Is the American coronavirus situation really Trump's fault?

[Physics-Man]

Yes

No

Other

Updates

+1 y

I read a lot of people's comments here blaming him. That's why I ask this question.

[nightdrot]

Voted "no." Under the American constitutional system, public health standards are overwhelmingly under the jurisdiction of state and local government. The Federal government has almost no authority in the area and the most it can do - and has done to date - is make policy recommendations and facilitate the delivery of medical equipment. This, given the evolving scientific knowledge, it has done well enough.

Cards on the table, I am a Republican who is no fan of Mr. Trump and did not vote for him. However, in this case I confess to a degree of sympathy for his situation. The public, which demands instant and easy answers and perfect security - none of which is attainable in an imperfect world of imperfect beings - is so grotesquely ill informed about their own constitutional system that they are holding the Federal government to account for things in which it has, at most, a quite circumscribed jurisdiction.

Furthermore, for an increasingly secular society the public treats science as almost a religion. Its' limitations are overlooked and the expectation that it should deliver instant answers being then blamed on the anything other than itself. This also prompting science to stray beyond its' competence.

Thus the legendary Dr. Anthony Fauci offhandedly recommending the abolition of the handshake. Such a simple thing and yet the handshake is an evolutionary development and a reinforcement to social trust. In a culture where social atomization is already an extremely dangerous problem - made worse by the technology man invented and uses but whose effects it does not fully comprehend - Dr. Fauci is suggesting using man as a lab rat in a giant social experiment.

As science, Dr. Fauci has a point. Germs are more easily transmitted by physical contact. He, like science generally, takes A+B=C questions and provides A+B=C answers. The problem being that man and society are infinitely more complex things and simple answers to such a complicated thing as man and society is apt to be disastrous in its consequences. The law of unintended consequences always pertaining.

Into this has been placed the Federal government and President Trump. Constitutionally, their authority is limited. Scientifically, the data is changing. (At one point Dr. Fauci was opposed to face masks. Now he predicts the end of civilization if everyone up to and including newborns and the family dog are not wearing them. This as the available scientific data changes.)

Yet because the President is the most prominent figure, the public demands a "plan" - as if sprung like Athena from the head of Zeus - that will solve everything. When this is not possible the public deems it an outrage when its simplistic thinking is not satisfied with a pat answer.

Given the real limits of science and constitutional authority, the President has handled the situation well enough. Not perfectly by any means. (Indeed, Mr. Trump's use of words tending to be like threading a needle with a sledgehammer, he has to some degree aggravated his own situation by suggesting more authority than he actually has.)

CONT.

[nightdrot]

However, at the end of the day, to the extent that there have been failures, the finger of blame points to state and local authorities, as well as to a media that speaks with more authority than knowledge of science. There being something especially comical in seeing commentators who only a month ago were authorities on politics and elections being able to turn on a dime and pronounce on medical science and public health policy.

The real problem being that, at the end of the day, the culture needs to grow up. There are no easy or perfect answers. The best plan is apt to be grotesquely inadequate given the limits of medical science, the nature of the constitutional system, the competing needs of science, human psychology, economics, and man's imperfect nature - very much including the imperfect President for whom more responsibility is assigned than power to act has been imprudently given.

Yes indeed, given the Federal nature of the American constitutional system juxtaposed to the relatively low per capita fatality rates and all the rest, the President does indeed have a half decent plan for dealing with Covid. Because "half decent" is as apt to be as good as it gets.

[Girther10]

This is what happens when someone asks you what time it is... haha

[nightdrot]

@Girther10 True enough. However, in fairness, most people are content with one sentence - or worse still one word - answers. Their understanding being equally shallow.

There is a reason that this site makes provision for 4000 character replies is because its' owners - if not most of its' users - understand that complex ideas require extended understandings. When you consider that whole libraries of books have been written on these topics, that is not unreasonable.

Still, guilty as charged. Thanks for the "thumbs up."

[Girther10]

@prof- you are right I hope you know that I meant that in a nice way I always appreciate your thorough narratives on most topics but sometimes I just question whether or not you’re speaking above most of these peoples heads. But I love having these on record and I often look back on your narratives because they are so timely and accurate they are a great reference in my humble opinion so please keep doing what you are doing is not falling on completely dead ears.

[Girther10]

And now as I see our president being hospitalized for COVID-19 this topic almost seems ancient things are happening so fast it’s really hard to keep up and we need to take a step back and look at the big picture take the stairs up to the balcony and check it out from there

[nightdrot]

@Girther10 Thanks. Yes, I will keep doing this. It is a hobby for me and I don't really worry too much who "gets it" and who not. When you do, as I do, write for other people and what they want, it is fun to go your own way and "do your own thing."

Of course, I don't write for people with whom I am in disagreement with, but every client has their own quirks - and as far as my writing, they tend to prefer something less "high brow," though not always. So this site, under the cloak of my "Nightdrot" nom de guerre allows me to say what I want, in the way that I want, and be heard by at least some folks.

Not least good folks like yourself. Thanks again.

[Girther10]

Since you brought it up, what exactly is the significance of your “nom de guirre”? Nightdrot has-what meaning, besides what you’ve so eloquently written thus far?

[Girther10]

If you ever have the time, I’d like to hear what you might suggest for a society to “just grow up”- already. How does one help that to occur, if at all?

[nightdrot]

@Girther10 On your second posting - we don't have enough space or time. That said, in any case, the biggest fallacy of statecraft is that there is some magic formula in answer to such questions. Societies grow and change organically - sometimes for the better, sometimes for the worse. Never perfectly as perfection is not given to imperfect beings in an imperfect world.

For my part, I would argue a greater emphasis on the study of history, a greater appreciation for what we have, less emphasis on gadgets and visuals starts the list. Note: Starts it. However, it is academic and, in any case, to propose a formula for society's perfection runs the risk of going down the path of Marx, Mussolini and Hitler.

It has a bad history.

As to my nom de guerre. No real significance. It is one part the first word in the title of a television show that I liked as a child. The word "Drot" was the nickname one of my favorite high school teachers gave to another of my favorite high school teachers. The latter had a key chain with the name of a construction company whose long name was reduced to the acronym "DROT."

So the one teacher gave the other teacher the nickname - he joked at how feminine it was.

So I just combined the two into Nightdrot. Nothing deeper than that and a bit of nostalgia.

[SuccessfulHornDog]

No it isn't, for many reasons.

• Top scientists couldn't agree on how it would affect us
• The WHO was co-opted by China and was lying
• Why blame the Republican president but not blame the Democrat Governors and mayors of NYS, NYS, CA, LA where most cases and deaths are. CA is currently a wild fire of Corona Virus. Who knows how bad it will be before it ends there
• Trump shut down the travel to prevent infection and the democrats called him a racist for it

[WhiteSteve]

I think he could have handled some things better, for sure. It feels like he had a desired outcome in mind that he tried to steer reality to, when this a situation that you should sit back and ride out reality in. I feel like he wanted to shut down medical advice if it didn’t agree with economic goals, and he quite simply chose business and economy over health. We can talk about low mortality rates and co-morbidities and all that jazz, but at the end of the day, nobody really knows what’s going on, in a way that seems to have scientists more stumped than with other viruses and such. So to me, if you don’t know for sure, you approach with extra caution, you don’t just wing it and hope for the best because you’re afraid of businesses going tits up if you play it safe. That said, it’s a tremendously difficult situation for anyone to manage, with no real correct answer to satisfy the requirements we’re collectively demanding, I just think at the end of the day it’s better for you and yours to end up destitute but alive than it is to be dead with money and possessions. People are way too afraid of society collapsing, we’re built to survive like wild animals, we just choose not to for the sake of comfort. So it’s the fear of that collapse that drives people to make these decisions that are detrimental to everyone’s health, and I just see that as a folly. As long as earth is still in existence and habitable, we gon’ be aiiiight, haha. So for me, the answer is always is the real (our health and survival) over the artificial (economy, prosperity, comfort). But I mean, overall, Trump got stuck with this virus like every other leader did, so everyone gets a partial pass from me because nobody alive has ever dealt with this before, other than some suuuuuper old person who was an infant in 1918, haha. I just think a lot of his strongest supporters were emboldened by him to be reckless. Wearing masks, etc, it’s SOMETHING to try to help, and it’s not a new concept, many Asian cultures consider this common courtesy if you’re sick and going into public, and of course medical personnel have been wearing masks as long as any of us have been alive, it’s not like this is some wild concept out of left field. It’s just a minor inconvenience that, for some reason, people have chosen as their hill to die on, which makes no sense to me, but whatever. Every excuse against them sounds like just that —an excuse—, and a reach, at that. Everyone should know by now that this is more to protect others from you in the event you are asymptomatic but contagious, so not doing it is really just kind of a douche maneuver and a middle finger to others. I just did an hour of cardio wearing one yesterday, I’m about to go do it again right now, WITH ASTHMA, and I was just fine and not really hindered at all, so please miss me with the “it’s too hard to breathe” shit, just be honest and say you don’t like it for whatever reason and you can’t be fucked to take one for the team. So as that relates to Trump, I feel like he bristled at the masks and closing high-risk businesses or amenities, and I’ve never seen a president with a more cult-like following than this one (not everyone, but a significant amount), it’s monkey see, monkey do, and I just think that was absolutely the LAST message that should have been put out into the world when you’re already dealing with a population of inherently selfish people who will ultimately just decide to do what’s most comfortable for themselves if not forced or strongly encouraged/facing ostracization by not complying. Honestly, my problem has never been so much with Trump as much as it is the people who comprise his strongest following. Like him or not, I think we can all agree Trump is kind of a crude guy. Some of us see it as indecency and poor role-modeling, others get riled up and applaud his irreverence and think it’s just what the world needs more of. But he knows what his base likes, and those are the people who bother me the most. Just something in their attitude towards life and people, it’s just... sub-admirable, to be polite. Again, that’s not everyone, but these people who think it’s just great that we’re back to talking brashly and antagonistically... there’s a place for bravado and overconfidence and just not giving a fuck, I personally love that shit in a lot of instances, but it’s just being used in the wrong ways against the wrong targets for the wrong purposes. I guess I just feel like Trump brings the worst out of a lot of people, in a way I’m not used to seeing from a political figure. And in the coronavirus sense, I feel like there was a period where he wasn’t totally on board with what the doctors were saying, he maybe didn’t say “don’t wear a mask”, but he’s one of those negative-space guys where I’m more troubled by what he DOESN’T say that he SHOULD be saying. I think in this economy we can’t be spending too much on tin foil hats and claiming that this virus and the response is all some sinister scheme, New World Order shit lmao, that we’re all being duped and controlled... again, just be real and say you don’t feel like wearing a mask because it’s uncomfortable and inconvenient, and you still want to go to restaurants and movie theaters, you don’t need to go through all this bullshit to convince me that we’re all under the invisible rule of The Pentaverate lmfao

https://www.youtube.com/embed/TPMS6tGOACo

[cc-catlady]

It is partially his fault by how he enforced the rules to restrict us from spreading it by how he waited to long to do that, if he did that sooner and take it serious when he knew it was out there at the time he was told about it, America might have possibly not have had the economy nearly shut down like it was in March. The medical field are the ones who are mostly at fault, because the patients who had corona without it being a discovered illness then, the doctors who treated them just gave them a diagnosis of what the doctor only thought they were right about giving them. If the doctors didn't have the logic of thinking the rare flu they gave patients as their diagnosis was not worth questioning further with research and an educated explanation they should have been able to provide since they did go to school for a long time to become a doctor, if they made the choice to see what they claimed to help their patients who believe them and trust them to make sure that patients health is what they can live with. If the doctors didn't take advantage of the power they get from what they were giving to do good with, and didn't just do what they need to with this job without ever going the extra mile when needed to make sure we will stay healthy by using what is possible for them to work with when they treat patients and know all the work was done right morally and logically. Instead they aren't doing that and think what they say is right always and it can never be wrong, this is how they get arrogant and didn't take corona serious enough when they first were caring for patients who had it because at that time not a lot of people had it, and eventually they stepped it up with taking corona serious from how thousands of people had corona and now them diagnosiding this as their own assumption to be true is what needs to be researched and discovered as covid 19 because they knew this illness wasn't just going to go away, no we all were going to be apart of its new appearance it showed to make 2020 a devastating year for history. Moral of this answer always do whats right even if it makes you show everybody you're not perfect, and have to speak out on what you know is necessary to do what is right, even if it takes more away than it would have if you just did what had to be done. We need to start doing whats right again, instead of doing what makes us look good, if we do what is right and have to sacrifice with it. If people were making that choice we wouldn't have our world with corona around as a result that shows we are selfish and it is created from how we have been to our society. Wake up everybody start taking responsibility for your wrongs and make a fucking change. We don't put this solution out there to know about and try to take effort in, NO, for that laziness corona being around to live with is what we deserve for how shitty we are in society

[BeMuse]

Each governor runs their own state. Governors are responsible for their own management practices and where those responsibilities have been delegated to country officials those responsibilities are transferred. At the Federal level the most important thing that could have been done was to shut down all international air travel. In the passed when such an action has been taken it was the responsibility of the United States Federal Aviation Administration. So that would rest with Stephen Dickson. I believe he reports to the US Department of Transportation, so if you want to shift the blame to someone higher up it would fall on the Secretary of Transportation Elaine L. Chao. Not that there was any congressional support to take such actions to begin with… I think it would have been nice to have a well spoken diplomatic president with a medical background to unify the country in that moment, but the rare moments when trained medical professionals, scientists, or engineers run for office the media destroys them like the did with Dr. Howard Dean. It seems that the powers that be want wealthy business men and lawyers to control power, not scientists and engineers. So what do you expect when a real crisis occurs? You’re going to have a bunch of businessmen and lawyers running around like chickens with their heads cut off with a total lack of education on such topics and no good ideas of how to solve the problem.

[Conspiracy_Theorist]

Here's what Trump was doing about coronavirus while Democrats, liberals and their media were obsessing about impeachment:December 31: China reports the discovery of the coronavirus to the World Health Organization. January 6: The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) issued a travel notice for Wuhan, China due to the spreading coronavirus. January 7: The CDC established a coronavirus incident management system to better share and respond to information about the virus. January 11: The CDC issued a Level I travel health notice for Wuhan, China. January 17: The CDC began implementing public health entry screening at the 3 U. S. airports that received the most travelers from Wuhan – San Francisco, New York JFK, and Los Angeles. January 20: Dr. Fauci announces the National Institutes of Health is already working on the development of a vaccine for the coronavirus. January 21: The CDC activated its emergency operations center to provide ongoing support to the coronavirus response. January 23: The CDC sought a “special emergency authorization” from the FDA to allow states to use its newly developed coronavirus test. January 27: The CDC issued a level III travel health notice urging Americans to avoid all nonessential travel to China due to the coronavirus.

[Conspiracy_Theorist]

January 29: The White House announced the formation of the Coronavirus Task Force to help monitor and contain the spread of the virus and provide updates to the President.
January 31: The Trump Administration:
Declared the coronavirus a public health emergency.
Announced Chinese travel restrictions.
Suspended entry into the United States for foreign nationals who pose a risk of transmitting the coronavirus.
January 31: The Department of Homeland Security took critical steps to funnel all flights from China into just 7 domestic U. S. airports.
February 3: The CDC had a team ready to travel to China to obtain critical information on the novel coronavirus, but were in the U. S. awaiting permission to enter by the Chinese government.
February 4: President Trump vowed in his State of the Union Address to “take all necessary steps” to protect Americans from the coronavirus.

[Conspiracy_Theorist]

The ONLY thing you heard out of the Democrats at that time was impeachment. Now they are blaming the president. Where were they? Trying to impeach a president and calling travel bans (that probably saved many lives) racist.

On January 29, 2020 Joe Biden in a speech in Iowa said that Trump's idea of restricting travel from China was "Xenophobic". On March 9, 2020 Bernie Sanders said he would NOT, I repeat he said he would NOT shut down travel from China. In fact Bernie said "Isn't it funny that this President's first reaction is to close the borders." February 24, 2020 Nancy Pelosi says from San Francisco's China Town to come visit, it is safe and "there are no Coronavirus concerns". Then SF became one of the epicenters of the disease. March 20, MSNBC's Rachel Maddow (as well as NY Times) bash Trump for talking about Hydroxy Cloroquin calling it a "fairy tale" and giving people false hope. Now it is being sought after to fight the disease and is being tested as helping patients recover faster. March 30, 2020 Morning Joe anchors say "everyone saw this coming in early January... yet January 24 2020, Joe Scarborough and wife Minka had a segment where they said "no Americans need to be concerned about COVID-19 and should be more concerned about the common flu. Everything I have quoted are all true and easily verified. It seems to me that the Liberal leaders and media have not been accurate about ANYTHING about COVID-19 and some how Trump has been way ahead of them. Trump nailed this one and the press does everything to blame him? Do not let the media rewrite facts. Liberals and the media on January 28th were talking about the final vote of the impeachment hearing while Trump was sounding the alarm. They all said he was trying to distract us... well guess what, he was right this time. Facts Matter"

[goaded]

Europe and the US were hit by the same variant of the same virus at about the same time. Since the beginning of June, the number of deaths from covid-19 has increased in the EU from 284 per million to 333, an increase of 17%; in the US, over the same time period, the number rose from 315, to 625, an increase of 98%.

Why June? Because more than 80% of the deaths so far in New York, New Jersey, Italy, Spain, and the UK had happened by then. They had successfully flattened the curve, they had learned, through painful trial and error what worked.

Did states in America accept this hard-earned knowledge? Were they enthusiastically encouraged and supported to manage the pandemic in the ways known to produce positive effects? What pressure was brought to bear on them? Was the pressure to follow scientific advice, or to re-open economies, despite it? Were leaders leading by example?

We all know the answer to those questions.

A 17% increase on 109,000 deaths (the US number as of 1 June), is less than 140,000. The current toll is over 213,000. That's 73,000 Americans who would still be alive, had there been competent leadership.

Hell, yes! Trump is absolutely to blame for the situation.

[007kingifrit]

of course the piece you are missing is that Europe will be in lockdown far longer than america, and many countries in Europe still have higher deaths per capita

Europe didn't handle this better, when its all over you will have destroyed your economy for no reason, sweden was right

[goaded]

@007kingifrit We're not in lockdown any more, my kids are in school, wearing masks (voluntarily, mind you), shops are open, sports centres, too, and the only European countries still with a worse total deaths per capita than the US are Belguim and Spain, which currently have 2.6, and less than 1 deaths per million, compared to the US's 731.

[007kingifrit]

you also conveniently don't admit you're having a second wave all across Europe

[goaded]

@007kingifrit Not at all. It's currently at 0.79 per million, compared to the US's 2.16.

[goaded]

Admittedly, it's up from the 0.2 it was at while the US was at 2.5.

[Anonymous]

No doubt not 100%. He could have done much better, but likely most presidents woulda fucked up somewhere among the line. The truth is the ONE thing people should have listened to him on from the beginning is China. BOTH SIDES are 100% to blame on that for not taking action years ago. Nothing like Democrats taking selfies with CCP associates but at the same time, walking into a TEXAS airport to see CHINESE signage. Yah. Then people wonder why Houston specifically had somebody sneak stuff by. Both sides are full of shit. Wake up and see the truth.

Ultimately though, they need to get their shit together soon, because China doesn't give a fuck about abortion, diversity, religious stuff, or whatever other minor social BS both sides obsess over. The time we take bickering over it is time they use to be worse than both sides combined. Which is actually kinda what they are. They use that time to build things. Fast. To invest in other nations, even close allies like Australia and Britain VERY quickly. Meanwhile America doesn't make shit and our money is basically paper while there's may be the first to be digitalized/crypto. If the world joins China, how tf will America mantain what they have? Time to put emotions aside and face the REAL enemy. Its not dems or gop. IT'S THE CCP!

https://www.youtube.com/embed/0eFBWnMlMIAhttps://www.youtube.com/embed/ed4ryYokLzU

Educate yourself a bit. Seriously.

[wkozak]

On the one hand, I would like to say that this pandemic and its effects revealed the problems of the health system and the accumulations of problems in previous eras, as Trump has no hand in these repercussions and the rapid spread of the virus, so the responsibility lies partly on the American awareness, some countries such as Germany faced the pandemic and they successed, because the awareness of people beside the precautionary measures from the Government, the both of them cooperated and won against Covid-19, so don't blame Trump and the government if you don't have the awareness of people, by the way the media was filled with information about how to protect yourself and your family from Coronavirus, so you should be awared about what you must do.

[wkozak]

I forgot to say that what i said is the same with every country in the world, if you didn't what you must do so don't blame anyone except yourself, but if the people was awarded but the Government was doing everything in the wrong way so in this case you can blame them

[wankiam]

he saw what china got right and he saw what Europe got wrong but his first reaction when a month later it came to america was one of playing it down. the situation in america could have been avoided but now over 200000 people have paid the price and i would struggle to see how many of those deaths couldnt be attributed to trump and his administration... would biden have done any better? not so sure he would

[Girther10]

Anyone who uses hindsight whentalking about this is not being realistic. It’s easy to do that, and lazy.

[wankiam]

@Girther10 but this isn't about hindsight... i feel you missed my point when i said he saw china surpress the virus very early on and then saw what happens when you dont lockdown soon enough in Europe. nothing to do with hindsight but everything to do with seeing waht others did, the outcome of that and then acting accordingly.

[goaded]

I'd say at least 73,000 lives, and Biden (or Clinton) would have done better; why would they have undone Obama's pandemic plans?

[Girther10]

@wankiam when your current trajectory is adjusted because of what you have seen happen in the past- is the very definition of hindsight- is it not?

[wankiam]

@Girther10 depends if you see the past as some time ago or something that just happened right infront of you which you chose not to learn from... yes if you want to be pedantic hindsight could include that but for me it really doesn't when we are talking days rather than years

[genericname85]

no, it's not trumps fault. it's the WHOs fault, who fools people with idiotic and meaningless statistics.

there has never been a "pandemic" (by the definition of 2009). covid has never been a considerable threat. it's just artificial blown up by several really idiotic and unscientific methods.

trump event straight up called bullshit on it... i don't give this man much credit but i gotta say he was right when he said "without measuring like madmen, we wouldn't have a pandemic".

[Tamera952]

Yes, it really is. Just like everyone else outside of Wuhan, they had no control over the virus or it spreading -- EXCEPT when it showed up in their respective nation, & when it crossed over into our country -- From then on, YOU BET YOUR ASS he is responsible for our response (or our lack of) and for underhandedly lying about it, downplaying it, & dismissing the information. Not to mention all the other shady things he did with PPE, ongoing obfuscation, pitting the states against each other, & continuing to try to silence medical professionals. He 100% fucked it from the get-go for MONTHS.

[captain_voidwalker]

Actualy no. Aside from directing the CDC which he in fact did, most corona virus response is the responsibility of state govoners not the president.

[007kingifrit]

void is right, the 10th amendment is very clear that all pandemic response is done at the state level

[goaded]

@007kingifrit Most presidents support the states, when they need it.

[007kingifrit]

@goaded as trump did, he supplied them with all the materials they needed. that's all he is allowed to do

[goaded]

@007kingifrit He is allowed to do a hell of a lot more. He's omnipotent when you want him to be, but has his hands tied when he doesn't do something.

[captain_voidwalker]

The president is not now or ever been omnipotent. And the president shouldn't be omnipotent, we have separation of powers for a reason. And as I recall when eupean nations started reporting that hydroxychloroquin was effective in treating covid symptoms, and trump suggested we start using it because it showed promising results. It was democrat govoners that out right banned it use in states like Michigan. If you don't like how vovid was handled sort your own party out before you start pointing fingers

[goaded]

@captain_voidwalker That never happened. The UK had possibly the widest ranging test, because of the NHS, and this is what a right-wing paper reported:

"Hydroxychloroquine does NOT treat Covid-19: Biggest study into the Donald Trump-backed anti-malaria drug is ended with 'immediate effect' after researchers found it made no difference

Oxford University scientists pulled the drug from the RECOVERY trial today
Results showed it had no benefit on NHS patients hospitalised with the virus
Scientists running the trial has urged doctors around the world to stop using it"
www.dailymail.co.uk/.../...t-study-drug-finds.html

"A quarter of NHS patients given hydroxychloroquine died from Covid-19, compared to 23.5 per cent who were not prescribed the drug.

The scientists running the trial, which has recruited more than 1,500 patients from around 170 UK hospitals, said the results were 'pretty compelling', adding: 'This isn't a treatment that works.'

Professor Martin Landray, lead author of the study, added: 'If you're admitted to hospital with Covid – you, your mother or anyone else - hydroxychloroquine is not the right treatment. It doesn't work.'

He called for doctors around the world to stop using the drug, which can cause a slew of nasty side effects including heart arrhythmias, headaches and vomiting. "

[007kingifrit]

@goaded you can point to all kinds of studies saying all kinds of things, its still just one guy's opinion

[goaded]

@007kingifrit No, it's not, it's scientific research.

[007kingifrit]

@goaded individual studies are always just one guy's opinion, only in context of multiple studies representative of a body of research does it become more

[goaded]

@007kingifrit Rubbish, as usual. This was a scientific study of 1,500 patients, and it didn't work. It's not just a guess, that's not how science works.

[captain_voidwalker]

They're double speaking you. Hydroxycloroquin didn't specifically treat covid. What it did was treat covid symptoms. This realy isn't that suprising since it was a drug used to treat malaria. Malaria and covid have a similar set of symptoms. This was proven and many doctors recommend the use of Hydroxycloroquin. But because orange man must always be bad it got banned in democrat states.

[goaded]

@captain_voidwalker It was worth a try, but it doesn't help to treat symptoms, if you end up dying anyway. The NHS is Britain's health service, and they tried it on 1500 people, and slightly more of them died than weren't treated with the drug. Nothing to do with Trump.

[walt0462]

NO why would it be President Trump's fault for the coronavirus he wasn't one of the scientist that created/released this virus as soon as President Trump had positive conformation of the Seriousness of this virus in China he immediately Banned/Blocked all travel to and from China back in January when even all or the majority of his politically opponents were still saying (well into March) it was completely safe to continued traveling to and from China and that President Trump was being a racist when he issued the Ban/Block All traveling to and from China

[crmoore]

No. It was expected to kill a million Americans at least, but it's only killed 200,000. And that's WITH people defying social distancing and going out protesting constantly. Not to mention, Trump has limited power to do anything. He can employ federal policies like a national travel ban from China, but he doesn't have the authority to cause lockdowns or make people wear masks. That's a state-level thing, and that's even arguably unconstitutional.

For perspective, 200,000 deaths is approximately 0.06% of the population or America. This is a success, despite all the ignorant people out there who insisted on protesting in certain ways during a global pandemic.

[ChineseWASP2]

No it’s not Trump’s fault and I’m Chinese myself!

Coronavirus is “China’s fault” but more broadly speaking it is an inevitability of altering the environment we live in. China just has too many people. The effort of supporting all those people creates a disease like the one we’re seeing now!

Long story short coronavirus is China’s fault but at a deeper level it is the problem of trying to support the population of people we have in this world. We cannot give everyone the same quality of life so we have to learn how to keep some people poor and some people rich. If everyone was the same rich the planet will be screwed.

But who gets to be rich and who gets to be poor? That is a delicate game that I cannot answer. Do Western nations get the be rich and everyone else lives in squalor? How is that fair? What is fair in this planet? The question is still left without an answer...

[Joseon_Jong-un]

okay sorry for reporting you @007kingifrit

[infinitelyaddison]

I chose "other". Trump, being the highest elected official in a place of authority that this country has, has A LOT of say in the what gets implemented to stop the spread of Covid-19. HOWEVER, the other people in the US are just as responsible for it. It's a two way street, people.

[007kingifrit]

actually the 10th amendment makes clear the president has no power to set policy in a pandemic; its all the states that do it

[infinitelyaddison]

@007kingifrit the 10th amendment simply states that if the president does not hold the power, then it goes to the states. However, the federal branch can override state government policies if it sees fit. The President's main job is to "implement and enforce" laws passed by congress. Laws that he has the right to propose and veto. And the 10th amendment was written in the 18th century. A pandemic (not an epidemic) hadn't occurred until the late 1800's. There would have been no reason to incorporate something like this.

[jshm2]

Yes. Not only because it was his piss-on trade war that exacerbated the situation, but his administration undermined and then defunded the research labs, WHO, and CDC response - making the outbreak into a global pandemic.

Not only that, but the clown was responsible for a lot of the misinformation about the virus.

[Archerer]

He handled it horribly, and I do blame him because he should recognize how stupid and ignorant the average American is. He didn't lead them the way he should have and as the leader of America, he needs to take the responsibility. I blame him, but I also blame Americans in general for being so stupid.

If a child falls into the pool and can't swim, do you blame the father for not paying attention? Or was the kid stupid for being so close to a pool? Trump is daddy, Americans are the child... And the rest of the world is looking in shock at a daddy watching his child drown and pretend like nothing is happening... We are all throwing life savers and begging daddy to help, but he just thinks the child will learn to swim, a miracle.

[bluetoblack99]

No and fuck no. I really like how left protects and downplays the fucking People’s Republic of China’s for being absolutely 100% at fault for this entire thing.

Assuming a democratic president would of magically “prevented the entire thing” is the most stupid, asinine and wistfully immature assumption possible. There is no way of knowing HRC, Biden or Obama would of done a “better job” other than your inherent hatred of Trump.

[NamerOfStars]

Not really, no. For the average (wo) man in the street, the President has a much smaller effect on their day-to-day lives than the governor does. But since the secondary function of the President is to be the government's whipping boy...

[0oGreyo0]

I mean we knew about it since October 2019. We should send people overseas to investigate.

Also, a lot of our jobs are overseas and we didn't have shit. And you saw what happened March and April.

The government had to LIE AND HORDE supply until they got more shipments in may


In the 3rd week of March, they said don't wear mask because it can land on the mask lol.

The 2nd week of April they said to wear a mask it goes 6 feet.

I don't know seems like both parties were retarded here democrat and Republican. I would have done better than 80% of government

[007kingifrit]

we did not know about it in October

[0oGreyo0]

Your correct late November early December is when I heard about it.

[Liam_Hayden]

Of course not. It is nature. Now if you want to talk about missteps, yes, he made some, all verbal, but none was as egregious as the ones made by the Five Dunce governors, Cuomo, Wolf, Whitmer, Murphy, and my very own Newsom, all of whom sent the infected back into nursing homes.