For some men who say women never know what they want,... Men these days seem to be guilty of that themselves...
They say they don't want a gold digger, someone using them for their wallet, yet have an issue with an independent woman who works and supports herself 🤔 So which is it 🤷🏼♀️
The real problem is when the man was the sole provider, most thought that meant they had a right to control everything, like a woman was their property...
Think that's the real issue... Because otherwise, why have an issue with a partner that wants to help provide for your future, your household, your family together? 🤔
Worked for me and my hubby for 20 years, but maybe that's because he didn't treat me as lesser than just because I was female, we didn't treat each other as property, more a partnership, hence the term partner...
He didn't have that "Me man (beats on chest) you lowly female that must do my bidding"...
A man that wasn't afraid to cook, or help with the chores...
And funny the people on here that call those men wimps or simps or cucks woulda never had the balls to say that to my hubby's face, cuz before he got sick people were very afraid of him till they got to know him...
That's what makes a man, not someone that wants to control someone else or put down someone else...
And until men stop seeing women as just Available pussy (just read the threads on here) why should women do anything for them... Stop expecting things from people and let them do it out of love and respect... But you have to give respect to get respect...🤷🏼♀️
I don't think a lot of men are honest or self-aware when it comes to this, to be honest. In my opinion, many are intimidated. They just think that saying, "I'm not intimidated, just not attracted" changes that. It doesn't. That's not how psychology works. A lot of men like "less intelligent and more dependent" a lot more than they will admit out loud. And when you think of traditional archetypes of masculinity and socialization, it makes sense. A lot of men value themselves based on ability to protect, provide, and maybe even guide. Dominance. So if you can do it yourself, it threatens their own sense of what they have to offer, or even indicates she is not going to be easy to mold/control. A woman not dependent on relationships for happiness/survival will put up with a lot less than one who is desperate for someone to take care of her. She's often going to be the pickier one too, because happiness isn't just found in a man - she has learned to create it herself. There's also a pretty strong point here about what he offers and brings to the table compared to her and how confident he is in himself with that hand.
In my experience, it's less to do with any ability to do everything on my own (or desire to, rather lolol), and more to do with the different implications of what independence means, specifically intellectually and what I desire. I think being independent changes your "aura" somehow. I think anyone who has spent time focused on developing themselves and focused on accepting and being comfortable with being single or on your own might be able to relate. After you develop that way, people notice it even when you don't. People think that you think you're above them when you live by your own rules and do what you want, if you come across as highly educated or intelligent, if you're comfortable being yourself and living your truth. And some people like it! Yay! It's not even just a gender thing, but it does present a different dynamic there because your friends/associates (unless gay) aren't trying to date you and may benefit from you being the independent one, the leader, the smart one, etc. in ways that might threaten the ego of certain types of men trying to date you.
Having said that, I think a lot of men LOVE independent women. Probably not a majority, but still, many. :) And look, every personality has a down side, or a potentially challenging aspect. I mostly know what mine are and we all should, including men. It's up to whatever crazy nut thinks our challenging traits are worth it or not. Can't be a match for everyone and that's okay!
I think the fact that this is even question speaks for itself, tbh. Think about it. Why would one have a problem with someone ambitious, wanting to live passionately and do what they want on their own terms? Why would anyone have a problem with intelligence, with someone who is an active participant in their own life, working hard for what they want and not just waiting for someone to give it to them? Why would these be negative things just because she's a woman? Why would these things mean she wouldn't be a good partner? Curiouser and curiouser.
It's not even that we are intimidated, but I believe it has to do strongly with roles as men and women. Masculine men want feminine women. Women that are independent through feminist teachings, more power to you, can do what they want, but we ultimately don't want to be with them in the long run.
Women that tend to be like this have high standards and expectations of their partners and will always be searching for better guys who fit their criteria, but they are few and far in between. Now women want guys either on their level or higher than them, but that is difficult because more women have higher education than men these days since we either drop out of college, don't go to college, or decide to go into trades or blue collar work. They don't see men like that as high value or to their standards because they don't make as much as them, even though a lot of them do well for themselves (worked blue collar since I got out of college). These women are more masculine than anything and are living like how men do, and that is not attractive in the long run. These are the women you want as friends or business partners.
Men want women that are feminine, submissive and let them make the decisions and lead. They don't want a woman who is masculine, stubborn and in your face all the time with the "we are doing it my way" deal. We might as well just marry and date another dude at the end of the day. I already know this answer is going to get a fair amount of hate, but I know there are many that agree with what I said.
I believe it depends. You can't use "strong, independent woman" to encompass all women that can take care of themselves, know what they want, and can pursue their own happiness without depending on others for it.
The problem when it comes to relationships is that some of these women (actually, many men as well) fail to remember that a partner is not another person to compete against, one-up, or assert dominance over. You are a team and are equals. Independence can exist without arrogance.
Some fail to realize that a relationship is about shifting priorities and mutual happiness. When a partner is far too keen on independence, it communicates that you will never be a priority to them, and their happiness is more important than yours (which in turn implies that compromise and consideration will be sorely lacking in the relationship). This inevitably turns the relationship into a competition, which I think is unhealthy. Not many guys would want to be in such an arrangement. And I doubt that many women are okay with it either (unless they are perhaps "winning")
Not all independent women are like this. But the ones that are have encouraged the stereotype that this is what an independent woman is like. A guy like me wants an "us against the world" relationship, not to play a mere supporting role, or that of a "simp".
Opinion
115Opinion
It doesn't really matter the state of the world.
Some men will complain about how dependent women are. Some will complain about how independent they are.
We need each other. Some of us like each other, and we interact not out of necessity, but because we offer and give things to each other, from a place of graciousness. And because it's simply fun.
The answer is finding a balance between giving and taking, needing each other but not being entirely dependent. Doesn't seem so difficult to me.
Don't mind me, I'm just here to roll my eyes and silently judge people-
I already know what most men are going to say so I'm keeping my mouth shut... for now at least.
I appreciate women who have your standard confidence and independence, who can think for themselves and know how to get a job, make life decisions, etc. But I'm not into your 'basic bitch' types whose self-worth and existence is built entirely on their college degree, money, and career.
And honestly, why would I want a woman who is so big on being independent and needing to declare it? Does she want me to know that or does she want herself to know it? Why would I want a woman who sees me as something she doesn't have to have but can if she wants? Am I like a hundred dollar dress she sees in a window that she doesn't need but can get it because she wants to?
Relationships are about two people seeing each other as important for their lives, and that your existence matters to each other. But as it stands, for independent women, men aren't something they "need," men are just play things that we should be honored we can even be with such women.
Though being independent is absolutely important and has been a key factor in my own marital bliss, there is a such thing as overdoing it. I’ve had male clients tell me that when a woman wants him to do nothing for her because she can do it all, he doesn’t know where to fit in or what to offer than she can’t just obtain herself. They struggle to keep up. In reality, men want to work to please a woman they love. They need to know how they qualify and bring value to her. Ladies, don’t be afraid to sit back and let him do some of the legwork. Let him show you what he’s made of. He wants to.
What should they be scared for?
Next to being able to cook, clean and make babies we probably work as well.
We have more hobbies, interests and more goals in life.
The only thing is that we have more opinions, stronger opinions and are less scared to make those known.
We are the old house wifes but with a little more spice I guess.
The idea of an independent woman is great actually. However, it's often that those who scream this out, or feel the need to portray it are often the ones who are toxic, have an inflated ego, have unrealistic expectations etc.
My girlfriend is independent from me financially and lifestyle wise. She does her things and I do mine. I help her out with things and she helps me out whenever I need help. We work as a team. The only difference is that she recognizes me as the leader in our relationship. And she wouldn't want it any other way (like most women). Does that mean she is my "slave" like some snowflakes here think? Of course not.
So, it you have to be careful with thinking men don't like independent women. From what I have seen it's not the independence that bothers men, it's the attitude and inflated ego is what's turning men off.
When I’m getting to know a guy, I would really really want him to tell me whether he likes independence and intelligence in women. I really would love to know asap.
This is because I need to know if I should run for my life and stop wasting my time with a sexist douche. ❤️
Have you ever met one of those women? I doubt It's fear that's putting men off, it's the fact they're obnoxious bitches.
Do the "I can do everything" women even exist? Or is that just an illusion made by the media? I wonder.
All I know is that I've seen many successful people and almost none of them had such attitude. Maybe men don't like to date immature adults who think they can have it all. It's just a guess, of course.
Lol. These are not men, these are little boys who can't stand normal women who dont want to be slaves. I am disgusted of these boys who want second mums aka slaves as partner's. If you are scared of non submissive women aka of women who dont want you be your slave, then you need therapy. These hypocritical bastards are also the same idiots who call submissive men simps. Lol they want women to be submissive slaves but also call women feminiazis for prefering submissive men.
No one wants to date someone who makes it clear that their partner isn't needed in their life. For example, my boyfriend and I make about the same yearly. Depending on his over time, he makes a bit more, and I have a degree and he doesn't. Financially, we don't need one another. However, we are very emotional and need that support from one another. We've cried and vented to each other, confided in one another, and confessed things that we never felt comfortable saying to previous partners. The attitude mentioned in that photo, whether it comes from male or female, is what drives people away.
Why are men scared? I get a super crush on girls when I find out not only is she beautiful, but she’s smart as hell and has a decent job like a nurse or some other college degree type job. And when we have conversations she actually knows what I’m talking about and we can talk about interesting shit like philosophy science and really any topic.
She makes her own money and I don’t have to buy her nothin! Good lol. Thank god. She can buy me stuff instead!
And I’ll reward her with good fucking. Besides it’s not that hard to please a woman. Stuff her full of food, and stuff her full of dick, and you got a happy woman in my opinion.
But the thing is, is such attitudes are laughable. And ignorant / arrogant on the woman. Just as how it is ignorant & arrogant of a man to think the same.
The average woman as example has no clue about cars or home renovations/maintenance tasks. Unless, like myself, they grew up in a family where male relatives taught them (my father was into buying/flipping houses so I'm very adept with tools/renos & my cousins were into cars so I am quite good, been better than my brother, with cars).
A relationship is a partnership. If someone is too immature to realise that then they should spare the world & date themselves.
Not at all!! Why would you need to ask that, unless a lot of men were scared? But WHY?
Are those guys afraid of her, THINKING, and having her own feelings, and things she likes, and, wait, OMG, maybe thinking HE would care?
I love those women that are confident, and are being who they are, and I love the time with them, and sharing things, together! Why can't she just say she wants to eat at this place, or suggest that we go, wherever, and be together, and share the experience, be it walking on a beach, or Hiking in a forest?
I love the women that KNOW they are at least my equals, and they tell me where they want to eat, and even, sometimes pay!!
It's an interesting new world, and I can't wait to see how it unfolds when more and more accept that they are at least EQUALS!! :)
No. A strong man has no problem dating a strong woman. That comes with a caveat, however. A man has no problem dating a NATURALLY strong woman. A weak woman who tries to act strong will compensate in many ways that come off as incredibly vapid and annoying. It's like saying, would I want to date a tomboy, or a pickmeisha? One is naturally independent, the other puts up a facade that is easily seen through. The same can be said for men. Naturally strong men are attractive, but men who are envious and try to appear strong come off as assholes. Overall, It's best to stay in your lane and accept where you grew into on the dominance hierarchy.
Okay, I didn't watch the video.
My view is that if they are scared, they are probably scared to even approach most women.
In other cases they probably don't have the tools to navigate and find out what she is looking for. A woman who is independent or has a lot of responsibility (like a CEO) wants to know the guy can measure up, keep up, and handle the demands of her life.
As more women move into these roles guys are going to have to adapt. They are going to need to figure out the "new filtering" women are going to be using to find someone suitable for them.
I don't think the guys are scared (the remaining ones) they just don't have the tools or knowledge to show they can handle an independent woman. The result is they even try.
Option C: There's a difference between being "scared" of someone and highly disinterested. If a woman wants to try to be a sh*tty, pseudo-"Alpha Male," because she's insecure and feminism is making her even more insecure in an endless feedback loop, then she certainly doesn't need any man to be with, let alone would ever complain about it, right? So, what's the problem?
(oh right; it's *you.*)
https://www.thesun.co.uk/tvandshowbiz/9155473/charlize-theron-shockingly-available-needs-a-man/
(comments:) > "Imagine if some guy had an article written for him, and demanded women step up and date him. She demands it. She's asking like an entitled snob who feels denied something they feel they are owed."
If you can do everything yourself, then what do you need a guy, or even a girl, for, since you seem too be doing fine on your own.
How I was raised, by a feminist mother, a person who believes in equality, not isolationism or volcanism, being capable of doing something doesn't mean that you necessarily have to do everything and if you insist on doing so then you are fine by yourself.
Some people appreciate help even feel absolutely needed to get something done simply because it makes it easier and for companionship.
If a woman can do for herself I have no issues with it.
To me it means that she was raised without gender roles, although some things can still be considered more emotionally sensitive or more masculine.
If a woman could do things for herself, frankly it'd be a turn on.
We would both be able to do whatever we wanted to do within reason of the guidelines to our set relationship.
One thing I have been against and I make sure to follow through with myself.
If I am in a relationship with someone (Primarily towards the beginning before I get to know friends and things) I will not hang out one on one with the opposite sex.
It helps to build trust first.
These women are only “independent” because they live in an advanced digitized society that negates gender differences. If there was ever a serious break down in civilization things would go back to what they used to be.
Not to say the female gains in the workplace is a bad thing. It’s a really good thing. But this feminist attitude that “us women rose up and made it all on our own” is disillusioned self serving bs.
There are two main reasons women have succeeded: sympathetic men who supported feminism and a modern society that requires less physical manual labor. But even the foundations of the internet was developed by men. Women are just succeeding on platforms that were invented and developed by men.
I don’t hate women and I really want a real equal society. But there “modern” feminists are just going off on conceited hate. They have issues that have absolutely nothing to do with “patriarchy” but they just want the cop out of blaming someone else.
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