I especially like it when religious women think this way its even more contradictory because they believe in natural things. If God didn't want men to cry then why did "he" give us lacrimal glands? From a evolutionary stand point of view it doesn't make any sense either. I do find it awkward though and do laugh at men who cry for the little things though like crying from a movie in public places. Its like c'mon hold yourself together or when his girlfriend dumped him. Or if he got beat up in a fight that he started.
"When the world has beaten me up, spit me out, and even when I am at its mercy, I still wouldn't cry! I'd be "strong" because "that's how a man is supposed to be."
Is that really how a man is supposed to be?"
Umm, yes. Because when SHIT pops off, do you want someone who will break down in tears, or someone who will get it done?
Also, a man rules by his emotions is a DANGEROUS individual. Imagine a man, who is volatile by nature, is having a emotional breakdown, do you think he will just sit in the corner and cry about it? I don't. I think he will take more extreme, maybe violent, measures.
Outside of that, Good take as always!! :D :D
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0 Reply
Anonymous
(30-35)
+1 y
I don't think its necessarily women who are enforcing this. Everytime someone on G@G asks if its weird, or unattractive for a guy to cry, practically every last girl on the site said no.
The problem lies with how we were raised by our fathers. At least that was my case.
Its other men who are putting us down and telling us its not ok to cry.
Yeah, but at least i was only raised like that until the divorce. Afterward, i barely saw my dad, and he lost his influence on me. But by then i was a teenager, and i could think for myself so it didn't really matter that i was being raised by my mom by then.
Hey same here. the exact same thing. It's better not stifling emotions because you miss out feeling good feelings even though you might be protecting the negative feelings
Yeah, but, that's the point. The point is that the crying -- under appropriate circumstances -- is a powerful statement of masculinity, precisely BECAUSE society says "you shouldn't do that".
The POWER of the whole thing comes not only from the raw emotion, but also from the fact that yr saying a giant fuck-you to the normal rules of society, at the same time.
If everyone condoned male crying everywhere, then, its power would be reduced.
I mean, duh, right? This is pretty much universal. Like, in the same way as, say, marijuana is a stupid, underwhelming drug that smells worse than dog shit, but, BECAUSE IT'S ILLEGAL, it's so "cool" and it's such a powerful statement to smoke it.
Also, in the same way, my husband is unabashedly the person who runs my household, and, if anyone had to have "the final say" in something, it'd be him. He knows well when my expertise outshines his, and he's not ashamed to let my advice guide the way in those (contd)
situations... but, he runs this house. Again, that's one of those "society says no" things -- and THAT is a huge part of the reason why his leadership has such a strong effect on keeping MY stubborn-ass personality in line. I mean, if we still lived in some hyper-religious society where the party-line was "submit to yr husband by default"... well, honestly, I'd probably stick up a giant middle finger to that. But, BECAUSE IT'S AGAINST THE RULES... yeah.
So, really, I'm of two minds here. I mean, I'd LIKE to say that we should just get rid of all the prohibitions on this kind of emotional display, and that we should all kum-ba-yaah and all that shit. But, I grew up around boys, and I know boys, and I know that EVERYTHING means more to boys when it's the result of overcoming adversity. So, if learning to show emotion comes only after overcoming this kind of pressure from society... that may ULTIMATELY be for the best, even though it sucks to go through.
@redeyemindtricks you and your husband sound like a great team. My husband wasn't the leader in our family, yet he wanted all of the benefits. In all honesty I had to be the leader even though I would have preferred he did, but I always made decisions based on what was good for the family. And the times he did show leadership, he made decisions based upon what was good for him not even considering what the family needs too.
@Nachtmeerde Hah, I know you aren't talking to me, but... when I need to cry, the last thing I give a shit about is who's around.
I mean, nope.
Ironically, that's probably the only time in my entire life when I just Do. Not. Give. Shit. Number. One. At that point, the whole world is me. Me me me me me. My party, and I'll cry mah damn eyes out if I want to.
Yep.
I mean, there'd be no point in even trying to stop it. I'd probably just blow balls of snot all over my nice clothes, and then I'd have one MORE thing to cry about.
@Nachtmeerde better not to break down when people are around. It's good you can let it out on your own though. I have broken down a few times in front of people, not meaning to but I haven't done that for a while.
@redeyemindtricks lmao that's good. Like I said in my comment I have a few times by accident, but I also wasn't trying to hold it in either. Now after I left my husband though, I've been crying less lol go figure
@stardust101 eh, that's more like "hey, apropos of this topic..."
Basically, one of the ways I dealt with teenage depression was to... really get INTO **feeling** it. Exactly like "no pain no gain" in the gym, but with tears. That's the point of that little story.
@redeyemindtricks I've always felt pain from the time I was young. Raised by narcissists, married a narcissist. Now I'm done with all them and feel better.
@redeyemindtricks I get that you mean pain makes you feel alive. And believe me, it really does! But I don't think anyone should have to actually live a painful life forever although there will always be aspects of pain in my own life. I can't get rid of it completely, but the majority of the time we should be happy
@stardust101 "the majority of the time we should be happy" ^^ Careful, there, with that. That might be the kind of Sisyphean task that you can't really ever accomplish.
There's a lot of evidence out there for a "hedonic set-point" -- basically, the idea that we gravitate toward a certain constant level of satisfaction in our lives, and pretty much stay there. Notice, "satisfaction" not "happiness". Big difference.
If you know anyone who has lots of "ambition", for instance, that's probably someone who is perpetually dissatisfied with life in general. Can't win 'em all. If you think about people you know, you'll probably realize the truth of this, too. Even people whose lives have been rocked by countless senseless tragedies still have a way of regressing to the same mean level of satisfaction with life. It's fuckin' weird, but it's true.
So, you should think about that -- and think, with BRUTAL honesty, about whether you actually...
... NEED a certain degree of dissatisfaction -- more than you'd care to admit in polite company -- in yr life. If you do, then the next step is to figure out how to attain a decent amount of **happiness** -- which is NOT constant -- while still having whatever degree of dissatisfaction.
If you need a lot of dissatisfaction, then, you might need to impose random changes in yr life from time to time (hard to do with kids, but, not impossible). And you might have to adopt job situations that are less stable/predictable than otherwise. (yay #freelancelife)
And when I left my husband, it wasn't because I was striving for happiness, it was at my first and very first breaking point of my life that I left to strive for my own sanity. I've never felt so out of control like that ever and I literally felt like I was dying. The things I went through, I don't ever wish upon anyone.
@redeyemindtricks it's funny you brought all of that up because I have thought about it And I think everyone including myself should be content no matter what. For me, it's about finding peace in the storm. Finding happiness in sadness and finding joy when one would think there isn't any joy. I've found all that in my marriage. But enough is enough and I couldn't handle any more pain
@stardust101 Ahh girl, I've got tears in the stupid corners of mah stupid eyes. I'm doing that thing where I have to look up at the ceiling, now, to keep black rivers from runnin' down mah face
Hey, IF THERE ARE ANY BOYS STILL READING THIS: Note stardust wrote... "I've never felt so out of control like that, ever"
She felt OUT OF CONTROL.
Why did she feel that way?
Because her MAN forced her to be IN CONTROL of ending that relationship.
That's girls for ya, kids. <3 Love us or leave us (but goddamnit DO NOT make us leave you).
::shakes hands:: Why do I always shake my hands when I have tears in the corners of my eyes? LOL what the hell is that supposed to do, anyway? hahah
@stardust101 yr mah bae of the day. my honorary little sister, yo
I think my lesson to learn in my marriage is to be content in my circumstances. But of course nobody should be drowned in their bad circumstances and I see now that my marriage that ended is a blessing. The door is SHUT. Time to move on but yeah it's hard. Real hard accepting closed doors. No more knocking. No more climbing through windows. It's locked and the key is gone
@stardust101 Well, you should try to find HAPPINESS in yr circumstances... but, happiness ≠ content. You can totally be happy and eternally discontented -- I mean, that's kinda how I roll. I just need a dynamic life, where lots of stuff is constantly evolving all the time in new, different, and somewhat unpredictable ways.
I mean, I'm using "content" specifically to mean satisfaction with things AS THEY ARE -- in other words, a lack of desire for things to CHANGE. THAT is the thing that's probably more hardwired than we care to admit. A lot of people mistake "happy" for "content", and try to shoehorn themselves and their hearts and souls into a lifestyle with excessive routine, rigidity, and "stability" -- ultimately to their own misery. The same lifestyle, of course, would make other, less dynamic people blissfully happy. It's all about finding yr own place on that scale.
It sounds like you were a victim of circumstances, more than anything else, in yr
marriage -- and that you were conditioned to accept that as normal, too, from what little you've said about the way yr parents raised you. So, it's totally possible that you still have NO IDEA where you lie on this particular scale, because you still haven't yet had the chance to find out -- in other words, it's possible that you may never have had enough agency over yr own life to really DISCOVER how much "discontent" (also known as "ambition") you really need to make you happy.
When you read the writings of the very early feminists -- the ones from back in the day when there really WERE no options other than kinder, küche, kirche -- you see this same thing. They were the ones who NEEDED more "discontent" -- more dynamism, more change -- to be happy, but, their circumstances just never ever afforded them that opportunity.
@Nachtmeerde Sorry if i missed a lot. But to answer your question:
Yes i have that problem too. Ik that people are more accepting about men crying nowadays, but its still hardwired in my brain that its not ok. I'm just afraid that if i cry in front of anyone that they will treat me the same way my family or more specifically my father did. I'm afraid that it'll make them look down on me.
That's why i always cry alone at night. I've yet to meet someone i trust enough to cry in front of...
@redeyemindtricks yeah that's true. And things are getting better in some areas of my life. usually victims don't see their way out on their own though. I got out on my own for the most part. Contacted a friend and he flew here from Michigan and he spent like 7,000$ on new stuff. He was supposed to have moved here permanently but his circumstances called him back to Michigan while and he gave me everything he bought
Try living life with no support and everyone you know is against you and you have to fight between life and death. That's me. Anyway, I got out and I've made a lot of new friends. They always contact me when they hear of jobs that are hiring and find ways for me to make money. Of course I'm learning to be independent again but I feel like my spirit is broken and needs to be mended
I'm a Christian and I believe that God holds me strong. I'm not lonely and still willing to help others. And you know, the saying is true that God's light shines the most in darkness. And God's light has brought me this far
Yeah, that habit can be a tough little bugger to break. :/ From my experience, it can take a long time to break free of unhealthy ideas about what being "strong" and "weak" mean. But it was worth it to keep trying. I'm a happier person now. Just hang in there, man.
Well I wouldn't say that women aren't looked down upon when they cry... As someone who cried very easily when I was younger, I was indeed made fun of for it, and felt that crying was embarrassing. However, I agree that men tend to have it worse in this area, and that men (and women) should be able to cry and express emotions.
Yes, I acknowledged that women too are ridiculed for it in the beginning of this article However , in comparison with a man you never hear a woman get told she's less of one for shedding tears, a man on the other hand , gets told he is less of one. I definitely feel the insults although painful on both sides , weighs far heavier with men than it does women just because of our "expected roles".
By agreeing that crying is a blow against masculinity, men inadvertantly subject themselves to the oppressive, stereotyping framework of patriarchal society, and by doing so, not only rob themselves of individuality, but also implicitly label themselves as chauvinists, something men of the present generation are quick to deny. Neither is crying an exclusively feminine trait. The ability to cry makes a person 'human', not in any aesthetic sense, but in the basic biological sense.
@Riggers *chuckle* Thank you for providing a most illuminating example of... By the way, I never said, "everything is men's fault". That is your interpretation of my words, and its wrong!!
You literally said men are oppressing themselves in their own ''patriarchy''... Like... Word for fucking word.
Not only, Is the idea of a ''Patriarchy'' in the modern day western world utterly retarded, And to blame anything on it is a sheer sign of stupidity, But... To say men also oppress themselves in it? What? Are you high?
If there really was a "patriarchy" in our society, it wouldn't be a system that would be failing men as badly as it is and benefiting women as much as it does. Trust me, we live in a gynocentric society controlled by the matriarchy, where the system benefits you, as a woman, much more than me, as a man.
"Men getting a taste of their own medicine"...
Wow, you love to demonize and villanize men and mock them, don't you? Not surprised, considering you're a Feminist (using all the buzzwords and also attacking men). Y'all are a bunch of bigoted misandrists, you Feminists are. Nice job making women look worse (as if they already do such a great job at that).
There's lots of different kinds of strength a person can possess. There's more than just physical strength for men, but falling into the trap of false masculinity means that's all you will ever know of strength. You can never know true strength of character or emotional stability if you don't want it.
A guy can cry about death or extreme heartbreak, but I won't be with someone who cries at a Hallmark commercial or because his girl yelled at him. Likewise, I don't cry often or in front of others.
I think embracing the inner tear factory isn't really masculine /feminine so much as mature/immature.
You hear this over and over from women and they are missing the point entirely. Men aren't encouraged to "bottle up" their emotions, they are encouraged to not be debilitated by them. Go ahead and have emotions, just don't let them make you screw up or not do what needs to be done. The thing men demand from other men is dependability, especially in a crisis, emotions are beside the point.
By people using the words, "Man Up", "Suck it up" or "Toughen up" when emotions are showed by men, I would think that definitely means to hide what you feel or bottle your feelings up. Yes, women don't want a weak man (who cries over everything), but we also don't want a man that is ice cold either.
When we say "man up" we generally mean "pull yourself together, blubbering is not going to fix the problem and there are important things to do right now". There are some guys who have a confused and limited idea of what it means to be masculine. Mostly younger and macho types, posers who object to any sign of emotion but they miss the point. What men don't want in another man is unreliability, he can have all the emotions he wants as long as he doesn't bug out when we need backup.
This is bad advice, unless you have a legitimate reason like a death in the family or a loved one diagnosed with cancer. Men can have hearts and can love, but at the end of the day we are not respected if we are seen as sensitive, insecure, or weak. I see it on here daily, just read what an average woman is looking for in a man. No man is going to intentionally turn themselves into an over emotional cry baby.
No one is saying let loose and cry on every occasion. For any gender of course that would mean something is psychologically not right. This article assumes we are speaking about men that are mentally stable, and can balance their emotions well. There's a time to show sadness. And there's a time to show strength.
@Spiorad_Aisce made some great points in his response to me. Ignoring your feelings altogether just to impress women or seem "tough" does more harm than good.
@asker Don't we do that already? I mean when have you seen a man hold back tears when his wife of 50 years passes away, or is diagnosed with breast cancer? Men cry, we just don't cry that often.
@Northeast100 I've never seen my Father shed a tear, and there's been tons of close relatives that have passed away. He is the stereotypical definition of what a "man" should be. A lot of men are touched in certain ways, and refuse to show it, this article pertains to them.
@asker He might have cried in secret. I remember when my grandpa died, I was 14. I ran out of the house to not be seen, but my dad came outside and found me and it pissed me off lol. I didn't want to be seen, and wanted to be left alone. I don't know why we are like that, we just are. Have to say though, I only cried that one day over his death, and as I got older I stopped crying altogether at funerals. We could just be wired that way. By contrast, my mom has this Christmas ornament that my grandparents recorded their voice on, in case they ever did pass away. She cries every time she hears it, to this day. (My grandma is still alive, it's when she hears my grandpa's voice.)
@Northeast106 Yes, he very well could have cried in secret. Although, I may say it still must be rare because my Mom has been married to him for almost 40 years and admits to only seeing him cry twice. I really think he just bottles his feelings up for the most part. "I didn't want to be seen, and wanted to be left alone. I don't know why we are like that, we just are. " You're like that because it's deeply integrated in you , that is how you should be because of your gender.
@asker I just think it's in our nature, men and women are just different. I'm not going to say that society brainwashed us into behaving this way, or that gender roles were imposed on us. You can look at Hawaiian Koa warriors, Aztecs, Norse Vikings, or South African Zulu warriors. Despite the geographical distance and cultural isolation, men and women had similar behavioural expectations and roles to perform in society. I think things evolved the way they are for a reason, and we are questioning thousands of years of human wisdom and nature that we take for granted in today's times. Just my two cents on it though.
The act of crying itself isn't what makes someone weak it's why, how often and their reasons for doing so.
Example, a mamma's boy who's a teenager crying because his mother isn't around and he can't stand not being around her, weak, and unhealthy.
Example, crying because someone has died or you saw a touching or sad part of a movie or story, or something touched in a way you haven't felt before, not weak.
I cry too and I dont think a man is weak if he cries. I love a sensitive man that is in touch with his emotions and feelings. Like you said, it only makes him human and I by no means will I judge :) A great take!
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Anonymous
(45 Plus)
+1 y
The thing is, women say they want a guy to show his emotions but when they actually do, then women are the very first to tell us to "suck it up" "grow a pair" and "stop being a wuss", among other comments.
"Programmed thinking" is what I call that. Why is it they feel that way? It's because of society's perception of how a man "should" be. I think what most women want is a healthy balance. A man who doesn't cry uncontrollably on every occasion. A man that will cry when the occasion suits it. "Pretending" is fake to me.
Depends on context. Hard emotional issues such as your parents passing on, if that doesn't bring a tear to your eye, something is wrong with you. I fell asleep every night for 6 months afterwards with a tear in my eye, but I wasn't letting anyone see that either. If you're crying because you run out of milk, or get called a name, definitely you have to toughen up
Nice take, but these things will not change, any time soon. The reality of how boys are raised is not going to change due to somebody's will. Extreme examples of this are places like ghettos and war zones, and no amount of activism has ever changed the social realities in such places. Even in the typical case of the overall society in the west, it would have to change organically. I don't see that happening, any time soon.
There's never really much need to cry though, I haven't really done it for about 3 years and if you just cry because of petty shit that does mean you're an oversensitive pussy, also nothing wrong with showing emotions e. g. anger, happiness but crying does kind of mean weakness as something has got to you so bad your breaking down over it.
We? l its the human conditions that need to change and perceptions of it I am a former hard *as and its easy to revert but as a human and a man I endeavor to grow as a person and learn to be positive as well. Don't care of ya think I am soft coz I cry. John Wayne cried and lots of other notable men. They were real men and respected I am one of those kinda guys. Love who I Love hurt when I don't show it sometimes bit always a man... Hugz and hope it helps.🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹
To bottle up is not right!! However we can't use "CRY" as a tool for feeble excuses. Moreover it is very important for men to be more supportive of women who by nature emotionally deeply expressive and men need to calm them down and cheer them up than sit and cry along with them. :) So we tend to restrain our emotions as an endowment, and it is for caring our lovely women. I cry not hidingly but cautiously.
I don't care what society teaches you men think... A lot of people make assumptions about what makes a man weak, and that's how other guys end up knocked the fuck out face down on the street and get rolled for their wallet and shoes because they mistook someone's kindness or vulnerability for weakness.
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I especially like it when religious women think this way its even more contradictory because they believe in natural things. If God didn't want men to cry then why did "he" give us lacrimal glands? From a evolutionary stand point of view it doesn't make any sense either. I do find it awkward though and do laugh at men who cry for the little things though like crying from a movie in public places. Its like c'mon hold yourself together or when his girlfriend dumped him. Or if he got beat up in a fight that he started.
"When the world has beaten me up, spit me out, and even when I am at its mercy, I still wouldn't cry!
I'd be "strong" because "that's how a man is supposed to be."
Is that really how a man is supposed to be?"
Umm, yes. Because when SHIT pops off, do you want someone who will break down in tears, or someone who will get it done?
Also, a man rules by his emotions is a DANGEROUS individual. Imagine a man, who is volatile by nature, is having a emotional breakdown, do you think he will just sit in the corner and cry about it? I don't. I think he will take more extreme, maybe violent, measures.
Outside of that, Good take as always!! :D :D
I don't think its necessarily women who are enforcing this. Everytime someone on G@G asks if its weird, or unattractive for a guy to cry, practically every last girl on the site said no.
The problem lies with how we were raised by our fathers. At least that was my case.
Its other men who are putting us down and telling us its not ok to cry.
I was raised to not cry by my Dad and I'm not even a guy
So that last phrase you mentioned rings a bell too close to home 😂 Haha
@stardust101 Same, except it was my mum. 😂
Ah, man, just when you thought that shit was past. Seems like the feels would never end. :/
@Nachtmeerde @stardust101
Yeah, but at least i was only raised like that until the divorce. Afterward, i barely saw my dad, and he lost his influence on me. But by then i was a teenager, and i could think for myself so it didn't really matter that i was being raised by my mom by then.
Hey same here. the exact same thing. It's better not stifling emotions because you miss out feeling good feelings even though you might be protecting the negative feelings
@stardust101 Couldn't have said it better myself
Yeah, but, that's the point. The point is that the crying -- under appropriate circumstances -- is a powerful statement of masculinity, precisely BECAUSE society says "you shouldn't do that".
The POWER of the whole thing comes not only from the raw emotion, but also from the fact that yr saying a giant fuck-you to the normal rules of society, at the same time.
If everyone condoned male crying everywhere, then, its power would be reduced.
I mean, duh, right? This is pretty much universal. Like, in the same way as, say, marijuana is a stupid, underwhelming drug that smells worse than dog shit, but, BECAUSE IT'S ILLEGAL, it's so "cool" and it's such a powerful statement to smoke it.
Also, in the same way, my husband is unabashedly the person who runs my household, and, if anyone had to have "the final say" in something, it'd be him. He knows well when my expertise outshines his, and he's not ashamed to let my advice guide the way in those (contd)
situations... but, he runs this house.
Again, that's one of those "society says no" things -- and THAT is a huge part of the reason why his leadership has such a strong effect on keeping MY stubborn-ass personality in line.
I mean, if we still lived in some hyper-religious society where the party-line was "submit to yr husband by default"... well, honestly, I'd probably stick up a giant middle finger to that.
But, BECAUSE IT'S AGAINST THE RULES... yeah.
So, really, I'm of two minds here.
I mean, I'd LIKE to say that we should just get rid of all the prohibitions on this kind of emotional display, and that we should all kum-ba-yaah and all that shit. But, I grew up around boys, and I know boys, and I know that EVERYTHING means more to boys when it's the result of overcoming adversity.
So, if learning to show emotion comes only after overcoming this kind of pressure from society... that may ULTIMATELY be for the best, even though it sucks to go through.
@redeyemindtricks you and your husband sound like a great team. My husband wasn't the leader in our family, yet he wanted all of the benefits. In all honesty I had to be the leader even though I would have preferred he did, but I always made decisions based on what was good for the family. And the times he did show leadership, he made decisions based upon what was good for him not even considering what the family needs too.
@stardust101 Oh, I can cry nowadays. The problem is that I can't cry or break down when there's people around :/ Do you have this problem?
What about you, anon?
@Nachtmeerde Hah, I know you aren't talking to me, but... when I need to cry, the last thing I give a shit about is who's around.
I mean, nope.
Ironically, that's probably the only time in my entire life when I just Do. Not. Give. Shit. Number. One.
At that point, the whole world is me. Me me me me me. My party, and I'll cry mah damn eyes out if I want to.
Yep.
I mean, there'd be no point in even trying to stop it. I'd probably just blow balls of snot all over my nice clothes, and then I'd have one MORE thing to cry about.
@Nachtmeerde better not to break down when people are around. It's good you can let it out on your own though. I have broken down a few times in front of people, not meaning to but I haven't done that for a while.
@redeyemindtricks lmao that's good. Like I said in my comment I have a few times by accident, but I also wasn't trying to hold it in either. Now after I left my husband though, I've been crying less lol go figure
@stardust101
www.girlsaskguys.com/.../q1844182-is-it-possible-to-run-out-of-tears
@redeyemindtricks I'll check it out. I'm not hurting like I did before I left. I think I did cry all my tears for my past present and even future.
@stardust101 eh, that's more like "hey, apropos of this topic..."
Basically, one of the ways I dealt with teenage depression was to... really get INTO **feeling** it.
Exactly like "no pain no gain" in the gym, but with tears. That's the point of that little story.
The other way was... not sleeping. LOL
Turns out I was ahead of mah time, there:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/12531127/
@redeyemindtricks I've always felt pain from the time I was young. Raised by narcissists, married a narcissist. Now I'm done with all them and feel better.
@redeyemindtricks I get that you mean pain makes you feel alive. And believe me, it really does! But I don't think anyone should have to actually live a painful life forever although there will always be aspects of pain in my own life. I can't get rid of it completely, but the majority of the time we should be happy
@stardust101
"the majority of the time we should be happy"
^^ Careful, there, with that. That might be the kind of Sisyphean task that you can't really ever accomplish.
There's a lot of evidence out there for a "hedonic set-point" -- basically, the idea that we gravitate toward a certain constant level of satisfaction in our lives, and pretty much stay there.
Notice, "satisfaction" not "happiness". Big difference.
If you know anyone who has lots of "ambition", for instance, that's probably someone who is perpetually dissatisfied with life in general. Can't win 'em all.
If you think about people you know, you'll probably realize the truth of this, too. Even people whose lives have been rocked by countless senseless tragedies still have a way of regressing to the same mean level of satisfaction with life. It's fuckin' weird, but it's true.
So, you should think about that -- and think, with BRUTAL honesty, about whether you actually...
... NEED a certain degree of dissatisfaction -- more than you'd care to admit in polite company -- in yr life.
If you do, then the next step is to figure out how to attain a decent amount of **happiness** -- which is NOT constant -- while still having whatever degree of dissatisfaction.
If you need a lot of dissatisfaction, then, you might need to impose random changes in yr life from time to time (hard to do with kids, but, not impossible). And you might have to adopt job situations that are less stable/predictable than otherwise. (yay #freelancelife)
But, yeah, think about that.
And when I left my husband, it wasn't because I was striving for happiness, it was at my first and very first breaking point of my life that I left to strive for my own sanity. I've never felt so out of control like that ever and I literally felt like I was dying. The things I went through, I don't ever wish upon anyone.
and somehow I found my sanity. Now I'm still healing and joy will come into my life
@redeyemindtricks it's funny you brought all of that up because I have thought about it And I think everyone including myself should be content no matter what. For me, it's about finding peace in the storm. Finding happiness in sadness and finding joy when one would think there isn't any joy. I've found all that in my marriage. But enough is enough and I couldn't handle any more pain
I couldn't handle being emotionally and mentally tortured anymore.
@stardust101 Ahh girl, I've got tears in the stupid corners of mah stupid eyes. I'm doing that thing where I have to look up at the ceiling, now, to keep black rivers from runnin' down mah face
Hey, IF THERE ARE ANY BOYS STILL READING THIS:
Note stardust wrote...
"I've never felt so out of control like that, ever"
She felt OUT OF CONTROL.
Why did she feel that way?
Because her MAN forced her to be IN CONTROL of ending that relationship.
That's girls for ya, kids.
<3
Love us or leave us (but goddamnit DO NOT make us leave you).
::shakes hands::
Why do I always shake my hands when I have tears in the corners of my eyes? LOL what the hell is that supposed to do, anyway?
hahah
@stardust101 yr mah bae of the day. my honorary little sister, yo
@redeyemindtricks awwwww hugs!
I think my lesson to learn in my marriage is to be content in my circumstances. But of course nobody should be drowned in their bad circumstances and I see now that my marriage that ended is a blessing. The door is SHUT. Time to move on but yeah it's hard. Real hard accepting closed doors. No more knocking. No more climbing through windows. It's locked and the key is gone
@stardust101 Well, you should try to find HAPPINESS in yr circumstances... but, happiness ≠ content. You can totally be happy and eternally discontented -- I mean, that's kinda how I roll. I just need a dynamic life, where lots of stuff is constantly evolving all the time in new, different, and somewhat unpredictable ways.
I mean, I'm using "content" specifically to mean satisfaction with things AS THEY ARE -- in other words, a lack of desire for things to CHANGE.
THAT is the thing that's probably more hardwired than we care to admit. A lot of people mistake "happy" for "content", and try to shoehorn themselves and their hearts and souls into a lifestyle with excessive routine, rigidity, and "stability" -- ultimately to their own misery. The same lifestyle, of course, would make other, less dynamic people blissfully happy. It's all about finding yr own place on that scale.
It sounds like you were a victim of circumstances, more than anything else, in yr
marriage -- and that you were conditioned to accept that as normal, too, from what little you've said about the way yr parents raised you.
So, it's totally possible that you still have NO IDEA where you lie on this particular scale, because you still haven't yet had the chance to find out -- in other words, it's possible that you may never have had enough agency over yr own life to really DISCOVER how much "discontent" (also known as "ambition") you really need to make you happy.
When you read the writings of the very early feminists -- the ones from back in the day when there really WERE no options other than kinder, küche, kirche -- you see this same thing. They were the ones who NEEDED more "discontent" -- more dynamism, more change -- to be happy, but, their circumstances just never ever afforded them that opportunity.
@redeyemindtricks social conditioning I suppose
What should I do?
@stardust101 Lemme think that through before dashing off as quick an answer as usual lol
@Nachtmeerde Sorry if i missed a lot. But to answer your question:
Yes i have that problem too. Ik that people are more accepting about men crying nowadays, but its still hardwired in my brain that its not ok. I'm just afraid that if i cry in front of anyone that they will treat me the same way my family or more specifically my father did. I'm afraid that it'll make them look down on me.
That's why i always cry alone at night. I've yet to meet someone i trust enough to cry in front of...
@redeyemindtricks wow I can't believe this has happened. I'm so fucked
@stardust101
"Courage doesn't always roar. Sometimes courage is just a little voice at the end of the day, saying, I'll try again tomorrow."
Hang in there babe.
Hey, you know what ALWAYS happens right after things are at their very worst?
They get better.
Fact!
<3
@redeyemindtricks yeah that's true. And things are getting better in some areas of my life. usually victims don't see their way out on their own though. I got out on my own for the most part. Contacted a friend and he flew here from Michigan and he spent like 7,000$ on new stuff. He was supposed to have moved here permanently but his circumstances called him back to Michigan while and he gave me everything he bought
Try living life with no support and everyone you know is against you and you have to fight between life and death. That's me. Anyway, I got out and I've made a lot of new friends. They always contact me when they hear of jobs that are hiring and find ways for me to make money. Of course I'm learning to be independent again but I feel like my spirit is broken and needs to be mended
Like I said I can't believe this had happened
I do have good friends though. Although I didn't tell them my circumstances because they were still new at the time
I figure since I haven't killed myself then it's possible to overcome this ❤️
I'm a Christian and I believe that God holds me strong. I'm not lonely and still willing to help others. And you know, the saying is true that God's light shines the most in darkness. And God's light has brought me this far
Yeah, that habit can be a tough little bugger to break. :/ From my experience, it can take a long time to break free of unhealthy ideas about what being "strong" and "weak" mean. But it was worth it to keep trying. I'm a happier person now. Just hang in there, man.
@Nachtmeerde that's good you're happy now. I don't feel unhealthy anymore and I don't have the victim mentality, but what do I know? Lol
@stardust101 Oh, I meant my last response for the anon opinion owner. ^_^U But I'm glad you're doing well too.
Well I wouldn't say that women aren't looked down upon when they cry... As someone who cried very easily when I was younger, I was indeed made fun of for it, and felt that crying was embarrassing.
However, I agree that men tend to have it worse in this area, and that men (and women) should be able to cry and express emotions.
Yes, I acknowledged that women too are ridiculed for it in the beginning of this article However , in comparison with a man you never hear a woman get told she's less of one for shedding tears, a man on the other hand , gets told he is less of one.
I definitely feel the insults although painful on both sides , weighs far heavier with men than it does women just because of our "expected roles".
Yeah, true. I agree.
Same, I even got ridiculed by adults for crying. There's nothing wrong with it. Also, at work if you cry, you're perceived as being weak.
By agreeing that crying is a blow against masculinity, men inadvertantly subject themselves to the oppressive, stereotyping framework of patriarchal society, and by doing so, not only rob themselves of individuality, but also implicitly label themselves as chauvinists, something men of the present generation are quick to deny.
Neither is crying an exclusively feminine trait.
The ability to cry makes a person 'human', not in any aesthetic sense, but in the basic biological sense.
Bigotry against women proves the existence of a patriarchy. And bigotry against men also proves the existence of a patriarchy. Right?
@evenlift Yes. Strange, isn't it? Men getting a taste of their own medicine, yet not even realising it!
''men inadvertantly subject themselves to the oppressive, stereotyping framework of patriarchal society''
Imagine having your head so far up your own feminist asshole, You literally believe everything is men's fault, and even men are men's fault...
Fucking feminist dipshits...
@Riggers *chuckle* Thank you for providing a most illuminating example of...
By the way, I never said, "everything is men's fault". That is your interpretation of my words, and its wrong!!
You literally said men are oppressing themselves in their own ''patriarchy''... Like... Word for fucking word.
Not only, Is the idea of a ''Patriarchy'' in the modern day western world utterly retarded, And to blame anything on it is a sheer sign of stupidity, But... To say men also oppress themselves in it? What? Are you high?
If there really was a "patriarchy" in our society, it wouldn't be a system that would be failing men as badly as it is and benefiting women as much as it does. Trust me, we live in a gynocentric society controlled by the matriarchy, where the system benefits you, as a woman, much more than me, as a man.
"Men getting a taste of their own medicine"...
Wow, you love to demonize and villanize men and mock them, don't you? Not surprised, considering you're a Feminist (using all the buzzwords and also attacking men). Y'all are a bunch of bigoted misandrists, you Feminists are. Nice job making women look worse (as if they already do such a great job at that).
We as egyptians say "men cry when their pain is heavier than a mountain "
It depends on why you cry actually
There's lots of different kinds of strength a person can possess. There's more than just physical strength for men, but falling into the trap of false masculinity means that's all you will ever know of strength. You can never know true strength of character or emotional stability if you don't want it.
As a human being, I should be allowed to feel, I should be allowed to cry when the pain is unbearable. Otherwise, how am I human being?
best. comment. ever.
Gratz mate
@meyra31 thanks man.
Absolutely!
Exactly.
A guy can cry about death or extreme heartbreak, but I won't be with someone who cries at a Hallmark commercial or because his girl yelled at him. Likewise, I don't cry often or in front of others.
I think embracing the inner tear factory isn't really masculine /feminine so much as mature/immature.
The most mature people I know, cry.
Don't worry love i wont' cry if a girl yelled at me, id just thump her.
You hear this over and over from women and they are missing the point entirely. Men aren't encouraged to "bottle up" their emotions, they are encouraged to not be debilitated by them. Go ahead and have emotions, just don't let them make you screw up or not do what needs to be done. The thing men demand from other men is dependability, especially in a crisis, emotions are beside the point.
By people using the words, "Man Up", "Suck it up" or "Toughen up" when emotions are showed by men, I would think that definitely means to hide what you feel or bottle your feelings up.
Yes, women don't want a weak man (who cries over everything), but we also don't want a man that is ice cold either.
When we say "man up" we generally mean "pull yourself together, blubbering is not going to fix the problem and there are important things to do right now". There are some guys who have a confused and limited idea of what it means to be masculine. Mostly younger and macho types, posers who object to any sign of emotion but they miss the point. What men don't want in another man is unreliability, he can have all the emotions he wants as long as he doesn't bug out when we need backup.
This is bad advice, unless you have a legitimate reason like a death in the family or a loved one diagnosed with cancer. Men can have hearts and can love, but at the end of the day we are not respected if we are seen as sensitive, insecure, or weak. I see it on here daily, just read what an average woman is looking for in a man. No man is going to intentionally turn themselves into an over emotional cry baby.
No one is saying let loose and cry on every occasion. For any gender of course that would mean something is psychologically not right.
This article assumes we are speaking about men that are mentally stable, and can balance their emotions well.
There's a time to show sadness.
And there's a time to show strength.
@Spiorad_Aisce made some great points in his response to me. Ignoring your feelings altogether just to impress women or seem "tough" does more harm than good.
@asker Don't we do that already? I mean when have you seen a man hold back tears when his wife of 50 years passes away, or is diagnosed with breast cancer? Men cry, we just don't cry that often.
@Northeast100 I've never seen my Father shed a tear, and there's been tons of close relatives that have passed away. He is the stereotypical definition of what a "man" should be.
A lot of men are touched in certain ways, and refuse to show it,
this article pertains to them.
@Northeast106
@asker He might have cried in secret. I remember when my grandpa died, I was 14. I ran out of the house to not be seen, but my dad came outside and found me and it pissed me off lol. I didn't want to be seen, and wanted to be left alone. I don't know why we are like that, we just are. Have to say though, I only cried that one day over his death, and as I got older I stopped crying altogether at funerals. We could just be wired that way. By contrast, my mom has this Christmas ornament that my grandparents recorded their voice on, in case they ever did pass away. She cries every time she hears it, to this day. (My grandma is still alive, it's when she hears my grandpa's voice.)
@Northeast106 Yes, he very well could have cried in secret. Although, I may say it still must be rare because my Mom has been married to him for almost 40 years and admits to only seeing him cry twice. I really think he just bottles his feelings up for the most part.
"I didn't want to be seen, and wanted to be left alone. I don't know why we are like that, we just are. "
You're like that because it's deeply integrated in you , that is how you should be because of your gender.
@asker I just think it's in our nature, men and women are just different. I'm not going to say that society brainwashed us into behaving this way, or that gender roles were imposed on us. You can look at Hawaiian Koa warriors, Aztecs, Norse Vikings, or South African Zulu warriors. Despite the geographical distance and cultural isolation, men and women had similar behavioural expectations and roles to perform in society. I think things evolved the way they are for a reason, and we are questioning thousands of years of human wisdom and nature that we take for granted in today's times. Just my two cents on it though.
The act of crying itself isn't what makes someone weak it's why, how often and their reasons for doing so.
Example, a mamma's boy who's a teenager crying because his mother isn't around and he can't stand not being around her, weak, and unhealthy.
Example, crying because someone has died or you saw a touching or sad part of a movie or story, or something touched in a way you haven't felt before, not weak.
I cry too and I dont think a man is weak if he cries. I love a sensitive man that is in touch with his emotions and feelings. Like you said, it only makes him human and I by no means will I judge :) A great take!
The thing is, women say they want a guy to show his emotions but when they actually do, then women are the very first to tell us to "suck it up" "grow a pair" and "stop being a wuss", among other comments.
"Programmed thinking" is what I call that.
Why is it they feel that way? It's because of society's perception of how a man "should" be.
I think what most women want is a healthy balance.
A man who doesn't cry uncontrollably on every occasion.
A man that will cry when the occasion suits it.
"Pretending" is fake to me.
Agreed.
Depends on context.
Hard emotional issues such as your parents passing on, if that doesn't bring a tear to your eye, something is wrong with you. I fell asleep every night for 6 months afterwards with a tear in my eye, but I wasn't letting anyone see that either.
If you're crying because you run out of milk, or get called a name, definitely you have to toughen up
Nice take, but these things will not change, any time soon. The reality of how boys are raised is not going to change due to somebody's will. Extreme examples of this are places like ghettos and war zones, and no amount of activism has ever changed the social realities in such places. Even in the typical case of the overall society in the west, it would have to change organically. I don't see that happening, any time soon.
I can agree , but in order for a big change to happen you have to start small.
Nobody will change it. It will have to happen on its own. I predict it will be along wait. Maybe by the 2100s.
There's never really much need to cry though, I haven't really done it for about 3 years and if you just cry because of petty shit that does mean you're an oversensitive pussy, also nothing wrong with showing emotions e. g. anger, happiness but crying does kind of mean weakness as something has got to you so bad your breaking down over it.
We? l its the human conditions that need to change and perceptions of it I am a former hard *as and its easy to revert but as a human and a man I endeavor to grow as a person and learn to be positive as well. Don't care of ya think I am soft coz I cry. John Wayne cried and lots of other notable men. They were real men and respected I am one of those kinda guys. Love who I Love hurt when I don't show it sometimes bit always a man... Hugz and hope it helps.🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹
To bottle up is not right!! However we can't use "CRY" as a tool for feeble excuses. Moreover it is very important for men to be more supportive of women who by nature emotionally deeply expressive and men need to calm them down and cheer them up than sit and cry along with them. :) So we tend to restrain our emotions as an endowment, and it is for caring our lovely women. I cry not hidingly but cautiously.
I don't care what society teaches you men think... A lot of people make assumptions about what makes a man weak, and that's how other guys end up knocked the fuck out face down on the street and get rolled for their wallet and shoes because they mistook someone's kindness or vulnerability for weakness.