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Women don't tend to work well together when it's a predominantly all female workforce.
A good example of this would be the article catfights over handbags and tears in the toilet. Which I suggest you check out.
On top of that women have 33% less skeletal muscle on their bodies then men do and have far less upper body strength then we do. And anyone who's been a manual laborer knows how important it is to have a strong upper body and strong body in general.
It's also quite physically dangerous and the elements play a major part in the exhaustion of it as well not everyone is built to work in extreme cold and heat.
We also handle stress differently as a user below already stated women tend to talk it out while men tend to act it out I can agree with this as when I get stressed out I take it out on the work and work harder so do my coworkers who are all men
That kind of work is fast paced, dirty, heavy and dangerous you often times find yourself in cramped and uncomfortable positions and it's not only the work itself you have to watch out for but the elements as well.
There's a reason why we don't see women doing manual labor often or at all and it's because they either can't do it or won't do it because they don't want to.
I am a manual laborer and I know most women couldn't do my job because I've seen guys built like tanks who couldn't do it because it's just that tiring and exhausting between the work and the elements it kills your body. There is not a single day in 3 years I've come home from work where my body wasn't killing me and I wasn't covered in sweat, dust and dirt or occasionally blood from accidents.
Now I'm not gonna say that there aren't women who couldn't succeed or even thrive doing that kind of stuff because I have seen farm girls who work the fields and it's hard work but they are few and far between and more of an exception and not the rule.
And most women that you do see doing that kind of labor or working in those kinds of environments grew up doing that kind of work and in that kind of environment such as working on farms and such as kids and stuck with it as they got older which is why they can do it.
Hell, to anyone who thinks women can't do the job... You ain't met the right bunch of women yet. My mother worked construction, and I ain't talking lite trim and paint work... I mean the heavy stuff. Framing, Roofing, Floor Joist Repair, Big Heavy Beams, Sheet Rock, Tile work, interior, exterior, everything... She could swing a sledge, work a hammer drill, and had no problems with a full size nail gun or whatever kind of saw you can imagine... Believe me. Think she's unique? Guess again, I got a buddy who is one of the toughest, meanest SOB's I've ever had the pleasure of calling a friend, his wife works construction and can out work any three of the other guys on her crew every day of the week. Hell, she fell off a roof once, landed on a running table saw and not only survived but gave birth to their happy healthy son 8 months later and went back to work.
All that said, to answer your question... as someone who has worked construction myself, I'd gladly welcome more women on the job. I think overall not much would change but that's okay too.
"Furthermore, please show some class and refrain from cheap shots such as "women are weaker and slower than men", focus on other topics, for instance teamwork, mental health, objectifying men and communication."
Why should anyone do that though? Don't you want everyone's honest opinions here? In my view, teamwork is grossly over-rated, because what you wind up with is a situation where one or two members of the team do all of the work while the others just slack off and don't do anything. Admittedly, I've never worked on a construction site, but everywhere else I've worked (and at university as well), whenever "teamwork" was involved I would find myself wanting to just get the job done but couldn't, because the other team-members just didn't care.
Well who's to say but if it were anything like in an office there would be a whole bunch of snarky power tripping and fault finding texts shooting around the jobsite all day.
Sabotage between the trades over petty crap like tone.
The forewoman targeting one employee and gathering a bunch of persnickety dirt on her to get her kicked off the job.
Meetings about one woman being to harsh with another about how she framed a job causing her to cry and the subsquent sensitivity training.
Then of course the celebratory pub night once the job is done. It would be kinda cool.
Hmm, you've raise some interesting and feasible scenarios here. The pub night is new to me, never thought of that. I was imagining a group of drunk female construction workers shamelessly objectifying some male nurses at the same pub, making some feel uncomfortable like myself 😄
Opinion
51Opinion
So this topic focuses on just the construction industry. But I can share my experience working in a production steel pipe mill for over 10 years. To elaborate what goes on in there, there's grinding, welding, operators, maintenance, crane, forklift, plasma cutting, and much more.
All women in there EXCEPT 2 either got themselves fired, quit very early, involved in a messy drama situation with human resources stepping in, big complainers, attendance issues, or showing up late often. Supervisors would even assign women the easiest jobs in the mill just pushing buttons at a control panel.
Everyone is different and finding good workers man or woman isn't easy to find. There were a lot of bad workers in that pipe mill both men and women. It was unlucky that almost all the women hired through there weren't good.
The 2 women that were excellent workers, one was the plant manager, other was high up on the quality side doing ultra sonic.
My opinion to the question from my experience in the working world is if a construction site has majority women and it has good workers overall, then I see the site doing just fine. If there's majority of bad workers then lol it would be quite the opposite.
As for the upper body strength differences between men and women for particular physically demanding jobs. I see no issue if she's willing to work hard and eventually gain some muscle overtime to be able to handle the job easier and get used to it doing it daily. Which is true for everyone.
I am a civil engineer.
I had a front row seat to see how women work on this field. Unlike most people here.
Literally all of them were great professionals! Do you have any idea what takes to be a woman giving orders to construction workers? Literally all the cliches about them are true and even we men have a hard time dealing with them sometimes.
So every single of them is super assertive and knows a LOT about what they are doing. Probably because they knew they had to be taken seriously.
I had already 2 bosses who said they would never hire woman. And funny thing is the ones I met working as engineers where some of the best on the field I have ever seen.
I never seem a woman working as a constructor. But make no mistake I give you no guarantee they would be worse then men. Do you know how many times I have to ye at my worker because they are being basically scratching their balls all day and nothing more?
This is why when I see people making assumptions about how bad and petty it would be, it drives me crazy. Especially in male dominated jobs, the women who get into those fields REALLY want to be there. Like you said, in most cases they have to work twice as hard to be taken seriously and even harder than that to lead men in those kinds of industries.
Think of the women who are taking on coaching roles in professional men's sports. We don't hear anyone within the team saying that these women are acting petty. They go in an earn respect for how much they know and how hard they work honing their craft.
For women to come in and say negative things about these women is frankly just sad and pathetic. Have more respect for yourselves and other women. If you are going to be petty then just admit you will be that type. Don't carry your laziness over to those who can actually do the job well and not be these stereotypes others try to place on us.
That's the point. These other posts are making it out to be that the women are going to be overly sensitive type that there to build more drama than buildings. Women who go into those kinds of fields know mostly what they are getting in to.
As for the guys out there saying "men built all the things we had to do"... yeah no sh*t. We didn't exactly have a lot of options back then did we? Now women are getting into these field and taking their rightful place to do the same kind of work as men. The same men who lament how hard their jobs are and how they get paid more because they take these kinds of jobs and women don't. We step in and start doing that work too and these men give women sh*t for it.
Make up your minds, guys. Either stop whining about how hard it is and how women have easy work or stop whining when we show up and show we can.
I get what you are saying, but I am actually more upset that other women would get in on this. I expect it from some of the guys around here and also let's not pretend those women don't have feelings just like we can't pretend guys don't. Those suicide rates are high for a reason. People have emotions so yeah while they can give it back, it doesn't mean it may not bother them.
Thank god, a fellow civil engineer, now I can have a proper discuss.
As you would guess, I agree with everything said by @This_Is_My_Opinion8 and subsequent repliers so far. In my experience, in consultancy side of the construction industry, women tend to perform better than men from university to their job as consultants and any site supervision work they do to supplement their application to the institute of civil engineer, chartership.
Women perform better, not because women are better than men, but because they have more to prove. Most women in our field, work hard and stay professional because they have to usually juggle a family and job whilst fighting the stereotypes against them.
To take it a level further in speculation and theorising, I was part of the Women's society at my firm, odd I know yes, one thing we speculated was that if the construction industry was 50% women, then they may not behave in such an assertive way with a stiff upper lip.
In my little team in flooding and water catchment management (civils) was a senior female engineer (Laura) who had worked with male junior engineers her whole life, she shared her account with working with the first female junior engineer (Ceri). Her tone and approach became softer and kinder and I had never seen Laura like this. Laura has 3 mischievous sons, and she often said she speaks to us the way she speaks to them, but I was so happy for her to have an opportunity to work with another female who didn't undermine her based on her gender and for being a mother of 3.
@Ez-Bri-Z I second your opinions, females in the construction industry were more put off with other women's close minded opinions than men. I think it's expected of some men, but they felt that women doing it was worse, like they are holding back their own gender, being unfeminist or something, when they should be encouraging women who want to go into the construction industry to persue their desired career path.
Another point that the female engineers raised to me is that they cannot do it alone. As the construction industry is a male dominated fields, the women need the men to help break the stereotypes and assist girls aged 7 and up who wish to persue a career in this field. Not because women need men, but because there lots of us and only a few of them. And many men want more gender equality in our industry but don't know how to help.
I personally teach STEM and engineering to 6-7 year old girls in a primary school, a few girls were blown away when I said I'll be bringing a female engineer and my mentee showed up in officewear. They felt they have a new role model and Bob the builder had led them to believe that all engineers are lads in PPE.
You, and your gender are welcome. A 7 year old girl named Pheobe asked me after my final lesson of the year, whether she can do an internship at my engineering company in 10 years, while her best friend, Emily, couldn't stop picking her nose. I was stunned by the maturity of Pheobe and the constrast between the two. Some young girl are into science, technology engineering and maths, but are deterred by our close minded society. When I am 35, if I see her as an intern in my company, I will most likely cry out of joy and pride 🥲
@ez-bri-z and @Ronald_25 one of the women I met was in charge of the safety protocol in a public site. It was her last week on the job since I kid you not she was pregnant. She gave her instructions, wrote the PSS (basically the big safety, health and hygine document for that work). Contruction workers chose to ignore every single one of her indications.
I was not the main engineer of that work, it was a colleague of mine. I just went there to see how things were going and she was there.
She arrived, saw everyone doing whatever they wanted. I could see in her face things were about to get heated. She stopped everyone's work, gather them all on the ground floor and asked them all if they even knew what the PSS was.
They began to joke about it.
She insisted they had to take the proper safety measures.
They said they did it like that for years and there was no need to be so careful. They didn't knew why they had to do it.
"WHEN YOU DON'T KNOW WHY YOU HAVE TO DO SOMETHING YOU DO IT BECAUSE YOU WERE COMMANDED TO DO SO! IF I HAVE TO REPEAT THIS AGAIN I WILL CLOSE THIS SITE FOR NOT MEETING THE PROPER SAFETY REQUIREMENTS!"
She yelled louder than them all. Silence after. They all did what what she wanted religiously after that.
@Ez-Bri-Z I was a fellow nose picker at that age so I shouldn't discount her so soon, t'was a few years later that the engineer shone through.
I think I'm a feminist because if my safety instructions was coming from a pregnant lady I'd take her far more seriously and more respectul than a guy with his ass crack hanging out 🤷🏽♂️
A lot less work would get done because females don't have as much upper body strength.
@Ronald_25 "Most on site work is now automated"
Saying this over and over doesn't make it true - and it's absolutely NOT true. Design/engineering is typically 2% or less of all construction hours. Skilled labor is over 90% of it, and that means REAL work by tradesmen - concrete work, framing, roofing, plumbing, electrical, finish carpentry, flooring, low voltage, sheetrockers, and painters. And in the 3 states I've worked in, there is nearly zero female participation in these trades.
My grandparents have a farm where they grow hay and alfalfa. My uncle and aunt also raise cattle on the farm as well. In a lot that has left me more open minded. To the men are not as superior to women as we a taught to think. Because both my grandmother and aunt have near had any real issues keeping with my grandfather and uncle when it comes to the physically intensive jobs on the farm. If it was not for my grandmother and aunts help for the years a lot of jobs would have taken a lot longer or never been finished at all.
Of course when it comes to loading a entire load of hay bales for a customer it's going to come down the the individual. I can see some women Not being up to loading hay bales for customers. I can a lot of the "men are superior" guys bitching after loading 10 bales and bitching about it being too hard. When my grandmother and grandfather are still going.
Of course there will be those who call me sexist but, I’m being realistic here. I love the ladies and all but, when it comes to heavy lifting and dangerous construction; that’s something you typically leave to guys who would be more likely to handle those sort of things and that’s just for everyone’s safety and how to get better and faster results.
However, things like planning, critiquing, and handling smaller objects (that are maybe even meticulous) would work out a lot better. Men and women can both handle things like those and can work together for those things but, dangerous things like you’ve mentioned are better off in the hands of men.
Physically and psychologically speaking men and women are different (which is what can make for great compatibility for certain situations) and have their strong suits and this particular one tends to lean into what guys can do better but, there are definitely women that can contribute to this field greatly as well.
It would all come crashing down. As a case in point, look at the bridge that was designed by 6 latinas who were so incompetent they don't understand basic structural engineering equations. Ultimately they are so incompetent, 6 people died and 9 were severely maimed. You know missing arms, faces sheered off, just minor inconveniences. And as a last point, the latinas who designed the bridge based it on their feelings, not on 2500 years worth of equations and established science. Or the fact that they felt re-enforced concrete wasn't necessary because it didn't feel good, rather than using re-enforced concrete. So to your question, that is what construction would look like if women were in charge.
For one thing the quality would be better because we have more attention to detail and tend to take more pride in perfecting the things we do.
@Ukrainianbuddafly You have no idea how thinking like that fucks a lot of things up, costs a fuckload of money, and sinks companies like nothing else.
I would be interested in knowing which woman downvoted this Ukrainian Chokri. @Ryfyle you need to calm down mate, the budda fly's benefits is circumstantial, if the project requires high quality stonework and detailing then attention to detail may not be a bad thing. Also, attention to detail is required for all things safety and quality related. If I met a woman like this on my site, I'd make her the foreman.
From experience based on women on and off the construction site, one job they do very well is ensuring men don't get themselves killed due to lack of health and safety. Also they can be very strict when dealing with women in the workplace and some men may behave in a soft and more lenient way if attractive female colleagues doss about or flaunt the rules.
The planning and engineering parts, the heavy equipment operators, the non “heavy manual labor positions could run fine.
Heavy manual labor, especially upper body strength demands, are better suited disproportionately to men. Not all men, but disproportionately so. It’s just the facts. It can’t be argued. My own mother worked such a position and while she a great deal more built than some men are and many women, she suffered far more joint damage from the abuses of the job than my Father, a well built man
If women were in charge, there would be a LOT more attention to small details. In addition, meetings would involve honest discussion, rather than a group of guys getting together who had already made up their minds on what they were going to do.
Women are much more detail oriented, which is why I prefer having a female doctor.
It would be pretty non existent.
All of the houses, buildings, roads, super structures, rocket engines, space craft/rockets, cars, engines, tractors, aircraft, trains, ships, welders, pipe fitters... etc. have pretty much been done by men.
The vast majority of women don't have any interest in that stuff at all.
If the world had been dependent on women throughout history to build all the houses, structures, sky scrapers, roads to think up and create internal combustion engines and vehicles, machines to power the industrial revolution, build all the roads and bridges, invent the airplane and jet engines... etc., we'd probably still be waiting for a lot of that.
I only partially agree with you, in the sense that your opinion I correct for only a few countries in the developed world. Countries like Lativa, with 1/3 of the country's workforce in engineering being female, it's a question of time and breaking stereotypes for young women. Opinion like yours, though factual is some parts, keeps the stigma and imbalance in gender amoung engineers.
Engineers do that math.
That math exists because of male mathematicians.
Men are still the one physically building what an engineer draws up.
Not true anymore, the construction industry has minimised manual labour due to operated machinery and automation, we are experiencing and influx of women due to the rise in STEM outreach programs and women in engineering societies. It'll take time, but we'll get there as I've already experienced good progress. I am currently mentoring two civil engineers at my job, two of which are female.
Engineering is not construction, engineering is a clip board and a slide rule, construction is pouring concrete, maneuvering I beams, welding, torching, hot, dangerous sweaty work. In order to accommodate women’s needs in order to place them in these jobs, construction costs will increase 400%
I've worked on construction sites regularly for 2 decades. I've only ever encountered one woman on the job (doing physical construction) and she was more of a gopher for the boss. While there is certainly machinery, there's still thousands or tens of thousands of manual labor hours in nearly and construction project, and it's all done by men.
Statistically speaking? Considerablly less efficient. Women take more days off, more sick days, work fewer hours, and are physically weaker then men as well as being in general less inclined towards that kind of work. Obviously any woman who does this job and does it well is fine, but they are the exception not the rule.
I have zero experience of construction but I have of Aviation, Electronics, Software etc and there are a large number of women working in those areas.
There are really good and add to the overall team.
Even in metal fabrication etc, I’ve noticed a rise in women working there.
Also I seem to remember both the UK and the US had a huge female workforce for WW2, building aircraft, ships etc.
They would give up and go home after 30 minutes rather than working 10-12 hour days. They would take a lot of days off. Most women don’t stick at hard labor unless a man is there saying keep going, we have to get the job done. So if a house normally takes 3 months to build it would take women six years to get it done and that’s before they even got to arguing over how to decorate it... The client might be dead before the house is ready to live in.
Nothing would get done cause women in general dont want to do construction. I'm an electrician, I've seen a handful of female electricians but only. on big jobs most places I go there are none, no one is stopping them from doing this work but themselves, so based on the fact that they could be construction workers if they chose to but many dont they would find any excuse to avoid work.
Women are physically incapable of doing the heavy, dirty and dangerous work that is involved in construction.
Most women are also not interested in doing that type of work.
When they try, this is how well it works:
https://iotwreport.com/female-led-construction-company-was-responsible-for-deadly-florida-bridge-collapse/
''Here'' (Thailand) this isn't too uncommon.
We have a number of girls working in our boat yard, too. They work just fine - fully accepted as part of the team and performing no different from men.
In previous and similar arrangements -in Europe- I saw the same; but it is spread less widely.
I think, the MAIN difference are the breakfast and lunch breaks. Men are less ''noisy'' there :D
The primary reason why men dominate this field is because of how physically dangerous it is. Im not saying women can't be put into dangerous situations, I am saying biologically men are more disposable. So for more women to be involved safety becomes a more important factor. So if it was female dominated I think our construction techniques would change significantly, less reliance on brute force and more concern over employee safety. The get it done factor just goes away.
Another factor is how men and women handle stress. Women have a tendency to talk about emotional distress while men have a tendency to act it out. It's important because when guys get stressed they have a tendency to work harder while women have a tendency to stop working and address it verbally. (This is the result of brain wiring not socialization) So when things go wrong construction would cease altogether. Neither of these are necessarily bad safety and stopping when things go wrong actually have some advantages. But it would certainly be different.
I'll have to consult my older daughter. She has a Masters in Architectural Engineering, was a LEED certified instructor, had her thesis published, and has published under her own label recently. Knowing her planning capabilities, (COVID notwithstanding) at least she would "bring the project in" on schedule!
Most likely not that much difference.
A lot of ideological gender beliefs gonna fly on this.
Even superiority complex beliefs.
When it comes to it humans have a way to adapt and a lot of thing's are intelligent created to fit someone's agenda.
On average, there would be far more talking and discussing going on.
There would be longer cues at the dixietoilet 😁
Possibly they'd work smarter with more machinery and technical efficiency.
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I used to sell equipment and uniforms for police and fire departments. This was when female police officers was becoming a thing. It was hard for the first of them but it became more mainstream. Maybe the same could happen in construction.
In our era, when machines have replaced physical strength in a great degree, women can be as efficient workers as men.
None of the heavy lifting would get done unless the entire operation was mechanically assisted. Women do NOT have the upper body strength to handle the repetitive lifting.
Some bum ass company will make a bunch of pink tools
They already have.
@Massageman and grown ass macho men buy them thinking that'll keep other macho guys they work with from stealing them... only to find that half the macho dudes on the job have the same set of pretty pink tools and they sure as hell walk away just as fast as any other color. lol
@Ronald_25 yesss ahahaha
There would be more vanity mirrors, such as you might find in a mercedes and the badges on the back indicating the vehicle was fuel injected e. g. 206 GTi would have heart shapes in place of dots for the 'i'.
Them. coming in as the guy would be great cause everytime there's a new female in a warehouse every dude and even the bosses are all over her but when your that dude it should be the other way around lol
"Focus on other topics, for instance teamwork, mental health, objectifying men and communication"
Seems much less like a question attempting to uncover truth and more like propagandistic promotion of an agenda. . .
The collective IQ of all construction workers would raise about 50 points.
Sadly, there's some truth to it. But you find the same situation in certain branches of military, or in the music industry (as just two examples).
The construction industry might not be too different but the overall society would probably collapse.
Nothing would ever get done. All work would be spontaneous and then remain unfinished for several weeks
Production would decrease by about 35-60 percent. Men have 30% more muscle than women. Men and women are different, its not sexist
True, men have more upper body strength and true, saying men and women are different is not sexist. You have considered maybe 5-10% of the implication of females in the construction industry. As a civil engineer, and as it stands you lack the reasoning to say 35-60%. Apart from muscle, why else would production decrease to this degree?
So I must wonder why on most site of male-only crews they set up a crane and use machinery? :)
Most infrastructure jobs are held by men about 85%. To even train the women production has to slow down. there's not enough of them working industrially so the women that are teachers and nurses will have to be trained
Oh well - no matter who it is: ANY (new) worker needs to be trained up. If you -here- think of ''replacing'' men you might be right. But otherwise I can't see how a woman operating a -say- tower crane or excavator is inferiour.
Nothing would get done. They would screw around and either gossip or be at each others' throats. Have you ever seen an all-female workplace?
Yeah, even less shit would get done. That may seem impossible, but I assure you that it is
Progress would slow to a halt. Prices would be unaffordable because demand would far far far far outstrip production. Women are unable to do these jobs productively
I work in construction and there are many females involved but everyone is treated as an equal
Everything would be very colorful but completely falling apart lol.
I don't know how could someone answer that with certainty, it's not.
Any speculation would be based on my perspective on women, not based in any statistics or facts.
I'm sure the field has something to gain from more women in the industry.
Mahalo
There would be far more accidents, and things would not be built correctly.
well gee... nothing would ever get built for one =p
It wouldn't exist.. Most women don't want that kind of work it requires strength, precision, and getting dirty,..
Down vote me all you like. It's true.. Most women I have talked to when offered a construction job, or being unemployed choose the latter. Plus most women couldn't handle the long hours involved. Look at the national averages of women working. Average construction worker works 50 to 60 hours per week.. The average woman is willing to work 30 to 36.. It's rare to find a woman that wants to put the hours in.
It wouldn't last a week.
It would cease to exist.
Would be a lot less effective lol
Nothing much would get done.
I think women would be hotter and more miserable.
Everything would be pink I guess
No work would get done
We would be at least 75 years behind.
we'd still be living in caves and pitching tents
Things would take longer and cost more
Just people bitching and not getting work done
We’d probably have a lot of building collapses
Things would b shorter?
Shit
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