My Argument for a Just and Good God

My Argument for a Just and Good God

To all atheists, I understand that you believe if God is so almighty and powerful, why is there suffering in this world? Why do babies have to die? Why do people even kill in the name of God? Why does rape, hate, and violence occur if God created everything? To the believers who have to face these questions, I would adventure to guess that you would say it is humanity's fault that these things happen and that God is only love, beauty, and truth.

It is a fair argument, but it still leaves many questions and doubts. I want to say this to everyone: God is the Father of all creation. I want to emphasize Father. Now, why Father? Why not Mother also? Of course, the highest God possesses traits from both; He (excuse me, I use this only because it is traditionally used) is beyond genders, and beyond limits. He is infinite and eternal. But most importantly, he is a Father.

What do I mean when I say Father? Let me compare this to your actual, human father. A normal father would love his children no matter what; he would sacrifice anything for them. When they make mistakes, he teaches them the better way. When they do evil, his heart cries out in pain, but above all, he still loves them and has faith in them. He wants them to become like him. In a sense, he is the creator of his children. But your father will never force you to do anything as in "If you don't do this, I will never love you." He never says that. Perhaps your father is a doctor and he wants you to become a doctor because he sees the potential within you. But what if you rebelled against your father? What if you, for the sake of rebellion, choose to become a drug addict? Your father can only cry because he still respects you and values your free will. He can only help as much as he can and hope that one day, you will understand.

Now, imagine a Universal Father. Imagine an infinite and eternal Father that has a grand plan for all of creation. Imagine a Father that has a divine plan for all beings to become participants in this endless creation. Of course though, the Universal Father allows free will (just like your human father, he cannot dictate to you what to do because you have free will). It is entirely up to you whether or not you choose to follow his grand plan for all of creation. He can only have faith in you and help as much as a father can because he is a Father.

Thank you and I hope you live a blessed and happy life, regardless of your beliefs. If you wish to know more, I have derived this idea of God as the Father from the Urantia Book (it is available for free online). I want to also say that personally, I am not Christian or of any religion. Because "My religion is very simple. My religion is kindness." - Dalai Lama


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What Girls Said 3

  • I know of that book. It's just channelling again from alien source. Too many aliens trying to control the earth human psyche.

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    • lol, I like it though, they seem like good and smart aliens.

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    • I'm actually interested in joining now; I am aware that you are suppose to get an invitation.

    • abundantlyrich - I have contacted my local branch and I am notifying one of its members that you have supposedly broken some of the terms of the masonic lodge that you are in. Don't worry though, I'm sure it's nothing, but still, I feel like turning you for kicks :p

  • i'm like right in the middle. everyone in my family is a christian. i'm fine with going to church and all that but i dont believe that god created everything. is there a word for that? i think people should just choose their religion later on in their life when they actually are able to make choices and think about their beliefs.

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  • All of you, every single one of you, pulled everything you wrote about your god straight out of your ass. You made it all up. It's inane drivel.

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    • Your argument had no support whatsoever.

      But I might as well just say this because I have to: I love you and I hope you your day goes well.

    • And I hope you didn't expect to use your age as a leverage for your debased comment... (¬_¬)

What Guys Said 15

  • Good myTake!!

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  • Religion is like a penis. It's fine to have one and it's fine to be proud of it, but please don't whip it out in public and start waving it around... and PLEASE don't try to shove it down my child's throat.
    Do not start writing laws with it.
    Do not think with it.

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    • Why should I not say what I think? Of course, religion is dangerous but so is everything else like science if not used properly.

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    • @vekin
      How many questions and takes to you see from atheists here? How many from theists?

    • @vekin
      I don't make takes promoting atheism

  • "A normal father would love his children no matter what;" How are we to know if God is a "normal" father. There are plenty of dad's who abuse their children. Nothing says God can't be one of them.
    "But your father will never force you to do anything as in "If you don't do this, I will never love you."" Um... excuse me? "If you don't love me, you'll burn for ever." That is the most basic idea behind the Christian faith - either you believe out of 'free will' or you burn for eternity - that is not free will.
    "Imagine a Father that has a divine plan for all beings to become participants in this endless creation." Since I have no choice but to participate in his divine plan - which I can not know if it will turn out good for me or not - again I am stricken of my free will. What if I don't want to be part of it? What if I will be in peril because of it? Why can't I sign off? How am I supposed to know that it's going to be good? Because you said so? Nope... need something more convincing than just that.
    "Of course though, the Universal Father allows free will" Either you have a twisted understanding of FREE will or something else... no he does not offer it.
    "It is entirely up to you whether or not you choose to follow his grand plan for all of creation." Yes... I can CHOOSE whether I become a slave to my father or burn for ever. In all technicality that is a CHOICE to make, yes, but c'mon... what kind of fucking choice is that?
    Now, to summarize everything - the examples you gave are not proof that God gives free will. He just does not because the 'loving' father does not enforce obedience with the threat of eternal suffering... no matter how fucking much he loves his child.
    "Thank you and I hope you live a blessed and happy life, regardless of your beliefs." Have a nice day. And better luck with the next argument.

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    • "If you don't love me, you'll burn for ever." That is the most basic idea behind the Christian faith - either you believe out of 'free will' or you burn for eternity - that is not free will.

      I will answer this argument; I want to emphasize that you mentioned the Christian faith follows this primarily. I would like to say again that I am not a Christian because I don't believe in such a wrathful God. But you are right, this is absolutely not free will; such a God would be a tyrant, something worse than a human. This idea itself contradicts the love and beauty of God. If we are to believe that God is infinite love, truth, and beauty, how can he possess such wicked qualities? With this, I agree with you, and I think people should look again at their idea of God.

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    • Look, you believe in it because it makes you feel good. I have nothing against that, I used to like Santa as well since he made me feel delightful during Christmas. But I simply can not imagine a deity when there is a mountain of reasons for it to make zero sense.

      I mean, answer this. You say that your God is a universal father figure. How do you know? What is the proof for it? Does it apply to every one? How and why does it apply to every one if so? Why is your particular version of God the real one? Is it the real one? Again, what is the reason for me or for any one to believe what you say? To make me feel better? No I feel just fine without some space-guy in 'my heart'. What do you think that I should do if I just do not believe none of this stuff? I don't need a God and I most definitely don't need your God in particular.

    • To your many questions, I don't think I can answer them because I believe you will find the answers eventually. And I was not trying to convert you or convince you of anything, this is simply what I believe.

      And "Look, you believe in it because it makes you feel good." This I will answer. I do this because I HAVE TO. Sometimes, I don't want to eat, but I force myself to eat anyways. Doing this does not make me "feel good" like sex or drugs or food or whatever. I do this because I MUST.

      On that note, I wish you a great day.

  • SHOW KINDNESS AND ATHEISTS WILL WALK IN WITH RAGE.

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    • @Nathand
      Kindness? LOL. It isn't the essence of religious books. You clearly know only a few cherry picked verses of your Bible.

    • SO I GUESS THAT GIVES THE ATHEISTS THE RIGHT TO BE DISRESPECTFUL...

  • "if God is so almighty and powerful, why is there suffering in this world?"
    Still no direct answer to this specific question as usual.

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  • Yeah, I've had a life of pain. just pain, everything has been pain from the moment I was born
    the way I was "created" oh he loves me? then why am I always in pain. Why do I work so hard yet everyone spews their hate onto me. Imagine waking up and looking at yur ceiling not wanting to move because of you do you will be in agonizing pain, but you have to crawl out of bed and go to your minimum wage job where everyone bullies you. you go home to where your roommates bully you and you can't do anything about it.

    Imagine being born to love your own race, imagen looking at the opposite sex and only seeing a gross body, seeing their parts disgusts you but when you see your own sex you can see every curve of their body and find that attractive, but have people wanting to kill you to rape you to send you in a boiling pit of blood because of that.

    if a god truly existed then he is evil, he is beyond evil he enjoys the suffering of others by implementing his will into some, and making their lives awesome having them taunt other people about how awesome their lives are.

    Tell me again god loves me? Tell me again to willingly submit to his abuse.

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    • I will leave you to your fate but I pray that one day, you will emerge from these hardships as a strong person. "I have never met a strong person with an easy past.". Have a great day man but always remember there is hope in the future.

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    • You have no hope, not even as small as a mustard seed so nothing is possible. You must learn your lesson the hard way I am sorry to say. But I underwent a similar experience like you did, so can I say this: Keep going through hell. I went through hell, and I lived.

    • So why can't you get out of hell like I did? We are both human beings, we both have a brain, 2 legs, 2 eyes, and 2 arms. We can love, and we can hurt. So why can't you become like me? Have faith, brother, and know that I will always be on GaG if you need my help.

      But here is how I survived through hell: I clung desperately to my family and Master (my guru who teaches me meditation and morals). My parents were dear to me because they were refugees who came here with nothing, and they built up so much that now I am attending pharmacy school. I clung to them desperately throughout my very difficult ordeals. The second is my Master - my mother is very spiritual (not religious), and she always thanked our Master for helping us throughout all of these trying times. And I clung onto my Master (even though I never met her) because I had strong faith that she was helping me spiritually despite never physically interacting with me. I was borderline suicidal for years, but I survived.

  • About the way you described a father. How is a mother any different?

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    • I'd rather you explain to me the difference and similarities between a father and mother if you are willing, and I mean that. You should also keep in mind that the idea of God as a Father has been around for 2000+ years, so it would make more sense for me to use Father over Mother than get into a pointless and irrelevant debate over divine sexism.

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    • It's not that I'm questioning that a father is like that, nor that God is like that, I'm just wondering how you think a mother would act, if not the way you described for a father.

    • hehe, I would assume it is similar, but I would ask a woman to be sure. Maybe it could be that fathers are more aggressive and rough whereas mothers are more nurturing and supportive.

  • I like the idea behind the mytake and it was presented beautifully with great quality however it doesn't actually address some of the core questions it proposes.
    "Why do babies die?"
    Babies don't choose to die, so it's that God didn't step in to keep the baby from losing free will.
    Another question I propose is that why would free will ever result in negative consequences? If God didn't create death, disease etc then even with free will babies wouldn't die.
    Think it could have been expanded, but great mytake and thanks for the read. :)

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    • http://www.urantiabook.org/ - if you ever have any questions or doubts about religion and spiritualism, this book helped me a great deal. I highly recommend although it is very dense.

      "Babies don't choose to die, so it's that God didn't step in to keep the baby from losing free will." The Urantia Book explains that if babies were to die, they would be reborn in the mansion worlds so they would have a proper upbringing just like on Earth (or Urantia as the book calls our planet).

      "why would free will ever result in negative consequences?" I believe that this is simply the Father teaching us right from wrong. If we do right, we are rewarded (albeit it might not be obvious); if we do wrong, we earn a valuable lesson. This is how all humans learn even animals. But I should mention that this free will is also limited by time and space so we aren't able to wreak havoc on the universe.

      And thank you for you kind and constructive comment! It means a lot especially after all the work and thought I put into this.

    • I appreciate the response and look forward to any future mytakes you may do. Thanks for the link, I'll be sure to check it out soon.

  • "Let me compare this to your actual, human father."

    God is a deadbeat! :p

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  • kids die, why aren't they saved? Oh, yeah, they find peace in heaven. Sorry but that's just a cheap goofy "I wan't to believe and I will do it no matter what" kind of text wall. I find it reaaaally hard to see this as an argument, is just faith fodder.

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    • Fair enough

    • Well, I just want to say everyone has the right to believe in whatever they want even if it really is "cheap goofy" fodder. Just keep in mind, there is never such a thing as "I'm right, you're wrong."

      "The fool who persists in his folly will become wise." - William Blake

  • I believe there's something running this bitch, but by no means is an bearded, old white dude.

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  • Why are you attempting to make an argument for a being we don't believe exists?

    If you're arguing for the God of the Bible, it doesn't take a Sarah Palin to realize he's a vindictive monster based on what he's committed.

    Bad mytake.

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    • "for a being we don't believe exists?" You will have to prove that to me if you are willing. You used "we" and I'm sure not all of us think the way you do.

      And I am not arguing for the God of the Bible; I am arguing for the God as presented in this book: www.urantiabook.org/

      As for the "Bad myTake," you will also have to support that opinion.

  • I personally think religion is bullshit because there is no way to prove if it's right. I know, there's no proof that it doesn't exist either, but because it's unprovable religious books are simply stories created by man. But if a god exists, I'm personally more attracted to the idea of deism; the god created the universe and then moved on, maybe it was a one-off project or they just like to create universes, whatever.

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    • I liked that idea too, the Founding Fathers were deists. But then I figured God would be interested in his creation so he would sort "guide" his children but never against their will.

    • Makes sense. Well, definitely more than standard Christianity that's taught in schools here.

    • hehe, yeah, I really think Christians should reevaluate their idea of God as a father. I mean, there are so many contradictions that they believe that contradicts the idea of a Universal Father. But I will leave this up to time.

  • on a serious note I've always wanted to mention this. people always say if god is good then why does..(put example here) happen. whatever "death" you experience in your family or friends or what have you.

    i need people to understand that death to us, isn't the same thing as death to god. neither is suffering.
    we dont live on the same plain of existence. to god "death" may just be another "level up".
    your perception of suffering may just be an illusion. and once death overcomes us it may just seem like the smallest thing.

    i have to say that im not sure if an intelligent force is actually running the world. But if he is. i imagine what we experience through our existence may not be as important as we all feel.

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    • finally something new to the table

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    • because death to us is not the same thing. you keep talking about god from a mortal standpoint.
      from a mortal stand point god is angry and can kill anyone at anytime. im not sure what gods stand point is. but to say all these horrible things are happening is funny cause to him it might just be nothing.

    • How do you know death to God is different? How do you know we don't live on the same plane? Also within Christianity God has experienced the same death as humans and this is from a Christian perspective so I do not really see the point in your pondering.

  • God is an analogy for your parents/the universe/the unknown. A tool. An instrument. An idea. It amuses me how you can write such a long argument and not realise you are talking from the inside of a box. Gotta love the Matrix. XD Good luck.

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    • "An idea" that is true to some degree. "Mankind created God." - I believe this is true to some extent. Our idea of God is basically our current understanding of God, it is our current understanding of infinity and eternity. Anyways, please explain to me what you mean by "not realise you are talking from the inside of a box." I am interested @drunkenlullaby

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    • Interesting.. But what do you mean by 'the one where we all come from'? Is that a metaphor for the universe or?

      My 'god' is nature, by the way. Here's an awesome quote from a song i love: 'Nature's the only dictator, that i respect and obey'. Nature won't judge anyone, nor tell anyone what to do. Nature just is content and we are simply part of it. I wish nature was the world's 'religion' as it still was ten thousands of years ago. I love how the vikings had a 'god of thunder' and a 'god of fertility' etc, they are just aspects of nature. :D

    • "But what do you mean by 'the one where we all come from'? Is that a metaphor for the universe or?"
      According to the Urantia Book (found at http://www.urantiabook.org/), the Universal Father (the highest concept of God - infinite and eternal) is also called "The First Source and Center" so you could say He was the beginning of all actions (that is my interpretation) so naturally, we are a product but also a continuation of Him.

      But your concept of God is good albeit it is a bit pantheistic (nothing wrong with that of course). It's just that that concept sort of "puts us to sleep" or lulls us into complacency. Our ancestors worshiped nature because they were fundamentally afraid of nature and thought that by worshiping it, it could favor them somehow. There's nothing wrong with that, but it depends on what kind of view you want. At least for me, God the Universal Father is the infinite and eternal that I always want to strive for.

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