanting education. Can't you just not indept yourself like a dipshit if money is your problem?

Anyway, I have no idea why previous generations haven't done the same. Marriage is pointless and kids are proven to have a detrimental effect on your quality of life.