I would let my future kids date whomever they want, it's their life and what type of parent would I be if I don't want the best for them? If they are happy that's all that I can ask for. I am a merry medley of Metis, Dutch, and English though my Metis and Dutch features are much more prominent. I have no problem with what race or gender someone happens to be, it's the person that matters. I am proud of who I am, not just my race. When it comes down to it, race is the least important thing. It's the history of the different races that matter more than what color your skin is. Look into your race's history, and your superiority might take a nose dive :P
Dig deeper until it does. Lady, no offense, but you are coming off as extremely egotistical, a wannabe superior, and a bit of a scardy cat. I'm trying to keep it polite here, but change is a good thing, as is learning new things. If everyone was of the same religion, had similar features, and liked the same things, everything would stagnate. It's only when we step out of our comfort zones can we truly flourish :P Time moves on, so does the world, catch up or be left behind...
actually because I say I only date white, you immidiately assume that's it's me having a racist issue. yes I do consider myself racist, but not aggressively. I also realize that everyone is also racist, just to varying degrees. I date white more for the cultural aspects of it.
...this is just going to evolve into a circle argument :P Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, and I'll just leave you to yours even though I do disagree with it, for the record.
Why do you think this is just because you are white? Everybody has a preference but the fact that you would stop your children because of YOUR preference is wrong if they love somebody. That is like somebody getting in the way of your love because say... he was tall or short of some other physical difference.
what I think ends up happening is society has denied white people the right to express racial pride. based on the reactions I got from a lot of people on this post I think that's safe to say. people don't want to have to defend themselves agaisnt the masses, so they give up their racial identity because it's a lot easier to be agreeable than to have to be on the defensive. meanwhile other groups are allowed, and even encouraged to express their racial pride because no one will ostricize them.
I'm sure there is some truth to that but just because others don't share the same beliefs you shouldn't hate them or be disgusted by them. I'm not disgusted by people who date within their own race. I've only dated within my race but I'm all for dating outside it if I connect to the person as an individual.
but I also should have the right to have strict preferences for white people for obvious reasons. if a black girl says, 'i only want to date a black guy,' that's perfectly understandable and acceptable. I seriously hear them say that ALL THE TIME, and be very outspoken and vocal about it. and that is the difference I'm trying to expose.
I guess I can understand that. People who have dated outside their race isn't because they lack pride though. I'm proud of European accomplishments but say I dated an Asian girl or something it doesn't mean I now hate my ancestry. Asians have accomplished great things throughout their history too so I would respect that and try to raise our kids with pride in both you know? I wouldn't suddenly hate one or the other.
i want my children to be white, and I also want their children to be white. so far every person in my family line has been white. what is so horrible about maintaining that tradition?
Its a waste of time to write to a bunch of ignorant biggots but here goes... This is a good example of people being ignorant and racist no matter the race. Just like there are white racist ignorant people, there are othter racist ignorant racists. So you are saying you would rather let your daughter marry a white drug dealer murderer over a black, hispanic, arab, chinese president? when you start using your brain you will find that this is a useless question on a useless topic created by useless biggots. You are giving a bad name to white people.
It would depend on so much more than skin color with me. When I was in high school, most of my friends were black gang members. I never got picked on. Now almost all my friends are white. The only reason for that is I live in Utah and I don't live near my old high school and so black people are scarce. As for hispanic, if he speaks fluen english, treats my daughter right, and is either going to school or trying to get a good job, I don't give a hoot. Same with a black man.
I hate people from all races. Even some white people. But I have friends who are from all races also.
hahahahahahhahaha "so this is what happens when a white person expresses racial preferences... "
well I ddnt read the comments below but I can kinda guess what they were :P
anyway in my case I don't mind :D I'd have beautiful grand children either way :P hahah
i think interracial dating is a great experience though! I reckon if interracial also include different nationality and cultures it might be harder to get used to (getting along with the family, different mentality and culture, etc... ) but that applies everywhere (two white people might have the same problem say if one of them is American and the other one european ^^)
oh and I guess I can't be considered white? :p I'm actually Lebanese so what does that make me? :p lol I know people have different opinions on us middle eastern people :p
You can't really tell your children, especially after they're 18, who to date. You also can't tell them who to love. People love other people, and if it's someone of another race, who cares. I will say, that it does make some relationships more difficult because sometimes the two people are coming from different cultures and it's a culture adjustment. But it shouldn't make a difference what race they are. Race is a skin color, who cares? Shouldn't you care about the person on the inside? Not what you see.
I am Latino and I really love my culture and I will be really ashamed if my kids date a Black why? Its a proven fact that a Black persons genes are stronger then any other race if a Black person has a baby with an Asian, Hispanic, or white it will be 99% black & 1% either of Asian, Hispanic, or white and seen my grandkids I will not really see them as mine cuzz they don't really have any blood of mine and it will be really a sad thing to see my grandfathers legacy just be cut right there passing on the green eyes:( but I won't be able to do anything if they date em I just won't be the same anymore:(
ZenSpace its preference its not racism you douchebag! Its a fact that Black people's genes are stronger then any other race! And what's wrong of liking my own culture?
I like my culture so much that I would want to see my kids loving it the same as I do this is their culture. Now why I won't see them as my grandchildren because I won't its true that black people's genes are stronger and it won't really have my son or daughters blood only like 1%! Get that in your head.
Hanhew, if it is only cultural, then it doesn't matter what colour they are. learning or participating in traditions, beliefs practices don't have anything to do with skin colour. you are caught up with how they look, not how they will be raised. To me that sounds racist. Using a nicer, less stigmatized word "preference" doesn't change that what you are saying is racist. I am posting a definition of racism to help you better understand why people on this thread are making the comparison.
I ain't racist! I use to have a Black friends, & Asian friends. I just love my damn culture why can't you people get it? I ain't racist I just feel more comfortable with my own race.
"I ain't racist! I use to have a Black friends, & Asian friends." Wow, that comment not only confirms the fact that you're racist but now also brings into question your intelligence. As for "used to", why not anymore?
I moved to Sylmar have you been to Sylmar? I don't think so there is hardly any Asian, or black people around here there is only Cubans, Mexicans, & Caucasians stop making me seem like if I am a racist person because I am not!
You clearly don't understand the first thing about genetics - or the difference between genotype and phenotype. I suspect if I tried to explain it to you I'd lose the will to live.
I can't condone any type of dating limitation based on "race." With all due respect, I don't personally see it as a problem, regardless of who my child is dating.
I reserve the right to make judgement beyond that on factors that, to me, actually matter, but personally, it makes my stomach turn to think that "race" would keep people apart.
we're outrageous? you're stating how "horrible" it would be for your kids to date interracially...youre a clown, you do NOT choose who your child falls for...grow up and to the "best answer" what a pussy, answering anonymously...man you people have no respect...you should all be moved to idaho and nuked
Okay, you prefer to date white people. Nothing at all wrong with that. But why do you care what color people our kids date? They're the ones fukcing their partners--not you! All that matter is that they're happy, right?
For instance, I prefer not to have sex with fat chicks. Nothing wrong with them--they're people too--I just happen to prefer nailing thinner gals. But if I had a son and he liked a chubbier girl, I wouldn't care. Why would I? I don't have to have sex with her!
I'm assuming you're taking heat for stating a preference on what you find attractive. I'm not doing that and I don't think it's fair. BUT I AM curious as to why the hell you'd care about what your kids find attractive as long as they're happy!
I assume that question is directed to penton, but yeah--it wouldn't matter to me. If she made my son miserable, then I'd have issues, but if he's happy I'm good. Again, I'm not the one boning her so I don't particularly care if she's fat.
coward indeed question asker is really a foolish person,would love to see you ask in a hospital for a heart from I white person instead of black we all bleed one color red,you live in an epoch I think you need Jesus yeah and I don't care whether he is black or white either lol.
Definitely . The only thing I want for my "future" children is for them to be happy. If a man/woman of a different race makes them happy, then go for it. Restricting your children from a certain race only spreads ignorance and sometimes hatred or resistance. If I feel the man/woman isn't right (mentally) for my child, then I would have to step in because this person has the potential to make my child unhappy. But one thing I would hope, is that my "future" child isn't dating inter-racially because he/she has no respect or does not want to be her own race. I have friends who date white guys because they are unhappy being black and want to put white-European into their future children genes. I would want my child to respect her self and who he/she is (including his/her race) before he/she loves anyone else.
WHY would it bother you though if your child dated a black person? How is a black man or woman too "different"? It seems to me you are focusing more or less on the color of our skin rather than the intellect and the character of our self as an individual. Yeah...I bet you didn't think there were ACTUAL African Americans who can talk with sense and intelligence. Yes I spelled intelligent right!
I could care less who my child would date. I have dated interracialy and would welcome any man from any race to date me if he has a great personality and a beautiful heart. I think mixing interracialy is a beautiful thing. It adds even more color to the rainbow that is the human race. That's another thing to keep in mind...we're all HUMAN.
I would rather my children date inside of their race but I can't force them to and it depends on the person. If they are of a different race but a serious gentleman or lady that I know for sure would be good for my son or daughter I would allow it. The main advantage to dating within your own race is that normally people of the same race understand each other better and can relate. Although this is not the case all the time but I think for the most part people of the same race also value each other a little bit more and that is can be from a number of reasons like if the other person maybe heard their parents speak bad about another persons race and they were dating that race, the minute they make a mistake its easier to jump on them the same or similar issues their parents talked about growing up. Anyways I would prefer it but I wouldn't force them to date inside their race.
Read this: it is about how Oxytocin (the love hormone) can contribute to racism. One of the implications of the study is that the more time you spend with people of different races, the less racist you are likely to become. If you were to spend time and be supportive of your kids if they date interracially, you are more likely to come to accept the relationship.
Please understand that MOST of the world IS NOT EXACTLY LIKE YOU. If you want to live in this world, you, at very least, need to learn to treat others with respect. Posting something like this is not very respectful.
And, quite frankly I would be embarrassed if I were you- your ignorance is showing.
I prefer my future kids to date within my own race but they can date whoever they want AS LONG AS they are respectable, can provide/hold up their end of the relationship, are very supportive, and treat my kids right. If they don't have class then it's a no. When I was little I didn't have a problem with interracial relationships but my mom told me I would never be allowed to date someone who wasn't white and it kind of changed my outlook after that unfortunately. But I know a married white/black interracial couple and they both themselves are very respectable. The guy is african american and is a very kind hearted, respectable man. He speaks very proper, is very smart, is a huge family man, and has a big heart.
I understand this user is no longer a member of this website but I would like the right to freely express my hatred for not only this woman but this question and the disgusting bullsh*t she is spurting from her mouth.
I personally wouldn't care, as long as the person was loving, respectful and loved God. God is really important to me, and I hope my children and the people they marry will love Him as much as I do. The other two I think everyone would agree with me, who would want their child dating a disrespectful or unloving person?
I'm only 17, so I don't have kids, but if they dated interracially, I wouldn't have a problem with it. I'm white, and I've dated a black guy. I didn't think it was a big deal. It's just another physical feature, like eye color or height.
This question asker is just saying that if they had a choice for who their child dated it would be someone of their own race. That's all. I'm more for looking for complete happiness but if a parent wants their children to be with people of their own race, its her opinion and a lot of the time its just that way in general. there are the ups and downs of all races but I do agree (being black) that black people generally now a days are not putting their best feet forward to show the world that we are just as equal to everyone else including whites. I think then the question asker would then have less of a problem with her child going outside of her race. the sterotype for blacks is only proved even more true by the way a large portion of the race acts... it makes you look specifically for their faults which you will find because we all have them.
the fact is that nobody should have racial preferences. yes you are right that it is more tollerated for a black person to express this type of preference, but its still wrong. I mean what is the inherent difference between a white person and a black person? how they look. that's it. why would you judge someone on that basis.
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I would let my future kids date whomever they want, it's their life and what type of parent would I be if I don't want the best for them? If they are happy that's all that I can ask for. I am a merry medley of Metis, Dutch, and English though my Metis and Dutch features are much more prominent. I have no problem with what race or gender someone happens to be, it's the person that matters. I am proud of who I am, not just my race. When it comes down to it, race is the least important thing. It's the history of the different races that matter more than what color your skin is. Look into your race's history, and your superiority might take a nose dive :P
nah I don't think it will
Dig deeper until it does. Lady, no offense, but you are coming off as extremely egotistical, a wannabe superior, and a bit of a scardy cat. I'm trying to keep it polite here, but change is a good thing, as is learning new things. If everyone was of the same religion, had similar features, and liked the same things, everything would stagnate. It's only when we step out of our comfort zones can we truly flourish :P Time moves on, so does the world, catch up or be left behind...
actually because I say I only date white, you immidiately assume that's it's me having a racist issue. yes I do consider myself racist, but not aggressively. I also realize that everyone is also racist, just to varying degrees. I date white more for the cultural aspects of it.
...this is just going to evolve into a circle argument :P Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, and I'll just leave you to yours even though I do disagree with it, for the record.
Why do you think this is just because you are white? Everybody has a preference but the fact that you would stop your children because of YOUR preference is wrong if they love somebody. That is like somebody getting in the way of your love because say... he was tall or short of some other physical difference.
it has everything to do with the fact that I'm white and you know it. don't try to deny that racial double standards don't exist.
I never did deny that but if I had a black friend that only dated blacks I would ask the same questions.
what I think ends up happening is society has denied white people the right to express racial pride. based on the reactions I got from a lot of people on this post I think that's safe to say. people don't want to have to defend themselves agaisnt the masses, so they give up their racial identity because it's a lot easier to be agreeable than to have to be on the defensive. meanwhile other groups are allowed, and even encouraged to express their racial pride because no one will ostricize them.
I'm sure there is some truth to that but just because others don't share the same beliefs you shouldn't hate them or be disgusted by them. I'm not disgusted by people who date within their own race. I've only dated within my race but I'm all for dating outside it if I connect to the person as an individual.
but I also should have the right to have strict preferences for white people for obvious reasons. if a black girl says, 'i only want to date a black guy,' that's perfectly understandable and acceptable. I seriously hear them say that ALL THE TIME, and be very outspoken and vocal about it. and that is the difference I'm trying to expose.
I guess I can understand that. People who have dated outside their race isn't because they lack pride though. I'm proud of European accomplishments but say I dated an Asian girl or something it doesn't mean I now hate my ancestry. Asians have accomplished great things throughout their history too so I would respect that and try to raise our kids with pride in both you know? I wouldn't suddenly hate one or the other.
i want my children to be white, and I also want their children to be white. so far every person in my family line has been white. what is so horrible about maintaining that tradition?
I didn't say it was I was just saying that those who don't isn't because they lack pride or anything.
Its a waste of time to write to a bunch of ignorant biggots but here goes... This is a good example of people being ignorant and racist no matter the race. Just like there are white racist ignorant people, there are othter racist ignorant racists. So you are saying you would rather let your daughter marry a white drug dealer murderer over a black, hispanic, arab, chinese president? when you start using your brain you will find that this is a useless question on a useless topic created by useless biggots. You are giving a bad name to white people.
Thanks you,
your friendly modern white guy
It would depend on so much more than skin color with me. When I was in high school, most of my friends were black gang members. I never got picked on. Now almost all my friends are white. The only reason for that is I live in Utah and I don't live near my old high school and so black people are scarce. As for hispanic, if he speaks fluen english, treats my daughter right, and is either going to school or trying to get a good job, I don't give a hoot. Same with a black man.
I hate people from all races. Even some white people. But I have friends who are from all races also.
hahahahahahhahaha "so this is what happens when a white person expresses racial preferences... "
well I ddnt read the comments below but I can kinda guess what they were :P
anyway in my case I don't mind :D I'd have beautiful grand children either way :P hahah
i think interracial dating is a great experience though! I reckon if interracial also include different nationality and cultures it might be harder to get used to (getting along with the family, different mentality and culture, etc... ) but that applies everywhere (two white people might have the same problem say if one of them is American and the other one european ^^)
oh and I guess I can't be considered white? :p I'm actually Lebanese so what does that make me? :p lol I know people have different opinions on us middle eastern people :p
im not sure. I think actually you can be. but I really don't know.
You can't really tell your children, especially after they're 18, who to date. You also can't tell them who to love. People love other people, and if it's someone of another race, who cares. I will say, that it does make some relationships more difficult because sometimes the two people are coming from different cultures and it's a culture adjustment. But it shouldn't make a difference what race they are. Race is a skin color, who cares? Shouldn't you care about the person on the inside? Not what you see.
that is the unfortunate reality I realize
I am Latino and I really love my culture and I will be really ashamed if my kids date a Black why? Its a proven fact that a Black persons genes are stronger then any other race if a Black person has a baby with an Asian, Hispanic, or white it will be 99% black & 1% either of Asian, Hispanic, or white and seen my grandkids I will not really see them as mine cuzz they don't really have any blood of mine and it will be really a sad thing to see my grandfathers legacy just be cut right there passing on the green eyes:( but I won't be able to do anything if they date em I just won't be the same anymore:(
agreed
Yeah and why is everybody against us? We just love our damn culture and its not racism its preference stu**d bi**!
wow this is so sad. I never realized there were so many racists on this website...
ZenSpace its preference its not racism you douchebag! Its a fact that Black people's genes are stronger then any other race! And what's wrong of liking my own culture?
There is nothing wrong with liking your own culture.
Being "Ashamed if my kids date a black" is RACIST. Plain and simple.
Saying you "would not see" your grandchildren "as yours" simply because they had a black parent is RACIST.
This is about much more than liking your own culture. You have a problem.
I like my culture so much that I would want to see my kids loving it the same as I do this is their culture. Now why I won't see them as my grandchildren because I won't its true that black people's genes are stronger and it won't really have my son or daughters blood only like 1%! Get that in your head.
Hanhew, if it is only cultural, then it doesn't matter what colour they are. learning or participating in traditions, beliefs practices don't have anything to do with skin colour. you are caught up with how they look, not how they will be raised. To me that sounds racist. Using a nicer, less stigmatized word "preference" doesn't change that what you are saying is racist. I am posting a definition of racism to help you better understand why people on this thread are making the comparison.
I ain't racist! I use to have a Black friends, & Asian friends. I just love my damn culture why can't you people get it? I ain't racist I just feel more comfortable with my own race.
"I ain't racist! I use to have a Black friends, & Asian friends." Wow, that comment not only confirms the fact that you're racist but now also brings into question your intelligence. As for "used to", why not anymore?
I moved to Sylmar have you been to Sylmar? I don't think so there is hardly any Asian, or black people around here there is only Cubans, Mexicans, & Caucasians stop making me seem like if I am a racist person because I am not!
You clearly don't understand the first thing about genetics - or the difference between genotype and phenotype. I suspect if I tried to explain it to you I'd lose the will to live.
Go ahead explain it to me?
First off, I'm white.
I can't condone any type of dating limitation based on "race." With all due respect, I don't personally see it as a problem, regardless of who my child is dating.
I reserve the right to make judgement beyond that on factors that, to me, actually matter, but personally, it makes my stomach turn to think that "race" would keep people apart.
we're outrageous? you're stating how "horrible" it would be for your kids to date interracially...youre a clown, you do NOT choose who your child falls for...grow up and to the "best answer" what a pussy, answering anonymously...man you people have no respect...you should all be moved to idaho and nuked
Amen to that!
hallelujah ! lol those people just hate themselve and are jelous of normal people
Why o you hate Idahoans?
Gotta agree this is all extremely racist
you look like a real jackass wearing your rosery beads like it's a piece of jewely.
Okay, you prefer to date white people. Nothing at all wrong with that. But why do you care what color people our kids date? They're the ones fukcing their partners--not you! All that matter is that they're happy, right?
For instance, I prefer not to have sex with fat chicks. Nothing wrong with them--they're people too--I just happen to prefer nailing thinner gals. But if I had a son and he liked a chubbier girl, I wouldn't care. Why would I? I don't have to have sex with her!
I'm assuming you're taking heat for stating a preference on what you find attractive. I'm not doing that and I don't think it's fair. BUT I AM curious as to why the hell you'd care about what your kids find attractive as long as they're happy!
would you want your son to date a big huge giant fat chic?
If he likes her, that works for me. I don't give a sh!t. I don't have to have sex with her.
Why would it matter?
I assume that question is directed to penton, but yeah--it wouldn't matter to me. If she made my son miserable, then I'd have issues, but if he's happy I'm good. Again, I'm not the one boning her so I don't particularly care if she's fat.
coward indeed question asker is really a foolish person,would love to see you ask in a hospital for a heart from I white person instead of black we all bleed one color red,you live in an epoch I think you need Jesus yeah and I don't care whether he is black or white either lol.
Amen to that too!
Jesus wasn't probably white, he had even a black ancestor, according to the Bible: link and link
Jesus was a jew. so I imagine he would have looked jewish.
Definitely . The only thing I want for my "future" children is for them to be happy. If a man/woman of a different race makes them happy, then go for it. Restricting your children from a certain race only spreads ignorance and sometimes hatred or resistance. If I feel the man/woman isn't right (mentally) for my child, then I would have to step in because this person has the potential to make my child unhappy. But one thing I would hope, is that my "future" child isn't dating inter-racially because he/she has no respect or does not want to be her own race. I have friends who date white guys because they are unhappy being black and want to put white-European into their future children genes. I would want my child to respect her self and who he/she is (including his/her race) before he/she loves anyone else.
WHY would it bother you though if your child dated a black person? How is a black man or woman too "different"? It seems to me you are focusing more or less on the color of our skin rather than the intellect and the character of our self as an individual. Yeah...I bet you didn't think there were ACTUAL African Americans who can talk with sense and intelligence. Yes I spelled intelligent right!
I could care less who my child would date. I have dated interracialy and would welcome any man from any race to date me if he has a great personality and a beautiful heart. I think mixing interracialy is a beautiful thing. It adds even more color to the rainbow that is the human race. That's another thing to keep in mind...we're all HUMAN.
I would rather my children date inside of their race but I can't force them to and it depends on the person. If they are of a different race but a serious gentleman or lady that I know for sure would be good for my son or daughter I would allow it. The main advantage to dating within your own race is that normally people of the same race understand each other better and can relate. Although this is not the case all the time but I think for the most part people of the same race also value each other a little bit more and that is can be from a number of reasons like if the other person maybe heard their parents speak bad about another persons race and they were dating that race, the minute they make a mistake its easier to jump on them the same or similar issues their parents talked about growing up. Anyways I would prefer it but I wouldn't force them to date inside their race.
Read this: it is about how Oxytocin (the love hormone) can contribute to racism. One of the implications of the study is that the more time you spend with people of different races, the less racist you are likely to become. If you were to spend time and be supportive of your kids if they date interracially, you are more likely to come to accept the relationship.
link
Please understand that MOST of the world IS NOT EXACTLY LIKE YOU. If you want to live in this world, you, at very least, need to learn to treat others with respect. Posting something like this is not very respectful.
And, quite frankly I would be embarrassed if I were you- your ignorance is showing.
I prefer my future kids to date within my own race but they can date whoever they want AS LONG AS they are respectable, can provide/hold up their end of the relationship, are very supportive, and treat my kids right. If they don't have class then it's a no. When I was little I didn't have a problem with interracial relationships but my mom told me I would never be allowed to date someone who wasn't white and it kind of changed my outlook after that unfortunately. But I know a married white/black interracial couple and they both themselves are very respectable. The guy is african american and is a very kind hearted, respectable man. He speaks very proper, is very smart, is a huge family man, and has a big heart.
I understand this user is no longer a member of this website but I would like the right to freely express my hatred for not only this woman but this question and the disgusting bullsh*t she is spurting from her mouth.
F*** racist people.
That will be all.
I personally wouldn't care, as long as the person was loving, respectful and loved God. God is really important to me, and I hope my children and the people they marry will love Him as much as I do. The other two I think everyone would agree with me, who would want their child dating a disrespectful or unloving person?
I'm only 17, so I don't have kids, but if they dated interracially, I wouldn't have a problem with it. I'm white, and I've dated a black guy. I didn't think it was a big deal. It's just another physical feature, like eye color or height.
This question asker is just saying that if they had a choice for who their child dated it would be someone of their own race. That's all. I'm more for looking for complete happiness but if a parent wants their children to be with people of their own race, its her opinion and a lot of the time its just that way in general. there are the ups and downs of all races but I do agree (being black) that black people generally now a days are not putting their best feet forward to show the world that we are just as equal to everyone else including whites. I think then the question asker would then have less of a problem with her child going outside of her race. the sterotype for blacks is only proved even more true by the way a large portion of the race acts... it makes you look specifically for their faults which you will find because we all have them.
the fact is that nobody should have racial preferences. yes you are right that it is more tollerated for a black person to express this type of preference, but its still wrong. I mean what is the inherent difference between a white person and a black person? how they look. that's it. why would you judge someone on that basis.
many many differences...
what is the big difference?
you can't recognize obvious differences amongst different racial groups. come on.