The Disillusionment of White Millennial Men on Race and Gender

[DaddyRollingStone]

I've been noticing more and more lately that the affects of post-modern society have been taking affect on the West's youth. Most specifically white men. I am speaking about this from personal experience as well as first-hand experience. I'm going to cover topics that include: the causation for the disillusionment of men and how it affects us regarding sex, the causation for the disillusionment of men and how it affects us in terms of race as well. This will be rather lengthy so strap yourselves in.

Relationships

Causation: Feminism

Feminism. Where do we even start? Well firstly by stating that the core idea of feminism is that men hold women down and keep them from reaching their full potentials, aka "patriarchy." Thus, many feminists hold resentment for men because of a delusional theory that somehow simply being born as a man means you will succeed in life while being born as a woman means you will inevitably fail. There will be plenty of "moderate feminists" who defend this claim and say that feminism is really about equality Feminism is taught today in public schools all over the US, some places worse than others. Furthermore, it was originally in the 70s when 2nd wave feminists rallied and protested and allowed many women to enter the workforce, ultimately ending the times of when women put being housewives first.

Causation: Porn and the Sex Industry

I'm definitely going to catch flak for this from men, but let's be honest: Watching execesive porn is bad for you.

"Kuhn and Galinat’s evidence suggests that it might: The men who had watched more porn had smaller volume in the striatum, a region of the brain’s reward network... The men who watched the most porn also had less activity in the striatum when viewing pictures of naked women. Since porn is, presumably, rewarding, the link between striatum size and time watching porn could mean that repeated exposure dulls the reward circuitry’s response to pleasure." https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/you-illuminated/201406/have-we-discovered-hidden-danger-pornography

Of course, this is from regular usage of pornography. Looking at it every once in a while won't hurt you. Also, watching too much porn has been known to give men unrealistic expectations of the women they meet in real life. If you are an average looking guy that jerks off to models everyday, average looking women (the women who you would be able to date) are suddenly not good looking enough for your attention. This obviously will cause disparities in your relationships.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Aftermath: Abandonement of Family Values and Relationships

MGTOW is the movement for men that is a direct result of feminism specifically. Many MGTOWs will say that they have given up on the concept of intimate relationships due to being hosed over in a bad divorce, which is perfectly understandable. But what about the men who have never been married before? They believe that women offer nothing of value in terms of marriage, that men are still expected to be chivalrous gentlemen but women can do whatever they want. Many even dislike women for this. It's not worth the trouble because there is so little reward. This is resulting in a generation of men who are happy bachelours and women that are growing impatient waiting to settle down.

"Seventy percent of American males between the ages of 20 and 34 are not married... After decades of feminism, Crouse noted that young men are now the ones who set the parameters for intimate relationships, and those increasingly do not include a wedding ring." https://cnsnews.com/news/article/barbara-hollingsworth/bachelor-nation-70-men-aged-20-34-are-not-married

Aftermath: Traditionalism

Traditionalism is an alternate, less popular reaction to feminism and postmodernism. Traditonalists emphasize the importance of religion and morals in society to fight the error of modern culture. Traditionalists are pro-family and pro-marriage but many of them feel that feminism has ruined a generation of women and there is no hope for them to find a wife that has similar values to theirs. These young men are not the average "turn the other cheek Christians" that you meet at church every Sunday, they only accept the original forms of their faith. They are mostly Catholics and Orthodox Christians, there are Protestants as well but due to the nature of their beliefs, Protestants are 2nd-class. The best way to describe these people is to think of a radical 3rd wave feminist and then imagine the exact opposite. It is also worth noting that MGTOWs and Traditionalists are not very fond of each other.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Race

Causation: European Migrant Crisis

The migrant crisis has been going on for years, but it has only recently hit the mainstream due to the photo of the drowned Syrian boy (who was actually from Turkey). In Sweden the number of rapes has increased 500% since they have taken in so many immigrants from 3rd world countries.

"In 2003, Sweden's rape statistics were higher than average at 9.24, but in 2005 they shot up to 36.8 and by 2008 were up to 53.2. Now they are almost certainly even higher as Muslim immigrants continue forming a larger percentage of the population." https://www.frontpagemag.com/point/175434/1-4-swedish-women-will-be-raped-sexual-assaults-daniel-greenfield

Meanwhile In Germany, it is being noted that they are importing almost the same number of immigrants from Asia and Africa as native Germans are born in a year. If Germany wants to stay German then this is completely unsustainable. "465,000 newcomers moved to the country in 2013" but in Germany, during the year 2013, only 682,000 Germans were born.

https://www.euractiv.com/sections/global-europe/germany-ranks-second-most-popular-immigration-destination-310486

https://www.dw.com/en/germany-birth-rate-rises/a-18664819

Causation: Whites Being Targetted for Violent Crimes by Non-Whites

I'm also going to loop in the Ferguson and Baltimore riots with this one. Slavery ended 150 years ago, Civil rights was 50 years ago. So what's the deal? Most Americans are considerably not racists, but how much can you take before you lose it? I've grown up all around this, watching it happen, how do you expect someone like me to have a postitve worldview when everyday on my local 5 o'clock news there is more black on black shootings, armed robberies, rapes, and hit and runs and I've been seeing that everyday since I knew what was going on. Here are some stats for you folks:

Total Murders committed by blacks in 2011: 2925
Total Murders committed by whites in 2011: 2823

White victims of black murderers: 448
Black victims of white murderers: 193

Murdering rate for blacks 7.1 / 100,000
Murdering rate for whites 1.1 / 100,000

Victimhood rate for blacks 6.7 / 100,000
Victimhood rate for whites 1.3 / 100,000
Raw Data used: https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-6

https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/table-43

Causation: Race Baiting/Anti-White Media

It seems to become common in mainstream media to attack white people for being white. It is normal to claim that racism is rampant in the US yet minorities today have it better than any of their ancestors ever did. During the George Zimmerman trial over the murder of Trayvon Martin, the media relentlessly reported that Trayvon Martin, an innocent black boy, had been murdered by an evil white man named George Zimmerman. But let's look at a picture of George, shall we?

Does he look white to you? To me he looks like a Latino-American. The media was looking for anything to get their hands on to make Geroge Zimmerman look worse, and get their station more ratings. This relentless propaganda-like campaign resulted in civil unrest when Zimmerman was not found guilty of manslaughter.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Aftermath: Racism

Kind of a given, isn't it? This may be the first time that an upcoming generation is more conservative than their parents and especially grandparents. Like I said earlier, you can't grow up around all this bad stuff happening and come out of it with a positive worldview. Life just doesn't work like that. Many racists that I know personally, are of the opinion that not all non-whites are bad but the majority of them are. They think that we should stop trying to accomadate them into our society and just leave them alone to deteriotate. Racial tension in the US is only rising, and it's not going to get better until it gets worse. Not really much to say about this other than people just dislike other races more.

Aftermath: Obsession with Homogenous Authoritarian Cultures

These indivuduals really only exist in what are referred to as "alt-right" circles. Alt-right is basically a blanket term for anyone who is not a typical conservative. I think obsession with these types of plaes, especially Nazi Germany, is intended to fulfill desires created by lack of strong leadership in the Government or any other faucet of life. The Nazis were certainly impressive, and scary if I'm to be honest. But this is usually an admiration of their strength and will-power taken too far. If you want to understand the appeal of it better, go onto the internet and listen to one Adolf Hitler's speeches. They are very powerful and moving, no matter what he is saying. Watch videos of Wehrmacht soldiers fighting and marching, they have a certain profesionalism about them that just makes even the average German soldier extremely intimidating.

So in conclusion: Everything is fucked up and only getting worse

[Starrk]

Oh lord where do I even begin with this hot mess.

I'll start with race since that has always been my speciality as a Social Science major.

First thing first. Muslim is not a race. It's a group that simply shares the same religious beliefs. Next, the increase in rapes in Sweden is not a result of Muslims fleeing to the country. You won't find one single reputable site stating such. All you have are blogs written by people who believe correlation = causation.. If you were to have done your research you would know that ever since 2005, the Swedish police definition of rape has changed along with how they classify rapes. The increase in rapes you see in Sweden is a result of the police widening the definition of rape. Basically, what wasn't consider rape 15 years ago, now is.
https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-19592372

Crime stats don't correlate to race but more to poverty. Poverty has always been known as a incubator for crime regardless of which ethnicity was being affected. I assure you a white man living in the trailer parks is more likely to commit a crime then a black middle class pre-med student. Since blacks are overrepresented in America's poverty, they are more prone to be victims and perpetrators of criminal activity. This isn't a race problem, but more so a socioeconomic one.

The media isn't attacking whites. Hell, I can argue they attack blacks and latinos more by making them look like deviants to society. Having open debates on race and informing the masses about the disadvantages that minorities face socially, isn't an attack on whites but more so an act of trying to enlightenment the majority, who don't have to go through these issues thus are oblivious to it.

Racial tension is actually getting better not worst. Interracial marriages was illegal a mere 50 years ago, fast forward to 2015 and the rate of interracial relationships have grown. Peoples opinion of it have shifted to becoming accepting of it, including those in the deep south. Minorities that were once pushed around and beaten are gaining economic and social power in the American system.

The World isn't becoming more fucked up. Your bias and traditional views, which goes against the liberal society we are progressing to, is clouding your vision.

[Tromba]

"Crime stats don't correlate to race but more to poverty."

That seems to be more or less true for Latinos but not for blacks. Even controlling for the poverty rate, the single mother rate, the living in a rundown urban area rate & etc the murder rate for blacks is still over twice as high as for whites. But hey i guess that's better than over six times as high right?

I guess my point is excuses aren't helping anybody, more like enabling.

[Starrk]

@Tromba

What I said prior goes for blacks as well. The difference for why the murder rates is more in black poverty as opposed to white poverty is due to proximity. Studies have shown the poor blacks are more likely to be clustered together, in term of neighboring, with other poor blacks. This concentration of poverty stricken people in one general area, intensifies the negative aspect of poverty. Poor whites on the other hand are less likely to congregate into one neighborhood or area, which explain why their murder rates are much lower.

www.washingtonpost.com/.../

https://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/badcomm.htm

So like I said prior, "Crime stats don't correlate to race but more to poverty". Poverty is and has ALWAYS been the incubator for crime.

[Tromba]

That doesn't hold up. Other poor people, Latinos and whites in places like West Virgina are or were clustered without these extreme effects. If you torture statistics they will tell you whatever story you want to hear.

[Starrk]

@Tromba

I can tell by how you responded that you didn't read none of the links that I gave you. You probably just glanced at the numbers. If you would have read it, you would know that they go in great details explaining black and white poverty (Latino poverty is unaccounted for, however if you glance at the Latino ghettos in the outskirts of L. A, they are no different from the Black ghettos).

Black poverty just doesn't stop at the doorstep. It expands beyond the neighborhood, to the grocery stores, to the public school system and to almost every single institution near it. If you don't believe me, then simply take a look at ghettos in Detroit or Chicago or LA or Houston or Atlanta or Miami or NYC. It's a trend that is very constant. This issue isn't prevalent in white poverty. I have never seen poverty in white communities that have became so bad that even the nearby schools are poor.

So my argument does hold up, your rebuttal however doesn't.

[Tromba]

You can go on feeling good about yourself but the truth is you aren't helping people by making excuses for them, you are only making the swamp of resentment which fuels their anti social behavior that much easier to sink into. You are part of the problem.

[Starrk]

@Tromba

It's not excuses it's facts. I never implied that there aren't other variables at play here such as bad subcultures, bad lifestyle, bad role models and etc. All I'm saying is that all those things came as a RESULT of the cycle of poverty (and constant discrimination) that existed in the black community. Which is why I placed most of the blame on poverty.

I'm not placing ALL the blame on poverty, because there are definitely other environmental variables at play, but you can't sit here and say poverty isn't the primary hurdle in these communities.

The good news is that poverty in the black community is decreasing and has continued to do so since the 60s. The bad news is, it's not decreasing fast enough.

[hellionthesage]

We do know it is a racial problem. The fact is when you remove all means of shaming/punishing a behavior you remove all control over that group. In the media they tend to gloss over black on white crime if they don't ignore it outright, they falsly represent the black victims when their is white on black "crime" as with the trevon martin case where it was shown that he had a history of drug use, theft, and was kicked out of school for destruction of property, all of which where minor but also does give insight into his character which of course was ignored. They also ignored that Zimmerman was beaten before he fired, unless one assumes he broke his own nose and slammed the back of his head onto concrete of his own accord (a strange assumption). This shows a prefferential treatment towards blacks, not a socioeconomic issue but in fact a racial one. One could state your liberal views and training are clouding your perspective.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

Please don't bring the Trayvon Martin and George Zimmerman case into here. That was a Florida case and since I'm a native here, I know very much about that case. The fact of the matter is that both parties were wrong. Zimmerman was wrong for defying police orders into not pursuing the "suspect" while Trayvon shouldn't have attacked him. But there is no denying that Zimmerman was the instigator in that situation. Just because he has a gun doesn't give him the right to defy a police orders especially when the suspect in question is not bothering anyone.

Also George Zimmerman has been in many run ins with the police after that Trayvon Martin verdict, so I guess that give us some insight on his character as well.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

There is no favoritism towards blacks, because if there was then all the negative stereotypes that perpertrate the Black community would no longer exist.

Now, is there sympathy towards blacks due to historical treatment? Yes.

Does this sympathy make them a privileged group of people who everyone is showing favoritism for? Hell No!

Because if it was, then blacks wouldn't be overrepresented in the prison system, nor would they be more likely to get a higher sentence for doing the same exact crime that a white man did. Nor would they be the main recipients of the stop and frisk policy. Nor would they always be portrayed as thugs and illiterate gangstas in Hollywood films which is presented to the international world. Nor would they have a higher chance of being shot by police officers, for simply being black.

Just because some whites are now getting criticize doesn't mean they are suddenly the oppressed group. If you want to argue that, then you would be a fool.

[hellionthesage]

The suspect in question was found with a screw driver and jewelery. Their had been repeated reports of break ins (screw driver being very good for jimming windows open) specificly jewelry being stolen. He saw some one who appeared to be climbing in to windows and he proceeded forward (whether or not he should have is another thing) The fact is he was not some innocent bistandard (in fact the robberies correlate to the time he started to live in the area) so again this seems to be an example of how things are skewed to make blacks look like victims when evidence suggests otherwise. As for the murder rate, that is due to black on black violence not whites. Single mothers is an issue in the black community but that is a choice they make, not whites. So again this is skewing the problem to push the burden of responsibility on to whites. Every thing you are listing is due to the problems that originate in the black community, not due to whites unfairly judging.

[hellionthesage]

Their is greater violence in the black community their fore they are more unfairly treated because their is statistical evidence showing them to be more violent. On the individual level that is unfair but its a logical type of unfair in that we can prove the greater probability of violence and crime. The reason this is such an issue ( every group in the world has been a slave and slaver, misreater and mistreated) is that we refuse to acknowledge the root cause, that is the removal of responsibility. If nothing is their fault then by extention their is nothing they can do to stop it thus resulting in them waiting for some one else to solve the problems, the problems they are creating. If you remove cause you remove action, if they cannot affect their own lives then they have no will, they lack the ability to cause a change and this is what our society (whites specificly) are telling them, that they are helpless and can do nothing about it so don't try.

[hellionthesage]

The black community has been getting worse the more society has pittied them. Marriage rates where higher as well as employment during segregation then they are now. Teen pregnancy was down as well as black on black violence. The only change is how they where treated by whites ie babied. This is the greatest tragedy of all because you just keep poisioning them not realizing that your actually instigating these problems not fixing them. They do not deserve that, they deserve to be treated as equals not as inferiors.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

Of course the murder rate issue is black on black crime. Intraracial crimes are much common then interracial due to the fact that America self segregate itself based on race and class. As for single mothers, that is a growing issue (since the 1970s) in ALL racial categories (except Asians). Blacks are just leading the charge, but they are not the only group that is apart of this growing trend.

As for your little paragraph on racial profiling, I have nothing against it because identifiers such as skin complexion, tattoos, hair color, eye color and etc are a great way to catch a suspected criminal. However I do have a problem with racial profiling when race/ethnicity is the ONLY identifier for a possible suspect. When this occur, this is what leads to innocent people being accused simply for being THEMSELVES and that is not right and it is NEVER acceptable. That's why the stop and frisk policy was wrong because race became the only identifier to cops, nothing else.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

Teen pregnancy has been actually been decreasing among ALL demographics (still high in black women, but still decreasing nevertheless) and Marriage have been decreasing among ALL demographics as well. Those trends have nothing to do with the black community but more so the values of America changing.

As for black on black crime, they are actually lower now then they were back then. Black on Black crime reached its lowest point in the 2000s, not the 1950s or the 1980s but in the 2000s.

As for the black employment rate I believe that can be due to many reasons, one of which is that many poor blacks are oblivious to the amount of opportunity out there or maybe they don't know how to reach it. Another reason is that many of the manufacturing jobs that blacks use to work at during the days of segregation are no longer here. Since most blacks don't go to college their horizon of employment is pretty limited. Many variables, but I'm sure it's a cluster of many reasons.

[hellionthesage]

"Of course the murder rate issue is black on black crime" so how can this be attributed to whites then as you suggested? Again the numbers presented show that its blacks who are more violent towards those outside their race then whites:
White victims of black murderers: 448
Black victims of white murderers: 193
So that would be a black issue not an issue caused by whites. Again, the fact that single mothers are more predominant in black communities would suggest its a black issue unrelated to white people (except in how whites have pushed feminism who, if you read the older feminist literature, actively attempted to dismantle the family unit specificly targeting the black community being more open to the "victim" mentality that feminism was/is pushing hence it correlating perfectly with the rise of feminism and feminisms sexual "revolution") So the only influence that whites have on these statistics is by them not shaming but encouraging the behavior by removing responsibility.

[hellionthesage]

Teen pregnancy has been decreasing , since when though? www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/databriefs/db89_fig1.png
Its only recently that they have begun to decreese from their surge in the 80s/90s and they where at an all time high in the 60s-70s.(again corresponding to the sexual revolution)
www.google.com/search
The abortion rate as you can see is much higher which also influences that rate, they are decreasing of course but they are still substantial and as you can see spike to extreme degrees during the rise of feminism.
thebirdman.org/.../proportion.gif
Again their is a decrease but that decrease is from the 80s-90s not from the 50s which where again, much less violent. In fact in all data we can see that their was a spike in the 60s-70s where feminism and liberal thought began to permeate society. The idea that every group (other then whites) where victims started at this point and has we begin to move away from that thinking we have actually seen a reduction in these issues, not an increase as we have when this ideology first serfuced.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

LOL

What in the blue hell have you gotten me into. How did I go from preaching that poverty is the primary issue affecting the black community, to arguing whether it's the white man's fault to arguing about teen pregnancy rates to abortion rates and then to black on black crime rate. I'm not even going to lie to you, I have no idea what hell we are arguing about or why we are arguing in the first place.

Please answer these three questions, so I can get a better understanding on if we are simply arguing semantics or not.

1) Do you believe poverty is the primary force behind the issues found in the Black Community?

2) Do you believe in the idea that poverty breeds criminality?

3) Do you believe poverty is a symptom of "victimhood" in the black community or is poverty the cause of the "victimhood" found in the black community?

[hellionthesage]

We got on these topics because they interlink, nothing exists independent of other events. They are created by events and create events. As for your questions:
1. No, many groups are impoverished. Their are more whites poor then any other group, numericly speaking (Caucasians make up 70% of the population so this is not suprising.) Their are poor hispanic and Asian families yet you do not see the same issues with these groups as you do within the black community proving that poverty is not the root cause of the issue.
2. I believe poverty has the capacity to breed criminality but is not the only factor, otherwise again, as previously stated you would be seeing the same things in all ethnic groups that you see in the black community which we don't, or at least not to the extreme degree that it is found in the black community.

[hellionthesage]

3. Poverty has many causes, but it is not helped by the victimhood mentallity. You take away a persons ability to change their life the moment you convince them they have no power over their life. By claiming things are beyond their control you tell them they are helpless and so they simply except things as they are. If you tell them that it is white peoples fault due to racism, they then demand the white people fix the problem, giving more power over to the white community while placidly waiting for things to change making no effort to fix the problems themselves. I have witnessed this first hand. I know a boy who was told that his school was racist for him failing in class, not because his grandparents didn't give him structure enough so that he would go to bed at a reasonable time (he would sleep in class) not because they would not help him with his homework (in fact they actively discouraged it). So he failed and will continue to do so because he has no agency according to society.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage Sorry bro, had to finish some homework.

Anyway for the first part, I had this discussion with Tromba and I already addressed the flaw with comparing Black poverty with that of White poverty. Poor black people tend to be concentrated in the inner cities, side by side each others. Studies have shown, that when you concentrate poverty like that, regardless of ethnicity, you intensify the negative aspect of poverty, which means more crime, more bad subcultures, more bad role models, more bad influences (gangs, drugs) and etc. White poverty is more common in rural areas. This difference in geography allows poor whites to be more spread out and less in contact with one another, which prevents poor whites from having to encounter the same hurdles that poor blacks have to deal with. I mean, I'm pretty sure, most poor whites don't have to worry about gangs having shootout on their front lawn.

Here's the link to that study.
onlinelibrary.wiley.com/.../abstract

You might have to download the entire thing.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

www.washingtonpost.com/.../
www.pbs.org/.../002_04-background-03-08.htm

There are many other studies on the differences between Black and White poverty so trying to act like the two things are comparable and face the same struggles besides being poor is highly flawed. Asian poverty is so miniscule that, that demographic is irrelevant in the conversation. As for Hispanic poverty, there actually are some sects of poor Latinos that are very similar to Black poverty, such as those found in LA, New Mexico, Arizona, Florida and Texas. Hell come down to the ghettos of Miami and you'll see no difference between the behavior of poor blacks and poor latinos.

I will admit, that poverty has resulted in bad subcultures being developed in impoverished black areas which has held the group back, such as being rebellious to the mainstream culture, but once again that was an effect of the cycle of poverty they have faced for generation, along with the discrimination.

For the third part, I agree, so no argument from me.

[Starrk]

Also I just want to add in this bit of information. "Across the nation, four out of five whites live outside of the cities and 86 percent of whites live in neighborhoods where minorities make up less than 1 percent of the population. In contrast, 70 percent of Blacks and Latinos live in the cities or inner-ring suburbs."

www.pbs.org/.../002_04-background-03-08.htm

So density and lack of economic admixture greatly affects blacks and latinos more as opposed to whites who are classified in that link I gave you as "the most segregated out of all the racial groups".

[hellionthesage]

I would not disagree with your first comment except that what I was stating was that despite poverty these negative aspects are found in a much larger number amongst black communitites then any where else even hispanic. The only difference is that unlike hispanics the black community has a readily willing scape goat, whites. The fact that blacks where slaves at one point in history is talked about to this day (ironic since so was every other race, whites included) it essentially is a means of preventing social shaming from whites on black behavior because if they do they are "racist" and because even after all this time (and the fact that whites stoped participating in slavery long before blacks and middleasterns did) it is still an open wound, white guilt essentially. This is what I am reffering to. Irish whent through the same things as did italians but eventually they assimilated, blacks have not and the only difference is again, white guilt.

[hellionthesage]

If you look back far enough you will see that every group without exception was living in these conditions. The irish whould be a good example, they where forced into ghettos (cornbeef and cabbage is not actually irish food, its poor people food) and where forced to work the railroad since most places would not hire them, yet we can see today they assimlated. The same goes with the italians (who where also poor), they where accuse of being criminals because of the mafia so when ever one of them did a crime the entire community would crack down on that individual demanding that all of them be perfect essentially because th actions of one would reflect on all of them. They too where assimilated. Honestly hispanics are in a better place then blacks despite blacks being here for a greater duration of time. The only difference between all of these is when the black community fails, no one holds them accountable, its because they are poor/racism.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

And here you go again with trying to compare black hardship with that of other ethnicities. No other ethnicity or group have went through as much systematic hardship as that as American Blacks. They were forced into the country as legal slaves for nearly 300 years, then after slavery they were exposed to 100 additional years of government sanctioned segregation and discrimination. Every time blacks tried to integrate into the society peacefully, their towns were rioted and burned down (Greenwood Tulsa and Rosewood) by racist whites who couldn't stand the idea of blacks moving on.

So racism definitely plays a role in the current condition in black communities so trying to downplay the role of racism is despicable. While the Italians and Irish did go through hard times, you'll be awfully wrong to assume that their struggle was even remotely comparable to that of blacks.

Black culture today, came as a RESULT of being excluded from America's culture for centuries.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

As for Hispanics, you're right. Hispanics as a whole are doing slightly better then Blacks (poverty level between the two is nearly equal though). Hispanics tend to have a very strong family oriented culture which motivates them to succeed which I'm positive plays a role in this. Black's family oriented culture shattered back in the late 60s due to many variables. So yeah, Hispanics have that family structure which is seriously lacking in impoverished black households.

[hellionthesage]

200 years not three hundred. Whites where slaves as well, the irish where sold to slavers by oliver chromwell, those who where kidnapped where sold into slavery by middle easterners and Africans alike. Indentured servitude, the mining companies had whites as slaves long after the blacks where free (a legal slavery is still slavery). Again you bring up slavery without understanding it. Many where slaves, in fact the term slave is derived from slav or slavic to be precise ie the very term we use to identify some one who was forced into servitude against their will is the name of a group of eastern europeans, white people in other words. Your narrow view of history is the issue I am speaking of. Further more ignoring the fact that whites ended slavery before any other group and had been enslaved by every other group, that still leaves us with over a hundred and fifty years of slavery being illegal. It ended in 1865.

[hellionthesage]

So that is not applicable today. All other groups who where indentured servents/slaves managed to assimilate, the only thing those groups had in common with each other is that no one cared that they had been enslaved, that they had been segregated. Blacks are the only group where people actually cared that they where enslaved, so much so that long after its been over we still act as if they are, we still talk about it and we still use it as an excuse not to do anything when their communities fall apart because of their own actions. As for black culture how is it from being excluded? Again irish where slaves. Irish where banned from many jobs, mostly only able to work on the railroad (hence chicago having such a high number of them). They where descriminated against. The claim that blacks where some how unique in this is absurd. www.globalresearch.ca/.../31076
www.historynet.com/were-the-irish-slaves.htm

[hellionthesage]

The destruction of the black family occured with feminism. Feminism itself coopted the condition of the black community essentially creating the victim mentality I am talking about. This destroyed the family unit and by extention any social cohesion the black community had. What you are doing is perpetuating it by claiming them as victims completely and helplessly inept, so much so that their only recourse is to hope the superior white man comes in and saves them. This is a modern "white mans burden"(if you know your history you'll know what that refers too). In short what your doign is perpetuatign racism by not believing they are on the same level as you but rather beneath you, relegating them to the level of children, helpless and ignorant, to weak to change their lives for the better.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

Actually it was closer to 250 years of slavery in America, not 200. As for the history lesson on slavery, I appreciate it, but it's not needed, however I am skeptical of your constant intentions of trying to compare two thing which may seem comparable on the surface but is not. Trying to bend history to fit your own agenda won't fly, so stop it.

Now you keep talking about how everyone was capable of integrating, however you are refusing to acknowledge the simple fact that over time the Irish were ALLOWED to integrate once they started to experience political clout by joining profession like police officers and firefighters as early as the 1850s. 40% of the NYC police department in 1855 was Irish. What were majority of blacks doing in 1855? Oh shit... they were slaves. What were blacks doing after slavery? They sure as hell weren't ALLOWED positions that can lead to them one day obtaining political clout, like the Irish did, especially with Jim Crow policies around.

www.loc.gov/.../irish7.html

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

Economic, Social and Political clout are some of the things a discriminated group needs in order to be allowed to assimilate in the society by the majority (It worked for the Italians, Jews, Asians and Irish). When were Blacks as a whole finally allowed access to obtain those three things? Keep in mind most of the black population has always lived in the South, where Jim Crow was alive.

I'm not perpetrating any kind of victim mentality onto the black community. I am however in agreement, when they list racism and past discrimination as for one of the reasons for why they are so far behind. That part is undeniable and the fact that you are trying to downplay that history is despicable on your part.

No one is asking the white man to be Captain Saviour to anyone. However they do however want whites to acknowledge that past racism and discrimination has played a significant role in the disparity that you see today between the two groups. What part are you not grasping?

[hellionthesage]

But obviously you don't know history, otherwise you would not keep bringing up how blacks where slaves and others where not, you would no every one was a slave, most of the original population in america where slaves, originally white. And it was 245 years to be precise. You seem confused. The irish where allowed to assimilate that is true but that was only after they proved themselves and bettered their own communities. You mention all the jobs they could have yet we know for a fact that they did not have those jobs to start with: yesteryearsnews.files.wordpress.com/.../...873.jpg
yesteryearsnews.files.wordpress.com/.../...854.jpg
disperser.files.wordpress.com/.../...0_2_14728.jpg
It was only when they lifted their own communities up that they where allowed to integrate. That is not happening in black communities. These things are comparative. To claim they are not despite evidence is absurd. You keep saying their is a difference but the only difference you keep coming back to is skin color. That is the only difference, that and our societies woeful lack of knowledge in history and again, white guilt.

[hellionthesage]

What your doing is literally jumping over half the history, its like looking at the first chapter of a book and the last and claiming you read it. You ignored all the parts where those white communities worked their way up, where they stayed in their groups made sure their communities where functioning (also why their where irish policemen, many where working in their own communities which then showed they where capable and slowly became more accepted outside of their communities) By ignoring over fifty percent of the story, of course your going to come to the conclusion that their is a difference between the two groups. Again you place the burden of lifting up the black man on white shoulders ie "the white mans burden". This is what holds back the black community the constant attempt to undermine their abilities, constantly undermining there ability to choose to act. As long as people who think this way are in the majority, the black community will continue to suffer.

[hellionthesage]

" That part is undeniable and the fact that you are trying to downplay that history is despicable on your part." the fact that you are attacking me simply proves my point. I have never downplayed it, I stated exactly what happened and the fact that you would ignore all of history in order to hold on to an ideal is not a good thing. We know that all groups where slaves, this is indisputable. We know that all groups where descriminatd against, again indisputable. We know that almost every group eventually assimilated into the society, again indisputable. Blacks where in no different a situation then any one else only they have not assimilated. The only difference is in how people like yourself treat them ie perpetuation of a victim mentality which removes any form of free will and agency they have. If this is the only difference then one must conclude that this is the root of the problem because all other factors where the same. This is fact.

[hellionthesage]

"No one is asking the white man to be Captain Saviour to anyone. However they do however want whites to acknowledge that past racism and discrimination has played a significant role in the disparity that you see today between the two groups. What part are you not grasping?" It has never not been acknowledged. No one at any point has ever said this did not happen. There fore acknowledgement is not what is wanted because they already have that. We have an entire system dedicated to talking about, while conviently ignoring all of the slavery and racism and prejudice that affected literally every other group out their. They are in fact the only group that has this injustice acknowledged. So again that is not what is wanted. That is an absurd claim to make. What you are doing is what people have been doing for decades, you have been poking at an open wound preventing it from healing. How you cannot see that is beyond me.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

I see you love employing strawman fallacies to your reponse, because I never made such claim that no other ethnic group was slaves except blacks. That was something that you made up. I also never implied that it's white people's duty to help blacks, which again is a claim that you created by twisting my words to your benefit. Stop doing that, it's not cute

And once again we are brought back to square one where your entire premise is "Everyone was discriminated against, but they manage to do fine, except blacks". However the error in your logic is flawed because it doesn't take into account of other variables that disproportionately targeted blacks such as Jim Crow ("Separate but unequal), Redlining by banks and the FHA, Burning of affluent black neighborhoods/towns by racist whites (and the Irish), unequal education in black schools, bias court officials that frequently tried to punish blacks over simple accusations...

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

... refusal of banks to give out loans to blacks which could have help them start their own businesses ( this practice continued well past the civil rights movement), government sanctioned discrimination toward blacks, ohh and lets not forget that when the Irish finally attained job security, they did everything in their power to exclude Blacks from these jobs since blacks were a threat due to their similar circumstances. The Irish were one of groups that were actually advocating for discriminating against blacks to continue. This is mentioned in the book "How the Irish became White".
https://www.pitt.edu/~hirtle/uujec/white.html

Hell by the time America got its first President who was proud to be of Irish descent in JFK, Blacks were still being systematically held back by forces that didn't want them around. Trying to ignore all these variables and making it seem that both ethnic group faced the EXACT same hurdles at the EXACT same time for the EXACT same duration by the same EXACT forces is flawed.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

Most people's issue with the Irish at the time was more of a result of their culture which Anglo-Americans looked down upon. Most people's issue with blacks at the time was the fact that THEY WERE BLACK and blacks were at the bottom of racial hierarchy (even the Irish and Asians were seen to be superior to them).

The link I gave you and the one below mentioned that Irish were able to assimilate easily once they "embraced their whiteness" and rid themselves of the things that American's look down upon on them which was their CULTURE. Blacks on the other hand were discriminated based on inherent phenotypes which they COULD never change. While the Irish can hide their culture and easily blend into the white majority society. Blacks can't hide the complexion of their skin. That small fact which you are ignoring played a major role in Irish Americans outpacing Black Americans.

www.racismreview.com/.../

So while the Irish faced SIMILAR hurdles to that of Blacks, these hurdle weren't IDENTICAL.

[hellionthesage]

"I see you love employing strawman fallacies to your reponse, because I never made such claim that no other ethnic group was slaves except blacks. That was something that you made up. I also never implied that it's white people's duty to help blacks, which again is a claim that you created by twisting my words to your benefit. Stop doing that, it's not cute"
This is in fact an ad homined attack and a straw man argument. You stated that the black community was treated differently because of descrimination, I then pointed out that all groups where descriminated against, you then claimed that the blacks where in a unique position compared to those groups because of slavery at which point I pointed out tha tall groups where slaves. So one, you did state these things albiet indirectly hence my statements. This entire paragraph is a straw man argument, its purpose is to shift focus away from the argument and its ad homined because its meant to attack my character not my argument.

[hellionthesage]

I stated that blacks and all groups where descriminated against, you telling me they where descriminated against doesn't change what I said. I never argued they where not descriminated against. Every thing you state happend to blacks happened to every other group as well from the Asians on the west coast, to native americans, to the various white groups in the east. You repeating it isn't going to alter this fact. So why are you bringing it up? No one, as I stated earlier, has ever claimed otherwise, the only thing I said was that blacks where not the only ones but in fact all groups where treated this way. And again none of this is happening now yet we still have problems in the black community so again its not applicable. Again you repeat over and over that blacks where descriminated against, how does this change anything? So where the irish. Yes Jim crow laws where an added issue in the south but again with they don't exist any more (except based on political parties)

[hellionthesage]

So whats your point? That since blacks where more recently discriminated against that its more sever then the same exact experiences every other group had? Thats illogical, and again most of this is not applicable at the moment since its been over fifty years and things have gotten WORSE. So your going to have to change your approach because obviously repeating that which is not being questioned is getting you no where. Again no body has questioned that blacks where descriminated against, nobody, at any point in time, not in this discussion, not in society at large so now that this has been established we can move on from this "but they where descriminated against" argument. All groups where all groups where victims of violence, all groups where victims of segregation, all victims of poverty yet blacks where and are the only group who not only hasn't been assimilated but has actually gotten worse not better.

[hellionthesage]

"even the Irish and Asians were seen to be superior to them"
"Although the Africans and Irish were housed together and were the property of the planter owners, the Africans received much better treatment, food and housing. In the British West Indies the planters routinely tortured white slaves for any infraction. Owners would hang Irish slaves by their hands and set their hands or feet afire as a means of punishment. To end this barbarity, Colonel William Brayne wrote to English authorities in 1656 urging the importation of Negro slaves on the grounds that, “as the planters would have to pay much more for them, they would have an interest in preserving their lives, which was wanting in the case of (Irish)….” many of whom, he charged, were killed by overwork and cruel treatment. African Negroes cost generally about 20 to 50 pounds Sterling, compared to 900 pounds of cotton (about 5 pounds Sterling) for an Irish. They were also more durable in the hot climate, and caused fewer problems.

[hellionthesage]

The biggest bonus with the Africans though, was they were NOT Catholic, and any heathen pagan was better than an Irish Papist." This is a written account of historical treatment of irish slaves compared to blacks. IN other words your statement is incorrect. Again the only differences between the blacks and any and all other groups is time (Black slavery lasted 245 years, white slavery existed before that and Africans and middleasterners sold black slaves to whites. They also created the slave trade as we know it, perpetuated it all the while whites got involved later then any other group and made it illegal before any other group, by nearly two hundred years in some cases.) and the fact that we have people who attribute personal actions as some how a social issue. If a black man kills a black man that is his responsibility and the parents responsibility, not whites, not society. We have effectively removed any social shaming that could prevent this behavior by labeling almost everything

[hellionthesage]

as racist. If we cannot state its wrong and that they need to take responsibility then we cannot resolve the issue and since as I pointed out that this is the only real factor in the black community it is the most likely culprit if in all other situations the issue resolved organicly despite having the same issues.
As for culture, yes if one wishes to assimilate into a culture they must except that culture as their own. Thats standard a society needs homogeny in order to function if we all function based on separate ideas and standards we loose social cohesion. That is irreleveant however to the topic unless you wish to point out that we are currently arguing (in our society) that we should not create a unified society but rather allow every one to do as they please and function on their own standards.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

Oh my god, I've been arguing with you for the past 2 days and nothing has been resolved. My opinion has and will never change on the topic and yours apparently won't either, so I'm declaring this debate over on grounds of "I'm tired".

[hellionthesage]

Of course it won't change, you have not presented any new data, repitition of falsehoods doesn't make a good argument. never has and never will.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

Dude, I provided my fair share of evidence. Hell, I even gave you a link to a passage from a book that proves my case along with studies backed by statistics. It's not my prerogative to convince someone who doesn't want to listen to reason and refuse to acknowledge the simple fact that just because two groups sufferer, doesn't mean their suffering and the circumstances under which they suffered was equal.

Anyway, Have a Nice Day. 😊

[hellionthesage]

Well, I also provided evidence but unlike yours mine was to show that others suffered as well, yours was to restate that blacks suffered, those sources also ignored that other groups whent through much the same thing. So again, you provided sources to an argument that was never made ie whether or not blacks suffered discrimination. Their is only one difference between all those groups of any significance and that is how blacks are pitied and all others where ignored.

[Starrk]

@hellionthesage

See that tells me that you didn't read none of the links I gave you nor do you any idea what I'm arguing.

I'm not arguing that African Americans were the only ones who were oppressed. I am arguing that their oppression was more different and more systematic then everyone else in America. Irish Americans experienced hardship, that undeniable, but their hardship is different from AA. I don't recall the Irish ever having STATE GOVERNMENTS and LAWS working against them for 100 years after The Emancipation Proclamations. AA were treated so unfairly that the Federal Government and Supreme Court had to step in and put a stop to it.

Now let me repeat this again. I'm not saying no other group haven't been oppressed. But I am saying that the way AA were oppressed was more unique and spanned over 3 centuries and literally only ended at the federal level about 30-40 years ago. Trying to compare the suffering of AA with any other group is like comparing apples to oranges.

[Navier-Stokes]

I'd absolutely like to take this post seriously but you lost me at the race problem...
Germany needs immigrants. The birthrate is so low that in a few years there won't be enough people 18-65 yo to pay retirement for the older retired generation. So Germany is using this as an opportunity to exploit arab immigrants and is trying to hire the more educated ones for less money. Of course this come with the disadvantage of needing to take care of the mostly uneducated and even illiterate family members of that single worker.
In other words, Germany has no choice but accept immigrants in order to stay an economic power.

[Lolomon]

Yet the Nazi regime has grown in Germany, Spain, and much of Europe due to these refugees whom live off the government. The men go to these countries and rape women. The recent influx of refugees have raped several German women, because as their words women on their country mean nothing, and these German rape customs never see these men prosecuted for fear the German government might be see, as racist. Just the last few weeks a German was raped but the rape was deemed. Acceptable because she went on her Facebook and stated how she disliked all of these foreigner in their country. And guess what their was a huge Nazi March a few days later. Its causing chaos nothing else

[DaddyRollingStone]

Instead of encouraging Germans to have more kids, because that wouldn't make any sense.

[Navier-Stokes]

That would just take too long and besides encouraging doesn't do much anymore. Here in germany you get paid monthly for every child you have. And the more kids you have the more they pay per kid. You also have 2 yeats of maternity leave with pay. Or paternity leave. Whatever you choose. Having kids means also paying less taxes.
If you are a single parent, your kids have an advantage in going to daycare. Schooling is free. Even higher education is free. So what else is there to do? Despite all these people refuse to have children. It's the same situation as in japan. The only fast and sure way is to either accept foreign students and later give them the opportunity to work in germany. But you need to qualify for that and the requirements are not that easy to obtain besides once you have graduated from University with a degree you won't really work for less pay. Or you accept refugees and use them as work force.

[DaddyRollingStone]

So what's your point? Just take away all the free shit and make people work. The world needs ditch diggers more than they need poets.

[Navier-Stokes]

All i am saying is that germany can't afford not using this cheap labor force. So they have to pay the price for it.

[Jager66]

The problem is that the immigrants aren't integrating, they are causing crime and collecting social benefits, this is not helping the country. Look into the issue, like in France there are entire neighborhoods taken over by Muslims where they run Sharia law and the police can;t go without causing huge violent riots. Muslims do this in every country they immigrate to in large enough numbers.

What's happening in Germany is happening all over the western world. What needs to happen is the damage done between the sexes by Feminism needs to be repaired so men and women can start forming secure families again. No culture on earth has ever recovered from a birth rate this low.

[SILENTCRUSADER]

And whos fault is it that they are in this situation?

[SILENTCRUSADER]

Exactly, the people responsible for our decline in all western countries, WANTED this outcome.

[elew4too]

Like @Navier-Stokes , you lost me at the race problem. . . The sentence, "If Germany wants to stay German. . ." doesn't acknowledge that the people coming to Germany will become German. Therefore, Germany will have no problem staying German. If the logic was correct, then America would have been overrun by non-Americans by the mid-1800s with its Irish and German immigrants. Those Irish and Germans became American though in the same way that migrants will become German.

I would much rather be attacked on the media for my skin color than be shot, unarmed, in the streets because of it.

And the crime in the black community is a function of their environment. If your family is in poverty; most of your network is in poverty; the schools in your neighborhood are underfunded and dilapidated; you have no transportation; public transportation is terrible; and the most economically prudent path is entering the black market, then crime will undoubtedly be high in those communities. In America, we suffer from having too much faith in an individual's free will. Thus, while we fallaciously assume that individuals in high crime communities deserve their circumstance because of their poor decisions, we celebrate successful individuals because of their alleged excellent decisions. I don't think people can rise about their environments as easy as we make it sound in America. It's unlikely a poor man will do well in life in the same way that it's unlikely that a billionaire's son will go broke. In short, the crime in the black community is less about individual failings and more about infrastructural ones.

[DaddyRollingStone]

Ethnic Arabs living in Germany are not Germans for simply living there.

[elew4too]

What about their kids?

[DaddyRollingStone]

They are raised as Ethnic Arabs, not Germans.

Being born in a barn doesn't automatically make you a horse

[hellionthesage]

"I would much rather be attacked on the media for my skin color than be shot, unarmed, in the streets because of it." I believe you missed the part where he pointed out that that is exactly what is happening with caucasians, that blacks are targeting them because of their race. When you state that an entire group of people are not responsible for what goes on their community you are telling them they have no reason to try and fix anything. If your child is not doing their homework you would not go and blame the school for it would you? So why is it that as a society we blame whites for everything that goes on in the black community. Every group of people have been in the same situation as blacks and every one of them have risen up, and in a much more timely manner then the black community. The only difference is tha before they where held accountable, currently they are not. By saying nothing is their fault you say that they have no control over their lives. Giving no reason to try.

[elew4too]

@hellionthesage I understand your point that whites are being attacked because of their race. In fact, I agree. Not all whites' ancestors were responsible for the adverse treatment of other races in the past. The difference is that when whites are attacked because of their race, their feelings are hurt. And when blacks are attacked because of their race, its a lot more dangerous.

And by saying that problems are infrastructural and not individual, I am saying that we are trying to "fix" the wrong things in those communities, not that we shouldn't fix them. Your child not reading is one thing, but the school not having enough teachers to even teach in the first place is another. And the contemporary poor experience is not exclusive to black people. Poor people in the U. S. today are finding it harder than ever to climb the economic ladder. Bad incentives: the black market is lucrative and easily accessible, the justice system is punitive, and the people are desperately poor.

[hellionthesage]

"And when blacks are attacked because of their race, its a lot more dangerous." but he gave many clips showing the violence towards whites was physical and in fact as his stats showed their is a larger margin of black on white physical violence/murder then the other way around so one would conclude the exact opposite of what your claiming. As for infrastructure, more blacks where employed during segregation then they currently are, their standard of living higher as pointed out by Thomas Sowell (a black proffessor at princeton) so one could conclude that by refusing to acknowledge that this is in fact directly due to our increasing tendency to coddle and bestow extra privledges on minority groups we are in fact creating the problem, not solving it.

[hellionthesage]

"
Poor people in the U. S. today are finding it harder than ever to climb the economic ladder. Bad incentives: the black market is lucrative and easily accessible, the justice system is punitive, and the people are desperately poor." While I think this statement is off topic (technicly their are more poor whites, numericly speaking, then blacks) I would concurr with it, we have created a system that is making the poor poorer and the rich richer. We are seeing the dissolutionment of the middle class and things are only getting worse.

[Speedbird_747]

"If your family is in poverty; most of your network is in poverty; the schools in your neighborhood are underfunded and dilapidated; you have no transportation; public transportation is terrible; and the most economically prudent path is entering the black market, then crime will undoubtedly be high in those communities."

You totally described Detroit

[Vasiliy]

It's a lot of things, I myself am disillusioned with relationships as I was raised by a single mother and saw the kind of fucked up childhood that results from living it.

I've been told my opinion isn't of matter in debates about poverty because I'm privileged for being a white, straight man, in my opinion this is discrimination in of itself and much worse than a simple racial slur as it isn't a direct result of hate, but attempted logic that fails to pervade even about a minute amount of scrutiny.

The school system told me whites were privileged from a young age, even though I was born in a single parent household while most of my mexican friends were better off than I. It's more neo-racism than it is being pro minority, I was not responsible for what the Europeans of old did, so why am I treated as such?

I'm not racist at all, but I can definitely see how someone would become racist/sexist after faux feminists and people of their own race and others openly mock them for simply being part of a well off racial/sexual/gender group.

[DaddyRollingStone]

It all adds up in your head and then finally you crack up, it doesn't happen overnight but very slowly over the course of weeks and months. Then one day you wake up in jack boots and a nazi party armband and you wonder how you let this happen to yourself without even realizing.

[Vasiliy]

Sadly it has become like that for some, extremism breeds extremism I suppose.

[DaddyRollingStone]

Maybe, I used to be normal though

[SILENTCRUSADER]

Define "normal".

[ClassicRocker]

The media does need to step off my nuts as a "white" man, but I can't agree that saying that minorities have it "better than any of their ancestors" is really anything to wave a victory flag over.
The fact that the media decided to portray George Zimmermann as a "white man" is troubling and speaks to the fact that more and more legitimate news-sources are going the way of buzzfeed.. i. e. implementing "view-bait" as a form of "click-bait"

The idea that only whites can be racist need to be expunged from the media as well... Too often "black leaders" figuratively get away with murder in the media and no one really says anything about it other than the far-right, who most with half a brain know are total whackjobs (Bill O'Reily etc...)

This makes the issue doubly troubling as it furthers divides the country as more and more white move further to the far right as more and more "moderate" news sources continue to crucify us simply for our existence. Which will ultimately lead to more people listening to Bill O'Reily and the like which, ultimately, results in a net loss of 10 IQ points per citizen and a whole army of people that are actually bigoted.

[hellionthesage]

I think he phrased it poorly, I believe he was reffering to the fact that we have more laws protecting minorities then we do the majority ie they are actually treated better then the majority. One can point out the media ignoring black on white crimes, the hiring quotas hate crimes that are only applicable if the perpetrator is white etc. All of these instill an idea of superiority in the minority groups ie they are oppressed because every one says they are and their fore "deserve" these advantages and anything they do that is wrong is in fact just racism on the part of the majority. It essentially creates a protected class that grants certain privledges that others do not get resulting in disparity in treatment which in turn creates resentment which then drives racism on both sides.

[Strider90]

I was about to ask you whats your point here but alright, you said it in the end. Everything is fucked up indeed. You dont say whats that one thing all rapists in Europe have in common: They are Middle Eastern muslims.
Everything you describe are the results of the ''glorious'' Allied victory in WWII, the Frankfurt School, the Cultural Marxists who dominate all key positions in our Nations.

www.girlsaskguys.com/.../a22979-the-new-trend-of-political-correctness-sexual-racism

www.girlsaskguys.com/.../a21863-diversity-means-difference-not-sameness

www.girlsaskguys.com/.../a22142-merkel-finally-admits-that-pseudo-refugees-will-change-germany

www.girlsaskguys.com/.../a21832-another-fine-example-of-anti-racists-hypocrisy

www.girlsaskguys.com/.../a11019-another-strike-from-the-white-genocide-project-but-they-confuse-me

[DaddyRollingStone]

I know all about the Frankfurt School and the Communists, trust me

[Anonymous]

Yes, the pendulum has swung way too far in other direction. White men today are still paying the sins of their fathers to people whose ancestors were victims, not them. It's pretty crazy. Things like racism are blown way out of proportion compared to reality, and the people who are supposedly the primary victims are actually more guilty of racism than anyone else.

Don't even get me started on feminism. What an incredibly fucked up, dishonest, hypocritical, sexist bunch feminists are. And all these naive little girls just walk around saying "real feminism is all about equality", which is the biggest lie of modern times.

The best thing white men can do today is just go about their lives, making the most of themselves, get a good education and have a good career, stay out of the racism fray and DO NOT get married. Women today are more than willing to have casual sex... stick with that and avoid the trap of commitment, especially marriage, which is designed for the benefit of women and children, NOT men.

[DaddyRollingStone]

I am more of a traditionalist myself, so I would like a family and all but it just doesn't seem realistic. Casual sex is out of the picture and I've stopped watching porn. I try to find comfort in other things like exercising and sports, it's been working so far.

My point in all of this was, that people can only take it for so long and what happens when they snap?

[Opinion Owner]

Well I think you are on the right track. My point about casual sex was that is you feel you need sex, that is the best course. I think many guys get into relationships and even marriage to meet that need, which is a big mistake. They are just signing over their lives to women and allowing themselves to be controlled by them. Marriage is just a mistake for men today. It sounds nice but it rarely works out. Married men get taken advantages of by women and the legal system and there is no recourse. That's why women are increasingly interested in marriage while men are totally saying no to it, as they should.

[Jager66]

The Feminist gender war has caused a divide between the genders that will take a long time to repair. Had they been a movement for equality instead of a religion of hate the world would be a much better place right now.

One of the many things Feminist's got wrong about men seem's to be that they thought men would fight back in much the same way that they fight men. The reality is that men want women to be happy, men have no desire to fight women so they capitulate to their demands. But when Feminism leads to women pricing them selves out of the market men don't just keep fighting for them they walk away instead. Men opt out of society when the cost of getting women/family is to high.

The race thing is another big nut but I don't feel like getting into it.

[Anonymous]

I don't disagree with everything, especially media sensationalism... but there are a few details you're overlooking.

"White" hasn't been a universally agreed upon term for most of "white" history. You can replace today's modern opinion of many groups with "Irish/Italian/Hungarian/Polish". Etc.

Intense war reparations were a huge player in the popularity of Adolf Hitler due to Germany's intense recession and poverty. A primary cause of WWI? Colonialism.

Conservative generations have followed more liberal generations in the past. Edwardian vs Victorian generations in England being the most well known.

As one song puts it, "The good old days weren't always good and tomorrow ain't is bad as it seems."

[DaddyRollingStone]

Yeah I know, but the old definitions of what race were have no bearing on today and I'm also well aware of why WWI caused WWII. Weimar Germany was a mess and The NSDAP cleaned it up. I am specifically referencing why people today like Hitler, people who were never alive when Hitler was in power.

[The_Empty]

So basically, some white millennial males are privileged little racist misogynistic shitheads and it's everyone else's fault, so the world should just feel sorry for the historically oppressive class? Give me a friggin break

[hellionthesage]

That was incredibly inaccurate. The term slave is derived from slav or slavic a eastern european group ie white, who where enslaved by most every group. The slace trade was created and maintained by both Africans and middleastern people, in fact caucasians where the last group to get involved in the slave trade (buying their slaves from black African slavers) and the first to make it illegal and attempt to dismantle it. The irony beign that whites where also slaves, the irish for example where sold off as slaves by oliver chromwell and others where indentured servents who where treated exactly as slaves themselves (mining companies specificly participated in this "legal" form of slavery). Their is no historically oppressive class of people (except perhaps those who where rich/in power) because all groups where slavers and slaves at one point or another.

[The_Empty]

@hellionthesage Last historically oppressive class in America, feel better? And, ya know, for some reason, I'd say white people enslaving other white people in a slavery system that actually allowed for eventual freedom, probably isn't as bad as the race based slavery they committed, just a hunch. And, and... ah screw it, why am I even bothering? This isn't about history or facts, this is about a bunch of white males trying to pretend their victims, because, apparently, victim hood is a fucking badge to wear. Ya see, I'd say a good way to measure how "victimized" you are is this, first off, do you have to go back about 200+ years to find evidence of said victimization? And we're these committed by your own people to each other? If yes, then, you're not a fucking victim! Especially when everyone else looks back a couple of decades ago, or hell, fucking yesterday!

[DaddyRollingStone]

Sounds like you fell victim to the war machine, it's ok, I get tired of fighting it too, but I always keep my head above the tar.

[Minxxie]

This website isn't here for you to whine and try to get sympathy, also "muslim" isn't a race it's a follower of islam which could be any race. As a white man you have it easier than literally anyone else what more do you want? grow up.

[DaddyRollingStone]

>implying I said muslim is a race
Doesn't change the fact that they are fanatical to the point of being violent

[hellionthesage]

Not really. I agree with the muslim comment but men are actually more likely to be abused domesticly (yet domestic violence is always portrayed as the male being the agressor never the victim), just as likely to be raped by women as women are to be raped by men (yet we pretend that it is impossible for a man to be raped) have a 4x higher suicide rate, 98% of all workplace accidents/deaths are male, 80% of all victims of murder/assualt/muggings are male, its illigal to circumcise a woman while we rigourusly campaign for male circumcision (meaning the women actually have more rights then men)

[hellionthesage]

In fact statisticly speaking, women are the safest and most secure group their is. Children are actually more likely to suffer harm then women. Women followed by female children followed by male children then lastly men, is the order from most secure to least. Again statisticly speaking.

[BigJake]

I agree that things have gotten very skewed ion the US, and it's because the equality movements of the 20th century have been bastardized into hate groups. The common enemy? White men. Everyone who identifies as an oppressed minority today will point to white men as the great Satan. White guys are the only unprotected class of people in the United States, meaning that we're granted none of the anti-discrimination protections afforded to every other group. Victim culture is out of control.

[TadCurious]

@BigJake "Victim culture is out of control." Ditto.

[SILENTCRUSADER]

When your countries have been hijacked by the biggest "victims" of them all, then what do you expect?

[GirlScout]

Excellent take, although I may disagree slightly in a few issues touched upon as a whole I do think it was quite accurate.

I also concur, everything is fucked up and only getting worse.

[jjmarvin]

So in conclusion, you hate everybody and it's all their fault

[DaddyRollingStone]

Pretty much

[jjmarvin]

Ok cool, so YOU'RE disillusioned. Leave me out of it.

[DaddyRollingStone]

I'm not alone though, I am sure of that

[jjmarvin]

Yes there is more than one nazi on this planet, more than one pedophile, more than one thief.

There are a lot of full of shit people for you to relate to, but it doesn't make you right.

[DaddyRollingStone]

Doesn't matter if I'm right or I'm wrong. Being wrong won't cause millions of people to disappear

[jjmarvin]

Interesting choice of words, as one of my examples was a group of insecure crybabies just like you that DID cause millions of people to disappear.

[DaddyRollingStone]

Survival of the fittest ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[jjmarvin]

Fittest to lose the Olympics

[DaddyRollingStone]

Americans always win the Olympics

[OrdinaryGentleman]

Nice my_take, I admire the work that went into this knowing full well that this would be criticized profusely and without clemency. Rationality is far gone from this generation being consistently downsized as well as revoked by media. There is only room for followers not leaders.

[OrdinaryGentleman]

Though I must digress, I don't agree with the level of racism on both sides of the spectrum. Not all non whites are bad, a majority are good. However the media sensationalizes everything, BS'ing the hell out of compliant individuals, ensuring that they are always subdued under the hierarchy and maintaining their place as the ultimate Kardashian experience.

[fivecaratfake]

But I don't understand your point? You're saying it should be okay for white people to be racist and for men to undervalue women, is that what you want or am I reading this wrong?

[DaddyRollingStone]

I'm not saying its right, and I'm not saying that it's good. I'm simply stating that this is what's happening and this is the reason why it's happening.

[AdamThomas]

A great piece. I'm actually surprised that there are some who agree with you, seems the pendulum is starting to shift.

[DaddyRollingStone]

For every action there is an equal, opposite reaction.

[bubble_tea]

In that case, you can never call yourself American. You're white. True Americans are Native Americans.

[DaddyRollingStone]

What? There was no America before the white man. Only separate nations of Indians that went to war and traded with each other like every place in the world. The Indians lost because they had lower birth rates than European Settlers, they were disorganized and many tribes lived nomadically, and their technology was inferior to what the Europeans had. The Spanish won easy over the Incans and Aztecs, because they had guns and cannons, but most importantly, the Spanish would recruit the help of other local tribes to fight with them and if they did their tribes would receive privileges when the Encomienda system was established. My ancestors specifically came to colonies before the Revolutionary War from England. The United States formed later in the 18th Century when the colonies ratified the Declaration of Independance. The document's composition and signing is attributed mostly to white, English men. As far as I know, there were no 'Native Americans' present during the signing.

[bubble_tea]

By America, I mean the whole continent, not the narrow view of a citizen of the USA. It existed before the arrival of the white man, and another race of man had pre-occupied it.

[DaddyRollingStone]

In that case, The English, French, and Spanish took an all of North America while Spain and Portugal got South America. It's the same story all over the continent, the natives lost to the Europeans because they were too weak to stop them.

[bubble_tea]

I guess in your mind -only- white people have the right to immigrate to other parts of the world (for a better life for themselves and their descendants) and call it their homeland, so it's logical that you would despise brown and black people who just try to do the same.

[DaddyRollingStone]

Darkies ruin everything

[Crazyced]

"But, do you have a flag?"

https://youtu.be/hYeFcSq7Mxg

[koko124]

None of that even matters, the environment and the behavioral/epigenetic trajectory for America's future (and to a lesser extent the rest of the world) is fucked already.

[Anonymous]

a shame yourfutureex isn't around anymore. He was obsessed/in love with hitler. He would've had a thing or two to say about the last bit

[DaddyRollingStone]

Maybe it will trigger his spidey-senses

[Anonymous]

Sad to say, you are correct and very young to have come to this conclusion.

[vishna]

So what exactly are you getting at?

[OrdinaryGentleman]

I think he is getting at white males are portrayed far too much as the antagonist, in society today.

[vishna]

Ok, this was long.
Remarks:
Feminism-was never taught in any of the schools I went to.
Porn-Mkay.
Immigration-how is this negatively affecting the millennial male?
Race-"You have problems and want to talk about them, but my ancestors stopped enslaving yours years ago. And you got equal rights 50 years ago. So, why are you so hurt and violent? Chill out."
Also, consider hate crime data vs just crimes. And consider what Starkk said about econo. class
White Devil Portion-"It is normal to claim that racism is rampant in the US yet minorities today have it better than any of their ancestors ever did." They were slaves! Ya know, I think systemic police brutality is bad, but it sure as hell beats being property. You are so right @Asker
Racial Tensions-are getting worse because no one wants to talk about the issues. You try to silence people, stereotype people, or vilify people who have emotion.
Hitler-What?

@OrdinaryGentlman there was too much crazy in here for me to take him seriously.

[DaddyRollingStone]

You do realize that blacks commit more hate crimes than whites, right?

[vishna]

No, can you link me this data because all I have is this.
"The federal government publishes a list annually of Hate Crime Statistics, 2009.[44] Also published by the federal government is the Known Offender's Race by Bias Motivation, 2009.[45] According to the Federal Bureau of Investigation Uniform Crime Report database, in 2010 58.6% of hate crime offenders were white (including Hispanics), 18.4% of offenders were black, 8.9% were of individuals of multiple races and 1% of offenders were Native Americans.[46] The report also reveals that 48% of all hate crime offenders were motivated by the victim's race, while 18% were based on the victim's religion, and another 18% were based on the victim's sexual orientation.[47] The report states that among hate crime offenses motivated by race, 70% were composed of anti-black bias, while 17.7% were of anti-white bias, and 5% were of anti-Asian or Pacific Islander bias.[47]"
This is from 2014. I linked the entire page.

[vishna]

"Of the reported 3,407 single-bias hate crime offenses that were racially motivated, 66.4 were motivated by anti-black or African-American bias, and 21.4 percent stemmed from anti-white bias."

[vishna]

"Law enforcement agencies identified 5,814 known offenders in the 5,928 bias-motivated incidents. Of these offenders, 52.4 percent were white and 24.3 percent were black or African-American."

@DaddyRollingStone

[vishna]

www.fbi.gov/.../latest-hate-crime-statistics-report-released this is the 2014 link.

[DaddyRollingStone]

Hate crimes are underreported by the Government since it is only considered racist when a white person attacks a black person and not the other way around. Plus, the FBI considers hispanics as 'white' so keep in mind whatever they report for white people would be lower than what actual white people do. Especially since blacks and hispanics both commit crimes at a higher rate than whites.

[vishna]

So, you want to use data when it appeals to your sensibilities but disregard it when it doesn't, ok.
But from that first sentence "Hate crimes are underreported by the Government since it is only considered racist when a white person attacks a black person and not the other way around." There's no reasoning with you.

You said "You do realize that blacks commit more hate crimes than whites, right?" So, I gave you FBI data that conflicted with what you said.

But that's not good enough because in your mind, white people are victims and black people get away with too much in this country, ok. Sure.

[vishna]

@DaddyRollingStone

[DaddyRollingStone]

It doesn't matter to me, I hate them anyway