Agree or disagree, "Only women, children, and dogs are loved unconditionally. A man is only loved under the condition that he provide something" ?

[Anonymous]

Do you agree or disagree with the above statement?

Yes, I agree.

No, I don't agree.

Other.

[nightdrot]

Could not disagree more. I know because I get more unconditional love from my girlfriend and our three children than I have any right to expect or ever would have thought possible. (Get ready, this will get drippy.)

My girlfriend gives me unconditional love every day. When I get on my high horse - and I work in politics so I do that a lot - she just smiles at me, rolls her eyes, and kisses me on the cheek. When she sees I am worried or nervous and - without me saying a word - she will come up to me and hug me and tell me that I am the best man in the world. When she makes love to me and gives her naked body to me in the most intimate and raw and primal and romantic way. It is the most basic sharing of two people that you can imagine.

There is nothing a man can do to earn that. She does not need me - except in the sense that for some strange reason that I cannot explain, I mean something to her. It is not because I have a job - she has one too. It is not because - heaven knows - I am handy around the house. Boy! Would THAT not be true.

It is not because I am always sweet and understanding. Trust me, I ain't. I am opinionated to the nth degree. I have a very definite sense of the way I want my home and am the very definition of a creature of habit.

So what is it then that I did to deserve my gfd's love? Put me to the test, I could not give you a logical, plausible answer. I can tell you that I would give my life to protect her. That there is not a day that goes by that I don't wonder how I got so lucky. That when I hold her and we share our naked bodies and I feel her warm skin against mine I wonder what I did to feel so safe and loved.

Ditto with our children. How did I ever get so lucky as to have such beautiful gifts placed in my arms - as the tears ran down my cheeks? Why I get to feel like a brain surgeon for just kissing a "boo-boo" and making it all better? Why these little people make me feel like a giant? Why I deserve the laughs they give me?

Suffice to say, I could point to so many other things. I barely scratched the surface. The thrust being that I got this without asking or being deserving. To be sure, I had to do my part because nothing comes without a bit of work. The paradox being that does not make it less unconditional.

Bottom line, if you really look around, you - men and women - will find a lot more unconditional love than you can imagine. The problem being that in this day and age, men and women both are quick to count the costs even as they lose sight of the wealth that they have been given. The implicit premise of this question: They know the costs of everything and the value of nothing.

[mattl338]

Sadly I have not had such a great girlfriend in my life, I feel that the unconditional love that you have is extremely rare and that you are very lucky to have that.

[nightdrot]

@mattl338 Well, I am sorry to hear that and I wish it for you. That said, what makes it so special is that it is so rare - and I am so lucky ti have my girlfriend (and my three little Munchkins) in my life. They mean more to me and give my life more meaning than I can begin to express.

That said, if it is worth having it is worth fighting for. Also, there are many pleasures in life and you should not forget the many good things to have and experience as you look for that woman who will make your life that much more special. Never give up and I wish you all the best.

[mattl338]

Thank you I appreciate that man :)

[Asker]

@nightdrot. Your experience is that of the tiniest percentage of men.

[nightdrot]

Please note the first paragraph of my reply to @mattl338. I did not say it was common, only that it is sometimes for lucky people (and people with the self-awareness to realize what they have) the case. As I noted in my own reply, I have been blessed.

[DiscomfortZone]

Absolutely true. Many men are too scared to admit it and many women are too ashamed.

[Asker]

I think it is a shock for men to fundamentally realize this truth. I wish someone had told me this when I was a little boy, it would have better prepared me for dating, marriage, etc. Older men know that they can older hold onto a woman (and their family) if they constantly add value, just like keeping a sales job. You are only as good as your last month.

[DiscomfortZone]

And that's the sad truth.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

Read my opinion here. Both of you...

[DiscomfortZone]

Grow up, attention whore, and worry about your lack of reading comprehension skills...

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@discomfortzone Oh good you read it.
Men are not loved only if they provide something. We can be loved simply for who we are.

[DiscomfortZone]

Like I said, ass kisser - reading comprehension.

[Asker]

@ThisIsMyOpinion Is that an order, Captain?

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@discomfortzone feel free to go there and try to prove me wrong.

[DiscomfortZone]

What are you, a failed business trying to get fake entrances? I've given you too much attention as it is

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@discomfortzone sad how some men actually believe in a word where women actually have the majority of college degrees that they need or want you just to provide for them.

[Anonymous]

If you love someone based on what they can do for you, it's not love.

Love is unconditional, but a relationship can't always be.

I adored my ex boyfriend, and he treated me like crap... and because i loved him, I made every excuse and every concession under the sun for him.
When he hurt me, I'd blame myself. When he left me, I'd let him go... and then I'd move on and he'd wanted to come back, and I took him back time after time. It was a vicious cycle.
I didn't even recognise myself. The old me would have just walked away long before I actually did, but I was in love.
It wasn't just that I was in love, I was in unrequited love. I had to love enough for the both of us.
I tried absolutely everything to make that relationship work for four long years.
In the end, I had to give up on him because I had nothing left to give. I'd lost myself, I'd lost friends, and I was so tired from having my heart broken over and over.
I knew it had to end when I started thinking that everyone would be happier if I wasn't here, and wondered at what point had I got to that.
I started to wonder what would happen if it didn't end for good.
Leaving him broke my heart... but the relief of not being in that situation anymore was just as intense.
It's been a year, and I don't love him any less. I'm always going to love him, but I won't go near him again.
I want him to be happy. I want him to be in a job that doesn't hold him back, I want him to see himself though the eyes of the people who like him, because he is way too hard on himself.
I want him to be with someone who makes him feel like I felt when things were good with us, and I want that person to feel the same way back.
I want all the best things for him, because he deserves them. I still think that, as a person, he's the best guy in the world. We just weren't good together.

[Dazed0N0Confused]

Only dogs are loved unconditionally, unless their owner is a major asshole. Personally, if I fall for you, it's already unconditional, until something disrespectful or rude occurs, then I rethink things. But I'm easy to please in a relationship. I just want some of your time and to cuddle, occasionally go out in public so I don't feel like a secret or something you're not proud to show off...

[Asker]

"Until something rude or disrespectful happens"... this is not "unconditional".

[Dazed0N0Confused]

You punch me for no good reason I think is a reasonable reason to stop loving unconditionally

[AllThatSweetJazz]

So your unconditional love has conditions...

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

You don't stop loving someone because he punched you in the face. You might be pissed and distance yourself from that person. But love doesn't fade like that.

[mattl338]

“Until something rude or disrespectful happens” That is not unconditional, that’s having conditions. Look up the definition of both of those things because you clearly don’t know what unconditional love is. Unconditional love is being delusional and I can safely say it can be a mental illness. As ThisIsMyOpinion said, if your boyfriend punched you in the face or abused you and your love doesn’t fade and you still love them, that is unconditional and it’s a self-destructive mindset.

[MzAsh]

A relationship with a man should absolutely be conditional, but I think she can have love in her heart for a man who didn’t meet her conditions.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

Why a relationship with a man must absolutely be conditional?

[MzAsh]

Well I mean you’re not going to want someone who doesn’t adhere to any moral principles. We’re all with each other on some conditions. Some are just more basic than others.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

I can see your point...

[jgibsonian1986]

@MzAsh I'd argue that a person's ethics and their adherence to them are what makes the man. I have excellent principals and morals, but I have no career, little aspiration for anything in particular, and little future plans. From what I have gotten in feedback those are the things women will leave a morally righteous man for. But I have yet to meet and ask every woman, so I'm more than sure I'm wrong to an extant.

[Interstate]

Yep. It falls under, "I'll take "Being In Love With the Wrong Person" for $1000 Alex.

[Interstate]

@ThisIsMyOpinion There has to be boundaries. Otherwise, either party would be allowed to do whatever they wanted against the other with no consequences.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@Interstate we love someone with the assumption that they will never break those boundaries. If they do in the moment we will still love them because love doesn't fade easy like that, but they will probably separate and love will fade with time.

[Dongtai]

I don’t believe in unconditional love. If loving someone means sacrificing self respect or health, that’s where I draw the line.

As far as men only being loved if they can provide something, that’s bullshit. What about the sons or daughters that love their fathers? Or what about women who stand by their terminally ill husbands?

People are capable of loving someone without wanting something materialistic in return. Yes there’s women who only love their spouse for what they can provide. But there’s plenty of women chasing deadbeats and losers who have nothing materialistic to offer.

[drsatan]

None of them get unconditional love.
First of all, I don't love any pets unconditionally. They're cute and nice and everything, but if it gets sick or I have to pick an animal over a person, I pick the person, every time.

Children get more leeway, depending on what they have done and their age.

An adult woman get exactly the same as a man.
Male or female, I think cheating is a bad thing to do, but doesn't necessarily make you a bad person, just a person who has made mistakes like we all do.

Man or woman who has killed in cold blood, I would have the same negative feelings to both.

[DanaeAdam5]

Women are loved only if:


Their good people

Children are only loved if:

If they don't grow up in a messed up family (or with no family at all)

Man's are loved if:

They are good people

Dogs are loved only if:

Dogs are loved by almost everyone cause they are fucking adorable beautiful creatures ❤❤❤❤❤

[Jay13496]

I think some cat people would disagree. My cousin hates dogs and only likes cats. 😂

[imyourprincess]

I disagree, I dont think love is ever really unconditional

[Asker]

Thumbs up for honesty.

[Goma15]

No, men should find women that love them for who they are and not what they bring to the table. That's not even really love, in my opinion. I certainly have found a person who loves me regardless.

That being said, I don't think anyone is loved COMPLETELY unconditionally (including women, children and dogs).

[theronaldmcdonald]

Love is always conditional (except for animals and children as most are pure of heart and very giving of love). But adult humans, they need to have something to offer. Whether or not you offer love, support, stability, companionship, etc is very important. Who wants to be with someone who has NOTHING to offer?

[Alex_988_2]

i'd...

[Mickey9999]

Don’t agree. I think many people have the capacity to love unconditionally. Dogs of course and most parents love their children unconditionally regardless of its reciprocated. As far as a couple, I think it’s completely possible but is solely dependent upon reciprocation... you cannot love unconditionally if you are not loved unconditionally, it’s an extension of trust

[MackToday]

No a man is a man and he has a certain job to do. If he won't do it then he is resented. Men don't get pregnant or give birth so we provide instead. Look at how our bodies are built, do you think we can pick up an engine block like a gorilla just because? We're made for war and work that's just the way the cards played out.

[Underworld158]

I can tell u no one is loved unconditionally. NO ONE. It all depends on who you are. And where do u live? also how good u r in making yourself matter.
have you heard of Brock tuner ‘s case. Or Oscar pistoruis case. Both men violated women and ruined their lives horribly and because they were rich guys they were treated in a very lenient way despite they both would get the death penalty if they were in other systems. It really MATTERS who u r.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

The fact that almost half of the men said "Yes, I agree." makes me ahamed as a men!
DUDES! If you really think no one will ever love you just for you I am really sorry that you have that little to offer! I am sorry that life sucks that bad for you! I am sorry that women didn't treat you right and/or never gave you attention! BUT most of all... I am sorry for the departure of your testicles!!!

[jaybee281]

So in your right mind you think that every dude that agreed is like that? I voted other by the way but the fact is just like we as guys wouldn't fall in love with a girl that is not good looking (that's how we get attracted to someone unlike them) a woman would never go for a dude that can't provide.. Just ask any woman if she would go for a broke man.. Spoiler alert:they don't and they won't that's how they're wired nothing wrong with that.. We both are only loved conditionally

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@jaybee281 I don't all guys fit in my description. Like you don't, but I think that many do. Look at the rest of the comments and see...

[JSmuve]

Disagree. If you love something unconditionally, then that's your choice. If you're with a woman who only values you for what you can do for her, then you probably need to rethink whether you want to be with her. Guys have a say in who they want to be with and don't have to accept women who treat them like some inexhaustible resource that they can use and take for granted.

[JayParris]

I've seen so many women walk out on men for losing their jobs, getting seriously sick or disabled and unable to provide, or just because it's more lucrative to go find another.

Build her a house, buy her a brand new car, fill her closet with the best clothes and jewelry, and she'll boot you out and find another man because you've outlived your usefulness to her

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

That doesn't always happen. Women today have their own jobs. They don't need us to buy them stuff anymore. So they leave less on those situations.

[JayParris]

@ThisIsMyOpinion you're right. Not always. But often enough to be wary and not fall into that trap

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

I lost my job after I got married. She stayed. I think having a special someone by your side is worth the risk. But I respect your position.

[hellionthesagereborn]

Of course, ask any of the women who disagreed whether or not they would date a man without a job who didn't pay for dates (like women), wasn't tall etc. Guarentee you that they would be stammering out an excuse for why that's different in no time.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

I can assure you from experience that women don't just leave if you are fired. As long as they actually love you.

[hellionthesagereborn]

@ThisIsMyOpinion A woman's love is conditional, period. Every one's is but especially a woman's and pretending like this isn't the case is not just naïve its stupid. Women care about money and protection and status, they always have and always will. That's like saying a man doesn't prefer an attractive woman to an ugly one, you would be a moron to make the claim and a even bigger moron to believe it. I don't much care for this game men like you play, where you blow smoke up women's asses and pretend they are gods gift to the world and make believe they don't shit and bleed like the rest of us. I have no issue with women having standards, I only have issues when they refuse to uphold their end of the bargain and fulfill their duties and when they let those "standards" become ridiculous to the point of them mattering more then the man. But yes, their love is always conditional and that isn't negotionable (because every ones love is, its just when it comes to men, the love for us is more conditional then others).

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

You saying "períod" doesn't make you right.
Women today have the majority of college degrees. They don't need either money or status anymore.

Yes the man might prefer the attractive one, but that doesn't mean he will leave his woman for a hotter one as soon as she comes along. Just like women won't for a richer man. Why? Because love.

Women are just humans just like we are. They can be evil and they can be caring and loving like we are. I say they are equal, you say they are worse.

Their duties? What are their duteis? And what are our duties by the way?

Each person has his or her individual standards. Men complain women want to much and vice versa. You hear both complain about this and that all the time, but in the end they will end up with someone that checks the most important boxes, not all of them as long as they love the personality the other has.

"Love is always conditional." Well you can say my wife loves me as long as I don't punch her face out of nowhere. Yes, those are extreme situations.

[hellionthesagereborn]

@ThisIsMyOpinion No, but you pandering doesn't make you right either. What does make me right is that you have not a single example of unconditional interactions between men and women and that is a fact. You can pander and kiss ass all you want, grovel at the feet of women and tell them their shit doesn't stink if that's your thing, but you will always be wrong (and quite frankly, pathetic.). As for "leaving", I never said that was the case, not once. What I did say was that the relationship is conditional. Statitically a woman who makes more then her husband is far more likely to be unhappy in the relationship and far more likely to divorce. Statistically speaking she is considerably less likely to "marry down" i. e. she would rather wait until some one comes along that makes at least as much as her and preferably more then marry a guy she likes that has less. This isn't opinion, this is statistical fact, this is a biological fact. You pandering and ass kissing and trying to white knight because you can't handle the idea that human interaction is transactional is your problem, not mine so please do not project it on me.

[hellionthesagereborn]

@ThisIsMyOpinion As for "their duties", you ask this but you know the answer. If a man protects, a woman nurtures, if a man provides, a woman maintains. This is the fair exchange of goods and services that is expected within a relationship. Currently men protect and women don't nurture, and men provide and women demand that the man maintain while they go off doing what ever they please because asking them to give as they have gotten is "sexism". You know this as well as I do, again, you can make believe if you want but this is reality, if she wants a traditional man she must be traditional in turn, if she doesn't want to be traditional that is fine but she has no right to demand traditionalism from him. Its really that simple (and again, you understand this, your just playing at being stupid because your more interested in white knighting then acting in a rational way (it both emasculating and undignified but its your choice to do it).

In short, every interaction is conditional, if you were laying around on the couch and she was supporting you she would leave you, if you did not provide anything for her she would leave you because that is the nature of interactions. If you wish to continue to play stupid and act weak that is your choice but don't sit their and try to justify your weakness to me.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

I don't have an example because I just agreed with you that is always conditional. But I also said that it goes both ways, men don't love unconditionaly more than women.

Do you read? I said we are equals I don't put men down at all! I just don't put women down like you. Needing to put them down to feel like a big shot, now that is pathetic.

Please feel free to show me that research that says women who marry men who make less are more likely to divorce. I am curious to see the percentage and the source.

It is a fact that women tend to marry men who make more money because of the types of career men tend to chose that make more money. But it is also a fact that as long as he has a job, which is something everyone wants in a partner, she will not reject him. I know more than one couples my age where both have superior degrees and she makes more money. Put in your head that today women don't need money from us. They did in the past because they didn't had jobs. Now that they do they don't need our money, but need our companionship, our care our touch and our love just as much if not more than before.

If you never felt that your value as a man to women was more than a ATM I have some bad news about your quality as a man.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

So you have the duty to bring money home and she has the duty to suck your dick in return? I shit on that! That is what you do with a prostitute. My wife blows me because she wants me, not because she has to.

We both have the duty to provide for the house. We both have the duty to take care of the kids when they come, and none of us has the duty to fuck the other. We do it because we want to, not because some transactions is taking place. That is not a relationship.

You really think that masculine men don't have to be the ones that will expect them to clean the floor 24/7. They want the masculine guy that will accept them as equals. They can have it both and so can we! We can have a woman that brings money home, but is nurturing and caring. You just think of extremes, it doesn't work like that.

"Women don't nuture". Oh how I love guys like you. Yes they do, but who do you expect them to do it for someone that is constantly bitching about how "women are this and that."? You act like men have no value aside from money, you don't even give us credit for our value as sexual partners, you have a victim mentality and YET I am the one who is emasculating and undignified us. Sure... You make us look like society and women's victims. That is just weak.

[hellionthesagereborn]

@ThisIsMyOpinion Never said men didn't have conditions, I just stated men have far fewer then women and again, this is a provable fact (not sure why you would pretend this isn't the case when women themselves all but admit to it).

As for the sources, your not curious, your going to dismiss it the moment I present it because that's what people like you do. Your to convinced that you are right and every one else wrong that any data given that doesn't support your belief structure is immediately disregarded (I know because I have these discussions all the time and they all have the same talking points, the same way of phrasing things.).
ifstudies.org/.../
www.westoverlaw.com/.../...-divorce-than-men.shtml
https://nymag.com/nymetro/news/features/n_9495/
www.dailymail.co.uk/.../...e-lead-wives-stray.html
www.theguardian.com/.../womens-rights-happiness-wellbeing-gender-gap

As the data shows, women are fare more likely to wait to marry some one who earns more, and more likely to divorce a man who makes less. Both parties report being unhappy with switched roles, and men who are in the more traditionally female role are less likely to get sex from their wife then traditional men.

Feel free to ignore this, nit pick, or take one sentence and apply it to every single source in a desperate attempt to justify your white knighting (not that you needed my permission to do so (because you people are so predictable).

[hellionthesagereborn]

@ThisIsMyOpinion As for the rest of your pandering, women did have jobs in the past. We have documents going back to the 1300s with lists of female master blacksmiths. We know that women worked all the time, the goal for htem however was not to work. The reason why its different now is because we have a social welfare system that takes money from men and gives it to women (studies show men pay about 200x more in taxes then women over their life span, almost all welfare is consumed by women, 80% of alimony and childsupport are paid by men (of the 20% that women are expected to pay only about 30% actually do (with no consequence for not doing it)) etc. etc. We have created a society where instead of men and women exchanging what they have, the government and society takes from men to give to women (which is also why women have become such terrible people in recent decades, because they have no responsibilities, just privilege with no consequence for their actions).

As for the ATM comment, your being intentionally obtuse, stop, I don't like people acting stupid. At no point did I suggest that was the case, though many women do in fact see men that way (hence over 70% of divorces being female initiated (about 10% of them specifically being due to him making less money by the way), and out of the 30% initated by men about 20% of them is due to the wifes infidelity). What was being stated is that love for men is significantly more conditional then for others, and its only getting worse due to the system we have and men spineless bootlicking men like yourself who think that if you pander enough some how that you will be taken seriously (you won't). Again, if you want to grovel that is entirely our choice, but don't pretend like its not what it is.

[Asker]

@hellionthesagereborn Very well said sir. Mr. @thisismyopinion has no clue, he is newly married and has never had any rough spots in his life. He will eventually learn, either first hand or through watching women torture his friends.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@hellionthesagereborn
Debatable. Saying women have more conditons than men do depends a lot on who you ask.

Yes women tend to mary men who make more because of the choices men and women usually do. That doesn't change the fact that they have more money than they ever did. Not needing us to provide for them. She can be a doctor and earn well and marry another doctor who happens to make more. But to sa that she married him for his income... Do you really think she needed that?
Women are more likely to file for divource more yes. Also men are also more likely to be domestic abusers, more likely to cheat and to stop putting an effort on the relationship as time goes by. There you have it why women file for divorce more that the article forgets to talk about.
The alpha women beta men is to long to read. Bt it has no stats whatsoever. Yes there are submissive guys and there are dominant women. So what? They are the minority. Nothing to be worked about.
Same as before. Stay at home dads are rare. And the topic was not ven about them. I talked about equal duty at home. Not giving it all to men.
Didn't make women happier? o tell the women that can abort now that. Go tell the women that can now drive that. Go tell every single women CEO that and see what they tell you.

They didn't wait to marry someone that makes more. Think for a second. "Hey this guys is perfect! Everything I wnat in a man. But oh he makes less 100 than me a month so I don't want him! Oh look a guy that I don't even like r am attracted that much, but he makes more 100 a mounth than me. He is the one!" This is your logic...

Did you expect me not to answer you? Of course I will. Just like you answered me once and will answer this too. That is what arguying is and exanging ideas is.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@hellionthesagereborn
Are you serious?
Do you really think that women had any visible liberty whatsoever in that time? Come on you must know better than that.
They pay more because they earn more! Trust me on that sense women wish they paid more taxes.
Put together the resons I gave you for women divorcing men and you might get a clue why we pay more chid support. Also in 51% of the cases in US both the motehr and the father agree that the chid should stay with the mother.
I find it funny when someone says women have no responsabilities today. I have three female doctors in my family who save lives everyday. No responsabilities. My wife works like me for a multinational company. I don't have more responsabilities than her. In what world do women have no responsabilities?

See my comment above on why women get divorced. Also if he lost his job and doesn't do anything to get a new one he will make less money and is a good reason to dump his lazy ass. Don't tell that the problem is him amking less than her because if that was the case she would never got married in the first place.
20% of supposed infidelity. Even if those 20% all cheated we still have them beat on how often we jump the fence.

Is it tho? You have a very narrow view of things. You are assuming it want it all and we want nothing. That is far vfrom the truth, they do not expect more from us then we expect of them. And this I can assure you.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@hellionthesagereborn
Now for the best... Why didn't you adressed all that I said?
You didn't adressed anything I said in the second post. I was particularly intersted in your response to this part...
"Women don't nuture". Oh how I love guys like you. Yes they do, but who do you expect them to do it for someone that is constantly bitching about how "women are this and that."? You act like men have no value aside from money, you don't even give us credit for our value as sexual partners, you have a victim mentality and YET I am the one who is emasculating and undignified us. Sure... You make us look like society and women's victims. That is just weak."

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@Asker "has never had any rough spots in his life" You clearlyy have no idea what my life was like.
Also don't worry about me or my friends. My closest friends and I all have good women at our side.

[hellionthesagereborn]

@ThisIsMyOpinion No, it doesn't. According to scientific surveys and research women have more criteria then men. Men care about looks, women care about looks, money, status, height etc. This is scientific fact.

As for women's liberty, you claiming they were oppressed doesn't make them oppressed. What your confusing is standards vs. no standards. See because your a white knight you think that having any expectations of a woman is oppression, but this isn't reality.

Women could own land if they where not married but not when married, why? Because the husband was legally responsible for that land, had to pay the taxes on it and because we were agrarian for almost all of our history they also had to till the land something women couldn't physically do, in order to produce food for those women. It was considered immoral to put the responsibility on him without giving him a way to control how the land was used. She couldn't vote, why? Because women didn't want the right to vote. Men only got the right to vote, in the US at least, about 67 years before women, why? Because they where forcibly conscripted (i. e. enslaved) against their will in to the military, bucket brigades and posses for police. Women didn't want that responsibility so they fought tooth and nail not to have it, only accepting the right to vote when they where assured they would not have the subsequent responsibity. The modern day is no different, women want all the privilege and none of the responsibility. That's why women demand traditionalism from men and non traditionalism for themselves.

[hellionthesagereborn]

@ThisIsMyOpinion I mean look at you, look at how slavishly devoted to women you are, look how you will crawl on your belly to serve women. Do you think that's something men are not wired for? We are built to give them what ever we can, that's why ancient societies pointed out that women could also be evil, that femininity, like masculinity, could become disfunctional and destructive. The difference is you refuse to see that, you would rather blow smoke up their ass and tell them how they are perfect in all ways and men are worthless pieces of shit (you have to believe that if you think men oppressed women for all of history for no reason what so ever). Its pathetic but you'll never be able to see that (maybe if you are unfortunate enough to have a woman destroy you as utterly as she is capable of doing, maybe you'll see the truth then.).

[hellionthesagereborn]

@Asker he is weak, he uses women to validate himself instead of having that validation come from within. Women are not evil but neither are men. What they are is human and if you refuse to hold them to a standard, just like with children, they will become more often then not twisted and hateful. Just what it is. White knighting is most harmful to women but he doesn't actually care about them, he just wants them to pat him on the head and tell him he is a good boy and that's just not something I can respect.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@hellionthesagereborn
No dude men don't only care about looks. We are more visual than women are, but to say that's all we care about is downgrading us. Yet again...

I didn't said women are opressed today. You are not even reading what I say.
"having any expectations of a woman is oppression". Oukey now I know for 100% sure that you don't read what I say! Are you joking? You have to be. When did I said that having any expectations for women is opression? I am seriously confused now. Please tell me what did I said that gave you that idea. I really want to know because you are misunderstanding what I say left and right. And for the record, we need to have as much expectation for women as we have for men.

I believe women to be on the same playing field as we are. You actually think we are bellow women with all this victim mentality crap.

Oh I loved this part! Do you realise that you just said thing that women couldn't do before that they now are really thankfull that they can do now? I really laugh at this because you actually act like now having the right to own land, to vote, to have more responsabilities than to be a housewife is something bad and today's women don't want it. Again are you serious? Do you really think women don't like to vote, to be landlords to have a life outside the house? Are you mental?

By the way thanks for not responding to the things I said again... It's becoming a thing.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@hellionthesagereborn
You and many guys here think I do this for women when I actually do it for us. Think about it... How hHUMILIATING it is to see guys here afraid of saying "Hi" to a girl. Saying that "feminism killed masculinity" like that was even possible! Saying that women are all evil and have us under their thumbs. FUCK THAT! I will open everyone's eyes to the fact that they are not powerless on this world.

By the do way do you a brain? Does Asker has a brain? Do men have a brain? Then no we are wired to do shit. If we were wired for anything we would still be living on caves the reason we are not is because we can think! We are not slaves to our impulses because over our evolutions those impulses got weaker and weaker. Any person, men or women, that uses that as an excuse is simply trying to avoid responsability.

The difference between you and me is that I want men to feel strong. Not to feel weak under today's society. Many here on this site do. You and others like you perpetuate the idea that we should be scared of women. Do you know how demeaning that is t us?

Good luck to any women to destroy me. Even if I divorce we will separate our things 50-50 like it says on the marriage contract and have joint custody if I have kids after it happens. So I couldn't be worried less than I am. And that is being a man! Not being afraid of what women can do to you!

[Asker]

@ThisIsMyOpinion Women will weigh your long-term prospects and if they can jump to a better man, than they will decide to leave you or not. Don't kid yourself. You wife does not love you unconditionally, regardless of what "vows" she took at the alter. You are disposable and replaceable.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@Asker if she goes for another man it will be because she loves him more. Not because he makes more money or looks better than me. That I can assure you.

[hellionthesagereborn]

@ThisIsMyOpinion You like being obtuse don't you? No one said that all men care about is looks, your aware of that yet you pretend like you don't understand. Men prefer women who are attractive, this is an absolute fact neither you nor any one else can argue against that and not look like an idiot. I never once said that is all that matters, I never said that they will only date women who are tens (men are pretty loose with their idea of attractive) but that they will want a woman they find physically attractive. So you have shown that speaking to you is a waste of time because you intentionally misrepresent what is being said and dance around the subject. Your a white knight who needs women to validate himself and while that is your right to do so, it in no way shape or form reflects reality.

[hellionthesagereborn]

@ThisIsMyOpinion As for women, yes I stated they have more legal rights then men in the western world and that is a provable fact. Now you can make believe what you want, however at no point will claiming all men are evil pieces of shit (the only argument you can make when claiming that all men oppressed all women for no particular reason (and with absolutely no evidence to back it)) be an effective argument. So again, women were never oppressed, provably and objectively speaking (I know you, you operate on your feelings instead of reason but I simply cannot do that, reason trumps feelings every time (yet another example of how effeminate white knights really are)) and provably and objectively speaking women have more legal rights (based upon the law i. e. objective fact) then men currently. That is not victim mentality (but claiming to be oppressed for all of history for no reason other then "vagina" most definitely is), that is a statement of provable fact.

[hellionthesagereborn]

@ThisIsMyOpinion As for all the other bullshit, I stated women where never oppressed in the past, I then pointed out that they are even less so today. Your ignoring what is being said over and over again because again, you are weak. I cannot stand people like you, you intentionally ignore, obfuscate or sidestep statements because you are to weak to face your own beliefs and see if they really do hold up. Your a coward and quite frankly, you are worthless as a man. If you wish to pander to women and blow smoke up their ass and tell them they are perfect in all ways that only men are worthless and women are perfect you are free to do so, but you will be wrong and you will not be deserving of respect (and you wont' be respected for it). As stated their is no point in talking to you because you do not listen you do not respond to points that were brought up, you bring up things that are unrelated, you then misrepresent what is stated and quite frankly I would have a more productive conversation with a brick wall then you. I'm trying to stay polite but you have decided to be disingenuous and intentionally obtuse so I'm loosing my patience (as should be apparent. Perhaps this is your goal all along, I don't know and I don't care). So this conversation is done, you are more then welcome to speak when you actually address what is stated instead of acting like your to stupid to understand basic concepts.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@hellionthesagereborn
We all want an attractive partner! So what? That was not my point. My point is that we do look to more than looks. Just that. So you can say women want this and that, well so do we.

I never once said that all men were big pieces of shit. We are fucking amazing! I mean the ones that don't bich about women all day like they are little weak things are. It's just sad. Never said that and I never will, so to say that it was my only argument, when if you scroll back I never said it, but I did said many others kinda proves that you are the one who is clearly not adressing what the other is saying.

Women were never opressed in the past? Are you kidding or just igorant? That is a fact whatever you want it or not. Or you hate women so much that you can't see it? My money is on option C.

You are the one twisting what I say. You argued that they actually wanted to keep not having any responsabilities today. That they didn't wanted it back then and they don't want it today. That's what I was mentioning and you know it. I said that they do want it. That was my argument. Don't try to run away from the fact that YOU actually said that women today don't want to vote, to be landlords or have any responsability. YOU said that and you are now trying to avoid it by saying I am not adressing what you said. What you write stays written here you know? And I am the brick wall... Oh well I shouldn't expect much.

But By all means tell me what I have not adressed and I will answer you. No really do that. I have no worries about anything you might say so go for it. Tell me what points I missed and I will give you feedback on them.

Again not reading anything and accusing me of being a women pleaser when I already said I want men to stop acting is such an embarrassing way. You are an embarassemnt to men. Crying like a baby that women this and women that. Always complaining like they are all evil and you are a poor victim. Makes me sick. You are pathetic.

[ThisIsMyOpinion]

@hellionthesagereborn
Also two things...
1. You keep not adressing what I said on that post as to why I do what I do. After I told you to do it many times. Good job on doing that and then accuse me of dodging the subject.
2. Do you remember how the conversation was about unconditional love? I bet you didn't you absolute joke! Do you know why we are talking about everything you can thing off now to put women down? Because you are stating everything that comes to you mind to try and dismiss them. Anyway you can is good. "Hey that person didn't washed his hands, so I am sure he also hates jews!"
And I am the one not adressing your points!!! This is has to be a comedy! xD
So my friend... Take a step back. Take a deep breath. Remember the subject and get back at me later will ya? I mean if you manage to adress what I say this time. Best of luck to that.

[MeltMilk]

I actually always wanted to try to pay on dates to beat the 'golddigger' stereotype lol. I've also dated guys my own height too (5'6"). Beauty is on the inside.

[David92506]

In the dating world, it definitely seems like a man has to provide something in order to be in a relationship with an attractive woman. But I don't agree with your assertion because my Mom loves me and I don't provide her with anything.

[Liam_Hayden]

Sounds like a MGTOW whine to me. I do not love anyone "unconditionally." I love my friends and relatives and the women I have dated long term, but always conditioned upon their not trying to steal from me or intentionally harm me.

[ILoveAnime]

I don't agree. I think everyone expects things out of everyone. They don't say explicity that you have too, but you can see the implications.

[advicecream]

If that’s true it’s also true that only attractive women are loved unconditionally.

[jaybee281]

Both of these are true actually i don't see how people are saying it's not

[advicecream]

I agree

[Mezius]

I have my standards and desires, but I would be grateful for any woman at all to show me honest affection at this point. This world makes me sick.

[MeltMilk]

I thought it was actually men that were incapable of loving women unconditionally (I thought they'd stop loving if the woman became ugly somehow, even if her personality is as beautiful as ever). I loved a man unconditionally, and he said he'd love me for as long as I was still physically beautiful.
Maybe it's just a case of there being ugly-personality men and women who pursue looks. I want my beauty to be a bonus to someone's love, not the reason and prerequisite.

[MannMitAntworten]

Nah, my pets love me unconditionally and I’m the fucker who sits upon the Pale Horse if you fuck with my pets... and Hell follows with me.