Go Fish: Do guys "fish" to see if their close female friends are interested even if the gal only sees him as an elder brotherly figure, nothing more?

[DishLady]

For as long as I've known my older friend, he's been with a revolving door of crazy little chippies -- very dramatic, very loud, blah blah blah... the whole nightmare.

The last woman was always coming to work and yelling at him. ALWAYS. It made him look very unprofessional in front of his team and clients, though he would stay very chill and composed the entire time, talking to her gently, etc. The rest of us did our best to just avert our eyes.

Yesterday he sinks into the chair beside me looking relaxed for the first time all year.

"You're single." I said -- it wasn't a question. The relief was clear on his face. (MIND YOU, he'll have a new chippy on his arm by next week.)

"Yes. How do you know?"

"Well first, welcome. Next, you just look happy. Last week you looked like Prometheus."

He laughed. We were talking a little -- or rather, he was venting. I told him it was her loss bc he's a great guy. "You don't like her." he said.

I grimaced. "Of course not. She made you look bad."

"She wasn't a fan of yours either."

I shrugged, I don't give a flying f what a lunatic thinks. "Why? I never said or did anything to her."

"She was jealous of you." he answered, with the intense eyes.

I knew that look. It's the look of a guy fishing... I laughed and gave him a firm nudge in the opposite direction bc he's one of my oldest friends and was being an idiot.

The tension faded as we ordered our food. Everything was right with the world once again... and by the end of the night he spotted a new gal and flirted with her (with my blessing).

So now I ask you bc I'm not one to cheat on a guy If I'm with someone and I'm certainly no chippy/home-wrecker type who enables cheating:

(1) Is there some signal a girl should be aware of even around close guy friends? This guy has never been more than an elder brother to me; while there's love and respect between us, I'd never want more from him, and I know that logically nor would he.

(2) So why would a guy "fish" like that?

[HawkPerception]

Hmm... depends on the same factors as when I judge someone on whether they're compatible with me or not. Otherwise, no I wouldn't "fish". It also depends on whether they're single or not. I'm no homewrecker. I'd hate myself if I ever did that.

Once a long time ago (about 12 years ago) before my female friend knew me well, I did think I kind of liked her. She was adventurous, outgoing, and friendly... all traits I'd like in a partner. I told her friend in high school I wanted to ask her out and asked her opinion of whether it would be a good idea or not. Her friend told me she it was cute, but she was in a complicated relationship. So I left it at that. Never brought it up. And down the years of getting to know her more, we both had relationships with others and the more I chilled with her, the more I realized that we weren't compatible. Although she was adventurous, outgoing, and friendly as I mentioned, she had very different views from myself, and I felt she was a little airheaded at times (although I have to give her this... she's definitely more successful than I am, so I gotta give her credit for that. She clearly is better in some categories than I am). I'm happy to say we've come this far in our lives being friends and I'm going to her wedding next month. I only wish her happiness.

But from my experiences, as with almost every scenario in life, it depends on the person. There are some guy that will fish and some that won't. It also depends on the female friend they're thinking about.

[DishLady]

See, this is closest to how I think of my guy friends. I mean, why mention anything after 20 years. We both know it wouldn’t work between us…. And I don’t become friends with ulterior motivations… 🤷🏻‍♀️

[HawkPerception]

Don't get me wrong. 20 years of friendship CAN turn into something. You can realize you like and see that you would be highly compatible with them more and more but never had the chance to convey that because they were always in a relationship and didn't see them often enough to meet them during the times they weren't. It just wasn't the case in my scenario.

Did your guy friend confess to you or something?

[DishLady]

He didn’t say HE likes me that way, he said his ex was jealous about us and joked about us being a couple. But I know I’m not his type and also he stays 6mo-12mo with a girl then something happens and he’s always single gain for maybe a week before he has a new girl… I don’t think he seriously thought of me “that way” until he was joking this week.

[HawkPerception]

I do think that guys and girls can be friends, but I think there's always a CHANCE it could develop into something more. If you're physically attracted to one another and compatible, what would be stopping you from liking each other like that really? Just the timing?

I honestly don't think you should distance yourself from the guy. That would make him feel terrible and feel regret for even bringing it up as a joke. Just make things clear... about your feelings (that you don't feel like that if you don't) and where he's at with his current relationship. And mention that you weren't sure whether you had to address anything based on his joke, but you did feel the need to nip it in the bud in case he was implying anything.

I know you're an intelligent girl though and you can handle the situation just fine on your own. Just giving my 2 cents.

[MrOracle]

Men who are single or "actively dating" (meaning they are constantly with someone new) don't HAVE close female friends (with only RARE exceptions). Instead, they have women they haven't slept with yet but still see a possibility.

Unlike women, men do not have a "just friends" category. We divide (single or otherwise available) women into 3 groups:

5% are women he is interested in a relationship with.

45% are women he wants to bang.

50% are women he has no interest in at all, for whatever reason.

Note that you won't find a "friends" category on this list.

A man can have female acquaintances - casual female friends that he sees sometimes and is friendly with, but that's not a FRIEND - a friend is a person you spend time with alone on a regular/frequent basis by choice. Guys don't do that, even if they don't realize it. Our biology just doesn't allow it.

A man who is already in a happy and healthy relationship can have female friends, but even they usually don't because it would usually be a problem for the girlfriend/wife.

[DishLady]

Ok, but my friend and I do spend time alone... as friends... weekly. There's never been any sign of the 5% or 45% (that I know of) and he's at least interested enough in my welfare to text, support my little social events and sit with me as just friends to chat about parenting stuff, personal stuff... so much. So where did this weird comment of his come from? I felt put on the spot, as though he was expecting me to lean into the comment or something that I wasn't feeling. Honestly, he's such a great guy I feel sort of bad for perhaps not noticing his interest... But, perhaps 30min later a relatively nice looking woman walked in and I saw him glance over then nudged him to go talk to her... God saved me from dying of awkwardness.

[MrOracle]

"Ok, but my friend and I do spend time alone... as friends... weekly."

No. YOU spend that time as friends. I'm trying to get you to understand that no such thing exists for him. Clearly you aren't in the group of women he has NO interest in, so you MUST either be in the "wants a relationship with" (but in my opinion you'd clearly know that if that were true), OR you're in the "girls I want to bang but haven't figured out how yet" group. Because those are the only groups he has.

Women can be platonic friends with men (unless they're really hot men), but men cannot be platonic friends with women who are even a little attractive UNLESS he's already in a happy and healthy relationship OR is attractive enough to get any girl and is already getting those needs completely met. Otherwise, men simply cannot be platonic - that's like fire being cold and wet - it's just not possible.

[Dongie]

🤫🤫🤫

[DishLady]

Ok, I guess you’re right…. 🤷🏻‍♀️

Objectively he’s quite handsome, smart and has a good personality and sense of humor. He’s a good, hardworking guy…. I’ve just seen him in enough relationships, perhaps, that he’s off limits. I know for sure that I’ve been off limits bc I declared I wasn’t dating anyone, period (after my last relationship ended).

Thinking back, he’s asked me a few times why I don’t date again, and told me I was nice looking blah blah, but he was with someone and I know that he’s faithful to whatever “girl of the year” he’s with, so I didn’t think anything of it. This week’s comment… and the look he gave me… it was just awkward.

Ok, so what now? I feel I should just keep my distance. I’m pretty sure he’s going to start seeing the little chippy he approached as our convo was ending.

[MrOracle]

You don't have to change anything on your end. It seems he has little trouble finding other women to be with. Just don't let yourself be under the delusion that he isn't physically attracted to you, and wouldn't accept any opportunity to bang you. The main thing is to understand that you cannot be "just friends" with (single) men - that doesn't exist outside of rare exceptions (that you should never count on).

[Dongie]

You are always right. I do want to bed the wench.

[DishLady]

Strange... but thanks for the honest feedback. :)

[Dongie]

Uum, @DishLady, I was talking to the Oracle. But it's ok.

[meepmeeperton]

You’d be surprised at the lengths men will go to. My girlfriend was friends with a guy for a few years who had a girlfriend. It’s not like they were close or anything but they had mutual friends and she considered it a friendship.

Well after his girlfriend broke up with him he started hitting on my girlfriend blatantly knowing she’s taken…

My girlfriend was stunned and blocked him.

As a man I wasn’t really that surprised.

So yes guys do “fish” as long as they’re single they see even the most platonic female friends as potential options.

[DishLady]

Thanks for that. I’d no notion of this happening before now. I’m single atm, and so is he, but I’ll probably avoid him a little if this is the direction he’s thinking about.

[OfMiceandMen]

Perhaps, he doesn't view you as a sisterly-type like you do him the brotherly figure. He likely just got along with you all those years and figured you were his type, but it could never come to fruition if he's with someone else.

He may have thought you were the same way and tried to see if there was more there, 50/50 chance really.

[DishLady]

I mean, to a degree it would be natural to be close bc we’re from the same region and have similar sense of humor. But we were each married to different people for a long time… and then he dated endlessly, never indicating anything… and I dated one guy for a while then took a very long, very public break from dating… so I can’t see why the wires would have gotten crossed. :(

[DishLady]

Also, physically I’m not his type.

[OfMiceandMen]

I see, so you somewhat had his chance earlier and kind of blew-it because he wasn't looking for an actual relationship.

[OfMiceandMen]

sorry, he somewhat had his chance...

[DishLady]

(On my end, I never thought to give him one bc he’s been my friend. I never saw him that way.)

[OfMiceandMen]

So he always remained in the friend-zone. It that's the case, then there's no spark either that or you would have considered it.

[DishLady]

True. But also, to be fair, I completely withdrew from dating till recently and … maybe that’s impacted things.

[TonyMetal___86]

I don't know, i'm not a fisher nor a hunter, i don't go humiliate myself in front of women, i don't even have female friends in real life, also my chat with women is fast, strict, i treat her the way she treats me...

If i ever wanted to be in a relationship with someone i knew, i'd try to see if she will go with the flow with me and in the end i'll tell her the truth and wait her answer, if yes so be it and if no than BYE!

These days i don't feel comfortable around women, because i see the majority of them as snakes, wolves and demons!

[MrGTAB]

Men are pretty much always on the lookout for prospects because we don't get as many chances so every chance is precious unless we are one of these playboys that have a different girl every night.

It's not done out of malice, I do it myself as well. I also have plenty of female friends who have turned me down and I remain friends with them without ulterior motives. If they change their minds at a later date I may consider romantically engaging with them.

Men would not have to do this as much if women would initiate more so more initiation by women will lead to less of this behavior.

[Dongie]

Because even tho you have that mutual friendship that's very important to you both, he is attracted to you.
Putting myself in his place with this girl I know, we both agree were friends. I love you gets thrown around like good friends do. I have to watch myself sometimes. In certain moods or situations I find myself looking, feeling like, well affectionate and wantin̈g to express it.
That's just chemistry I guess.

[DishLady]

I hear whey you’re saying, but if there were chemistry… we’d BOTH feel it, no?

[Dongie]

I figure it that way. So say she just has more resistance and will get bent out of shape if I try to take advantage of it.

[DishLady]

Hmm... perhaps not "bent out of shape" (in the sense that she'd be angry). I know what you're thinking about... and that's a mutual, low-key affection that should be escalated. In my situation, I didn't have those feelings for the guy and I'm 90% sure he didn't seriously entertain feelings... He was probably just messing with me to see if I'd "bite". he even begged off to go flirt with a little chippy who strolled in while we were at the bar counter chatting about his ex. Like I said... he's always had a revolving door of women. (A handsome, witty guy for sure, but I've seen him chase enough skirts that I know he's never serious... and I'm a LTR gal. It's not a smart thing for either of us to consider.)

[Dongie]

He's a horndog.

[DishLady]

My friend? Yes sir. Bona fide. 😂

[Dongie]

Dina get bent. She's a tough girl.

[ticktds]

In my experience, guys see every female friend they have as a potential love interest, even when we're not that interested ourselves. We just aren't discriminatory about it at all. It doesn't mean your friendship isn't real, it just means he's acknowledging the potential to himself. You're a girl, and I'm a guy, you know the rules and so do I.

[DishLady]

Hmm. I don't know. It just bugs me, mainly bc I've always had mostly guy friends. I honestly don't think that they've ever thought of me as being right for them at all... they all know I'm not a friends with benefits sort of girl... so this was just... disappointing to me, tbh. I went home feeling like I'd lost a good friend.

[ticktds]

Well for what it's worth, most of the lady friends I have, are because I was checking them out and that got the ball rolling. But I can't say I know how it works for your friend.

[DishLady]

Really? Ok, so may I ask... you were checking them out, got the ball rolling and then what made you think, "Ok, yes, we're going to be friends"? Because for me... if I find the guy intriguing, even if he's really nice looking, my first thought is friendship. And this guy is really attractive -- and by popular vote too based on his track record with the ladies -- but I've just never seen him that way. Maybe bc we were in relationships when we first met? I don't know...

[ticktds]

Just something will turn me off eventually, such as being taken, not into men, or not looking for the same things. So yeah, for me all girls are pretty much a suiter by default, until something changes that.

[DishLady]

Aha... I got you. So you think I *did* miss some sign at some point?

[OlderAndWiser]

Why do you assume that he would never want more than friendship?

[DishLady]

We supported each other durning our messy divorces. At difficult parenting points we’d chat and laugh off the stress… like friends. Plus the whole time he was dating other people while I threw myself into work and volunteering… I just never thought about it at all.

[OlderAndWiser]

You just never thought about it but that doesn't mean HE never thought about it.

"while there's love and respect between us, I'd never want more from him, and I know that logically nor would he." There is nothing logical about romance or physical attraction.

Most women say that they want their romantic partner to be their best friend, so why can't women contemplate becoming romantic with a guy who is already a good friend?

[DishLady]

I guess, but I honestly don’t think he’d ever be serious about a relationship. I’ve watched him plow through enough of them…. Maybe things would be different between us, or maybe I’d just lose a good friend once the timer on the relationship started and he wanted out after 6-12mo. THAT would break my heart.

[OlderAndWiser]

Once a male friend begins to have romantic feelings for you, the friendship will never be the same, regardless of how you respond to his expressions of interest. You will see signs of jealousy, you won't feel comfortable talking to him about other guys, and there will be a tension between you two.

[OlderAndWiser]

Been there, done that!

[exitseven]

Friendships with members of the opposite sex can be confusing.

[DishLady]

Yeah, apparently so!

[Grond21]

What is a chippy?

Maybe he was seeing if he missed a signal, and you actually liked him

[DishLady]

Chippy is an old fashioned word for a cheap, hooker-type gal. "Little chippy" is for women who basically flaunt everything to get a guy... very overdone, very clingy and boisterous. Most of the traits that are now boiled down to "the crazy girl" label. I use the term bc I learned it from my grandparents and it just sort of stuck.

I don't know that I've ever given any guy a signal other than the very few guys I've ever really liked. (Very few and far between).

I DO like his company... as a friend. I don't know why he'd mess with that.

[Grond21]

That's pretty cool. I've never heard it before but I can like it.

But he's not a mind reader. Nor is that normal for girls, as many give signals that guys miss. So perhaps he was just making sure that he hadn't missed a signal. It doesn't mean he's trying to mess with something

[DishLady]

After 20 years of friendship -- mainly giving each other parental advice on where to find different resources and such -- I wasn't expecting him to be reading my mind, tbh. To my knowledge I don't think I gave off any particular signal at all. 🤷🏻‍♀️

[Grond21]

Yeah, I'm not sure what he was thinking. It was just a guess and I could be wrong

[msc545]

It never hurts to try if it is done tastefully. You should feel complimented.

[DishLady]

I guess, but I’m still more stunned than anything. No, he’s not relationship material; he never stays with a woman more than about a year.

[msc545]

ok...

[DrPepper12]

Yeah. Depends on a lot if circumstances but its also mixed signals from her too

[noohair]

Why do people make the same mistakes over and over? History is full of this. Human nature I guess.

[NathanDavis]

my friends are my friends... period

[DishLady]

Guys and girls, right? Bc that’s how I feel.

[NathanDavis]

yes, most of my friends are women but there are men too

[DishLady]

Thank you. There's a running theory that it's not possible to be just friends with the opposite gender.

[NathanDavis]

a theory that is always of those who are not capable of being friends with... lol

[DishLady]

THANK you! Yes. Agreed!

[NathanDavis]

actually... I'm about to make it to 22 years of friendship with my closest friend, this next month... lol

[DishLady]

That's so sweet! :)

[NathanDavis]

we're going to party like it's 99' (=

[DishLady]

🎸 🎸 🎸

[AviatorTom]

In my experience, women play emotional games much more than men do.

[DishLady]

What’s that got to do with my situation? I never tried anything with the guy.

[dolemite58]

I think female acquaintances are fine but I don't know why a grown man would have female “friends”. Women use male friends for attention and validation.

[DishLady]

Do we? Want to tell me what I was supposedly “using him” for? I never needed either of these.

[MrGSpotHer]

Oh I thought it was a fishing question for a moment.. I don't get what you mean or are asking sorry

[DishLady]

See the last paragraph of the description. I clarified.

[MrGSpotHer]

I did and I don't understand

[DishLady]

Ok, I’ll circle back after wk, then.

[MrGSpotHer]

Okay

[DishLady]

@mrgspother So basically the guy was "fishing" to see if his comment about his jealous ex thinking he was interested in me (and vice versa) would get me to... I guess confess feelings for him or something... but obvi I just think of him as a friend; always have... for over 20 years.

Anyway, so I'm asking (1) did I miss some signal I was supposed to catch on to at some point over the past 20 years? (I don't think so, but maybe from a guy's perspective there was something I was supposed to be mindful of... I don't know!) and (2) why would a guy "fish" like that after 20+ years? (It doesn't make any sense to me... if we'd wanted each other, wouldn't we have done something about it 20 years ago when we were both way younger and more spry?)

[MrGSpotHer]

I dont get what you mean by fishing for me it's trying to catch a complement, hookups, dates and stuff like that?

[DishLady]

(Yes, exactly. So I’m not sure what you’re confused about.)

[MrGSpotHer]

Everything but it's ok

[MrGSpotHer]

I mean you started this conversation by saying he's single?

[DishLady]

He IS, and so am I, but over 20 years there wasn’t a sign of anything more than “just friends” from either of us… suddenly this week for the 1/2-second that we were both single he’s fishing to see if I’ll go with him…. It was a bit weird in my opinion. I’m sort of avoiding him now tbh.

[MrGSpotHer]

Ok then it feels like you made a statement more than a question

[DishLady]

Now, through the reparte with you, sure, since we're beating a dead horse. I don't think the original question did that...

[MrGSpotHer]

Isn't starting a conversation asking someone if they are single, fishing by what you're saying you did that. I don't know what your getting at?

[MrGSpotHer]

All he did was say his girlfriend didn't like you and that's what you think fishing is?

[legalboxers]

I dont fish

[DishLady]

I know. 🙂