I think Islam in many ways appeals to men a lot more than other religions. In that regard it does have many advantages, i have a lot of philippine friends and a minority of philippine people convert to islam and their reasoning was it was more fitting with their sexual desires to have more than one woman.
Not all Muslim guys will have multiple wifes (most won't) but the option is there if they can find a wife that finds it agreeable. There is also the masculine nature of conflict, i. e there is no "turn the other cheek". In Islam it's "an eye for an eye" and brotherhood separation from those not in the faith creating a brotherhood community against others. The basis of only muslim men having access to a lot of the fruits of the faith. In many ways it does really help men and seem based on them
that's where the advantage comes. under islamic sharia, the man inherents the control. It's up to the man to find the ideal wife for that and if he so wishes can divorce his wife by reciting the teleq 3 times. even ignoring this aspect. there are other advantages for the men like holdingthe rights over the children
"and their reasoning was it was more fitting with their sexual desires to have more than one woman"
https://youtu.be/pCpeeaIfF9c
https://youtu.be/n572sFAaL68
Islam can also be understood as a religion that empowers women, and even allows a woman a great role in a marriage.
For instance, the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) married a 40 year old Khadija, when he was 25. She was his employer, and once married, he came and lived with her. That's a very progressive marriage. As long as she lived, he never married another!
Islam allows an older woman to marry a much younger man. It even allows a woman to marry a male slave!
If there is one defining character, it is that Islam provides flexibility for all times, all cultures, all ages. Its timeless in its principles, and can help you define yourself without going outside the framework that God set for us...
That's great but why there is inequality under Sharia law?
dear Asker, thanks for asking me about Islam. Often people don't even bother asking us, at least you're open minded enough to ask. Islam believes men and women are equal, but it does not believe the modern Western presumption that they are the same. "equal but not the same". Women and men have different social, psychological, biological... etc. needs.
Islamic Law, which is very similar to the laws given in the Old and New Testament, therefore gives benefits sometimes to women more, and sometime to men more. For instance, a woman is not obligated to pay a single penny to her husband, but the welfare and upkeep of herself and her children is obligated upon the husband.
Legally, women have the right to justice equal to men. It does not matter if a man or a woman steels, the judgment is the same.
Inheritence wise, women get less - they get half of what men get, but then, they are not legally obliged to support or care for their partner, nor the children. I hope that answers.
thanks Brother Omar. Sallam.
Some of the biggest wet-noodles I've ever met were Muslim men whipped by their Muslim wives.
I used to think the same thing until I realized more and more that Muslims are pretty much just like everyone else, except for the terrorizing, father-raping, bomb-loving cunt-tards who have no place representing Islam in any way, who seem to get all the media attention just for being Muslim after they blow up a city block all in the name of Allah.
Those guys probably had some nagging wife at home telling them how to live their life too.
Thanks for your insight opinion :)
They can only have 4 wives if he could pay all their money things they need he had to keep everything in the same amount for all of them but this is only for the marriage and yes I do belive Islam is the religion of alpha males
Thanks for your opinion :)
Alpha man means a man who controls basically everything in their wives life and is too much possessive
That's bad :/
yeah it's Mostly in Arab countries
Yes we have things in Arabian cultural people do that are against Islam and people think it's Islam people think all Muslims act is from Islam like if they went to the bathroom u will find some people ISLAM ORDERS TO ENTER THE BATHROOM THAT'D CLOSE MINDED yes there are some muslim killers like there is American killer like there's a lot of killers that don't belong to Islam actually killing an innocent soul thats the worst sin in Islam
Like I said Islam needs to update a tiny bit but I don't think it's really that bad
Lol why thank you but Really people who are Muslims act a bit too much at times And make people from different religions to think badly of them
you couldn't be more accurate
did the "triple talaaq" controversy made you think? when i came to know a week back, i could not believe that a law like that even exists
OMG How could I forget this. There's two guest here on this question who would like to share their knowledge regarding their religion.
I really find it funny how you jumped from 'polygamy in Islam' to 'divorce in Islam' ... It seems that you are just trying to find anything to attack my religion, but never mind, I will respond to this claim anyway, actually I'm telling you for the 2nd time that "triple talaq" is called "Bidat" which means "innovation" ... And every single Bidat about Islam is sinful, so 'triple talaq' is sinful in Islam and just like any other Bidat, it has no place in the Islamic teachings.
@YazanAA cool down man. No one is attacking your religion. Don't be a bigoted person and keep the discussion intended for educational purposes only.
@YazanAA - It's about Alpha-ism and marriage as a whole.
@YourFutureEx ok dude, I really don't mind it to have a respectful discussion about religions, I don't mind it if anyone has a question about my religion, you can ask and I will answer and give my reasons, however what I really dislike is the claims that are being made about my religion, such as "Islam is a brutal religion" , "Islam views women as nothing more than slaves" , "male domination" , "triple talaq" ... Blah blah blah.
@YazanAA apart from triple talaq, I won't allow other things. Don't worry.
@YazanAA You don't need to mention me in my own questions :)
@YazanAA you can write it as
"YourFutureEx - blah blah blah" instead of "@YourFutureEx - blah blah blah"
So that I will get only one legit notification instead of two
And @asker is another user not me :P
For more information regarding how to mention like a pro :- www.girlsaskguys.com/.../a9417-my-gag-mantra-the-follow-up
(point #1)
You had to mention me because I'm not the asker... My dear friend, triple talaq is Bid'at, and every Bid'at is sinful, triple talaq goes against the teachings of Islam ( just like any other Bid'at) ... Now do you even know what Bid'at is? Bid'at is simply something that some Muslims created from nowhere because they were ignorent enough to do that and most likely they are not well educated about Islam, all Bid'ats has nothing to do with the teachings of Islam and all of them are sinful, for example, we Muslims were told to fast in Ramadan ( the ninth month of the Islamic calendar), now if a Muslim came out of the blue and decided " oh I don't wanna fast in Ramadan, instead I wanna fast in shawwal (the 10th month of Ramadan)" .. then in this case, he is creating bid'at, something that doesn't exist in Islam and he is doing it thinking that he will get rewards for that, while in reality he will get sins for that because you Muslims just follow what we are told, we mustn't creat things
All the Islamic scholars agree that triple talaq is Bid'ah... Even Ibn Taymiyyah ( 1263 AD - 1328 AD) one of the greatest (if not the greatest) Muslim scholars of all times, was one of the first to point out that triple talaq is Bid'ah and has no place in the Islamic teachings and he was against those Bid'ats that some regular not well educated Muslims make.
To know more about what Bid'ah (or bid'at, the pronunciation depends on the position of the word in the Arabic sentence) is, read this https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bid‘ah
Ok that's pretty cool, then next time you see a Muslim in India who says that triple talaq is Islamic, ask him this question, "where does it say in the Quran or in the sahih Hadiths that in order for a Muslim to divorce his wife, all he has to do is to say ( talaq, talaq, talaq) ?" .. Yes, ask them from where did they come up with this? That would be a good question for those Muslims that you are talking about and for anyone who says that triple talaq is an Islamic law or an Islamic teaching.
i know i am like, awfully late, but you're welcome!
I think its a religion of satan but alas I dont think gager permits my beliefs to be voiced
Uhm? How so?
Opinion
20Opinion
I never understood why having many women would be equal to being alpha. In my eyes, a man who promises a woman that he will be loyal only to her (expecting the same back of course) and actually KEEPS that promise is a greater man than one that fucks around.
But I duuno, maybe I'm young and naive.
I like such people :)
This is my opinion and mine only, I'm not saying that this is just how things are, this is what I think.
Following a religion will make one omega, not even beta. A beta will take over the alphas position if the alpha should die or be removed. (and since a god will never die, betas don't exist in person)
Why CHOOSE to be the lowest in a hierarchy when you can be your own alpha?
@YourFutureEx
I see, were you born into it or did you choose it yourself?
And just to clear things up, so no one misunderstands, I have nothing against religious people, I think it's interesting to hear others opinions and talk to people who are different from myself. I just think that it's hard for me to imagine MYSELF live that lifestyle because it's so far from what I believe. by the way, interesting question :)
Yup I agree that you are cool :)
I was born Hindu :) it doesn't stop me from doing anything except eating beef which I'd tolerate :) other than that, I'm free :)
@YourFutureEx I see, that's good. It's about finding that balance :)
Thanks for your time :)
All the other religions don't have perfect records - When you are in a glasshouse don't throw stones.
Diamond*house
You can't judge this permission claiming that it's against woman rights since the second wife isn't an alien but a woman.
According to this permission, a woman can marry to a man whom she loves even if he is married, a man can't marry a woman whom he loves if she is married. advantages for women.
Hahaha dude, the Quran is the only religious book on the face of the earth that says "MARRY ONLY ONE" ...
Then why don't you follow it?
I have watched it and it was relevant to the question for a few minutes only. Not just YOU but why some Muslims marry multiple women then?
Then you just watch it without understanding it, Islam allows men to have up to 4 wives but the Quran is the only religious scriptures that says 'marry only one' in case you can't be just with them, now can you show me something like that in the bible, the Torah, the Vedas.. etc?
"And if you fear that you will not deal justly with the orphan girls, then marry those that please you of [other] women, two or three or four. But if you fear that you will not be just, then [marry only] one" ( Surat an-Nisa verse 3)
Now if Islam is the religion of alpha males just because it allows you to marry up to 4 wives, then according to your logic, Christianity, Judaism and Hinduism are the religions of super super super super alpha males because in those religions, you can have as many wives as you wish, there's nothing written in their scriptures that prevent them from marrying as many wives as they want, it's the church and the Indian law that says you can only marry one not their scriptures.
"And if you fear"
-It means there's no point in stating that people should marry only once because it not a stringent rule but an emotive.
And there's a vast difference between what's written and what people actually do. Because after the prohibition by the church and the Indian law, most of the Christians and Hindus are proscribed, making them unimpeachable religions in terms of polygamy.
"t means there's no point in stating that people should marry only once because it not a stringent rule but an emotive."
Well actually, Islam is telling you that if you decided to marry more than one wife then you can marry up to 4 wives BUT there's a condition to do that which is treating them with justice if you can't treat them with justice then marry only one, how there's no point in stating that? Other scriptures don't give you a limit of how many wives you can have and they don't tell you that if you can't treat them fairly then marry only one.
"And there's a vast difference between what's written and what people actually do."
with all respect but his is a hypocritical statement, because:
A. Most Muslim men marry only one wife
b. You judge the religion by what's written in their scriptures not by what the followers of that religion do, because your question literally says "do you think Islam is the religion of alpha males?" You didn't ask "do you muslims are alpha males?"
Just hypothetically speaking, let's say that there's 2 different religious scriptures, and let's call them X And Y
Scripture X tells you that you can eat more than one Apple, you can eat up to 4 Apples, but if you decided that then make sure those apples have the same size, otherwise don't eat more than one.
Scripture Y doesn't tell you anything about eating apples, does that mean according to scripture Y that you can't eat more than one Apple? No it means that you can eat as many apples as you wish no matter what size those Apple are.
I'm just giving you a simple example to make it clear for you.
Now you shifted from "only one" to "upto four limit".
And you're talking about Christian and Hindu scriptures?
"You judge the religion by what's written in their scriptures not by what the followers of that religion do"
-THIS is hypocritical statement, because you're are including the religious scriptures of Christians and Hindus, not the fact that they prohibited polygamy.
A sweet view of contradiction lol.
I didn't jump from "only one" to "up to four limit" if you read the verse from the Quran you will realize what I meant by saying that the Quran is the only religious scripture that says 'marry only one' ... I didn't mean by saying that the Quran doesn't allow us to marry more than one wife, i mean that it's only religious book that gives you a limit with a condition that if you can't treat them fairly then marry only one.
"THIS is hypocritical statement, because you're are including the religious scriptures of Christians and Hindus, not the fact that they prohibited polygamy"
I'm including other religious scriptures just to let you know that polygamy is not only an Islamic thing, it does exist in Judaism, Christianity and Hinduism. those religions don't prohibit polygamy, the law is what prohibits polygamy, the teachings of a religion and the laws of a country ( or a church) are two different things.
In my original comment, I said " the Quran is the only religious nook on the face of the earth that says 'MARRY ONLY ONE' " ... I'm not contradicting, yes I didn't explain to you what I meant by saying that, but I gave you the video as an explanation of that, just to let you know that polygamy is not only an Islamic thing.
"those religions don't prohibit polygamy, the law is what prohibits polygamy, the teachings of a religion and the laws of a country ( or a church) are two different things."
That's what I am telling you fella. It is JUST written. People will have to follow the laws first, not the teachings.
And in Islam, BOTH things support polygamy.
Hahaha dudddde, how many times do I have to say that the laws and the teachings of a religion are two different things, we don't judge the religion by the human made laws, we judge the reliogn by its teachings that are mentioned in the scriptures.
Other religions don't prohibit polygamy, for example let's look at Hinduism, in fact Hindus are more polygamous than Muslims The report of the 'Committee of The Status of Woman in Islam', published in 1975 mentions on page numbers 66,67 that the percentage of polygamous marriages between the year 1951 -1961 was 5.06 among the Hindus and only 4.31 among the Muslims.
[off-topic] aren't scriptures human made?
It is because the law was passed after this report (The Hindu Marriage Act, 1955) which caused a considerable change s3-ap-southeast-1.amazonaws.com/.../...oad--4-.png
and then s3-ap-southeast-1.amazonaws.com/.../...oad--6-.png
I think the discussion we are having is very unproductive :|
"[off-topic] aren't scriptures human made?"
Well to you and to others maybe? But for me, I follow a book that has never changed, no word was removed, added or edited from the Quran and I believe that the Quran is the word of God that he revealed to the prophet Mohammad ( peace be upon him ) to guide mankind, so no for me, it's not human made.
Anyway, what I was trying to show you in this whole discussion is that polygamy is not just an Islamic thing and other religions don't prohibit polygamy, at least Islam put conditions and limits to polygamy, other religions don't. So by using your logic, no Islam is not a religion of "alpha males" ... at least comparing to other religions lol.
opinion owner, i don't know much about christianity or islam, but what i can tell you with confidence that polygamy is against the law according to the Hindu Marriage Act. but polygamy is permitted for muslims.
sure, in the 15th century, many hindu kings had many wives, but the law is different now. also, our holy books don't permit it.
considering for a second that the data provided by you is correct, if more hindus in India followed polygamy in 1950-1960, it still doesn't change the fact that it is illegal for hindus. i am sure they were punished. however, muslims were (and are still not) punished for having multiple wives because the qur'an permits it, and so the law was modified for them, taking into consideration, their religious beliefs.
that is the argument yourfutureex is trying to make.
i read your entire conversation. i understand that often we confuse the idea propagated by orthodox leaders, with the principles of the said religion. so i looked up whether your holy book..
actually does permit polygamy. i don't know how authentic my source is, but it said that qur'an permits men to have multiple wives, but women can't have multiple husbands. i suppose that is yourfutureex's second argument.
sure, the wives have to give him their permission, and the man is supposed to divide his time and resources equally, but it still doesn't change the fact that it is permitted
not to mention, triple talaaq. it is a law that enables a man to divorce a woman by simply saying "talaaq" three times, verbally.
Further it says, it is not lawful for men that they take from women anything which they have given them.
in some countries, the law is to say "talaaq" twice.
" If a Muslim wants to exchange one wife for another he is commanded not to take anything from her, even if he has given her a quintaar, meaning, pile of gold (Surah Nisa, Section 20)."... exchange wives? are they commodities?
and what is the logic behind not divorcing a woman who is menstruating (since it is un-islamic), and waiting for her to be "clean"?
@astatine I didn't say that Islam doesn't permit polygamy, it does permit a man to have up to 4 wives, however, I'm saying that polygamy is not an Islamic thing, and if you read the teachings of Jewish, Christian and Hindu scriptures, you will never find anything that prohibits polygamy, well actually the Quran is the only religious scripture that gives you a limitation of polygamy and it's the only religious scripture that tells you if you can't do justice between them then 'marry only one' and the Quran is the only religious book which has this phrase. So in other words, the Quran prohibits polygamy in some cases, which is if the man can't be fair with his wives.
D00D if it doesn't prohibit polygamy, it doesn't mean that it supports this. Simple. Logical. Reasoning.
@astatine the triple talaq thing is incorrect and has no place in the Islamic law, if a man says to his wife you are "talaq, talaq, talaq" then she is not talaq "divorced" ... It's called"talaq al-bidat" which means "the divorce of innovation" ... It has no place in the Islamic sharia and actually it's called bidat (innovation).
Now coming to (Surat al- Nisa, verse 20) ... "Exchange one wife to another" simply means, divorcing one wife with an intention to marry another one, something wrong with that? Lol... This verse is talking about something called "Mahr" ( bride price) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahr in Islam, a man must give his wife Mahr which is an amount of money or property ( or maybe both) ... This verse is simply telling the Muslim man, that if something bad happened between you and your wife and you decided to divorce her then you have no right to take anything from her Mahr and that's fair for women actually.
@astatine Now finally coming to your question " what is the logic behind not divorcing a woman who is menstruating?"
The wisdom behind this is that divorcing the wife in her menstrual period prolongs her waiting period (idda), because the menstrual period in which divorce is given will not be counted, and as such, her Idda will begin from the next menstrual period, resulting in unnecessary hardship for her. Another reason is that a man is generally less inclined towards his wife when she is menstruating; hence, it is possible that he may hasten in divorcing her without thinking properly of the consequences.
@YourFutureEx "D00D if it doesn't prohibit polygamy, it doesn't mean that it supports this. Simple. Logical. Reasoning."
And it also doesn't meant that it doesn't permit it.
@astatine unfortunately you and our friend Asker still don't know the difference between the law of a country which was created like 40-50 years ago, and the teachings religion which was there for thousands of years.
Hinduism AS A RELIGION allows polygamy, Many Hindu religious personalities, according to their scriptures, had multiple wives. King Dashrat, the father of Rama, had more than one wife. Krishna had several wives.
One can imagine what would have been the percentage of polygamous marriages among the Hindus if the Indian government had made it legal for them. Earlier, there was no restriction even on Hindu men with respect to the number of wives allowed. It was only in 1954, when the Hindu Marriage Act was passed that it became illegal for a Hindu to have more than one wife.
I am impressed that you happen to know so much about Hinduism, but you seem to have missed one big detail.
As I have said earlier, kings (and only kings, no other commoner) had multiple wives, to form peace treaties and alliances with various kingdoms. For example, if the kingdom of rajasthan wished to have peaceful relationships with delhi, they would have gotten their kids married to each other.
Rama, a human, was an avatar of Lord Vishnu, the Preserver of the universe (note, he WAS human). He was born to an ordinary, human king named Dasharath. Kings in that age had multiple wives, not because their religion permitted it, but because they wanted to make their kingdom strong and secure. So Dasharath had 3 wives.
Rama, however, had only one. Her name was Sita, who was an avatar of Goddess Laxmi. Lord Vishnu and Goddess Laxmi were married even before he appeared in the avatar of Lord Rama. And the fact that he got married to his own wife even when he had a different avatar, only goes on to prove how strongly our gods followed polygamy.
Krishna, again, a human with supernatural powers, is also an avatar of Lord Vishnu. He fell in love briefly with Radha. She was his girlfriend (crudely put).
But in the end, Krishna got married to Rukmini, which is an avatar of Goddess Laxmi. Because he believed in monogamy.
@astatine everything you said doesn't mean that Hinduism prohibits polygamy, it may not favor it ( well no religion does) but still, if a Hindu man wanted to marry more than one wife, then nothing can prevent him according to the Hindu scriptures and polygamy was practiced between Hindus even after the Indian law made it illegal for them in 1955, is there a verse in any Hindu scripture that says 'marry only one'? well from my knowledge, there is not.
And you say "how strongly our gods followed monogramy" ... Lol please, Krishna has around 16,000 wives, how can someone how married 16,000 wives strongly follow monogramy? Lol I'm not saying that Hinduism encourage you to have more than one wife, but if you wanted that then nothing can prevent you and it seems that through out history, a lot of Hindus wanted that and did it and nothing prevented them expect the Indian law that was made in 1955.
YazanAA - Those were not his wives, those were his followers. He gave them the "honour" of wife to show them love.
And yes, Muhammad's wives or Wives of Muhammad were the twelve women married to the Islamic prophet Muhammad. how can someone how married 12 wives strongly follow the rule/law of marrying only upto 4 wives? Lol I'm not saying that Islam... agrh leave it!
nothing about polygamy is mentioned in our scriptures because it is understood that ideally, a human being should be monogamous.
however, in your holy books, it is not only mentioned, but also permitted; which is terribly difficult to understand if islam doesn't support polygamy.
maybe hindu men wanted to get multiple wives even after 1955. but they couldn't because the law AS WELL AS the scriptures don't encourage it.
@astatine I have never denied that polygamy is allowed in Islam, it's allowed, but guess what? It was always allowed before/after the Quran, Polygamy was normally being practiced before and after the Quran by non-Muslims, Christians, Jews and Hindus. there's nothing written in their holy books that says polygamy is prohibited or says that a man can have only one wife, maybe Hinduism doesn't encourage it BUT IT DOES NOT PROHIBIT IT EITHER, again it was really practiced normally and this verse in the Quran didn't come with something new, it just came to limit polygamy and to warn those who are willing to marry more than one wife that they must do justice, again the Quran didn't bring polygamy to the world lol, it was there before the Quran and it was being practiced normally by non-Muslim folks even after the Quran.
@astatine and it was really really a normal practice, if you read the Old Testament, you will never find something that prohibits polygamy, the Jews themselves were practicing it,
Polygyny is permitted in Judaism. According to Talmudic law, Abraham had 2 wives, and Solomon had hundreds of wives. The practice of polygyny continued till Rabbi Gershom ben Yehudah. (960 AD to 1030 AD) issued an edict against it. The Jewish Sephardic communities living in Muslim countries continued the practice till as late as 1950, when an Act of the chief Rabbinate of Israel extended the ban on marrying more than one wife. so as you can see, nowadays, what prevents Hindus from having more than one wife is the Indian law not the Hindu scriptures and what prevents Jews from having more than one wife is what the Rabbi decided and the Israeli law not the Torah.
Yes and the greatest source says that it was 12
Now before answering your question, I wanna give you a little preview about the life of prophet Mohammed peace be upon him:
#1 prophet Mohammad wasn't sexually obsessed as some people claim about him, in fact the only wife that he chose for himself was his first wife Khadijah, he married her before his prophethood, he was 25 years old and she was 40 years old ( and she was also widowed twice) ... And I repeat, she was the only wife that he married by his own will and he lived with her for 25 years until she passed away. And during these 25 years, he never married anyone besides her.
#2 at the beginning of the message of Islam that started in the desert of Arabia, Quraysh ( a group of people who had the power at that time) were fighting against the prophet and they were killing those who accept Islam, they even kicked out all the Muslims from Makkah to Maddena. Anyway those people were trying to induce the prophet to leave Islam, they told him, "if you want money we will give you money, if you want women we will give you the most beautiful women, if you want to be a king of us, we will make you our king, we will give you everything you can imagine, if you just leave Islam and its message" and he rejected all of that and told them that no matter how hard they induce him and no matter who many things they have to offer, he will never ever leave the message of Islam.
So if he was sexually obsessed as some people claim about him, then why would he marry a 40 years old twice widowed woman by his own will when he is just 25 years old? Why would he spend 25 years old with her without looking for another one? Why would he refused and rejected all the money, the women and the power that Quraysh offered for him? The answer is simple, he was not sexually obsessed and he was not a liar, if he was a liar then he would leave the message of Islam and accept all these things that they offered to him.
Now coming to your question to why prophet Mohammad married 11 wives when Muslims can only have 4 maximum?
Actually, the Ahkam ( Islamic commandments) can be different sometimes between the prophet (peace be upon him) and the rest of Muslim, for example, Muslim must pray 5 times a day, and there are other optional prayers they can do if they want, however those optional prayers were a MUST For the prophet, so he had to pray the regular 5 daily prayers in addition to other prayers, they weren't optional for him they were a must, so god gave an exception for the prophet Mohammad, and remember that the prophet didn't choose to marry them, but he had to marry the other 10 because God told him to do that by revelations. Now why God told him to do that? Well because of many reasons some we know and others God only knows.
Now the ones we know, His later marriages were for various reasons. Some marriages were with the view to help the women whose husbands had been killed while they were defending their faith. Others were with a view to cement relationships with devoted followers like Abu Bakr, may Allah be pleased with him. Yet others were to build bridges with various tribes who were otherwise at war with the Muslims. When the prophet became their relative through marriage, their hostilities calmed down, and much bloodshed was averted.
alright, i get your point, and i respect your opinion and your faith.
i guess islam gets a bad image because of the people who practice it; who still think that a woman should wear a burkha at all times, who think that women shouldn't drive, drink, eat or speak, or have a life, who bomb nations in the name of Allah... who blatantly justify any wrong-doing as religious practice, so i hope you can understand my predicament when i came to know the truth about triple-talaaq..
although, islam should have had a firmer stand on polygamy. it IS encouraging people who desperately try to pass off their sins as beliefs
@astatine well with due respect, if Islam gets a bad image then it would be because of the media and the stereotypes that people make about Islam and Muslims just like the ones you are saying right now, not because the people who practice Islam, I don't deny that we have some bad Muslims who do bad things in the name of Islam, I don't deny it that the Saudi Arabian government is doing wrong when they don't allow women to drive, but guess what? Bad people exist in every religion, race, ethnicity, nationality... etc ... those are not Islam, they don't represent Islam or the fast majority of Muslims, they only represent themselves and people should be smart enough to realize that, I mean there's more than 1.7 billion Muslims around the world and let's say that 17 million of them are bad, that's only 1% of the Muslim population, what about the other 99%? Well in reality those extremists are no where near a couple of thousands so why would we make massive generalizations? thank you :)
@YourFutureEx hahahaha what the hell buddy? I just noticed the update, I'm not sure why you would feel the need to say something like that and make an update mentioning me and saying that the video I gave was "utterly pathetic" when you could just simply say that here on my opinion or at least tag me so I can be able to see what are you talking about... That was just a very childish and coward move dude. Not something I would accept from you.
And you are saying that the video is "utterly pathetic" yet you couldn't even prove me or the person in the video wrong, and you are ignoring the historical facts about polygamy between non-Muslim, maybe if you were able to do that then we would discuss who/what is really utterly pathetic.
The person in the video is not a kid, he is Dr. Zakir Naik, one of the most famous scholars in comparative religions, He was ranked 89 on The Indian Express's list of the "100 Most Powerful Indians in 2010". He was ranked 82 in the 2009 edition.
He also studied every single verse and text in the Muslim, Jewish, Christian and Hindu scriptures, he also literally memories every single verse of these scriptures in many languages and can give you the reference of these verses from his mind, so I really doubt it that you, I or anyone here know more than him about religions.
#1. There's nothing hell or even remotely similar to that.
#2. That was just a piece of credit for your great participation in this question (so that future visitors would specially check your opinion for knowledge) and a reason that why I still didn't give you MHO.
#3. I've discussed everything regarding the video. But if I choose something as MHO containing a video which has incorrect content especially to my religion, it'd not be a wise move.
#4. That was not childish or coward move. Maybe you have different meaning and interpretation of these words and their elucidation.
#5. Reading scriptures and getting ranked doesn't make you candid or better person. Even Gandhi is considered to be the nation's best but real people know what kind of person he was.
Some people could even read scriptures to better find ways to attract others by their exegesis.
#6 Just like mesonfielde said, it was like deriding others to prove oneself right.
#1 hell was just a expression to say that what you did is not cool, never mind.
#2 that would be nice if that was your intention I guess? However it seems that you are trying to say "oh he gave us lots of information but don't take what he said seriously because of the video" while in reality you couldn't even prove me wrong about anything I said.
#3 no you really didn't, and I wonder what incorrect content are you talking about? Everything he said are historical facts and I think that he gave references to back up what he said.
#4 the reason why I said it's childish and coward is because you said the video I gave (which is a part of my opinion) is utterly pathetic, and at the same you didn't tag me or even give me a hint in a comment here so I can see that and respond to your claim.
#5 that can be true sometimes but I'm not sure why we would you apply this to Zakir Naik while you couldn't even prove him wrong, again he said:
- the Quran is the only religious book on the face of the earth that has this phrase 'marry only one' which is true.
- other religions don't prohibit polygamy, and he gave a few examples about polygamous cases in their scriptures. Which is also true. And I can give you more examples if you want.
- Hindus and other religious groups were more polygamous than Muslims in India when polygamy was legal for them according to the statistics.
So seriously, I'm not sure what "incorrect content" are you talking about?
#6 not really, this argument is COMPLETELY different than that argument, that argument was about someone who makes false claims about Islam forgetting the fact that his religion teaches the same false claims he made, so my point was it's better for him to go and read what his religion teaches before he decide to make false claims about a religion that he knows nothing about (which is something he admitted by the way). However, in this argument, you didn't make a false claim about Islam, you said it allows man to have up to 4 wives and that's 100% true, I wasn't "deriding others to prove oneself right", I was just showing you that polygamy is not an Islamic thing and it's not something that Islam came up with, in fact, it was normally practiced by non-Muslims throw out the history before and after the Quran, and the Quran just came to limit it and put some conditions for it.
After reading #4, 5 & 6. I think you have ignored/forgot a lot of things we discussed and because of this, we are again at the beginning where we started absolutely nothing.
However, my intentions were positive, I just wanted to give you a credit and want others to read YOUR post but I don't know how it turned wrong.
If you desperately wanted MHO, then I am sorry. If you're not in condition of taking that, I'd ask another question tagging you and would give you one to compensate the loss so that we could make the deal work and leave you as happy (or maybe even happier) as always.
Thanks for your understanding.
"If you desperately wanted MHO, then I am sorry. If you're not in condition of taking that, I'd ask another question tagging you and would give you one to compensate the loss so that we could make the deal work and leave you as happy (or maybe even happier) as always."
Haha dudddee, I hope that you are joking right now, because that would be too silly if you are serious, but no no I'm very convinced that you are joking ;) you can't be serious here right now because I believe that you are smart enough to know that the last thing I care about is your MHO. My argument here wasn't because I'm upset because you didn't gave me MHO (I'm not that silly to even suggest that), my point was is that you said the video which I gave was utterly pathetic, and ironically, in this whole conversation, you failed to even prove any point from the video to be wrong. That's all what I'm trying to say, it has nothing to do with MHO.
Yeah I was kidding. I personally believed that we discussed a lot regarding this video and that's why I don't want to start this again because it'd be insanity. The fact is, Islam is not a religion of alpha males. Case closed.
Good to know that you were kidding... and I believe that we discussed a lot regarding that video too, but I also believe that I gave a lot of data and references to back up my opinion and still have more examples, references and evidences about polygamy being permitted and practiced in other religions (Christianity, Judaism and Hinduism) and maybe other religions, who knows? ( But I can only talk about he religions that I learned about) yet not a single evidence or reference were given from their scriptures which can disprove my point or show that polygamy is prohibited in those religions. But ehh, whatever.
I also think that Islam is not the religion of alpha males, no religion is, maybe a person who follows an X religion is an alpha male, but the religion itself? I don't think so. I also don't think that Islam or any other religion allows polygamy for the sake of alphaism.
But anyway, this argument was old, I just made my recent remark when I noticed the update, because I felt that it was unnecessary and it was very childish and had a malicious intention behind it, but if your intention were really positive as you claim then it's ok, never mind I guess, oh well.
Lol no, that religion is quite brutal and in reality refers to women as nothing more then slaves.
Deuteronomy 22: 28-29 "a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, he shall pay her father fifty shekels of silver. He must marry the young woman, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives."
Numbers 31: 17-18 "now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, BUT SAVE FOR YOURSELF EVERY GIRL WHO HAS NEVER SLEPT WITH A MAN"
Deuteronomy 20: 13-14 " When the LORD your God delivers it into your hand, put to the sword all the men in it. As for the women, the children, the livestock and everything else in the city, you may take these as plunder for yourselves. And you may use the plunder the LORD your God gives you from your enemies."
Maybe you need to read your "holy" bible to know which religion "refers to women as nothing more than slaves" before you come here and talk nonsense BS about another religion.
Calm yourself, @YazanAA I was referring more to what goes on today not thousands of years ago. Nor did I state that all Muslims were bad I know there are plenty of innocent ones. I also know many sins have been committed in the name of Christianity, I am not denying that.
But you can't deny that there is a lot of really horrible stuff going on right now with Muslims and your religion. I know that your not all like that, but there is enough going on right now that I could not in good graces support what he is asking/saying.
O and in regards to the scriptures, who we were is not a reflection of who we are now.
Well actually I'm very calm, but the thing is, I found it very funny and hypothetical that someone who is a Christian and who believes in the bible as the word of God felt the need to come here lying and claiming things about Islam which he clearly knows nothing about, so I would suggest that next time you feel that need, go please and read your bible first to know exactly which religion is brutal and which religion refers to women as nothing more than slaves, because as I see, those weren't "sins have been committed in the name of Christianity".. It's what your God told you to do.
Oh and say that again? "O and in regards to the scriptures, who we were is not a reflection of who we are now?" ... Haha but you and your Christinan friends here didn't say that when you were quoting verses from the bible and expressing your feelings about gay marriage being legalized in the USA. Who we were is not a reflection of who we are, right? Haha that's my friend is called an obvious hypocrisy :)
completely agree with you @Phoenix98
@YazanAA Not really Christianity has changed quite a bit in the thousands of years that it's been around, a lot of the stuff we used to do, we don't anymore. And you're right I don't know a lot about the Muslim religion but what I do know is Christians aren't the ones running around killing innocent people, Islam is not overall a bad religion on it's own, I know quite a few Muslims who aren't a threat to anyone, but when people like this misinterpret it, then people die, lots of good people, some of which I knew, so my view may be a bit biased.
And again I've read my bible, and I never denied us having a brutal past, but Christianity as it is today does none of that, right now we're the ones risking our lives to help others, my religion is not the one running around hurting innocent people right now, if it ever is then we'll talk.
@YazanAA I've never agreed with homosexuality even before becoming a Christian I've never made an outrage about it but I've never hidden the fact that I dislike it, nor have I ever said they will burn or anything disrespectful like that, all I've ever simply stated was that I disagreed with it, and that I wouldn't have anything to do with it. Though neither religion is innocent in it's views on homosexuality, homosexuality is a sin in Islam as well.
@dudegrt09 thank you.
Why you can't mention anyone anymore o_O?
"And you're right I don't know a lot about the Muslim religion"
That's very good, then next time, don't try to be too smart and claim things about a religion that you know nothing about because honestly, if you knew how women should be treated according to Islam and if you knew how Islam honored women then you wouldn't make this ridiculous remark. Thank you.
"but what I do know is Christians aren't the ones running around killing innocent people, Islam is not overall a bad religion on it's own, I know quite a few Muslims who aren't a threat to anyone, but when people like this misinterpret it, then people die, lots of good people, some of which I knew, so my view may be a bit biased"
Maybe you need to have a better understanding of the difference between what a religion teaches and what some followers of that religion do. Actually I'm not talking about what the Christians do, I'm talking about what Christianity teaches and in your original post, you were attacking Islam, you weren't attacking those people that you are referring to right now who claim to be Muslims like ISIS and who were founded and are supported by your government to make this propaganda in the Middle East for some political benefits.
If you were talking about ISIS as brutal people who refer to women as nothing more than slaves then believe me I wouldn't even disagree with you for a second, but actually you were talking about Islam, and those are false claims about Islam, but they are true about ISIS and their supporters, but ISIS and what they do, are against Islam and against the teachings of Islam.
"homosexuality is a sin in Islam as well." Yea it's, but my friend, I'm not the one who says that the Islamic teachings are from the past just like how my fellow Christians say the Old Testament is from the past and they are no longer following it. when they want to talk about homosexuality, they will quote from the OT, but when they want to respond to Muslim who pointed out the brutality of the OT, they say we no longer following it and just like did, you said "what we were is not what we are now" and "Not really Christianity has changed quite a bit in the thousands of years that it's been around, a lot of the stuff we used to do" ... Well yeah, you don't do it anymore but the teachings are there, and according to Jesus in the New Testament, you and every single Christian who doesn't follow and practice the Commandments of the Old Testament, he/she is doing something wrong and will be called "the least".
@YazanAA you know, if both of those religions suck so much, then why do you bother following either of them?
@Mesonfielde and I'm not sure how this can be any of your business? Because they only "suck" in your eyes but they don't in my eyes and the eyes of their followers. you think they suck, that's ok, but it's just your opinion which is meaningless to anyone who follows these religions.
In my opinion, lack of religion sucks, your lifestyle sucks, homosexuality sucks, adultery sucks, drinking alcohol sucks and eating pork sucks.
This old argument wasn't about showing that a religion sucks or not, it was about showing that it's better for someone who decides to claim false things about another religion to know what his religion teaches first.
@YazanAA I find it funny how each and every time there is a criticism for Islam, the only argument they ever came up with is that "But in Christianity..."
That doesn't make Islam seem any better. That's called "avoiding responsibility and putting blame on others".
Not mature.
@Mesonfielde not really, what I find funny here is that you are jumping from one thing to the other just to make a point.
You said "it's the only argument they ever came up with" .. that's not true, this argument only comes up when a Christian attacks Islam and in most cases it would be false claims, just like in this argument and the other argument when bubble_tea showed me a video of that Christian who attacks Islam. So when a Christian will start making false claims about Islam, of course I'm gonna say "hold on and read your bible first" I'm not gonna say that for an atheist for example.
The so immature and pathetic thing is to keep on lying and claiming things about something you don't know anything about. Just like you did, how many times did you say that Islam teaches to kill all non-Muslims? Many many times, did I say that Christianity teaches the same? No, I didn't. Instead, I said Islam doesn't teach that and in more than 200 places in the Quran talk about freedom of religion
So called "Alpha males" (i. e. Men who aren't spineless pussies) don't need religion to keep their bitches in check.
Yes. It's not about alphas needing a religion, but it's about Islam offering Alpha males a good scope.
First of all sorry for my bad English. Maryying with four wifes is a very old arap culture. today all muslims marry with one women. i am muslim
Thanks for your opinion :) keep practicing in English. Good luck :)
Lmao no, of course not. It's just the religion of the male chauvinist, nothing more.
Oh okay. Lol.
Being an alpha male doesn't mean marrying countless women. Plus, there is more chances of inbreeding to occur.
Critical hit!
Having multiple wives has a certain appeal, but in reality having multiple wives can leave some guys with out.
Yeah that's why I am against polygamy :/
It isn't really the best option
I think Islam is the religion of (censored, want to keep my head intact, if at all possible).
Most people think that way.
If you need the support of a religion and a culture to make you an alpha male you are not an alpha male. You are a little man in a big suit.
Word.
Most muslims are not that way simply to bang a group of women whenever they want...
Of course. That's obvious and pragmatic fact. And I never said that.
Mormon's no longer practice plural marriage. They haven't for over 150 years.
Thanks for the information :-)
We can't marry more than one woman unless our first wife agrees so it mostly don't happen and what does alpha man means
Thanks a lot for the insight information. Then why do women oppose Sharia law?
Not to offend anyone but Islam isn't for basically logical people.
And what made you say that?
Being offended by that isn't logical either so please don't.
It's just for really old time and needs to be updated
Religion of Alpha males xD If Muslim men are Alpha males then Nordic Pagans are super Alpha beasts.
Yup, I think so.
(All down-voters and the ones who criticize me and your families are cursed in advance.)
Oh thanks for the awareness O_O
hahahaha alpah males who rape and supress their women, treat them like shit
Uhm?
that is not alpha man, women love alpha males, it's very sad that they treat women like objects and have multiple wives.
No. I think it's just a religion...
Okay thanks :)
It's a system of ideology too, and a bunch of rules that define you as a person!
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